Is Kyrie a Top 100 player ever?

[Mamba4Life]

He obviously isn't close to being a Top 20 ATG like Pippen or a Top 50 ATG like Rodman, but is he in the Top 100 all time?

[FultzNationRISE]

I personally have him somewhere around Luke Walton and Disagana Diop, in that 230-240 range. Tho I tend to value impact over stats.

[LeCroix]

He obviously isn't close to being a Top 20 ATG like Pippen or a Top 50 ATG like Rodman, but is he in the Top 100 all time?

Top 150 around Horrace Grant level maybe

[3ball]

.
yes because he's a much better Playoff and Finals performer than Pippen:



Playoffs

Kyrie 16-17'...... 25.5 ppg.. 46.0 fg.. 23.0 PER.. 0.181 ws/48
Pippen 96-98'... 17.6 ppg.. 40.8 fg.. 19.0 PER.. 0.169 ws/48
Pippen 91-93'... 20.3 ppg.. 47.8 fg.. 19.6 PER.. 0.148 ws/48


Kyrie is clearly a better Playoff and Finals performer than Pippen, so he's clearly top 75 and Pippen 100

[iamgine]

I'd rank Kyrie at the top 70-85 range.

[CTbasketball92]

I think he's got top 30-40 ever ability if he maximizes himself and to me he's already a better player than people like Paul Pierce and Ray Allen were. But, with all his injuries since 2014-2015, it's taken away a couple of all-nba selections and a couple of playoff runs. He's 28 now and looks better than ever in terms of scoring consistency, passing and defense. I think he just needs to be healthy for a few consecutive years. If he can play 65 games from now until 32 or 33 at around this level and get another chip then he can be a top 60 player ever, maybe top 50. If he keeps missing the playoffs/20 games every other year for the next four years then I think he'll end at up at like 95-100. So the answer is, not at the moment, but if he keeps up his pace and is only even healthy every other year, he'll collect two or three more all star teams, maybe one or two all-nba teams and still be top 100. But he can be more if he's healthy.

[Wally450]

.
yes because he's a much better Playoff and Finals performer than Pippen:



Playoffs

Kyrie 16-17'...... 25.5 ppg.. 46.0 fg.. 23.0 PER.. 0.181 ws/48
Pippen 96-98'... 17.6 ppg.. 40.8 fg.. 19.0 PER.. 0.169 ws/48
Pippen 91-93'... 20.3 ppg.. 47.8 fg.. 19.6 PER.. 0.148 ws/48


Kyrie is clearly a better Playoff and Finals performer than Pippen, so he's clearly top 75 and Pippen 100

Jordan would have no rings without Pippen.

[Smook A.]

He obviously isn't close to being a Top 20 ATG like Pippen or a Top 50 ATG like Rodman, but is he in the Top 100 all time?

First of all, Pippen isn't a top 20 ATG. More like top 30, and Rodman isn't a top 50 ATG.

To answer your question, yes I think Kyrie is a top 100 player ever.

[Roundball_Rock]

He is top 100. He has a chance to move up but he hasn't done much since leaving Cleveland other than get hurt all the time. He will have missed 2 of 3 playoff runs since leaving Cleveland due to injury and in that one run he did play in he was terrible (38% shooting). There is a reason we only hear about 2 years of his career on ISH.

[Mamba4Life]

.
yes because he's a much better Playoff and Finals performer than Pippen:



Playoffs

Kyrie 16-17'...... 25.5 ppg.. 46.0 fg.. 23.0 PER.. 0.181 ws/48
Pippen 96-98'... 17.6 ppg.. 40.8 fg.. 19.0 PER.. 0.169 ws/48
Pippen 91-93'... 20.3 ppg.. 47.8 fg.. 19.6 PER.. 0.148 ws/48


Kyrie is clearly a better Playoff and Finals performer than Pippen, so he's clearly top 75 and Pippen 100


Wait.. no one caught 3ball tryna sneak Kyrie over Pippen all time and say Pippen was a Top 100 player ever???


:roll:

[RRR3]

Depends on how you rank people.

[MrFonzworth]

Depends on how you rank people.

Breaking news

[Axe]

The same kyrie irving who shot the last 3-point shot in the 2016 finals

[John8204]

I don't have him, if he gets another ring but for me he's a fringe Hall of Famer

[Manny98]

In terms of pure skill - he's top 10 arguably top 5

Overall as a basketball player he's top 40

[3ba11]

I don't recall Lillard making any Finals or demolishing the league MVP Curry - when was Lillard ever the key that put teams over the top like Kyrie?

So what's Lillard's argument over Kyrie?

Kyrie is easily top 75 if Lillard is in there.

[FultzNationRISE]

I don't recall Lillard making any Finals or demolishing the league MVP Curry - when was Lillard ever the key that put teams over the top like Kyrie?

So what's Lillard's argument over Kyrie?

Kyrie is easily top 75 if Lillard is in there.


Lillard never had the luxury of being carried to the Finals like Kyrie did.


Irving owes everything to LeFatherFigure.

[3ba11]

Lillard never had the luxury of being carried to the Finals like Kyrie did.


Irving owes everything to LeFatherFigure.


Lebron never brought titles to anyone - he simply amassed enough talent to win (all-star game strategy), while Wade infact taught Lebron how to perform under pressure (WIN)... :applause:

So kudos to Wade - you should be kissing his ass for showing Lebron the way because otherwise Lebron would never have won and you wouldn't have anything to post about in your free time.. You'd have to find another sport to watch or something, so Wade should really be your favorite player after Lebron.. Father Wade

Ultimately, Lebron lost without Kyrie in 2015, so that proves Kyrie is a difference-maker - he was the equal-scoring partner and closer that Lebron has always needed to win on the Finals level.

[John8204]

I don't recall Lillard making any Finals or demolishing the league MVP Curry - when was Lillard ever the key that put teams over the top like Kyrie?

So what's Lillard's argument over Kyrie?

Kyrie is easily top 75 if Lillard is in there.


I don't have either in my top 75, I got Lillard high 80's. Dame's record and being a one team player is big for him, Kyrie failing in Brooklyn and Boston really damages his legacy in my eyes.

[3ba11]

I don't have either in my top 75, I got Lillard high 80's. Dame's record and being a one team player is big for him, Kyrie failing in Brooklyn and Boston really damages his legacy in my eyes.


The 2018 Celtics were the league juggernaut when Kyrie first got there and were clearly a title contender before he got hurt - then Gordon Hayward returned in 2019, which destroyed the team because Tatum/Brown took a 1-year drop across the board (PER, BPM, WS/48, VORP)... They recovered in 2020 and became stars, but Hayward's return stalled their progress for that 19' season, and therefore killed what Kyrie had going..

You forget that the 18' Celtics were expected to make the ECF with Kyrie in 2018 (#3 in preseason odds), yet they made it without him and went 7 games - this means that he would've put them over the top, especially based on the historical precedent of him putting the Cavs over the top in 2016 - it's better to go by the historical precedent of 2016 (that he's a difference-maker), rather than an unfounded, biased opinion that you have against his enigmatic brand.

So Kyrie was the difference-maker in 2016 and would've been in 2018, while also being the difference-maker in 2021 when the Nets were demolishing the great Giannis until Kyrie got hurt - again, the historical precedent of 2016 tells the story of what would've happened in 18' and 21' with a healthy Kyrie.

Otoh, Lillard has done exactly nothing.. he's never been a difference-maker or done jack shit and I think he got destroyed by Curry, while Kyrie dominated him in historic fashion and hit the Finals-winner in his eye.... NO COMPARISON... I think Kyrie is a little taller than Lillard with superior handle (a superior talent) and he's a pure shooter and scorer off-the-ball - that's why his team ceilings are so high and much better than Lillard.. Lillard dominates the ball at historic levels to get his points, while Kyrie can get his while the ball moves, aka higher team ceilngs.

[John8204]

The 2018 Celtics were the league juggernaut when Kyrie first got there and were clearly a title contender before he got hurt - then Gordon Hayward returned in 2019, which destroyed the team because Tatum/Brown took a 1-year drop across the board (PER, BPM, WS/48, VORP)... They recovered in 2020 and became stars, but Hayward's return stalled their progress for that 19' season, and therefore killed what Kyrie had going..

You forget that the 18' Celtics were expected to make the ECF with Kyrie in 2018 (#3 in preseason odds), yet they made it without him and went 7 games - this means that he would've put them over the top, especially based on the historical precedent of him putting the Cavs over the top in 2016 - it's better to go by the historical precedent of 2016 (that he's a difference-maker), rather than an unfounded, biased opinion that you have against his enigmatic brand.

So Kyrie was the difference-maker in 2016 and would've been in 2018, while also being the difference-maker in 2021 when the Nets were demolishing the great Giannis until Kyrie got hurt - again, the historical precedent of 2016 tells the story of what would've happened in 18' and 21' with a healthy Kyrie.

Otoh, Lillard has done exactly nothing.. he's never been a difference-maker or done jack shit and I think he got destroyed by Curry, while Kyrie dominated him in historic fashion and hit the Finals-winner in his eye.... NO COMPARISON... I think Kyrie is a little taller than Lillard with superior handle (a superior talent) and he's a pure shooter and scorer off-the-ball - that's why his team ceilings are so high and much better than Lillard.. Lillard dominates the ball at historic levels to get his points, while Kyrie can get his while the ball moves, aka higher team ceilngs.

Yes the Celtics should have made a finals appearance, but it seems to me that everyone who played with Kyrie (Smart, Hayward, Horford, Tatum, and Brown) all got better when Kyrie left. I also think they were a better team with Thomas but that's just my opinion. It's also weird to me that you've got 1 chip Kyrie in the top 100 but 3 chip Klay isn't.

[SouBeachTalents]

Otoh, Lillard has done exactly nothing.. he's never been a difference-maker or done jack shit and I think he got destroyed by Curry, while Kyrie dominated him in historic fashion and hit the Finals-winner in his eye.... NO COMPARISON... I think Kyrie is a little taller than Lillard with superior handle (a superior talent) and he's a pure shooter and scorer off-the-ball - that's why his team ceilings are so high and much better than Lillard.. Lillard dominates the ball at historic levels to get his points, while Kyrie can get his while the ball moves, aka higher team ceilngs.
Kyrie wouldn't have won SHIT with the Blazers :oldlol: Just like he didn't pre LeBron or with Boston. There's a 0% chance he beats the Warriors with CJ McCollum instead of LeBron.

[iamgine]

Kyrie is around Joe Dumars level

[John8204]

Kyrie is around Joe Dumars level

I agree that's fair, I got him with Joe Dumars, Ralph Sampson, Sam Jones, and Billy Cunningham he's at that level in my eyes

[3ba11]

Kyrie wouldn't have won SHIT with the Blazers :oldlol: Just like he didn't pre LeBron or with Boston. There's a 0% chance he beats the Warriors with CJ McCollum instead of LeBron.


If healthy, Kyrie would've won with the 15' Cavs, 18' Celtics and 21' Nets (edit: Celitcs would've made Finals in 18')

^^^ That sounds like Lebron winning with a bunch of different franchises except Kyrie did it more organically.. Infact, he succeeded in doing what good 1st options are supposed to do - he improved his team each year and made them just attractive enough for Lebron to come back in 2015.. Otoh, we saw that Pippen didn't even need 18 months to destroy a 3-peat dynasty to lottery before MJ returned in 95'.. (those bulls were on pace for 43 wins and 8 seed, but likely falter down the stretch and win 42 or less, aka lottery)

Ultimately, Lebron didn't bring anyone titles - he simply amassed enough talent to win (all-star team strategy) - Wade infact taught Lebron how to perform under pressure (win), so other players have always made Lebron's teams good, like when Mo Williams added 21 wins in 09' by basically being the equivalent of prime Klay on offense.

[SouBeachTalents]

If healthy, Kyrie would've won with the 15' Cavs, 18' Celtics and 21' Nets (edit: Celitcs would've made Finals in 18')

^^^ That sounds like Lebron winning with a bunch of different franchises except Kyrie did it more organically.. Infact, he succeeded in doing what good 1st options are supposed to do - he improved his team each year and made them just attractive enough for Lebron to come back in 2015.. Otoh, we saw that Pippen didn't even need 18 months to destroy a 3-peat dynasty to lottery before MJ returned in 95'.. (those bulls were on pace for 43 wins and 8 seed, but likely falter down the stretch and win 42 or less, aka lottery)

Ultimately, Lebron didn't bring anyone titles - he simply amassed enough talent to win (all-star team strategy) - Wade infact taught Lebron how to perform under pressure (win), so other players have always made Lebron's teams good, like when Mo Williams added 21 wins in 09' by basically being the equivalent of prime Klay on offense.
At least you're not delusional enough to argue Kyrie wins anything in Dame's place :applause:

[3ba11]

At least you're not delusional enough to argue Kyrie wins anything in Dame's place :applause:


Again, there's no argument for Lillard over Kyrie for top 75 and no one has even tried to make one itt

Here's how dumb the media is - if Lillard hadn't hit that walk-off against OKC..... he isn't in the top 75..... PERIOD... that's how shallow the media is...

And if aliens came down here and started watching the media's coverage, they would think Kyrie was a massive cancer and loser instead of the difference-maker that grants the highest of team ceilings on virtually every team he goes to..

Heck, he was good enough to be the best example of a teammate NOT cratering alongside Lebron - not many guys remained dominant alongside Lebron - that's hard to do because you must have elite off-ball/pure off-the cuff scorer, which Lillard isn't but Kyrie is.. Let's just go through the categories - handle, overall jumpshooting including off-ball, and at-rim finishing are all Kyrie advantages.

[FromDowntown]

yes, smole peak but strong peak. list up all dudes with a better finals showing, will be less than 50 listed

[SouBeachTalents]

yes, smole peak but strong peak. list up all dudes with a better finals showing, will be less than 50 listed
I'd honestly be interested to see ISH do a ranking of the 50 greatest Finals performances, limit one per player. I'm sure Kyrie would make it, but I'd be very curious to see how high his Finals would get.

[TheGoatest]

Lillard:

1 x All-NBA 1st team
4 x All-NBA 2nd team
1 x All-NBA 3rd team

Kyrie:

1 x All-NBA 2nd team
2 x All-NBA 3rd team

And Kyrie has been in the league for a season more than Lillard. The only "argument" Kyrie has over Lillard is the same "argument" Rip Hamilton has over him.

[Manny98]

Lillard:

1 x All-NBA 1st team
4 x All-NBA 2nd team
1 x All-NBA 3rd team

Kyrie:

1 x All-NBA 2nd team
2 x All-NBA 3rd team

And Kyrie has been in the league for a season more than Lillard. The only "argument" Kyrie has over Lillard is the same "argument" Rip Hamilton has over him.

Kyrie is way better in the playoffs, no one cares about regular season participation trophies

Even in the regular season I am still taking Kyrie


https://youtu.be/qfmd3eY7nW0