Westbrook

[tpols]

I swear if you took all the possessions he bricks and turns it over and re-distribute the possessions, Rockets would have an infinitely better chance at winning.

[imdaman99]

He's not 100% healthy. He averaged 38 against the Lakers when he was healthy this season. On great efficiency as well.

That being said he's been bad tonight. Should concentrate on crashing boards and defense.

[LoneyROY7]

He's not 100% healthy. He averaged 38 against the Lakers when he was healthy this season. On great efficiency as well.

He's moving very well. Don't make excuses.

[NBAGOAT]

they need someone to give harden plays off, no one plays more minutes and he doesnt have a top tier motor. But yea lineups with harden alone scored better than lineups with harden and westbrook. westbrook's still a positive but i see people calling him 2nd team all-nba this year and his impact is not that good.

[imdaman99]

He's moving very well. Don't make excuses.

He just came back from an injury last week that should take a month to recover from. He is still playing hard, that's how he always plays.

[LoneyROY7]

He just came back from an injury last week that should take a month to recover from. STFU already.

Pathetic.

His quad has nothing to do with him playing bad.

[DMAVS41]

Unfortunately he's prone to games like this. It was never this bad in the past, but always been there on some level.

Overall it works for Houston though. They are currently playing better than they did last year with Paul, but obviously not at the 2018 level, but that was going to almost be impossible to reach again.

I also think we ignore the simple things that Russ does that are positive. He's actually a really good passer off penetration and he'll make like 2 or 3 hustle plays a game that lead to baskets. He's also crazy...for good and bad...I think it is more for good on a team like this though that needs to give Harden breaks.

[imdaman99]

Hell yeah Russ. He knew he was a detriment tonight and got in foul trouble :applause: is there nothing he isn't willing to do to help the team???? :pimp:

:lol :(

[GimmeThat]

I'm not sure how you intend to redistribute his shots, when Covington/Tucker took a combined 13 3 pointers to westbrook's 4 in 3 quarters.

[ralph_i_el]

Unfortunately he's prone to games like this. It was never this bad in the past, but always been there on some level.

Overall it works for Houston though. They are currently playing better than they did last year with Paul, but obviously not at the 2018 level, but that was going to almost be impossible to reach again.

I also think we ignore the simple things that Russ does that are positive. He's actually a really good passer off penetration and he'll make like 2 or 3 hustle plays a game that lead to baskets. He's also crazy...for good and bad...I think it is more for good on a team like this though that needs to give Harden breaks.


His balance of good-bad passes after penetration is key. When he's making bad passes in those situations it's awful.

[DMAVS41]

His balance of good-bad passes after penetration is key. When he's making bad passes in those situations it's awful.

Agreed.

On a night like tonight where he's just out of control, he's a big negative. Problem is, Rockets don't have any other options given their lack of depth.

[Young X]

Westbrook from like 2014-2017 was legitimately a great player.

He has done nothing since then but put up inefficient empty stats. He has been trash in the playoffs the past 3 years shooting his team out of series.

[starface]

Westbrook from like 2014-2017 was legitimately a great player.

He has done nothing since then but put up inefficient empty stats. He has been trash in the playoffs the past 3 years shooting his team out of series.


GREAT?

Nah.

[DMAVS41]

Westbrook from like 2014-2017 was legitimately a great player.

He has done nothing since then but put up inefficient empty stats. He has been trash in the playoffs the past 3 years shooting his team out of series.

I'd include 2013 as well.

But, yep...it really has been a big drop. Shame because I lot of people think this is who he is always was...and that just isn't true. Like you said, he really was a legit great player.

[Marchesk]

He's still a really good rebounding guard, and can beat defenses off the dribble to the rim. He's a good passer when not turning it over. Also takes some pressure off Harden having to bring the ball up every possession.

[JohnMax]

Westbrook after 12 years literally cannot shoot over 30% from 3. And unlike Rondo he commits awful low IQ turnovers.

[Marchesk]

Westbrook after 12 years literally cannot shoot over 30% from 3.

Yeah, but neither can Kawhi and PG this playoffs.

[bladefd]

He's not 100% healthy. He averaged 38 against the Lakers when he was healthy this season. On great efficiency as well.

That being said he's been bad tonight. Should concentrate on crashing boards and defense.

Regular season is night and day from a playoff series.. Playoff is a different animal

[bladefd]

I'd include 2013 as well.

