James harden or steph curry?

[Bronbron23]

first take had this debate today on whos better. 2 of the 3 said harden and i couldn't disagree more. They used his stats as the main argument. Harden has more points, assists and rebounds. This is a dumb argument. Harden has to monopolize the ball like no other to put up these crazy stat lines where curry can put up comparable numbers while not monopolizing the ball at all. This allows for better team movement which is a better recipe for success.

This an aspect of basketball that i swear most of the people on this forum dont understand. Putting up 25/5/5 while not monopolizing the ball is better than putting up 30/8/8 in a system where you monopolize the ball. This shouldn't even be a debate.

[Lebron23]

Harden with durant or klay are potential nba dynasty.

[Monta Ellis MVP]

first take had this debate today on whos better. 2 of the 3 said harden and i couldn't disagree more. They used his stats as the main argument. Harden has more points, assists and rebounds. This is a dumb argument. Harden has to monopolize the ball like no other to put up these crazy stat lines where curry can put up comparable numbers while not monopolizing the ball at all. This allows for better team movement which is a better recipe for success.

This an aspect of basketball that i swear most of the people on this forum dont understand. Putting up 25/5/5 while not monopolizing the ball is better than putting up 30/8/8 in a system where you monopolize the ball. This shouldn't even be a debate.

I agree that 25/5/5 with less dribbling is better. That is why I think Reggie Miller was such a great player. He was able to play away from the basketball and create opportunities for other players without even touching the ball. He also didn’t need a lot of shots to produce points because he is so efficient. I think Harden has better stats but Curry helps his team win more.

[Turbo Slayer]

Curry. He is way more of a ceiling raiser than Harden.

[Bronbron23]

Harden with durant or klay are potential nba dynasty.

Not sure about that. Kd couldn't form a dynasty with westbrook and im not sure harden would be a much better fit than him.

As far as klay i think hed be miserable with harden. Klay likes playing the right way with team movement.

[Bronbron23]

I agree that 25/5/5 with less dribbling is better. That is why I think Reggie Miller was such a great player. He was able to play away from the basketball and create opportunities for other players without even touching the ball. He also didn’t need a lot of shots to produce points because he is so efficient. I think Harden has better stats but Curry helps his team win more.

Exactly

[Turbo Slayer]

Not sure about that. Kd couldn't form a dynasty with westbrook and im not sure harden would be a much better fit than him.

As far as klay i think hed be miserable with harden. Klay likes playing the right way with team movement. Actually any on ball creator works especially well with shooters around him. Shooters around Harden would be a great fit since Harden can pass and create by himself at the same time.

[Monta Ellis MVP]

Actually any on ball creator works especially well with shooters around him. Shooters around Harden would be a great fit since Harden can pass and create by himself at the same time.

It doesn’t give you a diverse enough offense to win at the highest levels. There is only so many ISO’s and drive and kick plays you can do in a game.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

When the chips were down, last years playoffs told me all I needed to know. Curry was the guy hitting big shots. Not Harden.

That's not even taking into account Steph's impact. Historic offensive gravity.

[Stephonit]

That this is even a topic shows there are many people who need to have their heads examined.

Media of course muddying the waters with inanities. They could be asking more plausible questions like if Curry could overtake Jordan or if he's already better than Magic but we get a steady diet of this palaver instead. They're really doing their best trying to spike Curry. Unsurprising when you know the real stakes. Their entire industry is based on Jordan worship.

[tpols]

last i checked the rockets were the worst passing team in the league.

his style is a gimmick... Chef played like that under mark jackson, and lost.

Once he transitioned to more off ball approach they became a dynasty team.

[Turbo Slayer]

It doesn’t give you a diverse enough offense to win at the highest levels. There is only so many ISO’s and drive and kick plays you can do in a game.

**** you. The 2018 Rockets finished with a better record than stacked Golden State in a good conference. That's impressive. His style earned him the MVP too. The Rockets nearly beat GSW when CP3 went down and almost went to the Finals too.

Harden deserves respect despite his flopping and egregious need for the refs. It's that simple. Curry is a better player than Harden. Ill stand by that. But that doesnt mean that Harden doesnt deserve respect b/c quite honestly he does.

[Monta Ellis MVP]

**** you. The 2018 Rockets finished with a better record than Golden State in a good conference. That's impressive. His style earned him the MVP too. The Rockets nearly beat GSW when CP3 went down and almost went to the Finals too.

