Why Kawhi beating Warriors was more impressive then Lebron beating Warriors

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Game 5 the raptors lost by 1 point despite Kevin Durant playing and scoring 11 points. So if Durant doesn't play at all in 2019 finals like 2016 finals, raptors finish off the series in 5. The fact is if Kevin Durant never plays, raptors beat Curry/Klay/Dray/Iggy in 5 games. While it took LeBron to do it in 7 games.

On top of that, Kawhi had less offensive help from his 2nd scoring option.

PPG gap for Kawhi/Siakam - 9

GmSc gap for Kawhi/Siakam - 8.1

A total PPG and GmSc gap of 17.1

PPG gap for LeBron/Irving - 2.6

GmSc gap for LeBron/Irving - 7.4

A total PPG and GmSc gap of 10

Kawhi is +7.1 on PPG/GmSc relative to their sidekicks.

Kawhi has a 122 offensive rating and led Raptors to a 116 offensive rating

LeBron has a 114 offensive rating and led Cavs to a 109.1 offensive rating

Curry = Curry

Klay missed 1 game and 3 quarters vs Draymond missing 1 game

Harrison barnes = Demarcus cousins but cousins played way better actually.

Iggy put up his same 8PPG

Durant was also the x factor scoring 11 points 90% TS and giving warriors a 1 point win in game 5.

[Axe]

Sooner or later, you will have gurus here pointing out that the raptors played an injury-hobbled warriors team in the finals last year.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Sooner or later, you will have gurus here pointing out that the raptors played an injury-hobbled warriors team in the finals last year.

Durant actually changed the outcome of game 5. Klay missed roughly a game and a half which is similar to Draymond 2016 suspension. I don't get what they are referring too but I let them have it today.

[light]

Game 5 the raptors lost by 1 point despite Kevin Durant playing and scoring 11 points. So if Durant doesn't play at all in 2019 finals like 2016 finals, raptors finish off the series in 5. The fact is if Kevin Durant never plays, raptors beat Curry/Klay/Dray/Iggy in 5 games. While it took LeBron to do it in 7 games.

On top of that, Kawhi had less offensive help from his 2nd scoring option.

PPG gap for Kawhi/Siakam - 9

GmSc gap for Kawhi/Siakam - 8.1

A total PPG and GmSc gap of 17.1

PPG gap for LeBron/Irving - 2.6

GmSc gap for LeBron/Irving - 7.4

A total PPG and GmSc gap of 10

Kawhi is +7.1 on PPG/GmSc relative to their sidekicks.

Kawhi has a 122 offensive rating and led Raptors to a 116 offensive rating

LeBron has a 114 offensive rating and led Cavs to a 109.1 offensive rating

Curry = Curry

Klay missed 1 game and 3 quarters vs Draymond missing 1 game

Harrison barnes = Demarcus cousins but cousins played way better actually.

Iggy put up his same 8PPG

Durant was also the x factor scoring 11 points 90% TS and giving warriors a 1 point win in game 5.

Dude.

73-9 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 57-25

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Dude.

73-9 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 57-25

Regular season wins is due to health and variance. 2007 mavs had 67 wins after starting 0-4, impressive right? They ended up getting their ass kicked in the 1st round by the lonely Warriors lol

The core of Curry/Dray/Klay/Iggy was there and that's all that matters. Besides a game or game and a half missed by Dray/Klay both years.

[Rico2016]

Regular season wins is due to health and variance. 2007 mavs had 67 wins after starting 0-4, impressive right? They ended up getting their ass kicked in the 1st round by the lonely Warriors lol

The core of Curry/Dray/Klay/Iggy was there and that's all that matters. Besides a game or game and a half missed by Dray/Klay both years.

73 is the WORLD RECORD.

Try again

[LoneyROY7]

LeBron was considerably more dominant in the Finals in '16 than Kawhi was in the '19 Finals.

[SATAN]

What a ****ing stupid thread.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

73 is the WORLD RECORD.

Try again

All 73 wins means is they were extremely worn down by the finals.

2019 warriors were coasting with Durant and well rested by finals.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

LeBron was considerably more dominant in the Finals in '16 than Kawhi was in the '19 Finals.

Kawhi had Warriors in a chokehold and in control all series.

Lebron had to desperately come back from down 1-3 and have Irving make the biggest shot in the series game 7.

[Gougou]

Lol no way, even if I am a Toronto fan I think Lebron was more impressive, DOWN 3-1, and beat a 73-9 team. Curry and Klay/Dray was also at peak times.

[Axe]

That said, i still wonder why cleveland hasn't won more than 60 games at least once during his second stint there.

[Stephonit]

I respect Kawhi's performance far more than the lesser player's. Injuries are an inescapable part of the game. League intervention is not. Kawhi went through a difficult playoffs path. The lesser player waltzed to the finals.

[warriorfan]

Game 5 the raptors lost by 1 point despite Kevin Durant playing and scoring 11 points. So if Durant doesn't play at all in 2019 finals like 2016 finals, raptors finish off the series in 5. The fact is if Kevin Durant never plays, raptors beat Curry/Klay/Dray/Iggy in 5 games. While it took LeBron to do it in 7 games.

On top of that, Kawhi had less offensive help from his 2nd scoring option.

PPG gap for Kawhi/Siakam - 9

GmSc gap for Kawhi/Siakam - 8.1

A total PPG and GmSc gap of 17.1

PPG gap for LeBron/Irving - 2.6

GmSc gap for LeBron/Irving - 7.4

A total PPG and GmSc gap of 10

Kawhi is +7.1 on PPG/GmSc relative to their sidekicks.

Kawhi has a 122 offensive rating and led Raptors to a 116 offensive rating

LeBron has a 114 offensive rating and led Cavs to a 109.1 offensive rating

Curry = Curry

Klay missed 1 game and 3 quarters vs Draymond missing 1 game

Harrison barnes = Demarcus cousins but cousins played way better actually.

Iggy put up his same 8PPG

Durant was also the x factor scoring 11 points 90% TS and giving warriors a 1 point win in game 5.

Sorry I don’t speak stat nerd


I agree with your premise though. If you look at all the circumstances LeBrons 2016 championship wasn’t even that impressive. His abysmal offensive performances in games 1-4 when warriors were at near full strength while compared to his last 3 while the warriors were missing their 3 best defensive players... 2016 is big time asterisk.

