How are mj haters rationalizing what jimmy butler is doing?

[Bronbron23]

A much less athletic and skilled version of mj is putting up record numbers and just took at least 2 games of the best player and team in the league. Oh and btw butler is shooting 27% from three which is well below mj and apparently why he would struggle in this era.

This must be confusing time for mj hatters :roll:

[Gus Hemmingway]

Props to Jimmy for reaching the pinnacle of a NBA Finals without a sure fire 2nd option and HOF'r


as a Bull, only Scottie himself came close to achieving this feat


Then there was Michael and well..... the 1st round

[Bronbron23]

Props to Jimmy for reaching the pinnacle of a NBA Finals without a sure fire 2nd option and HOF'r


as a Bull, only Scottie himself came close to achieving this feat


Then there was Michael and well..... the 1st round

Ok thats fair mj was overrated but butler is still way worse. So if mj sucked that means butler really sucks but yet he has his team in the finals. That means this era is trash right? Also means that this chip wont mean much?

Either you spin it you lose buddy:rockon:

[Cyrus334]

Props to Jimmy for reaching the pinnacle of a NBA Finals without a sure fire 2nd option and HOF'r


as a Bull, only Scottie himself came close to achieving this feat


Then there was Michael and well..... the 1st round

So basically, your implying that Butler is better than Jordan since Butler got further than Jordan without a certified second guy.

[bullettooth]

So basically, your implying that Butler is better than Jordan since Butler got further than Jordan without a certified second guy.

It also speaks volumes about the Eastern conference....

[ThatCoolKid]

Butler is MJ with a 3 point shot. MJ is the poor man's Jimmy Butler. Jimmy Butler put up 2 game scores in one finals better than anything that MJ ever did in 6 :lol

[Bronbron23]

Butler is MJ with a 3 point shot. MJ is the poor man's Jimmy Butler. Jimmy Butler put up 2 game scores in one finals better than anything that MJ ever did in 6 :lol

This dudes talking straight shit. Butler shooting 27% from three for series. Lower than any of mj's im pretty sure

[paksat]

I guess everyone in the league is so good

[No Sir]

Better era, better players. Simple as that. Sadly Bron has tougher comp at his position than Muggsy Bogues and Hornacek.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Butler is easily more skilled than MJ.. hes less athletic but way more skilled than MJ. 10x better playmaker, better footwork, silkier jumper, better ball handler, higher IQ.

It's not close


The better question is how do MJ stains rationalize Butler being better than MJ?

[Carbine]

The responses in this thread are absolute trash.

[And1AllDay]

Butler is MJ with a 3 point shot. MJ is the poor man's Jimmy Butler. Jimmy Butler put up 2 game scores in one finals better than anything that MJ ever did in 6 :lol

+1

these kids are just realizing like OH SHIT

mike is not the bar he is below these modern guys

[HoopsNY]

A much less athletic and skilled version of mj is putting up record numbers and just took at least 2 games of the best player and team in the league. Oh and btw butler is shooting 27% from three which is well below mj and apparently why he would struggle in this era.

This must be confusing time for mj hatters :roll:

It's simple. Bran stans are a large pack of inconsistent idiots who think the world revolves around their idol. And the funny part is that, career-wise, MJ shot 37% from deep in the finals.

The problem is this automatic transferral of statistics cross-era without any consideration for context. That level of mental analysis is too great for people who jump on forums all day shouting the same slogans over and over.

[HoopsNY]

Butler is MJ with a 3 point shot. MJ is the poor man's Jimmy Butler. Jimmy Butler put up 2 game scores in one finals better than anything that MJ ever did in 6 :lol

Butler is a career 33% three point shooter shooting 27% in his first finals in a three point/shooter friendly era. Jordan also shot 33% from deep with 37% from the arc in the finals in an era that was less friendly to the three pointer.

How is this not understood?

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Butler is a career 33% three point shooter shooting 27% in his first finals in a three point/shooter friendly era. Jordan also shot 33% from deep with 37% from the arc in the finals in an era that was less friendly to the three pointer.

How is this not understood?

