Is it discrepant to complain about Pippen's playoff ppg when Wade scored even less?

[TheCorporation]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

[Ainosterhaspie]

No because you can cherry pick to claim whatever you want. If Wade's highest ppg is higher than Pippen's lowest then Wade>Pippen. You may think that it could be counter argued that if Wade's lowest is lower than Pippen's highest, then by the same reasoning applied above Pippen>Wade. You would be wrong though because Jordan had to be > LeBron. He just has to be. Don't you understand that you mean mean man?

[TheCorporation]

No because you can cherry pick to claim whatever you want. If Wade's highest ppg is higher than Pippen's lowest then Wade>Pippen. You may think that it could be counter argued that if Wade's lowest is lower than Pippen's highest, then by the same reasoning applied above Pippen>Wade. You would be wrong though because Jordan had to be > LeBron. He just has to be. Don't you understand that you mean mean man?

:roll::roll:

[SouBeachTalents]

We should settle the Boobie Gibson/Pippen debate before we move on to guys like Wade

[TheCorporation]

We should settle the Boobie Gibson/Pippen debate before we move on to guys like Wade

Facts :lol

[2much_knowledge]

Sadly, Wade averaged more ppg in the 2011 finals than Pippen in his whole career. But lebron laid and egg and didn't helped out Wade at all. Sabotaged Wade's finals mvp.

[Axe]

Oubre is a much better player than klay is now.

Oh w8

[SATAN]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

This might be the thread that causes 3ball to meltdown and get himself banned again. :yaohappy:

[LAL]

Why did Lebron decide to team up with the third best sg of all time in his prime and Bosh? Weakening the eastern conference before they began and now we have to feel sorry for him because he couldn't get the best out of him or injuries?

[8Ball]

Pippen is ranked higher than Wade all time.

Top 20 vs top 25 for Wade.

[2much_knowledge]

Why did Lebron decide to team up with the third best sg of all time in his prime and Bosh? Weakening the eastern conference before they began and now we have to feel sorry for him because he couldn't get the best out of him or injuries?

Teammate banging mom, tired of losing to Boston. Instead of improving along with his teammates, just jumped ship. Then gave hope to his city for 55 minutes to double cross them on live tv , to join two top 10 league players, to then average less points than jason terry lol. Cool story

[Smoke117]

Wade had a bad knee during the 2013 playoffs so that's not really fair. During their win streak before he hurt said knee he was playing at a top 10 level in the league.

[2much_knowledge]

Wade had a bad knee during the 2013 playoffs so that's not really fair. During their win streak before he hurt said knee he was playing at a top 10 level in the league.

O.P exposed. Acts like such a big fan, doesn't remember when the key players on his team are injured.

[Smoke117]

O.P exposed. Acts like such a big fan, doesn't remember when the key players on his team are injured.

Wade had started off that season slow as he had had knee surgery in the off season to get the knee scoped, but during their win streak he was pulling it together and playing like the Dwyane Wade we all know. Alas, he ended up hurting his knee again towards the tail end of that win streak and had to play through the playoffs with the bad knee when he came back. As I've said before, his body just always refused to cooperate. It's too bad that two healthy seasons in 2009 and 2010 at his peak/prime were wasted on those shitty Heat teams. He completely took a shit all over the Celtics in that 2010 first round series, but the Heat overall were just completely outclassed. Then Bran ****ed him over in 2011 playing like a bum in the finals.

[8Ball]

Wade had a bad knee during the 2013 playoffs so that's not really fair. During their win streak before he hurt said knee he was playing at a top 10 level in the league.

No excuses.

Pippen outperformed Wade regularly.

[Smoke117]

No excuses.

Pippen outperformed Wade regularly.

2013 and 2014 are regularly? If you say so, chief.

[8Ball]

Pippen has as nearly many all-nba teams as wade and 3x more all defense.

[warriorfan]

I wonder what LBJFTW has to say on this.

[mehyaM24]

I wonder what LBJFTW has to say on this.

rumor is that guy is an objective lebron fan.....

[Manny98]

rumor is that guy is an objective lebron fan.....
Who also has a lisp when he talks

[3ball]

Pippen scored less pace-adjusted

And Wade wasn't needed in the weak East, but was needed in the Finals where his 19.6 on 48% was better than Pippen's career Finals average of 19.0 on 42% (6 Finals)

So who cares about carry-jobs against weak teams - both Lebron and Jordan have a lot of those

But unfortunately, Lebron never beat a Finals team or otherwise good team (top 5 SRS) with weak scoring and efficiency from a sidekick - so he has zero carry-jobs against good teams in 2 decades of playing.

The reason that Lebron can't carry his squads over good teams is because he's bad at the contested jumpshooting required of tough carry-jobs - the stats show that he avoids contested jumpers (defers to lesser teammates)..

In addition to weak contested jumpshooting ability, another reason that Lebron can't have carry-jobs against good teams is because he can't win with high scoring - lebron's high scoring requires over-dribbling that invariably gets beat by ball movement against the better teams

[3ball]

Pippen scored less pace-adjusted

And Wade wasn't needed in the weak East, but was needed in the Finals where his 19.6 on 48% was better than Pippen's career Finals average of 19.0 on 42% (6 Finals)

So who cares about carry-jobs against weak teams - both Lebron and Jordan have a lot of those

But unfortunately, Lebron never beat a Finals team or otherwise good team (top 5 SRS) with weak scoring and efficiency from a sidekick - so he has zero carry-jobs against good teams in 2 decades of playing.

The reason that Lebron can't carry his squads over good teams is because he's bad at the contested jumpshooting required of tough carry-jobs - the stats show that he avoids contested jumpers (defers to lesser teammates)..

In addition to weak contested jumpshooting ability, another reason that Lebron can't have carry-jobs against good teams is because he can't win with high scoring - lebron's high scoring requires over-dribbling that invariably gets beat by ball movement against the better teams


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-19-2015/w3yhDm.gif

[mehyaM24]

https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-19-2015/w3yhDm.gif

:roll:

nobody thinks spamming is cool. so you win by default bud.

[Smoke117]

:roll:

He is such a half wit. He literally posted what he said 3 mins before he posted that gif. :facepalm

[warriorfan]

rumor is that guy is an objective lebron fan.....

:roll:

[2much_knowledge]

No excuses.

Pippen outperformed Wade regularly.

No excuses. 2019 lebron not good enough to make the playoffs without Davis. No excuses. Must stay consistent here ;)

[kawhileonard2]

Pippen won no league nor finals nor DPOY awards. Guys like Ben Wallace won DPOY, Tony Parker, Billups, Iggy, Maxwell, Worthy to name a few who won Finals mvp. Wade won a historic Finals mvp. Yet Pippen gets overrated as if he won any of those accolades.

[8Ball]

No excuses. 2019 lebron not good enough to make the playoffs without Davis. No excuses. Must stay consistent here ;)

LeBron 9 finals without AD.

Sit down clown.

[MrFonzworth]

He is such a half wit. He literally posted what he said 3 mins before he posted that gif. :facepalm

:roll:

[TheCorporation]

This might be the thread that causes 3ball to meltdown and get himself banned again. :yaohappy:

He's actually scared of me because I terrorize him every time he speaks.

[TheCorporation]

Who also has a lisp when he talks

:roll::roll:

[BigShotBob]

Let's break this down by series then.

Pippen first round against the Nets 1998 - 18 ppg on 43/28/63. The picture of efficiency

Jordan averaged 36...on 53/50/77

Second round against the Hornets - 17 on 44% shooting. MJ almost averaged 30 (nearly double) Pippen's

ECF against the Pacers - 16 ppg on a top 50 ATG legendary.... 39/20/58

MJ nearly doubled his scoring total again with 31 ppg....

Finals vs the Jazz - 15 ppg on 41/23/83

MJ more than doubled his scoring total with 33.5 ppg

---

Wade first round against the Bucks was hurt and didn't even play the 4th game so his effencicy suffered and he still averaged almost as much as Pippen did in the Finals with 13.5 ppg

Second round against the Bulls - 12 ppg on 50/83 (barely shot the ball) and an interesting note to add is that Lebron averaged 23 ppg on 43/35/80 against the almighty hobbled Bulls

ECF vs the Pacers - Still hobbled Wade averaged 15.4 ppg (more than Pippen in the Finals)

Finals vs the Spurs - Nearly 20ppg (19.6) had his best series performance by far when Lebron needed it the most.

Overall Wade performed better when he actually didn't need to sit and limp across the court for knee injections.

Imagine if MJ had a player in the Finals that could average 19 points back in 1998 on 47% shooting. Might have ended in 5.

[2much_knowledge]

Let's break this down by series then.

Pippen first round against the Nets 1998 - 18 ppg on 43/28/63. The picture of efficiency

Jordan averaged 36...on 53/50/77

Second round against the Hornets - 17 on 44% shooting. MJ almost averaged 30 (nearly double) Pippen's

ECF against the Pacers - 16 ppg on a top 50 ATG legendary.... 39/20/58

MJ nearly doubled his scoring total again with 31 ppg....

Finals vs the Jazz - 15 ppg on 41/23/83

MJ more than doubled his scoring total with 33.5 ppg

---

Wade first round against the Bucks was hurt and didn't even play the 4th game so his effencicy suffered and he still averaged almost as much as Pippen did in the Finals with 13.5 ppg

Second round against the Bulls - 12 ppg on 50/83 (barely shot the ball) and an interesting note to add is that Lebron averaged 23 ppg on 43/35/80 against the almighty hobbled Bulls

ECF vs the Pacers - Still hobbled Wade averaged 15.4 ppg (more than Pippen in the Finals)

Finals vs the Spurs - Nearly 20ppg (19.6) had his best series performance by far when Lebron needed it the most.

Overall Wade performed better when he actually didn't need to sit and limp across the court for knee injections.

Imagine if MJ had a player in the Finals that could average 19 points back in 1998 on 47% shooting. Might have ended in 5.

Love these detailed breakdowns. Stupid opinions become irrelevant

[And1AllDay]

Who also has a lisp when he talks

:roll::oldlol:

[TheCorporation]

Is there no one else?

[8Ball]

Is there no one else?

