Kevin Durant was on an MJ-like run

[StrongLurk]

Yeah, he was on the most stacked team of all time. No doubt. But he was still the best player on that team AND the best player in the NBA last year.

Before he got hurt, KD's 2019 playoff run was at 34/5/5 on 51/42/90 - GOAT-level scorer shit right there.

2017 Finals - 35/8/5 (only 2.2 turnovers) on 56/47/93 - Just insane, can't really compare that to anyone except KD himself (maybe 93 MJ).
2018 Finals - 29/11/7.5 with 2.3 blocks (only 2.3 turnovers) on 53/41/96 - Again insane, Lebron-type statline but even better efficiency and MJ-level low turnovers..

I understand it can't be understated how stacked GS was...but come on man this is top 10 type talent right here. KD's legacy might not be top 10 but his skill/talent is basically there. How many players in NBA history would be the best player on the 17-19 Warriors and put up those numbers? I'm not sure if even peak Kobe would perform like that when factoring in the efficiency.

At the highest level of competition, I would only put MJ over KD as a scorer. If the Warriors win last year (they would with healthy KD) and KD three-peated with FMVPS as well? IDK man.

KD is clearly one of the best finals performers (better than Kobe and Bird for comparison). I'm close to putting KD in the top 10 (not really legacy wise). But top-10 nonetheless. If he performs still at a high-level on the Nets then without a doubt he will be in the back half of top 10 with guys like Duncan, Hakeem, Bird, etc.

[SouBeachTalents]

https://media.giphy.com/media/5hHy4i1YoiyIw/giphy.gif

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

lol

[tpols]

Durant benefitted immensely from teams throwing the book at chef and even klay much more than himself.

Plus there was no mental pressure. Everything was landslide... the guy was playing against almost no resistance.

what he did to Lebron was embarrasing, literally best production of all time, but bron didnt care because that was his boy.

[ArbitraryWater]

was he also on an MJ like run before feeding off GS, Curry, and the space that comes with that?

Man got open dunks cause they doubled Curry at the 3 pt line

[red1]

mods?


of all weekends to start this thread he's starting this thread on baldans weekend? the weekend baldan takes his legacy back from miley cyrus?



when you think of the jordan brand in 2020 the first things that come to mind are nike sweatshops and miley cyrus


https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7409/10419820036_b1926f80e8_m.jpg
https://ftks732kpvy18zwzc2s17egw-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/mjmiley.jpg



kd isnt even on kawhi's level alone a top-5 player all-time like baldan

[StrongLurk]

So the second best scorer of the modern era after MJ...who was about to 3-peat with 3FMVPS like MJ...and equaled another legend in the finals two times in a row (Lebron)...wasn't on an MJ-like run? Never change ISH.

I guess we can disregard Bill Russell's accomplishments, Larry Bird's accomplishments, Magic's accomplishments, all because they played on stacked teams there whole careers. Got it.

Does ISH really think Larry Bird would have been SO MUCH BETTER than KD was if you put Bird on those Warriors teams? It's not like KD won his rings/FMVPS putting up 25/5/5 on average percentages.

[KD7]

Best player on the greatest team of all time

2017-2018 KD was the most dominant scorer the league has ever seen when you combine volume and efficiency

[StrongLurk]

Best player on the greatest team of all time

2017-2018 KD was the most dominant scorer the league has ever seen when you combine volume and efficiency

Bro 16-17 and 18-19 KD played better than 17-18 KD. Come on man if you want to try to stan at least do it right.

[SouBeachTalents]

So the second best scorer of the modern era after MJ...who was about to 3-peat with 3FMVPS like MJ...and equaled another legend in the finals two times in a row (Lebron)...wasn't on an MJ-like run? Never change ISH.

I guess we can disregard Bill Russell's accomplishments, Larry Bird's accomplishments, Magic's accomplishments, all because they played on stacked teams there whole careers. Got it.

Does ISH really think Larry Bird would have been SO MUCH BETTER than KD was if you put Bird on those Warriors teams?
You're entitled to your opinion, it's just strange you get upset when you voice a extremely minority opinion and people disagree with you. To call KD's run MJ like when most people don't even consider his rings legitimate would obviously be an opinion shared by very few people, if any.

And to answer your question, if you're talking strictly scoring numbers no, Bird couldn't replicate that. But the Warriors would without a doubt still repeat with Bird, while having better ball movement to boot. The better question is, would the Celtics be as good if you put Durant in Bird's place. The answer is no, and that's the more important question to consider

[ArbitraryWater]

Bro 16-17 and 18-19 KD played better than 17-18 KD. Come on man if you want to try to stan at least do it right.

