French professor Didier Raoult invents new combo treatment for COVID-19

[BarberSchool]

By themselves they had minimal effect, but together ? Wow.

HydroxyChloroQuine in conjunction with Azithromycin is having wild success, in cutting down COVID-19’s stay in the body to 2-4days, not the 2-3week duration we were all fearing would lead to many more diagnoses of Pulmonary fibrosis (which without ventilators is lethal), or myocarditis (which can also be lethal)

German Pharma Giant BAYER is prepping large global donations of the required medicines.

[bladefd]

Antibiotic Azithromycin? :eek:

[BarberSchool]

Antibiotic Azithromycin? :eek:Yes, but by itself it has little to no effect.

HydroxyChloroQuine by itself had a mild effect, but when combined together, COVID-19 was bodied in a few days.

German Pharma Giant BAYER is prepping a huge global donation of each medicine.

[ZenMaster]

Antibiotic Azithromycin? :eek:

I'm curious, what does the emoji represent in this context?

[Stephonit]

By themselves they had minimal effect, but together ? Wow.

HydroxyChloroQuine in conjunction with Azithromycin is having wild success, in cutting down COVID-19’s stay in the body to 2-4days, not the 2-3week duration we were all fearing would lead to many more diagnoses of Pulmonary fibrosis (which without ventilators is lethal), or myocarditis (which can also be lethal)

German Pharma Giant BAYER is prepping large global donations of the required medicines.


I thought I just read somewhere that taking chloroquine was contraindicated when taking azithromycin? Anyway cannot seem to find the link and maybe it was a warning because they do interact and become more potent which may not be wanted in most other cases. The combination seems to have been used to fight malaria so there is some history with it.

[Stephonit]

It will be interesting to see going forward how the MSM covers this news. The initial coverage on the NY Times given Trump's touting of chloroquine is predictably dim. If choloroquine becomes a successful standard treatment I can see Trump pulling out the win come election time.

[Long Duck Dong]

The Chinese and Koreans have been using HydroxyChloroQuine for months, it's an old drug. Trump has been pushing it hard the last few days, as has Elon Musk but neither of these guys are obviously doctors. The president wants it fast tracked as a COVID-19 treatment and into mass production but he is facing major backlash from the coronavirus czar NIAID director Anthony Fauci who says it's way too early to jump on this as a treatment. Fauci has served at this position since Reagan. It might be time for Trump to make moves to retire this guy.

[TheMan]

The Chinese and Koreans have been using HydroxyChloroQuine for months, it's an old drug. Trump has been pushing it hard the last few days, as has Elon Musk but neither of these guys are obviously doctors. The president wants it fast tracked as a COVID-19 treatment and into mass production but he is facing major backlash from the coronavirus czar NIAID director Anthony Fauci who says it's way too early to jump on this as a treatment. Fauci has served at this position since Reagan. It might be time for Trump to make moves to retire this guy.

So retire the guy with the most experience combating these kinds of things and taking the GOAT bullshitter's word over a real doctor? OK, sounds like a plan...

As much as I and the rest of the world want a cure, maybe listen to the doctor as to why he is reluctant, I doubt it's for superficial reasons.

[Long Duck Dong]

So retire the guy with the most experience combating these kinds of things and taking the GOAT bullshitter's word over a real doctor? OK, sounds like a plan...

As much as I and the rest of the world want a cure, maybe listen to the doctor as to why he is reluctant, I doubt it's for superficial reasons.

The Chinese and Koreans have been using it for a while now. You yourself was excited about it in another thread. The drug is already very familiar to doctors as it's been around for decades. So until another more proven drug comes around, why not start pumping out mass quantities of this one? Trump is right(finally). We have to do something. The only thing is, this drug is very toxic if given over the prescribed dose, and it stays in the blood for a long time, so patients will probably have to wear a bracelet stating when they received the drug because a double dose in a short period of time can make you sick or possibly even kill you.

[highwhey]

I read that this treatment is very effective while given during early onset of symptoms and not so effective once you're through the thick of the virus, is this true?

[Doomsday Dallas]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt2HfDqiuWM

[Long Duck Dong]

I read that this treatment is very effective while given during early onset of symptoms and not so effective once you're through the thick of the virus, is this true?

That's what they are saying. Once your lungs are FUBAR, you probably just hope to have oxygen and a strong body to ride it out. They already used this drug against the SARS coronavirus apparently with very good results which is why the Koreans and Chinese started using it early on. The American drug Remdesivir, is supposed to not only help deal with onset of the virus but has shown some preventative capabilities as well. It's already in clinical trials that won't reach a conclusion until May.

I just hope crooked politicians and drug companies don't conspire to give us an inferior drug because of some shady underhanded motivated by pure greed.

[TheMan]

The Chinese and Koreans have been using it for a while now. You yourself was excited about it in another thread. The drug is already very familiar to doctors as it's been around for decades. So until another more proven drug comes around, why not start pumping out mass quantities of this one? Trump is right(finally). We have to do something. The only thing is, this drug is very toxic if given over the prescribed dose, and it stays in the blood for a long time, so patients will probably have to wear a bracelet stating when they received the drug because a double dose in a short period of time can make you sick or possibly even kill you.

Ok, let's do it then :rockon:

Whatever we have to do to not trash the economy...how about the people most likely to be affected quarantine themselves and the rest of us avoid them and let's live our lives normally?

[tpols]

But i heard from hawker, tio, duck and the gang that USA! USA! is the best healthcare ever, free market yo.

Turns out german and french scientists kick our ass.


I read that this treatment is very effective while given during early onset of symptoms and not so effective once you're through the thick of the virus, is this true?

you could say that about any disease to ever exist.

[Hawker]

But i heard from hawker, tio, duck and the gang that USA! USA! is the best healthcare ever, free market yo.

Turns out german and french scientists kick our ass.



you could say that about any disease to ever exist.
Bayer is big pharma.

Didier Raoult works at a private research facility. Free market indeed.

[tpols]

Bayer is big pharma.

Didier Raoult works at a private research facility. Free market indeed.

Your reasoning for why americans pay way more for the same stuff than europeans (and others) was because USA private sector creates everything.

Getting shit on right now with that, mate.

Better private and public sectors most these countries have.

We've been running on past acclaim for too long substance aint there.

[Hawker]

Your reasoning for why americans pay way more for the same stuff than europeans (and others) was because USA private sector creates everything.

Getting shit on right now with that, mate.

Better private and public sectors most these countries have.

We've been running on past acclaim for too long substance aint there.

You’re right with the public sector - the reason why we couldn’t get things going quickly enough was due to existing regulations.

As far as the private sector, millions of tests are manufactured by Thermo fisher.

Cepheid, based in Silicon Valley, just created a test that gets you results in 45 minutes. The fastest yet.

[bladefd]

I'm curious, what does the emoji represent in this context?

Antibiotics don't typically work for viruses. They only work with bacteria so I was surprised. I am guessing when you mix it with hydrochloroquine, the chemistry makeup changes completely from pure Azithromycin. Just found it surprising that some doctor tried something like that which you wouldn't expect to work here.

[ZenMaster]

Antibiotics don't typically work for viruses. They only work with bacteria so I was surprised. I am guessing when you mix it with hydrochloroquine, the chemistry makeup changes completely from pure Azithromycin. Just found it surprising that some doctor tried something like that which you wouldn't expect to work here.

Makes sense, I had no clue how either drug worked.

@BarberSchool This seems like great news, thanks for posting. Amazing how no one really seems happy about it though, I wonder if it's because a certain orange man mentioned one of these drugs in yesterdays press conference.

[Overdrive]

Source?

[Long Duck Dong]

MSNBC and National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases director sh!tting on this drug's ability to help people. If it doesn't Trump will look like an even bigger idiot. If hydrochloroquine(or the remdesivir he mentioned) and/or some combo using it helps a lot more people than it hurts, Trump looks like genius and MSNBC and Fauci look like dolts, even if they were erring on the side of caution as people died left and right. It's good enough for the Koreans and Chinese but not good enough for Americans I guess

[highwhey]

MSNBC and National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases director sh!tting on this drug's ability to help people. If it doesn't Trump will look like an even bigger idiot. If hydrochloroquine(or the remdesivir he mentioned) and/or some combo using it helps a lot more people than it hurts, Trump looks like genius and MSNBC and Fauci look like dolts, even if they were erring on the side of caution as people died left and right. It's good enough for the Koreans and Chinese but not good enough for Americans I guess

Politics smh. As a nation and society, we're at a point where people need to abandon their fvcking agendas and unite to save our country and economy.

I hope this drug is as effective as it appears to be and MSNBC has to eat shit.

[BarberSchool]

Makes sense, I had no clue how either drug worked.

@BarberSchool This seems like great news, thanks for posting. Amazing how no one really seems happy about it though, I wonder if it's because a certain orange man mentioned one of these drugs in yesterdays press conference.that I sent how politicized EVERY DAILY HAPPENIHG has become . It’s truly sad how wretched and insane the monopolized media is. We need a diversity in media ownership bill ASAP. And diversity in media jobs. A group that is less than 2% of the country, and highly prone to neurosis, shouldn’t be 75% of media owners and the majority of news faces.

Bill Clinton’s 1996 telecommunications ct and the monopolies which resulted from it are a complete disaster for this once functioning nation.

[BarberSchool]

Source?https://www.connexionfrance.com/French-news/French-researcher-in-Marseille-posts-successful-Covid-19-coronavirus-drug-trial-results

There are many articles but this one is nice since it is free from crippling political bias that is sadly so common now, and it is light on proprietary language.

[BarberSchool]

You’re right with the public sector - the reason why we couldn’t get things going quickly enough was due to existing regulations.

As far as the private sector, millions of tests are manufactured by Thermo fisher.

Cepheid, based in Silicon Valley, just created a test that gets you results in 45 minutes. The fastest yet.chian is claiming to have a 15 second test, but given how bad they endlessly lie to the globe, we can’t trust a damn thing they say.

As for the domestic Medical manufacturing industry ... While this you say is all true, I think it’s a drop in the bucket compared to our volume required that could easily be manufactured in North America.

I predict the greatest single change which will stem from this pandemic, will be an unwavering public demand from much of the world, to not be reliant on China for essentials manufacturing. China knew how bad this was back in late November early December, but in an attempt to save face, drastically underreported numbers, stifled any discussion of it on any international media they had sway with (more than you think, including Bloomberg news and other US outlets).

China arrested its own citizens for merely mentioning it on public social media, arrested their own doctors for speaking the truth about it, several of those doctors mysteriously died, etc

The western public will not forgive China for this, and we will see manufacturing return to the west’s lower class populations, and global trade silk belt road initiative (sneaky quiet humble colonization attempt) will fail massively.

The force is not with these niccas. China’s 21st century plans are gonna be donezo by 2030. I have seen fearful Econ majors lately spouting off about how the Yuan could become the world’s reserve currndcy, and this is even more laughable now than it was after Saudi imprisoned ALL their petro-yuan guys in fall 2017.

[BarberSchool]

BACK ON TOPIC...

I cannot wait for these larger trials to give us big data, about how this combo treatment works in a variety of scenarios. I am also interested in some others tried with vageuly similar US/Japanese drugs, as well as Japanese AVIGAN.

I’m most curious how well it works for different blood types (A+ is most at risk IIRC, O- least at risk), ages, and even haplotypes (since these trials will take place in many different nations)

[bladefd]

The western public will not forgive China for this, and we will see manufacturing return to the west’s lower class populations, and global trade silk belt road initiative (sneaky quiet humble colonization attempt) will fail massively.

The force is not with these niccas. China’s 21st century plans are gonna be donezo by 2030. I have seen fearful Econ majors lately spouting off about how the Yuan could become the world’s reserve currndcy, and this is even more laughable now than it was after Saudi imprisoned ALL their petro-yuan guys in fall 2017.

Not sure about that.. Corporations profit too much doing business in China so I bet we will return right back to business as usual once this is done.. Money too precious for the rich corporations and our government is owned by these corporations.. Sadly money is everything to these greedy bastards

[Long Duck Dong]

Daniel Kim from Lost had the COVID-19 and his doctor gave him hydroxychloroquine. He personally believed it was the "secret weapon" to wiping it out quickly.



https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-8139205/Losts-Daniel-Dae-Kim-51-credits-antimalarial-drug-secret-weapon-against-coronavirus.html
(with video)




Kim's personal physician prescribed him a 'drug cocktail' that consisted of the antiviral medicine TamiFlu, the antibiotic Azithromycin, a Glycopyrrolate inhaler, and the antimalarial drug Hydroxychloroquine.

Though all of the medicines worked in conjunction to aid in Kim's healing process, the actor stated that Hydroxychloroquine was the 'secret weapon.'

According to Kim, the drug 'has been used with great success in Korea in their fight against the coronavirus' and was the drug mentioned by President Trump during a White House press conference earlier in the week.

President Donald Trump has continually pushed drugs used for malaria as a treatment option for coronavirus and his embrace of them has caused twinges in the medical community.



The liberal media and even some of our own top medical experts are still sh!tting on this drug though...

[DoctorP]

bodied.

[Long Duck Dong]

People, including this French professor, have been using different cocktails that include HydroxyChloroQuine or chloroquine, with great success. They were using it to battle the much more deadly coronavirus the original SARS-CoV decades ago.

Teva the US/Israeli company(thank you Jews) has 6 million tablets on hand and plans to donate them all in less than 2 weeks with plans to follow this up with 4 million more. Bayer, the German company, has 3 million tablets of the chloroquine, the original, more potent, but more toxic drug with side effects, also plans to donate these tablets.

The people that believe in it:
The Chinese
The Koreans
The French
Trump

The people who are doubting it at the moment

National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases director Anthony Fauci
MSNBC
The Hill
Washington Post
Mother Jones
New York Times
Vox
ABC News
and many others

I guess we'll see who's right. Until a drug comes along that is specifically designed to fight this virus, or a vaccine, this might be our best hope. It's already approved by the FDA for prescribed use in the US and there are tablets in the 10s of millions already in existence.

[bladefd]

People, including this French professor, have been using different cocktails that include HydroxyChloroQuine or chloroquine, with great success. They were using it to battle the much more deadly coronavirus the original SARS-CoV decades ago.

Teva the US/Israeli company(thank you Jews) has 6 million tablets on hand and plans to donate them all in less than 2 weeks with plans to follow this up with 4 million more. Bayer, the German company, has 3 million tablets of the chloroquine, the original, more potent, but more toxic drug with side effects, also plans to donate these tablets.

The people that believe in it:
The Chinese
The Koreans
The French
Trump

The people who are doubting it at the moment

National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases director Anthony Fauci
MSNBC
The Hill
Washington Post
Mother Jones
New York Times
Vox
ABC News
and many others

I guess we'll see who's right. Until a drug comes along that is specifically designed to fight this virus, or a vaccine, this might be our best hope. It's already approved by the FDA for prescribed use in the US and there are tablets in the 10s of millions already in existence.

They are using it in NY to essentially run a trial on the fly AFAIK. We will know soon. It is better to take precautions to ensure it's working without dangerous side-effects. It's a safety precaution..

[Hawker]

People, including this French professor, have been using different cocktails that include HydroxyChloroQuine or chloroquine, with great success. They were using it to battle the much more deadly coronavirus the original SARS-CoV decades ago.

Teva the US/Israeli company(thank you Jews) has 6 million tablets on hand and plans to donate them all in less than 2 weeks with plans to follow this up with 4 million more. Bayer, the German company, has 3 million tablets of the chloroquine, the original, more potent, but more toxic drug with side effects, also plans to donate these tablets.

The people that believe in it:
The Chinese
The Koreans
The French
Trump

The people who are doubting it at the moment

National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases director Anthony Fauci
MSNBC
The Hill
Washington Post
Mother Jones
New York Times
Vox
ABC News
and many others

I guess we'll see who's right. Until a drug comes along that is specifically designed to fight this virus, or a vaccine, this might be our best hope. It's already approved by the FDA for prescribed use in the US and there are tablets in the 10s of millions already in existence.


https://www.techtimes.com/articles/248234/20200320/covid-19-patients-have-successfully-recovered-using-two-medications-in-secret-trials-australia-to-start-rolling-out-the-treatment.htm?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Add Australia now as well.

[bladefd]

Why research is important..


Nigeria reported two cases of chloroquine poisoning after U.S. President Donald Trump praised the anti-malaria drug as a treatment for the novel coronavirus.

Health officials are warning Nigerians against self-medicating after demand for the drug surged in Lagos, a city that’s home to 20 million people. Two people were hospitalized in Lagos for chloroquine overdoses, Oreoluwa Finnih, senior health assistant to the governor of Lagos, said in an interview.

“Please don’t panic,” she said via text message. “Chloroquine is still in a testing phase in combination with other medication and not yet verified as a preventive treatment or curative option.”

Nigeria’s Centre for Disease Control warned that the World Health Organization hasn’t approved use of the drug against the virus. Africa’s most populous country reported 22 infections as of Saturday.

Dosage matters and it varies by different factors. It also needs to be under doctor's oversight. It's not something you just decide to pump in random amounts and hope for the best.. Chloroquine can kill you if you take too much..



“The president, as heard, as we all have heard, what are what I call anecdotal reports that certain drugs work,” Fauci said. “So what he was trying to do and express was the hope that if they might work, let's try and push their usage. I, on the other side, have said I'm not disagreeing with the fact [that] anecdotally they might work, but my job is to prove definitively from a scientific standpoint that they do work.“

[Long Duck Dong]

Why research is important..



Dosage matters and it varies by different factors. It also needs to be under doctor's oversight. It's not something you just decide to pump in random amounts and hope for the best.. Chloroquine can kill you if you take too much..

Yep, this was stated on the first page of the topic. The Teva drug is much safer than the original Bayer drug. It's ALREADY approved by the FDA, has been for a while. It also stays in the blood stream for a long time. Like you said doctor oversight is critical but we already know it's side effects on humans. I haven't researched on how doctors keep track of who's received a dose already so they don't kill or make someone sick with a double dose but I imagine it's a bracelet or something you wear.

[Long Duck Dong]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/marybethpfeiffer/2020/03/22/one-patient-dodges-a-covid-bullet-is-she-a-harbinger-or-outlier/

More success stories, including an older patient who's family begged the doctor's to give him/her a prescription and it saved their life.

I was under the impression this was given as a single or limited doses. Apparently you can get this stuff at your local Walmart for $20 for 60 pills to treat arthritis and lupus. Although I imagine the dosage is very different to treat malaria and COVID-19.

[Long Duck Dong]

https://www.techtimes.com/articles/248234/20200320/covid-19-patients-have-successfully-recovered-using-two-medications-in-secret-trials-australia-to-start-rolling-out-the-treatment.htm?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Add Australia now as well.

I don't know who Clive Palmer is but apparently he's famous in Australia. Anyways he just said he's going to purchase a million courses of hydroxychloroquine for Australians with his own money.

On the down side of things. Apparently the Nigerians got wind of the news this stuff helps fight COVID-19 and are popping it down like candy and subsequently overdosing, sending them straight to the hospital. They have a lot of it there due to the prevalence of malaria.

[diamenz]

great news!

@hateraid :cheers:

[Long Duck Dong]

They are using it in NY to essentially run a trial on the fly AFAIK. We will know soon. It is better to take precautions to ensure it's working without dangerous side-effects. It's a safety precaution..

The governor of NY just ordered 750k doses of the more potent
chloroquine and 70k doses of hydrochloroquine.

And he ain't playing politics like de Blasio. He stated.


“The president is optimistic about these drugs, and we are all optimistic that it could work,”


Cuomo looking like the new Guiliani

[TheMan]

The governor of NY just ordered 750k doses of the more potent
chloroquine and 70k doses of hydrochloroquine.

And he ain't playing politics like de Blasio. He stated.



Cuomo looking like the new Guiliani
I've seen a couple of his news conferences, I'm impressed. He's blunt with no BSing, wish the POTUS would've been straight forward with us from the get go.

TBH, I hope Trump leads us out of this mess with minimal damage, politics aside I'm rooting for him to get shit done, even if it helps him get reelected, I don't care, this is bigger than partisan politics. He's fumbled the ball so many times on this though so I'm not too confident ATM.

[Hawker]

They are using it in NY to essentially run a trial on the fly AFAIK. We will know soon. It is better to take precautions to ensure it's working without dangerous side-effects. It's a safety precaution..

These same safety precautions were what withheld the CDC from allowing tests to be run on COVID-19.

[Long Duck Dong]

Another encouraging news story about the drug



Rio Giardinieri, 52, who is vice-president of a company that manufactures cooking equipment at high-end restaurants in LA and around the world, thinks he contracted COVID-19 at a conference in New York. He had a fever for five days, horrendous back pain, headache, cough, and tiredness. He was sleeping about 15 hours a day when he’s used to getting five hours a night.

He says his doctors did not want to see him so he drove to Joe DiMaggio hospital in South Florida, near his home, and nearly passed out waiting to get tested. Doctors diagnosed him with pneumonia and coronavirus. They put him on oxygen in the ICU but he says he was still unable to breathe. After more than a week, he says doctors told him there was really nothing more they could do. Friday evening, he said goodbye to his wife and three children.

“I was at the point where I was barely able to speak and breathing was very challenging. I really thought my end was there. I had been through nine days of solid pain and for me, the end was there. So I made some calls to say in my own way goodbye to my friends and family.” A dear friend immediately sent him a recent article about hydroxychloroquine, an old anti-malaria medicine proven successful to treat COVID-19 patients overseas, and insisted he take the drug.

So, Giardinieri reached out to an infectious disease doctor. “He gave me all the reasons why I would probably not want to try it because there are no trials, there’s no testing, it was not something that was approved. And I said look I don’t know if I’m going to make it until the morning because at that point I really thought I was coming to the end because I couldn’t breathe anymore. He agreed and authorized the use of it and 30 minutes later the nurse gave it to me.

”An hour after an IV with the medicine, he says his heart felt like it was beating out of his chest. “They had to come in and get me calmed down and take care of me. I had another episode about two hours later where I just got to the point where I couldn’t breathe and my heart was pounding again so they gave me some Benadryl through the system and something else. I’m not sure what it was. It allowed me to go to sleep and when I woke up at exactly 4:45 in the morning, I woke up like nothing ever happened.”Miraculously, he’s since had no fever or pain, feels fine and he’s able to breathe again.

Giardinieri says doctors now believe those episodes were not a reaction to the medicine but the virus progressing in his body. “To me, there was no doubt in mind that I wouldn’t make it until morning,” says Giardinieri. “So to me the drug saved my life.”

On FOX 11’s “The Issue Is,” this week, Oncologist Dr. Paul Song says while using hydroxycloroquine to treat COVID-19 is still preliminary, it’s extremely compelling and hopeful with such an infectious virus.“A lot of people are walking around shedding viruses unknowingly and if you can’t eliminate this from the body in such a short period of time, then the potential to infect others is greatly diminished,” says Dr. Song.



https://www.foxla.com/news/a-man-with-coronavirus-who-works-in-la-says-the-drug-used-to-treat-malaria-saved-his-life

[bladefd]

I would give it to patients in critical conditions and study the results closely. I know they are already doing it in NY to limited number of patients, but I want them to do it in Italy too.. Italy is desperate enough that they have nothing to lose..

[Stephonit]

Frankly it is disturbing that a confirmed suffering patient with covid-19 has to argue with a doctor to be medicated with chloroquine. It shows the utter stupidity of the medical system and why absolute trust in doctors does not exist.

[Long Duck Dong]

Frankly it is disturbing that a confirmed suffering patient with covid-19 has to argue with a doctor to be medicated with chloroquine. It shows the utter stupidity of the medical system and why absolute trust in doctors does not exist.

Exactly. What's the worst that can happen? Especially with hydroxychloroquine. Minor side effects? It's FDA approved. It's effects on the body has been documented for decades. It's cheap. It's readily available(at least atm). I don't understand what's the hold up.

[Hawker]

Frankly it is disturbing that a confirmed suffering patient with covid-19 has to argue with a doctor to be medicated with chloroquine. It shows the utter stupidity of the medical system and why absolute trust in doctors does not exist.

It's not FDA approved to treat COVID-19. That's why doctors are hesitant since they are bound by those rules.

[Loco 50]

Frankly it is disturbing that a confirmed suffering patient with covid-19 has to argue with a doctor to be medicated with chloroquine. It shows the utter stupidity of the medical system and why absolute trust in doctors does not exist.
That's not happening. It's being used on patients that can tolerate it, as I type this, in ICU's throughout the country. It's not working in all patients as some would like to claim. Many patients are progressing to intubation despite these meds being administered well before sever symptoms manifest which means the meds did **** all for them.

Exactly. What's the worst that can happen? Especially with hydroxychloroquine. Minor side effects? It's FDA approved. It's effects on the body has been documented for decades. It's cheap. It's readily available(at least atm). I don't understand what's the hold up.
Heart block. Both drugs cause elongation of the QT portion of the ekg/heartbeat. Elongation beyond a critical point causes arrhythmia. Arrhythmia in a patient that already has any complication with his heart can cause heart block which leads to a very prompt death if not under hospital care. Since both drugs cause the same problem they can work synergistically at lower than the already unknown anti-viral therapeutic doses yet still kill someone dead if not under close watch.

[Loco 50]

It's not FDA approved to treat COVID-19. That's why doctors are hesitant since they are bound by those rules.
Untrue. Off-label use of many drugs occurs all the time and as I stated before is currently occurring with the hydroxychloroquine/z pack cocktail with patients that have been confirmed to have the virus. No FDA approval is needed.


I've posted it before. This is the best website you're going to find on coronavirus or any other health malady. Stop listening to an imbecile like Trump that hears what he wants to hear and then twists the info even further to suit his purposes.

https://www.uptodate.com/contents/coronavirus-disease-2019-covid-19?search=covid%2019&source=search_result&selectedTitle=1~25&usage_type=default&display_rank=1#H2430150683


From the site, pertinent negatives bolded:

Investigational agents — A number of investigational agents are being explored for antiviral treatment of COVID-19, and enrollment in clinical trials should be discussed with patients or their proxies. A registry of international clinical trials can be found on the WHO website and at clinicaltrials.gov.

Certain investigational agents have been described in observational series or are being used anecdotally based on in vitro or extrapolated evidence. It is important to acknowledge that there are no controlled data supporting the use of any of these agents, and their efficacy for COVID-19 is unknown.

●Chloroquine/hydroxychloroquine – Both chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine have been reported to inhibit SARS-CoV-2 in vitro, although hydroxychloroquine appears to have more potent antiviral activity [84].

Use of chloroquine is included in treatment guidelines from China's National Health Commission and was reportedly associated with reduced progression of disease and decreased duration of symptoms [85,86]. However, primary data supporting these claims have not been published [87].

Other published clinical data on either of these agents are limited. In an open-label study of 36 patients with COVID-19, use of hydroxychloroquine (200 mg three times per day for 10 days) was associated with a higher rate of undetectable SARS-CoV-2 RNA on nasopharyngeal specimens at day 6 compared with no specific treatment (70 versus 12.5 percent) [88]. In this study, the use of azithromycin in combination with hydroxychloroquine appeared to have additional benefit, but there are methodologic concerns about the control groups for the study, and the biologic basis for using azithromycin in this setting is unclear.

