list of NON-superteam rings (the only kind of ring that matters)

[3ball]

1980 Celtics

1991 Bulls

1992 Bulls

1993 Bulls

1996 Bulls

1997 Bulls

1998 Bulls

1999 Spurs

2003 Spurs

2004 Pistons

2009 Lakers

2010 Lakers

2011 Mavs

2015 Warriors

2019 Raptors



Super-team is defined as having 3 perennial all-stars on the same team, or 2 perennial MVP candidates on the same team


Ultimately, you don't need to face a super-team unless you have a super-team yourself - aka it means nothing for lebron's super-teams to beat non-superteams.. and Jordan doesn't have to face super-teams because he didn't have one himself

Btw, lebron lost twice to 1-star teams and underdogs.. so it's a moot point anyway.. Jordan never lost to 1-star teams or underdogs

[RRR3]

2006 Heat




Famous non-perennial MVP candidates Dwayne Wade and Shaquille O’Neal

[3ball]

Famous non-perennial MVP candidates Dwayne Wade and Shaquille O’Neal


I deleted them, thx

[HBK_Kliq_2]

LeBron and Durant will not make the list. So that makes Kawhi Leonard the king of this era. Jordan would be proud. Kawhi has a lot of inspiration from Jordan as well and Kawhi's the type who will get extra motivated vs bulls because he's thinking about Jordan and then end up shooting like 85% on midrange jumpers. He's just that damn good and the modern Jordan. All LeBron fans hate Kawhi and us Kawhi fans are damn proud of it.

Usually takes two mvp candidates to beat kawhi and he gets 1 average all star like a George or Aldridge

- jamal Murray led nuggets in points, assists, win shares through playoffs, had multiple 50 point games and had all nba 1st team and consistent mvp candidate jokic as teammate

- Westbrook mvp year in 2016 had better numbers then Durant

- Durant and Curry while kawhi gets Aldridge lol

[AirBonner]

Kawhi is the better defender and midrange shooter

[SouBeachTalents]

I bet 2013 Wade averaged less than every 2nd option of the teams listed in the OP. And 2013 Bosh would be close with every 3rd option

[3ball]

I bet 2013 Wade averaged less than every 2nd option of the teams listed in OP. And 2013 Bosh would be close for every 3rd option


Wade 2013 Finals.... 19.6 on 47% (outscored opposing #1 option)
Pippen 6 Finas......... 19.0 on 42%



TLDR - wade's worst ring > pippen's standard ring



Wade 2014 ECF...... 20/5/5 on 55
Lebron 2014 ECF.... 22/6/5 on 55%


TLDR - lebron carried to conference title

[SouBeachTalents]

Wade 2013 Finals.... 19.6 on 47% (outscored opposing #1 option)
Pippen 6 Finas......... 19.0 on 42%



TLDR - wade's worst ring > pippen's standard ring
Pippen averaged more in every title run than Wade did in 2013, that won't change no matter what bullshit cherry picking you try to do :lol

[jlip]

1980 Celtics



Stopped reading right there.

[AirBonner]

Op lost again

[3ball]

Pippen averaged more in every title run than Wade did in 2013, that won't change no matter what bullshit cherry picking you try to do :lol


Pippen averaged less on a pace-adjusted basis (96', 98') and who cares about carry-jobs against weak teams?.. We already know that Lebron has no carry-jobs against top 5 SRS teams in 2 decades of playing, which is why he needed Wade to average 20 on 47% in those Finals and outscore the opposing #1 option.. lebron never beat a good team with poor scoring and efficiency from a sidekick (no carry-jobs against good teams in 2 decades of playing)

[SouBeachTalents]

Pippen averaged less on a pace-adjusted basis (96', 98') and who cares about carry-jobs against weak teams?.. We already know that Lebron has no carry-jobs against top 5 SRS teams in 2 decades of playing, which is why he needed Wade to average 20 on 47% in those Finals and outscore the opposing #1 option (and score within 5 ppg of lebron)
Unfortunately you're not gonna be able to slither your way out of this one. Wade averaged less in 2013 than every 2nd option listed besides '03 Parker. So if the 2013 Heat are a superteam so are all the teams in question

[3ball]

Unfortunately you're not gonna be able to slither your way out of this one. Wade averaged less in 2013 than every 2nd option listed besides '03 Parker. So if the 2013 Heat are a superteam so are all the teams in question


The 13' Heat had 3 perennial all-stars = super-team

Wade was an all-star through 2016, and dominated the 13' Finals, 14' ECF, and 16' Playoffs.

