LeBron vs. Jordan: Survey Says...

[Roundball_Rock]

ESPN did a survey of experts. Here are the results (in the order ESPN discussed them).

Tougher era: LeBron 64%, MJ 36%
Better teammate: Pippen 68%, Davis 32%
More accomplishments: LeBron 62%, MJ 38%
Greater accomplishment: 6 rings 72%, 10 finals 28%
Greater accomplishment: Two threepeats with same team 57%, chips with three teams 43%
Higher peak: MJ 82%, LeBron 18%
MJ is...: GOAT 62%, #2 32%, top 5 6%
LeBron is...: GOAT 23%, #2 55%, top 5 21%
Final # of titles for LeBron: Four 17%, Five 70%, Six 13%, Seven+ 0% (Avg. 4.95)
Rings LeBron needs to surpass MJ: Three 15%, four 15%, Five 11%, Six 28%, Seven 15%, LeBron can never surpass MJ 17%

The rings to surpass MJ has 30% putting him ahead of MJ now whereas 23% had LeBron as GOAT. The discrepancy is they included other players in the GOAT discussion.

Per this, if LeBron wins five 41% would put him ahead of MJ. 6 would break the dam and get LeBron to 69%.

Discussion of each question in the full article at https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/30102629/nba-predictions-how-lebron-james-tops-michael-jordan-goat-status.

[Tobio-Star]

TL;DR
LeBron is the GOAT

[Kiddlovesnets]

Lebron has already lost the chance to be GOAT ever since he got swept by Spurs in 2007. MJ the reigning GOAT, has a 6/6 record in the Finals, a perfect 100% winning percentage in the finals. In order to match or surpass MJ, a perfect finals record is a necessary condition. Any players who have lost at least once in the NBA finals, are automatically disqualified from GOAT conversation. Lebron's ceiling is #2 all time, and he is already in the discussion after this title, another title should secure his #2 spot but this is as high as he will ever be.

[Meticode]

LeBron is #3 for me. He has the ability to make it #2, but unlikely he'll be GOAT because he's going to need 6 rings total to do it.

[MaxPlayer]

Lebron has already lost the chance to be GOAT ever since he got swept by Spurs in 2007. MJ the reigning GOAT, has a 6/6 record in the Finals, a perfect 100% winning percentage in the finals. In order to match or surpass MJ, a perfect finals record is a necessary condition. Any players who have lost at least once in the NBA finals, are automatically disqualified from GOAT conversation. Lebron's ceiling is #2 all time, and he is already in the discussion after this title, another title should secure his #2 spot but this is as high as he will ever be.

Maybe if you post this 1000 more times it will become true.

[Meticode]

Lebron has already lost the chance to be GOAT ever since he got swept by Spurs in 2007. MJ the reigning GOAT, has a 6/6 record in the Finals, a perfect 100% winning percentage in the finals. In order to match or surpass MJ, a perfect finals record is a necessary condition. Any players who have lost at least once in the NBA finals, are automatically disqualified from GOAT conversation. Lebron's ceiling is #2 all time, and he is already in the discussion after this title, another title should secure his #2 spot but this is as high as he will ever be.

It's subjective. I think he can pass MJ if he gets 6 rings and secures the all-time scoring title, but he'd have to win FMVP in those last two Finals as well. I think he'll make a secure #2. GOAT is unlikely unless the perfect storm happens. He'd have to play probably 3 more years at a high level, get two more rings with FMVPs in both, surpass Jabber in scoring...he'd be something like 38,000 points, 10,000 rebounds, 10,000 assists which is insane.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Maybe if you post this 1000 more times it will become true.

It is true regardless of how many times I post this, just need to get the truth to the head of the delusional people who refuse to believe it.

[Meticode]

Maybe if you post this 1000 more times it will become true.

It's called an opinion.

[MaxPlayer]

It is true regardless of how many times I post this, just need to get the truth to the head of the delusional people who refuse to believe it.

