Clyde Drexler claps back at Michael Jordan over "Last Dance"

[Roundball_Rock]

Everybody is taking their turn denouncing the "doc." :lol


One major storyline of the ESPN feature was the Michael Jordan vs. Clyde Drexler matchup in the 1992 NBA Finals. During the film, Jordan described how he felt disrespected by being compared to Drexler, which was a major slight considering how accomplished of a player Drexler became and was at that point.


“That’s Michael’s documentary so obviously it’s going to be from his perspective. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion. A lot of times guys didn’t like each other from other teams, but as you get older, you’ve got to get beyond all of that and show some love and some respect for the people you played with and against.

This is a team game, it’s not one guy. You can have 50 points and 40 rebounds but if you lose, are you less of a player than anybody on the other team? No, it’s a team game.

So I hate when people act like it’s an individual competition. I didn’t take 35 shots and get 20 free throws a night, so I wasn’t going to score 40 points a night.”

Full article at https://spacecityscoop.com/2020/05/27/houston-rockets-clyde-drexler-michael-jordan/

[scuzzy]

ouch, another one

[HBK_Kliq_2]

I don't understand Jordan talking down his 1992 finals opponent Drexler and laughing off his 1996 finals opponent in Gary Payton. That's basically like he's knocking his own era if he's acting like they never even stood a chance.

[Cyrus334]

Everybody is taking their turn denouncing the "doc." :lol





Full article at https://spacecityscoop.com/2020/05/27/houston-rockets-clyde-drexler-michael-jordan/

Why is he talking like Jordan is Wilt Chamberlein and averaged like 50 points but got beat in the Finals more than he won? Jordan was scoring high and winning tittles year after year, and on great efficiency too so why on earth would anyone have a problem with him taking that many shots?

[3ball]

Everybody is taking their turn denouncing the "doc." :lol





Full article at https://spacecityscoop.com/2020/05/27/houston-rockets-clyde-drexler-michael-jordan/

No

It isn't a team game when the #1 option has to average 10-20 more than his 2nd option to win a Finals and use twice as many possessions

otoh, it IS a team game when the #1 option wins Finals with a sidekick that scores nearly as much and uses the same number of possessions

Carry on, but the numbers are on my side

That being said - clyde is right - he deserves WAY more respect.. his numbers compare to ANYONE'S.. he'd be borderline top 10 if he won in 92'

[Norcaliblunt]

Michael Jordan is what is wrong with the world. The idea that it is cool creating fake narratives in your head (aka being delusional) and acting like a psychopathic narcissistic asshole is acceptable just because you wanna win.

[LostCause]

Ehh there’s nothing to see here

Drexler admitted he didn’t watch the series. He also understands its from Jordan’s perspective. If MJ said today he feels Drexler is trash, then what Drexler said would be applicable. However, Jordan was telling us what his thought process was at the time.

Stop being drama queens fellas. There’s nothing wrong with someone feeling they’re better at something than someone else

On a side note, here’s a cool interview with Jerry West.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=017nT9iS6jo

[bullettooth]

LeBron jock riders talking about it being a team game but are the first ones to bitch about LeBron's teams being trash when..... they lose. Or is it when he loses?

LOL, retards.

[fsvr54]

No

It isn't a team game when the #1 option has to average 10-20 more than his 2nd option to win a Finals and use twice as many possessions

otoh, it IS a team game when the #1 option wins Finals with a sidekick that scores nearly as much and uses the same number of possessions

Carry on, but the numbers are on my side

That being said - clyde is right - he deserves WAY more respect.. his numbers compare to ANYONE'S.. he'd be borderline top 10 if he won in 92'

Basketball is a team game under all circumstances, this is a fact of life. Teams play other teams. No one scores 100 points a game, no one guy gets every stop or gets 50 boards a game.

[3ball]

Basketball is a team game under all circumstances, this is a fact of life. Teams play other teams. No one scores 100 points a game, no one guy gets every stop or gets 50 boards a game.

