Wilt and Lebron Careers are so similar to each other's

[coastalmarker99]

As many know, Wilt was one of the best players to ever play in the league. He battled Bill Russell for the best player of the 60’s. While Russell played his entire career in Boston, Wilt played in a few different locations. Here are some things to note

1. Wilt won the MVP 4 times in his career (1960,66,67,68)

2. He had no problem making the finals, but would often be on the losing side. He would only win a third of the finals appearances he made

So far, both of these can also be said about another legend...

Lebron of course!! That was pretty easy. However, there’s more to it


Lebron was born in Akron, OH (45 min outside of Cleveland) , and started his career with the Cleveland Cavaliers

Wilt was born in Philadelphia, and started his career with the Philadelphia Warriors (he and the franchise would move to SF in 1962)


After spending time in Miami, Lebron would return to hometown cleveland, bringing a title to his city by defeating the Warriors (2016)

After spending time in SF, Wilt would return to hometown Philly ( 76ers now), bringing a title to his city by beating who? The Warriors (1967)

The icing on top of the cake?

The final years of Wilt’s career were spent with the Lakers, where he would gain a new rivalry against the future of the NBA: a young, lengthy superstar (with a very long last name that starts with an A) that played for the Bucks Same as with LeBron.

[ArbitraryWater]

Please stop trying to equal a guy who perenially disappeared in the playoffs and finals and who's production shrunk, to the greatest playoff and finals performer of all time.

That alone kills all similarities.

[coastalmarker99]

Please stop trying to equal a guy who perenially disappeared in the playoffs and finals and who's production shrunk, to the greatest playoff and finals performer of all time.

That alone kills all similarities.

Wilt's post-season FG% allowed vs centers

59-60:

Kerr regular season FG% against the league: .39.2 Kerr against Wilt in the playoffs: .29.4

Dierking regular season FG%: .36.5 Dierking vs Wilt in the post-season: .33.3

Russell regular season: .46.7 Russell vs. Wilt in the post-season: .44.6

60-61:

Kerr regular season: .39.7 Kerr vs Wilt: .32.1

Halbrook regular season: .33.5 Halbrook vs Wilt: .38.7

61-62:

Kerr regular season: .44.3 Kerr vs. Wilt: .37.6

Russell regular season: .45.7 Russell vs Wilt: .39.9

63-64:

Beaty regular season: .44.4 Beaty vs. Wilt: .52.0

Russell regular season: .43.3 Russell vs. Wilt: .38.6

64-65:

Embry regular season: .45.6 Embry vs Wilt .43.8

Russell regular season: .43.8 Russell vs. Wilt 44.6

65-66:

Russell regular season: .41.5 Russell vs. Wilt: .42.4

66-67:

Dierking regular season: .39.9 Dierking vs Wilt: .42.7

Russell regular season: .45.4 Russell vs. Wilt: .35.8

Thurmond regular season: .43.7 Thurmond vs. Wilt: .34.3

67-68:

Bellamy regular season: .54.1 Bellamy vs. Wilt: .42.1

Russell regular season: .42.5 Russell vs. Wilt: .44.0

68-69:

Thurmond regular season: .41.0 Thurmond vs Wilt: .39.2

Beaty regular season: .47.0 Beaty vs. Wilt: .38.3

Russell regular season: .43.3 Russell vs. Wilt: .39.7

69-70:

Walk regular season: .47.0 Walk vs Wilt: .39.5

Fox regular season: .52.4 Fox vs Wilt: .36.2

Bellamy regular season: .52.3 Bellamy vs Wilt: .45.6

Reed regular season: .50.7 Reed vs Wilt: .48.3

70-71:

Boerwinkle regular season: .48.5 Boerwinkle vs Wilt: .46.3

Fox regular season: .45.8 Fox vs Wilt: .43.4

Kareem regular season: .57.7 Kareem vs Wilt: .48.1

71-72:

Ray regular season: .49.9 Ray vs Wilt: .52.9

Kareem regular season: .57.4 Kareem vs Wilt: .45.7

Lucas regular season: .51.2 Lucas vs Wilt: .50.0

72-73:

Awtry regular season: .48.0 Awtry vs Wilt: .54.2

Thurmond regular season: .44.6 Thurmond vs Wilt: .37.3

Reed regular season: .47.4 Reed vs Wilt: .49.3

During Wilt's last 7 seasons after his scoring seasons, he would lead all players in playoff defensive win shares 5 out of 7 times during his non-scoring title seasons

And if blocks were tracked for Wilt he would also more then likely have the most blocks ever in the playoffs. In 81 known playoff games of recorded block shots. Wilt blocked a total of 590 shots, as a result, Wilt averaged 7.3 blocks per game in the playoffs. Tim Duncan has the most at 568 blocks and he played 251 playoffs games to Wilt's 160 and Wilt in less than 170 games at 81 games has more blocks then Tim Duncan. it's possible that Wilt might have gotten a 1000 blocks in the playoffs which is just ridiculous to think about.

[coastalmarker99]

Please stop trying to equal a guy who perenially disappeared in the playoffs and finals and who's production shrunk, to the greatest playoff and finals performer of all time.

That alone kills all similarities.

So no Wilt did not underperform in the playoffs he just ran up against better teams as LeBron did.


5 times Wilt faced a team with the league MVP( all opposing hall of fame centers) Wilt would average 24.5 points ,24.6 rebounds on 52.2 field goal percentage. the opposing MVP's centers combined averages vs Wilt were 22.8 points,19.1 rebounds, on a 45.1 field goal percentage.

Chamberlain also had in the postseason 8 games without assessing any personal fouls in those games Wilt's teams would win 6 games and lose 2 games. Wilt would average in those games 24.0 points,25,1 rebounds,4,6 assists on a 53.8 field goal percentage.


Chamberlain faced an opposing hall of fame starting center in all six of his NBA finals. Wilt would average 18.8 points,24.5 rebounds on a 55.4 field goal percentage. The opposing Hof centers finals averages combined were 15.1 points,16.9 rebounds on 43.9 field goal percentage.


In Chamberlain's two game 7's he played in the finals Wilt would average 19.5 points,25.5 rebounds,on a 70.8 field goal percentage. While his opposing hall of fame starting centers would both combined average 5.0 points,12,0 rebounds on a field goal percentage of 33.3 percent.

4 times Wilt faced the best scoring team in the league in the postseason. Wilt would average 28.6, 22.6 rebounds,2.9 assists on 48.8 field goal percentage. While holding all of his opposing hall of fame/all star centers combined to 18.0 points,16.9 rebounds ,2.7 assists on 44.6 field goal percentage.

[coastalmarker99]

Please stop trying to equal a guy who perenially disappeared in the playoffs and finals and who's production shrunk, to the greatest playoff and finals performer of all time.

That alone kills all similarities.

Also Wilt actually played in 37 "elimination games",...games where either his team faced elimination or could have clinched the series: both LeBron and Wilt have monster numbers in elimination games

W: 53-22-2, 24-42 FG/FGA

W: 50-35-2, 22-42

L: 26-24-0, 8-18

L: 33-23-1, 13-29

W: 56-35-1, 22-48

W: 32-21-1, 12-29

L: 22-22-3, 7-15

W: 39-30-?, 19-29

L: 30-27-2, 12-28

W: 38-26-5, 14-22, 10 blks (Triple-Double)

W: 30-26-4, 13-22, 13 blks (Triple-Double)

L: 30-32-2, 12-15

L: 46-34-?, 19-34

W: 18-27-9, 7-14

W: 29-36-13, 10-16, 7 blks (Triple-Double)

W: 24-23-4, 8-13

W: 25-27-3, 10-19

L: 28-30-7, 11-21

L: 20-27-8, 6-21

L: 14-34-5, 4-9

W: 11-25-1, 5-9

W: 16-29-3, 5-11, 16 blks (Triple-Double)

