Classic Jordan lockdown defensive highlights

[Im so nba'd out]

https://youtu.be/UQZnESjOkyA

vintage Joran shutting down the pistons

[dankok8]

Game 4 of 1989 ECF: (same series)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRh7__fN1zU

Game 7 of 1998 ECF:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPlPNDXkIYk

The second video is especially crazy. 35 year old MJ chasing Reggie around screens getting hit left right and center. Honestly people talk about hand-checking all the time but you used to get hit hard on screens and it wouldn't be called and it's not just Jordan's era. It was like that well into the 2000's.. Only in the last 10-15 years you can't set hard screens. It's automatically a charge nowadays.

Anyways great defense much of the time isn't even contesting let alone blocking a shot but deterring the guy from shooting in the first place. Reggie not only had 0 points in the 4th quarter but he only took 1 shot and a big part of that was MJ just closing down his air space.

[Honor Boost]

Jordan doesn't even hardly look to me like he's playing defense in that clip, I guess that is a reason why he wasn't successful against the Pistons.

[dankok8]

Jordan doesn't even hardly look to me like he's playing defense in that clip, I guess that is a reason why he wasn't successful against the Pistons.

Yea... OP's video has a few good defensive plays but it's actually not one of his best games. Check the videos I posted.

[aj1987]

Yea... OP's video has a few good defensive plays but it's actually not one of his best games. Check the videos I posted.

If you reference Nobody Touches Jordan in your posts, you should be automatically disqualified from talking basketball. Ever. Dude literally has no idea about anything related to basketball.

[Reggie43]

Huge reason why the Pacers had the lead in the 4th and was close till the end in that game 7 was the Pacers exploiting mismatches against the Bulls, force feeding Smits against Kukoc/Longley or whomever Pacer has an advantage.

Jordan Stans trying to change the narrative is sickening. Would gladly take Miller not scoring or attempt anything if it puts the Pacers in a better position to win. Watched that game live and had full trust on what the Pacers were doing. Jordan getting superstar calls by barrelling his body towards defenders and them being faster to looseballs is how they lost that game not because "Jordan held Miller to one attempt bullshit"

And for the record Miller holding Jordan to 36% shooting on 9/25 fga as his primary defender is the best defensive performance in that game easily. All this while scoring 22 points 54fg% while nursing a sprained ankle suffered mid series. He got shutdown in the 4th because of the great defense but also because he was passive and they ran the plays for Smits who led the Pacers to a win the game prior by scoring 11/12 fga on 92 fg% for 25 points against the same aforementioned defenders.

[dankok8]

If you reference Nobody Touches Jordan in your posts, you should be automatically disqualified from talking basketball. Ever. Dude literally has no idea about anything related to basketball.

The guy is probably a Jordan stan but it's not like he fabricated the footage... Everyone can watch and make their own conclusions.

[dankok8]

Huge reason why the Pacers had the lead in the 4th and was close till the end in that game 7 was the Pacers exploiting mismatches against the Bulls, force feeding Smits against Kukoc/Longley or whomever Pacer has an advantage.

Jordan Stans trying to change the narrative is sickening. Would gladly take Miller not scoring or attempt anything if it puts the Pacers in a better position to win. Watched that game live and had full trust on what the Pacers were doing. Jordan getting superstar calls by barrelling his body towards defenders and them being faster to looseballs is how they lost that game not because "Jordan held Miller to one attempt bullshit"

And for the record Miller holding Jordan to 36% shooting on 9/25 fga as his primary defender is the best defensive performance in that game easily. All this while scoring 22 points 54fg% while nursing a sprained ankle suffered mid series. He got shutdown in the 4th because of the great defense but also because he was passive and they ran the plays for Smits who led the Pacers to a win the game prior by scoring 11/12 fga on 92 fg% for 25 points against the same aforementioned defenders.

I admit the Bulls won because MJ and Pippen got a lot of calls in the 4th quarter. They shot like 20 free throws or something like that.

[Reggie43]

I admit the Bulls won because MJ and Pippen got a lot of calls in the 4th quarter. They shot like 20 free throws or something like that.