Despite the limited clinical data, given the relative safety of short-term use of hydroxychloroquine (with or without azithromycin), the lack of known effective interventions, and the in vitro antiviral activity, some clinicians think it is reasonable to use one or both of these agents in hospitalized patients with severe or risk for severe infection, particularly if they are not eligible for other clinical trials. The possibility of drug toxicity (including QTc prolongation and retinal toxicity) should be considered prior to using hydroxychloroquine, particularly in individuals who may be more susceptible to these effects. Optimal dosing is uncertain;[89].

[ZenMaster]

Untrue. Off-label use of many drugs occurs all the time and as I stated before is currently occurring with the hydroxychloroquine/z pack cocktail with patients that have been confirmed to have the virus. No FDA approval is needed.


I've posted it before. This is the best website you're going to find on coronavirus or any other health malady. Stop listening to an imbecile like Trump that hears what he wants to hear and then twists the info even further to suit his purposes.

https://www.uptodate.com/contents/coronavirus-disease-2019-covid-19?search=covid%2019&source=search_result&selectedTitle=1~25&usage_type=default&display_rank=1#H2430150683


From the site, pertinent negatives bolded:



Much respect for the medical community, but your pertinent negatives stem from the safeguards that are regularly in place to make sure that we as people generally don't get the wrong drugs that are unsafe, at doses that are unsafe.

Right now there's a crisis with this virus, where people are dying and the many places you aren't even allowed out the door unless you are going to buy food.

Is this the right time to refer to extensive testing and documentation, or is this the time where it's worth it to try things in ways we usually wouldn't?
How many people need to die, how many people need to go broke and not be able to feed their kids, how many small business owners need to go under before it's ok to try something in ways we usually wouldn't?

[Long Duck Dong]

That's not happening. It's being used on patients that can tolerate it, as I type this, in ICU's throughout the country. It's not working in all patients as some would like to claim. Many patients are progressing to intubation despite these meds being administered well before sever symptoms manifest which means the meds did **** all for them.

Heart block. Both drugs cause elongation of the QT portion of the ekg/heartbeat. Elongation beyond a critical point causes arrhythmia. Arrhythmia in a patient that already has any complication with his heart can cause heart block which leads to a very prompt death if not under hospital care. Since both drugs cause the same problem they can work synergistically at lower than the already unknown anti-viral therapeutic doses yet still kill someone dead if not under close watch.

That is rare though, as is damage to a person's retinas which happens with 1 in 5000 people who take it. And in these cases people are using it on a life long basis to treat lupus or arthritis. People who take it on a life long basis to treat Lupus are proven to have longer lives than people who don't use chloroquine/hydroxychloroquine. One of it's side benefits is that it reduces a person's cholesterol. Pretty sure an older person that needs to go to the hospital and has a significant chance of dying is willing to take the risks. I would.

There are other drugs out there to treat malaria and lupus. I'm pretty sure if hydroxychloroquine was that dangerous it wouldn't be the most commonly prescribed drug for these ailments

[Loco 50]

Much respect for the medical community, but your pertinent negatives stem from the safeguards that are regularly in place to make sure that we as people generally don't get the wrong drugs that are unsafe, at doses that are unsafe.

Right now there's a crisis with this virus, where people are dying and the many places you aren't even allowed out the door unless you are going to buy food.

Is this the right time to refer to extensive testing and documentation, or is this the time where it's worth it to try things in ways we usually wouldn't?
How many people need to die, how many people need to go broke and not be able to feed their kids, how many small business owners need to go under before it's ok to try something in ways we usually wouldn't?
It's being used.............

[ZenMaster]

It's being used.............

But you're worried about trashing the US President, and pointing out the negatives as to why he's wrong to show hopefulness. "It might work, it might not work" were his words.

[Loco 50]

That is rare though, as is damage to a person's retinas which happens with 1 in 5000 people who take it. And in these cases people are using it on a life long basis to treat lupus or arthritis. People who take it on a life long basis to treat Lupus are proven to have longer lives than people who don't use chloroquine/hydroxychloroquine. One of it's side benefits is that it reduces a person's cholesterol. Pretty sure an older person that needs to go to the hospital and has a significant chance of dying is willing to take the risks. I would.

There are other drugs out there to treat malaria and lupus. I'm pretty sure if hydroxychloroquine was that dangerous it wouldn't be the most commonly prescribed drug for these ailments
It's not rare enough. Especially not when combined with another agent that exacerbates the same problem. We'd never prescribe these two agents under a more mundane circumstance. Hydroxychloroquine is currently being administered to thousands of patients here in the states, but there are problems with it as I laid out. You honestly think we're going to listen to an idiot like Trump on whether or not we are going to prescribe a potentially lethal medication? Nah

:oldlol: At the thought of taking a drug that can stop your heart to lower cholesterol.....you folks......I provided the information. I can't do anything more.

[Loco 50]

But you're worried about trashing the US President, and pointing out the negatives as to why he's wrong to show hopefulness. "It might work, it might not work" were his words.
And you're in every thread ball washing his every move. He's a special president for special citizens.

:roll: WTF does "it might work it, might not" even mean to anybody? It's a nonsense sentence. It stated no facts. Gave no stance. Informed nobody of anything. It's a phrase from a fn idiot.

You know what might have worked? Shutting shit down before it started spreading in the community when we had months notice to prepare.

You know what also might have worked? Preparing the population for what's to come so that panic could be mitigated.

You know what also might have worked? Ramping up supply production so that the people that are trying to treat this shit aren't putting ourselves at risk.

You know what also might have worked? Expediting a reliable testing system so we can understand how pervasive the problem actually is.

There are a shit ton of other things that might have worked before the genie was let out of the bottle. Don't get to put it back in now.

[tpols]

ORANGE MAN BAD.

DRUG NOT WORK.



alright bro... i think we got ya.

[Loco 50]

I'm an idiot.
Where did I say for certain it doesn't work? It hasn't worked in all patients and it comes with severe complications that require hospital management. "Orange man bad" indeed.

We take the bullets while you and he get to make dumbass assertions from the sidelines. Do me a favor, if/when you get it, keep it to yourself and don't go looking for treatment since it ain't that bad.

[highwhey]

A man from Phoenix died after trying to self medicate with this medication: https://www.azfamily.com/news/continuing_coverage/coronavirus_coverage/phoenix-man-dies-wife-in-critical-condition-after-self-medicating/article_fac3d7cc-6d48-11ea-9092-8b65922dc7c0.html

Poor guy. Obviously not a good move to self medicate...but with the shortage of testing and the lack of support, I can understand the feeling of having to do whatever is necessary.

[ZenMaster]

And you're in every thread ball washing his every move. He's a special president for special citizens.

:roll: WTF does "it might work it, might not" even mean to anybody? It's a nonsense sentence. It stated no facts. Gave no stance. Informed nobody of anything. It's a phrase from a fn idiot.

You know what might have worked? Shutting shit down before it started spreading in the community when we had months notice to prepare.

You know what also might have worked? Preparing the population for what's to come so that panic could be mitigated.

You know what also might have worked? Ramping up supply production so that the people that are trying to treat this shit aren't putting ourselves at risk.

You know what also might have worked? Expediting a reliable testing system so we can understand how pervasive the problem actually is.

There are a shit ton of other things that might have worked before the genie was let out of the bottle. Don't get to put it back in now.

More nasty language.. It just goes to show how the handling of this crisis is being politicized.

The president is saying right now, stay at home, don't socialize, yet here you are giving the advice of "Don't listen to the imbecile" and it's counter productive.

The context of "It might work, might not" was that he was being questioned in a way framing it to probably not work, because Dr Fauci pointed out the same as your bolded negatives.

The US has been facing the same problems as almost every single other Western country, lack of available test to make them widespread.
Most of it because they simply haven't been produced, but also because mistakes are made. A good example of that is in Denmark, where the government said they don't have enough tests available, not even to test hospital workers at a different rate that the regular public, and they are running out. On the same day, a private Danish company goes public and say they've had already offered the Danish government to produce testing kits at a high rate, but never heard anything back. Instead they now had a contract to ship 100K test per week to Australia starting this week.
In fact, the head of the equivalent to the CDC said publicly just a couple days ago "we won't run out of equipment", only for that to happen 48 hours later.
Danish approval rate of how the government there is handling the crisis, around 85%.

Fact is that almost every Western country was not prepared for something like this on a basic level, nor in the ability to react preemptively, yet within the US for a lot people, it's all Trumps fault. To me the fault is how we've created modern society with an entire focus on money.

I didn't like how he initially spoke about the potential of the virus, the macho attitude isn't suitable for this kind of situation. But it's who he is and you have to take good with the bad. He's made good decisions recently, he's trying to show optimism and people need that because they're going to have to honker down for a while.

I agree with all your suggestions for what might have worked, but none of those were possible for almost any Western country because of how our economic system works. We as people over generations are to blame for that, we've voted in politicians who started to feed and prosper off corporations, instead of looking out for the people.

[Long Duck Dong]

A man from Phoenix died after trying to self medicate with this medication: https://www.azfamily.com/news/continuing_coverage/coronavirus_coverage/phoenix-man-dies-wife-in-critical-condition-after-self-medicating/article_fac3d7cc-6d48-11ea-9092-8b65922dc7c0.html

Poor guy. Obviously not a good move to self medicate...but with the shortage of testing and the lack of support, I can understand the feeling of having to do whatever is necessary.

This dude took fish tank cleaner though, not medication. :biggums:


I'm sorry but that's a Darwin award

[Long Duck Dong]

Doctors across the USA prescribing themselves large amounts of hydroxychloroquine creating a shortage across the US.

https://www.propublica.org/article/doctors-are-hoarding-unproven-coronavirus-medicine-by-writing-prescriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families




Doctors Are Hoarding Unproven Coronavirus Medicine by Writing Prescriptions for Themselves and Their Families
Pharmacists told ProPublica that they are seeing unusual and fraudulent prescribing activity as doctors stockpile unproven coronavirus drugs endorsed by President Donald Trump.


A nationwide shortage of two drugs touted as possible treatments for the coronavirus is being driven in part by doctors inappropriately prescribing the medicines for family, friends and themselves, according to pharmacists and state regulators.

“It’s disgraceful, is what it is,” said Garth Reynolds, executive director of the Illinois Pharmacists Association, which started getting calls and emails Saturday from members saying they were receiving questionable prescriptions. “And completely selfish.”

Demand for chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine surged over the past several days as President Donald Trump promoted them as possible treatments for the coronavirus and online forums buzzed with excitement over a small study suggesting the combination of hydroxychloroquine and a commonly used antibiotic could be effective in treating COVID-19.



The drug doesn't work though according to liberal media. Trump has made these doctors lose their mind with his endorsement of hydroxychloroquine. He also made the governor of New York lose his mind and order nearly a million pills for his state.

[highwhey]

Doctors across the USA prescribing themselves large amounts of hydroxychloroquine creating a shortage across the US.

https://www.propublica.org/article/doctors-are-hoarding-unproven-coronavirus-medicine-by-writing-prescriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families



The drug doesn't work though according to liberal media. Trump has made these doctors lose their mind with his touring of hydroxychloroquine. He also made the governor of New York lose his mind and order nearly a million pills for his state.

we really are seeing who people truly are inside. wow.

[TheMan]

Doctors across the USA prescribing themselves large amounts of hydroxychloroquine creating a shortage across the US.

https://www.propublica.org/article/doctors-are-hoarding-unproven-coronavirus-medicine-by-writing-prescriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families



The drug doesn't work though according to liberal media. Trump has made these doctors lose their mind with his endorsement of hydroxychloroquine. He also made the governor of New York lose his mind and order nearly a million pills for his state.

It better work because Trump has royally fukked up the biggest crisis of his presidency so far.

[Long Duck Dong]

It better work because Trump has royally fukked up the biggest crisis of his presidency so far.

I agree. His stance on wanting people to carry on with their lives like normal in 2 weeks is just insane to me

My gf says the Mexican president has the same stance more or less too :facepalm

[TheMan]

I agree. His stance on wanting people to carry on with their lives like normal in 2 weeks is just insane to me

My gf says the Mexican president has the same stance more or less too :facepalm
True, no wonder Trump and Lopez Obrador get along well. Fortunately, like in the US, governors in MX have pretty much ordered lockdowns in their respective states and so far the covid19 isn't spreading nowhere near like it is in the US. Probably just pure dumb luck TBH.

[Loco 50]

Doctors across the USA prescribing themselves large amounts of hydroxychloroquine creating a shortage across the US.

https://www.propublica.org/article/doctors-are-hoarding-unproven-coronavirus-medicine-by-writing-prescriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families



The drug doesn't work though according to liberal media. Trump has made these doctors lose their mind with his endorsement of hydroxychloroquine. He also made the governor of New York lose his mind and order nearly a million pills for his state.
Not surprising, unfortunately. Lotta coward ass docs out there. The article mentioned a surgeon, dentists and ophthalmologists as a few seeking the drugs. If you think that's proof they work......you're mistaken.

If it were internal med docs that's when you know they're onto something. Or pulmonary crit care specialists. Docs that are actually treating it. Most others are just acting out of fear grasping at straws like the folks panic buying months of medical supplies that they don't even know how to use.

[Loco 50]

we really are seeing who people truly are inside. wow.
Question your doc. Hold him accountable to a reasonable extent. Don't assume he has your best interest in mind at all times. Sometimes he's just a lazy piece of shit or in this case, a coward.

That being said, don't treat him like an enemy, but make him earn your trust too.

[BarberSchool]

Question your doc. Hold him accountable to a reasonable extent. Don't assume he has your best interest in mind at all times. Sometimes he's just a lazy piece of shit or in this case, a coward.

That being said, don't treat him like an enemy, but make him earn your trust too.as someone with a girlfriend who is a surgeon, a cousin who is a surgeon, an uncle who is a doctor, and a cousin in law who is also a doctor, let me be the first to tell you that a significant percentage of doctors are not as great as people think they are.