Everyone needs help to win (a team), but MJ just needed the least, aka he needed to average 10-20 more than sidekick to win every series and used 50% more possessions than everyone.. no one used more possessions than MJ at better efficiency per possession than any wing ever

[RoseCity07]

Jordan is definitely an ego maniac. His stans just feed it.

[WhiteKyrie]

LeBron jock riders talking about it being a team game but are the first ones to bitch about LeBron's teams being trash when..... they lose. Or is it when he loses?

LOL, retards.
:applause: truth

[Roundball_Rock]

I don't understand Jordan talking down his 1992 finals opponent Drexler and laughing off his 1996 finals opponent in Gary Payton. That's basically like he's knocking his own era if he's acting like they never even stood a chance.

It is funny, isn't it? His stans are always saying how tough that era was, how great all his opponents were, while MJ is saying they were not serious opponents and literally laughing off one of them and going out of his way to diminish them.


Why is he talking like Jordan is Wilt Chamberlein

Because MJ took more shots than Wilt. More shots than Kareem. More shots than...anyone.


Basketball is a team game under all circumstances, this is a fact of life. Teams play other teams. No one scores 100 points a game, no one guy gets every stop or gets 50 boards a game.

Exactly. Even the early parts of the "documentary" was about how bad his team was and that is why they were losing (when they began winning it suddenly became a one man operation :oldlol: ).

[light]

Jordan's act has worn thin. People are tired of it.

[ThatCoolKid]

Jordan's act has worn thin. People are tired of it.

Yes I think all of the drama around this doc has actually eroded at Jordan's reputation. His peers just don't like the guy.

[NBAGOAT]

LeBron jock riders talking about it being a team game but are the first ones to bitch about LeBron's teams being trash when..... they lose. Or is it when he loses?

LOL, retards.

It being a team game is exactly why more than one person should get credit or blame. Outside of not putting any of the blame on Lebron, those dick riders actually are pretty
consistent on this topic lol.

The fact that you couldn’t see this chain of logic is concerning since it’s pretty trivial. Then again, I never expect anything too intelligent from your posts

[Roundball_Rock]

Yes I think all of the drama around this doc has actually eroded at Jordan's reputation. His peers just don't like the guy.

There has to be some MJ fatigue. These guys turn on the television and ESPN and the other sports channels are talking MJ. Go to sports podcasts. More MJ. Go to a sports website. If he retired recently it would be one thing but we are now 22 years removed from his last notable season.

[Cyrus334]

Because MJ took more shots than Wilt. More shots than Kareem. More shots than...anyone.


The hell are you on about? Kareem has attempted the most field goals in NBA history. Hell, Lebron has attempted for field goals by Jordan by product of having played longer.

[Roundball_Rock]

The hell are you on about? Kareem has attempted the most field goals in NBA history. Hell, Lebron has attempted for field goals by Jordan by product of having played longer.

:kobe:

FGA per game

Jordan prime (87'-96'): 23.9
Jordan High (87'): 27.8
Jordan career: 22.9

Kareem prime (70'-80'): 21.0
Kareem high (72'): 24.9
Kareem career: 18.1

LeBron prime (06'-16'): 19.8
LeBron high (06'): 23.1
LeBron career: 19.6

Wilt prime (60'-67'): 29.2
Wilt high (62'): 39.5
Wilt career: 22.5

Kobe prime (01'-13'): 21.6
Kobe high (06'): 27.2
Kobe career: 19.5

Only Wilt surpassed him and that was only during the first 40% of his career. His career average is lower than Jordan's. With the others, Jordan's prime average and high season all are lower than MJ.

This is what Drexler was getting at.

[scuzzy]

Yes I think all of the drama around this doc has actually eroded at Jordan's reputation. His peers just don't like the guy.