Harden deserves respect despite his flopping and egregious need for the refs. It's that simple. Curry is a better player than Harden. Ill stand by that. But that doesnt mean that Harden doesnt respect b/c quite honestly he does.

I’m going to ask you to stop bullying please. It is 2020 and that type of behavior is not acceptable. If you look at the most successful teams in the past era they have a theme of good team ball movement. Stagnant, low team assist offenses that focus on iso and drive and kick opportunities do not win many championships. It is an inferior style of basketball.

[Turbo Slayer]

I’m going to ask you to stop bullying please. It is 2020 and that type of behavior is not acceptable. If you look at the most successful teams in the past era they have a theme of good team ball movement. Stagnant, low team assist offenses that focus on iso and drive and kick opportunities do not win many championships. It is an inferior style of basketball.

Bro I swear... ****ing idiots around here. The 2018 Houston Rockets was ranked 6th ALLTIME in ORtg in the 3 point era. (Click on the ORtg header to make it increase.)

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tsl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&type=advanced&year_min=1980&lg_id=NBA&c1stat=off_rtg&c1comp=gt&c2stat=pts&c2comp=gt&order_by=wins

Only the 2016-17 GSW, 1986-87 LAL, 1991-92 CHI, 1987-88 BOS, and the 1995-96 CHI finished with better ORtg. Only a ****ing idiot would say that Harden's style is not compatible.

[Turbo Slayer]

last i checked the rockets were the worst passing team in the league.

his style is a gimmick... Chef played like that under mark jackson, and lost.

Once he transitioned to more off ball approach they became a dynasty team. **** you ttrolls.

[Bronbron23]

Actually any on ball creator works especially well with shooters around him. Shooters around Harden would be a great fit since Harden can pass and create by himself at the same time.

Not saying it wouldn't work. Just not sure it work good enough for them to be a dynasty.

And i think your underestimating klays intelligence. He knows ball movement is ideal for winning. You could see his frustration with kd on the warriors because he would iso a fair amount. Now imagine harden doing that ten fold.

Plus the warriors with klay, steph and kd were beatable. Not sure why you think kd with just klay wouldn't be.

[r0drig0lac]

harden

[Stanley Kobrick]

harden
I too pick Harden. put James on those Warriors in place of Curry and he possibly would have been on his 4th fmvp now

[tpols]

watch the games.

When Harden iso's everybody stands around.

Cant have moving parts swirling around because it would interfere with him making his move. Imagine he goes left, and a cutter with his man runs right into his lane.

Cant have that. So the dude doesnt play team basketball. You can maybe fluke a title off it, but you'll never build a dynasty.

[Bronbron23]

watch the games.

When Harden iso's everybody stands around.

Cant have moving parts swirling around because it would interfere with him making his move. Imagine he goes left, and a cutter with his man runs right into his lane.

Cant have that. So the dude doesnt play team basketball. You can maybe fluke a title off it, but you'll never build a dynasty.

bingo

[Bronbron23]

I too pick Harden. put James on those Warriors in place of Curry and he possibly would have been on his 4th fmvp now

Maybe but not playing the way he plays now. Hed have to be willing to fit into the warriors system so theres no way he'd be putting up the numbers he puts up now so theres no way he wins any fmvps next to kd. Kd would be better on both ends

[light]

first take had this debate today on whos better. 2 of the 3 said harden and i couldn't disagree more. They used his stats as the main argument. Harden has more points, assists and rebounds. This is a dumb argument. Harden has to monopolize the ball like no other to put up these crazy stat lines where curry can put up comparable numbers while not monopolizing the ball at all. This allows for better team movement which is a better recipe for success.

This an aspect of basketball that i swear most of the people on this forum dont understand. Putting up 25/5/5 while not monopolizing the ball is better than putting up 30/8/8 in a system where you monopolize the ball. This shouldn't even be a debate.

This is like those Jordan vs Magic or Jordan vs Bird arguments from the 80's.

You can't really fault someone for thinking Harden might be better because his numbers really are insane.

Personally I prefer Steph, but Harden is a great guard in his own right too.

[Bronbron23]

This is like those Jordan vs Magic or Jordan vs Bird arguments from the 80's.

You can't really fault someone for thinking Harden might be better because his numbers really are insane.

Personally I prefer Steph, but Harden is a great guard in his own right too.

yeah i dont disagree with that. Saying anyone is better than the other at their level is splitting hairs

[FireDavidKahn]

Warriors fans: "WE DRAFTED OUR STARS YOU CAN'T HATE US!!!"