[SouBeachTalents]

The 13' Heat had 3 perennial all-stars = super-team

Wade was an all-star through 2016, and dominated the 13' Finals, 14' ECF, and 16' Playoffs.
Pippen averaged more ppg in the '91, '92, '93 & '97 Finals than Wade did in 2013, so if Wade dominated than so did Pippen in 4 of the titles in question. So guess those 4 teams are now superteams by your own logic

[3ball]

Pippen averaged more ppg in the '91, '92, '93 & '97 Finals than Wade did in 2013, so if Wade dominated so did Pippen in 4 of the titles in question. So guess those 4 are now superteams by your own logic


Pippen's peak Finals was only 21.0 ppg, so when you say "Pippen averaged more than 13' Wade", you mean 1 point more, so basically the same as 13' Wade - and that's the point - prime Pippen = 13/14 Wade

So you think Wade sucked in 13' and 14' because he fell to prime Pippen stats/caliber - he went from making lebron his bitch to prime Pippen, lol... Yes, that's quite a fall, hence you thinking he sucked

[3ball]

Pippen's peak Finals was only 21.0 ppg, so when you say "Pippen averaged more than 13' Wade", you mean 1 point more, so basically the same as 13' Wade - and that's the point - prime Pippen = 13/14 Wade

So you think Wade sucked in 13' and 14' because he fell to prime Pippen stats/caliber - he went from making lebron his bitch to prime Pippen, lol... Yes, that's quite a fall, hence you thinking he sucked


SouBeach right now


https://media1.tenor.com/images/1d882c56259564db60eb815ce11a671c/tenor.gif

[Axe]

LeBron and Durant will not make the list. So that makes Kawhi Leonard the king of this era. Jordan would be proud. Kawhi has a lot of inspiration from Jordan as well and Kawhi's the type who will get extra motivated vs bulls because he's thinking about Jordan and then end up shooting like 85% on midrange jumpers. He's just that damn good and the modern Jordan. All LeBron fans hate Kawhi and us Kawhi fans are damn proud of it.

Usually takes two mvp candidates to beat kawhi and he gets 1 average all star like a George or Aldridge

- jamal Murray led nuggets in points, assists, win shares through playoffs, had multiple 50 point games and had all nba 1st team and consistent mvp candidate jokic as teammate

- Westbrook mvp year in 2016 had better numbers then Durant

- Durant and Curry while kawhi gets Aldridge lol
Sucks to see that kawhi has been on teams that can win 50 games without him in the regular season.

[mehyaM24]

awful criteria. shaq was past his prime in 2006 and nobody considered miami a superteam. pippen was also more of an "mvp candidate" than wade up until he won a ring. your dumbass thinks the 96 bulls are exempt though. :oldlol:

[RRR3]

Pippen averaged more in every title run than Wade did in 2013, that won't change no matter what bullshit cherry picking you try to do :lol
He lied about the stats anyways.

[Wally450]

Send this to the NBA and watch them laugh at you like all of us do.

[Lebron23]

Jeff Hornacek. Bulls won't win more than 3 nba titles if they play in the 2000's, 2010's and 2020. Jordan played in 1980's and his team got swept by the Celtics.

[Mr.GOAT2408]

Solid list, pretty close to what I would qualify as non-superteam rings, and these non-superteam rings obviously mean a lot more to one's legacy than the superteam rings do

[Uncle Drew]

List of people who care:

[Sulico]

The fact that OP thinks that 89-90 Pistons were superteam and 90's Bulls weren't, shows how deeply he's disconnected from reality.

[3ball]

The fact that OP thinks that 89-90 Pistons were superteam and 90's Bulls weren't, shows how deeply he's disconnected from reality.


I agree that the Pistons weren't a super-team and they shouldn't be on the list.

Ultimately, those Pistons were the bridge between the super-team 80's and parity 90's - they weren't a true super-team, which is why Jordan was basically beating them with nothing in 89' and 90'.

[Sulico]

I agree that the Pistons weren't a super-team and they shouldn't be on the list.

Ultimately, those Pistons were the bridge between the super-team 80's and parity 90's - they weren't a true super-team, which is why Jordan was basically beating them with nothing in 89' and 90'.

OK. 2020 Lakers and 90's Bulls.

