MJ and Shaq wouldn’t be able to coexist

[Vino24]

Their games would mesh beautifully but MJ has a requirement to score 10-15ppg more than the next best player on the team. At times phill would want MJ feeding Shaq. MJ’s ego is huge. Not going to happen.

[Turbo Slayer]

Yeah man. A superior version of Kobe (Jordan) wouldnt be able to mesh/coexist with Shaq. :facepalm

They would mesh just fine as long egos don't get in the way. Hell Kobe had a big ego and the duo still managed to 3 peat and go to multiple Finals.

[DoctorP]

added to ignore list. congrats.

[Roundball_Rock]

If Shaq/Kobe and Shaq/Penny didn't work why do we think Shaq as the #2 option to MJ would work? Shaq clashed with the other superstars he played with.

MJ never scored less than 28 PPG in a full season. When he came back from baseball he took 28 shots his first game. Why would we think MJ would be willing to become a 25 PPG guy instead of 30 PPG to share the ball with Shaq?

[ImKobe]

I could see them not being a great fit personality-wise. Shaq/Kobe were cool before Kobe became a superstar, plus I don't see how MJ would have reacted any differently to Shaq being lazy and rehabbing "on company time". At best they last the same amount of time if a 18 y.o MJ joined prime Shaq, I don't think it plays out any differently.

[Turbo Slayer]

added to ignore list. congrats.Who me? Are you directing this to me? Sorry for the misunderstanding. :cheers:

[SouBeachTalents]

Yeah man. A superior version of Kobe (Jordan) wouldnt be able to mesh/coexist with Shaq. :facepalm

They would mesh just fine as long egos don't get in the way. Hell Kobe had a big ego and the duo still managed to 3 peat and go to multiple Finals.
He never said they wouldn't be successful, he said they wouldn't be able to coexist, which is a valid argument. I think they'd potentially clash over many issues; getting less touches and shots per game than they'd want, establishing which one of them is the alpha/leader of the team, and probably most of all Shaq's laziness and coming back from the offseason out of shape.

Success wasn't enough to keep Shaq & Kobe from completely falling apart, it might not be enough to keep those two from having the same fate

[Rysio]

Playing with shaq it would mean the offense would be ran through him so yea I don't think Jordan could handle that.

[Overdrive]

If Shaq/Kobe and Shaq/Penny didn't work why do we think Shaq as the #2 option to MJ would work? Shaq clashed with the other superstars he played with.

MJ never scored less than 28 PPG in a full season. When he came back from baseball he took 28 shots his first game. Why would we think MJ would be willing to become a 25 PPG guy instead of 30 PPG to share the ball with Shaq?

In which world is a 3peat "not working"?

[Roundball_Rock]

In which world is a 3peat "not working"?

:coleman:

A world where they broke up after 3 instead of becoming their era's Jordan/Pippen.

[DoctorP]

Who me? Are you directing this to me? Sorry for the misunderstanding. :cheers:

no not you. OP

[tpols]

i seen in other thread people saying 8 titles lmao.

Shaq alone would have nowhere near the stamina for any type of run like that. Even MJ never proved that he could do that. (lost in '95)

Thats not even mentioning the ego stuff. Neither of these cats are giving up the glory for long, these arent larry bird tim duncan types.

[Turbo Slayer]

He never said they wouldn't be successful, he said they wouldn't be able to coexist, which is a valid argument. I think they'd potentially clash over many issues; getting less touches and shots per game than they'd want, establishing which one of them is the alpha/leader of the team, and probably most of all Shaq's laziness and coming back from the offseason out of shape.

Success wasn't enough to keep Shaq & Kobe from completely falling apart, it might not be enough to keep those two from having the same fate I totally get you. I'm reasonable. Of course they would be successful because having Jordan is a improvement from having Kobe. So you are basically have the superior version of Kobe (Jordan).

There would be definitely be problems with personalities like you mentioned. Michael Jordan is generally a competitive person and Shaq is the opposite of it. Shaq had problems with weight and laziness and injuries later on in his career.

[tpols]

He never said they wouldn't be successful, he said they wouldn't be able to coexist, which is a valid argument. I think they'd potentially clash over many issues; getting less touches and shots per game than they'd want, establishing which one of them is the alpha/leader of the team, and probably most of all Shaq's laziness and coming back from the offseason out of shape.

Success wasn't enough to keep Shaq & Kobe from completely falling apart, it might not be enough to keep those two from having the same fate

thats actually a really good point.

Kobe was a stickler for "practice" but MJ was even moreso. Much more flagrant with it too. Shaq's attitude would drive him NUTS. lol...

[Overdrive]

:coleman:

A world where they broke up after 3 instead of becoming their era's Jordan/Pippen.

