It was called a regular foul at the time. Game went on as usual.

[Kblaze8855]

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/CluelessActualAmazondolphin-size_restricted.gif




https://thumbs.gfycat.com/NaturalRemoteLaughingthrush-size_restricted.gif




But the media made a big deal of it and forced the nba to review it and make it a flagrant later. That’s around the time the softening began. It took years to take over but it was starting. Review....

You settle it on the court. It was a physical series vs the Celtics. Hands might be put on you. Maybe your fans too if they talk too greasy over there:





https://thumbs.gfycat.com/BountifulAccomplishedAlaskankleekai-size_restricted.gif





And it was fine. Nobody hid the children. Just play on.

That was playoff ball. You don’t just compete within the confines of the game. You are in a contest of wills. You want a ring you need to beat us. Not just as putting a ball in a basket. You might have to beat our ass to advance. Or at least let it be known you’re willing to take it there.

Had to respect the champs more. You know they had a series of true conflicts to get what they got. You can win 4-5 rings these days with your knuckles never scuffing a jaw. Everybody stays pretty. Nobody has to hear from their friends how such and such not only eliminated you....but stomped your friend out with impunity as you stood there like a bitch.

Stakes were higher. Oh well. Watch your “tough” little series play out.....

[Shooter]

Most of your posts seem to be very level-headed so I'll pardon you on this one but let's take a step back and assess reality.

You're saying basketball was 'better' when less skilled players could attack the opposing team and potentially injure him? You want to see a game where Dexter Pitman is punching Jordan in the head and they both get ejected?

You want to reward the less skilled goons that cannot hang in a skill-filled game by allowing them to punch and attack opposing team players?

DUMB

[starface]

Meh.

It’s definitely too soft in terms of physical body-to-body stuff. Too many foul calls.

Im not that keen to see the most skilled basketball players in the world resort to boxing.

I agree it was “tougher” back then. Not convinced that makes it “better.”

[LoneyROY7]

https://media.tenor.com/images/6006221645cd35feca85d058d0345875/tenor.gif

[starface]

Most of your posts seem to be very level-headed so I'll pardon you on this one but let's take a step back and assess reality.

You're saying basketball was 'better' when less skilled players could attack the opposing team and potentially injure him? You want to see a game where Dexter Pitman is punching Jordan in the head and they both get ejected?

You want to reward the less skilled goons that cannot hang in a skill-filled game by allowing them to punch and attack opposing team players?

DUMB


:biggums:

We wrote the same post at the same time :lol

[Shooter]

:biggums:

We wrote the same post at the same time :lol

Goats gon' goat :cheers:

[Kblaze8855]

Imagine a series between the Clippers and Lakers after Paul George chokes Lebron and Leonard gives him 3 to the face:




https://thumbs.gfycat.com/EnormousAdvancedKakapo-size_restricted.gif


And it had happened to some degree 3 times before that.


The rivalries were just way more personal. This is Bird giving Laimbeer the ground and pound hammer fists 2 games before the ones in the OP:


https://thumbs.gfycat.com/PepperyThinIceblueredtopzebra-size_restricted.gif





Old people don’t say the league is soft now just out of nostalgia. The best teams for a long time literally hated each other and fought all the time. The Lakers and Celtics, Celtics and pistons, and worst the Celtics and 76ers....

Later the Bulls and Pistons...then Knicks and....humans.



https://thumbs.gfycat.com/FrightenedAdoredGalapagoshawk-size_restricted.gif



You couldn’t just go play. The other team was at some point gonna best your ass if you didn’t get them first.


Even if you don’t understand liking that kind of basketball....you have to get how it was more compelling.


Im almost 100% sure James Harden isn’t gonna get punched in the face these playoffs. In 1985 I could be almost 100% sure 3-4 guys would at least consider it.


I can’t miss that.

[red1]

the nba is definitely soft as hell. its like soccer - purely a finesse game now.



I dont know if the stakes were higher when the game was more physical. I'd say they're higher now because of the increased pool of players. you have the best european prospect of his era in the league already. he's going to be an nba product and not a euroleague product - hold that L Euroleague. luka>>>> spanoulis :oldlol:

not to mention the higher stakes nowadays because of the increased eyeballs. if a player sucks they never stop hearing about it - you can ask playoff pee. he was probably considering deleting his social media accounts. :oldlol:

[Shooter]

Low IQ thread :(

[Kblaze8855]

Most of your posts seem to be very level-headed so I'll pardon you on this one but let's take a step back and assess reality.

You're saying basketball was 'better' when less skilled players could attack the opposing team and potentially injure him? You want to see a game where Dexter Pitman is punching Jordan in the head and they both get ejected?

You want to reward the less skilled goons that cannot hang in a skill-filled game by allowing them to punch and attack opposing team players?

DUMB


They....didn’t...both get ejected. The nba was like 35 years in before a fight mandated an ejection.

It was rarely a full fledged fight. They happened. Someone might land a real punch like:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WillingPleasantArabianwildcat-size_restricted.gif





But for the most part it was more....chippy I’d say.

Most stars weren’t hands on. Now...Bird and Isiah Thomas would just punch you in the face.

Most stars had a goon or two for that.

The basketball itself? That’s largely era dependent far as what you like. But rest assured....if James Harden were being guarded by a guy who slapped him in the face in game 2 you would have a lot more to talk about.

From a coverage and entertainment point of view....it was just a more enthralling sport.

[red1]

IMO the current league is as exciting as ever. and I've been watching casually since I was a kid in the late 90's


I guess there were perks to the game in the 80's though. I'd love to see someone do this to harden.


https://thumbs.gfycat.com/CluelessActualAmazondolphin-size_restricted.gif




https://thumbs.gfycat.com/NaturalRemoteLaughingthrush-size_restricted.gif

[Kblaze8855]

the nba is definitely soft as hell. its like soccer - purely a finesse game now.



I dont know if the stakes were higher when the game was more physical. I'd say they're higher now because of the increased pool of players. you have the best european prospect of his era in the league already. he's going to be an nba product and not a euroleague product - hold that L Euroleague. luka>>>> spanoulis :oldlol:

not to mention the higher stakes nowadays because of the increased eyeballs. if a player sucks they never stop hearing about it - you can ask playoff pee. he was probably considering deleting his social media accounts. :oldlol:


More embarrassing....you shoot 3-12 and fans laugh....or...you shoot 3-12 and the guy guarding you calls you a pu$$y in front of your kids and slaps you in the face.