So you're one of those people who thinks losing in the first round is better than winning your conference?

[MaxPlayer]

It's called an opinion.

It's called spam

[Roundball_Rock]

LeBron is #3 for me. He has the ability to make it #2, but unlikely he'll be GOAT because he's going to need 6 rings total to do it.

That is where most of the panel came down. If he finishes with 5, 41% would have him ahead of MJ (30% currently do). If he gets to 6 he not only gets a majority but a commanding majority of 69%.


Lebron has already lost the chance to be GOAT

Per the survey, 83% of expert respondents are open to him surpassing MJ. 2011 was not the "deal breaker" many wish it was.

[Goldrush25]

Lebron has already lost the chance to be GOAT ever since he got swept by Spurs in 2007

At the same age MJ was busy getting swept out of the first round when Lebron brought a group of vagabonds to the NBA finals, but ok.

MJ couldn't do a damn thing until he had the best team, and that's the unquestioned GOAT?

[Kiddlovesnets]

So you're one of those people who thinks losing in the first round is better than winning your conference?

It depends, to take a title contender team to lose in the first round is definitely more humiliating. However, MJ's first round exit happened when he was young and developing, also his team was nowhere near a title contender. Once MJ had a team capable of winning titles, he never lost. Lebron on the other hand, had title contender teams in all the finals he appeared except for 2007, and still went 4/9 even if you take out the first one.

[Vino24]

MJ lost his shot at being goat when he went 1-9 in the first round. Bill Russell shit on him 5 extra times.

[Roundball_Rock]

MJ couldn't do a damn thing until he had the best team, and that's the unquestioned GOAT?

That is the odd thing about the team success obsession in connection to MJ. If you put the best player on the best team with the best coach with no other great team in the era, what do people expect to happen? If you put Kareem or LeBron on the Bulls they dominate that era as well.

[Kiddlovesnets]

At the same age MJ was busy getting swept out of the first round when Lebron brought a group of vagabonds to the NBA finals, but ok.

MJ couldn't do a damn thing until he had the best team, and that's the unquestioned GOAT?
If you are not ready to compete on the biggest stage of NBA, then you better not make it there. A college freshman taking a senior level course and gets a B, its still a B, not an A. And it still hurts his GPA, no one cares the fact that he got a B because he took a hard course.

[Meticode]

It's called spam

It's unfortunate you think this way.

[zeerghit]

If you are not ready to compete on the biggest stage of NBA, then you better not make it there. A college freshman taking a senior level course and gets a B, its still a B, not an A. And it still hurts his GPA, no one cares the fact that he got a B because he took a hard course.
wtf?:lol

[Vino24]

wtf?:lol

I think this nets fan is fvcking retarded lol

[Doranku]

68% to 32% in favor of Scottie of Davis? :wtf:

They've gotta be talking about career wise? Because 2020 AD >>> any version of Scottie

[Goldrush25]

If you are not ready to compete on the biggest stage of NBA, then you better not make it there. A college freshman taking a senior level course and gets a B, its still a B, not an A. And it still hurts his GPA, no one cares the fact that he got a B because he took a hard course.

But someone that has the aptitude to take that senior level course, even if he doesn't get an A, is thought of as a smarter person than the person that couldn't even register for the course, because he didn't meet the criteria.

[Roundball_Rock]

68% to 32% in favor of Scottie of Davis? :wtf:

They've gotta be talking about career wise? Because 2020 AD >>> any version of Scottie

Career wise it would be 99-1%...so clearly they are talking who the better player was.

ISH isn't the real world. ISH/places like it are polluted by the MJ stan 24/7 crusade against Pippen (from the same people who hype every single 90's star as flawless--except Pippen :oldlol: ). So Pippen is seen a lot worse here than he is in the real world, where he is ranked 21st-28th all-time (where is Davis at this point?).


