Harden with his third straight Scoring Title.

[FromDowntown]

Will pass up Larry Bird in points scored next season too. What a legend.

Appreciate James Harden :applause:

This era has so much talent it's hard to appreciate it all.

https://media.giphy.com/media/l4FGqAePe1Q0jqB6o/giphy.gif

[MrFonzworth]

Amazing how such a scorer still has nightmares about Manu Ginobli.

[LoneyROY7]

The Unguardable One.

[MrFonzworth]

The Unguardable One.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manu_Gin%C3%B3bili

[Proctor]

Amazing how such a scorer still has nightmares about Manu Ginobli.

:roll::roll::roll:

[LoneyROY7]

3 straight scoring titles.

On the verge of two straight 34+ ppg seasons.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/43MXTKiGLaiJKNqHKx/giphy.gif

[Roundball_Rock]

Underappreciated legend. It is ironic on ISH: ISH obsesses over scoring and he is one of the GOAT scorers and the best scorer of his era.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

When you put context behind how he got those scoring titles it's not impressive.

[Roundball_Rock]

When you put context behind how he got those scoring titles it's not impressive.

The hate. :lol He did it on 22 FGA and with 8 APG (on 62% TS). He wasn't taking 30 shots and not passing the ball.

[Axe]

I wish this guy could have dominated the warriors 2 years ago but for some reason, he didn't.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

The hate. :lol He did it on 22 FGA and with 8 APG (on 62% TS). He wasn't taking 30 shots and not passing the ball.

He's cheating the game,all he's doing is taking advantage of today's rules,those scoring titles are cheap.

[StrongLurk]

I give Harden props, yet at the same time can't watch him play a full game.

He is dominating but I had how he plays.

[Airupthere]

All the ghost fouls and uncalled travels

[LoneyROY7]

He's cheating the game,all he's doing is taking advantage of today's rules,those scoring titles are cheap.

Cheating the game?

By beating any defender off the dribble at will, hitting ridiculous stepback 3s every night, and drawing double-teams as soon as he crosses half-court?

[bobopenguin]

Houston loves ringless scoring title.

[Lebron23]

When you put context behind how he got those scoring titles it's not impressive.

Better scorer than the late kobe bryant.

[Lebron23]

Houston loves ringless scoring title.

The guy on your avatar would also be ringless.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Better scorer than the late kobe bryant.

You know that isn't true,moving on.

[uber]

Better scorer than the late kobe bryant.

wtf?


The guy on your avatar would also be ringless.

what?

[ImKobe]

Better scorer than the late kobe bryant.

Why are you so obsessed with him?

Harden isn't as good as Kobe when it comes to overall scoring ability(not nearly as good in midrange & post), but he's arguably the 2nd best scorer since. Definitely not better than Durant, and you could make a case for Kawhi as well. Kawhi's game is more reliable than Harden's 3-Pt chucking and foul-baiting which usually doesn't work well enough against good defenses/smart teams in the Playoffs.

[Doranku]

Underappreciated legend. It is ironic on ISH: ISH obsesses over scoring and he is one of the GOAT scorers and the best scorer of his era.

The problem is.. if he's the best scorer of this era and a GOAT level scorer, why are there 4 players in the league who are better playoff scorers than he is?

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Kobe,Durant,and Kawhi are all better scorers than James Flopper,they don't rely on the refs to give them calls to get to the foul line.They also use the mid-range and can post up.If Harden isn't using the stepback 3 then he's driving to the basket looking to draw a cheap foul.Of course this never works for him in the playoffs which exposes him even more.You had Dwight,CP3 and now Westbrick but still can't get to the finals or win a chip.

[Gudo]

Whether he travelled or not stands out to me more than being amazed by the skill or athleticism by which he scored. Officiating has been inconsistent on his step back jumpers and eurostep. And he gets away with too many nonexistent fouls called against him. Context should always be put when looking at numbers.

[FireDavidKahn]

He's cheating the game,all he's doing is taking advantage of today's rules,those scoring titles are cheap.

If it was so easy we'd be seeing a lot more players doing it:facepalm

[imdaman99]

Houston loves ringless scoring title.

His career isn't done :no: also the guy in your avatar plays the same way as him so stfu

[Roundball_Rock]

all he's doing is taking advantage of today's rules,those scoring titles are cheap.

If it is so easy, why isn't anyone else doing it and scoring an easy 36? :lol


Harden isn't as good as Kobe when it comes to overall scoring ability(not nearly as good in midrange & post)

Since when does midrange scoring and post scoring matter to you? :oldlol: You went pages hyping a guy who is useless as a scorer if he isn't at the rim or behind the arc.


The problem is.. if he's the best scorer of this era and a GOAT level scorer, why are there 4 players in the league who are better playoff scorers than he is?

I assume you are referring to career PPG? He is 3rd in RS average, 7th in PO average among active players.

The answer is obvious: mainly because he was a bench player for about two-fifths of his career playoff games to date. As a #1 option he has averaged 28.2; in OKC 13.8. KD is at 29.1, LeBron 28.9. The other issue is he managed to draw the Warriors defense for a large chunk of his starter/#1 option playoff games.


