Cavaliers lost game 3 and 4 in 2007 finals by combined 4 points, Bran shot under 40%

[STATUTORY]

BOTH games, going 19/53 from the field in them. His supporting cast played exceedingly well to keep the game close

MJ isn't getting swept that series, tbh the MJ comparison should have ended right then and there

[3ball]

He was obviously garbage in the clutch

Same thing happened in 09' ECF

His fear of contested jumpers causes passivity and weaker shot-making in the clutch

[tpols]

a common misconception was that this series was unwinnable and a total blowout because it was a sweep.

Nope. This wasnt 2014 or 2017 or 2018 or 2016...

The cavs were in every game.

[red1]

yeah the jumper wasnt up to snuff that year. wasnt the next year either. I'd say 2009 is the season it all came together.

[Bankaii]

He was obviously garbage in the clutch

Same thing happened in 09' ECF

His fear of contested jumpers causes passivity and weaker shot-making in the clutch
In 2007 he averaged 13 points on 45% and was a +7 and +2 in the 4th quarter of games 3 and 4 respectively.

[Axe]

So he simply choked back then? 🤔

[STATUTORY]

He was obviously garbage in the clutch

Same thing happened in 09' ECF

His fear of contested jumpers causes passivity and weaker shot-making in the clutch

has no go to move, still doesn't to a large extent

if there isn't a fastbreak opportunity, bran wasn't doing nothing

[red1]

He was obviously garbage in the clutch

Same thing happened in 09' ECF

His fear of contested jumpers causes passivity and weaker shot-making in the clutch
you really want to open that can of worms again? :oldlol:


wasnt that the season that you said mj would've led mo williams to his first ring as the second option? :oldlol: :roll:

[Stanley Kobrick]

In 2007 he averaged 13 points on 45% and was a +7 and +2 in the 4th quarter of games 3 and 4 respectively.
very impressive, only 21yo as well

[LAmbruh]

still can't believe my Lakers got backdoor swept in a quick 5 to Steve Nash in the first round that year


prime Kobe too

[StrongLurk]

Lebron deserves criticism for playing bad in the 2007 finals. I don't think that Cavs team had a real chance of winning the series...but Lebron himself could have played much better. The same Lebron stans who say "but he was only 22" will also claim Lebron was a top 3-5 player in the NBA in 2007...so which is it?

MJ at 22 years old put up 44/6/6 in 45mpg against the 86 Celtics.

[Axe]

If the cavs had the homecourt advantage if they finished with a better record, would that have helped them somehow?

[brownmamba00]

Earlier that playoff run against the Pistons he was making all that nut shit shooting over double teams in clutch time. You'd think his confidence in his jumper would be soaring but instead he looked hesitant to shoot. They'd sag off and clog the paint. Popovich would use the same strategy 6 years later in 2013. But this time Bron had his shooters with him.

[red1]

Earlier that playoff run against the Pistons he was making all that nut shit shooting over double teams in clutch time. You'd think his confidence in his jumper would be soaring but instead he looked hesitant to shoot. They'd sag off and clog the paint. Popovich would use the same strategy 6 years later in 2013. But this time Bron had his shooters with him.

yup.


and the star shooter was himself.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a1/00/0e/a1000ee6b01485f483c9a6d183f3985a.gif

[brownmamba00]

You know damn well i'm talking about that guy in your avy @Red

[Turbo Slayer]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiCa4sKM7-w :biggums: Wow.

[red1]

You know damn well i'm talking about that guy in your avy @Red

he's alright.


can shoot a little bit.

[red1]

the real splash bros


https://a.espncdn.com/photo/2013/0508/nba_lbj_allen_d1_576.jpg

[brownmamba00]

he's alright.


can shoot a little bit.

I can give bron props for that game 7. He figured it out. Manned up and sank the jumpers like a GOAT.

But pop was ****ing with bron's mind you gotta admit.

[RRR3]

I can give bron props for that game 7. He figured it out. Manned up and sank the jumpers like a GOAT.

But pop was ****ing with bron's mind you gotta admit.
Mostly because LeBron's jumper was on point that whole year and he was confused as to why Pop would sag off him like that. IMO. They didn't sag off him in 2014 that's for sure but it didn't matter because the Heat were garbo besides Bron in the finals.

[ShawkFactory]

a common misconception was that this series was unwinnable and a total blowout because it was a sweep.

Nope. This wasnt 2014 or 2017 or 2018 or 2016...

The cavs were in every game.

What are you talking about? There have been plenty of series that have gone 5,6, even 7 games that were unwinnable for the loser.

So maybe Lebron shoots better in one (or both) games. So then maybe it goes 5-6 instead.

The spurs were clearly way better and it not being a sweep doesn’t make it winnable.

[red1]

I can give bron props for that game 7. He figured it out. Manned up and sank the jumpers like a GOAT.

But pop was ****ing with bron's mind you gotta admit.

everyone was choking at the end of that series it was hilarious. lebron turnover threw it away duncan choked a layup ginobili choked a freethrow kawhi choked a freethrow ginobili threw the ball away at the end of the game a la curry etc


"palms sweaty knees weak arms are heavy" you get the point :)

[warriorfan]

In 2007 he averaged 13 points on 45% and was a +7 and +2 in the 4th quarter of games 3 and 4 respectively.