You will have to sometimes suggest things to them to get them to remember what correlation or treatment you assume they should know....

IF you ever encounter a doctor who is dismissive to your logical, well-read concerns (and not your idiotic baseless fear, if you’re an idiot), get another doctor. And let the sh1tbag know when you’re walking out of the office that their dismissiveness and lazy lack of mental effort is unacceptable.

[Long Duck Dong]

India just banned the export of hydroxychloroquine and it doesn't matter who manufactures it. They want it to stay all in country.

A doctor in NY has treated 500 patients with it starting several weeks ago. Before all the hype. He says he only used it on patients 60 years or older or with compromised immune systems. Atm he says he hasn't lost a single patient

[BarberSchool]

India just banned the export of hydroxychloroquine and it doesn't matter who manufactures it. They want it to stay all in country.

A doctor in NY has treated 500 patients with it starting several weeks ago. Before all the hype. He says he only used it on patients 60 years or older or with compromised immune systems. Atm he says he hasn't lost a single patient
What is the NY docs name ? I have fam in NYC, New Ro, Wappingers Falls, Schenectady, Syracuse & Buffalo and would like to know dude’s name!

[Long Duck Dong]

What is the NY docs name ? I have fam in NYC, New Ro, Wappingers Falls, Schenectady, Syracuse & Buffalo and would like to know dude’s name!

Here you go. If they are Jewish they will probably have a much better chance at being treated

https://forward.com/news/national/442285/coronavirus-hydroxychloroquine-trump-doctor/

[BarberSchool]

Here you go. If they are Jewish they will probably have a much better chance at being treated

https://forward.com/news/national/442285/coronavirus-hydroxychloroquine-trump-doctor/He’s saving the lives (and thus contributing to far greater death down the road) of the most grotesque corrupt and anti-semitism-causing Lubavitcher set in the USA (Kiryas Joel). We’ll take our business elsewhere, if anyone shows symptoms. But thanks anyways.

[Long Duck Dong]

Amneal Pharmaceuticals donated one million hydroxychloroquine pills to NY and just donated another one million to Texas. What about California? Pretty sure they have more COVID-19 cases than Texas :lol

The media absolutely hates this drug though. There are thousands of stories out there in just the last 2 weeks basically stating hydroxychloroquine is nothing better than snake oil.

[tpols]

Amneal Pharmaceuticals donated one million hydroxychloroquine pills to NY and just donated another one million to Texas. What about California? Pretty sure they have more COVID-19 cases than Texas :lol

The media absolutely hates this drug though. There are thousands of stories out there in just the last 2 weeks basically stating hydroxychloroquine is nothing better than snake oil.


yea because trump endorsed it.

Theyre going to shit on anything he proposes, and drag this out.

[Long Duck Dong]

Liberals(Cuomo isnt a true liberal) and the media REALLY REALLY hate this drug. Trump shouldn't have ever mentioned it or else they probably wouldn't care.

The Democrat Governor of Michigan just threatened the medical license of doctors and pharmacists who prescribe/give this drug out to COVID-19 patients.

In response 2 physicians responded to her actions via the Wall Street Journal



The most important point the doctors make is that we don’t have the luxury of time. There are currently larger studies being conducted, but the results won’t be available for weeks. They explain, “We have a drug with an excellent safety profile but limited clinical outcomes—and no better alternatives until long after this disaster peaks. We can use this treatment to help save lives and prevent others from becoming infected. Or we can wait several weeks and risk discovering we didn’t do everything we could to end this pandemic as quickly as possible.” It will also help contain the spread of the disease.

[bladefd]

I say use it in heavily hit areas if someone is in a critical state. We have nothing to lose :confusedshrug:

[highwhey]

Its been 7 days since the OP. How is the data looking for this treatment?

[Long Duck Dong]

Florida's governor just secured a massive shipment of hydroxychloroquine. New York and Texas have already got theirs. Meanwhile Michigan has threatened to destroy the lives of any health professional who treats a patient with hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19. Such polar opposites in opinion over this.



Its been 7 days since the OP. How is the data looking for this treatment?

Lots of anecdotal individual success stories. There has yet to be a definitive link to these successes proving it works. It's a low risk, high reward thing which is why everyone is going nuts trying to secure hydroxychloroquine. If it doesn't work at least some people tried what was a possible treatment. There will be no fallout for them. If it does help a significant amount of people, those that waited on the sidelines while people died will pay a dear price.

[BarberSchool]

Its been 7 days since the OP. How is the data looking for this treatment?Lots of new info from larger studies will be compiled shortly. Thanks for checking in yo.

What we didn’t expect, is how utterly politicized this damn drug became.

Btw, the politicians have been verbally ignorant in regards to it.
HydroxyChloroQuine on is own only had 57% effectiveness.
It’s ONLY when it was paired with Azithromycin that it had upwards of 90% effectiveness
Adding large doses of vitamin C & Zinc also done in some of the studies with upwards of 95% success.

Hang tight y’all.

[BarberSchool]

Florida's governor just secured a massive shipment of hydroxychloroquine. New York and Texas have already got theirs. Meanwhile Michigan has threatened to destroy the lives of any health professional who treats a patient with hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19. Such polar opposites in opinion over this.




Lots of anecdotal individual success stories. There has yet to be a definitive link to these successes proving it works. It's a low risk, high reward thing which is why everyone is going nuts trying to secure hydroxychloroquine. If it doesn't work at least some people tried what was a possible treatment. There will be no fallout for them. If it does help a significant amount of people, those that waited on the sidelines while people died will pay a dear price.
The Governors of both Michigan & Nevada were seemingly baited into the politicization of this, and their re-elections hinge almost entirely on its failure, so they can publicly claim to have protected citizenry from OrangeMan’s “bad advice”.

They basically bet against the Bayer pharmaceutical giant, and dozens of nations, in favor of the mainstream US media establishment and the DNC. I would not be surprised at all if some backdoor DNC deal was done with governors of states the DNC thinks have the best chances at getting electoral votes from in November lol

[highwhey]

Lots of new info from larger studies will be compiled shortly. Thanks for checking in yo.

What we didn’t expect, is how utterly politicized this damn drug became.

Btw, the politicians have been verbally ignorant in regards to it.
HydroxyChloroQuine on is own only had 57% effectiveness.
It’s ONLY when it was paired with Azithromycin that it had upwards of 90% effectiveness
Adding large doses of vitamin C & Zinc also done in some of the studies with upwards of 95% success.

Hang tight y’all.

Real unfortunate that politicians can't stop being scumbags even during a global pandemic. I truly hope they and the media are wrong.

[tpols]

The Governors of both Michigan & Nevada were seemingly baited into the politicization of this, and their re-elections hinge almost entirely on its failure, so they can publicly claim to have protected citizenry from OrangeMan’s “bad advice”.

They basically bet against the Bayer pharmaceutical giant, and dozens of nations, in favor of the mainstream US media establishment and the DNC. I would not be surprised at all if some backdoor DNC deal was done with governors of states the DNC thinks have the best chances at getting electoral votes from in November lol


trump should start pulling some reverse psychology to guide them where he wants lol

maybe if he condemns it, theyll start using it.

[Long Duck Dong]

The Governors of both Michigan & Nevada were seemingly baited into the politicization of this, and their re-elections hinge almost entirely on its failure, so they can publicly claim to have protected citizenry from OrangeMan’s “bad advice”.


You can now add Hawaii to that list.

[Stephonit]

Is there anyone saying you should take vitamin C? That really should be out there. Standard advice even for a cold.

[BurningHammer]

Is there anyone saying you should take vitamin C? That really should be out there. Standard advice even for a cold.
For a generic flu and cold, sure why not. For much more dangerous strains of coronavirus, no.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/03/24/coronavirus-fact-check-could-vitamin-c-cure-covid-19/2904303001/


The only impact that vitamins and supplements may have in any cold or flu is to lessen the severity,” Dr. Caroline Apovian, a professor of medicine and pediatrics at the Boston University School of Medicine, told USA TODAY. “In general, eating well and sleeping well will help your immune system; stress and anxiety and lack of sleep depresses the immune system,” she continued.

[Stephonit]

For a generic flu and cold, sure why not. For much more dangerous strains of coronavirus, no.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/03/24/coronavirus-fact-check-could-vitamin-c-cure-covid-19/2904303001/

Sounds like a ridiculous conclusion in terms of common sense things you can try to do. If you were to believe that article you wouldn't even try. That would be DUMB.

http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n14.shtml

https://www.newsmax.com/health/health-news/covid-19-vitamin-c-supplements/2020/03/20/id/959180/

https://www.globalresearch.ca/three-intravenous-vitamin-c-research-studies-approved-treating-covid-19/5705405

[BarberSchool]

For a generic flu and cold, sure why not. For much more dangerous strains of coronavirus, no.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/03/24/coronavirus-fact-check-could-vitamin-c-cure-covid-19/2904303001/Do you think about what you type and post ? Literally this article is a contradictory mess, USA Today should be ashamed they published it.

The article mentions other simple things to do to boost the immune system, then admits that vitamin C can lesssen the severity of the virus damage to the body. It’s well known and established that the following supplements boost the body’s immune system against all viruses, regardless of their differences:

Vitamin C
Vitamin D
Selenium
Magnesium
Zinc

This is literally common knowledge for every single CNA, RN, PA, MD, MBBS, etc
The media is making a suicidal politicized gamble, forgetting that the family of all the millions of people who work in healthcare, nutrition, dietitians, research science, etc all have this knowledge. They are digging their own grave faster and faster.

[Long Duck Dong]

Italy has seen enough evidence. Every single COVID-19 patient in the early stages will receive hydroxychloroquine until something better comes along.

https://www.trustnodes.com/2020/03/29/italy-finally-starts-mass-treatment-with-hydroxychloroquine



According to Corriere della Sera, a well known Italian daily newspaper, Dr. Pier Luigi Bartoletti, Deputy National Secretary of the Italian Federation of General Practitioners, explains that every single person with Covid-19 that has early signs, like a cough or a fever for example, is now being treated with the anti-malaria drug.

The drug “is already giving good results,” Bartoletti says while Malaysia reveals they have been using it since the very beginning.

We have just understood that the virus has an evolution in two phases and that it is during the second phase, after a few days (about a week), that the situation can suddenly, in 24 or 48 hours, worsen and leads to respiratory failure requiring intensive care.

The results that we are starting to accumulate suggest that hydroxychloroquine administered early, gives the possibility of avoiding this evolution in a majority of patients and is also helping us to prevent hospitals from filling up.”


Meanwhile most of the US media and many democrats are still hammering home that this treatment is ineffective with every study and story they can come up with. But the fact that there's governors threatening the medical licenses of doctor's who use this drug to treat COVID-19 is just plain nuts.

[highwhey]

FDA just announced tonight that hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine will receive emergency authorization and donated pills will be released to doctors around the US. Apparently they have over 30 million doses they have received through donation on hand

https://www.hhs.gov/about/news/2020/03/29/hhs-accepts-donations-of-medicine-to-strategic-national-stockpile-as-possible-treatments-for-covid-19-patients.html

https://media.tenor.com/images/cafe33c0f4cdc4b8cb552e4d5e78916c/tenor.gif

[Long Duck Dong]

FDA just announced tonight that hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine will receive emergency authorization to be used on COVID-19 patients and donated pills will be released to doctors around the US. Apparently they have over 30 million doses they have received through donation

https://www.hhs.gov/about/news/2020/03/29/hhs-accepts-donations-of-medicine-to-strategic-national-stockpile-as-possible-treatments-for-covid-19-patients.html

[Long Duck Dong]

https://media.tenor.com/images/cafe33c0f4cdc4b8cb552e4d5e78916c/tenor.gif

I deleted and resubmitted my post to clean it up but you're too fast :cheers:

[highwhey]

I deleted and resubmitted my post to clean it up but you're too fast :cheers:

so can i bunker with you? i'm a good shot with a rifle.

[Long Duck Dong]

so can i bunker with you? i'm a good shot with a rifle.

You bring the carne ranchera, I'll bring my suergra's homemade tortillas :cheers:

[bladefd]

Italy has seen enough evidence. Every single COVID-19 patient in the early stages will receive hydroxychloroquine until something better comes along.

https://www.trustnodes.com/2020/03/29/italy-finally-starts-mass-treatment-with-hydroxychloroquine



Meanwhile most of the US media and many democrats are still hammering home that this treatment is ineffective with every study and story they can come up with. But the fact that there's governors threatening the medical licenses of doctor's who use this drug to treat COVID-19 is just plain nuts.

If it helps then go on ahead. Just don't want to see any doctors hoarding it. It must be in national stockpile for anyone with covid-19 willing to try it until we have concrete results from the NYC trial.

[BarberSchool]

The politicization of COVID-19 is sickening.

Twitter just suspended the account of this leading French researcher who heads his own internationally respected institute.

The insanity is revealing who a lot of people really are beneath it all.

[Stephonit]

I singled out the U.S. experts in the title of the other thread I created because experts from other countries have shown the ability to share actually useful information. French authorities were the ones who gave the recommendation to avoid ibuprofen and ACE inhibitors. From the little I've seen they've treated their public like adults. The U.S. experts by contrast have provided little guidance and treated their public like children.

[Long Duck Dong]

Not a lot of mea culpas today going around by the media and politicians who said hydroxychloroquine was dangerous to use(despite it's side effect track record being well documented for decades). It's now FDA approved for COVID-19. No word yet from the Michigan governor who says she will yank the medical license of anyone using it to treat COVID-19, nor from Nevada or Hawaii who told doctors not to use it within their states.

[BarberSchool]

^
1. Those Governors will fire the insidious snakes posing as their state’s medical expert, who advised them of doing so, if they were simply MISLED. And despite firing them, those Governors will have a very tough time getting re-elected after showing such error in judgement on the biggest stage playing with their constituents’ lives.