Michael Jordan had 23ppg on 55% scorer Orlando Woolridge in 1985 and got swept.

23ppg! Imagine LeBron getting that kind of help!

[TheCorporation]

Michael Jordan had 23ppg on 55% scorer Orlando Woolridge in 1985 and got swept.

23ppg! Imagine LeBron getting that kind of help!

He must have been playing against a powerhouse team then to lose with that type of production? Don't tell me it was Terry Cummings that did him like that

[BigShotBob]

Let's break this down by series then.

Pippen first round against the Nets 1998 - 18 ppg on 43/28/63. The picture of efficiency

Jordan averaged 36...on 53/50/77

Second round against the Hornets - 17 on 44% shooting. MJ almost averaged 30 (nearly double) Pippen's

ECF against the Pacers - 16 ppg on a top 50 ATG legendary.... 39/20/58

MJ nearly doubled his scoring total again with 31 ppg....

Finals vs the Jazz - 15 ppg on 41/23/83

MJ more than doubled his scoring total with 33.5 ppg

---

Wade first round against the Bucks was hurt and didn't even play the 4th game so his effencicy suffered and he still averaged almost as much as Pippen did in the Finals with 13.5 ppg

Second round against the Bulls - 12 ppg on 50/83 (barely shot the ball) and an interesting note to add is that Lebron averaged 23 ppg on 43/35/80 against the almighty hobbled Bulls

ECF vs the Pacers - Still hobbled Wade averaged 15.4 ppg (more than Pippen in the Finals)

Finals vs the Spurs - Nearly 20ppg (19.6) had his best series performance by far when Lebron needed it the most.

Overall Wade performed better when he actually didn't need to sit and limp across the court for knee injections.

Imagine if MJ had a player in the Finals that could average 19 points back in 1998 on 47% shooting. Might have ended in 5.

Anyone?

[97 bulls]

Anyone?

Again, stats without context, let's take the Finals. Here are Pippens game by game numbers which are more important.


Game 1 21 pts 8 rbds on 37% Grade C
Game 2 21 pts 6 rbds 4 assts 53% A+
Game 3 10 pts and arguably the greatest NBA defensive game the Finals ever had that led to a 42 blowout spearheaded by Pippen A+

Game 4 28 pts 9 rbds, 5 asts, on 50% shooting grade A+
Game 5: 6 pts, 11 rbds, and 11 asts 13% shooting C
Game 6 8 pts, 3 rbds 4 asts on 57% on an injured back.

Pippen actually didnt have a bad Finals series. He shot bad in two games. But you stat whores dont watch games. Only look at unsubstantiated numbers.

[2much_knowledge]

Its funny because its a pippen vs wade debate as if Bosh is not there. Wade usually ranks top 3/4 among alltime shooting guards. Where does pippen rank among small fowards????? Wade was already a superstar and a champ and finals mvp... What did Pippen accomplished w/o Jordan? Can't remember???

They always down playing Wade's contributions to fit their laughable agende but speaking of contributions... Wade did his part in 2011, where was his sidekick help??? Where?????? Injuries like 2013 Wade??? Nope.... theres no coming back from this. Don't want no slick one liners avoidance replys.

Jordan >>>>>>>>>> lebron > wade > pippen.

Thats it.

[Axe]

Its funny because its a pippen vs wade debate as if Bosh is not there. Wade usually ranks top 3/4 among alltime shooting guards. Where does pippen rank among small fowards????? Wade was already a superstar and a champ and finals mvp... What did Pippen accomplished w/o Jordan? Can't remember???

They always down playing Wade's contributions to fit their laughable agende but speaking of contributions... Wade did his part in 2011, where was his sidekick help??? Where?????? Injuries like 2013 Wade??? Nope.... theres no coming back from this. Don't want no slick one liners avoidance replys.

Jordan >>>>>>>>>> lebron > wade > pippen.

Thats it.
Pippen has won more playoff series than his true first option in the past though. Let that sink in for awhile.

[2much_knowledge]

Pippen has won more playoff series than his true first option in the past though. Let that sink in for awhile.

Thought about it. Jordan was a rookie, broke his foot, faced 3 teams over 60 wins.

Pippen played with two stacked teams after the bulls and didn't do shit but get crossed by Kobe and knock down some towels in frustration lol

He also cost chicago the ring in 1990 but everyone gives him a pass just like they give lebron a past for failing wade vs dallas

Betas gonna betas

[Axe]

Thought about it. Jordan was a rookie, broke his foot, faced 3 teams over 60 wins.

Pippen played with two stacked teams after the bulls and didn't do shit but get crossed by Kobe and knock down some towels in frustration lol

He also cost chicago the ring in 1990 but everyone gives him a pass just like they give lebron a past for failing wade vs dallas

Betas gonna betas
Lol but the bulls without hca weren't even favored to win it all in 1990 and the defending champion pistons still finished ahead of them during the same year. And no, the rockets weren't stacked in '99. The blazers meanwhile got a deep, good playoff run in '00 when they got the wcf once but they didn't advance past the first round in the next two years. So i ain't sure what you're on about here. :confusedshrug:

[8Ball]

Thought about it. Jordan was a rookie, broke his foot, faced 3 teams over 60 wins.

Pippen played with two stacked teams after the bulls and didn't do shit but get crossed by Kobe and knock down some towels in frustration lol

He also cost chicago the ring in 1990 but everyone gives him a pass just like they give lebron a past for failing wade vs dallas

Betas gonna betas

Jordan got his shit pushed in 3 years in a row by Isiah Thomas, barely a top 50 player.

[ImKobe]

Jordan got his shit pushed in 3 years in a row by Isiah Thomas, barely a top 50 player.

Zeke is top 30 all-time. Pistons were a far better team. Pippen cost the Bulls the 1990 ECF.

Game 7 1990 ECF

MJ - 31/9/8 13/27 FG

Rest of the starters - 26 points 10/49 FG, Armstrong was 1/8 for 2 pts off the bench as well. Grant was the 2nd leading scorer on the Bulls with 10 points on 3/17 FG, Pippen had 2 pts on 1/10 FG.

[8Ball]

1993 Game 3 vs New York Knicks down 0-2:

Jordan: 3/18 from the field.

Pippen: 29/4/4 on 83%


Pippen saved Jordan a championship there.

[ImKobe]

1993 Game 3 vs New York Knicks down 0-2:

Jordan: 3/18 from the field.

Pippen: 29/4/4 on 83%


Pippen saved Jordan a championship there.

Nice try. Jordan had 22/8/11/2/2. Game wasn't close past the 1st quarter.

Next.

[8Ball]

3/18 from the field.

How many playoff games can LeBron win scoring 3/18?

A lot like Kobe's 6/24 game.

[ImKobe]

Lebron has won plenty of Playoff games with poor shooting performances, it was a rarity for Jordan.

Vs Celtics 2008

Game 1 - 2/18 FG 10 TOs, Cavs lose by 2 points, does any other star go 2/18 AND give the ball away 10 times, and have the chance to win the game at the end against a loaded Celtics squad?
Game 3 - 5/16 FG, Cavs win in a blowout
Game 4 - 7/20 FG, Cavs win by 11
Game 6 - 9/23 FG 8 TOs, Cavs win by 5

[BigShotBob]

Again, stats without context, let's take the Finals. Here are Pippens game by game numbers which are more important.


Game 1 21 pts 8 rbds on 37% Grade C
Game 2 21 pts 6 rbds 4 assts 53% A+
Game 3 10 pts and arguably the greatest NBA defensive game the Finals ever had that led to a 42 blowout spearheaded by Pippen A+

Game 4 28 pts 9 rbds, 5 asts, on 50% shooting grade A+
Game 5: 6 pts, 11 rbds, and 11 asts 13% shooting C
Game 6 8 pts, 3 rbds 4 asts on 57% on an injured back.

Pippen actually didnt have a bad Finals series. He shot bad in two games. But you stat whores dont watch games. Only look at unsubstantiated numbers.

Pippen had a horrific Finals. Who are you kidding? Wade out produced him in the Finals vs the Spurs when he was needed the most. Pippen never averaged the same amount of points as Wade did in that Finals run and he was hobbled.

Pippen for his career in the Finals is a 19 ppg scorer on 42/25/74 percent shooting. Tell me that's better and more efficient than Wade.

And if you want to factor in defense, Pippen averaged 1.9 steals per game, but Wade averaged 1.8 steals per game. Pippen averaged 1.1 blocks per game. Wade averaged 1.0.

In the Finals, Wade was far, far better overall. That's just a fact.

[And1AllDay]

1993 Game 3 vs New York Knicks down 0-2:

Jordan: 3/18 from the field.

Pippen: 29/4/4 on 83%


Pippen saved Jordan a championship there.

saved his career



bulls were.down 0-2 in 93' ecf and mike shoots 3 for 18? :oldlol:

pip saves his ass

[And1AllDay]

Jordan got his shit pushed in 3 years in a row by Isiah Thomas, barely a top 50 player.

mike lost to the same guy 3 years in a row?!

has that weak shit ever happened to another top 15 player like mike?

[2much_knowledge]

1993 Game 3 vs New York Knicks down 0-2:

Jordan: 3/18 from the field.

Pippen: 29/4/4 on 83%


Pippen saved Jordan a championship there.

Hahahahaahha

Saved a championship in game 3.... hahab

Try Ray Allen. Thats literally saving a championship

Loser

[8Ball]

mike lost to the same guy 3 years in a row?!

has that weak shit ever happened to another top 15 player like mike?

Losing 3 years in a row to a barely top 40 player.

Weak.


Meanwhile teams like 2008 Celtics have a top 15 player KG, top 25 player Paul Pierce, and a top 40 player Ray Allen.

[And1AllDay]

Losing 3 years in a row to a barely top 40 player.

Weak.


Meanwhile teams like 2008 Celtics have a top 15 player KG, top 25 player Paul Pierce, and a top 40 player Ray Allen.

thats like bran losing to demar 3 years str8 :oldlol:

[mehyaM24]

Pippen had a horrific Finals. Who are you kidding? Wade out produced him in the Finals vs the Spurs when he was needed the most. Pippen never averaged the same amount of points as Wade did in that Finals run and he was hobbled.

Pippen for his career in the Finals is a 19 ppg scorer on 42/25/74 percent shooting. Tell me that's better and more efficient than Wade.

And if you want to factor in defense, Pippen averaged 1.9 steals per game, but Wade averaged 1.8 steals per game. Pippen averaged 1.1 blocks per game. Wade averaged 1.0.

In the Finals, Wade was far, far better overall. That's just a fact.

i agree wade was better, but you can't measure defense just on "blocks" and "steals". be serious dude lol

[97 bulls]

Pippen had a horrific Finals. Who are you kidding? Wade out produced him in the Finals vs the Spurs when he was needed the most. Pippen never averaged the same amount of points as Wade did in that Finals run and he was hobbled.

Pippen for his career in the Finals is a 19 ppg scorer on 42/25/74 percent shooting. Tell me that's better and more efficient than Wade.

And if you want to factor in defense, Pippen averaged 1.9 steals per game, but Wade averaged 1.8 steals per game. Pippen averaged 1.1 blocks per game. Wade averaged 1.0.

In the Finals, Wade was far, far better overall. That's just a fact.

You'd be the slim few that believe Pippen had a horrific Fianls seeing as how all media outlets had him as the frontrunner for Finals MVP.

Either way, I broke down your stats bro. You're wrong. That's why Pippen is ranked in the top 25.

[97 bulls]

I honestly believe I'm conversing with children. The end all be all is gonna be winning. This video is so appropriate

Come back at me when Wade has 6 Rings

https://youtu.be/C62zHgyt9cU


ITS THE ONLY ARGUMENT I NEED SHAWN!!!!!!. Imma start calling all you clowns Shawn.

[3ball]

i agree wade was better, but you can't measure defense just on "blocks" and "steals". be serious dude lol


Who needs Pippen?



Defensive ranking

07' Cavs..... #4
09' Cavs..... #3
10' Cavs..... #7 (and 3 scorers)

91' Bulls..... #7 (and 2 scorers)
92' Bulls..... #4
93' Bulls..... #7


Tons of guys could've replaced Pippen and the Bulls still would've had the #7 defense.

So it's obviously false that a 2nd option's defense can make up for 15.7 on 41% (failing their 2nd option scoring role)...

2nd options must score, and when they don't, they cause losses or unnecessarily close series - Pippen's poor scoring/efficiency was the reason for every Bulls loss or close series, including the 88' ECSF, 89' 1st Round, 89' ECF, 90' ECF, 92' ECSF, 94' ECSF, 95' ECSF, 96' Finals, 97' Finals, 98' ECF, 98' Finals.




i agree wade was better, but you can't measure defense just on "blocks" and "steals". be serious dude lol


Thread Cliffs

Pippen scored less than 13' Wade on a pace-adjusted basis in 96' and 98 Playoffs, while 93' Pippen had lower production rates across the board (BPM, VORP, PER, and WS/48).

Wade also averaged 20/5/5 in the Finals, which would be Pippen's 3rd best Finals.. Wade was within 5 of Lebron, so Lebron never carried the scoring load in the playoffs and Finals for any championship run (no carry-job rings)..

Ultimately, only MJ won more than 1 ring while carrying the scoring load... (edit: Kobe and Hakeem have 2 carry-jobs each)

[mehyaM24]

Who needs Pippen?



Defensive ranking

07' Cavs..... #4
09' Cavs..... #3
10' Cavs..... #7 (and 3 scorers)

91' Bulls..... #7 (and 2 scorers)
92' Bulls..... #4
93' Bulls..... #7


Tons of guys could've replaced Pippen and the Bulls still would've had the #7 defense.

So it's obviously false that a 2nd option's defense can make up for 15.7 on 41% (failing their 2nd option scoring role)...

2nd options must score, and when they don't, they cause losses or unnecessarily close series - Pippen's poor scoring/efficiency was the reason for every Bulls loss or close series, including the 88' ECSF, 89' 1st Round, 89' ECF, 90' ECF, 92' ECSF, 94' ECSF, 95' ECSF, 96' Finals, 97' Finals, 98' ECF, 98' Finals.

Thread Cliffs

Pippen scored less than 13' Wade on a pace-adjusted basis in 96' and 98 Playoffs, while 93' Pippen had lower production rates across the board (BPM, VORP, PER, and WS/48).

Wade also averaged 20/5/5 in the Finals, which would be Pippen's 3rd best Finals.. Wade was within 5 of Lebron, so Lebron never carried the scoring load in the playoffs and Finals for any championship run (no carry-job rings)..

Ultimately, only MJ won more than 1 ring while carrying the scoring load... (edit: Kobe and Hakeem have 2 carry-jobs each)

the conversation is with wade & pippen. what do the 07, 08 & 09 cavs have to do with anything? again, i'm saying there's more to defense than blocks & steals. the poster above you is crazy though. nobody with a brain gives pippen alpha credit for chicago's rings. jordan led the charge, not the other way around.

[97 bulls]

the conversation is with wade & pippen. what do the 07, 08 & 09 cavs have to do with anything? again, i'm saying there's more to defense than blocks & steals. the poster above you is crazy though. nobody with a brain gives pippen alpha credit for chicago's rings. jordan led the charge, not the other way around.

Lol. I got you shook bro. Every thread you go in, you allude back to that ass whipping I gave you in the Pippen/Wade debate. You're easy work, you're beneath me. I can tell you've never played a lick of sport much less basketball. What the **** is "alpha credit"? Lol. Point black. The Bulls dont win those championships without Pippen.

[mehyaM24]

Lol. I got you shook bro. Every thread you go in, you allude back to that ass whipping I gave you in the Pippen/Wade debate. You're easy work, you're beneath me. I can tell you've never played a lick of sport much less basketball. What the **** is "alpha credit"? Lol. Point black. The Bulls dont win those championships without Pippen.

this nerd stalking my posts lol. wade>pippen isn't anything new, but a know-nothing like yourself has to compensate with ring count. the numbers and facts i educated you on left your ass delirious. you just linked a video debating jordan & lebron. pippen wasn't even mentioned. clown :oldlol:

[97 bulls]

this nerd stalking my posts lol. wade>pippen isn't anything new, but a know-nothing like yourself has to compensate with ring count. the numbers and facts i educated you on left your ass delirious. you just linked a video debating jordan & lebron. pippen wasn't even mentioned. clown :oldlol:

Same concept jackass. Only losers argue moral victories. I cant even call you a loser cuz I know you've never played sports outside of NBA 2k. SMDH.

[mehyaM24]

Same concept jackass. Only losers argue moral victories.

claims i "dont know basketball" but wants to give pippen JORDAN credit lol. nobody but your remedial ass thinks that.


I cant even call you a loser cuz I know you've never played sports outside of NBA 2k. SMDH.

quit projecting stalker lol

[3ball]

the conversation is with wade & pippen. what do the 07, 08 & 09 cavs have to do with anything?






Defensive ranking

11' Heat..... #5
12' Heat..... #4

07' Cavs..... #4
09' Cavs..... #3
10' Cavs..... #7 (and 3 scorers)

91' Bulls..... #7 (and 2 scorers)
92' Bulls..... #4
93' Bulls..... #7


^^^ Pippen isn't needed to have a defense like the Bulls - all-defenders like Varejao, Hughes, Battier, or Wade achieved defenses like the Bulls, and also good defenders like Shumpert, Birdman, Mosgov, Haslem, Zydrunas, Gooden and more.

Lebron simply had more good defensive teammates and better defenses, so who cares about Pippen's defense.






the conversation is with wade & pippen. what do the 07, 08 & 09 cavs have to do with anything?





The team defense stats (above) show that any standard lineup can result in the same defenses as the Bulls (like many of Lebron's lineups/teammates)

so Pippen's defense is irrelevant - a 2nd option's defense simply can't make up for 15.7 on 41% (failing their 2nd option scoring role).

2nd options must score, and when they don't, they cause losses or unnecessarily close series - Pippen's poor scoring/efficiency was the reason for every Bulls' loss or close series, including the 88' ECSF, 89' 1st Round, 89' ECF, 90' ECF, 92' ECSF, 94' ECSF, 95' ECSF, 96' Finals, 97' Finals, 98' ECF, 98' Finals.






. jordan led the charge


.


Jordan was the charge - he carried the scoring load more than anyone ever... what else is there?????

How could anyone carry teams more than MJ when they had equal-scoring teammates?.. It's backwards logic.

Jordan still averaged more assists and assisted 33% more often than Pippen in the Playoffs, but who cares??... Scoring is what constitutes "carry-job"

Ultimately, only MJ won 2+ rings while carrying the scoring load for the Playoffs/Finals... (edit: Kobe and Hakeem have 2 carry-jobs each)... Carry-jobs were Jordan's claim to fame - only Jordan won a bunch of rings without super-teams or 1b's

[8Ball]

Because Pippen outperformed Wade for entirety of Wade's Miami LeBron years.

Pippen is top 20 all time.
Wade is top 25.

[mehyaM24]

so you're saying pippen's defense was never high impact and easily replaceable? idk if i can get on board with that, 3ball.

[3ball]

so you're saying pippen's defense was never high impact and easily replaceable? idk if i can get on board with that, 3ball.


Lebron's numerous teams all achieved better defenses than the 1st three-peat Bulls

So who cares about individual defense - it's offset by 4 teammates, whereas there's only one 2nd option scoring role..

2nd options must score, and when they don't, they cause losses or unexpected close series - Pippen's poor scoring/efficiency was the reason for every Bulls' loss or close series, including the 88' ECSF, 89' 1st Round, 89' ECF, 90' ECF, 92' ECSF, 94' ECSF, 95' ECSF, 96' Finals, 97' Finals, 98' ECF, 98' Finals.

[And1AllDay]

yes op, very discrepant

[3ball]

Because Pippen outperformed Wade for entirety of Wade's Miami LeBron years.





2012 Wade had higher BPM, PER and WS/48 than any version of Pippen

Wade was top 5 in everything in 2012

Otoh..... 13-16' Wade was reduced to prime Pippen level (20/5/5... 20 PER).. that's why everyone thinks he sucked those years.. 13' Wade was higher in the playoffs than 93' Pippen across the board (BPM,. VORP, PER, WS/48).