Damn bro! Amazing!


:roll:

[SouBeachTalents]

Damn bro! Amazing!


:roll:
That's more than Curry's 4th quarter average in the '15 Finals that you always spam :lol

[warriorfan]

That's more than Curry's 4th quarter average in the '15 Finals that you always spam :lol

It’s an insane nitpick while trying to save face for an embarrassing performance. You guys are looking super desperate out here. :lol

[red1]

It’s an insane nitpick while trying to save face for an embarrassing performance. You guys are looking super desperate out here. :lol

dude. please.


soubeach is my boy - please show some respect to a high IQ poster. thanks.

[FromDowntown]

That's more than Curry's 4th quarter average in the '15 Finals that you always spam :lol

Wrekt

[Kblaze8855]

With the 112 or so combined years the other top 10-11 players ever lost it is truly amazing you people get so hung up on Lebrons 13 you feel a need to break down why almost all of them are worth a deep dive and serious consideration.

Im sure whatever gripe you could come up with to pretend Shaq being swept by the pacers in 94 or Hakeem having that 5 point game vs the Sonics when they were trying to 3 peat and match up with the Bulls would be stupid and mostly worth ignoring in the big picture.....but I swear I’d still like to read it.

Just for a change.

One of you have anything to say about Kobe having 17 in back to back games to be eliminated by the Mavs being outscored by Terry in both? Any long detailed posts on the Suns knocking the Showtime lakers out of the playoffs or them losing to a 40 win Rockets team while starting 3 hall of famers and an all star with a DPOY off the bench all of those games?

The Lebron standard of digging deep to find a stupid subject to harp on for a day or two? That being applied to a few others would no doubt lead to idiocy as well....but it would at least be somewhat new idiocy. The current crop of trolls who clearly sit down and rack their brains for a way to make a “fresh” Lebron topic that does nothing but inflame opposing trolls to come on and find a stupid opposing topic really ****s up my before bed scrolling at times.

Just once let one of you be on here trying to find a way to suggest that Dirk and Duncan losing to 8 seeds with teams that could have won the title justifies dropping them 10 spots below where the general fan base would put them.

It would be stupid and probably somehow devolve into counter trolling about Lebron but I’d like to see how you spin it when you don’t have 10 years of much more clever people having done the work for you so you can repeat it in altered words every 40 minutes. All the Lebron trolling is done to death. You’re just standing on the shoulders of previous trolls who give you almost every comment you make because you just repeat their talking points.


Come troll about whatever Isiah Thomas wasn’t getting done the 85% of his career he was losing. Is Lebron really the only one you can come up with anything to talk about losing wise when the majority of everyone’s career but Russell and Hondo is them losing?

There is SO much material to troll about. Know how much mileage you can get outta Karl Malone? Dude lost 19 years in a row including as a 60 win team in the first round and once while getting kinda outplayed by Brian Grant and Sabonis with no kneecaps. Material for years right there.

But I’ll be damned if I don’t read a “new” stat or comment about Lebron that was brought up years ago every single morning. Makes my 3-4 am coffee time much more bland.

[warriorfan]

With the 112 or so combined years the other top 10-11 players ever lost it is truly amazing you people get so hung up on Lebrons 13 you feel a need to break down why almost all of them are worth a deep dive and serious consideration.

Im sure whatever gripe you could come up with to pretend Shaq being swept by the pacers in 94 or Hakeem having that 5 point game vs the Sonics when they were trying to 3 peat and match up with the Bulls would be stupid and mostly worth ignoring in the big picture.....but I swear I’d still like to read it.

Just for a change.

One of you have anything to say about Kobe having 17 in back to back games to be eliminated by the Mavs being outscored by Terry in both? Any long detailed posts on the Suns knocking the Showtime lakers out of the playoffs or them losing to a 40 win Rockets team while starting 3 hall of famers and an all star with a DPOY off the bench all of those games?

The Lebron standard of digging deep to find a stupid subject to harp on for a day or two? That being applied to a few others would no doubt lead to idiocy as well....but it would at least be somewhat new idiocy. The current crop of trolls who clearly sit down and rack their brains for a way to make a “fresh” Lebron topic that does nothing but inflame opposing trolls to come on and find a stupid opposing topic really ****s up my before bed scrolling at times.

Just once let one of you be on here trying to find a way to suggest that Dirk and Duncan losing to 8 seeds with teams that could have won the title justifies dropping them 10 spots below where the general fan base would put them.

It would be stupid and probably somehow devolve into counter trolling about Lebron but I’d like to see how you spin it when you don’t have 10 years of much more clever people having done the work for you so you can repeat it in altered words every 40 minutes. All the Lebron trolling is done to death. You’re just standing on the shoulders of previous trolls who give you almost every comment you make because you just repeat their talking points.


Come troll about whatever Isiah Thomas wasn’t getting done the 85% of his career he was losing. Is Lebron really the only one you can come up with anything to talk about losing wise when the majority of everyone’s career but Russell and Hondo is them losing?