You play them again in 2 days.

Which situation do you expect to get more attention toon and which gets you more motivated to prove yourself?

[LoneyROY7]

They....didn’t...both get ejected. The nba was like 35 years in before a fight mandated an ejection.

It was rarely a full fledged fight. They happened. Someone might land a real punch like:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WillingPleasantArabianwildcat-size_restricted.gif





But for the most part it was more....chippy I’d say.

Most stars weren’t hands on. Now...Bird and Isiah Thomas would just punch you in the face.

Most stars had a goon or two for that.

The basketball itself? That’s largely era dependent far as what you like. But rest assured....if James Harden were being guarded by a guy who slapped him in the face in game 2 you would have a lot more to talk about.

From a coverage and entertainment point of view....it was just a more enthralling sport.

You really got Harden on the mind, huh? :lol

[Shooter]

You really got Harden on the mind, huh? :lol

:lol Harden's Game Score for the series is out of control, anything over 25 is IMPRESSIVE and he is at 26.2

[LoneyROY7]

:lol Harden's Game Score for the series is out of control, anything over 25 is IMPRESSIVE and he is at 26.2

He's been stellar so far, and feels like he's just revving up for the epic 2nd round match-up.

[red1]

More embarrassing....you shoot 3-12 and fans laugh....or...you shoot 3-12 and the guy guarding you calls you a pu$$y in front of your kids and slaps you in the face.

You play them again in 2 days.

Which situation do you expect to get more attention toon and which gets you more motivated to prove yourself?
I guess you're saying it was more physical and the competition was dirtier which is a fair point. from a fan and player perspective the stakes are just as high.

I'd say because of the star power of players nowadays and the growth of the nba overall you have more people paying attention to the biggest games, so the stakes are just as high. everyone wants to win.

[Kblaze8855]

Of course it’s exciting but if Luka were to say....give Morris the Danny Ainge treatment? Just scoops and slams him like Danny did Ralph Sampson or just gives him a:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/YellowishTenderGoat-size_restricted.gif


Let him know he’s not to be disrespected?


We both know that next matchup is “Stop what you’re doing” tv.

People think I mean a basketball game is better with fights. I’m saying....basketball is more compelling with intense physical rivalries. And if you remember them you understand.

It’s not about “better” it’s about compelling. And every single one of you know a series would be the talk of the sports world if two mega stars were going at it like Bird and Doc after that fight(well...those fights). Imagine Giannis and Lebron have the history Bird and Doc did and you get this madness:





https://thumbs.gfycat.com/NaturalScornfulAllosaurus-size_restricted.gif



https://thumbs.gfycat.com/AcclaimedComplexEarwig-size_restricted.gif






Sports would end.


You talking social media shit?


The guy on the wrong end of that?


Not only did you get in a fight last week and his boy choked you while he gave you 3 the hard way....they also beat up one of your fans...you choked at the line....and he wet a 3 for the win.



You would have to throw your phone away and go into hiding.


The stakes just get higher.

[Kblaze8855]

You really got Harden on the mind, huh? :lol


I was thinking along the lines of a Harden/Luka similar player matchup that gets personal but....yea. He’d be the type to get roughed up a bit. And he might be better for it. I’m not even saying he’d fold. I’m saying....the ratings for follow up matchups would be insane.

[LoneyROY7]

I was thinking along the lines of a Harden/Luka similar player matchup that gets personal but....yea. He’d be the type to get roughed up a bit. And he might be better for it. I’m not even saying he’d fold. I’m saying....the ratings for follow up matchups would be insane.

Harden is legit one of the strongest players in the NBA...easily the strongest guard. I'd be interested in who'd be roughing him up.

[red1]

Of course it’s exciting but if Luka were to say....give Morris the Danny Ainge treatment? Just scoops and slams him like Danny did Ralph Sampson or just gives him a:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/YellowishTenderGoat-size_restricted.gif


Let him know he’s not to be disrespected?


We both know that next matchup is “Stop what you’re doing” tv.

People think I mean a basketball game is better with fights. I’m saying....basketball is more compelling with intense physical rivalries. And if you remember them you understand.

It’s not about “better” it’s about compelling. And every single one of you know a series would be the talk of the sports world if two mega stars were going at it like Bird and Doc after that fight(well...those fights). Imagine Giannis and Lebron have the history Bird and Doc did and you get this madness:





https://thumbs.gfycat.com/NaturalScornfulAllosaurus-size_restricted.gif



https://thumbs.gfycat.com/AcclaimedComplexEarwig-size_restricted.gif






Sports would end.


You talking social media shit?


The guy on the wrong end of that?


Not only did you get in a fight last week and his boy choked you while he gave you 3 the hard way....they also beat up one of your fans...you choked at the line....and he wet a 3 for the win.



You would have to throw your phone away and go into hiding.


The stakes just get higher.



hey man I'd be with it if they wanted to add trash talk and physical play back into the game. I think its a great idea- less technicals and fouls.


Im just saying as a biased fan if my favorite teams and favorite players are in it then Im already invested. and yeah social media can make you more invested if you get to follow the game closer and get to trashtalk players and you know they'll read that shit. :oldlol:

[Proctor]

Harden is legit one of the strongest players in the NBA...easily the strongest guard. I'd be interested in who'd be roughing him up.

https://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1076137/elbow.gif

[Kblaze8855]

You didn’t need to be stronger than a guy to go at him. I’ve seen Isiah Thomas take on Kevin Willis, Rick Mahorn, Barkley, and Ewing. He couldn’t beat any of them but he was more trying to establish a mentality for the team.

[iamgine]

That does not seem like it should be part of basketball.

Seems up there with 'lemme just slide my foot under your foot here while you're shooting'.

[Kblaze8855]

I’d say there’sa difference between tempers boiling over in a physical contest and out right cheating the sport. Like the difference between a hard playoff foul and kicking a guy in the nuts. Both physical but.... you know.

[clutchinho]

Unfortunately for America, the fighting occurs outside of the gladiatorial arenas now while inside it is just a controlled circle jerk.

What a shame

[NuggetsFan]

I think where the league really changed was with the Bulls/Pistons. MJ/Pippen/Phil Jackson spoke out against there physical tactics, and if memory served me correctly even went to the league office. NBA/marketing realized the skill/finesse was the selling point and not your average NBA player using physicality to make an impact.

Somewhere in the early/mid 90's the NBA realized that basketball was far closer to soccer than it was to football/hockey/lacrosse etc. IMO.

[Shooter]

I think where the league really changed was with the Bulls/Pistons. MJ/Pippen/Phil Jackson spoke out against there physical tactics, and if memory served me correctly even went to the league office. NBA/marketing realized the skill/finesse was the selling point and not your average NBA player using physicality to make an impact.

Somewhere in the early/mid 90's the NBA realized that basketball was far closer to soccer than it was to football/hockey/lacrosse etc. IMO.

+1

[clutchinho]

I think where the league really changed was with the Bulls/Pistons. MJ/Pippen/Phil Jackson spoke out against there physical tactics, and if memory served me correctly even went to the league office. NBA/marketing realized the skill/finesse was the selling point and not your average NBA player using physicality to make an impact.

Somewhere in the early/mid 90's the NBA realized that basketball was far closer to soccer than it was to football/hockey/lacrosse etc. IMO.

Disagree with this take. Basketball is a stop start sport with plenty of upper body contact. It is way closer to something like football that soccer

In soccer players generally are not body on body with other players due to the size of the pitch , not to mention stoppages in play are far less common due to less whistles. Nobody is going to fight when it means you will end up costing your team a goal

[clutchinho]

Look at that Marcus Morris ejection today if you want to see what's wrong with the NBA. Did he perhaps give Luka an oowie? Yes he did. Did he swipe in the direction of the ball? Yes he did. Did Luka forearm him in the chest first ? Yes he did. Common foul and play on. Instead we have an ejection and widespread condemnation.

For what reason? Because he's Marcus Morris? Because he's not on Lebrons team? I fail to understand it except to say that shit makes me ashamed to be a NBA fan

[iamgine]

I’d say there’sa difference between tempers boiling over in a physical contest and out right cheating the sport. Like the difference between a hard playoff foul and kicking a guy in the nuts. Both physical but.... you know.

I'd say there's a difference between hard playoff foul and hammering a guy in the face. The latter seems more like what Bynum did to JJ.

I love it though, but that's not part of basketball.

[starface]

https://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1076137/elbow.gif


:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Reggie43]

Yeah nobody gets tested nowadays, they get to waltz around the court protected by the refs and the rule changes. I dont know about the fights but they need to bring back some sort of physicality back to the game and not handicap the defense too much. Defense and hustle are the most exciting parts of the game for me which makes the modern games almost unwatchable.

[Whoah10115]

I don't like that Bad Boys defense. And I'm a Knicks fan, but I think they were over the top and dirty in a way that wasn't basketball. And I do think there should be a flagrant or whatever for outright punching a guy in the face.

As far as Morris and Luka...that was a dirty play by Morris, and especially dirty because Luka had his back to him. He hit him twice, the second one out of line.

The problem turns out that we can't have progress without people going too far with it. Some of the flagrants that are called, some of the fouls that are called...ridiculous.

And these lack of calls not only highlight but magnify what some stars are able to get away with. Whether it's Harden and his travelling (or any other player and his travelling, as I think they'd be better off changing the rule at this point), or LeBron with his endless stiff arms and subsequent and-1s (which can be outrageous)...all of the soft calls go one way down the stretch of a lot of games.

Along with this awful defense...I mean a defender lets the shooter shoot...no hand up, as if he's daring him...why would you dare him to shoot?

[Axe]

Most of your posts seem to be very level-headed so I'll pardon you on this one but let's take a step back and assess reality.

You're saying basketball was 'better' when less skilled players could attack the opposing team and potentially injure him? You want to see a game where Dexter Pitman is punching Jordan in the head and they both get ejected?

You want to reward the less skilled goons that cannot hang in a skill-filled game by allowing them to punch and attack opposing team players?

DUMB
Permaban worthy

[Marchesk]

Imagine a series between the Clippers and Lakers after Paul George chokes Lebron and Leonard gives him 3 to the face:


https://thumbs.gfycat.com/EnormousAdvancedKakapo-size_restricted.gif


Imagine if it was Luka being choked by George while Leonard punched him in the face. Downtown Dallas would burn these days.

[Marchesk]

I don't think Morris should have been ejected, just a technical. It was a hard playoff foul with a little bit enforcement. Luka hasn't been entirely innocent.

If you can't give hard playoff fouls at the rim without worrying about getting tossed, then it's much more likely for players to get and ones with soft fouls. Marcus did make sure Luka had no chance at getting ball in the hoop.

But the league doesn't need to be like the 80s and before. You don't want to risk a Rudy Tomjonavic incident (70s). That was horrible.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jq-7ge0oiik

You also don't want another Malice in the Palace.

[Kblaze8855]

I’d like to know where people got the idea that the physical parts aren’t a normal part of basketball. You know the first organized game of basketball was stopped early by Dr.Naismith because of a fight right? Literally the first one. They didn’t complete one game of basketball before a massive brawl jumped off. And it was physical all through the next 100 years.

This is from when the Lakers played the gotdamn globetrotters of all teams:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WhisperedLightCaracal-size_restricted.gif



A small fight broke out after.


Dolph Schayes played with a cast for much of a season and apparently used it as a weapon. Physical altercations were common in basketball from literally the 1890s till the mid 2000. You can not like it and think it shouldn’t be in the game all you like. Fact is....it was part of the game for 100+ years.


Literally game one after the peach baskets went up:



I showed them two peach baskets I'd nailed up at each end of the gym, and I told them the idea was to throw the ball into the opposing team's peach basket. I blew a whistle, and the first game of basketball began. ...


The boys began tackling, kicking and punching in the clinches. They ended up in a free-for-all in the middle of the gym floor.

It certainly was murder.


The nba deciding that for marketing reasons physicality and defense were to be reduced doesn’t mean that’s real basketball.

Basketball everywhere in the world is a physical contest. We used to mock the “soft” euros but they are a lot tougher than the nba players are allowed to be now.

To me getting hard fouled is no more breaking the rules than this:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/HealthyPlushGiantschnauzer-size_restricted.gif


But that’s entertainment so it’s “real”.


The game played today is no more real than the 80s. Less so to me.

We like dunks and fancy gathers so we create a “zero” step to legitimize traveling. We let everyone carry so Giannis, KD, and Lebron can seem to have tight handles then make fun of tall players from the past for not having handles as if guys like Kemp couldn’t be point forwards without dribbling rules.

Getting bumped makes it not be basketball but not having to follow the basic rules of movement? No. That’s still basketball.

It’s crazy to me.

[warriorfan]

Maybe we will get lucky and see someone get killed.

[Kblaze8855]

Maybe we will get lucky and see someone get killed.

I suspect Lebron could handle a bump or two. Perhaps even being held up a bit off the ball. Much smaller players dealt with much more. The league just convinced you these superathletes need to be treated with kid gloves and never having seen anything else it’s easy to believe.

[tpols]

it's like that in all sports nowadays. the optics are too bad after malice in the palace, there's too much money in sports now to have some crazy incident go down. that event all started with a ben wallace ron artest fight.

[Kblaze8855]

Fans are just as soft now. This is from a topic with Heat fans calling Kirk Hinrich a thug in 2013:

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2388955/lebronRB_medium.gif

[iamgine]

I’d like to know where people got the idea that the physical parts aren’t a normal part of basketball. You know the first organized game of basketball was stopped early by Dr.Naismith because of a fight right? Literally the first one. They didn’t complete one game of basketball before a massive brawl jumped off. And it was physical all through the next 100 years.

This is from when the Lakers played the gotdamn globetrotters of all teams:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WhisperedLightCaracal-size_restricted.gif



A small fight broke out after.


Dolph Schayes played with a cast for much of a season and apparently used it as a weapon. Physical altercations were common in basketball from literally the 1990s till the mid 2000. You can not like it and think it shouldn’t be in the game all you like. Fact is....it was part of the game for 100+ years.


Literally game one after the peach baskets went up:





The nba deciding that for marketing reasons physicality and defense were to be reduced doesn’t mean that’s real basketball.

Basketball everywhere in the world is a physical contest. We used to mock the “soft” euros but they are a lot tougher than the nba players are allowed to be now.

To me getting hard fouled is no more breaking the rules than this:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/HealthyPlushGiantschnauzer-size_restricted.gif


But that’s entertainment so it’s “real”.


The game played today is no more real than the 80s. Less so to me.

We like dunks and fancy gathers so we create a “zero” step to legitimize traveling. We let everyone carry so Giannis, KD, and Lebron can seem to have tight handles then make fun of tall players from the past for not having handles as if guys like Kemp couldn’t be point forwards without dribbling rules.

Getting bumped makes it not be basketball but not having to follow the basic rules of movement? No. That’s still basketball.

It’s crazy to me.

Uh you posted a guy hammerfisting another guy. Hard foul is one thing but I don't consider that Artest to Harden type of physical altercation part of basketball. Fighting is common in team sports like basketball, soccer, baseball, hockey, etc. Even fights break regularly in my rec league. It's something that naturally happen when you put ultra competitive people against each other but it's not part of the sport.

[Shogon]

https://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1076137/elbow.gif

:roll::roll::roll:

[Marchesk]

Artest would have killed someone in the 80s.

[Marchesk]

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/HealthyPlushGiantschnauzer-size_restricted.gif

LOL, how many steps was that?

[Kblaze8855]

And if I remember correctly that’s also when Bosh was complaining about the Bulls playing too hard diving for loose balls and all putting him at risk. The league was already soft then and got a lot worse.

Im not talking punching people in the face. That’s just funny to me. I’m talking just....games being more physical contests seeming to make the players more invested and make it more interesting.

In all likelihood there wouldn’t be an outright fight. I just don’t need people kicked out over nothing. There is a happy medium and that was probably the early to mid 2000s but the league didn’t like all those 78 point scores so that couldn’t stand.

[Shogon]

I’d like to know where people got the idea that the physical parts aren’t a normal part of basketball. You know the first organized game of basketball was stopped early by Dr.Naismith because of a fight right? Literally the first one. They didn’t complete one game of basketball before a massive brawl jumped off. And it was physical all through the next 100 years.

This is from when the Lakers played the gotdamn globetrotters of all teams:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WhisperedLightCaracal-size_restricted.gif



A small fight broke out after.


Dolph Schayes played with a cast for much of a season and apparently used it as a weapon. Physical altercations were common in basketball from literally the 1990s till the mid 2000. You can not like it and think it shouldn’t be in the game all you like. Fact is....it was part of the game for 100+ years.


Literally game one after the peach baskets went up:





The nba deciding that for marketing reasons physicality and defense were to be reduced doesn’t mean that’s real basketball.

Basketball everywhere in the world is a physical contest. We used to mock the “soft” euros but they are a lot tougher than the nba players are allowed to be now.

To me getting hard fouled is no more breaking the rules than this:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/HealthyPlushGiantschnauzer-size_restricted.gif


But that’s entertainment so it’s “real”.


The game played today is no more real than the 80s. Less so to me.

We like dunks and fancy gathers so we create a “zero” step to legitimize traveling. We let everyone carry so Giannis, KD, and Lebron can seem to have tight handles then make fun of tall players from the past for not having handles as if guys like Kemp couldn’t be point forwards without dribbling rules.

Getting bumped makes it not be basketball but not having to follow the basic rules of movement? No. That’s still basketball.

It’s crazy to me.

:roll:

:applause:
:applause:


BTW, that's gotta be Corey Brewer right? Lol.

[Marchesk]

In all likelihood there wouldn’t be an outright fight. I just don’t need people kicked out over nothing. There is a happy medium and that was probably the early to mid 2000s but the league didn’t like all those 78 point scores so that couldn’t stand.

I agree with that. As Paul Pierce said at halftime, in his day the Morris foul was just a hard playoff foul. Give him a technical for excessiveness, but don't eject him.

But intentional elbows to the head or kicks to the groin should still be suspensions.

[warriorfan]

I suspect Lebron could handle a bump or two. Perhaps even being held up a bit off the ball. Much smaller players dealt with much more. The league just convinced you these superathletes need to be treated with kid gloves and never having seen anything else it’s easy to believe.

In all seriousness there could be more rivalries and rough competition. It got like that in the Finals with the Warriors and Cavs a few years ago. They were letting them play. It would be nice if they called games like that all the time. It’s kind of unfortunate that they are playing basically two hand touch for the whole season and they only let them tackle in the finals. But like people said before, people wanna see cross over step back 3’s, not guards getting held and taken out by cheap shots. There’s too much money involved too. These owners don’t want to see their 100 million guarenteed paid guys go at it like it’s the Roman coliseum.

[Kblaze8855]

If Baron Davis could do all this shit I suspect Kyrie and Curry would still be exciting with the early 2000s interpretations:



https://youtu.be/mcvWx93Q9VE


Just like Kenny Anderson and dozens before him. You can take ankles vs physical defenses too.

[tpols]

I agree with that. As Paul Pierce said at halftime, in his day the Morris foul was just a hard playoff foul. Give him a technical for excessiveness, but don't eject him.

But intentional elbows to the head or kicks to the groin should still be suspensions.

That ejection was a build up of things. Morris has been throwing racially charged insults at him for 5 games and generally just trying to goon him everywhere he goes. And the league made it clear with the zingis ejection, where he literally didn't even touch anybody, that the mavs cant protect themselves. That was a hard chop to the back of the head/neck. Thats illegal even in the UFC.

[imdaman99]

I used to get in fights all the time, if only to send a message to my teammates that we go all out. But this is playground basketball and then these guys I got into fights with, never put me down for next if I came late :lol suffice to say I calmed down with the trash talk and fighting and everyone at my park loves me :pimp: (outside of a couple of couple of ball hogging youngins)

[Kblaze8855]

That ejection was a build up of things. Morris has been throwing racially charged insults at him for 5 games and generally just trying to goon him everywhere he goes. And the league made it clear with the zingis ejection, where he literally didn't even touch anybody, that the mavs cant protect themselves. That was a hard chop to the back of the head/neck. Thats illegal even in the UFC.

Hard chop? I’ve been hit harder in games by people who loved me.

Luka is not that soft. He can take that and much more. Guys are just conditioned to collapse and pretend to be hurt to sell blows.

Hit him exactly that in the supermarket. He gonna turn around and ask what the hell is wrong with you. He won’t go down and hold his head. Guys don’t do that in actual fights.

Big ass dudes like Lebron falling all over the place. Shameful.

[Shogon]

Hard chop? I’ve been hit harder in games by people who loved me.

Luka is not that soft. He can take that and much more. Guys are just conditioned to collapse and pretend to be hurt to sell blows.

Hit him exactly that in the supermarket. He gonna turn around and ask what the hell is wrong with you. He won’t go down and hold his head. Guys don’t do that in actual fights.

Big ass dudes like Lebron falling all over the place. Shameful.

:applause:

[Norcaliblunt]

Hard chop? I’ve been hit harder in games by people who loved me.

Luka is not that soft. He can take that and much more. Guys are just conditioned to collapse and pretend to be hurt to sell blows.

Hit him exactly that in the supermarket. He gonna turn around and ask what the hell is wrong with you. He won’t go down and hold his head. Guys don’t do that in actual fights.

Big ass dudes like Lebron falling all over the place. Shameful.

I’ve always said this when it comes to flopping. On the street it would take someone UFC MMAing one of these big mofos to maybe get them to drop, but in a basketball game they are flopping all over the place off barely any contact.

[tpols]

When players flop they never have the type of reaction Luka had... they lay on the ground, roll around, grab their head, and sell it. Luka got immediately up wasn't on the floor for half a second, and wanted to fight him. Players just dont do that after flopping. That was a legit malicious hit. He threw the arm down on the back of his head exactly how Parish did it from behind, albeit he only gave one chop.

[Marchesk]

Still waiting on the Jordan flop compilation.

[Norcaliblunt]

I just wish they would mic them up so we could actually hear the shit talk. Sell us the obscene broadcast on PPV.

[tpols]

Please show us where Luka "sold" something in the clip. He didn't pretend to be injured and was clearly hit with enough force to be dropped.

It was from behind too so he couldnt even see it coming to brace.

Got immediately up and wanted to fight.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFUvGiYQ2cw

[Gudo]

League nowadays is like, let me score, imma let you score. Lets see who has better skills.

[Marchesk]

Please show us where Luka "sold" something in the clip. He didn't pretend to be injured and was clearly hit with enough force to be dropped.

It was from behind too so he couldnt even see it coming to brace.

Got immediately up and wanted to fight.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFUvGiYQ2cw

Just noticed that Kawhi was slowly walking over, scratching his head. :oldlol:

[Kblaze8855]

I’ll just say this....go get hit. You would be surprised how hard it is to be “dropped”.

Especially with a hit to the head. Jaw? Ok. It hurts. Tooth or something. You don’t even feel a head blow. You feel pressure but you immediately realize you’re fine. Head rings. But you’re fine.

I distinctly remember being mad at myself the first time I really got hit in the face. I fell and then got back up and later wondered why I fell at all. People acted like I got knocked out or something. Then you grow up and realize you can straight walk through shit.

Punch me in the stomach I might collapse. Hit me in the head with your hand? Nah.

Its just the nature of sports though. You get hit you go down. But the Players in real fights? They only go down when they get truly trucked like Laimbeer on Daugherty. When they really wanna fight they brush off those blows like Kobe and Chris Childs.

Tyson isn’t out there. Nba players don’t hit that hard. I remember saying that in like 02 on here and some kid tells me an nba player would tear my jaw off then the Malice in the palace and a fat ball boy takes I think 2 from Ron Artest and a running haymaker from Jermaine O’Neal and only fell because he slipped and got up fine.

An untrained punch from an nba player is not gonna do you in.

Those guys hit the floor when they get hit because that’s what instinct tells them to do.

Like Lebron falling 2 Manute Bols when Nazr pushed him. They don’t fall because they got hit hard. They fall because taking it like a man doesn’t get the other guy in trouble.

[Manny98]

https://media.tenor.com/images/6006221645cd35feca85d058d0345875/tenor.gif
:oldlol:

[Kblaze8855]

If the cloud behaves like this it needs to be yelled at:






https://thumbs.gfycat.com/CraftyAgedChuckwalla-size_restricted.gif

[tpols]

Lebron clearly flopped on the nazr play. He could've won an emmy for that. If you were running full speed at the rim, in the air, and I grabbed you by the back of your neck from behind and yanked as hard as I could you would fall. Take two people of equal sizes anybody would.

It just goes against the definition of flopping for a player to get mad after doing it. Why would I be infuriated at you after I flopped? By the definition of the word I didn't really get hit. If I harden'ed you, why would I be mad at you? If anything you'd be mad at me.

Luka's reaction and just a simple look at the footage show that he legit got hit. Morris yanked him as hard as he could.

[Marchesk]

https://i.postimg.cc/LXbtC7kM/Lebron-Flop.gif

Like this one where this legitimate contact on a box out (not a foul), but there is noway somebody Lebron's size is going flying in the other direction to the floor like that.

[Kblaze8855]

As hard as he could? You on some Pauk shit now. I remember him telling me Nazr shoved Lebron with “all his strength”.

Some of you guys don’t seem to have been in many conflicts. The Morris twins and a couple guards took on most of the Kentucky football team once in a fight. You think he’s hitting Luka as hard as he could in a game?

He is a lot stronger than that and Luka is a lot tougher. These people are hard fouling by basketball standards not swinging for the fences like a real fight.

[tpols]

https://i.postimg.cc/LXbtC7kM/Lebron-Flop.gif

Like this one where this legitimate contact on a box out (not a foul), but there is noway somebody Lebron's size is going flying in the other direction to the floor like that.

exactly, and lebron wasn't mad. that was a legit flop. if somebody truly violently threw you to the ground you would be angry.

[Kblaze8855]

Red
https://i.postimg.cc/LXbtC7kM/Lebron-Flop.gif

Like this one where this legitimate contact on a box out (not a foul), but there is noway somebody Lebron's size is going flying in the other direction to the floor like that.


https://thumbs.gfycat.com/HardtofindFortunateHectorsdolphin-size_restricted.gif

[tpols]

Also, as far as not falling after getting hit... what happened to Rudy T?

He took just one punch and almost died. Fractured his whole head and was leaking spinal fluid into his mouth.

[Kblaze8855]

Rudy obviously took a real “fight” punch he also ran into back when players had real fights. That’s what happens when someone actually hits you with everything they have. Most of the time it’s falling for effect. Sometimes you get the rare double fall when both sides want to make the ref acknowledge it:


https://thumbs.gfycat.com/PeriodicNeighboringCondor-size_restricted.gif



You can’t knock a grown man down like that unless a ref is near.

[Gudo]

Basketball is meant to be a physical sport. If you are going for a solid boxout and the other guys just flops his way down, I dont know how else you want to play this game.

[tpols]

Basketball is meant to be a physical sport. If you are going for a solid boxout and the other guys just flops his way down, I dont know how else you want to play this game.

Funny thing is I just got done watching a couple rodman series and documentaries and he was basically the defensive version of james harden. He used to hit guys and then flop like crazy when they would get mad. Get em into all types of foul troubles and ejections with his flopping, arm hooking and then acting like you had him tangled up.

[Kblaze8855]

Of course he was.

Dennis wanted to piss you off so you lose it. He was absolutely a dirty player, a flopper, and a cheap shot artist all in one while somehow not being soft. Truly unique.

[FKAri]

Basketball is meant to be a physical sport. If you are going for a solid boxout and the other guys just flops his way down, I dont know how else you want to play this game.

Everyone draws the line at different places when they say "physical", even league officials. And they change their minds from day to day; play to play. As a result the players walk a tight rope that referees hold from both ends. It will remain a whistle blowing clown show until The NBA can actually define what they mean on paper like on a legal document. They can't even properly define traveling/carrying/palming let alone contact fouls. The "verticality" was a good start at trying to make it all less nebulous.

A lot of fans seem to be fine with giving refs the power to interpret the rules on the floor while blaming them for being inadequate at their jobs. I am of the opinion that their job should be easier with as little power for judicial interpretation as possible. I think they do a great job with the tools they have available but I am not a fan of them having the power that they currently have.

[Kblaze8855]

On another matter....

Im pretty sure I just saw two dudes come out of the same bathroom stall at a Schlotzkys deli just now.

[Marchesk]

Of course he was.

Dennis wanted to piss you off so you lose it. He was absolutely a dirty player, a flopper, and a cheap shot artist all in one while somehow not being soft. Truly unique.

He learned from the best in Detroit.

[Hey Yo]

I think where the league really changed was with the Bulls/Pistons. MJ/Pippen/Phil Jackson spoke out against there physical tactics, and if memory served me correctly even went to the league office. NBA/marketing realized the skill/finesse was the selling point and not your average NBA player using physicality to make an impact.

Somewhere in the early/mid 90's the NBA realized that basketball was far closer to soccer than it was to football/hockey/lacrosse etc. IMO.

During and after the 1991 ECF:

''We believe playing our kind of basketball-solid, movement of ball, passing, being unselfish-is an enjoyable style to watch,'' said Bulls coach Phil Jackson after the Bulls dethroned the defending champions Monday in the Eastern Conference finals. ''We think that kind of game is clean and quick, and we think it`s just time to move onto another style of basketball in the NBA.''

Jackson`s comments came in the wake of a series of Michael Jordan statements over the last few days about how the Pistons` style of play degrades basketball.

And although the Pistons were angry Monday about Jordan`s remarks, they were unable to overcome the Bulls` play. But they did respond verbally.

''They didn`t give us any credit,'' said Dennis Rodman. ''All they did was complain the whole time: `You`re bad for basketball, (the Pistons)

shouldn`t even be here.` Why doesn`t he buy the team? He has all the money. This team`s worth about $200 million. Why doesn`t he buy it and change the organization if he`s that good?