But, yep...it really has been a big drop. Shame because I lot of people think this is who he is always was...and that just isn't true. Like you said, he really was a legit great player.

He always had low basketball IQ though and terrible decision-making his entire career. He always plays hard but makes too many bad decisions that leads to turnover or low percentage shot. That has always been him going back to his rookie season. He has developed into a leader since Magic called him out on national tv

[warriorfan]

I feel like my iq is lower after watching him play. I’m done. I refuse to watch another basketball game he plays in. He’s that bad. I’m glad I didn’t watch tonight. I knew better.

[light]

LeBron is blocking him left and right. Some of them are really disturbing, confidence crushing blocks. He might be shook.

[light]

Westbrook after 12 years literally cannot shoot over 30% from 3. And unlike Rondo he commits awful low IQ turnovers.

Jordan only shot 29% for his career from the current three point line distance. Happens to the best of them.

[RRR3]

Westbrook from like 2014-2017 was legitimately a great player.

He has done nothing since then but put up inefficient empty stats. He has been trash in the playoffs the past 3 years shooting his team out of series.
Peak Westbrook was something else man. People forget.

[warriorfan]

Jordan only shot 29% for his career from the current three point line distance. Happens to the best of them.

Lebron only won 30% of his Finals appearances from the current 3 point line. 0% of them vs Jason Terry.

[Turbo Slayer]

Westbrook has been in steady decline the last few years. He is probably one of the worst shooter to shoot at that volume. Rockets should kept CP3.

[Turbo Slayer]

However he is still a great rebounder at his position.

[k0kakw0rld]

He's not 100% healthy. He averaged 38 against the Lakers when he was healthy this season. On great efficiency as well.

That being said he's been bad tonight. Should concentrate on crashing boards and defense.
Of course you know he's not 100% because you obviously have the connections to get a hold of his medical report. :facepalm

He is trash and his play doesn't result into wins. It doesn't take a genius to understand that.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Jordan only shot 29% for his career from the current three point line distance. Happens to the best of them.

With the regularized line, though, Jordan had 2 seasons shooting over 35%. And on the same amount of 3PA as Westbrook.

Much as threes are emphasized now, Russell should be better.

[Shogon]

I feel like my iq is lower after watching him play. I’m done. I refuse to watch another basketball game he plays in. He’s that bad. I’m glad I didn’t watch tonight. I knew better.

:roll:

[JohnMax]

https://i.ibb.co/3sL2KM2/edd078594fdfdbd76194ca5fa2405e4f.png

[dankok8]

Westbrook makes terrible decisions with the ball so often that in many games I'm not sure if his overall impact is really positive. That's always been my main quibble with Westbrook. However he is a competitor. Overall a very frustrating player to watch.

[PP34Deuce]

Lebron realized he couldnt easily bully harden.. so hes really focused on taking westbrook out the game.

Funny thing is westbrook and lebron are legit friends.

[starface]

I'd include 2013 as well.

But, yep...it really has been a big drop. Shame because I lot of people think this is who he is always was...and that just isn't true. Like you said, he really was a legit great player.


He was rarely great in games/moments that mattered. In fact he was often a flat out detriment in such situations. Even when he was a statistically productive player, he was a low IQ player.

For me personally that means he wasn't great.

[DMAVS41]

He was rarely great in games/moments that mattered. In fact he was often a flat out detriment in such situations. Even when he was a statistically productive player, he was a low IQ player.

For me personally that means he wasn't great.

He's always had his flaws, but we might just have different definitions of great.

I think Russ often looks worse than he actually is because of the kind of plays he's prone to.

Also, like I always like to point out...this team had Chris Paul last year...basically the opposite of Russ...and they collapsed "playing the right way"...

I understand the criticism, but I just think Russ takes too much of it...especially in the past...he's going to be a first ball hall of famer...rightfully so...I personally think that is a fair standard for calling someone great. And a lot of the guys that you'd probably say are way better than him...spent most of their careers losing "playing the right way"...

[AlternativeAcc.]

He was rarely great in games/moments that mattered. In fact he was often a flat out detriment in such situations. Even when he was a statistically productive player, he was a low IQ player.

For me personally that means he wasn't great.

Dmavs is on a crusade to defend Westbrook because i called him out for saying Durant was on loaded teams his whole career. He thinks westbrick and shit role players = loaded

We all know that's not the case, even dmavs. But he's a weird **** and can't take being wrong on a bball message board. So he'll defend Westbrick... literally just because I called him out. He's that much of a loser :lol

[starface]

He's always had his flaws, but we might just have different definitions of great.