This place is infested with trolling :oldlol:

Don't bother rationalizing with them, its the only way they can cope Jordan's greatness.

[And1AllDay]

Butler is a career 33% three point shooter shooting 27% in his first finals in a three point/shooter friendly era. Jordan also shot 33% from deep with 37% from the arc in the finals in an era that was less friendly to the three pointer.

How is this not understood?

Mikes unbanned zone 3 pt years are baaaad

Like 22% google it

[HoopsNY]

Mikes unbanned zone 3 pt years are baaaad

Like 22% google it

That's convenient using a 39-40 year old's numbers with a player playing in a shooter friendly era who is also in his prime. If what you say is true, then all of Mj's numbers fall through the roof based off of his Wizards years. It literally makes no sense. Your take is comedic with no actual substance. Do you really make these kinds of arguments to people in real life?

[goozeman]

Butler is a career 33% three point shooter shooting 27% in his first finals in a three point/shooter friendly era. Jordan also shot 33% from deep with 37% from the arc in the finals in an era that was less friendly to the three pointer.

How is this not understood?

It's a myth that Jordan couldn't shoot the three. Discounting his rookie season (just 4 games and nobody shot the three then anyway because it was still a new rule), Jordan shot 40% from three in the playoffs for his career. Even if we just look at Bulls championship seasons during non-shortened 3-point line (1990 to 1993, 1998) Jordan shot 37% from three in the playoffs. In 1994 when he unretired Jordan destroyed the shortened 3-point line and shot 50% from the three. Jordan's career 3-point percentages are skewed down because he didn't take a lot of attempts and players weren't protecting their shooting numbers back then by passing on heaves.

[sdot_thadon]

Apparently it means Mj would be alive and well in 2020 just like Lebron would be in the 90s. The notion that a top 5 player ever cant play in a specific era is silly. But.....this point still doesn't magically make Mj a better 3 point shooter. It was a weakness in his game, one of a couple of things one could say in comparison to other players. But he'd be fine in any era where theres a baksetball.

[goozeman]

Apparently it means Mj would be alive and well in 2020 just like Lebron would be in the 90s. The notion that a top 5 player ever cant play in a specific era is silly. But.....this point still doesn't magically make Mj a better 3 point shooter. It was a weakness in his game, one of a couple of things one could say in comparison to other players. But he'd be fine in any era where theres a baksetball.

Nope, it wasn't a weakness. Jordan had no weaknesses to his game. Ya'll just don't know how to look at numbers in context. In the playoffs when it mattered Jordan could shot damn near 40 percent from three. Jordan would destroy this era and shooting 3's would not be a weakness to his game today. On the contrary, it would probably be a strength because he would be conserving energy taking more efficient shots instead of creating in the lane around the basket in an era in which there was no defensive three-second rule and teams usually featured multiple defensive enforcers in the front court.

[Bronbron23]

Butler is easily more skilled than MJ.. hes less athletic but way more skilled than MJ. 10x better playmaker, better footwork, silkier jumper, better ball handler, higher IQ.

It's not close


The better question is how do MJ stains rationalize Butler being better than MJ?

And the award for troll of the year goes too.....

[sdot_thadon]

Nope, it wasn't a weakness. Jordan had no weaknesses to his game. Ya'll just don't know how to look at numbers in context. In the playoffs when it mattered Jordan could shot damn near 40 percent from three. Jordan would destroy this era and shooting 3's would not be a weakness to his game today. On the contrary, it would probably be a strength because he would be conserving energy taking more efficient shots instead of creating in the lane around the basket in an era in which there was no defensive three-second rule and teams usually featured multiple defensive enforcers in the front court.
Nah, I watched him live. It definitely was a weakness, but the era didn't make it a debilitating one. That's a good point that when he focused and took only good looks his percentages could increase. We've seen the same out of a guy like Lebron before he became a legitimate 3 point shooter. Still it doesn't discount the numbers, which say he left alot to be desired in that faucet of the game. And if it was just due to era, why did other guys excel at it in the very same era?