''They still haven`t proved anything,'' added Rodman. ''They`ve got to win about five or six championships before they`re a great team.

''But now they can go home and rest in peace. The world is safe again. Life without the Pistons is safe.''

And that suits Jordan just fine.

''You see two different styles with us and them,'' Jordan said. ''The dirty play and the flagrant fouls and unsportsmanlike conduct. Hopefully, that will be eliminated from the game.

''I think we play clean basketball,'' added Jordan. ''We don`t go out and try to hurt people and dirty up the game.
''You never lose respect for the champions. But I haven`t agreed with the methods they used. I think people are happy the game will get back to a clean game (with a Bulls triumph) and away from the `Bad Boy` image.

''I don`t think people want that kind of basketball. I think they want to push that type of basketball out. We may not have liked Boston because they

(the Celtics) won, but they were a good, sound basketball team.

''Detroit`s been very successful with their style and other teams tried to copy it because they were successful, and that`s not good for the game.

''We`ve taken the Good Boy image and walked away,'' Jordan added. ''We may have complained about it and told the teacher, or whatever, but we never tried to lower ourselves to that level. We didn`t lose our cool or our heads. We maintained our poise.''

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1991-05-28-9102170643-story.html

[Hey Yo]

When players flop they never have the type of reaction Luka had... they lay on the ground, roll around, grab their head, and sell it. Luka got immediately up wasn't on the floor for half a second, and wanted to fight him. Players just dont do that after flopping. That was a legit malicious hit. He threw the arm down on the back of his head exactly how Parish did it from behind, albeit he only gave one chop.
Morris hit him twice.

Left hand with a chop to the very top of the head like some Chief Jay Strongbow shit, while the right hand clocks him in the side of the neck.

[Marchesk]

'"They still haven`t proved anything,'' added Rodman. ''They`ve got to win about five or six championships before they`re a great team."

Lot of irony in that quote.


''I don`t think people want that kind of basketball. I think they want to push that type of basketball out. We may not have liked Boston because they (the Celtics) won, but they were a good, sound basketball team."

Some irony here too because the Celtics would get physical with the Lakers and make them want to focus on getting even instead of playing Lakers ball.

But it wasn't just Jordan and the Bulls. Larry Bird hated Laimbeer:


“It’s because he was a dirty player,” Bird continued. “He had to do what he had to do and I understand that, but you take like (former Piston) Ricky Mahorn, he’d hit you and you knew you were going to get hit. He didn’t try to maim you. Bill tried to hurt you.

“He was one of them guys when you tried to shoot a jumper, he would try to slide his foot underneath your ankle so you’d twist your ankle.”

[Kblaze8855]

Morris hit him twice.

Left hand with a chop to the very top of the head like some Chief Jay Strongbow shit, while the right hand clocks him in the side of the neck.

And much like when Chief Jay Strongbow did it it doesnt really do any damage and it’s up to the other guy to sell it.

[Kblaze8855]

Lot of irony in that quote.



Some irony here too because the Celtics would get physical with the Lakers and make them want to focus on getting even instead of playing Lakers ball.

But it wasn't just Jordan and the Bulls. Larry Bird hated Laimbeer:


Everyone hated Laimbeer. Every single team.

[Hey Yo]

And much like when Chief Jay Strongbow did it it doesnt really do any damage and it’s up to the other guy to sell it.
The intent by Morris was still there regardless of the damage. Luca never saw it coming so his reaction was genuine IMO..... unlike Johnny Rodz or Frankie Williams who usually did see the chops coming.

[Marchesk]

Everyone hated Laimbeer. Every single team.

Did Laimbeer and your favorite, K. Malone every get in it?

[bdonovan]

Most of your posts seem to be very level-headed so I'll pardon you on this one but let's take a step back and assess reality.

You're saying basketball was 'better' when less skilled players could attack the opposing team and potentially injure him? You want to see a game where Dexter Pitman is punching Jordan in the head and they both get ejected?

You want to reward the less skilled goons that cannot hang in a skill-filled game by allowing them to punch and attack opposing team players?

DUMB

You have to keep in mind that 'toughness signaling' is important to men. More generally, whenever people say professional athletes are 'soft', they make themselves seem tough in comparison. That's why you get scores of overweight middle-aged suburbanite men go off about how 'weak' athletes are - though they are top physical specimens. Probably half the things we say are tied to our pride and wounded ego.

Same thing when people watch sports and gruffly go "Not a foul" and give a condescending laugh. Yet if they were subject to the same foul, they'd be crumpled on the ground, fetal position.

[Kblaze8855]

I’d say the exact opposite is the case right now. Knowing how powerful and imposing guys are is the whole reason to find the mental softness of flopping and generally behaving weakly so annoying.

If I thought Lebron were actually soft I wouldn’t consider him a flopper. Knowing he’s tough enough to not react how he does is the whole reason it’s pathetic .

[Kblaze8855]

Did Laimbeer and your favorite, K. Malone every get in it?

A clothesline after Karl ****ed up Isiah but that’s about it. I feel like I’ve seen a few shoves but I don’t remember a full fledged altercation.

[LoneyROY7]

Go watch MMA or something. This is basketball.

They don't need to fight for solely your entertainment. :lol

[Kblaze8855]

“Basketball” is not what any board of directors says it is. Leagues and people use different rules for their own reasons. None of them decide what the term means. What it meant for 110 years was not what the nba has made it now that’s for sure.

You not remembering anything else doesn’t mean the way it is....is the only way.

Mcdonalds fries used to be cooked in beef fat. They changed to make them more healthy. They don’t taste as good but people your age wouldn’t know that. Acknowledging that is just telling the truth. Doesn’t mean you can’t like them now. Just means they changed a recipe designed for flavor to one meant to appease soccer moms.

Call it nostalgia. Doesn’t mean the current fries are how they are supposed to be. Just what they do right now.

[LoneyROY7]

“Basketball” is not what any board of directors says it is. Leagues and people use different rules for their own reasons. None of them decide what the term means. What it meant for 110 years was not what the nba has made it now that’s for sure.