Yup

Great for network ratings during down time in sports

Terrible for his legacy and golden boy rep, everyone sniffed out this puff piece from a mile away

[STATUTORY]

this documentary was absolute a miscalculation on MJ's part, it has ignited a backlash against the man

[Cyrus334]

:kobe:

FGA per game

Jordan prime (87'-96'): 23.9
Jordan High (87'): 27.8
Jordan career: 22.9

Kareem prime (70'-80'): 21.0
Kareem high (72'): 24.9
Kareem career: 18.1

LeBron prime (06'-16'): 19.8
LeBron high (06'): 23.1
LeBron career: 19.6

Wilt prime (60'-67'): 29.2
Wilt high (62'): 39.5
Wilt career: 22.5

Kobe prime (01'-13'): 21.6
Kobe high (06'): 27.2
Kobe career: 19.5

Only Wilt surpassed him and that was only during the first 40% of his career. His career average is lower than Jordan's. With the others, Jordan's prime average and high season all are lower than MJ.

This is what Drexler was getting at.

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/who-has-the-most-career-field-goals-attempted-per-game

Actually Elgin was the one higher than Mike, not Wilt.

And Drexler's point is rather weak considering MJ's efficiency more than justified his shot attempts.

[Roundball_Rock]

Thanks--didn't know Baylor was ahead of MJ and Wilt.


And Drexler's point is rather weak considering MJ's efficiency more than justified his shot attempts.

Not necessarily. In a team sport players aren't going to play well if they are turned into spectators. Here is how the Bulls' did in the 10 games MJ took the most shots in his prime:

1996: 9-1 (63-9 in other games)
1993: 5-5 (52-20 in other games)
1992: 7-3 (60-12 in other games)
1991: 5-5 (56-16 in other games)
1990: 6-4 (49-23 in other games)
1989: 5-5 (42-30 in other games)
1988: 4-6 (46-26 in other games)
1987: 3-7 (37-35 in other games)

How about the 10 games MJ took the least shots?

1996: 10-0 (Bulls 17-0 when MJ took 18 or less shots)
1993: 9-1 (Bulls 15-1 when MJ took 21 or less shots)
1992: 10-0 (Bull 24-0 when MJ took 19 or less shots)
1991: 9-1 (Bulls 28-1 when MJ took 21 or less shots)
1990: 8-2
1989: 6-4
1988: 6-4
1987: 3-7

[Cyrus334]

Thanks--didn't know Baylor was ahead of MJ and Wilt.



Not necessarily. In a team sport players aren't going to play well if they are turned into spectators. Here is how the Bulls' did in the 10 games MJ took the most shots in his prime:

1996: 9-1 (63-9 in other games)
1993: 5-5 (52-20 in other games)
1992: 7-3 (60-12 in other games)
1991: 5-5 (56-16 in other games)
1990: 6-4 (49-23 in other games)
1989: 5-5 (42-30 in other games)
1988: 4-6 (46-26 in other games)
1987: 3-7 (37-35 in other games)

How about the 10 games MJ took the least shots?

1996: 10-0 (Bulls 17-0 when MJ took 18 or less shots)
1993: 9-1 (Bulls 15-1 when MJ took 21 or less shots)
1992: 10-0 (Bull 24-0 when MJ took 19 or less shots)
1991: 9-1 (Bulls 28-1 when MJ took 21 or less shots)
1990: 8-2
1989: 6-4
1988: 6-4
1987: 3-7

Well yes, clearly by the numbers the Bulls were less successful when MJ took his highest shot total (were those just regular season?), but my point is that Drexler's stance seemed like he was implying Mike was being inefficient while taking those shots and it led nowhere. When MJ was taking the most shots in the playoffs and in the Finals and was winning while being efficient, would Drexler still say the same thing?

And also he says he wasn't shooting that many free throws but in the 92 Finals, didn't he attempt the most free throws out of anyone?

[Soundwave]

Well yes, clearly by the numbers the Bulls were less successful when MJ took his highest shot total (were those just regular season?), but my point is that Drexler's stance seemed like he was implying Mike was being inefficient while taking those shots and it led nowhere. When MJ was taking the most shots in the playoffs and in the Finals and was winning while being efficient, would Drexler still say the same thing?

And also he says he wasn't shooting that many free throws but in the 92 Finals, didn't he attempt the most free throws out of anyone?

lol don't expect answers to any of these.

Jordan was able to get his 30-32 easily that was never a problem for him (8 points a quarter is easy pickings), if he had to shoot more it was often on nights when other guys on his team simply were not bringing it.