[light]

Regular season wins is due to health and variance. 2007 mavs had 67 wins after starting 0-4, impressive right? They ended up getting their ass kicked in the 1st round by the lonely Warriors lol

The core of Curry/Dray/Klay/Iggy was there and that's all that matters. Besides a game or game and a half missed by Dray/Klay both years.

73-9 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 67-15

Look, the Raptors were good before Kawhi and after Kawhi.

The Cavs suck without LeBron.

This is not even close.

[Duncan21formvp]

The fact you win 73 games with Harrison Barnes as your SF shows how weak the league was.

[Bronbron23]

Game 5 the raptors lost by 1 point despite Kevin Durant playing and scoring 11 points. So if Durant doesn't play at all in 2019 finals like 2016 finals, raptors finish off the series in 5. The fact is if Kevin Durant never plays, raptors beat Curry/Klay/Dray/Iggy in 5 games. While it took LeBron to do it in 7 games.

On top of that, Kawhi had less offensive help from his 2nd scoring option.

PPG gap for Kawhi/Siakam - 9

GmSc gap for Kawhi/Siakam - 8.1

A total PPG and GmSc gap of 17.1

PPG gap for LeBron/Irving - 2.6

GmSc gap for LeBron/Irving - 7.4

A total PPG and GmSc gap of 10

Kawhi is +7.1 on PPG/GmSc relative to their sidekicks.

Kawhi has a 122 offensive rating and led Raptors to a 116 offensive rating

LeBron has a 114 offensive rating and led Cavs to a 109.1 offensive rating

Curry = Curry

Klay missed 1 game and 3 quarters vs Draymond missing 1 game

Harrison barnes = Demarcus cousins but cousins played way better actually.

Iggy put up his same 8PPG

Durant was also the x factor scoring 11 points 90% TS and giving warriors a 1 point win in game 5.

Nah bruh i dont even have to see the numbers its not even close. Kd was hurt and klay ended up hurt. Green was also much better in 16 and the warriors bench was also better in 16. Brons was definitely more impressive

[Axe]

Both series saw the warriors ending up losing in their home floor.

[Rico2016]

The fact you win 73 games with Harrison Barnes as your SF shows how strojg
Curry, Klay, Dray, Bogut, Iggy was.

Duh....

Harrison Barnes, 6th option 20 ppg Olympian. No biggie

[deathawaitu]

Duh
That’s the public consensus that Kawhi championship was more impressive

Kawhi didn’t need the commissioner’s help. My inside source told me LeBron was begging Adam Silver for help

[SouBeachTalents]

The fact you win 73 games with Harrison Barnes as your SF shows how weak the league was.
The fact you win 72 games with Luc Longley as your C shows how weak the league was

[BigShotBob]

The fact you win 72 games with Luc Longley as your C shows how weak the league was

Luc Longley >>>> Harrison Barnes

[Roundball_Rock]

Look, the Raptors were good before Kawhi and after Kawhi.

The Cavs suck without LeBron.

This is not even close.

This. The Raptors were 59-23 before Kawhi, 17-5 (63 win pace) without Kawhi in 19' and 46-18 without him in 20' (59 win pace). It is ridiculous Kawhi gets all the credit. The Raptors have a better record than the Clippers who added Kawhi plus PG to a 48 win team. :lol


The fact you win 73 games with Harrison Barnes as your SF shows how weak the league was.

He was a 19 PPG scorer in Dallas--and he was the weak link on the Curry, Klay, Green, Iggy Warriors.


The fact you win 72 games with Luc Longley as your C shows how weak the league was

:lol

[Cyrus334]

Lebron's performance was unquestionably better but I was more impressed with the Raptors beating the Warriors then the Cavs beating the Warriors only because I expected the Cavs to beat the Warriors and could not for the life of me understand how they went down 3-1 to the Warriors when they had the supposed "GOAT".

[Lebron23]

Lebron's performance was unquestionably better but I was more impressed with the Raptors beating the Warriors then the Cavs beating the Warriors only because I expected the Cavs to beat the Warriors and could not for the life of me understand how they went down 3-1 to the Warriors when they had the supposed "GOAT".

Those Warriors team were better than the 1996 Sonics, 1997 and 1998 Utah Jazz. They would definitely beat Jordan's 2nd 3 peat Bulls. Warriors just beat two MVP's in the Western Conference Finals in 7 games. (Westbrook, and Durant)

[Roundball_Rock]

A 57 win team is not equal to a 73 win team. No excuses for the Warriors blowing it.

[Lebron23]

A 57 win team is not equal to a 73 win team.

Exactly.

[Hey Yo]

Duh
That’s the public consensus that Kawhi championship was more impressive

Kawhi didn’t need the commissioner’s help. My inside source told me LeBron was begging Adam Silver for help
Silver let Kawhit sit out regular season games when he was healthy.

[Hey Yo]

Let's compare 3rd option numbers

"Superstar" Kevin Love = 8-7-0 blocks on 36% shooting.

Siakam = 20-7-0 blocks on 50% shooting.


I think we're done here.

[Roundball_Rock]

Silver let Kawhit sit out regular season games when he was healthy.

Routinely. Just look at this season. It began on October 22. Kawhi skipped games on October 30 and November 6. So 10% into the season he already took 2 games often. It was an open defiance of the rules but Kawhi gets away with it because he simply can't play more than about 75% of the time.

[Rico2016]

Let's compare 3rd option numbers

"Superstar" Kevin Love = 8-7-0 blocks on 36% shooting.

Siakam = 20-7-0 blocks on 50% shooting.


I think we're done here.

Bingo

[riggyrich]

Ya'll think this is a 1v1 individual game lol. Raptors obviously had a better team. Arguable the best bench in the league. Obviously Lebron had help from Kyrie because it's a fukin "team game" Just like Kawhi had help, just like Magic had help, just like Jordan had help. It's a team game dumbasses.

[ArbitraryWater]

Can you compare LeBron and Kawhi though

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Routinely. Just look at this season. It began on October 22. Kawhi skipped games on October 30 and November 6. So 10% into the season he already took 2 games often. It was an open defiance of the rules but Kawhi gets away with it because he simply can't play more than about 75% of the time.

Kawhi only skipped games in 2019 but 90% of those games were awful teams. Majority of title winning teams can beat the worst teams without its best player.