L: 8-18-4, 1-5

L: 18-27-3, 7-8

W: 36-14-3, 12-20

W: 12-26-11, 4-11, 11 blks (Quad-Double)

W: 30-27-6, 11-18, 11 blks (Triple-Double)

W: 45-27-3, 20-27

L: 21-24-4, 10-16

W: 25-19-9, 7-12

L: 23-12-4, 10-21

W: 8-31-8, 4-6

W: 20-24-2, 8-12, 10 blks (Triple-Double)

W: 24-29-4, 10-14, 8 blks

W: 21-28-4, 10-17, 8 blks

W: 5-22-7, 2-2

L: 23-21-3, 9-16

W-L : 24-13

Here were Wilt's averages in those 37 games:

29.5 ppg

26.1 rpg

4.2 apg (missing one game)

.546 FG% (in post-seasons that shot about .440 on average in that span.)

Keep in mind that 24 of those 37 games came after his "scoring seasons" (59-60 thru 65-66)


And finally, in 37 career playoff games where Wilt Chamberlain's teams either faced elimination or successfully clinched a series Wilt's numbers look like this:

29.5 ppg
26.1 rpg
4.2 apg
10.4bpg (9 game sample size for blocked shots)
24 team W's -13 L's

In elimination games, from 1960-66, Wilt averaged 40ppg in 12 games. He had 3 of his 4 50+ point games were in those elimination games.

In elimination games, from 1967-73, Wilt averaged 23ppg in 12 games (different roles). despite he wasn't the main scoring option anymore (he was defensive minded Wilt at this time), but still was able to pull out a 45/27 game, 30/27/11 blocks (reported), etc...

You round his scoring average to 31.5ppg in 24 elimination games, with him having a rebounding average of 20+, high fg%, high blocks, and his enigma of low ft%.

[coastalmarker99]

Please stop trying to equal a guy who perenially disappeared in the playoffs and finals and who's production shrunk, to the greatest playoff and finals performer of all time.

That alone kills all similarities.

Throughout NBA history there have been 0 50 point game 7 performances. However, not every series has always been best of 7 games, some went 3 games, some 5 games. In all of these "winner take all" games(eg: G5 of a 5 game series), there have been 2 50 point games. They were:

Wilt Chamberlain, game 3 of a best of 3 against Syracuse Nationals, 1960 ECSF: 53 points(as a rookie)
Wilt Chamberlain, game 5 of a best of 5 against St Louis Hawks, 1962 ECSF: 56 points

"Choker" tho because narratives>facts on inside hoops

[light]

As many know, Wilt was one of the best players to ever play in the league. He battled Bill Russell for the best player of the 60’s. While Russell played his entire career in Boston, Wilt played in a few different locations. Here are some things to note

1. Wilt won the MVP 4 times in his career (1960,66,67,68)

2. He had no problem making the finals, but would often be on the losing side. He would only win a third of the finals appearances he made

So far, both of these can also be said about another legend...

Lebron of course!! That was pretty easy. However, there’s more to it


Lebron was born in Akron, OH (45 min outside of Cleveland) , and started his career with the Cleveland Cavaliers

Wilt was born in Philadelphia, and started his career with the Philadelphia Warriors (he and the franchise would move to SF in 1962)


After spending time in Miami, Lebron would return to hometown cleveland, bringing a title to his city by defeating the Warriors (2016)

After spending time in SF, Wilt would return to hometown Philly ( 76ers now), bringing a title to his city by beating who? The Warriors (1967)

The icing on top of the cake?

The final years of Wilt’s career were spent with the Lakers, where he would gain a new rivalry against the future of the NBA: a young, lengthy superstar (with a very long last name that starts with an A) that played for the Bucks Same as with LeBron.

No their career trajectories are completely different.

For the vast majority of Wilt's career he only had 0 or 1 title. His last title came at the tail end of his career at age 35 and then he retired.

