Jordan played like a crackhead on defense.

[999Guy]

A doped up pickpocket on an inner city street corner.

This might be the least fundamental, worst, mentally shitty defense I’ve ever seen on film. And it’s from Jordan...The supposed GOAT.

He literally played defense like a cross between Monta Ellis and Gerald Green. Two players I’ve seen enough of to despise on defense, and that’s his stylistic comparison.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5aNUS762wM&t=15m43s.
Gambling idiot on and off the court.

Look at the plays from 18th minute on.

He was an actual scrub with insane athleticism on defense. Puts into perspective what it takes to win a title. I actually can’t believe they didn’t get upset even once with him being this...dumb. I’m much lower on him now.

I think in the modern era, teams like SA and GS would’ve exposed his weaknesses on both ends because boy did they exist.

[warriorfan]

Cringe.

[ArbitraryWater]

Lol, MJ getting more and more exposed in this digital age with a bigger microscope...


dude was swiping like crazy.

Hack style defense

[3ball]

Top 5 DPOY every year from 88-98'

And scoring champ

That's the top level on both sides of the ball - no one else was this high on both sides

Otoh, lebron hasn't been all-defense in 8 years and is #15 scorer - so a totally lower level

Btw, I'm noticing a lot of pro-pippen and anti-jordan videos on youtube lately.. clutch sports propoganda

edit: Jordan was #6 for dpoy in 96' and 97'

[GrayGoat]

Who was MJ’s toughest opponent in the finals?

[3ball]

Who was MJ’s toughest opponent in the finals?

You can't compare 2-star teams (bulls and their opponents) to 3-star teams (lebron's teams and opponents)

Bottom line - lebron had his own big 3's and rarely faced a talent deficit

[8Ball]

Who was MJ’s toughest opponent in the finals?

The 73 win Warriors?

The 2018 Warriors?

The Spurs dynasty?

The 2012 3 headed OKC monster?

[eliteballer]

Why does LeBron use steroids?

[coin24]

20 years on, still living rent free in f@ggots like OPs head..

GOAT

[3ball]

The 73 win Warriors?

The 2018 Warriors?

The Spurs dynasty?

The 2012 3 headed OKC monster?

If MJ had a 3rd star teammate, he would've won 15 titles in 15 years and swept every series.. maybe he'd have a few 5 game series but otherwise it's lights out

So Lebron gets knocked for losing with big 3's... Heck, kyrie > curry, yet Lebron got destroyed in 2017

There's no excuse for losing with big 3's

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

OP is a lame. :oldlol: Kinda weakass 'analysis' is that?

Video nitpicked a few clips of Mike gambling on defense, but his impact was STILL among the best of any perimeter player. Ever. RAPM/APM etc all back that up.

[1987_Lakers]

Damn, that dude roasted MJ's defense. "Not quite an All-Time defensive wing" :oldlol:

His gambling on defense was one of the things that frustrated me about Kobe, can't count how many times I saw Kobe just watch and try to be a hero in making a play on defense on a guy he wasn't assigned to, ignoring his man assignment and end up getting burnt for it. It was pretty damn obvious Kobe was making All-Defensive Teams he shouldn't have made by the time he was in his late 20's - early 30's.

[3ball]

Jordan held his defensive assignment to 35-43% shooting in almost every series

This includes being the primary defender on Magic, Drexler, Miller, Dumars, Majerle, Isiah and many more

Otoh, Pippen let Dumas, Kersey, Worthy, Penny and many more shoot 45-57%

[Bronbron23]

I should of stopped watching at "mj didn't have a quick first step":facepalm

This dude obviously knows absolutely nothing about the game. Gambling in the lanes and using those big ass hands was how phil wanted pip and mj to play. He wanted them in transition as much as possible and turnovers were the best way to do that.

Imagine telling one of the best perimeter defenders ever not to use his biggest asset on defense. Wtf did I just watch :facepalm

[1987_Lakers]

I should of stopped watching at "mj didn't have a quick first step":facepalm



Huh? He literally says at the 1:55 mark that MJ had an incredible first step.

MJ stans just butthurt as expected.

That gambling defense on Magic was atrocious, Magic made him his bitch, good thing MJ had Pippen to step in and save the day in guarding Magic.

[3ball]

Huh? He literally says at the 1:55 mark that MJ had an incredible first step.

MJ stans just butthurt as expected.

That gambling defense on Magic was atrocious, Magic made him his bitch, good thing MJ had Pippen to step in and save the day in guarding Magic.


MJ was the primary defender on Magic and guarded him for 70% of the series

It's sad because Magic was normally guarded by forwards... But everyone knew the assignment was too big for pippen in his first Finals, so MJ did Pippen's job for him and guarded Magic...

They literally didn't want pippen to have another migraine.. :facepalm:... you guys don't seem to get it - pippen was NOTHING in 91'

[JohnMax]

He's 6-0 in finals because Bulls would turn on defensive intensity at the end of games and outplay teams in clutch.

