Why do so many legends still say Kobe is better than Lebron

[Basketball IQ]

Outside of championships, how exactly can you say Kobe is ahead of Lebron all time. Lebron has the better stats, records, more MVPs, better longevity, more Finals MVP, and you can make the argument that he did more with less. Can someone please explain to me how Kobe still has the edge over Lebron in a lot of peoples' eyes?

[999Guy]

Scoring, championships, persona, aesthetics. Hype/media sensationalism. The actual debate itself.

Kobe simply has more fans in general. He was a more popular player by 06.

[FultzNationRISE]

The short answer is: They dont

[Axe]

Kobe benefitted from playing for one of the most storied franchises in nba history, a team that was a perennial title contender in the west for how many times.

[3ball]

Only 6% of lebron's jumpers are considered "contested" by nba.com

So he avoids contested jumpers and only seeks threes and layups

That doesn't compare to Kobe and that's just the tip of the iceberg

Should we really be surprised that a stiff, mechanical style like lebron's get exploited and defeated, but the infinitely adjustable, smooth skills of Kobe couldn't be beaten like that?

Anyone with 2 eyes can see that Kobe was more skilled.. possibly the most skilled ever

[Reggie43]

Skills and Mentality.

[SATAN]

Kobe was one of the biggest ball hogs I've ever seen but I think people just liked the way he moved. He was a poor man's MJ and benefited from being around that era. Very popular guy with the fans and media for the most part. He had a great marketing gimmick going on that cornballs unashamedly mimic and talk about to this day. (mamba mentality)

But LeBron is the better all round player imo

[Goldrush25]

Only 6% of lebron's jumpers are considered "contested" by nba.com

So he avoids contested jumpers and only seeks threes and layups


That's called being a smarter, better player.

Why would you intentionally take more difficult shots if you don't have to? People call Kobe the best bad shot maker in NBA history, but you have to take a lot of bad shots to earn that reputation.

The game is putting the ball in the hoop, period. Lebron is better at it than Kobe was, period.

[Axe]

That's called being a smarter, better player.

Why would you intentionally take more difficult shots if you don't have to? People call Kobe the best bad shot maker in NBA history, but you have to take a lot of bad shots to earn that reputation.

The game is putting the ball in the hoop, period. Lebron is better at it than Kobe was, period.
Well, kobe also has this extreme mentality that screams he's not afraid to shoot crappy shots as long as he is trying and he feels very good about that.

[Norcaliblunt]

Michael Jordan, Kobe, and Lebron are all terrible human beings.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Because Kobe was a killer,more dangerous scorer and has 5 rings (even tho Shaq was the man in those first 3) Kobe's 2 rings away from Shaq were more impressive than all 3 of LeBron's rings due to winning while being in a more competitive conference and not having to form a superteam.

[MrFonzworth]

Because Kobe was a killer,more dangerous scorer and has 5 rings (even tho Shaq was the man in those first 3) Kobe's 2 rings away from Shaq were more impressive than all 3 of LeBron's rings due to winning while being in a more competitive conference and not having to form a superteam.

Kobe's more impressive than 2016? You're *** drunk buddy

[3ball]

That's called being a smarter, better player.

Why would you intentionally take more difficult shots if you don't have to? People call Kobe the best bad shot maker in NBA history, but you have to take a lot of bad shots to earn that reputation.

The game is putting the ball in the hoop, period. Lebron is better at it than Kobe was, period.

The team's best player should take the team's contested shots, bit lebron defers them to teammates, while Kobe never shirked his "bailout guy" responsibility

That's just 1 reason Kobe is superior and has a much better clutch rep

The reality is that Kobe employs a style that puts more pressure on the opponent and wears them out, so they have less capacity for offense.. otoh, lebron's long dribbles don't shift defenses/wear out teams like the ball movement he faces at the championship level, so opponents are always fresher with more capacity to go off offensively

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Kobe's more impressive than 2016? You're *** drunk buddy

Yes even the overrated 2016 finals win

[MrFonzworth]

Retard alert

[warriorfan]

Kobe's more impressive than 2016? You're *** drunk buddy

Open your eyes. 2016 wasn’t even good. Cliffnotes: Look at LeBron’s stats games 1-4, Adam silvers after the fact upgrade to flagrant and suspension of Draymond, injuries to Andrew Bogut and Andre Iguodala, Steph Curry visibly not healthy, Harrison Barnes going 3/18 in the last two games on wide open shots. 2016 fell into LeBron’s lap all circumstances considered.

[Norcaliblunt]

Put Lebron on those Laker teams with Gasol, Artest, and Odom and he does better than Kobe.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Put Lebron on those Laker teams with Gasol, Artest, and Odom and he does better than Kobe.

1) He refuses to play in a system

2) He wouldn't be able to play the triangle

3) He has no jumpshot

4) The West was more loaded than the East

5) LeBron turns teammates into spot up shooters

6) LeBron will probably just try to form a superteam in the west if he loses while playing in place of Kobe

[SouBeachTalents]

https://media.tenor.com/images/d6eb7c160a0b5a313fa495d38da1fdf3/tenor.gif
:lol

[jstern]

I think it's because Kobe was more skilled, and they appreciate that level of skills, and because Lebron's stats comes at the expense of the team, inflated.

Quick example, is it a coincidence that when Lebron sits the team does horrible? Having the stans saying, "Lebron needs more help. Lebron needs more help." How can that always be the case in an almost two decades long career? Because when you play for a Lebron led team you have to adjust your whole game to fit his. That's not the case with a Kobe Bryant, where at least his teammates can get something going when he's not on the floor.

I think NBA players recognize that.

[Axe]

Put Lebron on those Laker teams with Gasol, Artest, and Odom and he does better than Kobe.
Well, it almost happened in 2007 when the lakers tried to offer kobe for the cavs in exchange for lbj but the trade became toy story because they didn't want to let him go. Also, it would have allowed hof coach phil jackson an opportunity to coach him if only this went on.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.si.com/.amp/nba/2016/02/10/kobe-bryant-lebron-james-trade-2007-lakers-cavaliers

[Norcaliblunt]

1) He refuses to play in a system

2) He wouldn't be able to play the triangle

3) He has no jumpshot

4) The West was more loaded than the East

5) LeBron turns teammates into spot up shooters

6) LeBron will probably just try to form a superteam in the west if he loses while playing in place of Kobe


All this is very true, but he is still better than Kobe.

[Wavves]

Kobe's best skill was being a scorer, and Lebron does that better than him and that isn't even his best skill lmao

[Axe]

Kobe's best skill was being a scorer, and Lebron does that better than him and that isn't even his best skill lmao
The perks of being the renowned superstar in a team with a bunch of scrubs.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

All this is very true, but he is still better than Kobe.
How???

Kobe's best skill was being a scorer, and Lebron does that better than him and that isn't even his best skill lmao
False,Kobe was a more dangerous scorer than LeBron.Majority of LeBrick's points come from inside the paint via drive to the basket,if he's stripped of that he's screwed.Kobe had more tools in the toolbox,he could go off for 40,50,60 on any given night.

[SATAN]

Any given night? Explain all his terrible shooting performances then. The revisionist history is out of control. He wasn't a bad player by any stretch of the imagination but he had many a bad shooting night where he would just keep shooting and shooting in hopes it would eventually fall into place.

[Lebron23]

1) He refuses to play in a system

2) He wouldn't be able to play the triangle

3) He has no jumpshot

4) The West was more loaded than the East

5) LeBron turns teammates into spot up shooters

6) LeBron will probably just try to form a superteam in the west if he loses while playing in place of Kobe

I added another one on my ignore lists.

[deathawaitu]

It's a consensus among players and fans that Kobe was, is, and always will be the better player than Lebron

Kobe is cemented top 10 both in career and basketball skills. Whereas Lebron has a career arguable Top 15, but basketball skills wise he is not even top 50

Lebron fans cry and whine the loudest, but they are the minority of the fan base

Once everything is said and done,Curry most likely will be remember as the greater player and higher ranked on the goat list than Lebron by the fans and other legends

Fans actually watch the games and appreciate skills and greatness not stats watching like Lebron fans

[LAL]

Any given night? Explain all his terrible shooting performances then. The revisionist history is out of control. He wasn't a bad player by any stretch of the imagination but he had many a bad shooting night where he would just keep shooting and shooting in hopes it would eventually fall into place.
All true scorers have bad shooting nights. Kobe, Jordan, Kawhi, KD etc.. The fact that lebron almost never has bad shooting nights, or bad games on paper should tell you enough about how he plays without scoring responsibility.. an opportunistic scorer. Only bron stans complain about not being scared to shoot on bad nights. You guys rather care about triple doubles in a finals while he's getting shutdown in reality.