[Bronbron23]

Apparently it means Mj would be alive and well in 2020 just like Lebron would be in the 90s. The notion that a top 5 player ever cant play in a specific era is silly. But.....this point still doesn't magically make Mj a better 3 point shooter. It was a weakness in his game, one of a couple of things one could say in comparison to other players. But he'd be fine in any era where theres a baksetball.

It definitely wasn't a weakness. He and league at that time just weren't really shooting them. They shot like 7 a game. Plus you do know he shot around 36% from 3 in the finals right? Thats up there with almost anyone.

[goozeman]

Nah, I watched him live. It definitely was a weakness, but the era didn't make it a debilitating one. That's a good point that when he focused and took only good looks his percentages could increase. We've seen the same out of a guy like Lebron before he became a legitimate 3 point shooter. Still it doesn't discount the numbers, which say he left alot to be desired in that faucet of the game. And if it was just due to era, why did other guys excel at it in the very same era?

Nah, it wasn't. Speaking of eras, this era is all about getting easy looks from three. Offenses are designed around the three now to the point where lineups are getting smaller to accommodate for more 3-point specialists. Furthermore, the rules (gather step, no hand checking, emphasis on freedom of movement, mandated defensive clear out for landing era for airborne shooters, hesitation dribbling to freeze defender, etc ) allow players to always take easy uncontested 3's. A lot of the shooting today is manufactured because of the rules. You've got it backwards. It's easier to shoot the three today, and Jordan was putting up elite numbers in the playoffs in era when offenses weren't really designed to get shots from three and the rules didn't cater to getting easy looks. The greatest example of this is that players today can now always play the defender while facing the basket. In Jordan's era it wasn't unusual to see wing players playing with with their back to basket while bringing the ball up the court due to defensive pressure or start their possession in the post 15-feet out and greater due to hand checking. Look at Pippen guarding Magic in the Finals in 1991.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6Y3IE2Pnhk

Magic was basically forced to walk the ball up the court from the post because Pippen was basically mauling him full court. So to answer your question the guys that were elite shooters then would be even better today because the game is easier from an offensive perspective to get an easy shot. Jordan was an elite shooter from all areas of the court and his production in the playoffs when he was forced to rely more on the 3-point shot prove that. He would be an elite 3-point shooter today because A)Jordan was a very capable shooter from three when he needed to be (playoffs when more physical defense forced him to take more outside jumpers) and B)it's easier than ever to score in this era, especially from three.

[sdot_thadon]

If it wasn't a weakness I'd love an explanation of why he didn't shoot it as well as the players who were decent to great at it in his same era. There were plenty of guys who did shoot it good to elite despite the same non focus of it in that era. No pressure.

[r0drig0lac]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6Y3IE2Pnhk

imagine current players without all these illegal screens lol

[goozeman]

If it wasn't a weakness I'd love an explanation of why he didn't shoot it as well as the players who were decent to great at it in his same era. There were plenty of guys who did shoot it good to elite despite the same non focus of it in that era. No pressure.

For the most part Jordan didn't need to rely on the 3-point shot, which was considered an inferior shot during his era. Jordan's offensive game for a wing from a pure coaching/teaching perspective was considered the most theoretically correct for his time. Everything you see see Jordan doing on a basketball court was what was expected of him for that era. Nobody even looked at his 3-point percentages during the 90's because as far that era was concerned Jordan was playing the superior brand of basketball by attacking the paint, posting up, and hitting his open 2-point jumpers at a high percentage. He didn't shoot 3's and when he did a lot of those shots were "heaves," i.e. shots late in shot clock or end of regulation and busted offensive sets.

[Bronbron23]

If it wasn't a weakness I'd love an explanation of why he didn't shoot it as well as the players who were decent to great at it in his same era. There were plenty of guys who did shoot it good to elite despite the same non focus of it in that era. No pressure.

He didn't because he didn't need too for the most part. Either way it wasn't a weakness. He shot the three at a good enough clip to make it a threat and actually shot it pretty good on the biggest stage. You do know that he shot the three as good as almost anyone in the finals right?