The more agressive team will always get the calls, its just too bad that nobody on the Pacers is as naturally gifted athletically like Jordan and Pippen because both teams did whatever it takes to win and both deserved to advance to the Finals imo. In fairness Jordan gained a lot of respect for this game because he persevered through a bad shooting night by playing great defense, getting to the line and hustling for rebounds and looseballs. He also had great help from Kukoc and Pippen. Toni having a huge game was the dagger for me as a Pacers fan because it was unexpected and he did it in a key part of the game.

[3ball]

The more agressive team will always get the calls, its just too bad that nobody on the Pacers is as naturally gifted athletically like Jordan and Pippen because both teams did whatever it takes to win and both deserved to advance to the Finals imo. In fairness Jordan gained a lot of respect for this game because he persevered through a bad shooting night by playing great defense, getting to the line and hustling for rebounds and looseballs. He also had great help from Kukoc and Pippen. Toni having a huge game was the dagger for me as a Pacers fan because it was unexpected and he did it in a key part of the game.

Jordan is the only guy in history where 16 on 39% from his sidekick is considered "good help"

If AD got those numbers, everyone would say he sucks and lebron had no help.

Only Jordan beat top 5 SRS teams with poor scoring and efficiency from his sidekick, aka carry-jobs against good teams... it's rarely ever done, and certainly lebron never did it

[8Ball]

Jordan is the only guy in history where 16 on 39% from his sidekick is considered "good help"

If AD got those numbers, everyone would say he sucks and lebron had no help.

Only Jordan beat top 5 SRS teams with poor scoring and efficiency from his sidekick, aka carry-jobs against good teams... it's rarely ever done, and certainly lebron never did it

Jordan's side kick was still miles ahead of any sidekick in the finals of the opposing team.

If Jordan had to play the Celtics or the 80s Lakers we all know what would happen.

[Reggie43]

Jordan is the only guy in history where 16 on 39% from his sidekick is considered "good help"

If AD got those numbers, everyone would say he sucks and lebron had no help.

Only Jordan beat top 5 SRS teams with poor scoring and efficiency from his sidekick, aka carry-jobs against good teams... it's rarely ever done, and certainly lebron never did it

Defense is a thing and Pippen was at his best in this particular series. He seems to be inefficient at times in the playoffs scoring the ball but his all around brilliance usually makes up for it.

[3ball]

https://i.makeagif.com/media/4-07-2019/4EMYLq.gif


* The youtube channel "Nobody Touches Jordan" did a video of Payton guarding MJ in Game 4 of 1996 Finals (link here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgFWyLRNsGk)) - MJ was doubled exactly 10 of the 20 times he caught the ball with Payton guarding - all 10 double-teams are shown if gifs here:


http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11792377&postcount=161

[3ball]

.

Jordan's side kick was still miles ahead of any sidekick in the finals of the opposing team.

If Jordan had to play the Celtics or the 80s Lakers we all know what would happen.



Pippen was destroyed in the playoffs every year that the Bulls contended:



1989 - in the ECF, Pippen was destroyed by Dumars

1990 - in the ECF, Pippen was destroyed by Dumars

1992 - in the 92' ECSF, Pippen was destroyed by X-man... MJ had to literally save Pippen in Game 7 (gif in previous post above).

1993 - in the 1st Round, pippen was destroyed by Dominique and Willis.. Dominique doubled pippen's scoring average of 15 on 39%

1994 - in the ECSF, Pippen was destroyed by Ewing

1995 - In the 1st Round, Pippen was destroyed by Larry Johnson and then Penny in the 2nd Round

1996 - in the Finals, Pippen averaged 15 on 34% and was outplayed by Schrempf, Payton and Kemp.. by game 4, pippen's ineptitude had the sonics doubling Jordan 50% of the time he caught the ball (shown in previous post)

1997 - In the 1st Round, Pippen was destroyed Juwan Howard.

1998 - In the ECF, Pippen was outplayed by 2nd option Rik Smits..

[┌∩┐(﹒︠益﹒︡)┌∩┐]

Jordan is the only guy in history where 16 on 39% from his sidekick is considered "good help"

If AD got those numbers, everyone would say he sucks and lebron had no help.

Only Jordan beat top 5 SRS teams with poor scoring and efficiency from his sidekick, aka carry-jobs against good teams... it's rarely ever done, and certainly lebron never did it

You're looking at just raw stats

The best perimeter defender of era whose also a elite playmaker is considered good help for anybody

[light]

https://youtu.be/UQZnESjOkyA

vintage Joran shutting down the pistons

Cute.