2015 Finals MVP: Andre Iguodala (not drafted by the Warriors)

2017 Finals MVP: Kevin Durant (not drafted by the Warriors)

2018 Finals MVP: Kevin Durant (not drafted by the Warriors)

:roll:

[AlternativeAcc.]

Not sure about that. Kd couldn't form a dynasty with westbrook and im not sure harden would be a much better fit than him.

As far as klay i think hed be miserable with harden. Klay likes playing the right way with team movement.

Paul George couldn't form a 2nd round team with Westbrick.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

**** you. The 2018 Rockets finished with a better record than stacked Golden State in a good conference. That's impressive. His style earned him the MVP too. The Rockets nearly beat GSW when CP3 went down and almost went to the Finals too.

Harden deserves respect despite his flopping and egregious need for the refs. It's that simple. Curry is a better player than Harden. Ill stand by that. But that doesnt mean that Harden doesnt deserve respect b/c quite honestly he does.

They never won a game after CP3 went down lol

[Axe]

Had the rockets went to the 2018 finals and won the title, james harden would have been the fmvp.

[ralph_i_el]

I generally don't like ballhogs, but nobody can do what Harden is doing. He's worth letting ballhog. He ruthlessly plays bad defenders off the court. There's something to be said for having a guy that can be a decent offense all on his own. You can play defensive specialists and allow them to conserve energy for defense. It's a strategy that can work.

That being said, I've seen a healthy Curry put up the best offensive season of the last 20 years. I still think he has that in him. His off-ball gravity has an unquantifiable impact on the rest of his team. I've never seen someone get more attention from defenses coming around screens or off curls. He's the best shooter of all time. Give me Curry

[tpols]

:roll:

they were both like side dishes.

chef klay & dray was the main course.

[LoneyROY7]

Both are high gravity players. Harden was literally getting doubled teamed as soon as he crossed half-court for entire games this season. While Curry on the other hand, has insane off-ball gravity.

I believe Harden is the more talented basketball player overall, but Steph is obviously up there as well. And one could definitely take Steph from a ball movement perspective, which I could understand. Either way, haters gonna hate one way or another.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Curry has been a spoiled rich kid always having Klay\Dray\Iggy to cover up his weaknesses

Harden is less consistent in the playoffs as a scorer

Very tough to decide, I think it depends on what kind of roster you have. Curry is much more likely to get exposed with a bad supporting cast, while we already know Harden can carry weak supporting casts. I don't see Curry as a great enough playoff performer to overcome being the worse overall player, so I say Harden wins this by an inch.

[Stephonit]

Curry has been a spoiled rich kid always having Klay\Dray\Iggy to cover up his weaknesses

Harden is less consistent in the playoffs as a scorer

Very tough to decide, I think it depends on what kind of roster you have. Curry is much more likely to get exposed with a bad supporting cast, while we already know Harden can carry weak supporting casts. I don't see Curry as a great enough playoff performer to overcome being the worse overall player, so I say Harden wins this by an inch.

Yeah and Harden was dragged down by Chris Paul who I've heard is supposedly better than both of them.

[Axe]

i cant play ball.im just some fat kid who sits on my ass posting all day liveing with my grandma
Hmm. What's that, tough guy?

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Yeah and Harden was dragged down by Chris Paul who I've heard is supposedly better than both of them.

If he could keep his hamstring healthy, you may have a point. That wasn't the case. He was also terrible in 2019

[Whoah10115]

I generally don't like ballhogs, but nobody can do what Harden is doing. He's worth letting ballhog. He ruthlessly plays bad defenders off the court. There's something to be said for having a guy that can be a decent offense all on his own. You can play defensive specialists and allow them to conserve energy for defense. It's a strategy that can work.

That being said, I've seen a healthy Curry put up the best offensive season of the last 20 years. I still think he has that in him. His off-ball gravity has an unquantifiable impact on the rest of his team. I've never seen someone get more attention from defenses coming around screens or off curls. He's the best shooter of all time. Give me Curry

:bowdown:

[ralph_i_el]

Bro I swear... ****ing idiots around here. The 2018 Houston Rockets was ranked 6th ALLTIME in ORtg in the 3 point era. (Click on the ORtg header to make it increase.)