There is SO much material to troll about. Know how much mileage you can get outta Karl Malone? Dude lost 19 years in a row including as a 60 win team in the first round and once while getting kinda outplayed by Brian Grant and Sabonis with no kneecaps. Material for years right there.

But I’ll be damned if I don’t read a “new” stat or comment about Lebron that was brought up years ago every single morning. Makes my 3-4 am coffee time much more bland.

Lebron said he was going to win 7+ championships and it was “going to be easy”. He is merely getting his comeuppance.

[RRR3]

Lebron said he was going to win 7+ championships and it was “going to be easy”. He is merely getting his comeuppance.
And you said Curry was going to win Finals MVP.

[warriorfan]

And you said Curry was going to win Finals MVP.

And you said you would f.uck a tranny

[LAmbruh]

And you said Curry was going to win Finals MVP.

:roll:

[sdot_thadon]

BOTH games, going 19/53 from the field in them. His supporting cast played exceedingly well to keep the game close

MJ isn't getting swept that series, tbh the MJ comparison should have ended right then and there

Right because Mj wouldn't be and didn't make the finals at the same juncture of his career although the exact same opportunity for a historic game 5 to put the pistons on the ropes was there.....Lebron was just a different type of dude.

[RRR3]

And you said you would f.uck a tranny
That isn't what I said. There's actually proof of you saying Curry would win doe :roll:

[Bankaii]

And you said Curry was going to win Finals MVP.

:roll:

[Kblaze8855]

Lebron said he was going to win 7+ championships and it was “going to be easy”. He is merely getting his comeuppance.


Lebron trolls predate 2010, he included quite a few “ifs”, and Bosh was retired 5 years later later anyway so obviously that core couldn’t have played that long together no matter what.

Lebron James is getting no comeuppance from trolls on a forum repeating themselves for a decade while he’s doing whatever he’s doing. It’s trolls talking to other trolls.

[red1]

With the 112 or so combined years the other top 10-11 players ever lost it is truly amazing you people get so hung up on Lebrons 13 you feel a need to break down why almost all of them are worth a deep dive and serious consideration.

Im sure whatever gripe you could come up with to pretend Shaq being swept by the pacers in 94 or Hakeem having that 5 point game vs the Sonics when they were trying to 3 peat and match up with the Bulls would be stupid and mostly worth ignoring in the big picture.....but I swear I’d still like to read it.

Just for a change.

One of you have anything to say about Kobe having 17 in back to back games to be eliminated by the Mavs being outscored by Terry in both? Any long detailed posts on the Suns knocking the Showtime lakers out of the playoffs or them losing to a 40 win Rockets team while starting 3 hall of famers and an all star with a DPOY off the bench all of those games?

The Lebron standard of digging deep to find a stupid subject to harp on for a day or two? That being applied to a few others would no doubt lead to idiocy as well....but it would at least be somewhat new idiocy. The current crop of trolls who clearly sit down and rack their brains for a way to make a “fresh” Lebron topic that does nothing but inflame opposing trolls to come on and find a stupid opposing topic really ****s up my before bed scrolling at times.

Just once let one of you be on here trying to find a way to suggest that Dirk and Duncan losing to 8 seeds with teams that could have won the title justifies dropping them 10 spots below where the general fan base would put them.

It would be stupid and probably somehow devolve into counter trolling about Lebron but I’d like to see how you spin it when you don’t have 10 years of much more clever people having done the work for you so you can repeat it in altered words every 40 minutes. All the Lebron trolling is done to death. You’re just standing on the shoulders of previous trolls who give you almost every comment you make because you just repeat their talking points.


Come troll about whatever Isiah Thomas wasn’t getting done the 85% of his career he was losing. Is Lebron really the only one you can come up with anything to talk about losing wise when the majority of everyone’s career but Russell and Hondo is them losing?

There is SO much material to troll about. Know how much mileage you can get outta Karl Malone? Dude lost 19 years in a row including as a 60 win team in the first round and once while getting kinda outplayed by Brian Grant and Sabonis with no kneecaps. Material for years right there.

kblaze bringing high IQ to the nba board almost singlehandedly canceling out 3ball's low IQ. :applause:


its an insurmountable battle though sadly. you could throw einstein tesla and newton at 3ball - at the same time - and he'd still manage to find a way to lower all of their IQs.


3balls many threads and posts have actually done the opposite of what he intended and in fact lowered mj's ranking on the consensus™ ISH GOAT list.


before 3ball got here mike was the undisputed, uncontested, unanimous GOAT.


and now after 3ball has shared his views mj is now the shaky, kinda sure but not 100%, still a great player, type of GOAT.





I appreciate you 3ball please stay alive I dont want you to die before you get to experience a stroke or heart attack when lbj wins another ring with the lakers.

[3ball]

Right because Mj wouldn't be and didn't make the finals at the same juncture of his career although the exact same opportunity for a historic game 5 to put the pistons on the ropes was there.....Lebron was just a different type of dude.
07' Pistons don't compare to the 89' Cavs, let alone the 89' Pistons - 89' Cavs are superior by every metric and MJ's upset of them was superior as well..