But someone that has the aptitude to take that senior level course, even if he doesn't get an A, is thought of as a smarter person than the person that couldn't even register for the course, because he didn't meet the criteria.

Yup. LeBron was like a college freshman taking a grad level course.

[Carbine]

A few things

-LeBron is going to get a bigger % than normal because it's fresh. A more proper time to ask this would be in a few months. Recency bias is real.

-Kendrick Perkins is one of these "experts"

[Doranku]

Career wise it would be 99-1%...so clearly they are talking who the better player was.

ISH isn't the real world. ISH/places like it are polluted by the MJ stan 24/7 crusade against Pippen (from the same people who hype every single 90's star as flawless--except Pippen :oldlol: ). So Pippen is seen a lot worse here than he is in the real world, where he is ranked 21st-28th all-time (where is Davis at this point?).



Yup. LeBron was like a college freshman taking a grad level course.

Which version(s) of Scottie is better than 2020 AD?

[jlip]

LeBron is #3 for me. He has the ability to make it #2, but unlikely he'll be GOAT because he's going to need 6 rings total to do it.

Who is your #2? Russell? Kareem?

[Carbine]

Which version(s) of Scottie is better than 2020 AD?

There are none. He had the best big man playoff run since '03 Duncan. Nobody talks about '91 Pippen or '92 Pippen as benchmark playoff runs. AD's 2020 is a benchmark type performance for future big men.

[Roundball_Rock]

Which version(s) of Scottie is better than 2020 AD?

This isn't a Pippen thread. The fact is ESPN surveyed experts (I didn't have a vote) and Pippen beat AD in a landslide. Sorry, but the ISH "Pippen sucks" echo chamber isn't the way he is viewed outside of ISH.

Pippen is consensus top 20-30 all-time (Davis is top 15-20 then? For what? Finishing 3rd, 5th in MVP once*--same as Pippen?)--and usually in the front half of that group--outside of the ISH, a place where he is Iggy and PG>>>Pippen. :lol

The question to ask here is what did the 68% see that ISH is missing? This was a pro-Jordan panel too, as the 82-18% result suggests...If there was bias, it would be to prop up AD.

*Davis was 6th this year, getting zero second place votes and five third place votes. Pippen was 5th in 96', getting 11 second place votes (MJ was nearly unanimous in first place votes) and 18 third place votes.

[Goldrush25]

A few things

-LeBron is going to get a bigger % than normal because it's fresh. A more proper time to ask this would be in a few months. Recency bias is real.

-Kendrick Perkins is one of these "experts"

Well we saw the same thing after the Last Dance. MJ got a huge bump, but I knew it wouldn't last.

[Doranku]

This isn't a Pippen thread. The fact is ESPN surveyed experts (I didn't have a vote) and Pippen beat AD in a landslide. Sorry, but the ISH "Pippen sucks" echo chamber isn't the way he is viewed outside of ISH.

Pippen is consensus top 20-30 all-time (Davis is top 15-20 then? For what? Finishing 3rd, 5th in MVP once*--same as Pippen?)--and usually in the front half of that group--outside of the ISH, a place where he is Iggy and PG>>>Pippen. :lol

The question to ask here is what did the 68% see that ISH is missing?

*Davis was 6th this year, getting zero second place votes and five third place votes. Pippen was 5th in 96', getting 11 second place votes (MJ was nearly unanimous in first place votes) and 18 third place votes.

These ESPN experts? :oldlol:

Final tally: Raptors (13), Celtics (5).
Final tally: Bucks (11), Heat (7).
Final tally: Clippers (19), Denver (0).

Such experts that they managed to pick 3 out of 4 series wrong in the CSF.

And come on, you're bringing up regular season MVP voting in '96?! AD was quite literally twice the player Scottie was in the playoffs. Just because AD > any version of Scottie doesn't make Scottie an Iggy level player. :lol AD just had one of the best playoff runs ever by a big man. It's not an insult to say he was better than Scottie.