I think Russ often looks worse than he actually is because of the kind of plays he's prone to.

Also, like I always like to point out...this team had Chris Paul last year...basically the opposite of Russ...and they collapsed "playing the right way"...

I understand the criticism, but I just think Russ takes too much of it...especially in the past...he's going to be a first ball hall of famer...rightfully so...I personally think that is a fair standard for calling someone great. And a lot of the guys that you'd probably say are way better than him...spent most of their careers losing "playing the right way"...


Yeah, but that was because of the Rockets' other Big Game Choker ;)

Now they have two of them :lol

[DMAVS41]

Dmavs is on a crusade to defend Westbrook because i called him out for saying Durant was on loaded teams his whole career. He thinks westbrick and shit role players = loaded

We all know that's not the case, even dmavs. But he's a weird **** and can't take being wrong on a bball message board. So he'll defend Westbrick... literally just because I called him out. He's that much of a loser :lol

I don't even know who you are. I've been defending Russ for a long time on here. You are not relevant.

[DMAVS41]

Yeah, but that was because of the Rockets' other Big Game Choker ;)

Now they have two of them :lol

Ok, well, I'm not the biggest Harden guy, but he's another great player...one of the best ever.

[starface]

Ok, well, I'm not the biggest Harden guy, but he's another great player...one of the best ever.


For sure. But as others in the thread have mentioned... there's low stakes great, and high stakes great.

Westbrook and Harden are great when the stakes are low, but notoriously BAD when stakes is high.

And I think that mitigates a lot of their greatness in some peoples minds. Myself included.

[ArbitraryWater]

He was rarely great in games/moments that mattered. In fact he was often a flat out detriment in such situations. Even when he was a statistically productive player, he was a low IQ player.

For me personally that means he wasn't great.

Actually its the opposite.

Russ was OKC's #1 player in big games in the 2014 and 2016 playoffs.

[tpols]

Idk guys... I just watched 35 year old Chris Paul take this Rocket team to 7 and be very efficient in his role. Yea they needed him to be more "takeover" to beat the rockets, but lets say we swap current chris paul for westbrook on the rockets. Do you really think they lose last nights game? I dont think an argument could be made that they would. The shooters went nuts last night. Chris Paul will never have a game where he plays that bad. They should have never let him go. They'ed be title contenders in the bubble with chris paul this year. Covington is a HUGE addition. They didn't have him in 2019 playoffs.

[DMAVS41]

Idk guys... I just watched 35 year old Chris Paul take this Rocket team to 7 and be very efficient in his role. Yea they needed him to be more "takeover" to beat the rockets, but lets say we swap current chris paul for westbrook on the rockets. Do you really think they lose last nights game? I dont think an argument could be made that they would. The shooters went nuts last night. Chris Paul will never have a game where he plays that bad. They should have never let him go. They'ed be title contenders in the bubble with chris paul this year. Covington is a HUGE addition.

I agree they would be better with Paul, but they would likely lose...just like they did in the past.

[AlternativeAcc.]

I don't even know who you are. I've been defending Russ for a long time on here. You are not relevant.

No you haven't. Now all of a sudden its your life's mission to tell everyone how good westbrick is.

[DMAVS41]

No you haven't. Now all of a sudden its your life's mission to tell everyone how good westbrick is.

Again, I don't know how you are. You are not relevant for my reasons doing anything.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Again, I don't know how you are. You are not relevant for my reasons doing anything.

Ok, keep lying. Its amusing. Keep hyping westbrick cause I called you out yesterday.

It doesnt matter if I'm relevant or not. It could've been anybody. You do the same shit every time you're wrong. You just cant stand being wrong, its really sad

[RRR3]

I agree they would be better with Paul, but they would likely lose...just like they did in the past.
There is no way the Rockets with CP3 lose to the Lakers if Vogel coaches like he has been so far.

[DMAVS41]

For sure. But as others in the thread have mentioned... there's low stakes great, and high stakes great.

Westbrook and Harden are great when the stakes are low, but notoriously BAD when stakes is high.

And I think that mitigates a lot of their greatness in some peoples minds. Myself included.

Sure, but if you really evaluate NBA history...it gets really hard to find "high stakes" great players outside of all the obvious. The list gets short in a hurry....and you'll see Harden's name somewhere pretty damn high.

[DMAVS41]

There is no way the Rockets with CP3 lose to the Lakers if Vogel coaches like he has been so far.