And MJ lost a 2-1 lead in 89' - but he wasn't expected to have a 2-1 lead as the underdog, while Lebron lost 2-1 leads as the favorite in 10' and 11', and again in 15'

So you're wrong - lebron lost more leads and therefore isn't that kind of dude

[red1]

if 3ball knew how to explain things he'd actually focus on the things that make mj GOAT - the sociopathic obsession with winning which is admirable (if not sick and deranged, just in a different way from 3ball):

https://youtu.be/lU0IfTqgr0g?t=186
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjRbobUjAt8


or the jumpshooting and skill combined with GOAT athleticism in the form of quickness and vertical




instead 3ball comes in arguing "hurr durr lebron loser stacked teams mike won without any help durr"


and then you realize holy shit his arguments work even better on mike than they do lbj - and then all of his arguments keep backfiring and he shoots himself in the head when his exact criteria for what makes a GOAT (championships as the man) are fulfilled three times, with one ring in particular LITERALLY being what 3ball fantasizes about all the time for mike (2016 kyrie and love technically weren't allstars, lebron leads both teams in all stats including leading both teams in scoring)


this is 3ball's debate style:

https://media2.giphy.com/media/E4H4hEmeYfkaY/source.gif"]https://media2.giphy.com/media/E4H4hEmeYfkaY/source.gif

[warriorfan]

Lebron trolls predate 2010, he included quite a few “ifs”, and Bosh was retired 5 years later later anyway so obviously that core couldn’t have played that long together no matter what.

Lebron James is getting no comeuppance from trolls on a forum repeating themselves for a decade while he’s doing whatever he’s doing. It’s trolls talking to other trolls.

He wasn’t putting his money where his mouth is even if Bosh never has any medical issues. He talked a lot of game and didn’t back it up. Plain and simple. He acted ignorantly and arrogantly, he’s had it coming. I can only speak for myself but I had no problems with LeBron pre decision, I even could say I was a fan.

[dirkdiggler41]

Game 4 with 7 seconds left the score 81-76. The Cavs made 2 3pointers and Spurs made 2 free throws. It was not that close considering the low score and slow tempo. Many NBA does not tell the right story looking at just the score because of the fouling at the end.

[LAL]

He wasnÂ’t putting his money where his mouth is even if Bosh never has any medical issues. He talked a lot of game and didnÂ’t back it up. Plain and simple. He acted ignorantly and arrogantly, heÂ’s had it coming. I can only speak for myself but I had no problems with LeBron pre decision, I even could say I was a fan.

Kblaze is right as far as details and nitpicking of losses and lesser moments of ATGs, especially Mj, kobe and lebron... youd think the other guys were almost perfect because they don't get that atrention.. like tragic johnson finals, norm nixon averaging better numbers as magics backup, kareem's "sidekick" rings, ck jones fmvp instead of bird, hakeem's losing, Wilts losing, etc.. so much material and arguments to lower their ranking. Instead, you have people try to analyze and focus on derek fisher, pau gasol's and scottie's greatness for obvious reasons. And 4th quarter advanced plus minus stats and shit.

However, the decision to join wade and bosh in the east was just ****ed up, he didn't know those guys would break down after 5 years, the thought behind that move and him being a very stat based player, was enough for me to say he's not greater than MJ or Kobe. I don't do top 10's.

[aj1987]

Kblaze is right as far as details and nitpicking of losses and lesser moments of ATGs, especially Mj, kobe and lebron... youd think the other guys were almost perfect because they don't get that atrention.. like tragic johnson finals, norm nixon averaging better numbers as magics backup, kareem's "sidekick" rings, ck jones fmvp instead of bird, hakeem's losing, Wilts losing, etc.. so much material and arguments to lower their ranking. Instead, you have people try to analyze and focus on derek fisher, pau gasol's and scottie's greatness for obvious reasons. And 4th quarter advanced plus minus stats and shit.

However, the decision to join wade and bosh in the east was just ****ed up, he didn't know those guys would break down after 5 years, the thought behind that move and him being a very stat based player, was enough for me to say he's not greater than MJ or Kobe. I don't do top 10's.

A stat based player has more MVP's and FMVP's than anyone in the history of the game, other than MJ.

More FMVP's than Kobe as well. That must hurt deep. :roll:

[LAL]

A stat based player has more MVP's and FMVP's than anyone in the history of the game, other than MJ.

More FMVP's than Kobe as well. That must hurt deep. :roll:
Well yeah.. stats and media awards go hand in hand little ****er? Doesn't make him the better in my eyes.. tf?

[LAL]

https://media2.giphy.com/media/E4H4hEmeYfkaY/source.gif"]https://media2.giphy.com/media/E4H4hEmeYfkaY/source.gif Is that blood? Jezus

[aj1987]

Well yeah.. stats and media awards go hand in hand little ****er? Doesn't make him the better in my eyes.. tf?

:roll:

The meltdown continues? Go drink bleach, you mouth breathing retard.

LeBron shits on Kobe and it's not particularly close either.


Is that blood? Jezus

It's a watermelon, you ****ing idiot. :roll: :roll:

[LAL]

:roll:

The meltdown continues? Go drink bleach, you mouth breathing retard.

LeBron shits on Kobe and it's not particularly close either.