Pippen is top 20 all time.
Wade is top 25.





Pippen was barely awarded top 50 in 1996, and many new guys have since past him like Duncan, Curry, Kawhi, Jokic and dozens more..

So it's impossible that he's even top 70, but new fans/media make him top 30 because their on-paper evaluations only see the 6 rings..

Therefore, Pippen is obviously rated incorrectly..

The advanced stats have him about 150th, a d the raw stats about top 500 (22/5 peak stats)

[And1AllDay]

13' wades ppgz was lower then pippens worst championship playoff run


sorry 3baLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

[mehyaM24]

Lebron's numerous teams all achieved better defenses than the 1st three-peat Bulls

So who cares about individual defense - it's offset by 4 teammates, whereas there's only one 2nd option scoring role..

2nd options must score, and when they don't, they cause losses or unexpected close series - Pippen's poor scoring/efficiency was the reason for every Bulls' loss or close series, including the 88' ECSF, 89' 1st Round, 89' ECF, 90' ECF, 92' ECSF, 94' ECSF, 95' ECSF, 96' Finals, 97' Finals, 98' ECF, 98' Finals.

why can't a #2 be an all-around player? also why is individual defense synonymous with team defense? i might be able to see your point, if you used the same law with offense.

[warriorfan]

13' wades ppgz was lower then pippens worst championship playoff run


sorry 3baLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

Bran ball.

Scottie wouldn’t have broken double digits after being relegated to a spot up shooter.

[3ball]

why can't a #2 be an all-around player? also why is individual defense synonymous with team defense? i might be able to see your point, if you applied the same law to offense.


All 5 defenders are supposed to give the same effort (100%)

but on offense, there's hierarchy, including only one 2nd option scoring role.

when they don't score, they cause losses or unexpected close series - Pippen's poor scoring/efficiency was the reason for every Bulls' loss or close series, including the 88' ECSF, 89' 1st Round, 89' ECF, 90' ECF, 92' ECSF, 94' ECSF, 95' ECSF, 96' Finals, 97' Finals, 98' ECF, 98' Finals.

[mehyaM24]

All 5 defenders are supposed to give the same effort (100%)

but on offense, there's hierarchy, including only one 2nd option scoring role.

when they don't score, they cause losses or unexpected close series - Pippen's poor scoring/efficiency was the reason for every Bulls' loss or close series, including the 88' ECSF, 89' 1st Round, 89' ECF, 90' ECF, 92' ECSF, 94' ECSF, 95' ECSF, 96' Finals, 97' Finals, 98' ECF, 98' Finals.

but, there's more to offense than just scoring. unless you can't set anything up, there isn't more effort on the other side,

[3ball]

but, there's more to offense than just scoring. unless you can't set anything up, there isn't more effort on the other side,


The triangle had no point guard role - the ball moved via ball movement, while Pippen averaged 5 assists like Kyrie, Wade and about 500 other NBA players in history

He averaged less assists than Jordan and Jordan assisted 33% more often in the playoffs

Pippen had the lightest load of any 2nd option that won a bunch of rings

[ELITEpower23]

3ball, this thread ethered everything you cry about. Take your L and move on.

People might actually respect you more and take you seriously if you did that for once.

[3ball]

3ball, this thread ethered everything you cry about. Take your L and move on.

People might actually respect you more and take you seriously if you did that for once.


No, you just don't read my responses..

Pippen scored the least on a pace-adjusted basis

And Lebron never carried the scoring load in the Playoffs and Finals while winning a title, so he has zero carry-jobs to Jordan's 6

[HoopsNY]

Lol. I got you shook bro. Every thread you go in, you allude back to that ass whipping I gave you in the Pippen/Wade debate. You're easy work, you're beneath me. I can tell you've never played a lick of sport much less basketball. What the **** is "alpha credit"? Lol. Point black. The Bulls dont win those championships without Pippen.

This assumes no one is replacing Pippen. We saw Chicago win in 1996 and 1998 with sub-par Pippen. Why wouldn't Chicago win without him but with someone at least serviceable?

[mehyaM24]

This assumes no one is replacing Pippen. We saw Chicago win in 1996 and 1998 with sub-par Pippen. Why wouldn't Chicago win without him but with someone at least serviceable?

that dope assumes a lot. every argument revolves around "6 rings" but JORDAN was the head of the snake. if you put prime wade in place of scottie, chicago becomes even greater. because wade is objectively the better player.

[HoopsNY]

that dope assumes a lot. every argument revolves around "6 rings" but JORDAN was the head of the snake. if you put prime wade in place of scottie, chicago becomes even greater. because wade is objectively the better player.

For sure. If 24-25 year old Wade is there in 1989 and 1990, Chicago wins both years.

[8Ball]

13' wades ppgz was lower then pippens worst championship playoff run


sorry 3baLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

How did LeBron win in the modern era with 2013 Wade?

It boggles my mind.

[8Ball]

3ball, this thread ethered everything you cry about. Take your L and move on.

People might actually respect you more and take you seriously if you did that for once.

This thread is the ultimate truth about Scottie Pippen being superior to 2013 and 2014 Wade.

[kawhileonard2]

Lebron lost with Wade averaging 27 ppg in the finals.

[And1AllDay]

How did LeBron win in the modern era with 2013 Wade?

It boggles my mind.

one of the worst productions ppgz ever by a #2 option winning team

[And1AllDay]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

is there no one else?

[AirBonner]

We should settle the Boobie Gibson/Pippen debate before we move on to guys like Wade

Bingo lolol

[72-10]

Can't remember the last time I had seen a less impressive 18 ppg

[ImKobe]

is there no one else?

2013 Wade played just 35.5 mpg. Pippen played 4-6 more minutes a game. Heat were incredibly stacked with offensive talent with the addition of Ray Allen.

[97 bulls]

This assumes no one is replacing Pippen. We saw Chicago win in 1996 and 1998 with sub-par Pippen. Why wouldn't Chicago win without him but with someone at least serviceable?

Pippen was not subpar in 98. He was the favorite to win the Finals MVP. This has been shown to you many a time. Heres his game by game numbers

Game : 21pts 8rbds. He did shoot a paltry 38% in this game. But seeing as how Paul George bad FG% is excused by the amount of threes hes taking, why cant we apply the same logic to Pippen? Pip was 1-7 from three.

Game 2. 21pts 6rbds 4asts. On 53%

Game 3. 10pts 4rbds 4assts in a record setting blowout win. This was actually Pippens best game. But the stats arent gonna show it. His defensive prowess helped led the Bulls to hold the Jazz to only 54 pts for the game. And he shot 50% from the field.

Game 4 28pts 9rbds 5asts. 50%

Game 5 6pts 11rbds 11asts. This was his worst game and he almost got a triple double.

He played with a bad back but had a solid stat line of 8/3/4/2/1 on 57.

I always say real basketball fans can see past stats. Casual fans only see scoring and nothing else. Pippen was beast .

[Carbine]

Pippen was not subpar in 98. He was the favorite to win the Finals MVP. This has been shown to you many a time. Heres his game by game numbers

Game : 21pts 8rbds. He did shoot a paltry 38% in this game. But seeing as how Paul George bad FG% is excused by the amount of threes hes taking, why cant we apply the same logic to Pippen? Pip was 1-7 from three.

Game 2. 21pts 6rbds 4asts. On 53%

Game 3. 10pts 4rbds 4assts in a record setting blowout win. This was actually Pippens best game. But the stats arent gonna show it. His defensive prowess helped led the Bulls to hold the Jazz to only 54 pts for the game. And he shot 50% from the field.

Game 4 28pts 9rbds 5asts. 50%

Game 5 6pts 11rbds 11asts. This was his worst game and he almost got a triple double.

He played with a bad back but had a solid stat line of 8/3/4/2/1 on 57.

I always say real basketball fans can see past stats. Casual fans only see scoring and nothing else. Pippen was beast .

Pippen was never going to win FMVP over MJ. Not at any point in the series, because he never outscored or even came close to outscoring MJ.

The series could have ended after game 4 and MJ still would have won because MJ was at 32PPG and Pippen was at 20PPG. It just wasn't going to happen for Pippen when it was time to put pen to paper back then. Scoring margin too wide.

[97 bulls]

Pippen was never going to win FMVP over MJ. Not at any point in the series, because he never outscored or even came close to outscoring MJ.

The series could have ended after game 4 and MJ still would have won because MJ was at 32PPG and Pippen was at 20PPG. It just wasn't going to happen for Pippen when it was time to put pen to paper back then. Scoring margin too wide.

See what I mean by a casual fan? I agree Jordan definitely deserved the Finals MVP after what he did in game 6. But most news outlets had the Pippen as the Finals MVP winner when the Bulls had a 3-1 lead.

[Carbine]

I'm no casual fan sir.

He's MJ. Whether he deserved it or not, he wasn't going to lose out on an award to someone scoring significantly less than him even through 4 games. Just like LBJ would never lose it if he was the leading scorer by such a margin.

Media outlets are nice, but unless you can come up with known voters at the time (not just 1, but several) coming out and saying Pippen was going to be FMVP, it doesn't matter.

[MadDog]

See what I mean by a casual fan? I agree Jordan definitely deserved the Finals MVP after what he did in game 6. But most news outlets had the Pippen as the Finals MVP winner when the Bulls had a 3-1 lead.

That isn't a casual take at all. Jordan was their best scorer BY FAR and also played good defense. Most "media outlets" did not have Pippen as Finals MVP, either. The Tribune and "Deseret News" both mentioned Pippen being a worthy candidate, but again, that was through 4 games. Jordan averaged 32 on 45%FG up until that point.

Here's an exerpt from one of the outlets I cited


Just hand him the 1998 NBA Finals Most Valuable Player trophy right now. So you're tired of Michael Jordan getting all the recognition, all the glory, all the accolades? Then try this for a change: Scottie Pippen, MVP.

Sure, Jordan, owner of five Finals MVP trophies, again led the Bulls in scoring with 34 points. His Airness also served as a defensive terror against the Jazz.

https://www.deseret.com/1998/6/11/19385041/what-about-pippen-for-nba-finals-mvp

Voter vatigue isn't a valid enough reason to crown Pippen. Yes, his defense was great, however Jordan was the better player overall.

