How good was Penny Hardaway in Phoenix?

[PeroAntic]

When he signed there he had 28 years and averaged 17/6/6 on 47 fg% in his first season before he busted his knees in the second. His numbers were pretty good, why did people think he wasnt elite anymore?

[Phoenix]

When he signed there he had 28 years and averaged 17/6/6 on 47 fg% in his first season before he busted his knees in the second. His numbers were pretty good, why did people think he wasnt elite anymore?

Those arent really elite numbers though. I remember him being decent that year but he wasnt the guy we saw from 95-97 anymore. Penny was very skilled but the loss of athletic explosiveness dropped him from elite status. I mean you being a Rose guy can surely appreciate that.

[GreatHILL]

he was real good but injuries killed his career

[PeroAntic]

Those arent really elite numbers though. I remember him being decent that year but he wasnt the guy we saw from 95-97 anymore. Penny was very skilled but the loss of athletic explosiveness dropped him from elite status. I mean you being a Rose guy can surely appreciate that.

I appreciate that, but players like Rose and Hardaway have always been more than their athleticism. They always had incredible skill. I didn't see Penny that much in Phoenix back then unfortunately, I was a kid and the Suns didnt feature that much. But watching some old games from him there he looks still athletically dominant even if not the superfreak he was (kinda like Rose). So I wonder whether it was just perception of his dropoff, or there was something else like poor coaching/team fit.

[Phoenix]

I appreciate that, but players like Rose and Hardaway have always been more than their athleticism. They always had incredible skill. I didn't see Penny that much in Phoenix back then unfortunately, I was a kid and the Suns didnt feature that much. But watching some old games from him there he looks still athletically dominant even if not the superfreak he was (kinda like Rose). So I wonder whether it was just perception of his dropoff, or there was something else like poor coaching/team fit.

So was Tmac. Very high skill level. But stripping away that much explosiveness is tough to overcome. I think his injuries just continued to stockpile. Had he managed to stay even at that level he was in the year you referenced, he could have remained a valuable asset for a team if not the superstar he was otherwise trending to be. Two years after that he was 12ppg on 41%. Just an unfortunate what-if. Penny and Grant should have been the bridge perimeter greats between MJ and Kobe then slowly pass the baton to guys like Bron and Wade in the early/mid 2000s.

Rose has actually managed to bounce back much better than I thought. Guys at that height have a hard time sticking around when a vital piece of their makeup( Rose's tier 1 athleticism) is taken away because they can't completely redefine their game like a bigger player could.

[Turbo Slayer]

Penny was good but not as elite as in the late 90s.

[Lebron23]

Penny was good but not as elite as in the late 90s.

I have a request to you. Can you please posts the nba on abc/espn theme?. Create a thread about it.

[Turbo Slayer]

So you want me to post a thread titled "ABC/ESPN theme (NBA)"??

Sure I'm down. :cheers:

[PeroAntic]

he always sucked,couldnt won a title cause couldnt close like jordan or kobe
Pre injury Penny beat Jordan in 1995.

Post injury Penny outplayed Kobe in 2000.

Have some respect.

[Phoenix]

he always sucked,couldnt won a title cause couldnt close like jordan or kobe

274 posts and most of them are as dumb as this one.

[HoopsNY]

Penny was one of my favorite players as a kid but he left on a sour note from Orlando. When he went to Phoenix he had already had injury woes. But if my memory serves me correctly, he had gained some weight, too. He wasn't as explosive as he was in Orlando, naturally, and that obviously took away from his game.

[Soundwave]

The knee injury completely destroyed him, even by '97 or so he was saying he wasn't able to finish at the rim and dunk over people anymore.

He would have had some 25/7/6 type seasons I think if not for those injuries.

[HoopsNY]

The knee injury completely destroyed him, even by '97 or so he was saying he wasn't able to finish at the rim and dunk over people anymore.

He would have had some 25/7/6 type seasons I think if not for those injuries.

Yea I agree with this. When MJ retired in 1998, he was asked who the next MJ would be. He said confidently, "Kobe Bryant or Penny Hardaway."

[Turbo Slayer]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNUto6iLaMM

[PeroAntic]

The knee injury completely destroyed him, even by '97 or so he was saying he wasn't able to finish at the rim and dunk over people anymore.

He would have had some 25/7/6 type seasons I think if not for those injuries.

To say it completely destroyed him is far from the truth. He was an allstar level player for the first year in Phoenix. Dunking is not everything, Penny had elite intelligence and skill, and he improved on his midrange shooting and post game after the injury. He wasn't good as a transition player but became better in the half court.

What destroyed Penny was the fact that he never skipped his defensive assignments. People called him soft so he wanted to prove them wrong, so he was taking charges, going for blocks, boxing out etc. When your knees are bad, this is going to kill your career. He should have just focused on offense, but he always took pride in being a two way player.