More like, 2018 KD was the only one playing an equally matched opponent in a close/pressure series. And the OKC KD revealed itself to the world. Lots of iso's, tunnel vision, chucking, low assist rate. Kerr had to remind KD mid-game to trust his teammates, and look for others.

In 2019 once he played that team, the same thing happened. Shooting got a bit worse too, and he choked several game tying shots at the end of games.


I see a pattern here.

[FromDowntown]

Pull up his 2016 stats. Thank you.

Curry made KD.

[StrongLurk]

More like, 2018 KD was the only one playing an equally matched opponent in a close/pressure series. And the OKC KD revealed itself to the world. Lots of iso's, tunnel vision, chucking, low assist rate. Kerr had to remind KD mid-game to trust his teammates, and look for others.

In 2019 once he played that team, the same thing happened. Shooting got a bit worse too, and he choked several game tying shots at the end of games.


I see a pattern here.

Is the pattern that no player is perfect? You should see some of 96-98 Jordan's playoff series...where he uber-chucked with low assists and wasn't even efficient...yet he is still the GOAT.

KD is on Bird's level which means KD is top 10 all time.

[STATUTORY]

did MJ ever play with a core nearly as good as Steph, Klay and Dray? :confusedshrug:

[SouBeachTalents]

Is the pattern that no player is perfect? You should see some of 96-98 Jordan's playoff series...where he uber-chucked with low assists and wasn't even efficient...yet he is still the GOAT.

KD is on Bird's level which means KD is top 10 all time.
You're comparing a mid 30's Jordan with significantly worse offensive help in a much more offensively depressed era to a peak KD with GOAT offensive help in a league that's tailored it's rules for more offense and scoring

[StrongLurk]

You're entitled to your opinion, it's just strange you get upset when you voice a extremely minority opinion and people disagree with you. To call KD's run MJ like when most people don't even consider his rings legitimate would obviously be an opinion shared by very few people, if any.

And to answer your question, if you're talking strictly scoring numbers no, Bird couldn't replicate that. But the Warriors would without a doubt still repeat with Bird, while having better ball movement to boot. The better question is, would the Celtics be as good if you put Durant in Bird's place. The answer is no, and that's the more important question to consider

The Celtics would absolutely be as good. Are you serious? Please go back and truly review Bird's ENTIRE playoff career. 84-87 Bird is amazing, but his other years left a lot to be desired.

KD is on Bird's level for sure. KD is a much better scorer, slightly worse rebounder, worse playmaker, defense is probably equal.

It's kind of like comparing MJ (KD) and Lebron (Bird).

[ArbitraryWater]

Is the pattern that no player is perfect? You should see some of 96-98 Jordan's playoff series...where he uber-chucked with low assists and wasn't even efficient...yet he is still the GOAT.

KD is on Bird's level which means KD is top 10 all time.

Well, thats 96-98 MJ. Thats not a top 15 player of all time.

Its 87-93 what makes him GOAT.

Meanwhile, we are refering to the best of KD.

Dude starts off hot and then gets extremely held in check as the series goes on, in 2018. In 2019 he was down to the mean straight away.

In 2018 he had 2 near 40 pt games and wasnt particularly impactful in game 2 with his ballhog style as Kerr reprimanded him, and then had 3 straight games shooting below 38%.

Dude was on a straight path to a bitter postseason loss and an absolute failure of a GS stint had Paul not gone down.

[ArbitraryWater]

You're comparing a mid 30's Jordan with significantly worse offensive help in a much more offensively depressed era to a peak KD with GOAT offensive help in a league that's tailored it's rules for more offense and scoring

that, also.

OP is just a little shortsighted and not yet well educated around these parts.

He's still BREF watching a little too much.

But I respect his hustle.

[StrongLurk]

KD for his playoff career is 29/8/4 on 48/35/86 and in the finals is even better, top 5 final performer ever.

And people on ISH want to say he isn't worthy of top 10 all time?

I get that everyone hates him for joining GS, I hate that move too. But I am not going to hate on KD's talent/skills.

[Turbo Slayer]

No Kd wasnt.....

KD put up 35 points in the 2017 Finals it looks impressive until you take a look further....

KD dropped 35 points against a subpar defense (21st ranked defense) while LeBron dropped 34 points on the the 2nd ranked defense in the 2017 Finals. It doesnt look impressive to me at all.

Michael Jordan dropped 40 points on the 9th ranked defense (Suns.)