[Roundball_Rock]

And come on, you're bringing up regular season MVP voting in '96?! AD was quite literally twice the player Scottie was in the playoffs.

Yes, a healthy AD>a Pippen with 3 separate injuries. :oldlol: You raised the issue of them at peak levels. 96' Pippen, as judged by MVP voters, was rated higher than 20' Davis relative to the league at the time (ISH likes to pretend it didn't happen, but Pippen was getting some Jordan comparisons--including from MJ himself--until he got hurt). That was with Pippen limping to the finish the final 20 games or so. If that vote were taken prior to that Pippen may have been 3rd.

My other point was Davis is being overhyped, for various reasons. He didn't get a first or second place MVP vote. He barely got any third place votes. Yet people are acting like he was equal to LeBron.

Pippen is a useful comp since he is viewed as the prototypical sidekick, and he was able to get high MVP votes (he actually consistently outpaced Hakeem at the high end of the ballot but Hakeem swamped him in 5th place votes). Davis was a top 5 player this year but he wasn't in the best player conversation like LeBron was. If Davis=LeBron, he would have been.

Of course it also is possible MJ's era was so weak Iggy got that many votes because there was no one else. Someone has to be marked on ballots with 5 slots, right? :oldlol: While LeBron's is so tough AD did a lot worse despite>>>>>Pippen because this era>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>the 90's and AD had tougher comp for votes in this era.


AD's 2020 is a benchmark type performance for future big men.

Talk about being a prisoner of the moment. Sidekick performances aren't remembered in the long term. That process has already begun...As soon as the games ended, it became LeBron, LeBron, LeBron. The finals ended just days ago. Imagine 10, 20, 30 years from now.


LeBron is going to get a bigger % than normal because it's fresh. A more proper time to ask this would be in a few months. Recency bias is real.

True--but it is still useful. These are NBA expert surveys, not presidential tracking polls. So ESPN isn't going to do this regularly to allow us to track how this shifts. This represents the high end for LeBron since he probably is getting a 5-6 % "bounce". Maybe they ask this heading into the season but most likely we will get these at the end of seasons and then whenever LeBron heads into his farewell season.

As to the "expert" attacks, I'll take them over people who say PG>Pippen like ISH does. :oldlol:

[Overdrive]

ESPN did a survey of experts. Here are the results (in the order ESPN discussed them).

Tougher era: LeBron 64%, MJ 36%
Better teammate: Pippen 68%, Davis 32%
More accomplishments: LeBron 62%, MJ 38%
Greater accomplishment: 6 rings 72%, 10 finals 28%
Greater accomplishment: Two threepeats with same team 57%, chips with three teams 43%
Higher peak: MJ 82%, LeBron 18%
MJ is...: GOAT 62%, #2 32%, top 5 6%
LeBron is...: GOAT 23%, #2 55%, top 5 21%
Final # of titles for LeBron: Four 17%, Five 70%, Six 13%, Seven+ 0% (Avg. 4.95)
Rings LeBron needs to surpass MJ: Three 15%, four 15%, Five 11%, Six 28%, Seven 15%, LeBron can never surpass MJ 17%

The rings to surpass MJ has 30% putting him ahead of MJ now whereas 23% had LeBron as GOAT. The discrepancy is they included other players in the GOAT discussion.

Per this, if LeBron wins five 41% would put him ahead of MJ. 6 would break the dam and get LeBron to 69%.

Discussion of each question in the full article at https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/30102629/nba-predictions-how-lebron-james-tops-michael-jordan-goat-status.

How is # of accomplishments subjective? Everything else is debatable.

And yeah, Scottie > AD relative to era; peak for peak, but AD is such a nice fit for Lebron.

[AlternativeAcc.]

It's called an opinion.

Its called that guy is literally autistic and so are you.