If it was so easy we'd be seeing a lot more players doing it

Exactly. When he scored 36 last year the next guy was at 28. When Kobe put up 35, Iverson was scoring 33 and LeBron was right behind him. No one is in Harden's league during Harden's peak scoring years. KD? His career high is 32 and his next highest is 30.1.

The only players who averaged 35.0 or more in a season are Wilt, Jordan, Harden, Barry, and Kobe. That's it. If you round up to "35" Kareem, Baylor*, McAdoo join the small list. That is greatness no matter how you spin it.

*He had another season at 37 PPG but didn't play enough games to qualify for the scoring title.

[ELITEpower23]

Wow passing Larry Legend in scoring? And Harden did it in fewer seasons? :bowdown:

[Doranku]

I assume you are referring to career PPG? He is 3rd in RS average, 7th in PO average among active players.

The answer is obvious: mainly because he was a bench player for about two-fifths of his career playoff games to date. As a #1 option he has averaged 28.2; in OKC 13.8. KD is at 29.1, LeBron 28.9. The other issue is he managed to draw the Warriors defense for a large chunk of his starter/#1 option playoff games.



No, I'm actually basing it off the past 3 years (Harden's peak):

Harden, 39 playoff games: 29.5 ppg on 57% TS
Kawhi, 36 playoff games: 29.5 ppg on 64% TS
Durant, 48 playoff games: 29.6 ppg on 65% TS
Bran, 61 playoff games: 31.0 ppg on 62% TS
Curry, 54 playoff games, 27.2 ppg on 63% TS

So Kawhi, Durant, and Bran are inarguable - better or identical scoring on much better efficiency. Steph averaged a couple less ppg but again, he is much more efficient. Toss-up between those two but I'll still take Steph.

[Roundball_Rock]

No, I'm actually basing it off the past 3 years (Harden's peak):

Harden, 39 playoff games: 29.5 ppg on 57% TS
Kawhi, 36 playoff games: 29.5 ppg on 64% TS
Durant, 48 playoff games: 29.6 ppg on 65% TS
Bran, 61 playoff games: 31.0 ppg on 62% TS
Curry, 54 playoff games, 27.2 ppg on 63% TS

So Kawhi, Durant, and Bran are inarguable - better or identical scoring on much better efficiency. Steph averaged a couple less ppg but again, he is much more efficient. Toss-up between those two but I'll still take Steph.

Got it. The issue with "playoff" numbers is teams don't face the same opposition. Those numbers would have to be judged against the quality of defenses they faced.

Here is how his scoring edge compares BTW:

Harden Scoring Edge Compared

Harden 36 (George 28, Giannis 28). Harden +8.
Kobe 35 (Iverson 33, LeBron 31) Kobe +2.
Jordan 37 (Wilkins 29, English 29) Jordan +8.
Kareem 35 (Archibald 28, Havlicek 28). Kareem +7
Wilt 50 (Baylor 38, Bellamy 32) Wilt +12. Note Baylor didn’t technically qualify for the scoring title.

I looked at how he did against the Warriors defense and compared it to other perimeter stars. These numbers are FG %--I don't feel like looking them up again to adjust for TS %--but I will note TS % favors Harden because he takes so many threes, FT's (and is a very good FT shooter) so he would look even better if you updated these for TS %.

Harden against the Warriors

2015 WCF: 28/8/6 on 47%
2016 1st round: 27/5/8 on 41%
2018 WCF: 29/6/6 on 42%
2019 WCSF: 35/7/6 on 44%

How did other perimeter stars do against the same defense (I didn't include LeBron on the theory that he isn't a "peer" of Harden but mention him later)?

2016: Lillard 32/4/8 on 36%
2016: Durant 30/8/3 on 42%
2016: Westbrook 27/7/11 on 40%
2017: Lillard 28/5/3 on 43%
2018: Paul 20/7/5 on 41%
2019: Paul 17/7/6 on 44%
2019: Lillard 22/5/6 on 37%
2019: Leonard 29/10/4 on 43%

So Harden shot poorly against the Warriors--but so did everybody else. LeBron is the one major exception. He shot 40% in 15’ but shot well against the Warriors after that but LeBron is on another tier than these players so that is to be expected.

[ArbitraryWater]

Shame he won't be getting the 35 ppg average

He started off the season EVEN better than last year, did 39/8 on 46% FG/38% 3P/86% FT through 36/35 played games, absolutely absurd.

And still did 36/7/7 on 44% FG/36% 3P/87% FT through 50/47 played games.

He dipped from that 36 ppg average by only doing 29 ppg the next 13 games before COVID.

Crazy good.

[Stephonit]

In recent years there are 4 players who float above the others in their own realm where they fight each other for the grand prize: Curry, Durant, Kawhi and LeBron.

Harden is in his own tier just below it.

[Facepalm]

In recent years there are 4 players who float above the others in their own realm where they fight each other for the grand prize: Curry, Durant, Kawhi and LeBron.

Harden is in his own tier just below it.

Not Durant. His chips have an*. He needs to win with his own team to compare to James, Curry and Kawhi

[Axe]

In recent years there are 4 players who float above the others in their own realm where they fight each other for the grand prize: Curry, Durant, Kawhi and LeBron.

Harden is in his own tier just below it.
Welcome back :cheers: