Jordan's career without Pippen vs Pippen's career without Jordan

[Mamba4Life]

Jordan:

1985: Lost 3-1 in the first round
1986: Swept in the first round
1987: Swept in the first round
2002: Miss playoffs in a weak conference
2003: Miss playoffs in a weak conference


Pippen:

1994: Wins 55 games, Top 3 in MVP voting, loses in 7 in the second round (by rigged officiating)

1999: Made playoffs, scored 37/13/4 but loses to Lakers

2000: Made WCF but lost in Game 7 to Shaq. One play away from making the Finals and winning the championship

2001: Won 50 games, lost in first round



So Jordan has 1 playoff win without Pippen, Pippen was 2 plays away from winning 2 rings without MJ (1994 and 2000). Pippen could've had 8 rings :wtf:

[Mamba4Life]

Meanwhile anyone wanna do Kyrie, Kevin Love, Bosh, AD and Wade's career without LeBron vs LeBron without them??:roll::roll:

[HoopsNY]

How do you compare the two that way? That's far too simplistic. For one, consider the teams that each player played on, as well as their 1st round competition.

Sure you can understand that a 59 win Bucks team was great and the mid 80s Celtics were some of the best teams, ever. And Scottie joined a HOF squad in Houston and then joined a great team (that won 58 games) in Portland.

Mj then joined arguably the worst team in the league in 2001. The two situations aren't congruent. Nor can you really compare them. This is just another tear down post that serves no purpose except fanboyism and it doesn't offer any meaningful analysis.

[Wally450]

I'm all for shitting on MJ, but to give Pippens numbers then say he lost to the Lakers in 1999, then don't put anything for MJ scoring 63 against the Celtics and losing to them, seems a bit off.

[Mamba4Life]

I'm all for shitting on MJ, but to give Pippens numbers then say he lost to the Lakers in 1999, then don't put anything for MJ scoring 63 against the Celtics and losing to them, seems a bit off.

Pippen was in Game 7 of the WCF, one play away from making the Finals, and beating the Pacers to win the championship


All Jordan's 63 could've done is extend the series for another game, best case scenario Jordan loses 3-1 instead of getting swept

[Roundball_Rock]

The OP is why they always want to bring up what Kareem did without Magic, LeBron without Wade, Kobe without Shaq, and so on...but never a word about what Jordan did without Pippen.

[Axe]

Duh...

Of course you need the right pieces if you want to win the championship several times. You can't just win on your own alone.

What a dumb OP

[AlternativeAcc.]

OP got them boys shook

Pippen clearly had the better career without Jordan than Jordan did without him

That fact alone ruins Jordan's legacy and takes him out of the GOAT argument

[3ball]

The OP is why they always want to bring up what Kareem did without Magic, LeBron without Wade, Kobe without Shaq, and so on...but never a word about what Jordan did without Pippen.

All those guys had another star when they won.. i.e. Kareem had Oscar.. Lebron had Kyrie.. Kobe had Pau

MJ didn't have another star, so that's the difference... but when he got a one of the lowest-producing stars ever (pip), he never lost again in a full season

[Vino24]

Rodman was a star kukoc would have been had MJ given him the ball more

[Axe]

Lol are you going to unleash the crab mentality and bitterness you mudslingers have again just to downplay his feats or status? In '91, the rest of the bulls were first-time finalists before their maiden championship season that year.

And let's not forget that lebron formed the heat triumvirate in 2010 by joining former fmvp wade and another star in bosh, yet succumbing in the 2011 finals before he won his first title in 2012.

[Axe]

All those guys had another star when they won.. i.e. Kareem had Oscar.. Lebron had Kyrie.. Kobe had Pau

MJ didn't have another star, so that's the difference... but when he got a one of the lowest-producing stars ever (pip), he never lost again in a full season
That's why you get berated for having such pathetic perspective.

[3ball]

That's why you get berated for having such pathetic perspective.