LeBron does that to everybody - from small guys to centers.

[dankok8]

^ Lebron can switch on big men and not get burned because of his strength but there isn't another area of defense where he's better than MJ. And that's being 100% honest. MJ was so good at moving with his feet and keeping his man in front of him. The perfect example is that AI crossover. He crossed MJ over so bad and yet MJ almost recovered fast enough to block him. MJ was perhaps the best ever at getting steals and playing the passing lanes. His hands were so damn quick. Help defense, pressuring his man into passing the ball even pressing down the court. Chasedown blocks are considered Lebron's specialty but MJ had a fair bit of those too. He really could do it all.

Here is another defensive gem by MJ:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLa2NoCwUKY

He got credited with 5 steals but it feels like he had 10... seriously it's insane.

And just for fun a block party compilation:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzdQjVBeHOw

[dankok8]

The more agressive team will always get the calls, its just too bad that nobody on the Pacers is as naturally gifted athletically like Jordan and Pippen because both teams did whatever it takes to win and both deserved to advance to the Finals imo. In fairness Jordan gained a lot of respect for this game because he persevered through a bad shooting night by playing great defense, getting to the line and hustling for rebounds and looseballs. He also had great help from Kukoc and Pippen. Toni having a huge game was the dagger for me as a Pacers fan because it was unexpected and he did it in a key part of the game.

Yea no doubt. Toni was big in that one. It's a little hazy for me but I remember watching that game live as a kid. Reggie Miller was one of my favorite players. I didn't like the Bulls at the time.

[Manny98]

MI never locked down elite 25+ ppg scorers, his biggest accomplishment was shutting down Magic who's not even known for his scoring + he had the help of Pippen

Show me Jordan shutting down top tier scorers like


https://youtu.be/rkm3LVYhInM


https://youtu.be/B-xvPqW_6fk


https://youtu.be/w0C3el_99Kw

[tpols]

https://i.makeagif.com/media/4-07-2019/4EMYLq.gif


Damn... look at how pippen avoids eye contact in the fight. That's a beta. And then MJ swoops in like the alpha wolf and looks the bully dead in his eyes. The X-man wasn't only good at basketball... he was on some prison ball shit mentally. And Scottie was shook. Jordan, for whatever reason, even though he seemingly grew up in a nice household in the country, was totally ruthless.

[┌∩┐(﹒︠益﹒︡)┌∩┐]

Damn... look at how pippen avoids eye contact in the fight. That's a beta. And then MJ swoops in like the alpha wolf and looks the bully dead in his eyes. The X-man wasn't only good at basketball... he was on some prison ball shit mentally. And Scottie was shook. Jordan, for whatever reason, even though he seemingly grew up in a nice household in the country, was totally ruthless.

Why are you analyzing this so closely. Grown sweaty men and u want to figure out which one is a man's man, are you a 40 year old woman watching basketball for the first time?

[Stanley Kobrick]

Why are you analyzing this so closely. Grown sweaty men and u want to figure out which one is a man's man, are you a 40 year old woman watching basketball for the first time?
:cheers:

[3ball]

You're looking at just raw stats

The best perimeter defender of era whose also a elite playmaker is considered good help for anybody

AD is a better defender than pippen, so defense means nothing compared to offense

If AD scored 16 on 40% like Pippen, the Lakers would lose in the 1st Round.. the Lakers needed AD to lead them in scoring at nearly 30 ppg for the regular season and playoffs

Otoh, Pippen averaged 16 on 40% in 2 Finals, 4 ECF, and the 7 game war in the 92' ECSF... 19 on 42% in 6 Finals.... 17 on 41% in 96-98' Playoffs... 12 on 42% against the 88-90' Pistons

[3ball]

Btw, Jordan was a top 5 dpoy candidate every year

So his standard was dpoy candidate and #1 scorer, while Lebron's standard is no all-defense in 7 years and #15 scorer

[Manny98]

Btw, Jordan was a top 5 dpoy candidate every year

So his standard was dpoy candidate and #1 scorer, while Lebron's standard is no all-defense in 7 years and #15 scorer
Peak Lebron was better defensively than MJ but MJ was more consistent over the course of his career on that end

[3ball]

Peak Lebron was better defensively than MJ but MJ was more consistent over the course of his career on that end

Lebron was never dpoy

So you're wrong and just biased as usual

Lebron is not great and actually destroyed the game (replaced organic basketball with talent-based winning)