How is it 90's Bulls aren't superteam but 2020 Lakers are?
Both teams had one very top tier player, arguably best player of generation, one second tier player. The difference is, Lakers didn't have anyone comparable to Rodman or Grant, and Lebron was 35 yo, not 26-34.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Super-team is defined as having 3 perennial all-stars on the same team, or 2 perennial MVP candidates on the same team


By your standard, the 2000 Lakers should be up there since Kobe was not that good until 2001.

[jlip]

So are we going to continue to ignore the fact that OP listed the 1980 Celtics as actual champions? I wonder how Magic Johnson would feel being named finals MVP of the champion Celtics.

[8Ball]

Pippen averaged more in every title run than Wade did in 2013, that won't change no matter what bullshit cherry picking you try to do :lol

I'd take Pippen over any post 2010 Dwayne Wade.

[3ball]

OK. 2020 Lakers and 90's Bulls.

How is it 90's Bulls aren't superteam but 2020 Lakers are?
Both teams had one very top tier player, arguably best player of generation, one second tier player. The difference is, Lakers didn't have anyone comparable to Rodman or Grant, and Lebron was 35 yo, not 26-34.


Lebron and AD are 2 perennial MVP candidates, whereas Pippen wasn't

[3ball]

I'd take Pippen over any post 2010 Dwayne Wade.





2012 Wade had higher PER, BPM, and WS/48 than Pippen ever had and was top 5 in all categories.

Let that sink in - 2012 Wade was better than Pippen ever was, but he fell to Pippen-level in 13' and 14', which is why you think he sucked







I'd take Pippen over any post 2010 Dwayne Wade.






Playoffs

13' Wade..'.... 18.7 PER.. 3.0 bpm.. 1.0 vorp.. 0.108 ws/48
93' Pippen.... 16.9 PER.. 2.0 bpm.. 0.8 vorp.. 0.083 ws/48


Finals

13' Wade..........'..... 19.6 on 47% (outscored opposing #1 option)

96' Pippen............. 15.7 on 34%
97' Pippen............. 19.0 on 42%
98' Pippen............. 15.7 on 41%

Pippen 6 Finals.... 19.0 on 42%



Comparing sidekick help while trying to 3-peat



Playoffs

14' Wade...'.. 18.5 PER.. 0.086 ws/48.. 1.6 obpm
93' Pippen... 16.9 PER.. 0.083 ws/48.. 1.1 obpm


Per 100 Possessions

14' Wade...'.. 28.6 pts.. 6.2 ast.. 56.0 ts.. 106 ortg
93' Pippen... 26.2 pts.. 7.4 ast.. 50.0 ts.. 102 ortg

[hateraid]

OP's next thread title:

"List of NBA Teams that won a championship with only one team, one, coach, 1 white NBA center, and east of Indiana, but only as far as Nevada"

[3ball]

OP's next thread title:

"List of NBA Teams that won a championship with only one team, one, coach, 1 white NBA center, and east of Indiana, but only as far as Nevada"


it means nothing for lebron's super-teams to beat other super-teams or non-superteams

So the only rings that matter are those won with non-superteams (thread title)

[Kblaze8855]

The 04 Pistons had 4 all stars and I think the one who made the least made it 3 times. I’m not sure how none of them count as a perennial all stars but someone on the 94 Rockets does(Thorpe who made it once I believe?). Not that that’s the only issue with your list...

[3ball]

The 04 Pistons had 4 all stars and I think the one who made the least made it 3 times. I’m not sure how none of them count as a perennial all stars but someone on the 94 Rockets does(Thorpe who made it once I believe?). Not that that’s the only issue with your list...


94' Rockets are a massive omission from the OP.. thanks

The 04' Pistons only had 1 all-star - ben wallace

Ultimately, it means nothing for lebron's super-teams to beat other super-teams or non-superteams

So the only rings that matter are those won with non-superteams (thread title)

[Kblaze8855]

Only counting people who made the game the season in question presents some sizable issues for your obvious point. I suspect pointing the examples out wouldn’t do any good though.

[NBAGOAT]

94' Rockets are a massive omission from the OP.. thanks

The 04' Pistons only had 1 all-star - ben wallace

Ultimately, it means nothing for lebron's super-teams to beat other super-teams or non-superteams

So the only rings that matter are those won with non-superteams (thread title)

yea this is your biggest problem here. Someone makes an all star game in the past and he's a crucial part of a super team but if he doesnt he's irrelevant. You can point to name value but kareem was absolutely not all star level by 88, likely not by 87. draymond in 2015 or any of the big 4 on the pistons is significantly more relevant than old kareem when it came to contributing to a title.