[1987_Lakers]

MJ was the primary defender on Magic and guarded him for 70% of the series

It's sad because Magic was normally guarded by forwards... But everyone knew the assignment was too big for pippen in his first Finals, so MJ did Pippen's job for him and guarded Magic... They literally didn't want pippen to have another migraine.. you guys don't seem to get it - pippen was NOTHING in 91'

Pippen took the responsibilities to guard Magic, he came in and played solid D, MJ on the other hand was swiping and gambling like a mad man at Magic, giving up easy buckets. MJ exposed as an overrated defender, deal with it.

[3ball]

He's 6-0 in finals because Bulls would turn on defensive intensity at the end of games and outplay teams in clutch.

They still had to score in the clutch and mj scored about 90% of the clutch points many nights..

In the 97' and 98' Playoffs, he had 23 and 30 clutch points, respectively... That's more than the remaining team combined

Clutch is defined as last 5 minutes, within 5

[dankok8]

The guy who made the video in the OP is a very respected analyst and knows what he's talking about. And he's very very objective dissecting every players strengths and weaknesses. Within his dominant defense, yes MJ gambled a lot and it's true. However he himself states that MJ was still a very positive defender. In his top 40 career breakdowns he says that MJ's defensive impact wasn't near that of the greatest defensive big men... which is obvious. No perimeter player can ever be but he was a dominant defensive player at his position. Whoever says otherwise knows nothing and deserves no response.

[3ball]

This is how you gamble... and CLOSE:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4v0Fjy0GJlc


More lateral quickness at 35 than Kawhi or nearly any prime young player

[Axe]

Op having a meltdown on his dup because he went overdosed

[Axe]

OP is a lame. :oldlol: Kinda weakass 'analysis' is that?

Video nitpicked a few clips of Mike gambling on defense, but his impact was STILL among the best of any perimeter player. Ever. RAPM/APM etc all back that up.
/thread

[HoopsNY]

Pippen took the responsibilities to guard Magic, he came in and played solid D, MJ on the other hand was swiping and gambling like a mad man at Magic, giving up easy buckets. MJ exposed as an overrated defender, deal with it.

This kid still yackin? How many times must I send you back to your room?

[1987_Lakers]

This kid still yackin? How many times must I send you back to your room?

https://i.imgur.com/4bUV7Ls.gif

[Mauzah]

I'd take a crackhead on defense over a lazy statue

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia.giphy.com%2Fmedia%2F1BGPLg0 KIG7zpIwLQc%2Fgiphy.gif&f=1&nofb=1

[TheGoatest]

All those blatant uncalled fouls, and yet he never had a defensive rating below 100.

[3ball]

Pippen took the responsibilities to guard Magic, he came in and played solid D, MJ on the other hand was swiping and gambling like a mad man at Magic, giving up easy buckets. MJ exposed as an overrated defender, deal with it.

Even though forwards normally defend Magic, the Bulls only gave Pippen spot-duty on Magic

it was pippen's first Finals, and they knew he couldn't handle such a big responsibility from the outset - they literally didn't want him to get another migraine and cost the team another title

^^^ this is exactly what happened... Pippen only did spot-duty on Magic because they were protecting him!!.. as usual, only MJ would be held responsible for victory

No one gave a shit that 80's Jordan had no cast - he was expected to elevate teammates like Magic and Bird.. and even when Pippen was getting all-nba, no one paid attention to whether he was playing well or poor - he was never held responsible for wins or losses, even though he was the only guy having bad series (Jordan never had a bad series)

[Bronbron23]

Huh? He literally says at the 1:55 mark that MJ had an incredible first step.

MJ stans just butthurt as expected.

That gambling defense on Magic was atrocious, Magic made him his bitch, good thing MJ had Pippen to step in and save the day in guarding Magic.

Nah he said his first step wasn't amazing but it was his acceleration that was next level.

And yeah mj couldn't gaurd magic and pip was clutch defensively. Not sure what that proves though. I can find a series or game where other great defenders couldn't gaird certain players. Bron included

[tpols]

I'd take a crackhead on defense over a lazy statue

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia.giphy.com%2Fmedia%2F1BGPLg0 KIG7zpIwLQc%2Fgiphy.gif&f=1&nofb=1

Kooz. :oldlol: :lol

The disrepect. :facepalm

MJ would've whooped his ass back in the locker room.

[ArbitraryWater]

I'd take a crackhead on defense over a lazy statue

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia.giphy.com%2Fmedia%2F1BGPLg0 KIG7zpIwLQc%2Fgiphy.gif&f=1&nofb=1

LeBron forcing a missed shot :bowdown:

[Bronbron23]

LeBron forcing a missed shot :bowdown:

They crazy shit is i don't even think yall are trolling anymore. Yall actually believe this shit:facepalm

[SATAN]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUkoL1Ob6ag

[Bronbron23]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUkoL1Ob6ag

Hahaha yeah he was a terrible dancer. No rythem what so ever.