No comparison whatsoever....

[SouBeachTalents]

KD for his playoff career is 29/8/4 on 48/35/86 and in the finals is even better, top 5 final performer ever.

And people on ISH want to say he isn't worthy of top 10 all time?
Who you bumping out? Shaq, Duncan, Magic, Bird, Hakeem, Kobe?

[Uncle Drew]

Why is OP always wrong about everything?

[ArbitraryWater]

KD for his playoff career is 29/8/4 on 48/35/86 and in the finals is even better, top 5 final performer ever.

And people on ISH want to say he isn't worthy of top 10 all time?

I get that everyone hates him for joining GS, I hate that move too. But I am not going to hate on KD's talent/skills.

You're becoming very general and thick-headed again...

you often revert to your original stance, showing no learning curve or ability to take things in.

The devil is in the details.


Sure, if you ignore them, bump KD into your top 10. But know, your top 10 has no details. No insight.

[StrongLurk]

Top 10 all time tiers.

Tier 1 - MJ
Tier 2 - Kareem, Lebron
Tier 3 - Shaq, Magic, Kobe
Tier 4 - Bird, Olajawon, Duncan, KD

Honorable mentions (Wilt, Russell). They are HMs because their stats (WILT) and career accolades (RUSSELL) are so out of wack compared to anything in the modern era. There is no way to compare them on a scale with the modern era because of this so I leave them out of my top 10, but they are clearly the GOATs of the original NBA.

So who would people put in place of KD?

[Turbo Slayer]

No Kd wasnt.....

KD put up 35 points in the 2017 Finals it looks impressive until you take a look further....

KD dropped 35 points against a subpar defense (21st ranked defense) while LeBron dropped 34 points on the the 2nd ranked defense in the 2017 Finals. It doesnt look impressive to me at all.

Michael Jordan dropped 40 points on the 9th ranked defense (Suns.)

No comparison whatsoever....

Also Kawhi got injured in the 2017 WCF too....

[Drygon]

KD is not even the best scorer of his generation.

James Harden has surpassed him.

[StrongLurk]

No Kd wasnt.....

KD put up 35 points in the 2017 Finals it looks impressive until you take a look further....

KD dropped 35 points against a subpar defense (21st ranked defense) while LeBron dropped 34 points on the the 2nd ranked defense in the 2017 Finals. It doesnt look impressive to me at all.

Michael Jordan dropped 40 points on the 9th ranked defense (Suns.)

No comparison whatsoever....

Putting up 35/8/5 and 29/11/7.5 going up against Lebron James isn't impressive? KD's 2017 finals scoring output was the best all time when you combine volume and TS%.

Meanwhile who was guarding MJ in 93? Fukin KJ and Dan Majerle?

Besides you are cherry picking right now. Take the entire 17-19 playoff runs and really look at it. I would only say with confidence that MJ and peak Lebron could do better than KD did.

[Turbo Slayer]

Also Kawhi got injured in the 2017 WCF too....


No Kd wasnt.....

KD put up 35 points in the 2017 Finals it looks impressive until you take a look further....

KD dropped 35 points against a subpar defense (21st ranked defense) while LeBron dropped 34 points on the the 2nd ranked defense in the 2017 Finals. It doesnt look impressive to me at all.

Michael Jordan dropped 40 points on the 9th ranked defense (Suns.)

No comparison whatsoever....

After Kawhi went down their defenses went from good to virtually nonexistent... the Spurs were considered below average in DRtg relative to the league...

Why you want to hold so much stock on KD dropping statlines on bad defenses???

[StrongLurk]

After Kawhi went down their defenses went from good to virtually nonexistent... the Spurs were considered below average in DRtg relative to the league...

Why you want to hold so much stock on KD dropping statlines on bad defenses???

Putting up 35/8/5 and 29/11/7.5 going up against Lebron James isn't impressive? KD's 2017 finals scoring output was the best all time when you combine volume and TS%.

Meanwhile who was guarding MJ in 93? Fukin KJ and Dan Majerle?

Besides you are cherry picking right now. Take the ENTRE 17-19 playoff runs and really look at them. I would only say with confidence that MJ and peak Lebron could do better than KD did.

KD played on Lebron's level for 2 straight finals, and 17'/18' Lebron was an incredible player.

[FromDowntown]

Putting up 35/8/5 and 29/11/7.5 going up against Lebron James isn't impressive? KD's 2017 finals scoring output was the best all time when you combine volume and TS%.