I get praised frequently on this forum

Some less secure people berate because I know more than everybody.. consequently, people are jealous that their inferior knowledge results in inferior, less substantiated or intuitive takes, and an inability to effectively counter the facts i inform them of

[Axe]

I get praised frequently on this forum

Some less secure people berate because I know more than everybody.. consequently, people are jealous that their inferior knowledge results in inferior, less substantiated or intuitive takes, and an inability to effectively counter the facts i inform them of
Lmao. At this point, idk if you're just kidding me or not. 😂

[3ball]

Lmao. At this point, idk if you're just kidding me or not. ��

Just Google "3ball insidehoops"

Various worship threads lol

And its a fact - a previous poster said that Shaq won without Kobe, and Lebron without Wade - but those guys had another star to replace their sidekicks, aka Kyrie replaced Wade and Gasol replace Shaq - everyone needed another star to win, except mj won with the worst star (Pippen < Kobe, Wade)

[Mamba4Life]

I get praised frequently on this forum

Some less secure people berate because I know more than everybody.. consequently, people are jealous that their inferior knowledge results in inferior, less substantiated or intuitive takes, and an inability to effectively counter the facts i inform them of

So explain why Kyrie is better than Pippen with his 24ppg with no defense, rebounding, or playmaking, while Pippen produced 22 ppg with superior defense, rebounding, playmaking.

Explain why Jordan won in 1998 with 4 and 2, while LeBron lost with 12 and 10 in 2017(ppg cancel each other out)

Explain why Jordan lost with an all star teammate in 1990 and 1995, while LeBron won without an all star teammate in 2016

Explain why Pippen took a 57 win Bulls team that lost Jordan, and still won 55 games. Explain why Kyrie took a took a 55 win Celtics team that made the ECF, and made them win 47 games and lose in the 2nd round.

[3ball]

So explain why Kyrie is better than Pippen with his 24ppg with no defense, rebounding, or playmaking, while Pippen produced 22 ppg with superior defense, rebounding, playmaking.




Kyrie averaged 6 and 9 more points in the playoffs, and 9 more in the Finals... Specifically:

Kyrie averaged 25.5 in the 16' and 17' playoffs, compared to 20 and 17 for Pippen in the 1st and 2nd three-peats... Kyrie also averaged 28 for his Finals career compared to 19 for Pippen (42.5%)

^^^^ such massive scoring and efficiency gaps mean the other categories don't matter

Ultimately, Kyrie is a much better scorer and playmaker







Explain why Jordan won in 1998 with 4 and 2, while LeBron lost with 12 and 10 in 2017(ppg cancel each other out)



Because MJ properly delegated the rebounding duties instead of over-rebounding his position and stealing rebounds from his bigs (therefore disengaging them)

And he preferred ball movement/higher team assists over personal assistant/low team assists

But most importantly, mj a superior scorer, clutch player, and defender






why Jordan lost with an all star teammate in 1990 and 1995, while LeBron won without an all star teammate in 2016




^^^ Because that's better than losing 5 times with an all-star like lebron did in 09', 11', 14', 17', and 18





Explain week Pippen took a 57 win Bulls team that lost Jordan, and still won 55 games. Explain why Kyrie took a took a 55 win Celtics team that made the ECF, and made them win 47 games and lose in the 2nd round


.
It makes sense that a 3-peat brand can make 2nd Round and win 55 in regular season

Ultimately, mj's fundamentally-sound game allowed a 3-peat brand, while lebron's ball-dominance doesn't

Btw, if lebron won 60 games with Lowry as his sidekick, everyone would call it a carry-job.

Yet DeRozan routinely won 55-60 and no one cared because it's nothing.. guys like Marc Gasol, Hornacek and many more led 55 win teams in scoring

But just think what a massive decline that 3-peat to 2nd round is

[Roundball_Rock]

All those guys had another star when they won.. i.e. Kareem had Oscar.. Lebron had Kyrie.. Kobe had Pau

So you are admitting Pippen needed MJ? :lebronamazed:

MJ couldn't just "will his way" to chips with Woolridge, Oakley, Hamilton, or Stackhouse?