You not remembering anything else doesn’t mean the way it is....is the only way.

Mcdonalds fries used to be cooked in beef fat. They changed to make them more healthy. They don’t taste as good but people your age wouldn’t know that. Acknowledging that is just telling the truth. Doesn’t mean you can’t like them now. Just means they changed a recipe designed for flavor to one meant to appease soccer moms.

Call it nostalgia. Doesn’t mean the current fries are how they are supposed to be. Just what they do right now.

That would be an opinion, not a fact.

Like your take.

[Kblaze8855]

And like the other one...one you have no basis to compare. But here you are. Complaining about the findings of people who saw both when you didn’t.

The whole “This is basketball” take is absurd. It was all basketball. It is all basketball. But the version you know from the current league was literally manufactured in the last few years. Someone who never saw the game is handed a random recording of one from all history 99% of it wouldn’t look like what’s on in the nba this week.

And all of it would be basketball.

[LoneyROY7]

You're talking about wanting players to literally punch and clothesline eachother for no purpose other than you finding it entertaining. That is by definition NOT basketball. That is by definition fighting.

The rest is fine b/c I know you're an old head stuck deep in nostalgia.

[Marchesk]

I used to go to fight, and a basketball game would break out.

I haven't kept up with hockey. Has anything similar happened there, or is fighting still part of the sport?

[Kblaze8855]

By definition a travel isn’t basketball but we see it 85 times a night.

If the rules make the game how is:


https://thumbs.gfycat.com/InformalEsteemedBobcat-size_restricted.gif

Basketball?


Because the league looks the other way for maximum enjoyment?

Enjoyment is a valid reason to not have rules when it’s something you enjoy?

[talkingconch]

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/CluelessActualAmazondolphin-size_restricted.gif




https://thumbs.gfycat.com/NaturalRemoteLaughingthrush-size_restricted.gif




But the media made a big deal of it and forced the nba to review it and make it a flagrant later. That’s around the time the softening began. It took years to take over but it was starting. Review....

You settle it on the court. It was a physical series vs the Celtics. Hands might be put on you. Maybe your fans too if they talk too greasy over there:





https://thumbs.gfycat.com/BountifulAccomplishedAlaskankleekai-size_restricted.gif





And it was fine. Nobody hid the children. Just play on.

That was playoff ball. You don’t just compete within the confines of the game. You are in a contest of wills. You want a ring you need to beat us. Not just as putting a ball in a basket. You might have to beat our ass to advance. Or at least let it be known you’re willing to take it there.

Had to respect the champs more. You know they had a series of true conflicts to get what they got. You can win 4-5 rings these days with your knuckles never scuffing a jaw. Everybody stays pretty. Nobody has to hear from their friends how such and such not only eliminated you....but stomped your friend out with impunity as you stood there like a bitch.

Stakes were higher. Oh well. Watch your “tough” little series play out.....

you can blame mainstream news media and far left. EVERYONE is scared of being offended now. I was born in the 90's and I didn't even watch some of the physical ball and I'M TELLING YOU things are too soft nowadays.

its ridiculous. when a player can get called a technical foul/ejected for laughing on the bench, or saying 'what' to a players face, things are going downhill.

[tpols]

McDonald's fries were very good in the 90s. If I'm going to McDonald's I dont care about healthy anyway.

[Kblaze8855]

They are kinda like kfc gravy. It’s worse because the original was done that way by the creator for best taste. The changes are for economic reasons.

[PeroAntic]

Sure, I would like to see a bit tougher basketball. But why would I want to see more thuggery and fights?

[Kblaze8855]

The tougher basketball you may enjoy is simply more likely to result in emotional situations which lead to the so called thuggery. Outright fights were always rare.

[PeroAntic]

The tougher basketball you may enjoy is simply more likely to result in emotional situations which lead to the so called thuggery. Outright fights were always rare.

Yeah but op shows a bunch of fights saying I miss this. What is needed is less soft refereeing, that is return of handcheck, less fouls at drives etc. But I have no problem with refs keeping things in order with techs and flagrants. In Europe you play hard basketball but you hardly see fights or thuggery. American (mostly black) players are so emotional, with all their 'beefs' and constant attempts to get one over other players by disrespecting them, but then get very offended at being disrespected in the same way. Its really ridiculous.

[bdonovan]

Yeah but op shows a bunch of fights saying I miss this. What is needed is less soft refereeing, that is return of handcheck, less fouls at drives etc.

If you enjoy handchecks, just watch Toronto Raptor's guards. They have brought back handchecks - it's totally legit again, apparently.

[Kblaze8855]

The OP had one fight with a fan and a later updated flagrant foul. The fights are later. And again they aren’t the goal. The goal is the physical competition that often leads there. You think back on the greatest series ever most of them eventually got chippy. Even first round ones like the Bulls and Celtics a few years ago. Emotions run high and it’s simply more compelling to see the best under those conditions.

I do not need some star hurt and out for the season. I actually think that happens more now even though the league has gotten softer. The reasons for it vary with who you ask and that’s a whole other topic really.

[Whoah10115]

You're talking about wanting players to literally punch and clothesline eachother for no purpose other than you finding it entertaining. That is by definition NOT basketball. That is by definition fighting.

The rest is fine b/c I know you're an old head stuck deep in nostalgia.

I mean, he's not talking about that at all.

Also, as I said earlier, what the Pistons did is wrong to me. Most of it is basketball, but a lot of it shouldn't be in the game. Morris was not nearly as bad but I don't mind him being kicked out, because it was two slaps and it was with a guy's back turned.

But physical should remain. And it's true with traveling.

[Gohan]

He's been stellar so far, and feels like he's just revving up for the epic 2nd round match-up.

I’m not even a big harden fan but he’s gonna year the lakers apart. I can’t wait

[BigShotBob]

By definition a travel isn’t basketball but we see it 85 times a night.

If the rules make the game how is:


https://thumbs.gfycat.com/InformalEsteemedBobcat-size_restricted.gif

Basketball?


Because the league looks the other way for maximum enjoyment?

Enjoyment is a valid reason to not have rules when it’s something you enjoy?

Disgusting. I'd lay my hands on a player that traveled like that.