Comparing Kawhi vs Shaq first 9 seasons

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Shaq was voted 8th all-time on realgm, so I decided to compare his playoff career to kawhi for their first 9 seasons.

Kawhi vs Shaq first 9 year playoff comparison:

Kawhi: win shares, 20
Kawhi: VORP, 10.8

Shaq: win shares, 18
Shaq: VORP, 9.3

Kawhi why do you got to do Shaq like that? And shaq only had 1 strong title season after this as well.

Despite these old men being stubborn on their little lists, Kawhi is well on his way to be a top 5 player of all time and people just need to live with it and accept it.

[And1AllDay]

this guy stopped comparing careers at 9 years :oldlol:

keep going bb boi this is why longevity greatness matters

[Phoenix]

Shaq as a rookie was a more dominant force than Kawhi ever will be. Stop it.

[Phoenix]

Kawhi would be lucky to end up top 5 SF GOAT. Top 4 are Lebron, Bird, Dr. J and KD. Good luck.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Shaq as a rookie was a more dominant force than Kawhi ever will be. Stop it.

Then how come kawhi did shaq like that? Read OP advanced stat totals.

[Phoenix]

Then how come kawhi did shaq like that? Read OP advanced stat totals.

How come Kawhi lost to 7'1 Brian Windhorst? How'd those advanced stats work out then?

[paksat]

these fcking idiots and their analytics

I bet some 5 foot 8 white boy from the late 50's has some comparable stat

[HBK_Kliq_2]

How come Kawhi lost to 7'1 Brian Windhorst? How'd those advanced stats work out then?

Shaq got swept in the 1999 2nd round and averaged 0.5 assists.

[Phoenix]

Shaq got swept in the 1999 2nd round and averaged 0.5 assists.

To Tim Duncan and David Robinson, not getting embarrassed by 7'1 Windhorst going 6/22 playing Mickey Mouse hoops.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

To Tim Duncan and David Robinson, not getting embarrassed by 7'1 Windhorst going 6/22 playing Mickey Mouse hoops.

Jokic has a better 36 game playoff stretch then Duncan did to start his career.

Murray in 2020 playoffs put up way better numbers then David Robinson 1999

Kawhi didn't get swept like shaq did either

[Wally450]

When was Kawhi the most dominant force like Shaq was during those years?

[HBK_Kliq_2]

https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1=jokicni01&player_id2_hint=Tim+Duncan&player_id2_select=Tim+Duncan&player_id2=duncati01&p2yrfrom=1998&p2yrto=1999

Jokic in his first two playoff runs puts up better numbers then Duncan 98/99 playoff runs across the board. Phoenix you little midget.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

When was Kawhi the most dominant force like Shaq was during those years?

2019 entire playoffs, 2017 playoffs until injury, 2020 and 2016 1st round. Kawhi never had a clutch superstar on his team outside of maybe old Manu. While shaq had the ultimate closers in Kobe/Wade. So kawhi was way more clutch and better closer then Shaq ever was as well.

[Pipes2.0]

This fukking moron just compared the MDE to Kahwit. Just stop.

[Phoenix]

Jokic has a better 36 game playoff stretch then Duncan did to start his career.

Murray in 2020 playoffs put up way better numbers then David Robinson 1999

Kawhi didn't get swept like shaq did either

Duncan in his first 2 seasons was first team all nba twice, third in MVP voting in 99, finals MVP. Stop the bullfukkery.

With Murray putting up those numbers in 2020, what happened to Kahwi? 6/22 game 7 in the bubble all you can eat buffet for elite perimeter players.

Shaq> Kawhi

[Phoenix]

https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1=jokicni01&player_id2_hint=Tim+Duncan&player_id2_select=Tim+Duncan&player_id2=duncati01&p2yrfrom=1998&p2yrto=1999

Jokic in his first two playoff runs puts up better numbers then Duncan 98/99 playoff runs across the board. Phoenix you little midget.

Comparing 99 numbers when teams were scoring 80ppg with 2020 numbers when teams are scoring 70 by halftime. Back to the drawing board you little jizzrag.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Duncan in his first 2 seasons was first team all nba twice, third in MVP voting in 99, finals MVP. Stop the bullfukkery.

With Murray putting up those numbers in 2020, what happened to Kahwi? 6/22 game 7 in the bubble all you can eat buffet for elite perimeter players.

Shaq> Kawhi


https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1=jokicni01&player_id2_hint=Tim+Duncan&player_id2_select=Tim+Duncan&player_id2=duncati01&p2yrfrom=1998&p2yrto=1999

Jokic in his first two playoff runs puts up better numbers then Duncan 98/99 playoff runs across the board. Phoenix you little midget.