[Soundwave]

2000 Blazers win the title if you sub out Pippen and put in Jordan, even 2000 version Jordan. He's not going to just there and watch his team fall apart like that when a few buckets would've stemmed the tide and kept the Lakers at bay.

1999 Rockets also win the title with Jordan instead of Pippen.

[3ball]

So you are admitting Pippen needed MJ? :lebronamazed:

MJ couldn't just "will his way" to chips with Woolridge, Oakley, Hamilton, or Stackhouse?

Not as a rookie or sophomore.. guys like KD, Lebron, Curry, Giannis and kyrie MISS the playoffs in their first few years, so mj cutting his teeth on the goat team was an accelerated learning curve that set the foundation for organic rings.. it gave the bulls a couple extra bites at the apple

But 1990-1998 Jordan wins rings with just about anyone and a full season... Guarantee he wins multiple rings with X-man (underrated on both ends and had the mentality to thrive under MJ - check out his numbers vs Lakers in 87' WCF, or his destruction of Pippen in 92' ECSC)

[Roundball_Rock]

2000 Blazers win the title if you sub out Pippen and put in Jordan, even 2000 version Jordan.

Because 2000 Jordan was so dominant on the golf course? :oldlol:

Jordan would do this, Jordan would do that. I have never seen a historical figure get so much credit for things he never actually did. It is crazy.

[Mamba4Life]

Because 2000 Jordan was so dominant on the golf course? :oldlol:

Jordan would do this, Jordan would do that. I have never seen a historical figure get so much credit for things he never actually did. It is crazy.


People love to imagine mythical scenarios with Jordan’s career without Pippen but the truth is we have 5 seasons of proof and he either got swept in the first round while winning 30 games, or missed the playoffs :lol

[3ball]

People love to imagine mythical scenarios with Jordan’s career without Pippen but the truth is we have 5 seasons of proof and he either got swept in the first round while winning 30 games, or missed the playoffs :lol

Pippen was a 14 ppg player in 1989 and averaged 9 on 40% in the ECF

You don't think other guys in Pippen's place would've allowed the Bulls to win?.. that makes no sense, which means you have no argument

[Mamba4Life]

Pippen was a 14 ppg player in 1989 and averaged 9 on 40% in the ECF

You don't think other guys in Pippen's place would've allowed the Bulls to win?.. that makes no sense, which means you have no argument

Because Pippen also fosters GOAT teamwork, chemistry, defense, and playmaking. Why was Pippens 22 points enough for the Bulls to win 55 games and make the second round in 1994, but Jordan’s 37ppg in 1987 got him swept in the 1st round?

It’s obvious Pippen fosters superior teams than Jordan

[3ball]

Because Pippen also fosters GOAT teamwork, chemistry, defense, and playmaking. Why was Pippens 22 points enough for the Bulls to win 55 games and make the second round in 1994, but Jordan’s 37ppg in 1987 got him swept in the 1st round?

It’s obvious Pippen fosters superior teams than Jordan

Who wins with 9 on 40%

You expect jordan to win with that and you think that's the best sidekick for Jordan?

Go to bed son... Past your bed time

[Mamba4Life]

Who wins with 9 on 40%

You expect jordan to win with that and you think that's the best sidekick for Jordan?

Go to bed son... Past your bed time

LeBron made the Finals in 2018 with Love’s 13ppg on 37%

He made the Finals in 2007 with Hughes 11ppg on 40%

He made the Finals in 2013 with Wade’s 13ppg on 43% (Wade’s playoff stats in the first 3 rounds)


That’s far worse help than Pippen ever provided once you factor in defense


So why does LeBron make the Finals with help that Jordan loses in the 1st round with?