[LAL]

Kobe's best skill was being a scorer, and Lebron does that better than him and that isn't even his best skill lmaoKobe and MJ have proved they can playmake and get triple doubles when asked or needed. Can lebron play off ball, score, dominate, defend well and be as efficient? Those Doncic, Westbrook, Harden, Trae Young stats won't hide the fact he's very flawed basketball player. Why compare him to Kobe? All those flaws, finals losses, ringchasing, weak east, more seasons more oppurtunities and still nothing. All around stats don't mean all around player. Lebron plays in those tailor made systems and role because he has no choice, can't do what true scorers do, he can only try to average Westbrook type stats and lose with superteams.

[Turbo Slayer]

All true scorers have bad shooting nights. Kobe, Jordan, Kawhi, KD etc.. The fact that lebron almost never has bad shooting nights, or bad games on paper should tell you enough about how he plays without scoring responsibility.. an opportunistic scorer. Only bron stans complain about not being scared to shoot on bad nights. You guys rather care about triple doubles in a finals while he's getting shutdown in reality.


he plays without scoring responsibility Lebron led his team in points, rebounding and assists many times. He has done this in SIXTY-TWO playoff games. Next closest is Duncan and Bird who each did it 21 times. Yet you want to harp on how LeBron doesnt score "much".


You guys rather care about triple doubles in a finals while he's getting shutdown in reality. Sure. He got "shutdown" putting up 33.6 points on +0.76 rTS (league average playoffs 2017). Keep in mind he did this against the #2 defense in the NBA Finals.

Also LeBron's TS% in this Finals is higher than all Kobe Bryant's Finals series.

(63 TS% in the Finals)

[Vino24]

“Dangerous” “lethal” all catch phrases to prop up Kobe’s lack of scoring. LeBron has hit more game winners in the playoffs and has scored more points in playoffs and regular season

[LAL]

Lebron led his team in points, rebounding and assists many times. He has done this in SIXTY-TWO playoff games. Next closest is Duncan and Bird who each did it 21 times. Yet you want to harp on how LeBron doesnt score "much".

Sure. He got "shutdown" putting up 33.6 points on +0.76 rTS (league average playoffs 2017). Keep in mind he did this against the #2 defense in the NBA Finals.

Also LeBron's TS% in this Finals is higher than all Kobe Bryant's Finals series.

(63 TS% in the Finals)
Those stats didn't stop kawhi and iggy receive Fmvp's. We saw how they shut him down, looking scared and useless in half court, runnng after every fast break like his teammates can't finish a layup.. collecting garbage points. Better scorer my ass.

[Vino24]

Those stats didn't stop kawhi and iggy receive Fmvp's. We saw how they shut him down, looking scared and useless in half court, runnng after every fast break like his teammates can't finish a layup.. collecting garbage points. Better scorer my ass.

LeBron already has the 2nd most fmvps and has 4mvps. LeBron is very good

[Turbo Slayer]

Kobe and MJ have proved they can playmake and get triple doubles when asked or needed. Can lebron play off ball, score, dominate, defend well and be as efficient? Those Doncic, Westbrook, Harden, Trae Young stats won't hide the fact he's very flawed basketball player. Why compare him to Kobe? All those flaws, finals losses, ringchasing, weak east, more seasons more oppurtunities and still nothing. All around stats don't mean all around player. Lebron plays in those tailor made systems and role because he has no choice, can't do what true scorers do, he can only try to average Westbrook type stats and lose with superteams.


Can lebron play off ball Yes he can.


score 36.6 points/per 100 possessions. -LeBron 35.8 points/per 100 possessions. -Kobe

ADVANTAGE: LeBron


dominate In the Playoffs? Well yes.

LeBron James leads the NBA ALLTIME in PER wise.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&per_minute_base=36&per_poss_base=100&type=advanced&season_start=1&season_end=-1&lg_id=NBA&age_min=0&age_max=99&is_playoffs=Y&height_min=0&height_max=99&birth_country_is=Y&as_comp=gt&as_val=0&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=per&c1comp=gt&c2stat=ws_per_48&c2comp=gt&c3stat=bpm&c3comp=gt&c4stat=vorp&c4comp=gt&order_by=ws

LeBron James holds FIVE of the top 10 in playoffs runs (alltime). NO player in NBA history has more in the top 10 alltime. (#1, #3, #6, #8, and #9 respectively)

[LAL]

LeBron already has the 2nd most fmvps and has 4mvps. LeBron is very good

Great, more stats, media awards and ringchasing rings. BEttEr SCoreR!

[LAL]

Yes he can.

36.6 points/per 100 possessions. -LeBron 35.8 points/per 100 possessions. -Kobe

ADVANTAGE: LeBron

In the Playoffs? Well yes.