They wouldn't anyway. Shaq significally declined from peak form by 2004. Kobe wasn't good enough by then to win as a 1st option. They worked and the 2001 wcsf is a testament that you can give both enough touches. So Jordan and Shaq could be a 30ppg each duo if they worked it out. Doubtful they do, but they could.

[ImKobe]

They wouldn't anyway. Shaq significally declined from peak form by 2004. Kobe wasn't good enough by then to win as a 1st option. They worked and the 2001 wcsf is a testament that you can give both enough touches. So Jordan and Shaq could be a 30ppg each duo if they worked it out. Doubtful they do, but they could.

Kobe wasn't the issue, the team around them just got worse over the years. That 2003 roster was a joke. They had no shooters around them and the washed up GP/Malone signings didn't help either. Shaq got bullied trying to defend the P&R.

[Roundball_Rock]

They wouldn't anyway. Shaq significally declined from peak form by 2004. Kobe wasn't good enough by then to win as a 1st option. They worked and the 2001 wcsf is a testament that you can give both enough touches. So Jordan and Shaq could be a 30ppg each duo if they worked it out. Doubtful they do, but they could.

Shaq won with Wade. You are saying Wade>Kobe? Kobe was considered the best player in the league at the time.

You can't use 5-6 game series. A lot of things go into small sample sizes like that. Do you really think MJ and Shaq could both score 30 over the course of a full season? That would mean MJ ceding touches to Shaq...MJ was on the greatest team ever (Dream Team) and took far more shots than anyone else.

[iamgine]

I don't see why they wouldn't coexist. Mike was hard on teammates but he don't mess with the ones who stand up for themselves. Shaq would definitely gave Mike a beating or two.

As long as Shaq perform on the court, why would he care? The only thing I can see is with Shaq's free throw.

[LAL]

I don't see why they wouldn't coexist. Mike was hard on teammates but he don't mess with the ones who stand up for themselves. Shaq would definitely gave Mike a beating or two.

As long as Shaq perform on the court, why would he care? The only thing I can see is with Shaq's free throw.
I don't know.. shaq's ego and work ethic? Phil Jackson who' was always on Shaq's side?

[LostCause]

I don't see why they wouldn't coexist. Mike was hard on teammates but he don't mess with the ones who stand up for themselves. Shaq would definitely gave Mike a beating or two.

As long as Shaq perform on the court, why would he care? The only thing I can see is with Shaq's free throw.

This, as well as his conditioning

That said it depends on where they are in their careers. Mike would probably recognize sooner than Kobe did just how dominant Shaq was. He also went to bat for his teammates on numerous occasions (Paxson, Pippen etc). So I doubt he’d run Shaq out of town if they’re winning. Keep in mind Kobe and Shaqs feud was made even worse with the Rape allegation and Kobe subsequently snitching on Shaq.

I do t see these 2 clashing so much until Shaqs conditioning becomes an issue. Jordan was intense in practice so I do t think he’d be satisfied with Shaq half assing it. Though he put up with Rodman’s antics so who’s to really say. Mainly depends on the “when” I suppose. Jordan was already firmly established by the time Shaq arrived in the NBA, so in that scenario the dynamic would be entirely different than it was for Kobe/Penny with Shaq.

[LAL]

This, as well as his conditioning

That said it depends on where they are in their careers. Mike would probably recognize sooner than Kobe did just how dominant Shaq was. He also went to bat for his teammates on numerous occasions (Paxson, Pippen etc). So I doubt he’d run Shaq out of town if they’re winning. Keep in mind Kobe and Shaqs feud was made even worse with the Rape allegation and Kobe subsequently snitching on Shaq.

I do t see these 2 clashing so much until Shaqs conditioning becomes an issue. Jordan was intense in practice so I do t think he’d be satisfied with Shaq half assing it. Though he put up with Rodman’s antics so who’s to really say. Mainly depends on the “when” I suppose. Jordan was already firmly established by the time Shaq arrived in the NBA, so in that scenario the dynamic would be entirely different than it was for Kobe/Penny with Shaq.

You make it seem like kobe was the only problem. Shaq's conditioning was already a problem after their first ring. Rape allegations was kobe's problem, not shaq's. He didn't "snitch" anything, he didn't think their conversation was going to be leaked and it wasn't a crime. He said shaq ****s bitches too. Shaq did worse things to kobe. He hated him because kobe was too intense and focused. Shaq couldn't co exist with anyone, to this day.

[LostCause]

You make it seem like kobe was the only problem. Shaq's conditioning was already a problem after their first ring. Rape allegations was kobe's problem, not shaq's. He didn't "snitch" anything, he didn't think their conversation was going to be leaked and it wasn't a crime. He said shaq ****s bitches too. Shaq did worse things to kobe. He hated him because kobe was too intense and focused. Shaq couldn't co exist with anyone, to this day.