I already explained this, look at their playoff stats. Jokic is better then Duncan in points, rebounds, assists, BPM. Duncan wasn't that good in the 90's and only won finals MVP because he faced the 8th seed Knicks.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

This fukking moron just compared the MDE to Kahwit. Just stop.

Kawhi has better advanced stats, won with less help, better closer.

[Phoenix]

I already explained this, look at their playoff stats. Jokic is better then Duncan in points, rebounds, assists, BPM. Duncan wasn't that good in the 90's and only won finals MVP because he faced the 8th seed Knicks.

You didnt explain anything, you merely posted some numbers. And I explained you can't compare numbers in 99 and 2020. You're an idiot if you think scoring 20ppg in 99 and doing that in 2020 are remotely similar scenarios. Duncan in 99 averaged 21.7 during the season, his team averaged 93. Joker averaged 20ppg this season, his team averaged 111ppg. Do you need help doing the math on which player averaged a larger percentage of his teams points?

Duncan was first team all-nba as a rookie, 3rd in MVP as a 2nd year player. Not that good in the 90s though. Idiot.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

You didnt explain anything, you merely posted some numbers. And I explained you can't compare numbers in 99 and 2020. You're an idiot if you think scoring 20ppg in 99 and doing that in 2020 are remotely similar scenarios. Duncan in 99 averaged 21.7 during the season, his team averaged 93. Joker averaged 20ppg this season, his team averaged 111ppg. Do you need help doing the math on which player averaged a larger percentage of his teams points?

Duncan was first team all-nba as a rookie, 3rd in MVP as a 2nd year player. Not that good in the 90s though. Idiot.

Numbers in their own era and Jokic is better. Duncan would be played off the court in this era because he posts up too much. So you can't apply Duncan's numbers to this era. Jokic also has a higher BPM and that stands against any era.

Duncan just got a lot more all nba team hype cause he's a 1st pick and they have to promote the boring fella.

[Phoenix]

Numbers in their own era and Jokic is better. Duncan would be played off the court in this era because he posts up too much. So you can't apply Duncan's numbers to this era. Jokic also has a higher BPM and that stands against any era.

Duncan just got a lot more all nba team hype cause he's a 1st pick and they have to promote the boring fella.

What they averaged in their era is what they averaged. The point is comparing their numbers in a vaccum is dumb because 99 was a depressed offensive period compared to 2020 ball where any and every drops numbers. Relatively speaking, Duncans production within the context of his team 20 years ago was better than Jokic within the context of his in 2020. Not a difficult concept to grasp. You say Duncan would be played off the court in this era, but as recently as 2014 he was 15/10 at 37 years old playing 29 mins a night. That was 6 years ago, not the 60s. If someone like Rudy Gobert can be an All-NBA level center today theres no reason prime Duncan wouldn't adjust fine to this era. You're acting like he wasnt still a relevant player within the last 10 years when he was light years past his peak. Not sure what your obsession is with shitting on Duncan and the slurping of Kahwi but it's creepy.

Your second paragraph is so stupid it's not worth addressing but I'll humor you. Ever heard of Michael Olawakandi? How many first teams did he get? Kwame Brown? They don't hand out all nba awards to justify being picked first, jackass. You're literally a waste of sperm.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

What they averaged in their era is what they averaged. The point is comparing their numbers in a vaccum is dumb because 99 was a depressed offensive period compared to 2020 ball where any and every drops numbers. Relatively speaking, Duncans production within the context of his team 20 years ago was better than Jokic within the context of his in 2020. Not a difficult concept to grasp. You say Duncan would be played off the court in this era, but as recently as 2014 he was 15/10 at 37 years old playing 29 mins a night. That was 6 years ago, not the 60s. If someone like Rudy Gobert can be an All-NBA level center today theres no reason prime Duncan wouldn't adjust fine to this era. You're acting like he wasnt still a relevant player within the last 10 years when he was light years past his peak. Not sure what your obsession is with shitting on Duncan and the slurping of Kahwi but it's creepy.

Your second paragraph is so stupid it's not worth addressing but I'll humor you. Ever heard of Michael Olawakandi? How many first teams did he get? Kwame Brown? They don't hand out all nba awards to justify being picked first, jackass. You're literally a waste of sperm.

Duncan was a glorified role player in 2010s, he has a 3 BPM in 2010s. Duncan was never a superstar in 2010s and would be played off the court. That's why Duncan got eliminated by an 8th seed in 2011 and only had 5 total playoff wins from 2009-2011. Luckily for outdated tim Duncan, he had kawhi to save him.