It's a watermelon, you ****ing idiot. :roll: :roll:
Why so angry aj? :D

[aj1987]

Why so angry aj? :D

Not really. I just can't stand stupidity. :cheers:

[LAL]

Not really. I just can't stand stupidity. :cheers:

Noooo.. lol i know why you're mad silly. Dummy :oldlol:

[aj1987]

Noooo.. lol i know why you're mad silly. Dummy :oldlol:

Yeah, you should. I just said it. I can't stand stupidity.

[nayte]

I don't even give two ducks but if u wanna give Bron a pass u gotta give Durant and Russ the same pass.u all can't have it both ways .

[SouBeachTalents]

I don't even give two ducks but if u wanna give Bron a pass u gotta give Durant and Russ the same pass.u all can't have it both ways .
How do you even come to that conclusion :lol Literally the only thing comparable about the two situations are the stars were the same age. Besides that? The two circumstances couldn't be any different. The Thunder had HCA on a team with multiple star players, they had a legitimate chance of winning the series.

I would agree with you that I don't think it's fair to heavily criticize them for losing to LeBron and the Heat considering their age at the time, but the '07 Cavs & '12 Thunder are worlds apart roster wise. A much better comparison would be the '95 Magic, who also lost with HCA to a veteran team with an ATG at his peak

[nayte]

I agree in a way but experience is experience.LeBron was so far past them at that stage like Duncan was to LeBron. I feel it was the same but u don't have to agree

[LAL]

Yeah, you should. I just said it. I can't stand stupidity.

:oldlol: Your mad because i probably bullied you a couple times. Don't take it personal buddy, i think you have a good heart, i just attack your "smart" posts thats all :oldlol:

[LAL]

I don't even give two ducks but if u wanna give Bron a pass u gotta give Durant and Russ the same pass.u all can't have it both ways .

Facts

[nayte]

Facts
South beech is a good poster but if he can't see the same narratives that are going on these days with the crew I dinno

[ShawkFactory]

07' Pistons don't compare to the 89' Cavs, let alone the 89' Pistons - 89' Cavs are superior by every metric and MJ's upset of them was superior as well..

And MJ lost a 2-1 lead in 89' - but he wasn't expected to have a 2-1 lead as the underdog, while Lebron lost 2-1 leads as the favorite in 10' and 11', and again in 15'

So you're wrong - lebron lost more leads and therefore isn't that kind of dude
You think the Cavs were favored in 2015?

[3ball]

You think the Cavs were favored in 2015?
No he lost a 2-1 lead as the big underdog, like MJ in 89'

But he lost two other 2-1 leads as the favorite in 10' and 11'

So he's inferior to MJ, who only lost as the underdog

However, I do think 15' was winnable - lebron proved that by going 6 games despite shooting and defending like Iverson

[red1]

No he lost a 2-1 lead as the big underdog, like MJ in 89'

But he lost two other 2-1 leads as the favorite in 10' and 11'

So he's inferior to MJ, who only lost as the underdog

However, I do think 15' was winnable - lebron proved that by going 6 games despite shooting and defending like Iverson
I get it. this is all you wanted to post.


disagree on nearly all counts. you're wrong.



what about 2016 though? why'd he do what mike couldnt? what you've always fantasized about?


kyrie has your soul in a jar. he made you start 100 threads that year alone out of your insecurity :roll:

[ShawkFactory]

No he lost a 2-1 lead as the big underdog, like MJ in 89'

But he lost two other 2-1 leads as the favorite in 10' and 11'

So he's inferior to MJ, who only lost as the underdog

However, I do think 15' was winnable - lebron proved that by going 6 games despite shooting and defending like Iverson

His defense was fine. In fact his DRTG was the best on the team.

As for the shooting...8 extra shots sends the % from 40 to 45. If you think 8 shots turns a 6 game defeat to a win, particularly against a much more talented team? That’s on you.

[3ball]

His defense was fine. In fact his DRTG was the best on the team.

As for the shooting...8 extra shots sends the % from 40 to 45. If you think 8 shots turns a 6 game defeat to a win, particularly against a much more talented team? That’s on you.
Drtg means nothing because it's based primarily on defensive rebounds

Otoh, an 8-point bench player doubled their scoring average and won MVP - a bench player going off is bad defense.. Iggy isn't KD so there's no excuse

And you have no idea what lebron shoots a different volume levels, except that he always shoots poorly at high volume (because he's poor at the additional jumpshooting required of high volume shooters)

If lebron shoots 50%, and holds iggy to his normal averages, the cavs win EASILY...

[Bronbron23]

BOTH games, going 19/53 from the field in them. His supporting cast played exceedingly well to keep the game close

MJ isn't getting swept that series, tbh the MJ comparison should have ended right then and there

I wouldn't say he chocked. He was young and didnt have alot of confidence in his mid range and three ball. Having a weakness offensively isnt the same as choking.

[3ball]

I wouldn't say he chocked. He was young and didnt have alot of confidence in his mid range and three ball. Having a weakness offensively isnt the same as choking.
How does a so-called goat candidate lack confidence......

And in his shot of all things?

