The only Steven A rant nobody ever disagreed with?

[Kblaze8855]

https://youtu.be/6PP4RT-vv-o

[tpols]

That's fake news since the Grizzlies got his brother Marc who led Memphis further in the playoffs than Pau ever could. Who went 0-12.

So the whole basis of the argument is tainted from the start when you frame it as kwame for pau directly.

[Overdrive]

That's fake news since the Grizzlies got his brother Marc who led Memphis further in the playoffs than Pau ever could. Who went 0-12.

So the whole basis of the argument is tainted from the start when you frame it as kwame for pau directly.

Marc was an unknown 2nd round pick at that time.

[tpols]

Marc was an unknown 2nd round pick at that time.

Jokic was a 41st pick. Manu 57th. Tony Parker 28th. Euro's are usually underrated in the NBA which is an entertainment league. Marc ended up being a better playoff performer for the Grizzlies than Pau was.

[Kblaze8855]

It’s “fake news” for someone not to factor in a second rounder who stayed in Europe his first season and wasn’t a star till like 4 years later?

Nobody knew or cared about Paus little brother at the time.

[Turbo Slayer]

I agree.

[Overdrive]

Jokic was a 41st pick. Manu 57th. Tony Parker 28th. Euro's are usually underrated in the NBA which is an entertainment league. Marc ended up being a better playoff performer for the Grizzlies than Pau was.

That's all hindsight. For every Marc there are 20 Frederic Weis's.

[CelticBaller]

Jokic was a 41st pick. Manu 57th. Tony Parker 28th. Euro's are usually underrated in the NBA which is an entertainment league. Marc ended up being a better playoff performer for the Grizzlies than Pau was.

this is all hindsight. At the time it terms of value the Grizzlies got bent

[Kblaze8855]

For real. And Gasol was the 5th drafted euro that year. Several went first round. That’s always the case when people act like some euro was skipped over for being a euro. It’s not skipping over Europeans it’s drafting the wrong ones.

Not that Marc is a traditional euro. He played in the us. He moved here with Pau when he was like 14. He was a local Memphis high school star.

[dreamshake]

For real. And Gasol was the 5th drafted euro that year. Several went first round. That’s always the case when people act like some euro was skipped over for being a euro. It’s not skipping over Europeans it’s drafting the wrong ones.

Not that Marc is a traditional euro. He played in the us. He moved here with Pau when he was like 14. He was a local Memphis high school star.

I think you’re vastly underrating Jerry West’s ability as a GM. He’s the guy who discovered Kobe, helped build the Warriors dynasty, turned the Clippers franchise around, etc. He wouldn’t just give Pau away for nothing. The man was playing chess.

[tpols]

That's all hindsight. For every Marc there are 20 Frederic Weis's.

There are far more underrated Euro's than overrated.

Drazen Petrovic was 60th pick. Manu 57th pick. Jokic 41st. Kukoc 29th. Parker 28th. Divac 26th. Sabonis 24th.

Go look up the clowns taken over Dirk.

It's not hindsight, it's reality. Memphis ended up getting great value out of that trade in the long run.

[DMAVS41]

There are far more underrated Euro's than overrated.

Drazen Petrovic was 60th pick. Manu 57th pick. Jokic 41st. Kukoc 29th. Parker 28th. Divac 26th. Sabonis 24th.

Go look up the clowns taken over Dirk.

It's not hindsight, it's reality. Memphis ended up getting great value out of that trade in the long run.


The bold is the definition of hindsight. It was a meaningless part of the trade. What are you talking about?

[Kblaze8855]

I think you’re vastly underrating Jerry West’s ability as a GM. He’s the guy who discovered Kobe, helped build the Warriors dynasty, turned the Clippers franchise around, etc. He wouldn’t just give Pau away for nothing. The man was playing chess.

Im not talking about if West knew. I’m talking about Steven A and everyone else....who laughed at the time. It was a funny rant...which was the point.

[tpols]

[/B]

The bold is the definition of hindsight. It was a meaningless part of the trade. What are you talking about?

Not at all.

The whole concept of a trade also includes long term repercussions. You don't analyze a deal on just it's immediate impact, but take both that and it's long term impact into account as well. Which is why draft picks matter. And I have no doubt Memphis's previous experience with Pau would make them more likely to draft Marc. You guys are giving a knee jerk reaction here. The Grizz were coming off 3 straight first round SWEEPS.

They had to shake it up long term and it worked. The 2010's Grizzlies were better than their 2000's counterparts.

[Kblaze8855]

There are far more underrated Euro's than overrated.

Drazen Petrovic was 60th pick. Manu 57th pick. Jokic 41st. Kukoc 29th. Parker 28th. Divac 26th. Sabonis 24th.

Go look up the clowns taken over Dirk.

It's not hindsight, it's reality. Memphis ended up getting great value out of that trade in the long run.


I realize you aren’t old enough to remember the Soviet Union and all the related difficulties there, or the fact that even pros in Europe couldn’t be in the nba and play for their home countries internationally and the great players that kept from ever coming....but there were more issues than how good players were.

A lot of them were under contract and wouldn’t come for years. Sabonis, Drazen, Kukoc and so on. Marc went to Spain. Some lottery picks never came over at all. Ask the Magic. Fran Vasquez went lottery ahead of some all stars and never even came over.

A bad team trying to turn it around doesn’t tend to take a euro superstar who may never want to come over. Ricky Rubio got drafted then signed a 6 year deal to stay in Europe that later had to be bought out.

Between international loyalty, already being under contract, some not wanting to leave, and most being somewhat of a mystery theres good reason euros fall in drafts.


Not everyone’s prepared to wait for a guy like Manu to not come over till he’s like 25-26. Gms and coaches need to win to stay employed.

Maybe they don’t risk it all on Dirk but in the same draft all those bums you mentioned went over Paul Pierce too and a couple over Vince Carter.

There is no one thing that causes that.

Toni Kukoc was known to be a wait and see. He made more in Europe than some hall of famers were making in the nba and then when he got here became the highest paid player in Bulls history ahead of Jordan and Pippen. He was incredibly valued and Krause wanted him bad. Why do you think Jordan and Pippen wanted to embarrass him in the 92 olympics? The Bulls were all about Toni. We had heard about him for a long time.

It was just a different time then. Those guys couldn’t be relied on to come over at all.

[starface]

Knew this had to be the iconic Kwame Brown rant :lol

[DMAVS41]

Not at all.

The whole concept of a trade also includes long term repercussions. You don't analyze a deal on just it's immediate impact, but take both that and it's long term impact into account as well. Which is why draft picks matter. And I have no doubt Memphis's previous experience with Pau would make them more likely to draft Marc. You guys are giving a knee jerk reaction here. The Grizz were coming off 3 straight first round SWEEPS.

They had to shake it up long term and it worked. The 2010's Grizzlies were better than their 2000's counterparts.

You analyze the deal on the expected value of the assets.

If the Bucks traded Giannis for Westbrook and a bunch of future 2nd rounders...it is a terrible deal. If one of those 2nd rounders becomes a 10-time all-star 7 years from now...it does nothing to change the fact that it was a terrible deal at the time and any GM making it should be fired on the spot.

Obviously I'm not comparing that to the Pau deal, but it makes the point.