You are also picky and choosy with your criteria, no consistency what so ever. ad's top 2 finishes in mvp race are 3rd in 2015 and 6th last year, if he's a perennial mvp candidate then so is pippen. He's better than pippen but by your "objective criteria" either neither lakers and bulls are super teams or both are. Doesnt just apply to lebron's team, kobe was not a perennial mvp candidate for the first 3peat. his first high finish in mvp voting was 5th in 02. You cant retroactively call him one just because he was one later.

how many all star games does a guy have to make to be a perennial all star anyway 3? Ginobili only made one in 05 before 2011 if he's a perennial all star then you should say artest(10 lakers) and rodman are too.

Good to see you havent gotten any smarter with your trolling

[mehyaM24]

Top 5 in MVP voting
wade - twice and 7 total 1st place votes
pippen - twice and 7 total 1st place votes

All-league teams
wade - 12 total including all-defensive
pippen - 17 total including all-defensive

can anyone explain why op thinks miami was a "superteam" but not chicago?

[3ball]

Top 5 in MVP voting
wade - twice and 7 total 1st place votes
pippen - twice and 7 total 1st place votes

All-league teams
wade - 12 total including all-defensive
pippen - 17 total including all-defensive

can anyone explain why op thinks miami was a "superteam" but not chicago?


Miami had 3 perennial all-stars; Chicago only 2

You either need 3 perennial all-stars or 2 perennial MVP candidates

[ShawkFactory]

Only counting people who made the game the season in question presents some sizable issues for your obvious point. I suspect pointing the examples out wouldn’t do any good though.

Well we certainly all know the most painful example for him. But that would likely cause a significant and seamless diversion from the premise. We'd start talking about numbers and not AS appearances at that point.

[mehyaM24]

Miami had 3 perennial all-stars; Chicago only 2

You either need 3 perennial all-stars or 2 perennial MVP candidates

in your synopsis, you also claimed "or 2 mvp candidates".


or 2 perennial MVP candidates on the same team

so how was dwyane wade more of an mvp than pippen? heck, pippen has the all-teams in his favor too.

[3ball]

in your synopsis, you also claimed "or 2 mvp candidates".



so how was dwyane wade more of an mvp than pippen? heck, pippen has the all-teams in his favor too.


Wade wasn't a perennial mvp candidate and neither was Pippen

But the heat still qualify as a super-team by virtue of having 3 perennial all-stars

[mehyaM24]

Wade wasn't a perennial mvp candidate and neither was Pippen

But the heat still qualify as a super-team by virtue of having 3 perennial all-stars

sounds a little arbitrary but fair enough

let me throw one at you. from 95-98 aka expansion, can you name another team that had 3 perennial all-leaguers? chicago is the ONLY team who come to mind.

[Gohan]

2001 sixers beat lakers= 3 championships

Iverson top 10 player of all time

[Axe]

2001 sixers beat lakers= 3 championships

Iverson top 10 player of all time
Lol

[SpaceJam]

AD has had as many Top 3 MVP finishes as Pippen

[Sulico]

Lebron and AD are 2 perennial MVP candidates, whereas Pippen wasn't

What the hell are you talking about?

Pippen MVP finishes: 9/3/7/5/11/10

AD: 5/9/3/6

Pippen is more "perennial" MVP candidate than AD.

[Mr.GOAT2408]

By your standard, the 2000 Lakers should be up there since Kobe was not that good until 2001.
Kobe alongside Rice were the perennial AS alongside Shaq, they qualify


AD has had as many Top 3 MVP finishes as Pippen
To be fair to 3ball AD has only had two seasons where he's played enough games to merit serious MVP considerations anyway (and still finished top 3 in 2015 playing less than 68 games), Pippen had 9 such seasons with the Bulls (with MJ) where he played at least 70 games. AD may not have been much back then (today's NBA is a joke bro) but relative to his peers he was definitely more of an MVP candidate when put into context

[Mr. Woke]

The 80s Celtics, the 80s Lakers, the 90s Bulls, and the Shaq/Kobe Lakers were all either super teams or super-duper teams.