2. if indeed it was Gilead who offered them big donations to ban it, so they could hype Remdesivir (which Gilead holds patent for) it will be even worse landslide losses for those Governors. And possibly divorces and eternal shame. I am leaning that this was the case, that Gilead intended to charge taxpayers (govt) an absolute fortune
for Remdesivir, and banning 2 inexpensive generics with better results was priority #1.

IL scumbag Bolshevik governor Pritzker hyped Remdesivir (which may have some effectiveness that’s not the point), but didn’t go full retard and ban Plaquenil & Zithromax, or double extra strength retard, like Michigan Governor and threaten to strip Medical licenses for anyone who administered it.

[Long Duck Dong]

Some smaller studies with control groups starting to trickle in and things look promising with hydroxychloroquine.


Half the subjects — the controls — received just the usual care given to coronavirus patients, and half had usual care plus hydroxychloroquine. The usual care included oxygen, antiviral drugs, antibiotics and other treatments.

Their disease was considered mild, even though all had pneumonia that showed up on CT scans. After giving informed consent, they were assigned at random to either the hydroxychloroquine or the control group. They were treated for five days, and their fevers and coughing were monitored. They also had chest CT scans the day before the study treatment began, and the day after it ended.

Coughing and fever eased a day or so earlier in the patients who received hydroxychloroquine, and pneumonia improved in 25 of 31, as opposed to 17 of 31 in the controls.

The illness turned severe in four patients — all in the control group.

Two patients had minor side effects from hydroxychloroquine: One had a rash and another had a headache.



https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/01/health/hydroxychloroquine-coronavirus-malaria.html


ADVERTISEMENT
Marcus Zervos, infectious disease doctor for Henry Ford Health System, said they had seen success with hydroxychloroquine therapy in a number of COVID-19 patients. He said those given the drug were able to get off a ventilator and out of the hospital faster.

“The goal of therapy is to take patients that have shortness of breath, compromised respiratory status, that have pneumonia, and by treating them with hydroxychloroquine, prevent them from the complication of progression of infection, ending up in an intensive care unit or ending up on a ventilator," Zervos said.

Zervos said it typically took patients hospitalized with COVID-19 between two and four weeks to recover. He said hydroxychloroquine therapy was reducing that recovery time



https://wwmt.com/news/local/michigan-doctors-see-success-in-covid-19-treatment-but-say-more-clinical-trials-are-needed


And to bring in a little comedy to a serious situation. The Democrat governor of Michigan who threatened the medical licenses of physicians who treated COVID-19 patients with hydroxychloroquine, not only has backtracked on this, she is now begging the feds to send her donated doses of the drug :oldlol:

https://www.metrotimes.com/news-hits/archives/2020/03/31/gov-whitmer-reverses-course-on-coronavirus-drugs-is-now-asking-feds-for-hydroxychloroquine-and-chloroquine

I guess what this drug does is lower the ph of the tissue in our body making it much more acidic than this virus likes, weakening it and allowing our bodies to fight it off better.

[tpols]

Some smaller studies with control groups starting to trickle in and things look promising with hydroxychloroquine.



https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/01/health/hydroxychloroquine-coronavirus-malaria.html



https://wwmt.com/news/local/michigan-doctors-see-success-in-covid-19-treatment-but-say-more-clinical-trials-are-needed


And to bring in a little comedy to a serious situation. The Democrat governor of Michigan who threatened the medical licenses of physicians who treated COVID-19 patients with hydroxychloroquine, not only has backtracked on this, she is now begging the feds to send her donated doses of the drug :oldlol:

https://www.metrotimes.com/news-hits/archives/2020/03/31/gov-whitmer-reverses-course-on-coronavirus-drugs-is-now-asking-feds-for-hydroxychloroquine-and-chloroquine

I guess what this drug does is lower the ph of the tissue in our body making it much more acidic than this virus likes, weakening it and allowing our bodies to fight it off better.

thats pretty crazy... high body acidity is associated with almost every type of internal human disease which is why health experts say in general to eat your fruits, veggies, drink tons of water to keep yourself alkaline.

that drug almost sounds like a form of chemo, poisoning yourself a little bit, but the virus a lot.

[Long Duck Dong]

I guess that's why many doctors are saying it's an excellent PREVENTATIVE drug. It changes the body a little so that the when virus enters us, it finds a hostile, uncomfortable environment rather than a nice cozy home.

The science behind it's use treating COVID-19, and why it should work, is solid. This was never a case of, "Hey! We got this anti-malaria drug that we gave to people and it seems to help fight the coronavirus although we don't know why. Let's keep giving it to people in the blind hope it seems to work for whatever reason".

[Long Duck Dong]

thats pretty crazy... high body acidity is associated with almost every type of internal human disease which is why health experts say in general to eat your fruits, veggies, drink tons of water to keep yourself alkaline.

that drug almost sounds like a form of chemo, poisoning yourself a little bit, but the virus a lot.

Maybe I got ph balance it doesn't like in reverse. I'm going by a YT video of a doctor explaining the science of behind how the drug has an effect on COVID-19. But yes, I think this drug does weaken the body in some respects

Maybe someone could do a little research on that. Just got a little busy with work.

[FKAri]

This seems to be trashing it:

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/hydroxychloroquine-and-azithromycin-versus-covid-19/


I have no knowledge in this area so I don't know one way or another. Just wanted to post a counter view. I guess we'll let the experts debate it out.

[Long Duck Dong]

This seems to be trashing it:

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/hydroxychloroquine-and-azithromycin-versus-covid-19/


I have no knowledge in this area so I don't know one way or another. Just wanted to post a counter view. I guess we'll let the experts debate it out.

Seems like a legit professionally written article


That didn’t stop America’s Quack Dr. Oz and other grifters from touting Raoult’s study, as well as a handful of “miracle cure”


That said, this French professor does seem like a quack. But hydroxychloroquine was being used to treat COVID-19 long before he wrote combining it with Azithromycin was the ticket to success. Malaysia was the one country using it right from the start and their death rate is even lower than South Korea who was also using it. It was even being used to treat the SARS coronavirus over 15 years ago.

[highwhey]

You bring the carne ranchera, I'll bring my suergra's homemade tortillas :cheers:

on my way :cheers:

[Stephonit]

This seems to be trashing it:

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/hydroxychloroquine-and-azithromycin-versus-covid-19/


I have no knowledge in this area so I don't know one way or another. Just wanted to post a counter view. I guess we'll let the experts debate it out.

An apologist website that has never seriously criticized the stupidity that goes on in the health area. By the way azithromycin should usually be contraindicated when taking chloroquine. But these aren't normal times.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmcQMCB2li8

[Long Duck Dong]

Still waiting on the results of the bigger trials to come in but a doctor who treated 47 elderly patients with hydroxychloroquine had pretty good success. The elderly have a much higher mortality rate with COVID-19 but 38 recovered, 7 needed to go to the hospital and 2 died. However the doctor could not use Azithromycin with elderly patients because it elevates the heart rates to dangerous levels for older patients. Instead he substituted Azithromycin with a common inflammatory drug.

https://nypost.com/2020/04/04/long-island-doctor-tries-new-hydroxychloroquine-for-covid-19-patients/

[Long Duck Dong]

Trump sparring with Indian PM over hydroxychloroquine. The US has a huge order that's supposed to be sent here but the India PM placed a ban on the export of the drug after the order was already placed. Trump says the US needs it more than anyone else in the world atm but Indian PM says he needs it for his own people

[TheMan]

Trump sparring with Indian PM over hydroxychloroquine. The US has a huge order that's supposed to be sent here but the India PM placed a ban on the export of the drug after the order was already placed. Trump says the US needs it more than anyone else in the world atm but Indian PM says he needs it for his own people

https://www.google.com/amp/s/en.as.com/en/2020/04/04/other_sports/1586014265_026414.amp.html

Anti parasitic drug invermectin is proving effective versus Covid19, more human tests needed but so far it's looking like a viable option...readily available and FDA approved. Get 'er done

[Long Duck Dong]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/en.as.com/en/2020/04/04/other_sports/1586014265_026414.amp.html

Anti parasitic drug invermectin is proving effective versus Covid19, more human tests needed but so far it's looking like a viable option...readily available and FDA approved. Get 'er done

I hope the FDA doesn't stand in the way of this like they did with hydroxychloroquine. If doctors, hospitals, researchers and hell even patients want to take a chance with an FDA approved drug that's being repurposed for COVID-19 they should be able to do so until a sure fire treatment plan has been formed and available to most Americans.

[TheMan]

I hope the FDA doesn't stand in the way of this like they did with hydroxychloroquine. If doctors, hospitals, researchers and hell even patients want to take a chance with an FDA approved drug that's being repurposed for COVID-19 they should be able to do so until a sure fire treatment plan has been formed and available to most Americans.
This 100%...if you get really sick, you got nothing left to lose.

[Long Duck Dong]

Trump laying down the common sense to the media who are wishing Americans will die so Trump will be wrong about hydroxychloroquine hopefully helping us.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QEtZGZdUGwA

[Hawker]

Trump laying down the common sense to the media who are wishing Americans will die so Trump will be wrong about hydroxychloroquine hopefully helping us.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QEtZGZdUGwA

I do not understand why american media acts so self-important.

[Axe]

I do not understand why american media acts so self-important.
They need to brainwash a lot of people.

[ZenMaster]

Trump laying down the common sense to the media who are wishing Americans will die so Trump will be wrong about hydroxychloroquine hopefully helping us.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QEtZGZdUGwA

They want to act like it's all for the good of the people, but it's clear they're foaming around the mouth for the death total to be high and the economy to take a hit.

It's such common sense why you'd take a chance on these drugs without going through the long testing period when in a time of crisis, but they have to oppose him to rile up their base.
It's shameless "reporting", and I hope people see through how utterly stupid it is.

[Long Duck Dong]

They want to act like it's all for the good of the people, but it's clear they're foaming around the mouth for the death total to be high and the economy to take a hit.

It's such common sense why you'd take a chance on these drugs without going through the long testing period when in a time of crisis, but they have to oppose him to rile up their base.
It's shameless "reporting", and I hope people see through how utterly stupid it is.

It's pure insanity. The drug is being stockpiled and used by basically every nation on earth to battle COVID-19. Some nations are prescribing it to every infected person in the early stages. A poll of over 6200 doctors from 30 countries rate hydroxychloroquine as the most promising drug to combat COVID-19 that's available atm. And all Trump is saying is try it, if it doesn't work fine but it's what many doctors think can help. Yet the media act like he's the only guy on Earth promoting it and all doctors, and science itself, are against it.

The TDS among the media is real.

[coin24]

I do not understand why american media acts so self-important.


Trumps been ethering CNN activists daily now:oldlol:

[MaxFly]

The malaria drugs touted by President Donald Trump as potentially “the biggest game changers in the history of medicine” have received a decidedly more sober assessment of their coronavirus-fighting potential from researchers in China, France and Brazil.

In research done in France, hydroxychloroquine reduced neither deaths nor admissions to intensive care units among patients who received it. In a study conducted in China and another in Brazil, the two drugs failed to help patients clear the coronavirus faster.

A few people died from complications due to high doses.

[Cleverness]

A few people died from complications due to high doses.

Why did the doctors give them high doses?

[Hawker]

If it doesn't work, it doesn't work and need to move on to something else.

[MaxFly]

Why did the doctors give them high doses?

Trials generally require the testing of various dosages of a drug in order to determine the efficacy of the drug and ultimately the ideal dosage.

[Cleverness]

Trials generally require the testing of various dosages of a drug in order to determine the efficacy of the drug and ultimately the ideal dosage.

Sure, but the drug has been around for a very long time, so general 'safe doses' have already been established.

The quote you used seemed to suggest that those 'few people dying' was somehow Trump's fault.

I haven't read any of the studies on azithromycin/hydroxychloroquine/zinc for treating COVID-19, but I find it interesting that a poll found 65 percent of physicians in United States would prescribe chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID-19 in a family member. I hope those physicians are basing their decision on... some kind of evidence

[Hawker]

Sure, but the drug has been around for a very long time, so general 'safe doses' have already been established.

The quote you used seemed to suggest that those 'few people dying' was somehow Trump's fault.

I haven't read any of the studies on azithromycin/hydroxychloroquine/zinc for treating COVID-19, but I find it interesting that a poll found 65 percent of physicians in United States would prescribe chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID-19 in a family member. I hope those physicians are basing their decision on... some kind of evidence

His quote doesn't even reference the high dosing?

Every article that tries to "criticize" trump for promoting the drug seems to omit the facts the doctors are prescribing this to try and prevent the spread. This is such dishonest journalism and dismissive of the work that doctors provide to the general public. Are doctors not highly educated individuals on the front lines? They are. Why shouldn't their opinion be considered? They are taking a hedged approach as well.

Yes, there isn't "concrete" evidence that it works but it simply takes time for this clear cut, 100% evidence to come about. The individuals who want to wait for this are the scientists that don't live in the world of real life circumstances or won't take an evidence based guess because the evidence is only 99% clear and not 100% clear.

It's like the differences between scientists the work in labs and engineers who work in the real world. We recognize the work scientists do but have to remind them that we have to consider more than just the science.

You can have an opinion that goes down the middle.

[bladefd]

Sure, but the drug has been around for a very long time, so general 'safe doses' have already been established.

The quote you used seemed to suggest that those 'few people dying' was somehow Trump's fault.