[Roundball_Rock]

How is # of accomplishments subjective? Everything else is debatable.

And yeah, Scottie > AD relative to era; peak for peak, but AD is such a nice fit for Lebron.

I suppose it depends on what you define as accomplishments. One could make a strong case that Jordan is the more accomplished player (e.g., 5 MVP's versus 4) but the panel had LeBron ahead 62-38% and LeBron is still going.

Good point bringing up relative to era. The question was who was the greater/better teammate, which inevitably involves comparing them within their eras.

2020 MVP voting: Giannis, LeBron, Harden, Luka, Kawhi, Davis, Paul, Lillard, Jokic, Siakam.
1996 MVP voting: Jordan, Robinson, Penny, Hakeem, Pippen, Payton, Malone, Kemp, Hill/Shaq.

Which list is more impressive? I suspect Pippen haters would say the 96' list--but then you have to square that with Pippen, who sucks, being ahead of all those guys, and as noted earlier, he got hurt late in the season. If the vote was taken in mid-February he would likely have been 3rd.

[Gimmedarock]

What happens when Bron gets 7 rings? I mean that’s a definite possibility. He got dat magic sauce bruh. Once he gets 6 you know he won’t miss getting 7. Guaranteed!

[Goldrush25]

What happens when Bron gets 7 rings? I mean that’s a definite possibility. He got dat magic sauce bruh. Once he gets 6 you know he won’t miss getting 7. Guaranteed!

More goal post moving. All of a sudden ring count won't matter.

[Roundball_Rock]

What happens when Bron gets 7 rings? I mean that’s a definite possibility. He got dat magic sauce bruh. Once he gets 6 you know he won’t miss getting 7. Guaranteed!

Good question, especially if Davis has surpassed him as the best player by then (as he presumably will in the next 2-3 years).


More goal post moving. All of a sudden ring count won't matter.

I think so, at least with Jordan stans and Jordan advocates in the media (someone noted Perkins was part of this panel--how much MJ fans were :oldlol: ?) . We know because that is what happened when Kobe looked like he would win 6 or more. They will shift to MJ was just better, like they did with Kobe.

The problem is when you hammer rangz so often, for so long you can't fully take it back. So some people, as the survey noted, will hold to that standard. If LeBron has 6 you give the edge to LeBron since that would come via 12-13 finals (MJ had 13 total playoff appearances, and in two of them he missed 80% of the season). If it is 7, then definitely game over, per MJ stan's professed standard.

[MaxPlayer]

What happens when Bron gets 7 rings? I mean that’s a definite possibility. He got dat magic sauce bruh. Once he gets 6 you know he won’t miss getting 7. Guaranteed!

It's hard to imagine that at 35 he could still have 3 rings left in him.

If he somehow pulls it off, I doubt there will be many people still arguing against him.

[Spurs m8]

Exactly....do a poll off this website and LeBron isn't even close to being ranked as GOAT.

This is literally the only place - through at least 30 alts - that LeBron is magically GOAT.

Majority in the real world know the deal...

Majority of knowledgeable basketball fans DEFS know the deal.

Sorry boys...you can start 1000 threads, but we all know you only do it because you know deep down who the real goat will always be

We win again

[Kiddlovesnets]

What happens when Bron gets 7 rings? I mean that’s a definite possibility. He got dat magic sauce bruh. Once he gets 6 you know he won’t miss getting 7. Guaranteed!

MJ would still be ahead, since Lebron can no longer match the 100% finals winning percentage unless he builds a time machine to go back in time and win the finals he lost. Anyone who fails to maintain a perfect finals record is automatically disqualified from GOAT conversation.

[MaxPlayer]

MJ would still be ahead, since Lebron can no longer match the 100% finals winning percentage unless he builds a time machine to go back in time and win the finals he lost. Anyone who fails to maintain a perfect finals record is automatically disqualified from GOAT conversation.