Also as far as era, shaq was in the same era as Duncan and put up better scoring numbers. There's no excuses for Duncan. You also still never addressed how Jokic has a higher BPM and how that stat has nothing to do with era.

They aren't going to hand 1st teams to just any 1st round pick. If you are all-star level, they are more likely to give you all nba teams and that's my point. Duncan didn't deserve credit for 2013/2014, the stats say it was Kawhi.

[light]

Shaq was voted 8th all-time on realgm, so I decided to compare his playoff career to kawhi for their first 9 seasons.

Kawhi vs Shaq first 9 year playoff comparison:

Kawhi: win shares, 20
Kawhi: VORP, 10.8

Shaq: win shares, 18
Shaq: VORP, 9.3

Kawhi why do you got to do Shaq like that? And shaq only had 1 strong title season after this as well.

Despite these old men being stubborn on their little lists, Kawhi is well on his way to be a top 5 player of all time and people just need to live with it and accept it.

Kawhi is currently ranked 25th all time, which is amazing for him. He will rise on the list over time.

In order for him to even think about entering the top 10 he has to win MVP at some point and he needs more records and more great playoff games.

He's only had 1 significant playoff run and that is a good start but he needs several more.

[Phoenix]

Duncan was a glorified role player in 2010s, he has a 3 BPM in 2010s. Duncan was never a superstar in 2010s and would be played off the court. That's why Duncan got eliminated by an 8th seed in 2011 and only had 5 total playoff wins from 2009-2011. Luckily for outdated tim Duncan, he had kawhi to save him.

Also as far as era, shaq was in the same era as Duncan and put up better scoring numbers. There's no excuses for Duncan. You also still never addressed how Jokic has a higher BPM and how that stat has nothing to do with era.

They aren't going to hand 1st teams to just any 1st round pick. If you are all-star level, they are more likely to give you all nba teams and that's my point. Duncan didn't deserve credit for 2013/2014, the stats say it was Kawhi.


He was third team all-nba in 2015, 2nd team all-defensive in 2015. That's not a glorified role player, cupcake. This was 5 years ago and he wasnt getting played off the court .You're some trolling statwhore quoting BPM and VORP who quite clearly knows nothing, and googles everything you think about basketball. Try to form a cohesive argument that isnt structured around repeating BPM. And if you want to stick by that stat, both Giannia and Harden have a higher BPM this year so by your logic both are better than Kawhi. He was also 8th in BPM last year, 2nd in 2017, and 3rd in 2015. You in your infinite stupidity want to declare Kawhi GOAT but based on BPM he's never been the best player in any give season, let alone the best ever. You need to get off basketball reference handpicking random stats and watch a game.

Your point about first teams and 1st picks continued to be stupid. You said Duncan wasnt that good in the 90s. And I'm saying he was first team as a rookie. Had nothing to do with being the 1st pick. You're a fukking c*nt who should have been banned 2 months ago after the Clippers lost due to Kawhit going 6/22.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Kawhi is currently ranked 25th all time, which is amazing for him. He will rise on the list over time.

In order for him to even think about entering the top 10 he has to win MVP at some point and he needs more records and more great playoff games.

He's only had 1 significant playoff run and that is a good start but he needs several more.

Winning MVP has a lot to do with hype. You have to remember that nba is a hype machine at the end of the day. Kawhi could of won it in 2017 but people went with Westbrook's triple double hype, kawhi could of won it in 2016 but people went with Curry's 73 game win hype. Kawhi has already had three different seasons in the top 5 MVP voting.

2012 - all rookie 1st team
2013/2014 - back to back finals and finals mvp
2015/2016 - back to back defensive player of the year
2016/2017 - back to back top 5 MVP candidate years
2019 - finals MVP
2020 - top 5 MVP candidate year

He has done literally everything you can ask for. The only thing you can nitpick on is him not getting the ball enough in his early spurs days and him not having good enough teammates in 2015-present.

[Phoenix]

Kawhi is currently ranked 25th all time, which is amazing for him. He will rise on the list over time.

In order for him to even think about entering the top 10 he has to win MVP at some point and he needs more records and more great playoff games.

He's only had 1 significant playoff run and that is a good start but he needs several more.

That clown thinks Kawhi is the GOAT on the basis of a roleplayer FMVP award, and an asterisk chip in 2019. Dude barely made the ISH top ten small forwards list and this clown HBK_Klit thinks he's GOAT when he's barely been a star since 2015, and one of those years he barely played.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

That clown thinks Kawhi is the GOAT on the basis of a roleplayer FMVP award, and an asterisk chip in 2019. Dude barely made the ISH top ten small forwards list and this clown HBK_Klit thinks he's GOAT when he's barely been a star since 2015, and one of those years he barely played.