[hateraid]

The Bulls don't fit the premise of this thread so this thread fails. Bulls were EASILY a superteam in a watered down NBA. WITH a HOF coach too boot.

[mehyaM24]

The Bulls don't fit the premise of this thread so this thread fails. Bulls were EASILY a superteam in a watered down NBA. WITH a HOF coach too boot.

correct. the op intentionally went with all-stars over all-leaguers. we know the 96 bulls were the ONLY team that year with 3 all-leaguers - defense included. during expansion that is a superteam AND some.

[SouBeachTalents]

correct. the op intentionally went with all-stars over all-leaguers. we know the 96 bulls were the ONLY team that year with 3 all-leaguers - defense included. during expansion that is a superteam AND some.
Yep

MVP in Jordan
All-NBA & All-Defensive First Team, top 5 in MVP & 2nd in DPOY voting in Pippen
The rebounding leader and All-Defensive First Team in Rodman
The 6MOTY in Kukoc
COTY in Phil

NOT a superteam though :oldlol:

[hateraid]

Yep

MVP in Jordan
All-NBA & All-Defensive First Team, top 5 in MVP & 2nd in DPOY voting in Pippen
The rebounding leader and All-Defensive First Team in Rodman
The 6MOTY in Kukoc
COTY in Phil

NOT a superteam though :oldlol:

This team can compete and most likely win in today's stacked league.
Imagine having second option Kawhi, Gobert, Clarkson, and being coached Pop in today's league?

[LeCola]

As a person who thinks MJ is the goat, I think

Jordan-Pippen-Grant

and

Jordan-Pippen-Rodman

Could be considered as big 3's or super teams for that era.

However, no one is even close to him. Because;

He never lost finals. He never played a game 7 on finals.

If he had great teammates, he succeed to carry his team.

Else, he dominated the game and won MVP titles, scoring titles,dpoy title, all defensive teams, etc.

[Airupthere]

As a person who thinks MJ is the goat, I think

Jordan-Pippen-Grant

and

Jordan-Pippen-Rodman

Could be considered as big 3's or super teams for that era.

However, no one is even close to him. Because;

He never lost finals. He never played a game 7 on finals.

If he had great teammates, he succeed to carry his team.

Else, he dominated the game and won MVP titles, scoring titles,dpoy title, all defensive teams, etc.

Grant with another team would not have been an all star, much less a superstar. Same with rodman.

[SATAN]

Grant with another team would not have been an all star, much less a superstar. Same with rodman.

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/jGQAAOSw9y1feQNl/s-l400.jpg

:facepalm

[hateraid]

Grant with another team would not have been an all star, much less a superstar. Same with rodman.

And you know this how? A year without Jordan proved otherwise.

[FireDavidKahn]

Lordan was gifted his rings.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EyVj9dpWgAEgEZg?format=jpg&name=large

[mehyaM24]

Grant with another team would not have been an all star, much less a superstar. Same with rodman.

actually rodman was an all-star in 90 and 92 - with detroit. jordan was great, but without him in the spotlight other guys would get more shine. which is why bj armstrong and grant became all-stars in 94. again without jordan. some of you mj fans need to acknowledge he had really good help, and arguably the BEST help during the second three-peat.

[scuzzy]

Grant with another team would not have been an all star, much less a superstar. Same with rodman.heh

If only Coach could get that time machine fired up and yank Rodman's rangs and thangs he personally collected on Michaels watch before either three peat. :lol:(

[Kiddlovesnets]

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/jGQAAOSw9y1feQNl/s-l400.jpg

:facepalm

So what? Rodman was an all star but he was 34 years old when he joined the Bulls and already ain’t in his prime. Apparently by your logic, the Cavs had big 5 since Isaiah Thomas, Wade and Rose were former all stars. I didn’t know Rapaport had such a regarded son like you before but now I see what you are capable of.
:facepalm

[scuzzy]

What the hell are you talking about?