Do you actually type it each time, or do you just copy-paste like 3ball?

[Spurs m8]

Do you actually type it each time, or do you just copy-paste like 3ball?

Get out of here champ, winners are talking

[MaxPlayer]

Get out of here champ, winners are talking

But you're a Spurs fan.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

I don't believe in this whole "4 rings in modern era equals 6 crap". Have LeBron 3peat with Lakers and we'll talk.

[lxlHoTsAuSelxl]

Didnt espn say Lakers werent even top 5 this year?

[Roundball_Rock]

I don't believe in this whole "4 rings in modern era equals 6 crap". Have LeBron 3peat with Lakers and we'll talk.

Why not? We hear 6 rings>11 Russell rings every day.

[SATAN]

Why do people actually give a shit what ESPN tries to force feed them? "Experts"...Like who? Scottie "change my opinion every 2 months" Pippen? All the other guys who get paid handsome salaries to sit around talking all kinds of foul stuff about athletes?

It's all bullshit. You're allowed to have your own opinion and criteria without being criticized for it. It's only sport. I grew up with MJ but prefer LeBron's style and story. They are both better than each other at certain things and play nothing alike at all. The obsession with the comparison has always been kind of weird to me, much like the MJ brainwashing that occurred throughout the 80s and 90s. This shouldn't be a daily debate for years on end. One guy hasn't even ended his career yet. How much time are we going to waste on this garbage?

[3ball]

Jordan didn't have the same team for both 3-peats

Every teammate was different on the 2nd three-peat, except a player that would average 17 on 41% for that three-peat

So that proves MJ could win with anyone

[3BallSucks]

Jordan didn't have the same team for both 3-peats

Every teammate was different on the 2nd three-peat, except a player that would average 17 on 41% for that three-peat

So that proves MJ could win with anyone

Pippen is so bad that he outscored the opposing team's 2nd highest scorer in 5/6 finals.

[SATAN]

Jordan didn't have the same team for both 3-peats

Every teammate was different on the 2nd three-peat, except a player that would average 17 on 41% for that three-peat

So that proves MJ could win with anyone

lol

He just chose not to sometimes then. Got it.

[scuzzy]

ESPN did a survey of experts. Here are the results (in the order ESPN discussed them).

Tougher era: LeBron 64%, MJ 36%
Better teammate: Pippen 68%, Davis 32%
More accomplishments: LeBron 62%, MJ 38%
Greater accomplishment: 6 rings 72%, 10 finals 28%
Greater accomplishment: Two threepeats with same team 57%, chips with three teams 43%
Higher peak: MJ 82%, LeBron 18%
MJ is...: GOAT 62%, #2 32%, top 5 6%
LeBron is...: GOAT 23%, #2 55%, top 5 21%
Final # of titles for LeBron: Four 17%, Five 70%, Six 13%, Seven+ 0% (Avg. 4.95)
Rings LeBron needs to surpass MJ: Three 15%, four 15%, Five 11%, Six 28%, Seven 15%, LeBron can never surpass MJ 17%

The rings to surpass MJ has 30% putting him ahead of MJ now whereas 23% had LeBron as GOAT. The discrepancy is they included other players in the GOAT discussion.

Per this, if LeBron wins five 41% would put him ahead of MJ. 6 would break the dam and get LeBron to 69%.

Discussion of each question in the full article at https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/30102629/nba-predictions-how-lebron-james-tops-michael-jordan-goat-status.
:pimp:

[Shooter]

Mike needed a perfectly crafted system. He needed it tailor made to win. Mike won because of a system.

He needed to have an elite 2 way player at small forward, No Pip? NO CHIP. He needed the legendary GOAT head coach. He had to play in Chicago. He had to play under no legal zone defense.