It's impossible... He simply isn't goat or anywhere near

And how does the so-called goat have a weak jumper and not shoot great from ANYWHERE

again.... (not the goat.. :facepalm:)

[ShawkFactory]

Drtg means nothing because it's based primarily on defensive rebounds

Otoh, an 8-point bench player doubled their scoring average and won MVP - a bench player going off is bad defense.. Iggy isn't KD so there's no excuse



Iggy started half the games and played exactly as many minutes as both Klay and Draymond.

But you already knew that.

Also, defensive rebounds are not factored into DRTG at all, much less the primary basis of the number.

And I’m sure you knew that too.

[Hey Yo]

He wasn’t putting his money where his mouth is even if Bosh never has any medical issues. He talked a lot of game and didn’t back it up. Plain and simple. He acted ignorantly and arrogantly, he’s had it coming. I can only speak for myself but I had no problems with LeBron pre decision, I even could say I was a fan.
LOL @ going to a high school that never had pep rallies for a sporting event. If you did, then you would have recognized that is what was going on in Miami that night.

[red1]

How does a so-called goat candidate lack confidence......

And in his shot of all things?

It's impossible... He simply isn't goat or anywhere near

And how does the so-called goat have a weak jumper and not shoot great from ANYWHERE

again.... (not the goat.. :facepalm:)

I thought you said the true measure of a GOAT was leading your team to wins?


who did that more than lebron in the history of the NBA? mike? magic?


"buh buh kyrie buh buh ray allen buh buh stacked" go ahead and cry some more kid :oldlol:


https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/QWsHKcy4qwsh1Idg1F2TJp5Tti8=/1400x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/6677601/bron%20hat.jpg












































































































https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41CBeze0MJL.jpg

[3ball]

Also, defensive rebounds are not factored into DRTG at all, much less the primary basis of the number.




^^^ Incorrect - you're confusing team drtg with individual drtg - only the individual drtg uses drebs - here's the official definition and formula for individual DRtg:

from bballref (https://www.basketball-reference.com/about/ratings.html):

The core of the Defensive Rating calculation is the concept of the individual Defensive Stop. Stops take into account the instances of a player ending an opposing possession that are tracked in the boxscore (blocks, steals, and defensive rebounds), in addition to an estimate for the number of forced turnovers and forced misses by the player which aren't captured by steals and blocks.

The formula for Stops is:

Stops = Stops1 + Stops2
where:

Stops1 = STL + BLK * FMwt * (1 - 1.07 * DOR%) + DRB * (1 - FMwt)







Iggy started half the games and played exactly as many minutes as both Klay and Draymond.



Iggy only became a factor because the Warriors stumbled on the leak in the Cavs' defense.

[RRR3]

^^^ Incorrect - you're confusing team ortg (doesn't use dreb), with individual drtg (uses dreb) - here's the official definition and formula for individual DRtg:

from bballref (https://www.basketball-reference.com/about/ratings.html):

The core of the Defensive Rating calculation is the concept of the individual Defensive Stop. Stops take into account the instances of a player ending an opposing possession that are tracked in the boxscore (blocks, steals, and defensive rebounds), in addition to an estimate for the number of forced turnovers and forced misses by the player which aren't captured by steals and blocks.

The formula for Stops is:

Stops = Stops1 + Stops2
where:

Stops1 = STL + BLK * FMwt * (1 - 1.07 * DOR%) + DRB * (1 - FMwt)





Iggy only became a factor because the Warriors stumbled on the leak in the Cavs' defense.
How would you know? You admitted you haven’t watched a game since 2011...

[red1]

How would you know? You admitted you haven’t watched a game since 2011...

he already lost the argument. he said balldominant styles dont win and he doesnt even realize that every star scorer is balldominant INCLUDING mike.


in fact the main knock against young MJ was that even though he was already the GOAT scorer they said he was too balldominant or selfish to win a championship like bird and magic :roll:

[ShawkFactory]

^^^ Incorrect - you're confusing team drtg with individual drtg - only the individual drtg uses drebs - here's the official definition and formula for individual DRtg:

from bballref (https://www.basketball-reference.com/about/ratings.html):

The core of the Defensive Rating calculation is the concept of the individual Defensive Stop. Stops take into account the instances of a player ending an opposing possession that are tracked in the boxscore (blocks, steals, and defensive rebounds), in addition to an estimate for the number of forced turnovers and forced misses by the player which aren't captured by steals and blocks.

The formula for Stops is:

Stops = Stops1 + Stops2
where:

Stops1 = STL + BLK * FMwt * (1 - 1.07 * DOR%) + DRB * (1 - FMwt)





Iggy only became a factor because the Warriors stumbled on the leak in the Cavs' defense.
Ok so we’re both wrong. You heavily overstated its weight.

As for Iggy becoming a factor? It’s because he was the only person on the Warriors who was remotely able to matchup with Bron defensively. Hence, more minutes.

This is common knowledge..

[tpols]

Iggy only became a factor because the Warriors stumbled on the leak in the Cavs' defense.


the "leak" in the cavs defense was that they doubled curry at halfcourt every play and gave iggy wide open lanes and looks.

[RRR3]

the "leak" in the cavs defense was that they doubled curry at halfcourt every play and gave iggy wide open lanes and looks.
He admitted he hasn’t watched the NBA since 2011 he has no idea what he’s talking about.