2016 - Kawhi played 80%
2017 - Kawhi played 80%
2019 - As long as Kawhi plays remaining 8 games he is at 80% of 73 virus games

[Roundball_Rock]

Kawhi only skipped games in 2019 but 90% of those games were awful teams. Majority of title winning teams can beat the worst teams without its best player.

2016 - Kawhi played 80%
2017 - Kawhi played 80%
2019 - As long as Kawhi plays remaining 8 games he is at 80% of 73 virus games

2020: 80%
2019: 73% (60 games played)
2018: 11%
2017: 90% (career high)
2016: 88%
2015: 78%
2014: 80%
2013: 71%
2012: 97%

These are terrible numbers--especially when you look at it from 2016-2020 since 2016 is when he became a superstar.

He doesn't just skip games against bad teams. There was controversy earlier this year because he missed a nationally televised game against the Bucks a week into the season.

I can't take his stats seriously when he is taking this much time off. Any superstar's stats would look great if they played only 70-80% of games and when he plays it is relatively limited minutes (32 MPG this year) too. He needs an unprecedented amount of rest just to function--and he is 28 and in his peak...

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Let's compare 3rd option numbers

"Superstar" Kevin Love = 8-7-0 blocks on 36% shooting.

Siakam = 20-7-0 blocks on 50% shooting.


I think we're done here.

Lowry is just a glorified 3 & d guy, kind of like a midget Draymond Green.

In finals series, you look at the stars and not the role players.

Irving averaged 27 PPG, hit biggest shot of series, game 5 elimination game scores 40

Irving gave LeBron more help in 2016 finals then any single player Kawhi had on his team

[Roundball_Rock]

Team A: 59+ win pace without Kawhi three seasons running
Team B: lottery team without LeBron

Kawhi is the one who didn't have help, the other guy had super help? :coleman:

Kyrie is a proven cancer. How much "help" did his stats give Boston and Brooklyn? We can't assess him by numbers, especially since the sample size is small since he is always injured. His entire reputation revolves around 2 playoff runs. He has been playing for about a decade...

[HBK_Kliq_2]

2020: 80%
2019: 73% (60 games played)
2018: 11%
2017: 90% (career high)
2016: 88%
2015: 78%
2014: 80%
2013: 71%
2012: 97%

These are terrible numbers--especially when you look at it from 2016-2020 since 2016 is when he became a superstar.

He doesn't just skip games against bad teams. There was controversy earlier this year because he missed a nationally televised game against the Bucks a week into the season.

I can't take his stats seriously when he is taking this much time off. Any superstar's stats would look great if they played only 70-80% of games and when he plays it is relatively limited minutes (32 MPG this year) too. He needs an unprecedented amount of rest just to function--and he is 28 and in his peak...

80, 73, 90, 88 for his four prime years. 2018 he had an injury. That's plenty of games.

32MPG isn't as big of a deal as it once was. Nobody plays 40MPG anymore. Giannis is the leader for MVP and he plays like 31MPG, Luka plays about 32MPG

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Team A: 59+ win pace without Kawhi three seasons running
Team B: lottery team without LeBron

Kawhi is the one who didn't have help, the other guy had super help? :coleman:

Kyrie is a proven cancer. How much "help" did his stats give Boston and Brooklyn? We can't assess him by numbers, especially since the sample size is small since he is always injured. His entire reputation revolves around 2 playoff runs. He has been playing for about a decade...

Irving isn't all that when he's the 1st option scorer like Boston/Nets. However, he is a great beta star and thrives as 2nd option.

[Rico2016]

Lowry is just a glorified 3 & d guy, kind of like a midget Draymond Green.

In finals series, you look at the stars and not the role players.

Irving averaged 27 PPG, hit biggest shot of series, game 5 elimination game scores 40

Irving gave LeBron more help in 2016 finals then any single player Kawhi had on his team

You're 100% 3-ball because you're the only idiot dumb enough to 'blame' LeBron for elevating a player like Kyrie to that status. I'll let you in on a little secret. Lebron was able to get MAX production out of Kyrie because that 2016 Warriors team was not going to anything less. Make sense? In the 2016 WCF KD dropped 30 and Russell dropped 27-11-7-4 but that still wasn't enough. Got it?

And here's the beauty of your brain, you prove LeBron's greatness by disregarding logic. You're praising Kyrie for feats that LeBron surpassed. So once again thanks for the compliments. The King appreciates them.

[Hey Yo]

Lowry is just a glorified 3 & d guy, kind of like a midget Draymond Green.

In finals series, you look at the stars and not the role players.

Irving averaged 27 PPG, hit biggest shot of series, game 5 elimination game scores 40

Irving gave LeBron more help in 2016 finals then any single player Kawhi had on his team

So all of a sudden Love's a role player? I thought his signing made Cleveland a superteam?

Lowry + Siakam in 2019 >>>>>>> Kyrie + Love 2016 and it's not close.

[Roundball_Rock]

Irving isn't all that when he's the 1st option scorer like Boston/Nets. However, he is a great beta star and thrives as 2nd option.

That's the perception--but I doubt he will thrive next to Durant. LeBron and the Cavs were just able to mask his deficiencies. It happens. The Steelers did it for years with Antonio Brown and look at what we saw as soon as he left.


80, 73, 90, 88 for his four prime years. 2018 he had an injury. That's plenty of games.

That is unprecedented. We have never had a superstar before who played 70-80% of games--and that is the high end for him if he remains healthy. His four prime years aren't all the same. He became a diva in 2018 so 2016 and 2017 doesn't tell us much about him today.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

So all of a sudden Love's a role player? I thought his signing made Cleveland a superteam?

Lowry + Siakam in 2019 >>>>>>> Kyrie + Love 2016 and it's not close.

Lowry is a role player. Love is an all-star who Lebron turned into a role player. Big differences. Kevin Love is better then Lowry in a vacuum.

Siakam missed 12 straight three pointers in the finals and couldn't even average 20 PPG. Irving averaged 27PPG and made the game winning 3 pointer in game 7

[HBK_Kliq_2]

You're 100% 3-ball because you're the only idiot dumb enough to 'blame' LeBron for elevating a player like Kyrie to that status. I'll let you in on a little secret. Lebron was able to get MAX production out of Kyrie because that 2016 Warriors team was not going to anything less. Make sense? In the 2016 WCF KD dropped 30 and Russell dropped 27-11-7-4 but that still wasn't enough. Got it?