But LeBron had 2 titles by age 28 and 3 by age 31. Much more of a winner, in other words.

To give you an idea of the difference in their championship impact, Wilt never won an MVP, a ring and a Finals MVP in back-to-back seasons like LeBron did in 2012 and 2013. When you do that you make a significant mark and Wilt has never made that kind of a mark.

And Wilt has never done the utterly impossible in the Finals like LeBron did in 2016.

So Bron's reputation right now at age 35 is higher than Wilt's was at the same age because he is more accomplished and is a respected winner.

And another difference is that LeBron is still virtually in his prime at age 35. Wilt at 35 was done - he was down to averaging 14 ppg. He retired a year later.

So... not similar at all really.

[Turbo Slayer]

:applause:

[warriorfan]

High iq

[Rico2016]

Please stop trying to equal a guy who perenially disappeared in the playoffs and finals and who's production shrunk, to the greatest playoff and finals performer of all time.

That alone kills all similarities.

/thread

Be better OP

[Turbo Slayer]

High iq No.

[Psileas]

Hey, coastal, how is the Wilt game project going? I hope there has been some response by the NBA.


No their career trajectories are completely different.

For the vast majority of Wilt's career he only had 0 or 1 title. His last title came at the tail end of his career at age 35 and then he retired.

But LeBron had 2 titles by age 28 and 3 by age 31. Much more of a winner, in other words.

To give you an idea of the difference in their championship impact, Wilt never won an MVP, a ring and a Finals MVP in back-to-back seasons like LeBron did in 2012 and 2013. When you do that you make a significant mark and Wilt has never made that kind of a mark.

And Wilt has never done the utterly impossible in the Finals like LeBron did in 2016.

So Bron's reputation right now at age 35 is higher than Wilt's was at the same age because he is more accomplished and is a respected winner.

And another difference is that LeBron is still virtually in his prime at age 35. Wilt at 35 was done - he was down to averaging 14 ppg. He retired a year later.

So... not similar at all really.

You try to compare certain special situations of Wilt and LeBron straighly, as if they played in the same era. You claim LeBron had 2 titles by age 28, leaving out that when LeBron was in his 8th season (Wilt's first title), he was still at zero. Hell, if Wilt had the good fortune of being able to play in the NBA since he was a HS'er, he might join the already 1956 champions Warriors and add a few titles early on, suddenly entering the Russell/Magic/Bird territories instead of the LeBron ones.
You compare their situations at 35, when Wilt was a 300+ lb monster coming off a potential career-ending injury and having the crappy 70's medicine at his disposal to a 35 y.o LeBron who has never been seriously injured and has a half-century medical head start. LeBron would have zero case of being as healthy in the 70's as he's now. 35 in 1970 is nothing like 35 in 2020.
You're right, there's nothing to compare here, but it's not any testament of LeBron being greater.
Btw, for someone who was "done", Wilt had a hell of a lot of success: All-NBA 2nd team behind a prime Kareem, valid MVP candidate (he got almost half as many votes as 35 ppg Kareem), leading with Russell's role a team to a record that stood a quarter of a century, leading the league in rebounding, leading the league in FG%, probably leading the league in blocks and probably winning DPOY if the award had existed back then etc. If this is "done", Russell must have been "done" during his whole career.



Please stop trying to equal a guy who perenially disappeared in the playoffs and finals and who's production shrunk, to the greatest playoff and finals performer of all time.

That alone kills all similarities.

Famous last words. :oldlol:

[coastalmarker99]

Hey, coastal, how is the Wilt game project going? I hope there has been some response by the NBA.