LeBron James leads the NBA ALLTIME in PER wise.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&per_minute_base=36&per_poss_base=100&type=advanced&season_start=1&season_end=-1&lg_id=NBA&age_min=0&age_max=99&is_playoffs=Y&height_min=0&height_max=99&birth_country_is=Y&as_comp=gt&as_val=0&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=per&c1comp=gt&c2stat=ws_per_48&c2comp=gt&c3stat=bpm&c3comp=gt&c4stat=vorp&c4comp=gt&order_by=ws

LeBron James holds FIVE of the top 10 in playoffs runs (alltime). NO player in NBA history has more in the top 10 alltime. (#1, #3, #6, #8, and #9 respectively)

We know he has the stats lol relax . Yes he can you said :oldlol:

[Vino24]

Great, more stats, media awards and ringchasing rings. BEttEr SCoreR!

You sound mad. Stats and rings the two most important things in basketball

[Turbo Slayer]

Kobe and MJ have proved they can playmake and get triple doubles when asked or needed. Can lebron play off ball, score, dominate, defend well and be as efficient? Those Doncic, Westbrook, Harden, Trae Young stats won't hide the fact he's very flawed basketball player. Why compare him to Kobe? All those flaws, finals losses, ringchasing, weak east, more seasons more oppurtunities and still nothing. All around stats don't mean all around player. Lebron plays in those tailor made systems and role because he has no choice, can't do what true scorers do, he can only try to average Westbrook type stats and lose with superteams.


dominate Well LeBron's 2009 playoff run is (arguably) the greatest playoff run of ALL TIME statistically. I decided to include LeBron's playoff run in 2018 for VORP.

LeBron led the NBA alltime in WS/48, PER, BPM, VORP (2018), and OBPM in the 2009 playoff run.

[LAL]

You sound mad. Stats and rings the two most important things in basketball

He has less rings than kobe with superteams in a weak east because he couldn't win before that so he created the monstars. Stats tell me Westbrook and Harden are better than your boi

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

The only time LeBron was more willing to play off the ball was in Miami but he still couldn't catch & shoot like a Jordan or Durant.

[LAL]

And Luka Doncic is better than kawhi according to stats

[ArbitraryWater]

like which

[Turbo Slayer]

Those stats didn't stop kawhi and iggy receive Fmvp's. We saw how they shut him down, looking scared and useless in half court, runnng after every fast break like his teammates can't finish a layup.. collecting garbage points. Better scorer my ass.


Those stats didn't stop kawhi and iggy receive Fmvp's. 2014 Finals deserves a bit of criticism of course but not 2015. The ONLY reason why GSW won in the 2015 Finals is because Kyrie and Love was out for the 2015 Finals.


We saw how they shut him down, looking scared and useless in half court, runnng after every fast break like his teammates can't finish a layup.. collecting garbage points. Better scorer my ass.


LeBron put up 28 points on 68 TS% in the 2014 Finals.

LeBron put up 36 points on 48 TS% in the 2015 Finals. None of this screams "shutdown".

[LAL]

2014 Finals deserves a bit of criticism of course but not 2015. The ONLY reason why GSW won in the 2015 Finals is because Kyrie and Love was out for the 2015 Finals.



LeBron put up 28 points on 68 TS% in the 2014 Finals.

LeBron put up 36 points on 48 TS% in the 2015 Finals. None of this screams "shutdown".

What were his numbers with Kawhi and Iggy on him statnerd.

[Turbo Slayer]

What were his numbers with Kawhi and Iggy on him statnerd. When Iggy was on LeBron, LeBron was shooting 38% FG shooting. When you hold the best player in the world to 38% you deserve credit for that. And that's one of the reasons why Iggy won Finals MVP.

Also have to give credit to Kawhi. LeBron shot an abysmal 17% FG when guarded by Kawhi in Game 5.

[Turbo Slayer]

And Luka Doncic is better than kawhi according to stats Uh no. Luka Doncic hasn't even shown up the playoffs yet like Kawhi did.

[warriorfan]

When Iggy was on LeBron, LeBron was shooting 38% FG shooting. When you hold the best player in the world to 38% you deserve credit for that. And that's one of the reasons why Iggy won Finals MVP.

Also have to give credit to Kawhi. LeBron shot an abysmal 17% FG when guarded by Kawhi in Game 5.

Since you were 11 years old at the time? Did you watch it live? Have you ever seen the entire series?