And here's the beauty of your brain, you prove LeBron's greatness by disregarding logic. You're praising Kyrie for feats that LeBron surpassed. So once again thanks for the compliments. The King appreciates them.

54% TS and 106 offensive rating for Durant in 2016 WCF. That's nothing special and he still took warriors to 7 games. Thunder were even up 3-1. Durant handed warriors the series because he choked so hard. If Durant had a clutch player like Irving instead of choking Westbrook, thunder win that series. Don't forget Irving made the biggest shot of the 2016 finals, Durant didn't have a clutch co star like that.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

That's the perception--but I doubt he will thrive next to Durant. LeBron and the Cavs were just able to mask his deficiencies. It happens. The Steelers did it for years with Antonio Brown and look at what we saw as soon as he left.



That is unprecedented. We have never had a superstar before who played 70-80% of games--and that is the high end for him if he remains healthy. His four prime years aren't all the same. He became a diva in 2018 so 2016 and 2017 doesn't tell us much about him today.

Go look at all the games kawhi sat out with raptors and clippers. I guarantee you 90% are against non playoff teams.

[Rico2016]

54% TS and 106 offensive rating for Durant in 2016 WCF. That's nothing special and he still took warriors to 7 games. Thunder were even up 3-1. Durant handed warriors the series because he choked so hard. If Durant had a clutch player like Irving instead of choking Westbrook, thunder win that series. Don't forget Irving made the biggest shot of the 2016 finals, Durant didn't have a clutch co star like that.

I'm so glad you gave me the opportunity to own you further regarding 2016 Warriors and what it would take to beat them.

First off, Russell did more than Kyrie. Russell put up 27-11-7-4 and still, that was NOT enough
Kyrie only put up 27-4-4 -2 but hat was enough. Why? Because Not only did the winning team's #2 option need at least 27, the #1 option needed at least 30. But wait, was 30 enough for Thunder's #1 option? KD scored 30 and Russ 27, but they still lost? Why? How could this be? Because it still was not enough, because the Warriors were that good.

KD: 30-8-3
Russ: 27-11-7

Still not enough to beat the juggernaut 73-win Warriors. Let it sink in. There really only was one way to beat that 73-win Warrior team and you know what that was:
https://i.postimg.cc/MGR4Fm7m/GOATchipalltime.jpg

[Rico2016]

One last thing to mention that just makes your claim even funnier

Kawhi: 28-10-4-2-1.2 on 43% fg
LeBron: 30-11-9-2.6-2.3 on 49% fg

:lol

Also, Kawhi's 6th option, his #6 option, scored more than LeBron's #3 option J.R. Smith
Also, LeBron's 3rd option was J.R. Smith

I know you're just trying to take down LeBron's greatest achievement but it's full-proof, locked in tightly. I apologize in advance.

[Roundball_Rock]

Go look at all the games kawhi sat out with raptors and clippers. I guarantee you 90% are against non playoff teams.

How about he show up for work? No other superstar has ever needed to take this volume of days off to function.

What is your answer to the Raptors being 63-23 without Kawhi the last two seasons? Kawhi was "carrying" that team? Then how do they have a better record than Kawhi's team this year?

[Rico2016]

How about he show up for work? No other superstar has ever needed to take this volume of days off to function.

What is your answer to the Raptors being 63-23 without Kawhi the last two seasons? Kawhi was "carrying" that team? Then how do they have a better record than Kawhi's team this year?

This is a big reason why he will never win the most prestigious, hardest to achieve award in NBA history. The MVP.

The MVP is more iconic than the FMVP, people just care about the FMVP because it equates to winning, but what if I told you it was Jerry West's 1969 FMVP where his team lost? Or if LBJ had won it in 2015 after putting on his heroics. The MVP is harder to win, more powerful, and reserved for the elite of the elite.

Iggy could win FMVP
Worthy could win FMVP
Cornbread Maxwell would win FMVP

None of them could win the true MVP. They could get hot for 4 to 7 games, but not 82.

[Hey Yo]

Lowry is a role player. Love is an all-star who Lebron turned into a role player. Big differences. Kevin Love is better then Lowry in a vacuum.

Siakam missed 12 straight three pointers in the finals and couldn't even average 20 PPG. Irving averaged 27PPG and made the game winning 3 pointer in game 7
Quit moving the goalposts, Chico.

Your thread is about the 2 said Finals. Lowry and Siakam both played significantly better than Love did. Siakam did indeed avg. 20ppg for the series.

[Roundball_Rock]

This is a big reason why he will never win the most prestigious, hardest to achieve award in NBA history. The MVP.

The MVP is more iconic than the FMVP, people just care about the FMVP because it equates to winning, but what if I told you it was Jerry West's 1969 FMVP where his team lost? Or if LBJ had won it in 2015 after putting on his heroics. The MVP is harder to win, more powerful, and reserved for the elite of the elite.

Iggy could win FMVP
Worthy could win FMVP
Cornbread Maxwell would win FMVP

None of them could win the true MVP. They could get hot for 4 to 7 games, but not 82.

Yeah FMVP is vastly overrated if players like that, including role player Kawhi in 14', can win it. Kawhi is a good example. It was based on 3 good games (similar story with Iggy, it was games 4-6) but he won because someone on the Spurs had to get it since it isn't even a real FMVP award (outside of 1969). It is FMVP of the winning team.

MVP is the best of the best. No 3-4 game flukes in there.


Lowry and Siakam both played significantly better than Love did. Siakam did indeed avg. 20ppg for the series.

Love was 9/7/1 on 36%. Toronto had 7 players in total in double digits. Siakam was at 20, Lowry 16/4/7 and then FVV and the rest.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

I'm so glad you gave me the opportunity to own you further regarding 2016 Warriors and what it would take to beat them.

First off, Russell did more than Kyrie. Russell put up 27-11-7-4 and still, that was NOT enough
Kyrie only put up 27-4-4 -2 but hat was enough. Why? Because Not only did the winning team's #2 option need at least 27, the #1 option needed at least 30. But wait, was 30 enough for Thunder's #1 option? KD scored 30 and Russ 27, but they still lost? Why? How could this be? Because it still was not enough, because the Warriors were that good.