[1987_Lakers]

Peak Lebron was better defensively than MJ but MJ was more consistent over the course of his career on that end

Big Facts

[3ball]

Big Facts

^^^ nothing supports lebron having a higher defensive peak

Nothing

Not the stats... not the accolades... And david west treated lebron like a junior-higher and destroyed him.. . Spolestra had to change the whole plan once it was clear lebron couldn't stop West

And Lebron was never dpoy

So you're wrong and just biased as usual

Lebron is not great and actually destroyed the game (replaced organic basketball with talent-based winning)

[Manny98]

Lebron was never dpoy

So you're wrong and just biased as usual

Lebron is not great and actually destroyed the game (replaced organic basketball with talent-based winning)
Tim Duncan never won DPOY either yet he is regarded by some as the best defensive player ever

[3ball]

Tim Duncan never won DPOY either yet he is regarded by some as the best defensive player ever

Lebron hasn't been all-defense in 7 years

Jordan was dpoy candidate every year (top 5 dpoy voting)

Massive difference.. lebron isn't in Jordan's league as a defender.. or scorer...

Jordan's standard was #1 scorer and dpoy candidate, while lebron's standard is no defense and #15 scorer
.

[Manny98]

Lebron hasn't been all-defense in 7 years

Jordan was dpoy candidate every year (top 5 dpoy voting)

Massive difference.. lebron isn't in Jordan's league as a defender.. or scorer...

Jordan's standard was #1 scorer and dpoy candidate, while lebron's standard is no defense and #15 scorer
.
I did agree that Jordan was more consistent defensively throughout his career

But imo Miami LeBron when locked in was a better defender than MJ ever was due to his sheer versatility and ability to switch onto anyone on the court

[dankok8]

In their peaks MJ and Lebron were both great defenders. MJ was a better man-to-man defender by far. If another team had a hot player you needed to neutralize MJ wins in that. He just moves laterally much more quickly. This is very evident on film. MJ also has faster hands and gets more steals. Where Lebron excels is switching on screens... he can switch on to basically any position 1 through 4. Whereas MJ got overpowered getting switched on someone like Barkley, Lebron could probably hold his own against Chuck. When people say Lebron can guard centers they are taking it a bit far though. But yes he is definitely more versatile. The thing about MJ when you watch him guarding Reggie is that he would run around and fight through screens. In today's era this barely exists anymore and teams always switch but back then you used to fight through screens. That's a stylistic difference between the 90's and today.

Bottom line is I think at their peaks MJ was probably a bit better defensively although calling it a wash it reasonable... I know steals don't capture defense in its entirety or anywhere close but it's hard to ignore 3.2 steals and 1.6 blocks MJ averaged in 1988 when he won DPOY. Those stats show the havoc MJ caused on defense. Longevity wise definitely edge Jordan on the defensive end.

[3ball]

In their peaks MJ and Lebron were both great defenders. MJ was a better man-to-man defender by far. If another team had a hot player you needed to neutralize MJ wins in that. He just moves laterally much more quickly. This is very evident on film. MJ also has faster hands and gets more steals. Where Lebron excels is switching on screens... he can switch on to basically any position 1 through 4. Whereas MJ got overpowered getting switched on someone like Barkley, Lebron could probably hold his own against Chuck. When people say Lebron can guard centers they are taking it a bit far though. But yes he is definitely more versatile. The thing about MJ when you watch him guarding Reggie is that he would run around and fight through screens. In today's era this barely exists anymore and teams always switch but back then you used to fight through screens. That's a stylistic difference between the 90's and today.

Bottom line is I think at their peaks MJ was probably a bit better defensively although calling it a wash it reasonable... I know steals don't capture defense in its entirety or anywhere close but it's hard to ignore 3.2 steals and 1.6 blocks MJ averaged in 1988 when he won DPOY. Those stats show the havoc MJ caused on defense. Longevity wise definitely edge Jordan on the defensive end.

Defensive versatility doesn't = good defense

Lebron hasn't been all-defense for 7 years... Or mvp

[aj1987]

The guy is probably a Jordan stan but it's not like he fabricated the footage... Everyone can watch and make their own conclusions.

What he infers from the footage is absolutely horrendous and people just fall for it. They just look at the title and post those videos, without actually looking at the footage and analyzing it.