[Roundball_Rock]

People love to imagine mythical scenarios with Jordan’s career without Pippen but the truth is we have 5 seasons of proof and he either got swept in the first round while winning 30 games, or missed the playoffs :lol

Exactly. :lol

Other classics:

*In the KAJ thread we were told MJ would win 50+ and make the ECF at minimum with any random team. When asked--repeatedtly--what evidence there was from his career to support that the answer was...silence and more silence.
*MJ is often credited with rings in 94' and even 95'.
*Sometimes MJ is credited with 9-10 straight rings.

The list goes on but these are the most common fictions. We always get some unique ones, like "2000 Jordan".

MJ was a bald Dominique before and after Pippen and these guys can't handle that, even though they comically ask what every other legend did without their best teammate (LeBron without Wade, Kareem without Magic, etc.).

[LAmbruh]

People love to imagine mythical scenarios with Jordan’s career without Pippen but the truth is we have 5 seasons of proof and he either got swept in the first round while winning 30 games, or missed the playoffs :lol

Exactly :lol

[LeCroix]

So you are admitting Pippen needed MJ? :lebronamazed:

MJ couldn't just "will his way" to chips with Woolridge, Oakley, Hamilton, or Stackhouse?

He had a 10 game sample size in 85 86 87

It does NOT END WELL

1-9

[LeCroix]

LeBron made the Finals in 2018 with Love’s 13ppg on 37%

He made the Finals in 2007 with Hughes 11ppg on 40%

He made the Finals in 2013 with Wade’s 13ppg on 43% (Wade’s playoff stats in the first 3 rounds)


That’s far worse help than Pippen ever provided once you factor in defense


So why does LeBron make the Finals with help that Jordan loses in the 1st round with?

I think this is the winner of the decade post

[3ball]

LeBron made the Finals in 2018 with Love’s 13ppg on 37%

He made the Finals in 2007 with Hughes 11ppg on 40%

He made the Finals in 2013 with Wade’s 13ppg on 43% (Wade’s playoff stats in the first 3 rounds)


That’s far worse help than Pippen ever provided once you factor in defense


So why does LeBron make the Finals with help that Jordan loses in the 1st round with?

The problem with your point is that Jordan was facing the league champ in his own conference - lebron didn't face that comp until the Finals, where he couldn't win with the stats you posted - he needed prime Pippen stats (or better) from his sidekick to win each Finals/a team of the Bad Boys' caliber (20/5/5 on 48% for Wade in 13' Finals)

[Mamba4Life]

The problem with your point is that Jordan was facing the league champ in his own conference - lebron didn't face that comp until the Finals, where he couldn't win with the stats you posted - he needed prime Pippen stats (or better) from his sidekick to win each Finals/a team of the Bad Boys' caliber (20/5/5 on 48% for Wade in 13' Finals)

Why did Jordan’s 37ppg in 1987 yield only 40 wins while LeBrons 27ppg yielded 50 wins in 2007? Both players didn’t have an all star teammate so supporting cast isn’t an excuse.

If Jordan was able to employ a more optimal brand of basketball with better teamwork maybe he could’ve got a higher seed instead of losing in the 1st round.

[86Celtics]

MJ was a bald Dominique before and after Pippen and these guys can't handle that, even though they comically ask what every other legend did without their best teammate (LeBron without Wade, Kareem without Magic, etc.).

And this train of thought leads where exactly? Jordan didn't win anything without Pippen and neither did Jabbar without Magic or Robertson. What's the point of perpetuating a flawed argument?

The only that you've achieved is to show that you're no better than them.

[Roundball_Rock]

Why did Jordan’s 37ppg in 1987 yield only 40 wins while LeBrons 27ppg yielded 50 wins in 2007? Both players didn’t have an all star teammate so supporting cast isn’t an excuse.

If Jordan was able to employ a more optimal brand of basketball with better teamwork maybe he could’ve got a higher seed instead of losing in the 1st round.