KD: 30-8-3
Russ: 27-11-7

Still not enough to beat the juggernaut 73-win Warriors. Let it sink in. There really only was one way to beat that 73-win Warrior team and you know what that was:
https://i.postimg.cc/MGR4Fm7m/GOATchipalltime.jpg

Russell had a 39% FG for the series. Irving shot better then that even from the 3 point line! Irving was at 40% from three and 47% FG, he was a massively better scorer then Westbrook was for the series. Lebron needs a scorer on his team like irving, not a passer like Westbrook who shoots 39% FG. Put Westbrook on 2016 cavs instead of Irving and they don't win the title.

Besides, since when is beating Durant/Westbrook duo considered brag worthy? They consistently choked every year and were the Stockton/Malone of their era.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Quit moving the goalposts, Chico.

Your thread is about the 2 said Finals. Lowry and Siakam both played significantly better than Love did. Siakam did indeed avg. 20ppg for the series.

LeBron needs shooters and that's why he won with Irving. If his 2nd option scorer was Siakam, he loses. Siakam missed 12 consecutive three pointers in 2019 finals.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

One last thing to mention that just makes your claim even funnier

Kawhi: 28-10-4-2-1.2 on 43% fg
LeBron: 30-11-9-2.6-2.3 on 49% fg

:lol

Also, Kawhi's 6th option, his #6 option, scored more than LeBron's #3 option J.R. Smith
Also, LeBron's 3rd option was J.R. Smith

I know you're just trying to take down LeBron's greatest achievement but it's full-proof, locked in tightly. I apologize in advance.

Kawhi 60% TS to Lebron 56% TS
Kawhi 122 offensive rating to Lebron 114

Kawhi may have had slightly better role players, that's it. Don't forget if Durant doesn't play in game 5, Kawhi eliminates warriors in 5 games. It took LeBron 7 games just to do it.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

How about he show up for work? No other superstar has ever needed to take this volume of days off to function.

What is your answer to the Raptors being 63-23 without Kawhi the last two seasons? Kawhi was "carrying" that team? Then how do they have a better record than Kawhi's team this year?

How many playoff games did 2018 raptors win not including the 1st round? That will answer your question right there. Regular season is when players are coasting or playing bad teams, its a joke compared to playoff basketball.

[Indian guy]

The KD-less 2019 Warriors are NOT the 2016 Warriors. Way less depth, regressed Draymond, much older Iggy and not to mention Klay's injury.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

LeBron fans love to talk about regular season accomplishments and supporting cast. His toughest challenge in the east during 2013 playoffs was facing the MVP Derrick Rose leading the -0.02 SRS Bulls.

Meanwhile, Kawhi has to face MVP Giannis leading 8.04 bucks.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

The KD-less 2019 Warriors are NOT the 2016 Warriors. Way less depth, regressed Draymond, much older Iggy and not to mention Klay's injury.


That's not true, Draymond got in really good shape before the playoffs and he was Warriors best player when they eliminated Rockets. Then they swept a top 6 SRS and top 3 offense team in blazers.

Iggy stats 2016: 9 points 4 rebs, 4 assists

Iggy stats 2019: 8 points, 4 rebounds, 3 assists

Sounds like iggy was generally the same guy.

Draymond missed a game, Klay missed 7 quarters. That's not a big enough gap to argue for Lebron.

As far as this supposed depth that 2016 warriors had over 2019 warriors. You want to argue the 13 minutes per game that barbosa played in the finals? Go right ahead because anybody with half a brain isn't going to buy it.

[Roundball_Rock]

How many playoff games did 2018 raptors win not including the 1st round? That will answer your question right there. Regular season is when players are coasting or playing bad teams, its a joke compared to playoff basketball.

The Raptors were in the ECF before Kawhi. They won a series in 18'. You are acting like they were a sacrificial lamb. If the Raptors flame out in the first round or get crushed in the second round this year your point will have more merit but let's see what happens. The flip side is, what will Kawhi do in LA without Siakam, Lowry, FVV, and co.? So far Toronto has done better than the Clips.


His toughest challenge in the east during 2013 playoffs was facing the MVP Derrick Rose leading the -0.02 SRS Bulls.

Rose didn't play at all in 2013...

[Rico2016]

Kawhi 60% TS to Lebron 56% TS
Kawhi 122 offensive rating to Lebron 114

Kawhi may have had slightly better role players, that's it. Don't forget if Durant doesn't play in game 5, Kawhi eliminates warriors in 5 games. It took LeBron 7 games just to do it.

Well you are forgetting a few pieces, how convenient of you.

KD played 11 minutes. He took 5 shots. That's it. So nice try on up-playing his impact in the series :lol

Klay also missed an entire game.

Harrison Barnes, the 20 ppg team USA Olympian was replaced by...Jerebko?

Andre Igoudola and Shaun Livingston and Andrew Bogut were all three years older...

LBJ's #3 option was out scored by Kawhi's #6 option.

Any other 'claims' that I need to take down? Let me know baby boi.

[Rico2016]

The Raptors were in the ECF before Kawhi. They won a series in 18'. You are acting like they were a sacrificial lamb. If the Raptors flame out in the first round or get crushed in the second round this year your point will have more merit but let's see what happens. The flip side is, what will Kawhi do in LA without Siakam, Lowry, FVV, and co.? So far Toronto has done better than the Clips.



Rose didn't play at all in 2013...

Another easy way to detect a 3ball alt. They repeatedly misquote basic information from the modern era (somehow thought Rose won MVP in 2013 and played :lol) and always rounding up and down in his favor.


3ball, give it a rest. We know it's you.

[Roundball_Rock]

My favorite is these guys rounding 21.7 down to 21. Who does that? :lol

[Rico2016]

Kawhi 60% TS to Lebron 56% TS
Kawhi 122 offensive rating to Lebron 114

Kawhi may have had slightly better role players, that's it. Don't forget if Durant doesn't play in game 5, Kawhi eliminates warriors in 5 games. It took LeBron 7 games just to do it.

So LeBron faced a stronger Warriors version and lead not only every Cav and Warrior from the 2016, but also Kawhi?

FINALS
2019 Kawhi: 28- 10- 4 - 2.0 - 1.2 on 43% fg, 35% 3p
2016 LeBron: 30 - 11 - 9 - 2.6 - 2.3 on 49% fg, 37% 3p

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Well you are forgetting a few pieces, how convenient of you.

KD played 11 minutes. He took 5 shots. That's it. So nice try on up-playing his impact in the series :lol

Klay also missed an entire game.