[8Ball]

They crazy shit is i don't even think yall are trolling anymore. Yall actually believe this shit:facepalm

He's trolling obviously. Kuzma has to call for a switch there and didn't. Still a missed shot :applause:

Jordan played very good defence. You don't make all-defensive teams and play bad defence.

[Bronbron23]

He's trolling obviously. Kuzma has to call for a switch there and didn't. Still a missed shot :applause:

Jordan played very good defence. You don't make all-defensive teams and play bad defence.

Yeah i actually defended bron on this when this happened. It wasn't a big deal. This happens a fair amount in basketball where a guy will push or guide his teammate in the right direction or direction they want them to go. This was an extreme example because kuzma pushed him hard but it was no big deal.

[ArbitraryWater]

They crazy shit is i don't even think yall are trolling anymore. Yall actually believe this shit:facepalm


I will refer you to this post:


stop trying to act unbothered or above.

Every single pro Bron post has your panties in a twist and you try to give a cool response ending it with "shit like this", "bron stans", "this is why"..

Always the same formula, you clown.
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?488817-What-s-it-like-having-a-fav-player-who-isn-t-BITW&p=14213934&viewfull=1#post14213934

Just shut the **** up already

[Bronbron23]

I will refer you to this post:


http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?488817-What-s-it-like-having-a-fav-player-who-isn-t-BITW&p=14213934&viewfull=1#post14213934

Just shut the **** up already



See This is why i can't stand y'all bron stans. Posting dumb shit like this.:roll:

[bison]

He's trolling obviously. Kuzma has to call for a switch there and didn't. Still a missed shot :applause:



There was meaning to that push. That was a frustration shove, whether kuz was angry at himself for the missed switch or angry at LeBron for not reading it. That year was bad tho. Made me question the LeBron signing.


Then we got AD :rockon:

[Baller789]

Yeah i actually defended bron on this when this happened. It wasn't a big deal. This happens a fair amount in basketball where a guy will push or guide his teammate in the right direction or direction they want them to go. This was an extreme example because kuzma pushed him hard but it was no big deal.

It normally happens but the shove was so obvious which made it hilarious. Also Lebron being lazy and uninterested on D doesnt help.

[Shooter]

Lol, MJ getting more and more exposed in this digital age with a bigger microscope...


dude was swiping like crazy.

Hack style defense

Gambling on and off the court :roll: :lol

[Baller789]

Gambling on and off the court :roll: :lol

Shooter posts like a crackhead :roll:

[GrayGoat]

MJ was slightly overrated

[PeroAntic]

Lol anyone with that quickness and athleticism and huge hands would gamble so much. You strike fear in opponents which is better in the long run. Especially when youre such a force on offense. Jordan is the GOAT. He was just too good.

[GrayGoat]

He was a just barely better than Derrick Rose

[Axe]

Lol anyone with that quickness and athleticism and huge hands would gamble so much. You strike fear in opponents which is better in the long run. Especially when youre such a force on offense. Jordan is the GOAT. He was just too good.
But 1-9 tho

[HoopsNY]

Any attempt to discredit MJ's great defensive ability. At this rate, might as well disqualify the first 60 years of the league. Oh wait, Bran stans already do. :lol

[97 bulls]

Any attempt to discredit MJ's great defensive ability. At this rate, might as well disqualify the first 60 years of the league. Oh wait, Bran stans already do. :lol

I agree. Everybody gambles for steals and blocks. You can make the same video for any player on defense .

My point of contention when it comes to gambling for a steal is to stay involved. Get back into the play. Even thia videonahows that when MJ did gamble, he didnt become a spectator.

[3ball]

Did no one see the 13:51 mark:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=p5aNUS762wM&t=13m51s


That being said, the video is trash and makes up stats, including the link posted above

We simply don't have possession data before 97'

[And1AllDay]

Lol, MJ getting more and more exposed in this digital age with a bigger microscope...


dude was swiping like crazy.

Hack style defense

+1

[Johnny32]

Jordan gets absolutely torched on defense in today's nba. There's no doubt in my highly educated basketball mind

[iamgine]

Defense is a complex subject. It's unfair to say just because Jordan gambled a lot on defense, that means he's gonna gamble a lot against every team. Just like every other player, he's gonna pick and choose who he gambled against.

[HylianNightmare]

6>4

[RogueBorg]

The 73 win Warriors?

The 2018 Warriors?

The Spurs dynasty?

The 2012 3 headed OKC monster?

What happened in 2011?

[Johnny32]

Defense is a complex subject. It's unfair to say just because Jordan gambled a lot on defense, that means he's gonna gamble a lot against every team. Just like every other player, he's gonna pick and choose who he gambled against.

Did he pick and choose though? Lol dude reached three different times vs Iverson in that crossover clip I'm sure you've seen. Was he so used to playing against players who could only dribble with one hand and that's why he got embarrassed so badly reaching vs AI?