Give LBJ the worst front office that hadn't won a championship in 50 years and he will find a way to win. Stick Lebron in Cleveland, Miami, Los Angeles. It doesn't matter. LeBron's number two option star can be a point guard like Kyrie, a shooting guard like Dwayne Wade, or a big man like Anthony Davis. Again, it doesn't matter, he always finds a way to win. And don't forget, Ty Lue is no Phil Jackson.

Michael needed a tailor made, perfectly crafted system to get out of the 1st round.

LeBron just needed a ball.

[Roundball_Rock]

Pippen is so bad that he outscored the opposing team's 2nd highest scorer in 5/6 finals.

:lol

[Bawkish]

Mike needed a perfectly crafted system. He needed it tailor made to win. Mike won because of a system.

He needed to have an elite 2 way player at small forward, No Pip? NO CHIP. He needed the legendary GOAT head coach. He had to play in Chicago. He had to play under no legal zone defense.

Give LBJ the worst front office that hadn't won a championship in 50 years and he will find a way to win. Stick Lebron in Cleveland, Miami, Los Angeles. It doesn't matter. LeBron's number two option star can be a point guard like Kyrie, a shooting guard like Dwayne Wade, or a big man like Anthony Davis. Again, it doesn't matter, he always finds a way to win. And don't forget, Ty Lue is no Phil Jackson.

Michael needed a tailor made, perfectly crafted system to get out of the 1st round.

LeBron just needed a ball.

If Bron just needed a ball, why didn't he stay in Cleveland for the rest of his career?

why keep hopping teams?

[Stanley Kobrick]

If Bron just needed a ball, why didn't he stay in Cleveland for the rest of his career?

why keep hopping teams?
he needed the challenge. lakers decade long losing drought, miami dry spell and then 30 year drought cleveland. the hardest road. and he chose them delivering a chip without pip

[Bawkish]

he needed the challenge. lakers decade long losing drought, miami dry spell and then 30 year drought cleveland. the hardest road. and he chose them delivering a chip without pip

i thought he just needed a ball, no challenge mentioned

i thought Bron could lift teams all by himself, he just needs a ball right?

[Stanley Kobrick]

i thought he just needed a ball, no challenge mentioned

i thought Bron could lift teams all by himself, he just needs a ball right?
no pip fo chips

[Spurs m8]

i thought he just needed a ball, no challenge mentioned

i thought Bron could lift teams all by himself, he just needs a ball right?

Nope.

He needs to collude with multiple all stars.

No rings without it

[And1AllDay]

Mike needed a perfectly crafted system. He needed it tailor made to win. Mike won because of a system.

He needed to have an elite 2 way player at small forward, No Pip? NO CHIP. He needed the legendary GOAT head coach. He had to play in Chicago. He had to play under no legal zone defense.

Give LBJ the worst front office that hadn't won a championship in 50 years and he will find a way to win. Stick Lebron in Cleveland, Miami, Los Angeles. It doesn't matter. LeBron's number two option star can be a point guard like Kyrie, a shooting guard like Dwayne Wade, or a big man like Anthony Davis. Again, it doesn't matter, he always finds a way to win. And don't forget, Ty Lue is no Phil Jackson.

Michael needed a tailor made, perfectly crafted system to get out of the 1st round.

LeBron just needed a ball.

Ether

[ArbitraryWater]

Damn, this is a hard hit for the MJ stans


Must jerk off to space jam now

[paksat]

congrats to all the shills employed by lebronze to brain wash the younger generation.

from espn trash shannon sharpe, all the way down to random message boards like this one.

tougher era lebronzes? LOL ok great job shills, great job @ thecorporation, and1allday, etc. etc.

[Spurs m8]

congrats to all the shills employed by lebronze to brain wash the younger generation.

from espn trash shannon sharpe, all the way down to random message boards like this one.

tougher era lebronzes? LOL ok great job shills, great job @ thecorporation, and1allday, etc. etc.

Shills would make the most sense....

No normal person goes around in real life saying these things.