[3ball]

Ok so we’re both wrong. You heavily overstated its weight.

As for Iggy becoming a factor? It’s because he was the only person on the Warriors who was remotely able to matchup with Bron defensively. Hence, more minutes.

This is common knowledge..
Did Lebron have to let Iggy succeed defensively??.. Did he have to let Iggy turn him into Iverson?

With 35 shots a game at 39% a pop and a record long dribbling (12 minutes time of possession), the Warriors wanted the ball in his hands, hence the lack of doubles.. So he was completely exploited and his 39% response against the single coverage was a poor counter and made their strategy optimal.

What if he was a sick jumpershooter/scorer like MJ or Kobe, so he could get hot and command a double/disrupt the defense? Teammates would get freed up and the ball would move because "double-teams create a 4-on-3 off-the-ball" and therefore ball movement.

Seriously, what if Lebron simply shot 50% against the single-coverage and wide open isolations he was getting????.............. while also sticking to Iggy close enough to prevent him from being the key that unlocks the Warriors' offense????

^^^ That shouldn't be too much to ask - the Warriors' struggles against LeIverson proves the pre-KD Warriors were NOT hard to beat, along with their loss in 16' and 19'

[red1]

Did Lebron have to let Iggy succeed defensively??.. Did he have to let Iggy turn him into Iverson?

With 35 shots a game at 39% a pop and a record long dribbling (12 minutes time of possession), the Warriors wanted the ball in his hands, hence the lack of doubles.. So he was completely exploited and his 39% response against the single coverage was a poor counter and made their strategy optimal.

What if he was a sick jumpershooter/scorer like MJ or Kobe, so he could get hot and command a double/disrupt the defense? Teammates would get freed up and the ball would move because "double-teams create a 4-on-3 off-the-ball" and therefore ball movement.

Seriously, what if Lebron simply shot 50% against the single-coverage and wide open isolations he was getting????.............. while also sticking to Iggy close enough to prevent him from being the key that unlocks the Warriors' offense????

^^^ That shouldn't be too much to ask - the Warriors' struggles against LeIverson proves the pre-KD Warriors were NOT hard to beat, along with their loss in 16' and 19'
agreed.



I'm knocking mj down on the GOAT list from 1.a to 1.b after this post.



might be looking at a 1.d scenario pretty soon with shaq creeping into that 1.c spot.

[3ball]

.
Lebron faced [I] the most spaced-out iso's EVER) with single-coverage - but horrible moves & shooting touch held him to only 39%:


http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/XIjX_w.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/P5Zone.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/I7p0lg.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/xUCd0U.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/CU5j5S.gif

http://www.gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/1e79dc71a542600a777d78638e6a7e69.gif





agreed.



I'm knocking mj down on the GOAT list from 1.a to 1.b after this post.



might be looking at a 1.d scenario pretty soon with shaq creeping into that 1.c spot.



Why is Iverson knocked for high-volume, inefficiency, but Lebron almost wins MVP for it?

Why is shooting horribly against wide open single-coverage okay? (see examples above)

[RRR3]

.
Lebron faced [I] the most spaced-out iso's EVER) with single-coverage - but horrible moves & shooting touch held him to only 39%:


http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/XIjX_w.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/P5Zone.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/I7p0lg.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/xUCd0U.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/CU5j5S.gif

http://www.gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/1e79dc71a542600a777d78638e6a7e69.gif





Why is Iverson knocked for high-volume, inefficiency, but Lebron almost wins MVP for it?

Why is shooting horribly against wide open single-coverage okay? (see examples above)

LeBron had back problems that year. He is never that inefficient normally. He was actually very inefficient the entire playoffs, it wasn't just Iggy.

[3ball]

LeBron had back problems that year. He is never that inefficient normally. He was actually very inefficient the entire playoffs, it wasn't just Iggy.
Right, and the Warriors almost lost to that broken-down Iverson crap and a weak cast

That series (where they struggled to beat Iverson and a weak cast), along with the 16' and 19' Finals prove the pre-KD Warriors are easy to beat

[red1]

.
Lebron faced [I] the most spaced-out iso's EVER) with single-coverage - but horrible moves & shooting touch held him to only 39%:


http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/XIjX_w.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/P5Zone.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/I7p0lg.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/xUCd0U.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-05-2015/CU5j5S.gif

http://www.gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/1e79dc71a542600a777d78638e6a7e69.gif





Why is Iverson knocked for high-volume, inefficiency, but Lebron almost wins MVP for it?

Why is shooting horribly against wide open single-coverage okay? (see examples above)


why do they defend him like that? why did the spurs gamble and let him shoot?


is it because he is the GOAT at driving to the rim? and an unselfish passer?


you think that might play a small role?

[3ball]

why do they defend him like that? why did the spurs gamble and let him shoot?


is it because he is the GOAT at driving to the rim? and an unselfish passer?


you think that might play a small role?
It's dangerous to double any player (even elementary school players) because it creates a 4-on-3 off-the-ball and spurs ball movement.