[insidious301]

Drexler is correct. Jordan also didnt do himself favors LYING about Isiah Thomas. Jordan had no problem calling Thomas an asshole, but couldn't admit he had something to do with IT not playing on Dream Team 1992. Shameful.

[BigShotBob]

Drexler always believed that it was a "team sport" until it came to other players, then they're so great that they can transcend it :lol

[Soundwave]

this documentary was absolute a miscalculation on MJ's part, it has ignited a backlash against the man

Documentary was a massive global hit and watched by millions and millions of people and many basketball players will now try and copy it (to less success). Boo-hoo that Drexler, Grant, and Thomas, three people MJ wouldn't want to hang around anyway are butt hurt.

[Norcaliblunt]

Jordan has always been shoved down your throat by the media. It’s like social engineering brainwashing the youth to be psychopaths.

[PP34Deuce]

Jordan was so advanced athletically from his counter parts and had skills the elite athletes didnt have. I enjoy these stan melt downs... clyde was not on jordans level but he was a top guard in a big dominated era.

[PeroAntic]

Drexler is correct. Jordan also didnt do himself favors LYING about Isiah Thomas. Jordan had no problem calling Thomas an asshole, but couldn't admit he had something to do with IT not playing on Dream Team 1992. Shameful.

**** Isiah, his bum ass didnt deserve to be on the team.

Drexler too, what a sore loser.

[LoneyROY7]

MJ getting clap backs left and right these days.

[Horatio33]

There has to be some MJ fatigue. These guys turn on the television and ESPN and the other sports channels are talking MJ. Go to sports podcasts. More MJ. Go to a sports website. If he retired recently it would be one thing but we are now 22 years removed from his last notable season.

Its because of Coronavirus. No sport at all. Now the playoffs would have been in full swing for a month, approaching the finals. They bought the documentary forward to fill the void left by coronavirus.

[Lebowski]

Wow, the amount of cry babies (who are supposed to be grown men) actually surprises me. How about get over it, he won, you lost. Jordan is a jackass, douchebag etc. who cares, he won, you did not. End of that story.

[guy]

Thanks--didn't know Baylor was ahead of MJ and Wilt.



Not necessarily. In a team sport players aren't going to play well if they are turned into spectators. Here is how the Bulls' did in the 10 games MJ took the most shots in his prime:

1996: 9-1 (63-9 in other games)
……
How about the 10 games MJ took the least shots?

1996: 10-0 (Bulls 17-0 when MJ took 18 or less shots)
……

Flawed logic as usual from you. The game isn’t played on a spreadsheet. For most of his career, especially in the winning years, Jordan approached the game based on what the defense was giving and how his teammates were playing. If his teammates had it going, he didn’t shoot as much. If they didn’t, he did shoot more. Sure, there were games where he had the hot hand or he forced the issue so his teammates didn’t shoot as much, but that wasn’t the usual approach he had.

And there were PLENTY of games where his teammates were anemic offensively and he had to shoot a lot. In those games if he didn’t change how he was playing and took 20 or less shots, that doesn’t mean the record would be similar to the numbers you posted where he shot less – which by the way don’t make clear all the games that ended up being blowouts largely due to Jordan’s aggressive shooting which put the game out early so he didn’t need to play or shoot as much later in the game or the games where he was fouled a bunch on shots and took a ton of free throws (shots that you’re fouled on and don’t make the shot do not count towards FGA).

And for the games where he shot a lot, you took the absolute extreme. He’s averaging well over 30 FGA per game in that sample size. No one has said that’s ideal. That’s way more then his career average, which is already high. And with that said, he’s still 44-36 in those games. In all the regular season games he shot 30 shots or more, he’s 75-57. In the playoffs, he’s 25-14. That’s actually pretty great because its not ideal for anyone to shoot over 30 times per game. Kobe for example is well below .500 in those type of games, while Lebron has a similar win % as Jordan but not nearly the same number of games where he did that.