Pippen MVP finishes: 9/3/7/5/11/10

AD: 5/9/3/6

Pippen is more "perennial" MVP candidate than AD.
:oldlol:

[Axe]

Yep

MVP in Jordan
All-NBA & All-Defensive First Team, top 5 in MVP & 2nd in DPOY voting in Pippen
The rebounding leader and All-Defensive First Team in Rodman
The 6MOTY in Kukoc
COTY in Phil

NOT a superteam though :oldlol:
But

Mo williams > scottie pippen
Doug collins > phil jackson

:confusedshrug:

[scuzzy]

So what? Rodman was an all star but he was 34 years old when he joined the Bulls and already ain’t in his prime. Apparently by your logic, the Cavs had big 5 since Isaiah Thomas, Wade and Rose were former all stars. I didn’t know Rapaport had such a regarded son like you before but now I see what you are capable of.
:facepalm
Dennis at 34, old n washed :(

Last Dance rivalry, 35yo Malone and 34yo Carr checked by washed Dennis :eek:

Defending champ 36yo Bran, FMVP, runner up MVP with expectations to hoist another Larry-O :bowdown:

Goat standard for only the Goat thangs. :pimp:

[Airupthere]

actually rodman was an all-star in 90 and 92 - with detroit. jordan was great, but without him in the spotlight other guys would get more shine. which is why bj armstrong and grant became all-stars in 94. again without jordan. some of you mj fans need to acknowledge he had really good help, and arguably the BEST help during the second three-peat.

Grant was a one time all star and rodman a 2 time all star. They were all stars by virtue of team success, not because they were individually at all star level. Rodman is an atg rebounder and a versatile defender but as a whole, you wont even mention him as a top pf of all time. We only glorify these players in terms of their contributions to the pistons and bulls. And they did contirbute. But they do not define a superteam like the one lebron makes or kd makes.

Grants all star is more like draymonds. We already see what draymond is with a different team/lineup.

[NBAGOAT]

Grant was a one time all star and rodman a 2 time all star. They were all stars by virtue of team success, not because they were individually at all star level. Rodman is an atg rebounder and a versatile defender but as a whole, you wont even mention him as a top pf of all time. We only glorify these players in terms of their contributions to the pistons and bulls. And they did contirbute. But they do not define a superteam like the one lebron makes or kd makes.

Grants all star is more like draymonds. We already see what draymond is with a different team/lineup.

rodman does get mention for top 10 pf all time now as analysts have moved away from seeing scoring as the only thing that matters

[scuzzy]

Grant was a one time all star and rodman a 2 time all star. They were all stars by virtue of team success, not because they were individually at all star level. Rodman is an atg rebounder and a versatile defender but as a whole, you wont even mention him as a top pf of all time. We only glorify these players in terms of their contributions to the pistons and bulls. And they did contirbute. But they do not define a superteam like the one lebron makes or kd makes.

Grants all star is more like draymonds. We already see what draymond is with a different team/lineup.
players perfecting their roles a tee.. :biggums: like linemen or goalies or pitchers. :biggums: three point specialist, even :biggums:

sorry Dennis your role isn't spamming fade aways, you Dennis are shamed the "team success" all-star. The most prestige all-stars of them all. There goes old 34yo Dennis man handling prime 34yo MVP Karl again bc somebody has to cover Karl. might as well be a be a defensive and rebounding specialist whos only recognized by team success he built :ohwell:

[Axe]

rodman does get mention for top 10 pf all time now as analysts have moved away from seeing scoring as the only thing that matters
Nostalgia goggles no more

[LAmbruh]

Grant was a one time all star and rodman a 2 time all star. They were all stars by virtue of team success, not because they were individually at all star level. Rodman is an atg rebounder and a versatile defender but as a whole, you wont even mention him as a top pf of all time. We only glorify these players in terms of their contributions to the pistons and bulls. And they did contirbute. But they do not define a superteam like the one lebron makes or kd makes.

Grants all star is more like draymonds. We already see what draymond is with a different team/lineup.
damage control

Yourself and netsfanslongtime just had to just be elementary schooled on well known HOF Dennis the Worm making his early legacy beating the pulp out of Michael. Like youz literally had no idea bad boys and chips, or dennis related ITT. Responding by reciting bball reference all-star nods and accolades doesn't impress the the charitable men who just went to school on that ass :oldlol:

[mehyaM24]

Grant was a one time all star and rodman a 2 time all star. They were all stars by virtue of team success, not because they were individually at all star level. Rodman is an atg rebounder and a versatile defender but as a whole, you wont even mention him as a top pf of all time. We only glorify these players in terms of their contributions to the pistons and bulls. And they did contirbute. But they do not define a superteam like the one lebron makes or kd makes.