But some players are so deadly as iso players and jumpshooters that it's better to double and face ball movement, then allow a couple made jumpers that gets the whole team going

Lebron is not in this category because his weak shooting and long dribbles are preferred over ball movement

Otoh, imagine being so deadly - like a Mamba - that coaches prefer getting the ball out of your hands and rolling the dice against ball movement and open jumpers by Fisher and Kerr... :bowdown:

[FromDowntown]

It's dangerous to double any player (even elementary school players) because it creates a 4-on-3 off-the-ball and spurs ball movement.

But some players are so deadly as iso players and jumpshooters that it's better to double and face ball movement, then allow a couple made jumpers that gets the whole team going

Lebron is not in this category because his weak shooting and long dribbles are preferred over ball movement

Otoh, imagine being so deadly - like a Mamba - that coaches prefer getting the ball out of your hands and rolling the dice against ball movement and open jumpers by Fisher and Kerr... :bowdown:

This cat always forgets Mike was doubled because he can't pass.

LeBron can pass, and will make you pay if you double him. He has high IQ and will make the right pass/play.

Summarize:

IQ
LBJ: Elite High
MJ: Medium

Selfishness
LBJ: Low
MJ: High

Passing ability
LBJ: Elite High
MJ: Low

Therefore...MJ is the perfect player to double team and LeBron is the worst player to double team

MJ = low IQ, selfish, cannot pass well = BEST player to double...Much like Kobe.

[red1]

It's dangerous to double any player (even elementary school players) because it creates a 4-on-3 off-the-ball and spurs ball movement.

But some players are so deadly as iso players and jumpshooters that it's better to double and face ball movement, then allow a couple made jumpers that gets the whole team going

Lebron is not in this category because his weak shooting and long dribbles are preferred over ball movement

Otoh, imagine being so deadly - like a Mamba - that coaches prefer getting the ball out of your hands and rolling the dice against ball movement and open jumpers by Fisher and Kerr... :bowdown:

dude you're wrong again. literally 0-100 in every discussion I've seen you have with other posters too.

in basketball you exploit mismatches and lebron does a thousand different things that benefit his team like drawing doubles AND iso scoring.


the reason the spurs prefer to give him the open shot is because they'd rather roll the dice and live with the poison of giving open shots because they know they will lose if they let buddy get the chance to drive and finish or make a play - which he does better than any player in the league.


mike himself is always praising kobe says kobe is the only guy that can beat him or the only guy that can hang with him - and mike himself says lebron is more dominant than kobe:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DyTMEiORok



so what does that tell you, my dear brother 3ball?

[aj1987]

:oldlol: Your mad because i probably bullied you a couple times. Don't take it personal buddy, i think you have a good heart, i just attack your "smart" posts thats all :oldlol:

With each post, somehow you manage to sound dumber than before. It's pretty incredible, TBH. It's that single digit IQ, I guess.

[3ball]

dude you're wrong again. literally 0-100 in every discussion I've seen you have with other posters too.

in basketball you exploit mismatches and lebron does a thousand different things that benefit his team like drawing doubles AND iso scoring.


the reason the spurs prefer to give him the open shot is because they'd rather roll the dice and live with the poison of giving open shots because they know they will lose if they let buddy get the chance to drive and finish or make a play - which he does better than any player in the league.


mike himself is always praising kobe says kobe is the only guy that can beat him or the only guy that can hang with him - and mike himself says lebron is more dominant than kobe:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DyTMEiORok



so what does that tell you, my dear brother 3ball?
They let lebron shoot because he can't

If lebron was like MJ or Curry, defenders would be forced to guard him, thus making his drives easier

But his jumper isn't deadly enough to force teams to guard it

Accept it bud - lebron can't shoot like Curry or MJ - it is a knock and he would be better off with a jumper like theirs

[aj1987]

They let lebron shoot because he can't

If lebron was like MJ or Curry, defenders would be forced to guard him, thus making his drives easier

But his jumper isn't deadly enough to force teams to guard it

Accept it bud - lebron can't shoot like Curry or MJ - it is a knock and he would be better off with a jumper like theirs

You still have absolutely no idea how basketball is played and how it works. Just amazing.

[AlternativeAcc.]

At the same or similar age Jordan was either getting cut by his high school ball coach or was a 3rd option in college at UNC.. can't remember which

[34-24 Footwork]

Whats crazy is that OP didn't mention the 6 turnovers per game nor the sub 70% from the free-throw line.

A few of those games were extremely winnable. I thought this prepped him for 2011, but I was wrong about that too.

[rmt]

With Bowen pestering Lebron, Duncan cutting off the paint and Lebron's lack of shooting (at that time), this series was never in doubt (once Lebron was controlled). This is even discounting the disparity in experience, coaching, talent, etc.

[Manny98]

It was a tough shooting series for both teams

Outside of the first half of game 1, LeBron was actually pretty good that series considering how God awful his cast was and the Spurs focused their entire defense on stopping LeBron as the Cavs had no other offensive threats

If Larry Hughes was healthy I believe it would have went to 6 games maybe 7

[ArbitraryWater]

cavs might win the title that year if the refs dont fall asleep on bowen fouling lebron

[Smoke117]

Bran has never been able to come through in tight games so this is no surprise. :lol