That is what always gets ignored about those years. A team isn't going to win when one player is taking every shot and the rest of the team is eating popcorn watching a one man show.



And this train of thought leads where exactly? Jordan didn't win anything without Pippen and neither did Jabbar without Magic or Robertson. What's the point of perpetuating a flawed argument?

Demonstrating absurdity by showing them how dumb it looks when applied to their own hero (he comes off the worst of any top 10 all-time player in that regard).

One note: you had to use two players for Kareem. We see it with LeBron too now "Wade or Irving." There was a post days ago asking what KAJ did with 6-7 players. The answer is nothing because he had those guys his entire career. When you get to a zillion players it becomes ridiculous.

[Cyrus334]

Why did Jordan’s 37ppg in 1987 yield only 40 wins while LeBrons 27ppg yielded 50 wins in 2007? Both players didn’t have an all star teammate so supporting cast isn’t an excuse.

If Jordan was able to employ a more optimal brand of basketball with better teamwork maybe he could’ve got a higher seed instead of losing in the 1st round.

Your right, but you also have to understand the team construction of the 1987 Bulls and the 2007 Cavs. The Bulls were a complete mess before Phil Jackson took over and basically just let MJ do whatever the hell he wanted. He put up big numbers but it didn't lead to anything. Lebron's teams on the other hand had no star power and were rather untalented but they were full of gritty defenders who hustled on every play and that's why they were always ranked near the top in defensive rating. Their problem was that outside of Lebron.

So yes, your right. Jordan needed to be taught by Phil Jackson to trust his team mates more and play a more winning style of basketball. But I don't think anyone sensible argues that MJ learned that on his own.

[Roundball_Rock]

Your right, but you also have to understand the team construction of the 1987 Bulls and the 2007 Cavs. The Bulls were a complete mess before Phil Jackson took over and basically just let MJ do whatever the hell he wanted. He put up big numbers but it didn't lead to anything. Lebron's teams on the other hand had no star power and were rather untalented but they were full of gritty defenders who hustled on every play and that's why they were always ranked near the top in defensive rating. Their problem was that outside of Lebron.

So yes, your right. Jordan needed to be taught by Phil Jackson to trust his team mates more and play a more winning style of basketball. But I don't think anyone sensible argues that MJ learned that on his own.

Great points. I would note that Collins tried (unsuccessfully) to get MJ to play team ball but yes his previous coaches gave him a blank check.


Lebron's teams on the other hand had no star power and were rather untalented but they were full of gritty defenders who hustled on every play and that's why they were always ranked near the top in defensive rating.

We are told MJ was this awesome leader who willed his teams to dominance. Why couldn't MJ get his teammates to play defense before Pippen, Grant showed up?

[Axe]

Exactly. :lol

Other classics:

*In the KAJ thread we were told MJ would win 50+ and make the ECF at minimum with any random team. When asked--repeatedtly--what evidence there was from his career to support that the answer was...silence and more silence.
*MJ is often credited with rings in 94' and even 95'.
*Sometimes MJ is credited with 9-10 straight rings.

The list goes on but these are the most common fictions. We always get some unique ones, like "2000 Jordan".

MJ was a bald Dominique before and after Pippen and these guys can't handle that, even though they comically ask what every other legend did without their best teammate (LeBron without Wade, Kareem without Magic, etc.).
Care to tell us what was the first team pippen played for in the league way back in 1987 again?

[Soundwave]

Jordan played 2 seasons without Pippen basically unless you're counting the Wizards years on horrible teams. He's basically injured for all of 85-86 or not allowed to play more than 18 minutes until like the very end of the season.

You can't seriously base anything on that.

[Mamba4Life]

Jordan played 2 seasons without Pippen basically unless you're counting the Wizards years on horrible teams. He's basically injured for all of 85-86 or not allowed to play more than 18 minutes until like the very end of the season.

You can't seriously base anything on that.