You try to compare certain special situations of Wilt and LeBron straighly, as if they played in the same era. You claim LeBron had 2 titles by age 28, leaving out that when LeBron was in his 8th season (Wilt's first title), he was still at zero. Hell, if Wilt had the good fortune of being able to play in the NBA since he was a HS'er, he might join the already 1956 champions Warriors and add a few titles early on, suddenly entering the Russell/Magic/Bird territories instead of the LeBron ones.
You compare their situations at 35, when Wilt was a 300+ lb monster coming off a potential career-ending injury and having the crappy 70's medicine at his disposal to a 35 y.o LeBron who has never been seriously injured and has a half-century medical head start. LeBron would have zero case of being as healthy in the 70's as he's now. 35 in 1970 is nothing like 35 in 2020.
You're right, there's nothing to compare here, but it's not any testament of LeBron being greater.
Btw, for someone who was "done", Wilt had a hell of a lot of success: All-NBA 2nd team behind a prime Kareem, valid MVP candidate (he got almost half as many votes as 35 ppg Kareem), leading with Russell's role a team to a record that stood a quarter of a century, leading the league in rebounding, leading the league in FG%, probably leading the league in blocks and probably winning DPOY if the award had existed back then etc. If this is "done", Russell must have been "done" during his whole career.




Famous last words. :oldlol:

it is going well, my man I have been in contact with Wilt's family and I think that they may give me permission to view Wilt's games Wca is helping me with this so I will get back to you very soon about this but I think they will say yes.

Also praising lebron as a winner and calling Wilt a loser is unfair as if Ray misses that shot in game 6 then lebron has the same amount of rings as Wilt despite playing longer then him.

Wilt was also 9 points away from having 6 to 7 rings for his career and Wilt showed up in those game 7' and dominated Russell if his teammates hit a couple of more shots in those close game 7's losses then it is likely that Russell falls out of the top ten and Wilt is viewed as an undisputed top 3 player ever.

I like both players and they are my two favourite players of all time and I think that they are both the most talented players ever to step foot on a Nba court. And also if Wilt comes out of high school like LeBron Wilt could easily have scored 5 to 8,000 points more for his career and would still be number 1 on the all-time scoring list. also Wilt could have gotten 30,00 rebounds for his career along with more rings with his teammates being better as they would have been in their primes with a young Wilt.

[Roundball_Rock]

I agree. If we are talking type of play, Wilt's closest all-time great comp is Shaq and for LeBron he is a souped up Pippen/Havlicek/Hill. If we are talking career similarities, though, Wilt and LeBron are the two most parallel greats. The criticisms of both are very similar as well.

The two things that stick out most to me about Wilt that tend to be overlooked are 1) how close his (vastly inferior) teams came in a lot of the losses held against him to the Celtics 2) his ability to dominate in three different roles at different times of his career.

I don't get the "losing" knock against Wilt. It is the same as with LeBron: both players drag teams much farther than they would go without them, or with another superstar replacing them (e.g., put Durant or Carmelo on those LeBron teams or Thurmond or Russell on Wilt's). Those are credits to them, not discredits. Are we saying they "should" have lost earlier with those teams?

Wilt also succeeded as 1) the most dominant scorer ever 2) a facilitator 3) the Russell role of dominant defense/rebounding. No one else in the top 10 can say that. LeBron has succeeded moving to PG but Jordan was in the same exact role every second of his NBA career. Kareem's prime was the same, although he should he could gradually cede the reins to Magic. Russell's playing role was always the same (although he became a player-coach).


For the vast majority of Wilt's career he only had 0 or 1 title. His last title came at the tail end of his career at age 35 and then he retired.

True, but Wilt wasn't along for the ride. Wilt was 3rd in MVP in 72', behind West (2nd--KAJ was MVP). In first place MVP votes West got 44, Wilt 36, although the gap in overall votes was greater.

Even in 73', Wilt's final year, Wilt was still 4th in MVP (12 first place votes). West was 9th, although he missed 13 games.

The Lakers won 60 games and made the NBA finals with Wilt; after he retired they went to 47-35 and lost in the first round. That shows the type of impact he still had.

Regarding MVP's, Wilt played in arguably the toughest era to win MVP's. He had to compete with Russell, West, Oscar, Kareem for MVP's and that is only the top of the list (you had guys like Baylor, Havlicek, Petit, Cousy out there too).