[3ba11]

That isn't a casual take at all. Jordan was their best scorer BY FAR and also played good defense. Most "media outlets" did not have Pippen as Finals MVP, either. The Tribune and "Deseret News" both mentioned Pippen being a worthy candidate, but again, that was through 4 games. Jordan averaged 32 on 45%FG up until that point.

Here's an exerpt from one of the outlets I cited



https://www.deseret.com/1998/6/11/19385041/what-about-pippen-for-nba-finals-mvp

Voter vatigue isn't a valid enough reason to crown Pippen. Yes, his defense was great, however Jordan was the better player overall.


It's 2 outlets among literally thousands (print and online) that took a devil's advocate position on FMVP through only 4 games.. So it's a completely irrelevant talking point.. More fraud from the LeSide of the aisle.

And defense doesn't make up for 15.7 on 41%... If a player gets those numbers, they're a defensive role player, not a 2nd option star

[MadDog]

It's 2 outlets among literally thousands (print and online) that took a devil's advocate position on FMVP through only 4 games.. So it's a completely irrelevant talking point.. More fraud from the LeSide of the aisle.

Idk if that poster is a "LeBron fan" but voter fatigue is a copout. Notice the author mentioning change? He couldn't get through his piece without bringing up Jordan's defense, either. Combined with his superior scoring, the award was clearly Jordan's.

[3ba11]

Idk if that poster is a "LeBron fan" but voter fatigue is a copout. Notice the author talking about change? He couldn't get through his piece without mentioning Jordan's defense, either. Combined with his superior scoring, the award was clearly Jordan's.


it's 2 outlets out of 1000's and voter fatigue is their reason like you said.. this is the best argument they can muster for pippen being a good player, in a series that he averaged 15.7 on 41%....

Otoh, we don't need to "muster" arguments for Kyrie, AD, or Wade - we can just look at their performance, since they were all equal-scoring partners on various playoff runs with Lebron (1b's)... Otoh, Pippen was a true 2nd option that peaked at 22 ppg and never got within 10 ppg of MJ in any series..

[MadDog]

it's 2 outlets out of 1000's and voter fatigue is their reason like you said.. this is the best argument they can muster for pippen being a good player, in a series that he averaged 15.7 on 41%....

Otoh, we don't need to "muster" arguments for Kyrie, AD, or Wade - we can just look at their performance, since they were all equal-scoring partners on various playoff runs with Lebron (1b's)... Otoh, Pippen was a true 2nd option that peaked at 22 ppg and never got within 10 ppg of MJ in any series..

Good points. What years do you think LeBron wasn't FMVP of his team?

[TheCorporation]

I hope I got my message across and anytime I dare read Pippen slander I will be bound to my duties of bumping this thread and sending a quick dagger to the heart of all MJ head cases.

Despite Pippen's woeful playoff scoring, Wade still scored less and all you hear is "Wade is so great, Pippen is awful."

Myth destroyed. Carry on :pimp:

[3ba11]

Good points. What years do you think LeBron wasn't FMVP of his team?


Well we have to remove one of his FMVP's because he cost Wade a FMVP in 2011... So which one should we remove?..

In the 2013 Finals, teammates staved off an 0-3 deficit while Lebron wet the bed with 16 on 39% against Diaw's sag-off defense.

Lebron's 23 on 43% was insufficient through 6 games and needed a lottery-like miracle to force Game 7.

Overall, Lebron had a 0 plus/minus for the series and negative net rating, so the Heat lost with him on the floor.

So I would give Wade the FMVP to offset 2011, and since he outscored the opposing #1 option in the 13' Finals and was the heartbeat of the Heat (he taught Lebron how to win)

Btw, 2016 or 2020 are also options because of Kyrie's heroics in destroying the key guy on the Warriors, or AD leading the team in the "real" Finals against Denver.
.

[97 bulls]

That isn't a casual take at all. Jordan was their best scorer BY FAR and also played good defense. Most "media outlets" did not have Pippen as Finals MVP, either. The Tribune and "Deseret News" both mentioned Pippen being a worthy candidate, but again, that was through 4 games. Jordan averaged 32 on 45%FG up until that point.

Here's an exerpt from one of the outlets I cited



https://www.deseret.com/1998/6/11/19385041/what-about-pippen-for-nba-finals-mvp

Voter vatigue isn't a valid enough reason to crown Pippen. Yes, his defense was great, however Jordan was the better player overall.

That article was hardly about voter fatigue. It went on to show Pippen was the catalyst in all the Bulls 3 wins up to that point. Again, had Pippen not hurt his back, he wins Finals MVP.

[MadDog]

Well we have to remove one of his FMVP's because he cost Wade a FMVP in 2011... So which one should we remove?..

In the 2013 Finals, teammates staved off an 0-3 deficit while Lebron wet the bed with 16 on 39% against Diaw's sag-off defense.

Lebron's 23 on 43% was insufficient through 6 games and needed a lottery-like miracle to force Game 7.

Overall, Lebron had a 0 plus/minus for the series and negative net rating, so the Heat lost with him on the floor.

So I would give Wade the FMVP to offset 2011, and since he outscored the opposing #1 option in the 13' Finals and was the heartbeat of the Heat (he taught Lebron how to win)

Btw, 2016 or 2020 are also options because of Kyrie's heroics in destroying the key guy on the Warriors, or AD leading the team in the "real" Finals against Denver.
.

Yeah, he definitely owes Wade a FMVP. I count 2013, but since he wasn't high impact in 13, I could see why you'd wanna negate it. Ray Allen's shot gave LeBron a chance to redeem himself in game 7. And to his credit, he did.


That article was hardly about voter fatigue. It went on to show Pippen was the catalyst in all the Bulls 3 wins up to that point. Again, had Pippen not hurt his back, he wins Finals MVP.

Nope. It's mentioned right there, before delving into the stuff you're on. Being a "worthy candidate" doesn't make you a winner. Learn the difference. Bottom line, Jordan was their best offensive player, and by a large margin. He also wasn't far off on defense. The award would've been his.

[And1AllDay]

I hope I got my message across and anytime I dare read Pippen slander I will be bound to my duties of bumping this thread and sending a quick dagger to the heart of all MJ head cases.

Despite Pippen's woeful playoff scoring, Wade still scored less and all you hear is "Wade is so great, Pippen is awful."

Myth destroyed. Carry on :pimp:

dagger

mike jordan stains shook :oldlol:

[ELITEpower23]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

Has anyone figured this out yet?

[3ba11]

Has anyone figured this out yet?


there's nothing to figure out - pippen averaged less in those years than Wade's tenure with Lebron, with often horrific efficiency (aka completely wetting the bed)

And the difference in conference strength and pace accounts for Wade's low of 15.9 - he otherwise averaged 20 in the Finals as 1b, while Pippen peaked at that amount as 2nd option (10-20 less than Jordan in either 3-peat), while cratering at worst-ever levels for a sidekick.

[TheCorporation]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

Anyone?

[2much_knowledge]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

Anyone?

Few of us are not stupid. Notice how all the prime Pippen years are there but we only see Wade numbers from injured to old....

Don't play dumb and try harder

[Gudo]

Few of us are not stupid. Notice how all the prime Pippen years are there but we only see Wade numbers from injured to old....

Don't play dumb and try harder

Lebron also had Bosh. So it's like Bosh+Wade = Pippen in terms of comparison.

[TheCorporation]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

Anybody?

[2much_knowledge]

Thank you for bumping this thread again. I almost forgot how many people i owned in one single thread

[3ba11]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

Anybody?


Wade scored less on a pace-adjusted basis with far better efficiency, while 20 ppg was needed from Wade to beat the West (almost matching Lebron), compared to 15 from Pippen on 2 occasions because the goat was carrying the load.

[ELITEpower23]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

It's over

[3ba11]

It's over


13' Wade scored more than 96' or 98' Pippen on a pace-adjusted basis with far better efficiency, while 20 ppg was needed from Wade to beat the West (almost matching Lebron), compared to 15 from Pippen (20 less than Jordan)

[ELITEpower23]

Discrepant.

Nice word OP. Must be high IQ.

[2much_knowledge]

Discrepant.

Nice word OP. Must be high IQ.

Super high i.q I'd say. He just highlighted all the prime Pippen years and left out Wade's healthy years with Lebron to try to fool some.

Slick Slick Slick

[ELITEpower23]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

Guys?

[2much_knowledge]

Guys?

Scroll up fool

[ELITEpower23]

Scroll up fool

I did, I saw Wade's 2013 ppg lower than any Pippen ppg chip run

Response?

[2much_knowledge]

I did, I saw Wade's 2013 ppg lower than any Pippen ppg chip run

Response?

I see peak pippen years start to finish vs Wade's injury prone seasons.

Response? Where is 2011 and 2012??????

[TheGoatest]

#2 options on championship team with lower playoff ppg than 2013 Wade since 1970:

1975 Jamaal Wilkes
1994 Vernon Maxwell
2003 Tony Parker

That's it. In addition to this fact, there's also the fact that aside from the 1994 Rockets, the 2016 Cavs are the only championship winning team where only one player (LeBron) was an all-star, all-NBA/defensive team member, or won any individual award during the season. In other words, LeGOATest has some of the biggest carry championship carry jobs in history.

[expansionera]

Be honest, at any point in history a team would take a 6’9 point forward that can guard four positions at an elite level, while running the offense and taking his team on a deep playoff run without any all NBA help over a 6’3 volume scorer (easiest thing to find in free agency).

Jordan and Wade needed Pippen and Shaq/Bosh/Bron just to win a playoff series. Pippen = Jordan > Wade

[RogueBorg]

Michael Jordan had 23ppg on 55% scorer Orlando Woolridge in 1985 and got swept.

23ppg! Imagine LeBron getting that kind of help!