Meanwhile who was guarding MJ in 93? Fukin KJ and Dan Majerle?

Besides you are cherry picking right now. Take the ENTRE 17-19 playoff runs and really look at them. I would only say with confidence that MJ and peak Lebron could do better than KD did.

KD played on Lebron's level for 2 straight finals, and 17'/18' Lebron was an incredible player.

LeBron's 2017 Finals was technically better if you account for level of competition and teammates.

LBJ had a second fiddle Irving while KD had MVP Curry, who led a 73 win team on a 30-point 50/40/90 season

hard to compare. LBJ average 34-12-10 on 52%

[Rysio]

Well, thats 96-98 MJ. Thats not a top 15 player of all time.
.
This is why your a retard stat geek

Jordan was a complete master of the game in 96-98 he was a smarter player than his younger self also a better teammate and more clutch too.

[FromDowntown]

This is why your a retard stat geek

Jordan was a complete master of the game in 96-98 he was a smarter player than his younger self also a better teammate and more clutch too.

If MJ was not beating up plumbers he would have a hard time against actual athletes. I can say the 2018 Raptors might have been enough to push 98 MJ off a cliff. You have to remember in 1998 his Finals opponent was weak. As in, #1 lowest alltime #2 option, scoring 10.7 ppg. Google it.

[KD7]

Bro 16-17 and 18-19 KD played better than 17-18 KD. Come on man if you want to try to stan at least do it right.

That's why I said 2017-2018 not 17-18 dummy

[Turbo Slayer]

Putting up 35/8/5 and 29/11/7.5 going up against Lebron James isn't impressive? KD's 2017 finals scoring output was the best all time when you combine volume and TS%.

Meanwhile who was guarding MJ in 93? Fukin KJ and Dan Majerle?

Besides you are cherry picking right now. Take the ENTRE 17-19 playoff runs and really look at them. I would only say with confidence that MJ and peak Lebron could do better than KD did.

KD played on Lebron's level for 2 straight finals, and 17'/18' Lebron was an incredible player. Again I have to remind that KD played on the most stacked team and scored against Cleveland´s trash defenses...

Cool. Its impressive to me.

[Drygon]

Again I have to remind that KD played on the most stacked team and scored against Cleveland´s trash defenses...

Cool. Its impressive to me.

KD was dropping 30 ppg against Miami Heat and their 4th ranked defense...

But I guess KD will be remembered as a scrub when people will downplay LeBron's competition years from now.

[Turbo Slayer]

I consider it impressive... I concede my argument.

:cheers:

Lets be rational...

[ArbitraryWater]

This is why your a retard stat geek

Jordan was a complete master of the game in 96-98 he was a smarter player than his younger self also a better teammate and more clutch too.

sure, except for the clutch part.

Still, he wasn't better.

He only acquired a better jump shot.

However you are the average idiot basketball fan who sees the jumpshot-reliant MJ and comes up with his fantasy bullshit "omg refined master of the game so complete and so much smarter" and think that was peak MJ.

You're an idiot.

[Bronbron23]

Yeah, he was on the most stacked team of all time. No doubt. But he was still the best player on that team AND the best player in the NBA last year.

Before he got hurt, KD's 2019 playoff run was at 34/5/5 on 51/42/90 - GOAT-level scorer shit right there.

2017 Finals - 35/8/5 (only 2.2 turnovers) on 56/47/93 - Just insane, can't really compare that to anyone except KD himself (maybe 93 MJ).
2018 Finals - 29/11/7.5 with 2.3 blocks (only 2.3 turnovers) on 53/41/96 - Again insane, Lebron-type statline but even better efficiency and MJ-level low turnovers..

I understand it can't be understated how stacked GS was...but come on man this is top 10 type talent right here. KD's legacy might not be top 10 but his skill/talent is basically there. How many players in NBA history would be the best player on the 17-19 Warriors and put up those numbers? I'm not sure if even peak Kobe would perform like that when factoring in the efficiency.

At the highest level of competition, I would only put MJ over KD as a scorer. If the Warriors win last year (they would with healthy KD) and KD three-peated with FMVPS as well? IDK man.

KD is clearly one of the best finals performers (better than Kobe and Bird for comparison). I'm close to putting KD in the top 10 (not really legacy wise). But top-10 nonetheless. If he performs still at a high-level on the Nets then without a doubt he will be in the back half of top 10 with guys like Duncan, Hakeem, Bird, etc.

No not even close. Mj earned his championships the hard way. Thats part of what makes them so great. Kd just piggy backed off the hard work steph and the warriors put in for years before kd to become champions.