[sdot_thadon]

For the most part Jordan didn't need to rely on the 3-point shot, which was considered an inferior shot during his era. Jordan's offensive game for a wing from a pure coaching/teaching perspective was considered the most theoretically correct for his time. Everything you see see Jordan doing on a basketball court was what was expected of him for that era. Nobody even looked at his 3-point percentages during the 90's because as far that era was concerned Jordan was playing the superior brand of basketball by attacking the paint, posting up, and hitting his open 2-point jumpers at a high percentage. He didn't shoot 3's and when he did a lot of those shots were "heaves," i.e. shots late in shot clock or end of regulation and busted offensive sets.

That all is true and also That is a pretty long way of saying he didn't shoot it because he did something else much better. That also doesn't in anyway disprove what I said. It was a weakness because he didn't need it. Still a weakness.

[sdot_thadon]

He didn't because he didn't need too for the most part. Either way it wasn't a weakness. He shot the three at a good enough clip to make it a threat and actually shot it pretty good on the biggest stage. You do know that he shot the three as good as almost anyone in the finals right?

Same for you. He didn't need it so he didn't do it. Meaning he didn't do it well either. Yes he made them at a higher clip in the postseason, any idea why? Because in the playoffs you completely sell out to keep him from Air Jordaning all over your guys in the paint, so you let him have the outside shot and live with the results. Not because he just decided to be a better shooter in the playoffs lol, its literally what the defense would give him and hope he'd take.

[Spurs m8]

Its hilarious people even hate MJ...

If you can't appreciate MJ, you either don't like basketball, or you're an upset Bron stan.

MJ is the epitome of everything basketball and sports in general should be...

Bron haters actually have reason...
Collusion
Cherry picked teams over and over
Self proclaimed King
Bad fundamentals
Ugly game - stiff arm, crab dribble, pound the rock, etc...
Runs when its too hard
Entitled
Sacrifices team for stats and loses coz too busy trying to get fmvp
List goes on....

[sdot_thadon]

Its hilarious people even hate MJ...

If you can't appreciate MJ, you either don't like basketball, or you're an upset Bron stan.

MJ is the epitome of everything basketball and sports in general should be...

Bron haters actually have reason...
Collusion
Cherry picked teams over and over
Self proclaimed King
Bad fundamentals
Ugly game - stiff arm, crab dribble, pound the rock, etc...
Runs when its too hard
Entitled
Sacrifices team for stats and loses coz too busy trying to get fmvp
List goes on....

I'm curious, how many Mj games you get to watch down under.....M8?

[BigShotBob]

Its hilarious people even hate MJ...

If you can't appreciate MJ, you either don't like basketball, or you're an upset Bron stan.

MJ is the epitome of everything basketball and sports in general should be...

Bron haters actually have reason...
Collusion
Cherry picked teams over and over
Self proclaimed King
Bad fundamentals
Ugly game - stiff arm, crab dribble, pound the rock, etc...
Runs when its too hard
Entitled
Sacrifices team for stats and loses coz too busy trying to get fmvp
List goes on....

I hated MJ for one reason.....

He was just too good.

But now I appreciate him and his greatness and it is a shame that we will literally never see anything like him ever again.

[PeroAntic]

Its hilarious people even hate MJ...

If you can't appreciate MJ, you either don't like basketball, or you're an upset Bron stan.

MJ is the epitome of everything basketball and sports in general should be...

Bron haters actually have reason...
Collusion
Cherry picked teams over and over
Self proclaimed King
Bad fundamentals
Ugly game - stiff arm, crab dribble, pound the rock, etc...
Runs when its too hard
Entitled
Sacrifices team for stats and loses coz too busy trying to get fmvp
List goes on....

great post m8:cheers:

[FKAri]

Its hilarious people even hate MJ...

If you can't appreciate MJ, you either don't like basketball, or you're an upset Bron stan.

MJ is the epitome of everything basketball and sports in general should be...

Bron haters actually have reason...
Collusion
Cherry picked teams over and over
Self proclaimed King
Bad fundamentals
Ugly game - stiff arm, crab dribble, pound the rock, etc...
Runs when its too hard
Entitled
Sacrifices team for stats and loses coz too busy trying to get fmvp
List goes on....