So we’re not counting Jordan’s 14th and 15th seasons? Even though LeBron was All-NBA first team and made the Finals in his 14th and 15th seasons?

[Roundball_Rock]

So we’re not counting Jordan’s 14th and 15th seasons? Even though LeBron was All-NBA first team and made the Finals in his 14th and 15th seasons?

You know the MJ gospel: the Washington years never happened.


You can't seriously base anything on that.

So we have to base everything on KAJ on what he did without Magic or Oscar (AKA remove 70% of his career) or LeBron without Wade and Irving but we can't look at MJ without Pippen (10 years ago the big shtick was asking what Kobe did without Shaq)? This is the consistent standard MJ fans apply to every other legend.

[Soundwave]

So we’re not counting Jordan’s 14th and 15th seasons? Even though LeBron was All-NBA first team and made the Finals in his 14th and 15th seasons?

He's 39 and 40 years old, lol, exactly what conclusion are you going to draw from that.

Everyone knows this whole narrative is bull sh*t even Roundball Rock knows its garbage deep down.

The Bulls were the lucky ones to have Jordan, not the other way around, this is like Billy Bob Thornton thinking Angelina Jolie was lucky to have dated his fugly ass. If the Bulls couldn't build a team around MJ he simply would've asked for a trade out eventually and won 6-7 titles somewhere else.

No, Scottie Pippen was not some magical wizard who was the only player that Michael Jordan could've possibly won with.

Every great player has a minimum 2-4 other very good players to play with, acting as if Jordan is the only one is bull shit. What did LeBron win with Mo Williams? How many titles did Kareem win in the 70s once Oscar declined?

LeBron was sitting at home last year at age 35 watching the playoffs on TV, Jordan was winning his 6th NBA championship by hitting the series clinching shot at that age.

[aceman]

Between 1991 & 98 bulls won 80% of games
Without Pippen percentage was 71%
69% without Jordan.
The pair had similar impact on team.

[Roundball_Rock]

Roundball Rock knows its garbage deep down.

The main relevance I see is the principle. There is a disturbing tendency to re-write history with MJ. Frankly I don't see it with any other historical figure. So 2, sometimes 3 (95'), years of his career are just erased. You also have the cadre of people who give him credit for fictional rings (often 94', 95', sometimes you hear 99', 00', 90' too). In the KAJ/MJ thread one guy kept pushing to give MJ some fictional wins in 86' if he did not have a minutes restriction.

Historical figures have to be judged by their entire record. Put it in context but don't revise history. LBJ (the president) would be a GOAT candidate if we looked only at everyone's best but we can't just erase the bad part of his record.

The only other relevance I see is vis-a-vis KAJ. KAJ was a top 5 MVP candidate and all-NBA first team player at 38. MJ had the benefit of five years off by that point (plus a 6th season where he played only 17 games). If MJ is the GOAT why couldn't he match what KAJ did? So it is relevant as a data point for KAJ>MJ.


If the Bulls couldn't build a team around MJ he simply would've asked for a trade out eventually and won 6-7 titles somewhere else.

See what I mean? There is no basis for that. The more likely scenario is he would have had a career similar to Hakeem's as far as team success went. Probably 1-2 rings (if Hakeem won 1 with Thorpe and Ewing and Drexler were in the finals with Starks and Porter, MJ could have done it with even just Grant, who is comparable to these players), maybe a few other deep runs but also a lot of 45-50 win seasons that didn't go far.


What did LeBron win with Mo Williams? How many titles did Kareem win in the 70s once Oscar declined?

The distinction is they came close without those players; MJ never did. KAJ made 2 WCF without Magic or Oscar, LeBron was in the finals and a second ECF without any of Wade, Irving, Bosh, Davis, Love etc. MJ is the only top 10 player who did nothing without his best teammate.