[Rysio]

sure, except for the clutch part.

Still, he wasn't better.

He only acquired a better jump shot.

However you are the average idiot basketball fan who sees the jumpshot-reliant MJ and comes up with his fantasy bullshit "omg refined master of the game so complete and so much smarter" and think that was peak MJ.

You're an idiot.
Master Vs student. Master doesn't try to prove he can do it all at all times only when it matters as he did.

[3ball]

You're comparing a mid 30's Jordan with significantly worse offensive help in a much more offensively depressed era to a peak KD with GOAT offensive help in a league that's tailored it's rules for more offense and scoring
^^^ insightful and accurate... and historical record

But it's funny how the "era" arguments apply to degrade KD, but not say Bron or Curry.. or to account for goat form not shooting good at threes (MJ)

Carry on

[ArbitraryWater]

Master Vs student. Master doesn't try to prove he can do it all at all times only when it matters as he did.


Yup, you're an idiot.

Go watch some japanese ninja movie and foh with your dumbass master student takes lol

[Axe]

KD is not even the best scorer of his generation.

James Harden has surpassed him.
That wouldn't have happened if harden remained as the sixth man for the team he's playing.

[Run DLC]

So now KD is the GOAT. I’ve heard it all now.

[Run DLC]

The Celtics would absolutely be as good. Are you serious? Please go back and truly review Bird's ENTIRE playoff career. 84-87 Bird is amazing, but his other years left a lot to be desired.

KD is on Bird's level for sure. KD is a much better scorer, slightly worse rebounder, worse playmaker, defense is probably equal.

It's kind of like comparing MJ (KD) and Lebron (Bird).

Defense isn’t equal. Bird won three all-defense selections to KD’s 0

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

According to OP, Kawhi is overrated and his '19 ring is an asterisk That's while playing similar to Jordan and having REALLY good numbers.

ALL THAT yet no issue with Durant joining a 73-win PROVEN champion. And one of the greatest offenses ever. Nope. Durant's run was so good he barely moved up ALL TIME :oldlol:

[StrongLurk]

According to OP, Kawhi is overrated and his '19 ring is an asterisk That's while playing similar to Jordan and having REALLY good numbers.

ALL THAT yet no issue with Durant joining a 73-win PROVEN champion. And one of the greatest offenses ever. Nope. Durant's run was so good he barely moved up ALL TIME :oldlol:

We all know Kawhi would NOT have a 2019 ring if Kevin Durant does not blow out his achilles. KD has ALWAYS been better than Kawhi.

[StrongLurk]

So now KD is the GOAT. I’ve heard it all now.

Who said KD was GOAT?

[Axe]

We all know Kawhi would NOT have a 2019 ring if Kevin Durant does not blow out his achilles. KD has ALWAYS been better than Kawhi.
You seem to have an intense dislike for kawhi.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

We all know Kawhi would NOT have a 2019 ring if Kevin Durant does not blow out his achilles. KD has ALWAYS been better than Kawhi.

And Durant likely never wins without GSW. Not only that, but without the 73-win insurance, he doesn't have "MJ-like" playoff runs either.

So what's your point?

[StrongLurk]

You seem to have an intense dislike for kawhi.

Not at all, I'm extremely neutral to him and think he most likely was the second or third best player in the league last year. I just think he's a classic example of lazy, casual NBA fans ranking him much higher than he really deserves.

Kawhi has never been on a level that Lebron and KD reached...but he a VERY good player without a doubt.

[StrongLurk]

And Durant likely never wins without GSW. Not only that, but without the 73-win safety net, he doesn't have "MJ-like" playoff runs either.

So what's your point?

I give Durant a break because of how good he actually played, it was a level few have ever reached. Sure, his rings are WEAK, but they are not asterisked.

In Kawhi's case, he won BECAUSE KD, the best player in 2019 got injured literally right before the finals. Not even gonna factor in Klay missing games which was big. Imagine Lebron, Magic or Bird blowing their achilles out right before the finals. You think those teams would still win the chip? Hell no.

It's kind of like the 2015 Finals missing Kyrie after game 1 and Kevin Love the whole time. Just huge unlucky breaks for one team.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

I give Durant a break because of how good he actually played, it was a level few have ever reached. Sure, his rings are WEAK, but they are not asterisked.

And a lot of that is because who Durant played with. How does that point keep flying over your head?