Grants all star is more like draymonds. We already see what draymond is with a different team/lineup.

i already told you rodman was an all-star twice. this was after you claimed he wouldn't be one without jordan. you're also underrating rodman who in 96 led the league in rebounding and made 1st team all-defense. what's more, chicago was the ONLY team that year withh 3 all-leaguers. we must conclude they were a superteam with an "unfair" talent advantage.

[mehyaM24]

So what? Rodman was an all star but he was 34 years old when he joined the Bulls and already ain’t in his prime. Apparently by your logic, the Cavs had big 5 since Isaiah Thomas, Wade and Rose were former all stars. I didn’t know Rapaport had such a regarded son like you before but now I see what you are capable of.
:facepalm

another myth. in 96 rodman played some of the best ball of his career. like i mentioned in the post above, he also made 1st team all-defense & led the league in rebounding (#1 in o-rebounds too). rodman's defensive impact was so great that he also finished top 15 in MVP shares. if you didn't know, for someone NEVER known for scoring, that is highly impressive.

it was chicago's league in 96. nobody came close or ever stood a chance - another reason they're a superteam.

[SouBeachTalents]

Yeah, Rodman was a beast in '96


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wg3BiOw4TWo&ab_channel=LamarMatic


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98R_SCHiSUY&ab_channel=LamarMatic

[SATAN]

Kiddlovesnets is a very weird person. Probably hasn't even watched that era beyond what was shown in The Last Dance.

[ShawkFactory]

Yeah, Rodman was a beast in '96


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wg3BiOw4TWo&ab_channel=LamarMatic


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98R_SCHiSUY&ab_channel=LamarMatic

I’ve very recently watched both of those games in full. I see why Rodman was getting serious FMVP consideration. He was so impactful.

3ball will throw his numbers out there claiming Rodman shouldn’t even be mentioned as Jordan’s teammate because 6 ppg on 40%. I’m sure Andre Drummond will be mentioned as a far better player at some point in the next couple months.

It’s like he doesn’t realize that literally all of these games can be watched for free any time you want.

[Kblaze8855]

Dennis Rodman turned 26 during his rookie season. Going by age he was past his prime by the end of the 80s....but he wasn’t in reality. Dennis was one of the goat athletes and had some of the best physical preparation in history despite the reputation. He could stay up all night, play 45 minutes, have 8/5/23, then ride the bike for an hour because the game wasn’t enough of a workout....and that was in his 30s.

[tpols]

Yeah, Rodman was a beast in '96


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wg3BiOw4TWo&ab_channel=LamarMatic


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98R_SCHiSUY&ab_channel=LamarMatic

So Rodman was 6'7 220 according to Bill Walton in the first video, and a 7'2 300+ lb Shaq could barely move him. That's absurd. Also his passing was awesome in this video... He's basically a super Dray. Man that crowd was roaring...that's an intense atmosphere. He kept getting putbacks off pippens misses I swear over and over in the clip. :lol

[Kblaze8855]

He’d put it back up in the playoffs but in a game that didn’t count? I’ve seen Dennis get two offensive rebounds for easy layups on one possession and pass it back out just to keep his scoring at zero. Phil talked about it once. He loved having a 0-2 point game with 15-20 rebounds. It was fun to him. He didn’t give half a shit about points. But I’ve seen people say shit like he couldn’t score to take him down a notch. It’s true he wasn’t a scorer but what they don’t realize....he was probably annoyed at the 10 points he did score some times. He’d rather have 4 and kick it to role player guards for an easy look to keep the soldiers happy. He didn’t usually want to shoot unless it was disrespectful not to. He’d dunk in an easy one or tip it in if he couldn’t get all the way to it....but he genuinely didn’t want to score on the Bulls. Not usually.

[3ball]

Mo williams > scottie pippen

:confusedshrug:





09' Mo Will...'.... 17.2 PER.. 2.3 BPM.. 0.165 WS/48.. 3.1 VORP.... #3 team defense
90' Pippen........ 16.3 PER.. 1.8 BPM.. 0.087 WS/48.. 3.0 VORP.. #19 team defense


09' Lebron had more help on both sides of the ball than 90' Jordan, and a much better rebounding team (#2 rebounding team in the league)

[Ainosterhaspie]

09' Mo Will...'.... 17.2 PER.. 2.3 BPM.. 0.165 WS/48.. 3.1 VORP.... #3 team defense
90' Pippen........ 16.3 PER.. 1.8 BPM.. 0.087 WS/48.. 3.0 VORP.. #19 team defense


09' Lebron had more help on both sides of the ball than 90' Jordan, and a much better rebounding team (#2 rebounding team in the league)

Now do 90 vs 09 playoffs for those two players. Pippen obliterates Williams when it actually matters.