That's great except the Bulls didn't get swept in '85. Love your passion though :applause:

[3ba11]

#2 options on championship team with lower playoff ppg than 2013 Wade since 1970:

1975 Jamaal Wilkes
1994 Vernon Maxwell
2003 Tony Parker

That's it. In addition to this fact, there's also the fact that aside from the 1994 Rockets, the 2016 Cavs are the only championship winning team where only one player (LeBron) was an all-star, all-NBA/defensive team member, or won any individual award during the season. In other words, LeGOATest has some of the biggest carry championship carry jobs in history.


None of that matters because Pippen scored the least when you adjust for pace and Jordan has numerous title runs of Pippen scoring poorly, not just 1 like Lebron...

And Lebron had a 3rd scorer so Wade's scoring doesn't matter anyway because he's sharing the load... The Heat had a Big 3 in a weak conference, so it's expected that big performance wouldn't been needed from all 3 stars to win

But against the West in the Finals, Wade averaged nearly as much as Lebron (20 ppg) and outscored the opposing #1 option, so Lebron never carried the scoring load in the Finals and never beat a good team with a sidekick wetting the bed (no real carry-jobs in 2 decades of playing - he never beat a top 5 SRS team with poor scoring and efficiency from a sidekick)

[TheGoatest]

That's great except the Bulls didn't get swept in '85. Love your passion though :applause:

They lost 3-1 to a Milwaukee Bucks team that got swept in the second round by a team lost 4-1 against by a team that lost in the finals.
Thanks for making me point this out, because someone on this forum without knowledge of NBA history might've thought this was one of those perennial Celtics sweeps of Jordan.

[TheGoatest]

None of that matters because Pippen scored the least when you adjust for pace and Jordan has numerous title runs of Pippen scoring poorly

None of this matters because LeBron has 8 rings and Jordan has 0 when you adjust for strength of competition faced.

[3ba11]

None of this matters because LeBron has 8 rings and Jordan has 0 when you adjust for strength of competition faced.


The problem with this logic is that Jordan would sweep any team in history if you gave him a 3rd all-star teammate like Lebron had (super-team), or if you gave him a teammate that out-produced him like AD does Lebron

Jordan went 6/6 in a 2-star vs 2-star format, while Lebron mostly lost with his super-teams versus non-super-teams like the Mavs or Spurs... Or he lost versus the KD super-team, who were the only super-team that Lebron faced.. (klay/dray were 1st-time all-stars in 2015 while Lebron had the veteran, perennial all-stars and was therefore the preseason favorite in 15' and 16')

[TheGoatest]

The problem with this logic is that Jordan would sweep any team in history if you gave him a 3rd all-star teammate like Lebron had (super-team), or if you gave him a teammate that out-produced him like AD does Lebron

Jordan won in a 2-star vs 2-star format, and Lebron mostly lost with his super-teams versus non-super-teams like the Mavs or Spurs, or versus the KD super-team, who were the only super-team that Lebron faced.. (klay/dray were 1st-time all-stars in 2015 while Lebron had the veteran, perennial all-stars and was therefore the preseason favorite)

The problem with that logic is that we exist in the parallel universe where Scottie Pippen came closer to winning a championship without Jordan on two each of the two separate occasions he played without Jordan than Jordan did in either of his two occasions he played without Pippen...

...Whereas LeBron's winning resumé is way better than any of his so-called "super teammates" he ever played with, in the years he played without them than the other way around - 2 championships without Wade vs Wade's 1 without LeBron, 2 chips without Bosh vs 0, 3 championships without Kyrie, Love and AD vs 0 those 3 have combined without LeBron.

Try the next parallel universe over, where it might be bizarro world in which Jordan did better without Pippen than Pippen did without Jordan.

[2much_knowledge]

The problem with that logic is that we exist in the parallel universe where Scottie Pippen came closer to winning a championship without Jordan on two each of the two separate occasions he played without Jordan than Jordan did in either of his two occasions he played without Pippen...

...Whereas LeBron's winning resumé is way better than any of his so-called "super teammates" he ever played with, in the years he played without them than the other way around - 2 championships without Wade vs Wade's 1 without LeBron, 2 chips without Bosh vs 0, 3 championships without Kyrie, Love and AD vs 0 those 3 have combined without LeBron.

Try the next parallel universe over, where it might be bizarro world in which Jordan did better without Pippen than Pippen did without Jordan.

What a dumb logic

Try to analyze without being biased for once

When jordan was w/o pippen, he was a newbie, with no team, facing the elite

When pippen was w/o jordan, he had championship experience and a squad both times.

Makes sense to everyone

[3ba11]

The problem with that logic is that we exist in the parallel universe where Scottie Pippen came closer to winning a championship without Jordan on two each of the two separate occasions he played without Jordan than Jordan did in either of his two occasions he played without Pippen...

...Whereas LeBron's winning resumé is way better than any of his so-called "super teammates" he ever played with, in the years he played without them than the other way around - 2 championships without Wade vs Wade's 1 without LeBron, 2 chips without Bosh vs 0, 3 championships without Kyrie, Love and AD vs 0 those 3 have combined without LeBron.

Try the next parallel universe over, where it might be bizarro world in which Jordan did better without Pippen than Pippen did without Jordan.


Jordan played without Pippen during his first few seasons, when nearly everyone loses - Durant, Lebron, Giannis and Curry were lottery for their first few years, so you're knocking Jordan for losing during a period when everyone loses.

Once Jordan had 3 healthy seasons to develop his team (88'), he made the 2nd Round just like 06' Lebron - the difference is that Jordan was carrying a rookie low seed in a conference that required a super-team to win it, while Lebron had the East all-star center and high seeds in a conference that 1-star teams were winning (Iverson, Kidd, Dwight).

And you'll say that Lebron was making the Finals at 22 years old, while Jordan was losing in the 1st Round - but Jordan was carrying 8 seeds in his rookie year, while Lebron had 3 seasons to develop his team into a high seed before entering the 06' Playoffs - so Lebron had better teams than his opponents (high seeds) and actually won the 1st Round by stealing his opponent's sidekick (Hughes), while Jordan had low seeds (lottery casts).

If you want to go by age, look at Lebron and Jordan's performance at 22-23 years old versus #1 defenses and championship teams - Lebron averaged 22 on 35% versus the 07' Spurs, while Jordan averaged 44 on 50% against the 86' Celtics.

[TheGoatest]

What a dumb logic

Try to analyze without being biased for once

When jordan was w/o pippen, he was a newbie, with no team, facing the elite

When pippen was w/o jordan, he had championship experience and a squad both times.

Makes sense to everyone

Yes, nothing like having to finish below in the seedings than that "elite" all-star-less team whose best player by far was a rookie Chuck Person. That was in his 3rd season, whereas Larry Bird and Tim Duncan led their teams to championships in their second seasons.

LOL @ calling me biased while claiming that a Kyrie-Love team that went 4-23 without LeBron in the seasons they played WITH LeBron (nevermind how much they sucked with Kyrie before LeBron returned and how much they sucked with Love since LeBron went) is a "Super Team".

[TheGoatest]

Jordan played without Pippen during his first few seasons, when nearly everyone loses - Durant, Lebron, Giannis and Curry were lottery for their first few years, so you're knocking Jordan for losing during a period when everyone loses.

Once Jordan had 3 healthy seasons to develop his team (88'), he made the 2nd Round just like 06' Lebron - the difference is that Jordan was carrying a rookie low seed in a conference that required a super-team to win it, while Lebron had the East all-star center and high seeds in a conference that 1-star teams were winning (Iverson, Kidd, Dwight).

And you'll say that Lebron was making the Finals at 22 years old, while Jordan was losing in the 1st Round - but Jordan was carrying 8 seeds in his rookie year, while Lebron had 3 seasons to develop his team into a high seed before entering the 06' Playoffs - so Lebron had better teams than his opponents (high seeds) and actually won the 1st Round by stealing his opponent's sidekick (Hughes), while Jordan had low seeds (lottery casts).

If you want to go by age, look at Lebron and Jordan's performance at 22-23 years old versus #1 defenses and championship teams - Lebron averaged 22 on 35% versus the 07' Spurs, while Jordan averaged 44 on 50% against the 86' Celtics.

If Jordan played with the same playoff-making criteria that LeBron had to play with in his first few seasons, not only would he have not have won a playoff series before Pippen entered the league, he wouldn't have even made the playoffs before Pippen entered the league. Instead Jordan played in an era where having a 30-52 record was enough to get you a playoff spot. That's 11 games below .500... and you still get into the playoffs.

LeBron missed the playoffs despite having a 42-40 record. By Jordan era standards, he would've made the playoffs as a 18-19 year-old rookie, let alone in his second season. And he would be over 8000 career playoff points right now.

Jordan lost 3-1 to a random-ass Milwaukee Bucks team while having a 23 ppg on 55% shooting teammate. LeBron beat a Pistons team that would mop the floor with those Bucks with someone named Daniel Gibson as his second leading scorer.

[2much_knowledge]

Yes, nothing like having to finish below in the seedings than that "elite" all-star-less team whose best player by far was a rookie Chuck Person. That was in his 3rd season, whereas Larry Bird and Tim Duncan led their teams to championships in their second seasons.

LOL @ calling me biased while claiming that a Kyrie-Love team that went 4-23 without LeBron in the seasons they played WITH LeBron (nevermind how much they sucked with Kyrie before LeBron returned and how much they sucked with Love since LeBron went) is a "Super Team".

As if Jordan would have been eliminated in the first round with David Robinson by his side lol

Excellent comparison

[3ba11]

If Jordan played with the same playoff-making criteria that LeBron had to play with in his first few seasons, not only would he have not have won a playoff series before Pippen entered the league, he wouldn't have even made the playoffs before Pippen entered the league. Instead Jordan played in an era where having a 30-52 record was enough to get you a playoff spot. That's 11 games below .500... and you still get into the playoffs.

LeBron missed the playoffs despite having a 42-40 record. By Jordan era standards, he would've made the playoffs as a 18-19 year-old rookie, let alone in his second season. And he would be over 8000 career playoff points right now.


.


Lebron only had high seeds/good teams in the playoffs - he was never forced to carry bad teams/low seeds like Jordan

so the statistical anomaly that allowed the 30-win Bulls in the playoffs only means that Jordan carried a worse team than anyone ever had, yet still played the 86' Celtics closer than Lebron's veteran champion teams played the 14' Spurs or 18' Warriors.