In Kawhi's case, he won BECAUSE KD, the best player in 2019 got injured literally right before the finals. Not even gonna factor in Klay missing games which was big. Imagine Lebron, Magic or Bird blowing their achilles out right before the finals. You think those teams would still win the chip? Hell no.

Yeah. With KD, they're only the most STACKED team of all time :oldlol: I'll give you the Klay injury, its a legit argument. But that game 6 was also winnable. More than winnable actually.

[DoctorP]

a run of crying

[Axe]

I give Durant a break because of how good he actually played, it was a level few have ever reached. Sure, his rings are WEAK, but they are not asterisked.

In Kawhi's case, he won BECAUSE KD, the best player in 2019 got injured literally right before the finals. Not even gonna factor in Klay missing games which was big. Imagine Lebron, Magic or Bird blowing their achilles out right before the finals. You think those teams would still win the chip? Hell no.

It's kind of like the 2015 Finals missing Kyrie after game 1 and Kevin Love the whole time. Just huge unlucky breaks for one team.
Lol you should definitely know that dub stans used to chant 'no kd, no problem' as the warriors swept the trailblazers in the wcf last year with ease, only for them to be proven wrong and be forced to eat their very own words when they found themselves in a 3-1 deficit vs. the raptors during the finals. So kd had to come and try to save their day until he went down early in the 2nd quarter. The 11 points he gave was so crucial in letting this team stay alive. Otherwise, it would have been a game over already.

Now going into game 6 and down 3-2 with no more hopes of kd returning to play, the warriors simply tried their best to not give up and remain in the game but as it goes on, it just became obvious that they're trying way too hard when klay suddenly slumped into the floor during the 3rd quarter and needless to say, he was out. After that, curry did everything on his own to force a desperate game 7 but he came up short, too. I think that's the reason why he can't be the fmvp of every finals his team have won in the last five years.

[Drygon]

Not at all, I'm extremely neutral to him and think he most likely was the second or third best player in the league last year. I just think he's a classic example of lazy, casual NBA fans ranking him much higher than he really deserves.

Kawhi has never been on a level that Lebron and KD reached...but he a VERY good player without a doubt.

Absolutely ridiculous statement. Kawhi was clearly better than both of them in playoffs 2017 & against KD in 2019.

2017 playoffs

Box Scores:

- Kawhi Leonard: 27.7/7.8/4.6 on shooting splits 52/45/93 with 16.8 FGA
- LeBron James: 32.8/9.1/7.8 on shooting splits 56.5/41.1/69.8 with 21.3 FGA
- Steph Curry: 28.1/6.2/6.7 on shooting splits 48.4/41.9/90.4 with 18.4 FGA
- Kevin Durant: 28.5/7.9/4.3 on shooting splits 55.6/44.2/89.3 with 17.9 FGA


Advanced Stats:

- Kawhi Leonard: 67.2% TS, 0.314 WS/48, 10.5 OBPM, 3.7 DBPM, 14.2 BPM
- LeBron James: 64.9% TS, 0.275 WS/48, 7.7 OBPM, 2.1 DBPM, 9.8 BPM
- Steph Curry: 65.9% TS, 0.272 WS/48, 8.3 OBPM, 1.4 DBPM, 9.7 BPM
- Kevin Durant: 68.3% TS, 0.280 WS/48, 8.2 OBPM, 1.7 DBPM, 9.9 BPM

2019 playoffs

Box Scores:

- Kawhi Leonard: 30.5/9.1/3.9 on shooting splits 49.0/37.9/88.4 with 20.7 FGA
- Giannis: 25.5/12.3/4.9 on shooting splits 49.2/32.7/63.7 with 17.5 FGA
- Steph Curry: 28.2/6.0/5.7 on shooting splits 44.1/37.7/94.3 with 19.6 FGA
- Kevin Durant: 32.3/4.9/4.5 on shooting splits 51.4/43.8/90.3 with 20.3 FGA

Advanced Stats:

- Kawhi Leonard: 61.9% TS, 0.249 WS/48, 7.6 OBPM, 2.4 DBPM, 10.1 BPM
- Giannis: 57.0% TS, 0.219 WS/48, 5.0 OBPM, 3.3 DBPM, 8.4 BPM
- Steph Curry: 62.0% TS, 0.185 WS/48, 5.6 OBPM, -0.5 DBPM, 5.2 BPM
- Kevin Durant: 66.1% TS, 0.206 WS/48, 6.8 OBPM, 0.8 DBPM, 7.6 BPM






Obviously, numbers without context doesn't really mean much. Kawhi's supporting cast in both of those years were clearly worse. And yet, Kawhi's individual impact & numbers are super impressive.