[LAL]

Since you were 11 years old at the time? Did you watch it live? Have you ever seen the entire series?

https://youtu.be/APGlNxSvODw
Honestly, look at that body language, i don't get it.. Kobe??

Probably had nice stats that game.

[Axe]

And Luka Doncic is better than kawhi according to stats
Luka has never even played in the postseason yet

[knicksman]

That's called being a smarter, better player.

Why would you intentionally take more difficult shots if you don't have to? People call Kobe the best bad shot maker in NBA history, but you have to take a lot of bad shots to earn that reputation.

The game is putting the ball in the hoop, period. Lebron is better at it than Kobe was, period.

"Difficult roads often lead to beautiful destinations." So the players who continuously challenge themselves are more likely to win than those who avoids them.

[RogueBorg]

Why do I like it when you guys fight like you do?

[Axe]

"Difficult roads often lead to beautiful destinations." So the players who continuously challenge themselves are more likely to win than those who avoids them.
Or probably he's just 'bored' of the competition?

[The Iron Fist]

Lebron led his team in points, rebounding and assists many times. He has done this in SIXTY-TWO playoff games. Next closest is Duncan and Bird who each did it 21 times. Yet you want to harp on how LeBron doesnt score "much".

Sure. He got "shutdown" putting up 33.6 points on +0.76 rTS (league average playoffs 2017). Keep in mind he did this against the #2 defense in the NBA Finals.

Also LeBron's TS% in this Finals is higher than all Kobe Bryant's Finals series.

(63 TS% in the Finals)

With all those stats lebron has at least 7 titles, yes? If not, what’s the point of all that? Is having 62 of those games a good thing or a bad thing? If it’s good, then you can’t blame his team. If it’s bad, you have to call him a ball hog who doesn’t make his team better for winning. So which is it?

[ImKobe]

Lebron led his team in points, rebounding and assists many times. He has done this in SIXTY-TWO playoff games. Next closest is Duncan and Bird who each did it 21 times. Yet you want to harp on how LeBron doesnt score "much".

Sure. He got "shutdown" putting up 33.6 points on +0.76 rTS (league average playoffs 2017). Keep in mind he did this against the #2 defense in the NBA Finals.

Also LeBron's TS% in this Finals is higher than all Kobe Bryant's Finals series.

(63 TS% in the Finals)

Apples to oranges. Lebron's numbers are heavily inflated post-2013, when the league started chucking 3s and amping up the pace. Kobe played half of his career in the toughest era for perimeter players while Lebron is playing in the one that revolves around playing 5 out and spamming high P&Rs.

[dbugz]

What's wrong with that?

Kobe > LeBron

[Lebron23]

LeBron is way better.

[3ball]

on plays where lebron doesn't get in the paint, he won't shoot unless he's open (he avoids contested jumpers), so the defender has hope if they can just stay close enough to him - aka lebron won't shoot at all (avoids contested jumpers) and will pass to a lesser teammate instead..

Imagine not having to worry about being repeatedly demoralized by contested jumpers because your man (Bron) won't shoot in those spots!.. the defender can restrict lebron's volume this way, and the lower volume means lebron can't command a double.

Kobe doesn't let the defender off the hook like that.. Kobe will take contested shots and get hot doing so, thus commanding a double team to free up teammates... Kobe commanding a double introduces a randomness to the game that LeRobot lacks... LeBoring-ball.. LePredictiball.. LeExploitable-ball.. no random factor.. jumper never gets hot

[Bronbron23]

That's called being a smarter, better player.

Why would you intentionally take more difficult shots if you don't have to? People call Kobe the best bad shot maker in NBA history, but you have to take a lot of bad shots to earn that reputation.

The game is putting the ball in the hoop, period. Lebron is better at it than Kobe was, period.

This is true to a point. Lebron definitely lets the game come to him more. This can be smart but it also become a problem in times where he has no other choice. Like the 15 finals for instance. He was forced to be a volume shooter and create shots and it took him out of his comfort zone. The eye test and his stats showed this. Thats the advantage mj and kb a little less had. They could play within the triangle and let the game come to them or they could say f*ck it and take the ball and create and shoot a shit ton of shots whike still being fairly efficient. This is why mj was feared way more than lebron. They knew there he had no weakness and could score at will in a variety of ways. Offensively lebron has a few weaknesses. Particularly his shooting. His stats say hes a good shooter but the eye test says something else. Many times bron has been reluctant to take a jumper. Hes never truly trusted it or been confident in it. He also has never seemed comfortable in the post. So scoring wise lebron mostly attacks you in only 2 ways. Threes and attacking the rim.