In MJ's defense, his time without Pippen all happened to be his earliest and oldest years. He didn't have a shot in his prime without Pippen. That said, it is relevant because MJ's fans keep going around saying "Kareem sucks, what did he do without Magic?" or "LeBron had Wade!" when their own guy has this glaring vulnerability by the same (dumb) metric.

[Shooter]

OP got them boys shook

Pippen clearly had the better career without Jordan than Jordan did without him

That fact alone ruins Jordan's legacy and takes him out of the GOAT argument

[TheGoatest]

It's not like we only have 1 random season where they each played without the other to use as an indication.
We have 5 SEASONS where jordon played without The Great Scott Pippen and 6 SEASONS where The Great Scott Pippen played without jordon worth of data. And all of it points in one direction, where one of the two clearly did better without the other, as opposed to vice versa.

[Baller789]

OP got them boys shook

Pippen clearly had the better career without Jordan than Jordan did without him

That fact alone ruins Jordan's legacy and takes him out of the GOAT argument


It's not like we only have 1 random season where they each played without the other to use as an indication.
We have 5 SEASONS where jordon played without The Great Scott Pippen and 6 SEASONS where The Great Scott Pippen played without jordon worth of data. And all of it points in one direction, where one of the two clearly did better without the other, as opposed to vice versa.

And this thread's IQ suddenly drops to 0 with the meddling of this ONE dimwit. :roll:

[Shooter]

It's not like we only have 1 random season where they each played without the other to use as an indication.
We have 5 SEASONS where jordon played without The Great Scott Pippen and 6 SEASONS where The Great Scott Pippen played without jordon worth of data. And all of it points in one direction, where one of the two clearly did better without the other, as opposed to vice versa.

And Bingo was his name-o

[kawhileonard2]

Pippen lost in round 1 with Hakeem and Barkley which never happened with Jordan. Pippen lost in round 1 for 3 straight years in Portland after joining a stacked team. Hell Lebron missed the playoffs with a stacked team in Westbrook (league mvp), Anthony Davis (PER leader), Melo (scoring champion), Dwight Howard (3x DPOY and who beat Lebron without HCA)

[Shooter]

Pippen lost in round 1 with Hakeem and Barkley which never happened with Jordan. Pippen lost in round 1 for 3 straight years in Portland after joining a stacked team. Hell Lebron missed the playoffs with a stacked team in Westbrook (league mvp), Anthony Davis (PER leader), Melo (scoring champion), Dwight Howard (3x DPOY and who beat Lebron without HCA)

Pippen did more in one year without MJ (1994) than MJ did in his FIVE YEARS without Pippen.

Get wrekt.

[kawhileonard2]

Pippen did more in one year without MJ (1994) than MJ did in his FIVE YEARS without Pippen.

Get wrekt.

Oh

MJ = 6 Titles, 6 finals MVP's, 5 League MVP's = 17 Points total
Russell = 11 Titles, 0 finals MVP's, 5 League MVP's = 16 Points Total
Kareem = 6 Titles, 2 finals MVP's, 6 League MVP's = 14 Points Total
Lebron = 4 Titles, 4 finals MVP's, 4 League MVP's = 12 Points Total
Magic = 5 Titles, 3 finals MVP's, 3 League MVP's = 11 Points Total
Duncan = 4 Titles, 3 finals MVP's, 2 League MVP's = 9 Points Total
Kobe = 5 Titles, 2 finals MVP's, 1 League MVP's = 8 Points Total
Shaq = 4 Titles, 3 finals MVP's, 1 League MVP's = 8 Points Total
Bird = 3 Titles, 2 finals MVP's, 3 League MVP's = 8 Points Total
Wilt = 2 Titles, 1 finals MVP's, 4 League MVP's = 7 Points Total
Hakeem = 2 Titles, 2 finals MVP's, 1 League MVP's = 5 Points Total
Moses Malone = 1 Titles, 1 finals MVP's, 3 League MVP's = 5 Points Total
Kawhi = 2 Titles, 2 finals MVP's = 4 Points Total