[Akeem34TheDream]

Absolutely ridiculous statement. Kawhi was clearly better than both of them in playoffs 2017 & against KD in 2019.

2017 playoffs

Box Scores:

- Kawhi Leonard: 27.7/7.8/4.6 on shooting splits 52/45/93 with 16.8 FGA
- LeBron James: 32.8/9.1/7.8 on shooting splits 56.5/41.1/69.8 with 21.3 FGA
- Steph Curry: 28.1/6.2/6.7 on shooting splits 48.4/41.9/90.4 with 18.4 FGA
- Kevin Durant: 28.5/7.9/4.3 on shooting splits 55.6/44.2/89.3 with 17.9 FGA


Advanced Stats:

- Kawhi Leonard: 67.2% TS, 0.314 WS/48, 10.5 OBPM, 3.7 DBPM, 14.2 BPM
- LeBron James: 64.9% TS, 0.275 WS/48, 7.7 OBPM, 2.1 DBPM, 9.8 BPM
- Steph Curry: 65.9% TS, 0.272 WS/48, 8.3 OBPM, 1.4 DBPM, 9.7 BPM
- Kevin Durant: 68.3% TS, 0.280 WS/48, 8.2 OBPM, 1.7 DBPM, 9.9 BPM

2019 playoffs

Box Scores:

- Kawhi Leonard: 30.5/9.1/3.9 on shooting splits 49.0/37.9/88.4 with 20.7 FGA
- Giannis: 25.5/12.3/4.9 on shooting splits 49.2/32.7/63.7 with 17.5 FGA
- Steph Curry: 28.2/6.0/5.7 on shooting splits 44.1/37.7/94.3 with 19.6 FGA
- Kevin Durant: 32.3/4.9/4.5 on shooting splits 51.4/43.8/90.3 with 20.3 FGA

Advanced Stats:

- Kawhi Leonard: 61.9% TS, 0.249 WS/48, 7.6 OBPM, 2.4 DBPM, 10.1 BPM
- Giannis: 57.0% TS, 0.219 WS/48, 5.0 OBPM, 3.3 DBPM, 8.4 BPM
- Steph Curry: 62.0% TS, 0.185 WS/48, 5.6 OBPM, -0.5 DBPM, 5.2 BPM
- Kevin Durant: 66.1% TS, 0.206 WS/48, 6.8 OBPM, 0.8 DBPM, 7.6 BPM






Obviously, numbers without context doesn't really mean much. Kawhi's supporting cast in both of those years were clearly worse. And yet, Kawhi's individual impact & numbers are super impressive.

Brilliant post and the one thing with Kawhi is, he still keeps on improving. Best work ethic in the league.

[ArbitraryWater]

Absolutely ridiculous statement. Kawhi was clearly better than both of them in playoffs 2017 & against KD in 2019.

2017 playoffs

Box Scores:

- Kawhi Leonard: 27.7/7.8/4.6 on shooting splits 52/45/93 with 16.8 FGA
- LeBron James: 32.8/9.1/7.8 on shooting splits 56.5/41.1/69.8 with 21.3 FGA
- Steph Curry: 28.1/6.2/6.7 on shooting splits 48.4/41.9/90.4 with 18.4 FGA
- Kevin Durant: 28.5/7.9/4.3 on shooting splits 55.6/44.2/89.3 with 17.9 FGA


Advanced Stats:

- Kawhi Leonard: 67.2% TS, 0.314 WS/48, 10.5 OBPM, 3.7 DBPM, 14.2 BPM
- LeBron James: 64.9% TS, 0.275 WS/48, 7.7 OBPM, 2.1 DBPM, 9.8 BPM
- Steph Curry: 65.9% TS, 0.272 WS/48, 8.3 OBPM, 1.4 DBPM, 9.7 BPM
- Kevin Durant: 68.3% TS, 0.280 WS/48, 8.2 OBPM, 1.7 DBPM, 9.9 BPM

2019 playoffs

Box Scores:

- Kawhi Leonard: 30.5/9.1/3.9 on shooting splits 49.0/37.9/88.4 with 20.7 FGA
- Giannis: 25.5/12.3/4.9 on shooting splits 49.2/32.7/63.7 with 17.5 FGA
- Steph Curry: 28.2/6.0/5.7 on shooting splits 44.1/37.7/94.3 with 19.6 FGA
- Kevin Durant: 32.3/4.9/4.5 on shooting splits 51.4/43.8/90.3 with 20.3 FGA

Advanced Stats:

- Kawhi Leonard: 61.9% TS, 0.249 WS/48, 7.6 OBPM, 2.4 DBPM, 10.1 BPM
- Giannis: 57.0% TS, 0.219 WS/48, 5.0 OBPM, 3.3 DBPM, 8.4 BPM
- Steph Curry: 62.0% TS, 0.185 WS/48, 5.6 OBPM, -0.5 DBPM, 5.2 BPM
- Kevin Durant: 66.1% TS, 0.206 WS/48, 6.8 OBPM, 0.8 DBPM, 7.6 BPM






Obviously, numbers without context doesn't really mean much. Kawhi's supporting cast in both of those years were clearly worse. And yet, Kawhi's individual impact & numbers are super impressive.


You do see LeBron massively outperforming him, right?

[Drygon]

You do see LeBron massively outperforming him, right?

Lol, no. Kawhi's impact across all metrics were significantly bigger than LeBron.

[StrongLurk]

Absolutely ridiculous statement. Kawhi was clearly better than both of them in playoffs 2017 & against KD in 2019.

2017 playoffs

Box Scores:

- Kawhi Leonard: 27.7/7.8/4.6 on shooting splits 52/45/93 with 16.8 FGA
- LeBron James: 32.8/9.1/7.8 on shooting splits 56.5/41.1/69.8 with 21.3 FGA
- Steph Curry: 28.1/6.2/6.7 on shooting splits 48.4/41.9/90.4 with 18.4 FGA
- Kevin Durant: 28.5/7.9/4.3 on shooting splits 55.6/44.2/89.3 with 17.9 FGA


Advanced Stats:

- Kawhi Leonard: 67.2% TS, 0.314 WS/48, 10.5 OBPM, 3.7 DBPM, 14.2 BPM
- LeBron James: 64.9% TS, 0.275 WS/48, 7.7 OBPM, 2.1 DBPM, 9.8 BPM
- Steph Curry: 65.9% TS, 0.272 WS/48, 8.3 OBPM, 1.4 DBPM, 9.7 BPM
- Kevin Durant: 68.3% TS, 0.280 WS/48, 8.2 OBPM, 1.7 DBPM, 9.9 BPM

2019 playoffs

Box Scores:

- Kawhi Leonard: 30.5/9.1/3.9 on shooting splits 49.0/37.9/88.4 with 20.7 FGA
- Giannis: 25.5/12.3/4.9 on shooting splits 49.2/32.7/63.7 with 17.5 FGA
- Steph Curry: 28.2/6.0/5.7 on shooting splits 44.1/37.7/94.3 with 19.6 FGA
- Kevin Durant: 32.3/4.9/4.5 on shooting splits 51.4/43.8/90.3 with 20.3 FGA

Advanced Stats:

- Kawhi Leonard: 61.9% TS, 0.249 WS/48, 7.6 OBPM, 2.4 DBPM, 10.1 BPM
- Giannis: 57.0% TS, 0.219 WS/48, 5.0 OBPM, 3.3 DBPM, 8.4 BPM
- Steph Curry: 62.0% TS, 0.185 WS/48, 5.6 OBPM, -0.5 DBPM, 5.2 BPM
- Kevin Durant: 66.1% TS, 0.206 WS/48, 6.8 OBPM, 0.8 DBPM, 7.6 BPM






Obviously, numbers without context doesn't really mean much. Kawhi's supporting cast in both of those years were clearly worse. And yet, Kawhi's individual impact & numbers are super impressive.


I'm not a fan of "advanced stats" that much anymore. They themselves are subjective to the creators methods and can't really provide an accurate assessment.

KD has better quantifiable, objective numbers than Kawhi.

2017
Kawhi Leonard: 27.7/7.8/4.6 on shooting splits 52/45/93 with 16.8 FGA - 67%TS
Kevin Durant: 28.5/7.9/4.3 on shooting splits 55.6/44.2/89.3 with 17.9 FGA - 68%TS

2019
Kawhi Leonard: 30.5/9.1/3.9 on shooting splits 49.0/37.9/88.4 with 20.7 FGA - 62%TS
Kevin Durant: 32.3/4.9/4.5 on shooting splits 51.4/43.8/90.3 with 20.3 FGA - 66%TS

And of course the BIGGEST difference is that KD is FAR superior to Kawhi in the finals.

Here's also a vid of KD dropping 51/11/6 on Kawhi's HEAD literally earlier that year (18-19) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnzg8oGfCnI

[Roundball_Rock]

How many MVPs has Durant won?