Harrison Barnes, the 20 ppg team USA Olympian was replaced by...Jerebko?

Andre Igoudola and Shaun Livingston and Andrew Bogut were all three years older...

LBJ's #3 option was out scored by Kawhi's #6 option.

Any other 'claims' that I need to take down? Let me know baby boi.

Kevin Durant had 11 points and warriors won by 1 point, that's called an x factor. Also Durant had 90% TS and was like a 20BPM in those minutes he played, he changed the outcome of that game 5. Without Durant playing, Kawhi finishes them off in 4-1 series.

Klay missed a game when the series was tied 1-1
Draymond missed a game when warriors were up 3-1 and cavs were facing elimination

Barnes averaged 9 points 40% TS wow what a game changer. You know what's sad? Durant had more impact in 11 minutes then Barnes did for an entire series.

[HoopsNY]

I wouldn't say it was more impressive, but the two series are closer than most people realize or are willing to admit.

Kawhi didn't have a running mate like Kyrie, that is true, but his overall supporting cast might have been slightly better than LeBron's, though it is close with all things considered. Klay missing a game in 2019 and Draymond missing a game in 2016 kinda cancel each other out.

Another poster mentioned Iguodala's decline, but Iggy was basically the same player for both series. And in game 7 of 2019, Iguodala goes for 22 points on 9-15 shooting. In game 7 of 2016 he was 2-6 for 4 points.

I also think having Cousins for 7 games is an upgrade over Bogut for 5, no matter how much worse Cousins was as a player after his return.

And I think it's interesting that the Raptors beat GS in 6 games where as the Cavs went the full 7. On the other hand, a person can still argue that this Warriors team only won 57 games while the 2015-16 Warriors was a 73 win team. The retort of that would be the injury woes during the regular season for GS, with Steph and Draymond missing some time, as well as Cousins missing more than half of the season.

I'd say the victory is about even with the 2016 win, though it could go both ways in the eyes of many.

[Roundball_Rock]

Kawhi didn't have a running mate like Kyrie, that is true, but his overall supporting cast might have been slightly better than LeBron's, though it is close with all things considered

Could the Cavs win 59 games without LeBron (Raptors' 20' win pace)? I find that hard to believe since with LeBron they won 57 in 16'. LeBron missed six games that year; Cavs went 1-5.


Klay missing a game in 2019 and Draymond missing a game in 2016 kinda cancel each other out.

The difference is Green missed one game. Klay missed a game and then got hurt in Game 6--when he was dominating. He was carrying GS in the third quarter and went down so he didn't go done in a random performance at a random time. Plus, injuries are bad luck. Green got suspended for being an idiot. He knew the rules.

Then there were other injuries beyond Klay.


And I think it's interesting that the Raptors beat GS in 6 games where as the Cavs went the full 7

The Warriors were down Durant, Klay (for a full game and the end of Game 6), while Iggy and Cousins were banged up as was Looney. That's their entire top 7 outside of Curry and Green. Despite this, if Klay doesn't get hurt the Warriors were on the way to at least forcing a Game 7. People always bring Green up but he was suspended--when he came back he was 100%.

You also have to factor in age, mileage, etc. Green regressed a lot since 16', Iggy was 35 by 19'.

[HoopsNY]

Could the Cavs win 59 games without LeBron (Raptors' 20' win pace)? I find that hard to believe since with LeBron they won 57 in 16'. LeBron missed six games that year; Cavs went 1-5.

That's a slightly different discussion, though. The OP was talking about the finals series, not about the regular season and comparing the value of Kawhi vs. the value of Lebron. If we're talking about the value of Lebron from 2015-16 vs that of Kawhi in 2018-19, then LeBron wins that debate.


The difference is Green missed one game. Klay missed a game and then got hurt in Game 6--when he was dominating. He was carrying GS in the third quarter and went down so he didn't go done in a random performance at a random time. Plus, injuries are bad luck. Green got suspended for being an idiot. He knew the rules.


Yea, but it was toward the end of the 3rd quarter with GS only being up by 3. It wasn't as if he missed the entire game, which I think would have changed the outlook between the two series if he did.


The Warriors were down Durant, Klay (for a full game and the end of Game 6), while Iggy and Cousins were banged up as was Looney. That's their entire top 7 outside of Curry and Green. Despite this, if Klay doesn't get hurt the Warriors were on the way to at least forcing a Game 7. People always bring Green up but he was suspended--when he came back he was 100%.

The Warriors didn't have Durant in 2015-16, which is the point - both teams were similar in performance and structure, with the Raptors having a slightly better outcome than Cleveland.

Cousins' production was better than Bogut, who only played in 5 games to Cousin's 7. Iguodala's production was also similar, with his game 6 performance being a lot better than his game 7 performance in 2016. Green being suspended was still him missing a game.


You also have to factor in age, mileage, etc. Green regressed a lot since 16', Iggy was 35 by 19'.

That didn't stop Iguodala from putting up 22 points on 9-15 shooting in game 6, while also averaging similar numbers for the series. Not to mention, Green put up triple-double numbers during the series.

I agree, you can say the Warriors were slightly better in 2015-16 in terms of their matchup. But this conversation is A LOT closer than most are willing to admit. I think the matchups were about equal given the overall production and that Toronto took it to 6 games whereas Cleveland went to 7.

[Roundball_Rock]

Yea, but it was toward the end of the 3rd quarter with GS only being up by 3.

Because of him, though. They lost both this game and the game he missed.


The Warriors didn't have Durant in 2015-16, which is the point - both teams were similar in performance and structure

73 wins down to 58, even with KD. One reason it is hard to keep winning is the wear and tear that teams accrue going into June each year not to mention aging (unless older players are replaced by younger players, which GS didn't do).


Cousins' production was better than Bogut, who only played in 5 games to Cousin's 7. Iguodala's production was also similar, with his game 6 performance being a lot better than his game 7 performance in 2016. Green being suspended was still him missing a game.

Cousins wasn't the defender Bogut was and Bogut had ripple effects, namely being forced to use Ezeli who sucked in Game 7.

There are only so many compartments that can be flooded before the Titanic sinks. When you have 5 of your top 7 rotation players and 3 of 5 starters hurt in some fashion, the real surprise is how competitive they remained. Kawhi these days is compared to Kareem, Jordan, and LeBron. He had the Warriors on crutches and put up offensive numbers similar to what Harden did the same year?