Jordan carried an 8 ppg rookie to the 2nd Round, while Lebron needed the East all-star center and a 22/5/5 all-defender acquisition to make the 06' Playoffs - that's why Lebron had high seeds compared to Jordans low seeds.. Heck, Lebron stole his opponent's sidekick to win his first playoff series - he beat Arenas after stealing Hughes, so that's proof of Lebron's superior casts to his Eastern opponents.






Jordan lost 3-1 to a random-ass Milwaukee Bucks team while having a 23 ppg on 55% shooting teammate.

LeBron beat a Pistons team that would mop the floor with those Bucks





No

07' Pistons...... #6 SRS... 53 wins.. 1 seed
07' Cavs........... #7 SRS... 50 wins.. 2 seed

85' Bucks......... #1 SRS... 59 wins.. 2 seed
85' Bulls......... #14 SRS... 38 wins.. 7 seed

89' Cavs........... #1 SRS... 57 wins.. 3 seed
89' Bulls......... #10 SRS... 47 wins.. 6 seed

[TheGoatest]

As if Jordan would have been eliminated in the first round with David Robinson by his side lol

Excellent comparison

As if LeBron wouldn't have won 8 rings if the Cavs drafted Kevin Durant in 2007.

[TheGoatest]

Lebron only had high seeds/good teams in the playoffs - he was never forced to carry bad teams/low seeds like Jordan

so the statistical anomaly that allowed the 30-win Bulls in the playoffs only means that Jordan carried a worse team than anyone ever had, yet still played the 86' Celtics closer than Lebron's veteran champion teams played the 14' Spurs or 18' Warriors.

Jordan carried an 8 ppg rookie to the 2nd Round, while Lebron needed the East all-star center and a 22/5/5 all-defender acquisition to make the 06' Playoffs - that's why Lebron had high seeds compared to Jordans low seeds.. Heck, Lebron stole his opponent's sidekick to win his first playoff series - he beat Arenas after stealing Hughes, so that's proof of Lebron's superior casts to his Eastern opponents.






No

07' Pistons...... #6 SRS... 53 wins.. 1 seed
07' Cavs........... #7 SRS... 50 wins.. 2 seed

85' Bucks......... #1 SRS... 59 wins.. 2 seed
85' Bulls......... #14 SRS... 38 wins.. 7 seed

89' Cavs........... #1 SRS... 57 wins.. 3 seed
89' Bulls......... #10 SRS... 47 wins.. 6 seed

LeBron made his teams into teams with winning records in his 2nd season as a 19-20 year-old. Jordan couldn't even crack .500 in any of his season prior to Pippen's arrival despite playing with not one but two teammates who were clearly better than anyone LeBron played with in his first period with the Cavs.

LeBron's franchise only acquired players like Mo Williams - they never acquired a certified legend GOAT perimeter defender Scottie Pippen.

Rookie Pippen made Jordan into a winner, who up until him wasn't able to have a higher seed than a team whose best player by far was a rookie Chuck Person.

2007 Pistons: Beat two teams in a 7 game series, including a team that beat another team in a 7 game series.
1985 Bucks: Beat Jordan in a 5 game series, then proceeded to lose to a team in a 7 game series that lost to another team in a 7 game series that lost to another team in a 7 game series.

[3ba11]

LeBron made his teams into teams with winning records in his 2nd season as a 19-20 year-old. Jordan couldn't even crack .500 in any of his season prior to Pippen's arrival despite playing with not one but two teammates who were clearly better than anyone LeBron played with in his first period with the Cavs.

LeBron's franchise only acquired players like Mo Williams - they never acquired a certified legend GOAT perimeter defender Scottie Pippen.

Rookie Pippen made Jordan into a winner, who up until him wasn't able to have a higher seed than a team whose best player by far was a rookie Chuck Person.

.


Lebron entered the league with the East all-star center on his team, yet he could only win 35 and 42 games, while Jordan won 38 with the traveling cocaine circus in 85' and 87' (injured in 86').

Jordan's 38 wins happened to make the 8 seed, while Lebron's 35 and 42 avoided the playoffs as the 9 seed, aka Lebron avoided carrying his worst teams in the playoffs like MJ did... Instead, Lebron got 3 seasons to develop into a high seed before entering the playoffs in 06', while Jordan was thrown into the playoffs in Year 1 as an 8 seed.

Again, we have actual proof of Lebron's superior casts to his Eastern opponents because Arenas/Hughes made the 2nd Round in 05', but Lebron stole Hughes to beat Arenas in 06'.. So Lebron's high seed had the East all-star center and his opponent's sidekick in a conference that 1-star teams were winning (Iverson, Kidd, Dwight), while Jordan had rookie low seeds in a conference that required a super-team to win..







Rookie Pippen made Jordan into a winner,





Rookie Pippen averaged 8 ppg this horrible play is why the Bulls didn't win the title from 88-90' - so many guys would've won in his place.






2007 Pistons: Beat two teams in a 7 game series, including a team that beat another team in a 7 game series.
1985 Bucks: Beat Jordan in a 5 game series, then proceeded to lose to a team in a 7 game series that lost to another team in a 7 game series that lost to another team in a 7 game series





07' Pistons...... #6 SRS... 53 wins.. 1 seed
07' Cavs........... #7 SRS... 50 wins.. 2 seed

85' Bucks......... #1 SRS... 59 wins.. 2 seed
85' Bulls......... #14 SRS... 38 wins.. 7 seed

89' Cavs........... #1 SRS... 57 wins.. 3 seed
89' Bulls......... #10 SRS... 47 wins.. 6 seed

[TheGoatest]

Lebron entered the league with the East all-star center on his team, yet he could only win 35 and 42 games, while Jordan won 38 with the traveling cocaine circus in 85' and 87' (injured in 86').

Jordan's 38 wins happened to make the 8 seed, while Lebron's 35 and 42 avoided the playoffs as the 9 seed, aka Lebron avoided carrying his worst teams in the playoffs like MJ did... Instead, Lebron got 3 seasons to develop into a high seed before entering the playoffs in 06', while Jordan was thrown into the playoffs in Year 1 as an 8 seed.

Again, we have actual proof of Lebron's superior casts to his Eastern opponents because Arenas/Hughes made the 2nd Round in 05', but Lebron stole Hughes to beat Arenas in 06'.. So Lebron's high seed had the East all-star center and his opponent's sidekick in a conference that 1-star teams were winning (Iverson, Kidd, Dwight), while Jordan had rookie low seeds in a conference that required a super-team to win..

LeBron more than doubled his crappy franchise's win total from the previous season as a 18-19 year old, straight out of high-school rookie, from 17 wins (worst record in the league= to 35 wins: Added 18 wins.
Jordan entered the league as a 21-22 3 year college veteran yet was the weakest link in the playoffs with a teammate who averaged 23 on 55%. He didn't win a playoff series until Pippen entered the league and didn't win a championship until Pippen entered his prime. If he played in an era where 30 wins wouldn't have been enough to make the playoffs, he wouldn't have even made the playoffs without Pippen.

Again, we have actual proof of Pippen's superior value to the Bulls' winning over Jordan because Pippen did better without Jordan (1993-94 and 1999-00) than Jordan did without Pippen (1984-1987 and 2001-2003) on not one but two separate occasions.


Rookie Pippen averaged 8 ppg this horrible play is why the Bulls didn't win the title from 88-90' - so many guys would've won in his place.

Empty stats OrlandoMcGrady/HoustonHarden Jordan averaged 37 ppg his last season without Pippen, these empty points couldn't amount to a better seed than an all-star-less team whose best player by far was a rookie Chuck Person. So many full stat players could've had a .500 season in Jordan's place.



07' Pistons...... #6 SRS... 53 wins.. 1 seed
07' Cavs........... #7 SRS... 50 wins.. 2 seed

85' Bucks......... #1 SRS... 59 wins.. 2 seed
85' Bulls......... #14 SRS... 38 wins.. 7 seed

89' Cavs........... #1 SRS... 57 wins.. 3 seed
89' Bulls......... #10 SRS... 47 wins.. 6 seed

2007 Pistons: Beat two teams in a 7 game series, including a team that beat another team in a 7 game series.
1985 Bucks: Beat Jordan in a 5 game series, then proceeded to lose to a team in a 7 game series that lost to another team in a 7 game series that lost to another team in a 7 game series

[kawhileonard2]

Wade won finals mvp and actually scored more than Lebron in a series.:facepalm

[kawhileonard2]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?496256-Lebron-with-Tim-Duncan-Bronze-Medal-in-Olympics-Vince-with-KG-Gold-Medal

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?496255-Lebron-with-Carlos-Boozer-No-Playoffs-Deron-Williams-with-Carlos-Boozer-WCF

[TheCorporation]

#2 options on championship team with lower playoff ppg than 2013 Wade since 1970:

1975 Jamaal Wilkes
1994 Vernon Maxwell
2003 Tony Parker

That's it. In addition to this fact, there's also the fact that aside from the 1994 Rockets, the 2016 Cavs are the only championship winning team where only one player (LeBron) was an all-star, all-NBA/defensive team member, or won any individual award during the season. In other words, LeGOATest has some of the biggest carry championship carry jobs in history.

Ether

[2much_knowledge]

Nice triumphant return of da King lol

[2much_knowledge]

LeBron made his teams into teams with winning records in his 2nd season as a 19-20 year-old. Jordan couldn't even crack .500 in any of his season prior to Pippen's arrival despite playing with not one but two teammates who were clearly better than anyone LeBron played with in his first period with the Cavs.

LeBron's franchise only acquired players like Mo Williams - they never acquired a certified legend GOAT perimeter defender Scottie Pippen.

Rookie Pippen made Jordan into a winner, who up until him wasn't able to have a higher seed than a team whose best player by far was a rookie Chuck Person.

2007 Pistons: Beat two teams in a 7 game series, including a team that beat another team in a 7 game series.
1985 Bucks: Beat Jordan in a 5 game series, then proceeded to lose to a team in a 7 game series that lost to another team in a 7 game series that lost to another team in a 7 game series.