And Jordan averaged 25 FGA per game for his career in the playoffs. He’s done that or more for 4 championship runs as well. The only other player since the merger (so trying to remove the earlier high pace eras) was Hakeem who did it once in 95. Clearly it worked for him and his team - it wouldn't work for the vast majority of great players.

He was clearly justified to take a lot of shots, especially more then someone like Drexler. He was a more efficient player on significantly more volume (~+7 more FGA/g in the regular season and ~+8.5 more FGA/g in the playoffs for their careers.) and didn’t play in uptempo offenses that are supposed to make it easier to score like Drexler did. He is just making excuses. Only a fool would think the difference between the 2 is that Jordan took more shots. After the actual ability to score, shot creation is probably the most important skill to have and Jordan was clearly above most great players in that regard, especially Drexler.

At least he didn’t bring up the bullsh*t excuse that he was injured in the 92 Finals that people like you thought was a legitimate gripe about the documentary for not mentioning.

[ArbitraryWater]

MJ still that dumb kid that hasnt grown up, never understand the power of team.

So full of himself, the idiot.

[Roundball_Rock]

Its because of Coronavirus. No sport at all. Now the playoffs would have been in full swing for a month, approaching the finals. They bought the documentary forward to fill the void left by coronavirus.

They were talking about him non-stop before the Coronavirus. The media is addicted to and worships MJ. It went to saturation coverage because of the "documentary" but he is a regular topic on sports media. The only guys who get more coverage are LeBron and Brady--who actually still play.

Drexler has always said it is a team sport. Here is what he said to MJ:
"Let me have Scottie. See how I do then."--Clyde Drexler to Michael Jordan

[ImKobe]

LeBron jock riders talking about it being a team game but are the first ones to bitch about LeBron's teams being trash when..... they lose. Or is it when he loses?

LOL, retards.

Exactly. These same losers gloss over the point Clyde was making about stats and the game being about team effort. Lebron stans only care about his individual numbers but not how many times his teams have come up short due to his ball dominant style of play. Jordan won a lot and put up great numbers, but he was also a great team player, in a sense that he actually played off ball and didn't need to have the ball in his hands on every single possession to have all-time great numbers and win at the same time. Clyde simply wasn't as talented as MJ, he can say shit about Jordan taking more shots, but he never was able to produce as much as he did, despite coming up in a similar situation himself in Portland.

[Da_Realist]

I can understand where Clyde is coming from. He's been hearing this same story for almost 30 years. He didn't just lose during the Olympics and in the 92 Finals. He's the loser every time he has to hear this story. Any true competitor would be frustrated that this is part of his legacy. The Blazers had a more devastating loss to Magic's Lakers in 91 with homecourt advantage and the best record in the league but he probably never hears about that.

[Stanley Kobrick]

MJ getting clap backs left and right these days.
he shouldn't have released his documentary, now he's getting a taste of what real criticism is. back in the 90's that didn't exist because he was the face of every name brand. you can tell this is frustrating a lot of michael fans who looked up to him as a god during their prepubescent childhood

[Roundball_Rock]

he shouldn't have released his documentary, now he's getting a taste of what real criticism is. back in the 90's that didn't exist because he was the face of every name brand. you can tell this is frustrating a lot of michael fans who looked up to him as a god during their prepubescent childhood

Good points. Would guys like Drexler, Grant, Isiah and all the others who are coming out criticizing this have had the same platform to speak out as they do today? They speak to one media outlet and it spreads quickly on the internet and social media.

Back then ESPN was the king but if you didn't watch ESPN you weren't going to hear about it. Newspapers were out there too but this likely would be not be covered at all or be a minor story. NBC's NBA telecasts was another one but Jordan was a sponsor of NBC's telecasts (imagine if LeBron sponsored ABC :oldlol: ) and their reporter Ahmed Rashad his buddy so you weren't going to get much negativity there. In today's media environment small outlets can break stories that go viral.

[Uncle Drew]

Damn, this has been terrible PR for DK. Every player of little relevance in the 90's is denouncing him, all the way to his own teammates. :oldlol: Well, it had been coming. Good to see that bubble burst, except for some obnoxious fools who act like teenage schoolgirls. I won't state any names but it's 3ball.