I haven't read any of the studies on azithromycin/hydroxychloroquine/zinc for treating COVID-19, but I find it interesting that a poll found 65 percent of physicians in United States would prescribe chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID-19 in a family member. I hope those physicians are basing their decision on... some kind of evidence

When you use something off-label, the dosage would differ depending on what it is being used for and the patient factors (weight, age, etc). Dosage for fighting malaria would not necessarily be the same for covid-19

[LostCause]

As someone who recently had a mildly serious bout with Covid (Had early pneumonia along with it) I can't speak to the efficacy of taking the hydroxychloroquine but I was prescribed Zpack (azithromycin) which helped immensely with the pneumonia at least. In addition to that I was drinking lots of echinacea tea, taking manuka honey (medicinal grade) and drinking honey/lemon tea and using eucalyptus/tea tree essential oil steams. I also ate a LOT of chicken noodle soup with garlic. It wasn't fun and I can't guarantee any of this actually led to my recovery but these things did help ease some symptoms as sleeping was really difficult and near impossible for most of it. I want to add that the echinacea can produce mixed results since it causes your immune system to work harder (It's been reported antibodies produced by your immune response can cause covid to worsen in some people)

Of course I added Zinc where I could also (I say that because there was a lot of vomiting involved so it was difficult keeping things down)

I'll be going in to get some new tests run soon to ensure I'm free of the virus, but for the most part most my symptoms are gone. Absolutely terrible experience though I wouldn't wish on anyone, and this coming from someone pretty healthy and active which the doctors kept reminding me is why I'd recover

[DoctorP]

As someone who recently had a mildly serious bout with Covid (Had early pneumonia along with it) I can't speak to the efficacy of taking the hydroxychloroquine but I was prescribed Zpack (azithromycin) which helped immensely with the pneumonia at least. In addition to that I was drinking lots of echinacea tea, taking manuka honey (medicinal grade) and drinking honey/lemon tea and using eucalyptus/tea tree essential oil steams. I also ate a LOT of chicken noodle soup with garlic. It wasn't fun and I can't guarantee any of this actually led to my recovery but these things did help ease some symptoms as sleeping was really difficult and near impossible for most of it. I want to add that the echinacea can produce mixed results since it causes your immune system to work harder (It's been reported antibodies produced by your immune response can cause covid to worsen in some people)

Of course I added Zinc where I could also (I say that because there was a lot of vomiting involved so it was difficult keeping things down)

I'll be going in to get some new tests run soon to ensure I'm free of the virus, but for the most part most my symptoms are gone. Absolutely terrible experience though I wouldn't wish on anyone, and this coming from someone pretty healthy and active which the doctors kept reminding me is why I'd recover

thumbs up, mate. congrats on the recovery. i had a hell of a flu earlier this year and i feel for ya

[BarberSchool]

thumbs up, mate. congrats on the recovery. i had a hell of a flu earlier this year and i feel for yaWhen did you have it and what were your symptoms ?

[BarberSchool]

Data of the earlier large clinical trials should be finished soon.

In the meantime, Swiss pharma giant Novartis, is yet another big time power player getting in on Plaquenil/Zpak action, expect data for this in May:

https://www.novartis.com/news/media-releases/novartis-sponsor-large-clinical-trial-hydroxychloroquine-hospitalized-covid-19-patients

[BarberSchool]

Also, some suspicious news regarding Remdesivir (which many vocal opponents of Plaquenil/Zpak seemed to publicly tout in concert)

While it doesn’t dispute the drug’s possible effectiveness, it’s unclear if Gilead owns the full rights to the patent, as a Chinese Entity apparently may still own the majority of the patent rights. It stands to reason that:

1. if one owns rights to the cure...

2. They have no morals or ethics that their nation was bound by back in the 1970’s by signing an international treaty....

That they may have something to do with it’s intentional/accidental release into public, thru any number of scenarios with plausible deniability, among which the Wet market that was so close to the Wuhan Institute of Virology, would be a perfect release point with acceptable levels of plausible deniability in a stubbornly dishonest culture like that of the CCP.

[MaxFly]

Sure, but the drug has been around for a very long time, so general 'safe doses' have already been established.


Going to say it again. Trials generally require the testing of various dosages of a drug in order to determine the efficacy of the drug and ultimately the ideal dosage.

Different diseases and illnesses can often require different doses of the same medication. Different people often require different doses of the same medication for the same illness depending on their weight, medical history and the other medications they take. In fact, the same disease in the same person can require different doses of the same medication over the course of the illness depending on how virulent their illness is at a given time.


The quote you used seemed to suggest that those 'few people dying' was somehow Trump's fault.

I'm not sure how you arrived at the conclusion that I and/or the writer of the article was blaming Trump for deaths, but I'm not. These were clinical trials and studies that took place in France, China and Brazil to determine whether hydroxychloroquine was useful in battling COVID-19. Trump was mentioned because he jumped ahead of the release of solid evidence-based studies to tout the drug before appropriate trials could be carried out and reported on... not because he was responsible for deaths. The studies and trials referenced indicate that Trump should have held off and waited for a more definitive assessment stemming from studies by doctors and scientists. Even these studies aren't conclusive. We need more information even beyond these three.

[MaxFly]

There was a larger, yet still not rigorous study done in the US. The good thing is that the NIH is funding other, likely larger, studies... I'm guessing with tighter controls.


A malaria drug widely touted by President Donald Trump for treating the new coronavirus showed no benefit in a large analysis of its use in U.S. veterans hospitals. There were more deaths among those given hydroxychloroquine versus standard care, researchers reported.

The nationwide study was not a rigorous experiment. But with 368 patients, it’s the largest look so far of hydroxychloroquine with or without the antibiotic azithromycin for COVID-19, which has killed more than 171,000 people as of Tuesday.

The study was posted on an online site for researchers and has been submitted to the New England Journal of Medicine, but has not been reviewed by other scientists. Grants from the National Institutes of Health and the University of Virginia paid for the work.

The NIH and others have more rigorous tests underway.

[Facepalm]

Not a lot of mea culpas today going around by the media and politicians who said hydroxychloroquine was dangerous to use(despite it's side effect track record being well documented for decades). It's now FDA approved for COVID-19. No word yet from the Michigan governor who says she will yank the medical license of anyone using it to treat COVID-19, nor from Nevada or Hawaii who told doctors not to use it within their states.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/22/media/fox-news-hydroxychloroquine-reliable-sources/index.html




Fox News has fallen out of love with hydroxychloroquine. After weeks of unrelenting coverage hyping the antimalarial drug as a potential game-changing treatment for the coronavirus, the network has all but stopped mentioning it on its airwaves. So has President Donald Trump.


The quiet abandonment of hydroxychloroquine comes as studies indicate it is not an effective treatment against the coronavirus. A French study found last week that the drug does not help patients with the virus. And on Tuesday, a study of hundreds of patents at US Veterans Health Administration medical centers found that patients who took hydroxychloroquine were no less likely to need ventilation and had higher death rates than those who didn't take the drug.





Despite having previously pushed the drug as a possible treatment, neither Tucker Carlson nor Sean Hannity mentioned the study on their Fox News shows Tuesday night. I didn't see Laura Ingraham, who reportedly visited the White House to promote the drug, discuss it either. Fox published a digital story on the Tuesday study, but it fell off the website's homepage after a few hours. And, according to CNN's Betsy Klein, Trump hasn't mentioned it in a week...




From March 23 to April 6, Fox News personalities and guests mentioned hydroxychloroquine nearly 300 times. But that's changed in recent days. Media Matters found that between April 16 to April 20 mentions of the drug dropped 77% compared to the previous five-day period.


Trump dodges question

During Tuesday's White House briefing, Trump — who repeatedly asked what Americans had to lose by taking the drug — was asked about the new VA study. He pleaded ignorance. "I don't know of the report," Trump said. He promised the White House will be "looking at it."




"These findings highlight the importance of awaiting the results of ongoing prospective, randomized, controlled studies"
While Tuesday VA study — funded by the National Institutes of Health and the University of Virginia — raised significant red flags, it's also important to note that it was not peer reviewed. As the authors wrote, "These findings highlight the importance of awaiting the results of ongoing prospective, randomized, controlled studies before widespread adoption of these drugs." Which is why it was so irresponsible for Fox personalities and the President to jump the gun and promote the drug as a possible game-changer before the scientific evidence was in...

https://media1.tenor.com/images/112f98db4b2070e60996de58549e7067/tenor.gif?itemid=16257769

[Hawker]

As someone who recently had a mildly serious bout with Covid (Had early pneumonia along with it) I can't speak to the efficacy of taking the hydroxychloroquine but I was prescribed Zpack (azithromycin) which helped immensely with the pneumonia at least. In addition to that I was drinking lots of echinacea tea, taking manuka honey (medicinal grade) and drinking honey/lemon tea and using eucalyptus/tea tree essential oil steams. I also ate a LOT of chicken noodle soup with garlic. It wasn't fun and I can't guarantee any of this actually led to my recovery but these things did help ease some symptoms as sleeping was really difficult and near impossible for most of it. I want to add that the echinacea can produce mixed results since it causes your immune system to work harder (It's been reported antibodies produced by your immune response can cause covid to worsen in some people)

Of course I added Zinc where I could also (I say that because there was a lot of vomiting involved so it was difficult keeping things down)

I'll be going in to get some new tests run soon to ensure I'm free of the virus, but for the most part most my symptoms are gone. Absolutely terrible experience though I wouldn't wish on anyone, and this coming from someone pretty healthy and active which the doctors kept reminding me is why I'd recover

I don't remember the amounts but I think the original concoction was Hydoxylchloroquine + Z Pack + Zinc to try and stem the symptoms. Gald you're feeling better and that the Z Pack worked.

[bladefd]

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/22/media/fox-news-hydroxychloroquine-reliable-sources/index.html



https://media1.tenor.com/images/112f98db4b2070e60996de58549e7067/tenor.gif?itemid=16257769

This is exactly why you have to do a study before you start touting a drug.. It's dangerous and ill-advised.

Wait for the scientists/doctors to finish the damn study. FauxNews didn't help matters one bit - they came storming in yelling how it is the treatment option along with their dear leader Lil Donny and crying conspiracy about liberals trying to stop the sure treatment BEFORE SCIENTISTS COULD TEST/VERIFY IT! Then surely they went into hiding quickly going hush-hush the moment this study comes out.. I actually think there should be a class-action filed against FauxNews/LilDonny by family of anyone who took hydroxychloroquine and still died from covid-19. I would be curious to see how a judge would rule :confusedshrug:

[Hawker]

This is exactly why you have to do a study before you start touting a drug.. It's dangerous and ill-advised.

Wait for the scientists/doctors to finish the damn study. FauxNews didn't help matters one bit - they came storming in yelling how it is the treatment option along with their dear leader Lil Donny and crying conspiracy about liberals trying to stop the sure treatment BEFORE SCIENTISTS COULD TEST/VERIFY IT! Then surely they went into hiding quickly going hush-hush the moment this study comes out.. I actually think there should be a class-action filed against FauxNews/LilDonny by family of anyone who took hydroxychloroquine and still died from covid-19. I would be curious to see how a judge would rule :confusedshrug:

Plenty of doctors were issuing out the drugs dude but keep trying to blame Trump. The problem with liberals is they were ignoring the doctors issuing it out as if they have no expertise or knowledge as well. You're taking it waaaay too partisan. The scientists in the lab don't have to take real world circumstances into consideration.

[Long Duck Dong]

This is exactly why you have to do a study before you start touting a drug.. It's dangerous and ill-advised.

Wait for the scientists/doctors to finish the damn study. FauxNews didn't help matters one bit - they came storming in yelling how it is the treatment option along with their dear leader Lil Donny and crying conspiracy about liberals trying to stop the sure treatment BEFORE SCIENTISTS COULD TEST/VERIFY IT! Then surely they went into hiding quickly going hush-hush the moment this study comes out.. I actually think there should be a class-action filed against FauxNews/LilDonny by family of anyone who took hydroxychloroquine and still died from covid-19. I would be curious to see how a judge would rule :confusedshrug:

If there's nothing else to offer atm, it's worth the risk. The media is trying to make hydroxychloroquine seem very risky to take but I have yet to see any of them point out that some people take hydroxychloroquine FOR LIFE. Yes there will be some who will receive side effects but not many. Most of the people who've experienced bad side effects have taken it for years or took over the recommended dosage. If people take this drug for life it's certainly isn't going to cause very many harm over the course of a few days.

Keep in mind if you are blaming Trump your are also blaming most physicians in general. Over 50% over doctors who tried to combat COVID-19 in the US with a drug used hydroxychloroquine

[bladefd]

If there's nothing else to offer atm, it's worth the risk. The media is trying to make hydroxychloroquine seem very risky to take but I have yet to see any of them point out that some people take hydroxychloroquine FOR LIFE. Yes there will be some who will receive side effects but not many. Most of the people who've experienced bad side effects have taken it for years or took over the recommended dosage. If people take this drug for life it's certainly isn't going to cause very many harm over the course of a few days.

Keep in mind if you are blaming Trump your are also blaming most physicians in general. Over 50% over doctors who tried to combat COVID-19 in the US with a drug used hydroxychloroquine

I blame anyone who was publicly touting this as the treatment. We are still waiting for the two double-blinded placebo studies to finish. Lets be patient and not call it one way or the other until those results are out. If the studies show it doesn't work, are you going to see an apology by Lil Donny or FauxNews?? Yeah, never going to happen :oldlol:

If the studies show it works then I will publicly apologize in this thread, I promise you.

[andgar923]

The problem is Trump was telling people it was THE wonder drug.
Trump was literally telling people NOT to use the other methods.

And as we found out, he and his buddies were making cheese of this. They were making a profit from this, rushing a yet unproven drug, a drug that had it's results altered for political/financial purposes. Researchers were literally told to ignore findings that didn't fit their agenda even when the tests themselves were edited to have positive results.

Do some of you not see how this is criminal? This would land multiple people in jail, it would result in large lawsuits under normal circumstances.

Trump is literally telling people to take something that's proven to kill people while being questionable to be effective, this is a modern day 'snake oil'.