Bragging about those 2007 Pistons with no Ben Wallace. Jeez

[Shooter]

Guys?
https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

[3ba11]

Guys?
https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png


Wade scored much more than Pippen on better efficiency

It isn't even close

Pippen wasn't a scoring option - he wasn't a scorer... Wade was

[Shooter]

Wade scored much more than Pippen on better efficiency

It isn't even close

Pippen wasn't a scoring option - he wasn't a scorer... Wade was

2013 playoffs Wade 15.9
1998 playoffs Pippen 16.8

Get fukt :lol

[3ba11]

2013 playoffs Wade 15.9
1998 playoffs Pippen 16.8

Get fukt :lol


Lebron only averaged 25 because it was a shared load.

Wade played on a super-team in a weak conference, so he wasn't needed until the Finals (20 for Wade... 15 for Pippen on woat efficiency)

[Shooter]

Lebron only averaged 25 because it was a shared load.

Wade played on a super-team in a weak conference, so he wasn't needed until the Finals (20 for Wade... 15 for Pippen on woat efficiency)

:lol 3bot is broken, let's try this again:

Is it discrepant to complain about Pippen's playoff ppg when Wade scored even less?
https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

[3ba11]

:lol 3bot is broken, let's try this again:

Is it discrepant to complain about Pippen's playoff ppg when Wade scored even less?
https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png


Wade scored far more than Pippen - one Eastern run with a super-team in a weak conference is the kind of exception that proves the rule

Jordan had to beat great teams with Pippen wetting the bed while Lebron didn't

[TheGoatest]

Guys?
https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

Damn...
At least Wade had better all-round stats than The Great Scott Pippen in his 15.9 ppg playoff run. Oh wait... :roll:

[Shooter]

Damn...
At least Wade had better all-round stats than The Great Scott Pippen in his 15.9 ppg playoff run. Oh wait... :roll:

And now 3bot is broken :lol

He can't compute. He has been defeated by me again. I never lose an argument to a simpleton like him.

[Baller789]

And now 3bot is broken :lol

He can't compute. He has been defeated by me again. I never lose an argument to a simpleton like him.

Well, peasant 8ball using his own alts to bump up his own thread.

What a joke of a human being. :roll:

[La Frescobaldi]

And now 3bot is broken :lol

He can't compute. He has been defeated by me again. I never lose an argument to a simpleton like him.

Well done but finish the job talk about defense and rebounding. Even though that idiot oddball doesn’t know anything about it they used to be important before adam silver showed up and ruined the sport

[3ba11]

.
Lebron never defeated maximum defensive attention (carried the scoring load in the Finals) and never beat a top 5 SRS team with bed-wetting sidekicks.

So he literally has zero carry-jobs against good teams in 2 decades of playing (never defeated maximum defensive attention, aka carried scoring load in Finals and never carried bed-wetting sidekicks over top 5 SRS teams).

^^^ This was never refuted and can't be because it's the historical record.. So 3ball won this thread a long time ago after OP kept reposting Lebron's few carry-jobs OVER BAD TEAMS, WHICH EVERYONE DOES.. If you never did it against good teams (top 5 SRS or Finals team), then who gives a shit.

Lebron simply isn't good enough to beat a top 5 SRS opponent with poor scoring and efficiency from a sidekick (like Mo's 18 on 37%).. Lebron can't beat good teams with bed-wetting teammates because his high scoring levels are too ball-dominant to beat good teams.. He can only beat Finals teams with near-equal-scoring partners because his own high scoring levels are too ball-dominant (insufficient jumpshooting skill to promote more ball movement).

[Hey Yo]

Thought about it. Jordan was a rookie, broke his foot, faced 3 teams over 60 wins.

Pippen played with two stacked teams after the bulls and didn't do shit but get crossed by Kobe and knock down some towels in frustration lol

He also cost chicago the ring in 1990 but everyone gives him a pass just like they give lebron a past for failing wade vs dallas

Betas gonna betas

Pippen's first year as first option = 3rd MVP voting, won 55gms, All-NBA on both sides of the court and a bullshit call from making the ECF.

MJ = All-NBA and bounced in first round.

[Shooter]

Well done but finish the job talk about defense and rebounding. Even though that idiot oddball doesn’t know anything about it they used to be important before adam silver showed up and ruined the sport

I wanted to step on his puny neck just by mentioning ppg alone but yes you are right, with the mention of defense and rebounding it quickly becomes a landslide victory.

[Shooter]

So Wade's 2013 playoff ppg was lower than ANY Pippen championship year and 3ball cried about Pippen's low scoring? :roll:

And we haven't even mentioned defense yet?

[3ba11]

So Wade's 2013 playoff ppg was lower than ANY Pippen championship year and 3ball cried about Pippen's low scoring? :roll:

And we haven't even mentioned defense yet?


Wade averaged nearly the same as Lebron in the Finals (20 to 25) because Lebron lacls the elite jumpshooting skill to defeat maximum defensive attention (carry scoring load in Finals).

That's all that matters because the East could be won by 1-star teams like Iverson, Kidd, Dwight - Lebron won it by himself or nearly won in 07', 09', 10', and 15', so the super-team was massive overkill..

[Shooter]

Wade averaged nearly the same as Lebron in the Finals (20 to 25) because Lebron lacls the elite jumpshooting skill to defeat maximum defensive attention (carry scoring load in Finals).

That's all that matters because the East could be won by 1-star teams like Iverson, Kidd, Dwight - Lebron won it by himself or nearly won in 07', 09', 10', and 15', so the super-team was massive overkill..

So Wade's 2013 playoff ppg was lower than ANY Pippen championship year and 3ball cried about Pippen's low scoring? :roll:

And we haven't even mentioned defense yet?

[3ba11]

So Wade's 2013 playoff ppg was lower than ANY Pippen championship year and 3ball cried about Pippen's low scoring? :roll:

And we haven't even mentioned defense yet?


Wade always averaged more than Pippen against good teams, while super-teams don't need good stats to beat weak teams - Lebron only averaged 25 for that entire run (bum)... ::roll:

[Shooter]

Wade always averaged more than Pippen against good teams, while super-teams don't need good stats to beat weak teams - Lebron only averaged 25 for that entire run (bum)... ::roll:

Is this what a full meltdown looks like? :lol Stay focused buddy

[3ba11]

Is this what a full meltdown looks like? :lol Stay focused buddy


^^^ at least make it a GOOD deflection.. :facepalm:

you didn't realize Lebron only averaged 25 did you lol - super-teams don't need good stats to beat shit opponents and conferences

[Shooter]

^^^ at least make it a GOOD deflection.. :facepalm:

you didn't realize Lebron only averaged 25 did you lol - super-teams don't need good stats to beat shit opponents and conferences


Wade's 2013 playoff ppg was lower than ANY Pippen championship year and you cried about Pippen's low scoring?

And we haven't even mentioned defense yet...?

[2much_knowledge]

Loser squad go on a old thread bumping rampage as a sad sad sad attempt to keep him relevant

badmouth jordan as a coping mechanism

Im such a profet aint i? Lol. Stop bumping garbage.

[WhiteKyrie]

Sadly, Wade averaged more ppg in the 2011 finals than Pippen in his whole career. But lebron laid and egg and didn't helped out Wade at all. Sabotaged Wade's finals mvp.

That would’ve been Wade’s second Finals MVP before LeBron even got one. Bad look for him after already looking like a coward needing to team up with Wade … and Bosh. :roll: sabotage for sure. Pip never came close to Finals MVP. Let alone twice. If LeBron didn’t wet the bed.

[TheGoatest]

Gotta love how jordon extremist alts point out The Great Scott Pippen's "low scoring", but then get shut down by the fact that LeGOATest won a chip with Wade averaging 15.9 ppg in the playoffs, which is lower than ANY of the averages of The Great Scott Pippen. And we're ONLY talking about scoring. If we include overall numbers and defense, it isn't even close. :roll:

[Phoenix]

Wade averaged nearly the same as Lebron in the Finals (20 to 25) because Lebron lacls the elite jumpshooting skill to defeat maximum defensive attention (carry scoring load in Finals).




How is 20 to 25ppg 'nearly the same'? MJ is a career 33ppg playoff scorer, and Lebron is a career 29ppg playoff scorer, and you're quick to categorize that 4ppg differenial as two different tiers. So how is a 5ppg difference between 20 and 25ppg 'nearly the same'? So how is Wade averaging 20 to Lebron's 25ppg over 7 games a more relevant sample size......remember THAT argument?!!.....compared to the overall playoff scoring over of Lebron averaging 25.9ppg and Wade 15.9 over 20+ games. You call 'defeating maximum defensive attention' a scoring differential of 10ppg or more. You're on record as saying this numerous times So what's 25.9 ( Lebron) and Wade(15.9) come out to on your calculator? How is that 'not defeating maximum defensive attention'? How is it not defeating maximum defensive attention when Lebron drops 32 and Wade 14 in game 6? Or Lebron drops 37 and Wade 23 in game 7? All WELL over the 10ppg 'maximum defensive attention' threshold you spam on a daily basis. Why do you shit on Pippen's scoring when Wade dropped 10 points in game 2? The reason Wade was able to average 20ppg in the finals in the first place is because he was spending the first 3 rounds averaging 14ppg, 13ppg, and 15ppg. Who was carrying the scoring for the first THREE rounds dropping 25, 24, and 29ppg?

This isn't about defending anyone at this point. I'm a Jordan fan. Wade's one of my favorites. I don't care about Lebron one way or another. It's about calling you out on your bullshit.

[Shooter]

Gotta love how jordon extremist alts point out The Great Scott Pippen's "low scoring", but then get shut down by the fact that LeGOATest won a chip with Wade averaging 15.9 ppg in the playoffs, which is lower than ANY of the averages of The Great Scott Pippen. And we're ONLY talking about scoring. If we include overall numbers and defense, it isn't even close. :roll:

The sheer beauty of it all is quite remarkable.

Post a simple fact and all we are left with in response are malfunctioning 3bot responses that do not contain even one shred of sense, clearly exemplifying another obvious and necessary victory for LeFam.

[Shooter]

Friendly reminder, Wade's 2013 playoff ppg was lower than ANY Pippen championship year

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png