That didn't stop Iguodala from putting up 22 points on 9-15 shooting in game 6,

Younger Iggy won FMVP for his defense on LeBron; older Iggy wasn't capable of doing the same on Kawhi. LeBron was roasting the Warriors before Iggy, even with Irving and Love done.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Because of him, though. They lost both this game and the game he missed.



73 wins down to 58, even with KD. One reason it is hard to keep winning is the wear and tear that teams accrue going into June each year not to mention aging (unless older players are replaced by younger players, which GS didn't do).



Cousins wasn't the defender Bogut was and Bogut had ripple effects, namely being forced to use Ezeli who sucked in Game 7.

There are only so many compartments that can be flooded before the Titanic sinks. When you have 5 of your top 7 rotation players and 3 of 5 starters hurt in some fashion, the real surprise is how competitive they remained. Kawhi these days is compared to Kareem, Jordan, and LeBron. He had the Warriors on crutches and put up offensive numbers similar to what Harden did the same year?



Younger Iggy won FMVP for his defense on LeBron; older Iggy wasn't capable of doing the same on Kawhi. LeBron was roasting the Warriors before Iggy, even with Irving and Love done.

The 2016 finals series had a total of 336 minutes and bogut played in 60 minutes. Being around for 18% of the series isn't making a huge difference either way.

Durant/Cousins were the reasons that Warriors won game 5 by a whopping 1 point. Without those two guys playing in that game, raptors close the series 4-1. The same two guys who never even existed in the 2016 finals.

[Axe]

2019 was just the end of the dub dynasty under steve kerr's rule.

[HylianNightmare]

Lebum not fooling the real heads

[NBAGOAT]

not much to say besides this ppg+gmsc differential metric is just moronic haha. You have any analytical basis for this "proprietary metric"? Tbf it doesnt detract much from your overall point but I think you're just greatly understating the difference in supporting cast, mainly defensively. tor was an average offensive team in the playoffs and put up a 116 ortg in the finals, gs was just not nearly the same defensively as they were in 16. When you're playing guys like cook hobbled cousins and older livingston significant minutes, it matters. Draymond's declined a bit too especially offensively, his numbers are not the same.

[HoopsNY]

Because of him, though. They lost both this game and the game he missed.

73 wins down to 58, even with KD. One reason it is hard to keep winning is the wear and tear that teams accrue going into June each year not to mention aging (unless older players are replaced by younger players, which GS didn't do).

True, but we're not talking about an aging Utah Jazz or Houston Rockets teams like we saw in 1998, or even the Spurs in 2013-14. Steph, Klay, Draymond, Cousins, Looney, etc weren't old.


Cousins wasn't the defender Bogut was and Bogut had ripple effects, namely being forced to use Ezeli who sucked in Game 7.

And Bogut isn't the offensive player or rebounder that Cousins was. You're splitting hairs at this point. The two can more or less cancel each other out, which is essentially my point. I disagreed with the OP, but I do see how both teams are closer than many people would like to admit.


There are only so many compartments that can be flooded before the Titanic sinks. When you have 5 of your top 7 rotation players and 3 of 5 starters hurt in some fashion, the real surprise is how competitive they remained. Kawhi these days is compared to Kareem, Jordan, and LeBron. He had the Warriors on crutches and put up offensive numbers similar to what Harden did the same year?

Well, you're right. Kawhi doesn't deserve that comparison, at least not yet.


Younger Iggy won FMVP for his defense on LeBron; older Iggy wasn't capable of doing the same on Kawhi. LeBron was roasting the Warriors before Iggy, even with Irving and Love done.

Younger Iggy won FMVP in 2015. The comparison is between 2016 and 2019.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

not much to say besides this ppg+gmsc differential metric is just moronic haha. You have any analytical basis for this "proprietary metric"? Tbf it doesnt detract much from your overall point but I think you're just greatly understating the difference in supporting cast, mainly defensively. tor was an average offensive team in the playoffs and put up a 116 ortg in the finals, gs was just not nearly the same defensively as they were in 16. When you're playing guys like cook hobbled cousins and older livingston significant minutes, it matters. Draymond's declined a bit too especially offensively, his numbers are not the same.

2019 West finals Warriors faced blazers a top 3 offense and held them to a 106.8 offensive rating from their 114 regular season offensive rating.

[Axe]

2019 West finals Warriors faced blazers a top 3 offense and held them to a 106.8 offensive rating from their 114 regular season offensive rating.
Such a shame those blazers team choked and got swept, despite facing an injury-hobbled dubs team that lost boogie and kd in the prior rounds.

[nashwade]

Stop "comparing" players for pete's sake. Different people have different yardstick to measure what is "better". Some are stat nerds, some watch the games, some are just biased. But who cares

watching an NBA team, down 1-3, come back to win a championship is GOLD

watching an NBA team beat a crippled team to win a championship is boring

[Axe]

Yet the warriors were still heavily favored to win the finals last year, despite losing kd in their series against the rockets. Also, they swept portland too despite the odds.

[Soundwave]

Regular season records are a severely overrated way to measure how good a team is. Sometimes teams have regular season declines for various reasons, especially common in repeating championship teams.

Team's like that eventually get bored of the regular season and simply want to move on to the playoffs, the 73 win Warriors weren't even close to the best Warriors team, the teams with Durant were way better.

The Rockets in 95 similarily were actually a better team than the 94 team despite a far worse regular season record. Adding Drexler added a legit no.2 20 ppg scoring option to the team, that was simply better than what they had the year before.

[SATAN]

Stop "comparing" players for pete's sake. Different people have different yardstick to measure what is "better". Some are stat nerds, some watch the games, some are just biased. But who cares

watching an NBA team, down 1-3, come back to win a championship is GOLD

watching an NBA team beat a crippled team to win a championship is boring

This.

[Uncle Drew]

4 years later and 2016 is still rattling people. Greatest championship in the history of sports, no matter how you try to twist it. We won.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Stop "comparing" players for pete's sake. Different people have different yardstick to measure what is "better". Some are stat nerds, some watch the games, some are just biased. But who cares

watching an NBA team, down 1-3, come back to win a championship is GOLD

watching an NBA team beat a crippled team to win a championship is boring

Curry was playing hurt in 2016 finals and fully healthy in the 2019 finals. Draymond also missed a full game in 2016 just like Klay did in 2019.