[Cleverness]

Going to say it again. Trials generally require the testing of various dosages of a drug in order to determine the efficacy of the drug and ultimately the ideal dosage.

Different diseases and illnesses can often require different doses of the same medication. Different people often require different doses of the same medication for the same illness depending on their weight, medical history and the other medications they take. In fact, the same disease in the same person can require different doses of the same medication over the course of the illness depending on how virulent their illness is at a given time.

I'm not sure how you arrived at the conclusion that I and/or the writer of the article was blaming Trump for deaths, but I'm not. These were clinical trials and studies that took place in France, China and Brazil to determine whether hydroxychloroquine was useful in battling COVID-19. Trump was mentioned because he jumped ahead of the release of solid evidence-based studies to tout the drug before appropriate trials could be carried out and reported on... not because he was responsible for deaths. The studies and trials referenced indicate that Trump should have held off and waited for a more definitive assessment stemming from studies by doctors and scientists. Even these studies aren't conclusive. We need more information even beyond these three.

I'm going to say it again. It's been around for a long time. Just because a drug hasn't undergone a trial to treat xyz doesn't mean we don't have some idea of what doses to try. You don't try 50mg/day of MTX if it was a possible treatment because... it's been around for a long time. Just because a drug hasn't undergone a trial to treat xyz doesn't mean we don't have some idea of what doses to try.

What doses did they use?

I arrived at that conclusion because the quote you used cited president Trump and then you mentioned patients dying from the drug. Unfortunately, like Hawker said, the quote you used didn't even reference high dosing.

Why did 65% of doctors say they would use the treatment for COVID-19?

[Long Duck Dong]

The problem is Trump was telling people it was THE wonder drug.
Trump was literally telling people NOT to use the other methods.

And as we found out, he and his buddies were making cheese of this. They were making a profit from this, rushing a yet unproven drug, a drug that had it's results altered for political/financial purposes. Researchers were literally told to ignore findings that didn't fit their agenda even when the tests themselves were edited to have positive results.

Do some of you not see how this is criminal? This would land multiple people in jail, it would result in large lawsuits under normal circumstances.

Trump is literally telling people to take something that's proven to kill people while being questionable to be effective, this is a modern day 'snake oil'.

You need professional help for your TDS. :oldlol:

It's already been proven that Trump's individual holding of one of the manufacturers of this drug ranges from a low of $95 to a high of $1500. Making cheese though :oldlol:

This is the most commonly prescribed drug to date in the US for COVID-19. Do you think doctors in the US are going to let Trump or any other politician tell them what to prescribe for the patients? Because that's what you are saying. Countries like Italy and Malaysia began prescribing hydroxychloroquine to EVERY early stage COVID-19 patient. Are they under the control of Trump as well. India, the world's leading manufacturer of hydroxychloroquine said they were going to stop exporting hydroxychloroquine and start hoarding it for themselves. Were they under the influence of Trump?

Nobody is dying of hydroxychloroquine after short term use as prescribed by a doctor. The only people that have died are those Nigerians who started popping them like antacid pills. Once again, people take this drug for decades with only a small percentage experiencing serious side effects. Harmful side effects to someone taking it under a doctor's guidance over the period of a few days or couple of weeks is minuscule. Keep in mind around 1000 people a year die from common aspirin and an equal amount or more die from OTC ibuprofen.

[MaxFly]

I'm going to say it again. It's been around for a long time. Just because a drug hasn't undergone a trial to treat xyz doesn't mean we don't have some idea of what doses to try. You don't try 50mg/day of MTX if it was a possible treatment because... it's been around for a long time. Just because a drug hasn't undergone a trial to treat xyz doesn't mean we don't have some idea of what doses to try.

The very point of these kinds of studies and trials is to figure out whether a medication is effective in treating a specific illness or disease and what dosages work best in treating the specific illness or disease in question. Individuals with Lupus or MCTD take a range of doses of Hydroxychloroquine depending on the severity of their disease. Some take small doses, some take moderate doses, and others take high doses. Doctors generally monitor a person's response to new drugs at all doses closely to look out for side effects or complications that may arise. In the case of this study, a few patients died from complications due to high doses. If you've ever paid attention to a drug commercial, you should be well aware that medications can result in side affects and even death for some individuals.


I arrived at that conclusion because the quote you used cited president Trump and then you mentioned patients dying from the drug. Unfortunately, like Hawker said, the quote you used didn't even reference high dosing.

Why did 65% of doctors say they would use the treatment for COVID-19?

The section of the article I posted cited Trump because he has publicly touted the drug even in the absence of clinical studies and trials evaluating its efficacy in treating COVID-19. The results of three studies came out questioning (not disproving) its efficacy in treating COVID-19. I also pointed out that a few people died from complications. I'm not sure how anyone could draw the conclusion that Trump was to blame for anyone's death unless they believe that Trump forced doctors in France, China and Brazil to do studies. There's a ridiculous jump in logic from "Trump prematurely touted this drug" to "so you're saying he is responsible for the deaths of people in other countries who were given high doses during a clinical study to see if those high doses worked in battling COVID-19."

As for why doctors say they would use it to treat COVID-19, I gather that many of them have heard there was some success in treating patients with it... and in the absence of alternatives, would try it. Their commitment to trying it as a treatment option does not mean that it works.

Are you in agreement that Trump should not have publicly touted Hydroxychloroquine as a game changer?

Have you read the new study the came out yesterday?

[Real Men Wear Green]

When did we start infecting science with politics? I'm just talking about here in America not worldwide.

[bladefd]

Looks like remdesivir may be another flop


According to the summary of the China study, remdesivir was “not associated with a difference in time to clinical improvement” compared to a standard of care control. After one month, it appeared 13.9% of the remdesivir patients had died compared to 12.8% of patients in the control arm. The difference was not statistically significant.https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/23/data-on-gileads-remdesivir-released-by-accident-show-no-benefit-for-coronavirus-patients/

Waited for study to be peer-reviewed

[MaxFly]

Perhaps light, heat and disinfectants will work as treatments? After White House officials shared findings on the effects of sunlight and common cleaning supplies on the coronavirus on Thursday, Trump suggested heat, light and disinfectant be looked into as possible treatments. Trump is really on the cutting edge of medical science.


So, supposedly when we hit the body with a tremendous, whether it’s ultraviolet or just very powerful light, and I think you said that hasn’t been checked, but you’re going to test it. And then I said supposing you brought the light inside the body, which you can do either through the skin or in some other way. And I think you said you’re going to test that too. Sounds interesting, right? And then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in one minute. And is there a way we can do something like that by injection inside or almost a cleaning because you see it gets in the lungs and it does a tremendous number on the lungs, so it’d be interesting to check that so that you’re going to have to use medical doctors with, but it sounds interesting to me.


:facepalm

[highwhey]

Perhaps light, heat and disinfectants will work as treatments? After White House officials shared findings on the effects of sunlight and common cleaning supplies on the coronavirus on Thursday, Trump suggested heat, light and disinfectant be looked into as possible treatments. Trump is really on the cutting edge of medical science.



:facepalm

I mean, I've thought about it too.

The hand wipes I am using have been proven to kill coronavirus. Ingredients? Lemongrass oil and 2 other plant based, natural, ingredients. No bleach or alcohol.

[Stephonit]

I mean, I've thought about it too.

The hand wipes I am using have been proven to kill coronavirus. Ingredients? Lemongrass oil and 2 other plant based, natural, ingredients. No bleach or alcohol.

So we're back to eating garlic and getting enough vitamin C.

[MaxFly]

I mean, I've thought about it too.

The hand wipes I am using have been proven to kill coronavirus. Ingredients? Lemongrass oil and 2 other plant based, natural, ingredients. No bleach or alcohol.

You've thought about using disinfectant, light and heat to clean your lungs and kill the virus in your body?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zicGxU5MfwE

[MaxFly]

I haven't really been tracking the Rick Bright story. Seems like he is serious about being a whistle blower.


...just hours after that April 4 press conference, White House officials pushed ahead with a massive behind-the-scenes pressure campaign on the government’s top health officials to deliver huge amounts of chloroquine drugs to just about anyone who wanted them, according to documents reviewed by Vanity Fair. That night, Brett Giroir, the assistant secretary for health in the Department of Health and Human Services, sent an email with the subject line “Hydroxychloroquine” to a group including FEMA administrator Pete Gaynor, HHS assistant secretary for preparedness and response Robert Kadlec, and Navy Rear Admiral John Polowczyk, who leads a supply-chain task force at FEMA.

The email read:

--------------------

WH call. Really want to flood Ny and NJ with treatment courses. Hospitals have it. Sick out patients don’t. And can’t get. So go through distribution channels as we discussed. If we have 29 million perhaps send a few million ASAP? WH wants follow up in AM.

We can get a lot more of this. Right Bob? Millions per week?

--------------------

The emails indicate that the administration’s top health officials were closely involved in a frenzied effort to make unproven chloroquine treatments widely available, even though the FDA’s new emergency rule limited distribution of the drug as a COVID-19 treatment to hospitalized patients. One hour after the first email, Gaynor replied to Kadlec, Giroir, and Polowczyk, seeming to suggest that FDA commissioner Stephen Hahn was on board with expanding COVID-19 patients’ access to the drug: “Hahn asked to distribute to hospitals and the drug stores.”

In a second email that appears to have been sent the same night, Gaynor indicated that he was working closely with Rear Admiral Polowczyk: “Me and Adm P are on it. More to follow in the am.”

The intra–White House battle over the use of chloroquine drugs for treating COVID-19 broke into the open in dramatic fashion on April 21, when the administration’s top coronavirus vaccine developer, Rick Bright, was pushed out of his position as the head of the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (BARDA), a small agency within HHS that partners with private scientific ventures to create vaccines, drugs, and diagnostics. The next day Bright issued a statement, first reported by the New York Times, stating that he was fired for resisting efforts “to fund potentially dangerous drugs promoted by those with political connections.”

“Specifically, and contrary to misguided directives,” he said, “I limited the broad use of chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine, promoted by the administration as a panacea, but which clearly lack scientific merit.” On April 23, attorneys for Bright said they would file a formal whistleblower complaint on his behalf.

Under the plan, which set off alarm bells within the health agencies, chloroquine drugs would be available to patients through pharmacies, not just to hospitalized patients. “There wasn’t a plan for physician oversight or monitoring,” one federal official told Vanity Fair. “That’s what concerned clinicians the most. Career FDA, NIH, CDC, and BARDA [personnel] were all very concerned about lack of physician oversight or adverse event monitoring with the expanded-access program.”


That last part is pretty disturbing. I'm guessing Bright and others started leaking e-mails.

[Cleverness]

The very point of these kinds of studies and trials is to figure out whether a medication is effective in treating a specific illness or disease and what dosages work best in treating the specific illness or disease in question. Individuals with Lupus or MCTD take a range of doses of Hydroxychloroquine depending on the severity of their disease. Some take small doses, some take moderate doses, and others take high doses. Doctors generally monitor a person's response to new drugs at all doses closely to look out for side effects or complications that may arise. In the case of this study, a few patients died from complications due to high doses. If you've ever paid attention to a drug commercial, you should be well aware that medications can result in side affects and even death for some individuals.



The section of the article I posted cited Trump because he has publicly touted the drug even in the absence of clinical studies and trials evaluating its efficacy in treating COVID-19. The results of three studies came out questioning (not disproving) its efficacy in treating COVID-19. I also pointed out that a few people died from complications. I'm not sure how anyone could draw the conclusion that Trump was to blame for anyone's death unless they believe that Trump forced doctors in France, China and Brazil to do studies. There's a ridiculous jump in logic from "Trump prematurely touted this drug" to "so you're saying he is responsible for the deaths of people in other countries who were given high doses during a clinical study to see if those high doses worked in battling COVID-19."

As for why doctors say they would use it to treat COVID-19, I gather that many of them have heard there was some success in treating patients with it... and in the absence of alternatives, would try it. Their commitment to trying it as a treatment option does not mean that it works.

Are you in agreement that Trump should not have publicly touted Hydroxychloroquine as a game changer?

Have you read the new study the came out yesterday?

Let me just say I have never had a lot of confidence in this drug combo w zpak/zinc being a miracle cure.

I appreciate the time you took to type all that out, but... the drug has been approved for safety since the 1950s... there is a lot of pharmacokenetic/pharmacodynamic/MoA data on this drug ... overwhelming majority (my guess 90-95%+) who are taking it for RA/SLE are taking 200 mg bid... so like I said we have a general idea of where to start our dosing regimen.

With that in mind,
Did you ever post here what high doses they were using? I think Hawker and I brought it up a couple of times, but your quote talked about Trump and not the high doses you wrote about.

I think we'd have to take a deep dive into each study to evaluate how/when to use it, but it seems like some studies show benefit? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32205204 (first one I saw when I searched Didier Raoult study)


Despite its small sample size our survey shows that hydroxychloroquine treatment is significantly associated with viral load reduction/disappearance in COVID-19 patients and its effect is reinforced by azithromycin.

That study was using 600 mg qday and zpak

[Cleverness]

You've thought about using disinfectant, light and heat to clean your lungs and kill the virus in your body?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zicGxU5MfwE

I was hearing today that what he said/did was horrendous and millions of Americans would be drinking bleach by the end of the week to protect themselves from COVID-19.

But... now that I've heard it for myself, it's actually not that bad?

I'm cringing a little bit as he's speaking, but he sounds exactly like a regular guy who just got done watching a complex video/presentation intended for and given by MDs/PhDs, and then tried to dumb it all down for regular America. :confusedshrug:

[SATAN]

Keep making excuses for him.

"Dumb it down for.." He literally thinks US citizens are stupid. It's blatantly obvious it's just a stupid game to him.