Its manufactured on TV and only on the Internet

[LAmbruh]

god damn we stay winning


lots of top 10 lists finna be revised and revealing all year long


just make DJKhaled a ish emote for ease of fam access:pimp:

[guy]

It's hard to imagine that at 35 he could still have 3 rings left in him.

If he somehow pulls it off, I doubt there will be many people still arguing against him.

I find it highly unlikely I’ll ever put Lebron over Jordan. I mostly base my rankings around who I would build around to win the most championships, and despite the considerable edge in longevity for Lebron, Id probably still pick Jordan for a number of reasons assuming Lebron’s longevity doesn’t become much more incredible then I expect it to be.

With that said, I concede that his longevity has become greater then I thought it would. He’s just a freak of nature that we’ve never seen and he’s doing it in an era where the tools and methods to maintaining your body and prolonging your career are much more advanced. So it’s not out of the realm of possibility at this point that he can end up winning as much or more then Jordan especially with AD at his side. If that’s the case, yes I can see him becoming the GOAT in the public/media’s view. With that resume, it’s just going to be hard to argue with people that didn’t see Jordan play. And at this point I can’t count out the possibility that he he has 2-3 more years left of being close to his current level. Crazy as it sounds, but the guy just keeps on going and hasn’t given me a reason to think if someone is going to do something unprecedented like this that it’s not him.

[Kiddlovesnets]

god damn we stay winning


lots of top 10 lists finna be revised and revealing all year long


just make DJKhaled a ish emote for ease of fam access:pimp:

Updated top 25 player of all time by tier:
Tier 1(1): Michael Jordan
Tier 2(2-4): Kareem Abdul Jabbar, Magic Johnson, Lebron James
Tier 3(5-7): Bill Russell, Tim Duncan, Wilt Chamberlain
Tier 4(8-9): Larry Bird, Shaq O'neal
Tier 5(10-12): Hakeem Olajuwon, Oscar Robertson, Kobe Bryant
Tier 6(13-16): Moses Malone, John Havlicek, Jerry West, Kevin Durant
Tier 7(17-20): Dirk Nowitzki, Julies Irving, George Mikan, Stephen Curry
Tier 8(21-25): Karl Malone, Dwayne Wade, Scottie Pippen, Charles Barkley, Willis Reed

[guy]

Career wise it would be 99-1%...so clearly they are talking who the better player was.

I think you’re clearly wrong here. Unlike what you wrote in the OP the article asks “greater” teammate, not “better”. The article is mainly asking who’s “greater” between Jordan and Lebron in terms of their career so I would assume they are using the same definition for Pippen/AD.

And I don’t think it’s crazy that 1/3 of them would think that AD is already greater than Pippen. In terms of accomplishments he has more all-nba first teams, just as many all-star teams, and the same peak in MVP voting. He also blows Pippen out of the water statistically and is considered one of the greatest statistical players ever especially advanced stats (3rd in PER all time behind Jordan and Lebron) all while still being an all-time great defensive player. And even if it’s unfair, a lot of the media doesn’t care that much about 2nd banana rings but they do care about at least getting the monkey off your back which AD just did.

I would think that the only reason that Pippen is ranked ahead of AD by most is because of his longevity and number of rings. It’s not based on who’s “better”. And assuming he stays healthy, I doubt that will last especially if they win more.

[hateraid]

I am OP

[Roundball_Rock]

tougher era lebronzes? LOL ok great job shills, great job @ thecorporation, and1allday, etc. etc.


You think those experts (former players, coaches, journalists, etc.) are swayed by ISH posters? :oldlol:

[paksat]

You think those experts (former players, coaches, journalists, etc.) are swayed by ISH posters? :oldlol:

NO but these ISH posters aren't the only ones shilling either.

[Roundball_Rock]

NO but these ISH posters aren't the only ones shilling either.

True--but the media shilling is almost completely on behalf of MJ in the MJ vs. LeBron debate.