The bolded is just fluff. Nobody said the rape allegation was Shaq's problem, but that led to Kobe subsequently snitching on Shaq. Call it how you want but fact is Kobe said some things that got out and obviously wasn't perceived well. Nobody said it was a crime either

Anyway, as I said, it depends on where in their careers they are when it occurs. If it's peak Jordan with peak Shaq (00s) then obviously they'd clash. Shaq was already slacking in his conditioning and established himself as the leader of the team before Kobe's rise to prominence. If Shaq is brought in as a rookie to MJ's team, the dynamic will be much different especially with Phil Jackson coaching. The only time we've seen Shaq join teams that were successful before he got there was after he declined greatly. He wasn't that disruptive by then so it remains to be seen how he'd handle joining Jordans Bulls as a rookie. If Shaq joins Jordan the same time he left Orlando I don't see that souring too quickly either tbh (Jordan will retire in 2 years anyway, though he might stay an extra year or 2 with Shaq there). They'd easily win the championship every year they're together

[JohnMax]

https://media1.tenor.com/images/5809cf4d61dc047ff129416fbfc13d66/tenor.gif?itemid=4763706

[JohnMax]

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[Gotterdammerung]

This, as well as his conditioning

That said it depends on where they are in their careers. Mike would probably recognize sooner than Kobe did just how dominant Shaq was. He also went to bat for his teammates on numerous occasions (Paxson, Pippen etc). So I doubt he’d run Shaq out of town if they’re winning. Keep in mind Kobe and Shaqs feud was made even worse with the Rape allegation and Kobe subsequently snitching on Shaq.

I do t see these 2 clashing so much until Shaqs conditioning becomes an issue. Jordan was intense in practice so I do t think he’d be satisfied with Shaq half assing it. Though he put up with Rodman’s antics so who’s to really say. Mainly depends on the “when” I suppose. Jordan was already firmly established by the time Shaq arrived in the NBA, so in that scenario the dynamic would be entirely different than it was for Kobe/Penny with Shaq.

Came in here to say this.

If Shaq was drafted on the Bulls in 1992, he would have a much different approach because by that point, Jordan was an established superstar, and a first ballot hall-of-famer, unlike the upstart 18 year old Kobe Bryant was in 1996.

I think Shaq would respect Jordan just enough to hustle his butt more, and prove himself to the standard bearer, and Jackson would already be on Jordan's side at that point. Once Shaq became a superstar in his own right, in a few years, Jordan would continue to be the game's closer, while averaging around 28 to 30 points a game as he adjusted more to Shaq.

There would be clashes or disagreement, but not like that of Bryant because he was out to prove himself.

[LAL]

The bolded is just fluff. Nobody said the rape allegation was Shaq's problem, but that led to Kobe subsequently snitching on Shaq. Call it how you want but fact is Kobe said some things that got out and obviously wasn't perceived well. Nobody said it was a crime either

Anyway, as I said, it depends on where in their careers they are when it occurs. If it's peak Jordan with peak Shaq (00s) then obviously they'd clash. Shaq was already slacking in his conditioning and established himself as the leader of the team before Kobe's rise to prominence. If Shaq is brought in as a rookie to MJ's team, the dynamic will be much different especially with Phil Jackson coaching. The only time we've seen Shaq join teams that were successful before he got there was after he declined greatly. He wasn't that disruptive by then so it remains to be seen how he'd handle joining Jordans Bulls as a rookie. If Shaq joins Jordan the same time he left Orlando I don't see that souring too quickly either tbh (Jordan will retire in 2 years anyway, though he might stay an extra year or 2 with Shaq there). They'd easily win the championship every year they're together

Let's just pretend MJ came straight out of high school, had to deal with a coach not giving him minutes, then dealing with a triangle offense, coaches and teammates telling you to hold back, feeding shaq, shaq's ego and work ethic, a coach that would always be on shaqs side etc. People have a different view of MJ and Lebron because they could stat pad and lose from the first minute.

[Roundball_Rock]

Possible but a big wild card is how the two mesh on the court. Shaq was the #1 pick and the only players as hyped as him out of college were Wilt, Kareem, and LeBron. He was a top 5 player by his second season (robbed of a scoring title). He is going to just accept playing the understudy role for several years? Especially after becoming "the guy" when MJ retired? Jordan's tactics on Bill Wennington won't work the same way on a #1 pick (ask Kwame Brown :oldlol: ).

People are focusing on Kobe but Shaq had issues with Penny too and that was part of why he left. So Shaq played with 2 superstar guards in his prime and had problems with both. Neither demanded the ball as much as MJ would.