I disagree.

I think you likely would be saying the same thing if Russ was on the Rockets last year and they lost to the Warriors games 5 and 6 without Durant. No way they lose with Paul, but they did...winning against the best players is really hard.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Ok, keep lying. Its amusing. Keep hyping westbrick cause I called you out yesterday.

It doesnt matter if I'm relevant or not. It could've been anybody. You do the same shit every time you're wrong. You just cant stand being wrong, its really sad


There is no way the Rockets with CP3 lose to the Lakers if Vogel coaches like he has been so far.

Rockets are totally different than last year anyways. Covington adds so much to this team.

They'd be Champs with Paul, now they're 2nd round losers because of Westbrick (almost 1st rnd losers)

[DMAVS41]

Ok, keep lying. Its amusing. Keep hyping westbrick cause I called you out yesterday.

It doesnt matter if I'm relevant or not. It could've been anybody. You do the same shit every time you're wrong. You just cant stand being wrong, its really sad

Wrong?

I merely factually stated that Russ is a first ballot hall of famer and that Ibaka played a role on a title winning team. You then had a meltdown. Carry on though...tell me more.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Wrong?

I merely factually stated that Russ is a first ballot hall of famer and that Ibaka played a role on a title winning team. You then had a meltdown. Carry on though...tell me more.

Well if I'm wrong then so be it. It seems like there was a correlation there. Either way, you were wrong about your original point.

Nobody is winning with westbrook and garbage role players.

Peak harden just about lost with Westbrook and ELITE role players... in the 1st round..

Do you not see a pattern with westbrick? And don't give that shit that he's washed. His stats this season are better than when he played with Durant.

You can't win with him. Having him on your team doesn't make you loaded.

[RRR3]

I disagree.

I think you likely would be saying the same thing if Russ was on the Rockets last year and they lost to the Warriors games 5 and 6 without Durant. No way they lose with Paul, but they did...winning against the best players is really hard.
Are you paying attention to how Vogel is coaching? He literally doesn’t understand small ball and spacing. He is double teaming Harden and leaving shooters wide open, playing people like McGee who can’t switch, overplaying Rondo, and playing Rondo with LeBron. The fact that he still started JaVale McGee after game 1 was mind boggling. The Lakers won because WB was awful. CP3 will not have games like that. If Vogel is going to continue coaching like he’s in 1988, the Rockets have a great chance even with WB. Considering CP3>>WB, it’s clear they’d win if they had him.

[DMAVS41]

Are you paying attention to how Vogel is coaching? He literally doesn’t understand small ball and spacing. He is double teaming Harden and leaving shooters wide open, playing people like McGee who can’t switch, overplaying Rondo, and playing Rondo with LeBron. The fact that he still started JaVale McGee after game 1 was mind boggling. The Lakers won because WB was awful. CP3 will not have games like that. If Vogel is going to continue coaching like he’s in 1988, the Rockets have a great chance even with WB. Considering CP3>>WB, it’s clear they’d win if they had him.

There is nothing clear about this Rockets team beating the Lakers team with Paul instead of Russ. I think we can all agree that with Paul they'd be better, but you lose me on claiming they'd for sure win with him.

That just isn't how the stuff works in reality.

[RRR3]

There is nothing clear about this Rockets team beating the Lakers team with Paul instead of Russ. I think we can all agree that with Paul they'd be better, but you lose me on claiming they'd for sure win with him.

That just isn't how the stuff works in reality.
I said they’d clearly beat them if Vogel keeps coaching like a retard. If he coaches smart Lakers would win CP3 or not.

[ArbitraryWater]

I said they’d clearly beat them if Vogel keeps coaching like a retard. If he coaches smart Lakers would win CP3 or not.

You present all of these matters in such a black/white manner lol.

[RRR3]

You present all of these matters in such a black/white manner lol.
Member when you said WB was better than CP3? :yaohappy:

[imdaman99]

Rockets are totally different than last year anyways. Covington adds so much to this team.

They'd be Champs with Paul, now they're 2nd round losers because of Westbrick (almost 1st rnd losers)

GTFO, they wouldn't be favorites to beat the Lakers even if you swap Paul and Westbrook.

Lakers defense shaded Lebron to help out on Westbrook because Westbrook can bully the guards and Lebron is a great team defender. He blocked his shots a few times.

It's a good thing this series is 1-1 because that tells me it's not over and Westbrook has time to redeem himself.