[SouBeachTalents]

Now do 90 vs 09 playoffs for those two players. Pippen obliterates Williams when it actually matters.
Mo Williams, JR Smith & Timofey Mozgov > Pippen

[3ball]

Now do 90 vs 09 playoffs for those two players. Pippen obliterates Williams when it actually matters.



ECF

89' Pippen....... 9.7 and 3.0 apg... 45% TS
90' Pippen..... 16.6 and 3.7 apg... 52% TS

Mo Will.......... 18.3 and 3.7 apg... 51% TS


Jordan had inferior help on both sides of the ball but nearly beat the champs, while Lebron was swept (07'), lottery (05'), or lost as the favorite (09' and 10')

[3ball]

.
Thread Cliffs


Lebron couldn't make the 2nd Round without a 2-time all-star center, the future COY, a 22/6/5 acquisition and a top rebounding/defensive team - that's easily enough to compete in a conference that 1-star teams routinely won.

Otoh, young Jordan played in a conference that required a super-team to win, yet he made the 2nd Round with a simple rebounder (oakley).

Furthermore, the 05' Cavs had a much better team defense than the 90' Bulls (#12 vs #19), while Zydrunas was a top 5 rim protector/all-star with better offense than Pippen (scoring, efficiency, PER, WS/48).

Accordingly, 90' Jordan nearly led a worse cast than the 05' Cavs to the title, while Lebron needed a much better cast than the 05' Cavs to be title-worthy.

Ultimately, anyone was going to win alongside the league's best player once expansion spread the talent around evenly in the 90's, so a special team (super-team) was no longer required to win like the 80's.

[SouBeachTalents]

.
Thread Cliffs


Lebron couldn't make the 2nd Round without a 2-time all-star center, the future COY, a 22/6/5 acquisition and a top rebounding/defensive team - that's easily enough to compete in a conference that 1-star teams routinely won.

Otoh, young Jordan played in a conference that required a super-team to win, yet he made the 2nd Round with a simple rebounder (oakley).

Furthermore, the 05' Cavs had a much better team defense than the 90' Bulls (#12 vs #19), while Zydrunas was a top 5 rim protector/all-star with better offense than Pippen (scoring, efficiency, PER, WS/48).

Accordingly, 90' Jordan nearly led a worse cast than the 05' Cavs to the title, while Lebron needed a much better cast than the 05' Cavs to be title-worthy.

Ultimately, anyone was going to win alongside the league's best player once expansion spread the talent around evenly in the 90's, so a special team (super-team) was no longer required to win like the 80's.
This psychopath copy and pasted this in like 7 different threads :lol

[light]

The 1996 Chicago Bulls were the most loaded superteam of the 1990s.

Jordan - 1st All-NBA, 1st All-Defensive
Pippen - 1st All-NBA, 1st All-Defensive
Rodman - 1st All-Defensive, Rebounding champ
Kukoc - Sixth Man of the Year
Jackson - Coach of the Year

LeBron has never had help like that on any of his championship teams.

LeBron's first All-Defensive teammate was Anthony Davis.

[light]

I mean, cmon, look at this ish:

1996 Chicago Bulls


Jordan - 1st All-NBA, 1st All-Defensive
Pippen - 1st All-NBA, 1st All-Defensive
Rodman - 1st All-Defensive, Rebounding champ
Kukoc - Sixth Man of the Year
Jackson - Coach of the Year
Krause - Executive of the Year


2012 Miami Heat


LeBron James - 1st All-NBA, 1st All-Defensive
Dwyane Wade - 3rd All-NBA

2013 Miami Heat


LeBron James - 1st All-NBA, 1st All-Defensive
Dwyane Wade - 3rd All-NBA

2016 Cleveland Cavaliers


LeBron James - 1st All-NBA

2020 Los Angeles Lakers


LeBron James - 1st All-NBA
Anthony Davis - 1st All-NBA, 1st All-Defensive

I only see one superteam up above and it's from the 90's.

What LeBron did in 2016 was simply not possible for Michael Jordan - he wasn't good enough to carry a team like that.

[ArbitraryWater]

but what do you do when there are only superteams around and its impossible to compete without one?