Excuse Kawhi for not being down 1-3, he's sorry for being too good. Durant returned game 5 and warriors still only won by 1. No Durant and Kawhi finishes Warriors off 4-1

[SATAN]

:facepalm

[Axe]

4 years later and 2016 is still rattling people. Greatest championship in the history of sports, no matter how you try to twist it. We won.
Yup but no need for you to be an overzealous bandwagon over this shit.

[Turbo Slayer]

Curry was playing hurt in 2016 finals and fully healthy in the 2019 finals. Draymond also missed a full game in 2016 just like Klay did in 2019.

Excuse Kawhi for not being down 1-3, he's sorry for being too good. Durant returned game 5 and warriors still only won by 1. No Durant and Kawhi finishes Warriors off 4-1
Some of your post requires speculation and I don't delve into speculation b/c it's nonsense. We can't forget Cousins injury too and the fact this Warriors team was hit hard in the POs as well in the Finals too.
It's a bit hypocritical coming from you.

[Roundball_Rock]

5 of the Warriors top 7 were injured in 19'. The real question is why the Warriors managed to keep it as close as they did despite being a MASH unit.

[deathawaitu]

Typical Lebron stans so insecure

Having said that, it's the general consensus that Kawhi run was more impressive. Kawhi pretty much beat the same warrior team that Lebron got his ass handed by

Unfortunately Lebron stans can't use injuries as an excuse since they ignored how crippled 2016 warriors were and praise Lebron for beating that crippled team.

Think about it... Lebron needed both a crippled warrior team and help from the commissioner to win that year.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Some of your post requires speculation and I don't delve into speculation b/c it's nonsense. We can't forget Cousins injury too and the fact this Warriors team was hit hard in the POs as well in the Finals too.
It's a bit hypocritical coming from you.

Curry playing hurt in 2016 or Cousins playing hurt in 2019.

I wonder who was more valuable to the warriors? Hahahha laughable.

[NBAGOAT]

Regular season records are a severely overrated way to measure how good a team is. Sometimes teams have regular season declines for various reasons, especially common in repeating championship teams.

Team's like that eventually get bored of the regular season and simply want to move on to the playoffs, the 73 win Warriors weren't even close to the best Warriors team, the teams with Durant were way better.

The Rockets in 95 similarily were actually a better team than the 94 team despite a far worse regular season record. Adding Drexler added a legit no.2 20 ppg scoring option to the team, that was simply better than what they had the year before.

what's also overrated is basing a team's lvl of play off the sum of talent, usually there's a huge bias for offense. agree regular season records arent that indicative but the same people who say that love pointing out results in 6 game series where it can be easily explained by sample size. For example you may have a point about the rockets but I could argue they looked worse in the playoffs up til the Finals where the consensus is orlando choked. Even had 2 of the same matchups as 94 with the jazz and suns. It's just not that clear.

[NBAGOAT]

2019 West finals Warriors faced blazers a top 3 offense and held them to a 106.8 offensive rating from their 114 regular season offensive rating.

and in 16 the warriors held okc 5 below their rs total(108 vs 113). The thing is there's regular season evidence for my point too though coasting is a factor. However, you cant just suddenly put a bunch of weight on playoff series as conclusive evidence when they go 4-7 games. sample size is so small.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

and in 16 the warriors held okc 5 below their rs total(108 vs 113). The thing is there's regular season evidence for my point too though coasting is a factor. However, you cant just suddenly put a bunch of weight on playoff series as conclusive evidence when they go 4-7 games. sample size is so small.

Thunder took warriors to 7 games, LeBron was a game 7 performance better then the choking Durant/Westbrook duo

2019 warriors were never taken to 7 games and they were swept through the west finals.

[Axe]

Thunder took warriors to 7 games, LeBron was a game 7 performance better then the choking Durant/Westbrook duo

2019 warriors were never taken to 7 games and they were swept through the west finals.
Warriors were swept in the wcf last year? 🥴

Gosh, i didn't know that until now.

[light]

LeBron beat the 73-9 Warriors in 3 consecutive games, 2 of them in Oakland, where Golden State hadn't lost 2 consecutive all season long.

That series win was legendary.

The Raptors beating the 57 win Warriors without KD was kind of just meh.

[ELITEpower23]

LeBron beat the 73-9 Warriors in 3 consecutive games, 2 of them in Oakland, where Golden State hadn't lost 2 consecutive all season long.

That series win was legendary.

The Raptors beating the 57 win Warriors without KD was kind of just meh.
Imagine comparing the two :lol

OP = Fail

[ELITEpower23]

So LeBron faced a stronger Warriors version and lead not only every Cav and Warrior from the 2016, but also Kawhi?

FINALS
2019 Kawhi: 28- 10- 4 - 2.0 - 1.2 on 43% fg, 35% 3p
2016 LeBron: 30 - 11 - 9 - 2.6 - 2.3 on 49% fg, 37% 3p

We done here?

[ELITEpower23]

Typical Lebron stans so insecure

Having said that, it's the general consensus that Kawhi run was more impressive. Kawhi pretty much beat the same warrior team that Lebron got his ass handed by

Unfortunately Lebron stans can't use injuries as an excuse since they ignored how crippled 2016 warriors were and praise Lebron for beating that crippled team.

Think about it... Lebron needed both a crippled warrior team and help from the commissioner to win that year.

Imagine saying someone is "insecure" when they have the three greatest chips of all time :lol Funny fellow

[HBK_Kliq_2]

LeBron beat the 73-9 Warriors in 3 consecutive games, 2 of them in Oakland, where Golden State hadn't lost 2 consecutive all season long.

That series win was legendary.

The Raptors beating the 57 win Warriors without KD was kind of just meh.

Kawhi beat warriors 2 straight games in Oakland and didn't have to go 7 games.

73 wins just means they were exhausted by the finals. 2019 curry was fresh because he had Durant helping him all year.

[ELITEpower23]

LeBron >Kawhi on EVERY single level

FINALS
2019 Kawhi: 28- 10- 4 - 2.0 - 1.2 on 43% fg, 35% 3p
2016 LeBron: 30 - 11 - 9 - 2.6 - 2.3 on 49% fg, 37% 3p

We done? :lol

[Axe]

Imagine saying someone is "insecure" when they have the three greatest chips of all time :lol Funny fellow
You just made 3cps in a row, which is very unethical.