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tsl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&type=advanced&year_min=1980&lg_id=NBA&c1stat=off_rtg&c1comp=gt&c2stat=pts&c2comp=gt&order_by=wins

Only the 2016-17 GSW, 1986-87 LAL, 1991-92 CHI, 1987-88 BOS, and the 1995-96 CHI finished with better ORtg. Only a ****ing idiot would say that Harden's style is not compatible.

2019-20 Dallas Mavs have the highest ORtg of all time :lol

[j3lademaster]

Curry has been a spoiled rich kid always having Klay\Dray\Iggy to cover up his weaknesses

Harden is less consistent in the playoffs as a scorer

Very tough to decide, I think it depends on what kind of roster you have. Curry is much more likely to get exposed with a bad supporting cast, while we already know Harden can carry weak supporting casts. I don't see Curry as a great enough playoff performer to overcome being the worse overall player, so I say Harden wins this by an inch.
I mean, it goes both ways, Curry covers a lot of their weaknesses as well. Draymond pretty much proved this year hes just your basic roleplayer.

[Bronbron23]

I mean, it goes both ways, Curry covers a lot of their weaknesses as well. Draymond pretty much proved this year hes just your basic roleplayer.

He needs them more than they need him. Dont forget the warriors were cruising through the first 2 rounds of the 16 playoffs before steph came back. That same team without klay had a losing record. Steph needs dray and especially klay more than his stans realize

[RogueBorg]

I generally don't like ballhogs, but nobody can do what Harden is doing. He's worth letting ballhog. He ruthlessly plays bad defenders off the court. There's something to be said for having a guy that can be a decent offense all on his own. You can play defensive specialists and allow them to conserve energy for defense. It's a strategy that can work.

That being said, I've seen a healthy Curry put up the best offensive season of the last 20 years. I still think he has that in him. His off-ball gravity has an unquantifiable impact on the rest of his team. I've never seen someone get more attention from defenses coming around screens or off curls. He's the best shooter of all time. Give me Curry

This sequence is pretty amazing.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/59/c1/00/59c100948cc7780cd5450cbd2659878e.gif

[RRR3]

Had the rockets went to the 2018 finals and won the title, james harden would have been the fmvp.
The way it was going against the Warriors it would have been CP3. I trust CP3 a lot more in pressure situations than Harden too.

[BigShotBob]

Harden is pretty awful when the game actually matters, but then again Curry's 2016 performance was extremely subpar as well.

[Stephonit]

He needs them more than they need him. Dont forget the warriors were cruising through the first 2 rounds of the 16 playoffs before steph came back. That same team without klay had a losing record. Steph needs dray and especially klay more than his stans realize

At this rate Klay will need to be ranked higher than Reggie Miller for the world Curry's critics live in to make sense. Maybe Pippen too. Not that Curry would mind, he's always been happy to see his teammates shine.

[RogueBorg]

1. What has James Harden done that Curry hasn't? :confusedshrug:

2. What has Curry done that Harden hasn't? 3 championships/1 more league MVP/Led the league in steals

How is this even a discussion?

[light]

This sequence is pretty amazing.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/59/c1/00/59c100948cc7780cd5450cbd2659878e.gif

What's amazing about that is how hard it was for Curry to get around LeBron. He tried to get around him three or four times before finally seeing a crease on the fifth.

Basically Curry had to clear back out to use the threat of his three to find any room against LJ.

Incredible defense by James.

[Bronbron23]

At this rate Klay will need to be ranked higher than Reggie Miller for the world Curry's critics live in to make sense. Maybe Pippen too. Not that Curry would mind, he's always been happy to see his teammates shine.

Dont take it personal dude. Everyone needs help its just that curry needs more than others because he lacks in certain ereas where others dont. Most noticeably defense. Klay and dray were definitely worse offensively without steff but they were better defensively and good enough offensively so they coukd get by without him. Without klay you still lose alot offense but you also lose alot of defense.

[Bronbron23]

What's amazing about that is how hard it was for Curry to get around LeBron. He tried to get around him three or four times before finally seeing a crease on the fifth.

Basically Curry had to clear back out to use the threat of his three to find any room against LJ.

Incredible defense by James.

Well bron is an excellent defender but its not like curry is lightning fast or anything. Bron has all the advantage in that matchup. Hes faster, bigger and stronger. What funny is that in that series steph actually defended bron even better. For whatever reason bron kind of struggled whenever curry was on him

[Axe]

The way it was going against the Warriors it would have been CP3. I trust CP3 a lot more in pressure situations than Harden too.
Probably but too bad that hamstring he got in game 5 effectively ended his season, so...