Your argument is handpicking a year and ignoring everything else. I'm looking at Duncan 2010-2016 entire playoffs he averaged 3.3 BPM and 16% win share 48 which is very good role player numbers.

Kawhi was clearly the best player in 2016,2017,2020 regular season and clearly best player in 2019,2017 playoffs. Votes don't mean shit, that's all hype.

Jokic's BPM was higher then Duncan and you laugh at Jokic. I don't laugh at anybody who has a higher BPM then Kawhi. That's my point. I've talked to 6 year olds that are smarter then you.

[Phoenix]

Your argument is handpicking a year and ignoring everything else. I'm looking at Duncan 2010-2016 entire playoffs he averaged 3.3 BPM and 16% win share 48 which is very good role player numbers.

Kawhi was clearly the best player in 2016,2017,2020 regular season and clearly best player in 2019,2017 playoffs. Votes don't mean shit, that's all hype.

Jokic's BPM was higher then Duncan and you laugh at Jokic. I don't laugh at anybody who has a higher BPM then Kawhi. That's my point. I've talked to 6 year olds that are smarter then you.

My argument is that a 37 year old Duncan was still an all NBA caliber performer as recent as 2015. Your asinine take was that Duncan would get run off the court if he played today, so if a 37 year old Duncan is third team all nba in 2015, what's 25 year old Duncan doing? Those 6 year olds you claim are smarter than me would extrapolate that he'd be more than fine, so what does that say about you?

Based on BPM Kawhi has never been the best player. You use BPM comparing Joker and Duncan, so don't back away from that position now. He was 8th in BPM in 2019 so you consent that 7 players were better than him that year on that measure. Or, maybe more goes into 'whose better' than picking some stat you think looks good for one agenda but betrays you in other ways. So how we doing this? Giannis and Harden were better this year, right? BPM says so.

[And1AllDay]

imagine thinking leading your team in finals scoring for only one year while shaq did it 5 and forgetting shaq > kawhit. Even Curry has 3 of them.


kiwi needs at least 4 more to tie shaq :oldlol:

keep up :oldlol:

[SATAN]

OP...There's a reason no one ever agrees with you. You're really bad at this. You just keep digging the hole for yourself deeper and deeper while everyone just thinks you're an idiotic casual. It's not a matter of anyone here disliking Kawit and being biased. It's a matter of you stating some ridiculous shit about Kawit and then when someone disagrees or points out a flaw in the logic of your post, you just make your original point look worse as the thread progresses. You get out maneuvered every time. I stopped responding to your threads and posts because they're so pathetic. I feel sorry for you. No offense.

[And1AllDay]

OP...There's a reason no one ever agrees with you. You're really bad at this. You just keep digging the hole for yourself deeper and deeper while everyone just thinks you're an idiotic casual. It's not a matter of anyone here disliking Kawit and being biased. It's a matter of you stating some ridiculous shit about Kawit and then when someone disagrees or points out a flaw in the logic of your post, you just make your original point look worse as the thread progresses. You get out maneuvered every time. I stopped responding to your threads and posts because they're so pathetic. I feel sorry for you. No offense.

ouch :oldlol:

Op wrekt

[AussieSteve]

Honestly, Kawhi is just your run of the mill great player. The kind that comes around a few times each generation. That's it. There's not much about him to make a fuss about in my opinion.

[8Ball]

This idiot just put Kawhi ahead of Shaq....

Not even worth any words to argue. :facepalm

[Phoenix]

OP...There's a reason no one ever agrees with you. You're really bad at this. You just keep digging the hole for yourself deeper and deeper while everyone just thinks you're an idiotic casual. It's not a matter of anyone here disliking Kawit and being biased. It's a matter of you stating some ridiculous shit about Kawit and then when someone disagrees or points out a flaw in the logic of your post, you just make your original point look worse as the thread progresses. You get out maneuvered every time. I stopped responding to your threads and posts because they're so pathetic. I feel sorry for you. No offense.

Its clearly a troll account. I actually like Kawhi but he hasn't reached any level we haven't seen before or had a career yet that warrants this level of stanning. Not sure who this is an alt of, but it's clearly a gimmick.

[8Ball]

Dunno why he continues to stan Kawhi so hard after what happened against Denver....

I'd imagine he'd disappear for a few months but nope...

[And1AllDay]

Dunno why he continues to stan Kawhi so hard after what happened against Denver....

I'd imagine he'd disappear for a few months but nope...

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