[MaxFly]

I was hearing today that what he said/did was horrendous and millions of Americans would be drinking bleach by the end of the week to protect themselves from COVID-19.

But... now that I've heard it for myself, it's actually not that bad?

I'm cringing a little bit as he's speaking, but he sounds exactly like a regular guy who just got done watching a complex video/presentation intended for and given by MDs/PhDs, and then tried to dumb it all down for regular America. :confusedshrug:

You think a "regular guy in America" would hear that UV light, heat and disinfectants are effective in destroying coronavirus outdoors and on surfaces and think to himself, "Hey, that could probably be used as a treatment in the human body. Maybe they could inject some disinfectant to clean the lungs"? Is that what you think of "regular America?" What does it say about Trump that he, by your assessment, "dumbed down" the information presented (that was not in anyway complex, lol), but did so in completely the wrong way and took it way left?

[Cleverness]

You think a "regular guy in America" would hear that UV light, heat and disinfectants are effective in destroying coronavirus outdoors and on surfaces and think to himself, "Hey, that could probably be used as a treatment in the human body. Maybe they could inject some disinfectant to clean the lungs"? Is that what you think of "regular America?" What does it say about Trump that he, by your assessment, "dumbed down" the information presented (that was not in anyway complex, lol), but did so in completely the wrong way and took it way left?

It really does sound like he watched a presentation way above his knowledge level and what came out of his mouth is his interpretation of what he learned.

He speaks his mind. As president of the US, doing this will get you in trouble, especially if the media hates you. If he starts to inject bleach into people I'll be concerned. Otherwise I'll just cringe/facepalm at what he says and try to focus on what he does policy-wise.

[DoctorP]

It really does sound like he watched a presentation way above his knowledge level and what came out of his mouth is his interpretation of what he learned.

He speaks his mind. As president of the US, doing this will get you in trouble, especially if the media hates you. If he starts to inject bleach into people I'll be concerned. Otherwise I'll just cringe/facepalm at what he says and try to focus on what he does policy-wise.

yeah. this has been the M.O. but he should try to stop blabbering his ass off. he enjoys it

[MaxFly]

It really does sound like he watched a presentation way above his knowledge level and what came out of his mouth is his interpretation of what he learned.

He speaks his mind. As president of the US, doing this will get you in trouble, especially if the media hates you. If he starts to inject bleach into people I'll be concerned. Otherwise I'll just cringe/facepalm at what he says and try to focus on what he does policy-wise.

It's pretty clear that Trump was unaware that disinfectants cannot be used inside the human body. This is what actually preceded his comments:


Acting Under Secretary of the Department of Homeland Security, Bill Bryan, says:

If I may have the first slide, please. And while that’s coming up, our most striking observation to date is the powerful effect that solar light appears to have on killing the virus — both surfaces and in the air. We’ve seen a similar effect with both temperature and humidity as well, where increasing the temperature and humidity or both is generally less favorable to the virus.

If you look at the first three lines, when you see the word “surface,” we’re talking about nonporous surfaces: door handles, stainless steel. And if you look at the — as the temperature increases, as the humidity increases, with no sun involved, you can see how drastically the half-life goes down on that virus. So the virus is dying at a much more rapid pace, just from exposure to higher temperatures and just from exposure to humidity. If you look at the fourth line, you inject summer — the sunlight into that. You inject UV rays into that. The same effects on line two — as 70 to 35 degrees with 80 percent humidity on the surface. And look at line four, but now you inject the sun. The half-life goes from six hours to two minutes. That’s how much of an impact UV rays has on the virus.

We’re also testing disinfectants readily available. We’ve tested bleach, we’ve tested isopropyl alcohol on the virus, specifically in saliva or in respiratory fluids. And I can tell you that bleach will kill the virus in five minutes; isopropyl alcohol will kill the virus in 30 seconds, and that’s with no manipulation, no rubbing — just spraying it on and letting it go. You rub it and it goes away even faster. We’re also looking at other disinfectants, specifically looking at the COVID-19 virus in saliva.

What, in any of that, should confuse the President of the United States so much that he would publicly ask his medical experts whether they have looked into using disinfectants in the human body and that they should look into it? The issue here is that he was unable to properly interpret information from an extremely simple and straight forward presentation... a presentation that should have been well within his knowledge level. We already knew that UV light, heat and disinfectants destroy the coronavirus. The government has been telling people to wipe things down with disinfectant wipes and to wash their hands with soap or alcohol based hand sanitizer for 2 months now.

This isn't about speaking his mind. This is about revealing his knowledge deficit in an area with which he should be well acquainted given the fact that he has been leading the government's response to this pandemic for months. His general behavior, his pushing of hydroxychloroquine, and now this should not engender confidence in his ability to formulate and execute sound policy.

[bladefd]

Half the game is just pure awareness. Pay attention, Donny, at the information being presented. You can occasionally zone out, but just think for a moment before you suggest something that might make you look like a fool. I was always taught since I was a kid to think before you open your mouth... A few times I did the opposite and it made me look bad or just come across as insulting, but I have learned my lesson since those school days

[Cleverness]

You may be disturbed because you're someone who takes a lot of guidance from the president. You shouldn't. Pay attention to what direction we're headed policy-wise. There is no policy regarding forcing people to drink bleach or fish cleaner. It's bad, and I cringe at some of his ramblings, but it's not nearly as bad as you and the media make it.

Also, did you ever post here what high doses they were using? What were the doctors' rationale? When was the med given? It may be helpful to know if they started the regimen early or late. I think Hawker and I brought it up a couple of times, but your quote talked about Trump and not the high doses you wrote about.

[MaxFly]

You may be disturbed because you're someone who takes a lot of guidance from the president. You shouldn't. Pay attention to what direction we're headed policy-wise. There is no policy regarding forcing people to drink bleach or fish cleaner. It's bad, and I cringe at some of his ramblings, but it's not nearly as bad as you and the media make it.


Cleverness, Trump followed up an exceedingly simple and straight forward presentation on the longevity and hardiness of the virus in the open and it's lack of resistance to heat, UV radiation from sunlight and disinfectants by suggesting that his medical experts look into injecting disinfectants into the human body as a treatment. This was part of the presentation...

https://www.chicagotribune.com/resizer/8r3CaLByQ3_NCPn8JCvTPwSpbZ4=/800x533/top/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-tronc.s3.amazonaws.com/public/SIBAOIMPS5BIVKWVVYRJW4NALU.JPG

You went as far as trying to make it sound as if he had just heard a complicated presentation that he felt the need to dumb down for the "regular guy in America." What is disturbing is that the same individual who suggested to medical experts that they look into the use of disinfectants in the body as a cleaning treatment is the same person making policy elsewhere. In what other areas of knowledge is he deficient? Hopefully his advisers are able to prevent that wide deficit in his knowledge base from seeping into policy, but this new bit of foolishness from the President does not engender confidence.


Also, did you ever post here what high doses they were using? What were the doctors' rationale? When was the med given? It may be helpful to know if they started the regimen early or late. I think Hawker and I brought it up a couple of times, but your quote talked about Trump and not the high doses you wrote about.

Haven't you read the reporting regarding the studies done? I posted an except of an article and relayed what the article said. I thought you would have read some of the reporting by now.

https://www.latimes.com/science/story/2020-04-17/malaria-drugs-fails-to-help-coronavirus-patients-in-controlled-studies (https://www.nation.co.ke/news/Study-finds-no-benefit-hydroxychloroquine-for-Covid-19/1056-5534072-15eetht/index.html)

https://www.nation.co.ke/news/Study-finds-no-benefit-hydroxychloroquine-for-Covid-19/1056-5534072-15eetht/index.html

[Long Duck Dong]

There was a larger, yet still not rigorous study done in the US. The good thing is that the NIH is funding other, likely larger, studies... I'm guessing with tighter controls.

This study is being exposed a political hit piece and is literally being called a "sham". Apparently this study was being conducted with only 3 MDs involved and all 3 were eye doctors. It also was using reported numbers from the application of hydroxychloroquine in late stage COVID-19 patients where the drug was not likely to help, as it's been said all along this repurposed drug appears only effective in early stage COVID-19 patients. Like stated, the study included only men, but it was also older men and mostly African Americans who seem more at risk of death than other groups. The study also neglected to include any dosage information.

One expert stated



"I've no idea why [University of Virginia School of Medicine opthamology professor Dr. Jayakrishna Ambati] delved into this study, which isn't a study. It's a sham," Smith said. "I can't believe anyone took this seriously. There's not one dosage listed, cumulative or daily, of hydroxychloriquine or anthromicin. And people call this a study."

"Not one person in that paper saw one COVID patient. Only three are MDs [and] all [those] are ophthalmology trained," Smith said of the research. "It's a sham. It's a shame on UVA. I sent an email to the dean of the medical school at UVA. I have not heard back from them. It is an embarrassment that UVA allows this thing to be called a study."


The Association of American Physicians and Surgeons, a biased, conservative leaning group came out today with a study of 2137 patients, saying 92% improved with the use of hydroxychloroquine. There 63 deaths but all of those minus 11 were given to late stage COVID-19 patients as reported by the Veterans Administration, the same stats used by the VA study hit piece.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/hydroxychloroquine-90-percent-chance-helping-155637974.html

It will be nice to see some unbiased reports coming out soon but by the time doctors figure out conclusively if hydroxychloroquine helps a vaccine will probably already be here. :oldlol:

[Long Duck Dong]

Looks like remdesivir may be another flop

https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/23/data-on-gileads-remdesivir-released-by-accident-show-no-benefit-for-coronavirus-patients/

Waited for study to be peer-reviewed

They are showing positive results with it here in the US according to a study released today by Gilead.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/29/gilead-reports-positive-data-on-remdesivir-coronavirus-drug-trial.html

Again, these are repurposed drugs. Until something else comes along developed to specifically fight COVID-19, it's all we have. But that could take a years. A vaccine is will probably be here much sooner

[BarberSchool]

Bigger study results, fellas:

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.27.20073379v1

Despite huge shilling by NIH board members with past employment by Gilead, several governors who just so happen to be popular with the media, and Tony Fauxi himself, Gilead’s Remdesivir has yet to publish any similar study which shows prevention of death.

What has been published about Remdesivir, is that it decreased sperm counts and possibly permanently damaged the testicular ability of mice:

https://archive.vn/Kx9cB

[DoctorP]

french women.... nuff said

[bladefd]

Fda revoked emergency authorization for Hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine, saying they are unlikely to be effective.

[FKAri]

Fda revoked emergency authorization for Hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine, saying they are unlikely to be effective.

How quickly did you think of this thread once you heard the news? Be honest.

[bladefd]

How quickly did you think of this thread once you heard the news? Be honest.

30 secs

[ZenMaster]

Fda revoked emergency authorization for Hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine, saying they are unlikely to be effective.

Wasn't Hydroxychloroquine supposed to be used in combination with Zinc? I remember reading that it was the reaction of that combination that doctors were successful with and not just either of the two.

Anyways, this is good news, it means that Hydroxychloroquine is available for all doctors to prescribe if they and/or their patients want it.

[bladefd]

WHO is out as well. Hydroxychloroquine dead for covid-19


The World Health Organization is stopping its trial of the hyped drug hydroxychloroquine, it announced Wednesday.

The decision was made on the basis of data from a large, randomized U.K. trial of the drug as well as the data available to the WHO through its own Solidarity trial, said Ana Maria Henao Restrepo, head of the WHO’s research and development group.

The decision to remove the drug from its Solidarity trial came following several events, Restrepo noted. A review of the evidence suggested there was “no apparent beneficial effect of hydroxychloroquine” to treat Covid-19. In addition, the results coming out of the U.K. last Friday indicated that there was no apparent effect on mortality or ventilation during a hospital stay. Finally, there was the Solidarity trial’s own evidence.

This news comes after the WHO paused enrolling patients following findings from a now-retracted study in the Lancet that had indicated that there was an increased risk of heart problems and death in Covid-19 patients who used chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine. The WHO then restarted the trial following a safety review.https://www.politico.com/news/2020/06/17/who-ends-hydroxychloroquine-study-326238

[Hawker]

https://www.henryford.com/news/2020/07/hydro-treatment-study


Treatment with hydroxychloroquine cut the death rate significantly in sick patients hospitalized with COVID-19 – and without heart-related side-effects, according to a new study published by Henry Ford Health System.

In a large-scale retrospective analysis of 2,541 patients hospitalized between March 10 and May 2, 2020 across the system’s six hospitals, the study found 13% of those treated with hydroxychloroquine alone died compared to 26.4% not treated with hydroxychloroquine. None of the patients had documented serious heart abnormalities; however, patients were monitored for a heart condition routinely pointed to as a reason to avoid the drug as a treatment for COVID-19.

The study was published today in the International Journal of Infectious Diseases, the peer-reviewed, open-access online publication of the International Society of Infectious Diseases (ISID.org).

Bladefd was pretty quick last time. Wonder why he was slow to post this?

This study emphasized on treating early while other studies were not. That's the difference.

[Cleverness]

ITT Long Duck Dong was correct to emphasize EARLY treatment in several of his posts.

[bladefd]

https://www.henryford.com/news/2020/07/hydro-treatment-study



Bladefd was pretty quick last time. Wonder why he was slow to post this?

This study emphasized on treating early while other studies were not. That's the difference.

Tell that to Trump's FDA and his appointed coronavirus task force

[Rooster]

Tell that to Trump's FDA and his appointed coronavirus task force

We are stacking Remdisivir so this is definitely the drug of choice. Gilead is about to make billions on a failed Ebola drug.

[tywolcot]

I think this is excellent news, I wish the whole pandemic would have ended sooner, and everything would have returned to its previous state.

[Axe]

I think this is excellent news, I wish the whole pandemic would have ended sooner, and everything would have returned to its previous state.
It will be still lingering for a few years though, especially since a minority of the population are not willing to be vaccinated.