MJ was a good player. But I'm a bit old school so it's harder for me to tolerate his phaggitry and snivelling behaviour. If I can't respect him as a man then I can't respect him as an athlete. Just my 2 cents.

[And1AllDay]

I hated MJ for one reason.....

He was just too good.

But now I appreciate him and his greatness and it is a shame that we will literally never see anything like him ever again.

wait till this guy learns who lebron james is :oldlol:

7500 > 5900

keep up

[Bronbron23]

Same for you. He didn't need it so he didn't do it. Meaning he didn't do it well either. Yes he made them at a higher clip in the postseason, any idea why? Because in the playoffs you completely sell out to keep him from Air Jordaning all over your guys in the paint, so you let him have the outside shot and live with the results. Not because he just decided to be a better shooter in the playoffs lol, its literally what the defense would give him and hope he'd take.

When you say didn't do it well you have to more specific. What do you consider well? Reggie miller? Steph curry? Ray allen? If that's well then no he wasn't those guys. He shot it as well as bron and luka though who most people woukd consider decent 3 point shooters.

[sdot_thadon]

When you say didn't do it well you have to more specific. What do you consider well? Reggie miller? Steph curry? Ray allen? If that's well then no he wasn't those guys. He shot it as well as bron and luka though who most people woukd consider decent 3 point shooters.

Quit playing with me. If you dont know any good shooters from Mjs day you're probably not qualified enough to make this argument to be honest.

[Bronbron23]

Quit playing with me. If you dont know any good shooters from Mjs day you're probably not qualified enough to make this argument to be honest.

I named 2 and theres obviously way more. Its irrelevant though. Im asking you what you consider shooting it well because if you consider lebron and luka good shooters who shoot it well than mj is right there.

[Trollsmasher]

butler is bigger, stronger and tougher than MJ

better defender, better rebounder, better passer, better free throw and three point shooter

and yet he is a fringe top 10 player in this league

think about it

[Roundball_Rock]

A much less athletic and skilled version of mj is putting up record numbers and just took at least 2 games of the best player and team in the league. Oh and btw butler is shooting 27% from three which is well below mj and apparently why he would struggle in this era.

This must be confusing time for mj hatters :roll:

Yeah, it is crazy to say MJ wouldn't dominate in this era. Kawhi, Butler are loosely lesser versions of MJ in this era (with Kawhi being closer to MJ). Not only that, we had Kobe dominating as recently as 2013, the closest thing to MJ we have ever had.

Great players will adapt and be great in any era.

[imdaman99]

Jimmy was invisible tonight. Yeah he's had his moments but he's obviously worn out and they gameplanned for him and locked him up.

[Bronbron23]

Yeah, it is crazy to say MJ wouldn't dominate in this era. Kawhi, Butler are loosely lesser versions of MJ in this era (with Kawhi being closer to MJ). Not only that, we had Kobe dominating as recently as 2013, the closest thing to MJ we have ever had.

Great players will adapt and be great in any era.

Yeah. Would be awesome to see bron and mj go head to head. Would of thought bron and kobe would have had more battles

[Real14]

:lol

[Vino24]

Yeah. Would be awesome to see bron and mj go head to head. Would of thought bron and kobe would have had more battles

LeBron 16-6 vs Kobe


Not exactly a “battle”

[brownmamba00]

Its hilarious people even hate MJ...

If you can't appreciate MJ, you either don't like basketball, or you're an upset Bron stan.

MJ is the epitome of everything basketball and sports in general should be...

Bron haters actually have reason...
Collusion
Cherry picked teams over and over
Self proclaimed King
Bad fundamentals
Ugly game - stiff arm, crab dribble, pound the rock, etc...
Runs when its too hard
Entitled
Sacrifices team for stats and loses coz too busy trying to get fmvp
List goes on....

His game is ugly thats the godhonest truth

[Real14]

LeBron 16-6 vs Kobe


Not exactly a “battle”

Lebron chickened out in 09

[Mr. Woke]

His game is ugly thats the godhonest truth

I personally prefer watching King James. To me, he is also more likable than MJ.

[Real14]

I personally prefer watching King James. To me, he is also more likable than MJ.

Reported.