Shawn Marion dropping truth BOMBS about the media and ball-dominator predictability

[3ball]

.
Shawn Marion is has moved into my top 4 all-time players for being a real dude and a unique talent:


0:46 (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pNOpxN6Ac-4&t=0m46s) - Marion says the media doesn't know shit about basketball and never played, so their narratives are FALSE, like the narrative they had about the Nash Suns (which he explains in detail)..

2:16 (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pNOpxN6Ac-4&t=02m16s) - Marion says the Suns lost because they were too predictable, with Nash dominating the ball, and D'Antoni never adjusting


Of course, all this stuff applies to the predictable Lebron-ball - the only difference between Nash and Lebron is that Nash didn't stack the deck with a super-team - before the "decision", lebron was a 1-trick pony like AI, Kidd and Dwight (with 1 Finals run in a weak conference)...

However, it should be noted that Nash was an elite shooter, which helped the Suns have #1 offenses in the regular season.

Carry on the fraud tho

[1987_Lakers]

Didnt CP3 say one of the reasons the Clippers always lost to Golden State was because of the clippers constant ball movement? He said the Warriors would just switch matchups which would make them easier to stop.

The toughest series the KD Warriors ever had was against Houston. A known ISO team that had a 3-2 lead before CP3 went down.

[3ball]

Didnt CP3 say one of the reasons the Clippers always lost to Golden State was because of the clippers constant ball movement? He said the Warriors would just switch matchups which would make them easier to stop.

The toughest series the KD Warriors ever had was against Houston. A known ISO team that had a 3-2 lead before CP3 went down.


Yet all these ball-dominators lose, including cp3, nash, westbrook, harden, and lebron before the "decision" to stack the deck

Otoh, the off-ball guys (ball movement guys) like Kobe, Bird, KD, Kawhi, Dirk and MJ have unbelievable Finals records

[1987_Lakers]

Yet all these ball-dominators lose, including cp3, nash, westbrook, harden, and lebron before the "decision" to stack the deck

Otoh, the off-ball guys (ball movement guys) like Kobe, Bird, KD, Kawhi, Dirk and MJ have unbelievable Finals records

Yet, LeBron has 4 rings.

[SouBeachTalents]

Yet all these ball-dominators lose, including cp3, nash, westbrook, harden, and lebron before the "decision" to stack the deck

Otoh, the off-ball guys (ball movement guys) like Kobe, Bird, KD, Kawhi, Dirk and MJ have unbelievable Finals records
:lol

Tell me more though about how 3-2, 2-1, 2-1 & 1-1 are "unbelievable" Finals records :oldlol:

And your hypocrisy and double standards never cease to amaze me. I've seen you post repeatedly about how LeBron was never able to outscore his sidekick by more than 5 points in his Finals wins, yet here you are giving Kobe full credit for his Finals record when he was outscored by 10-20 points in his first 3 Finals wins

[Bronbron23]

Didnt CP3 say one of the reasons the Clippers always lost to Golden State was because of the clippers constant ball movement? He said the Warriors would just switch matchups which would make them easier to stop.

The toughest series the KD Warriors ever had was against Houston. A known ISO team that had a 3-2 lead before CP3 went down.

Yeah but that series was a defensive one. Rockets offense for the most part was sub par that series. They had 2 games in the 80's, 3 in the 90's. Out of the 7 games they only had one where they were really good offensively.

[insight]

Yet all these ball-dominators lose, including cp3, nash, westbrook, harden, and lebron before the "decision" to stack the deck

Otoh, the off-ball guys (ball movement guys) like Kobe, Bird, KD, Kawhi, Dirk and MJ have unbelievable Finals records
.
What about ball dominators like Magic Johnson, IT, Tony Parker many others that were successful. You are also ignoring the fact other than Kobe and MJ they all ran difference offenseses.

[tpols]

Nashs offenses were always number
1 with elite assist ranks so that makes no sense. If anything it was their defense that did them in but they wouldve won a ring if not for a bogus suspension that Robert Horry instigated. (similar to how bran instigated with dray)

[BigKobeFan]

That's why predictable bran ball needs 2 other guys who can score on their own without being part of the system.

[8Ball]

4 rebounds. 2 assists.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

He says the suspension didn't matter, but it absolutely did.

Had Amare and Diaw played, Phoenix definitely make the finals. No doubt about it.

[ShawkFactory]

Nashs offenses were always number
1 with elite assist ranks so that makes no sense. If anything it was their defense that did them in but they wouldve won a ring if not for a bogus suspension that Robert Horry instigated. (similar to how bran instigated with dray)

They also were missing Amare for all of 2006. With him there I think they're the clear favorites to win the title.

And we know how unlucky they were in 07 obviously.

Sometimes outside circumstances prevent guys from winning. It's not always them and their play-style.

[3ball]

Nashs offenses were always number
1 with elite assist ranks so that makes no sense. If anything it was their defense that did them in but they wouldve won a ring if not for a bogus suspension that Robert Horry instigated. (similar to how bran instigated with dray)


The best defense is a good offense, and Shawn Marion said the Suns' offense was predictable.

The predictability doesn't rear it's head in the regular season because teams only play each other in 1-offs (no adjusting)

Ultimately, a predictable offense requires less energy to defend, so opponents have more capacity to go off offensively.

[8Ball]

Best defense is a defense anchored by Scottie Pippen.

[Spain_]

Teams built around a single ball handler don't win championships.
Teams with ball dominant PGs in general don't win championships, even if the team has a more diverse offense, it is what it is.

[Spain_]

Teams built around a single ball handler don't win championships.
Teams with ball dominant PGs in general don't win championships, even if the team has a more diverse offense, it is what it is.

This can also apply to non PG stars.
High usage playstyles are just not the most effective way to play basketball, there's 5 men on the court, USE them!

[3ball]

:lol

Tell me more though about how 3-2, 2-1, 2-1 & 1-1 are "unbelievable" Finals records :oldlol:





Ball-dominators like Magic, Lebron, CP3, Nash, Westbrook or Harden are 9-12 in the Finals, while off-ball players like Bird, Jordan, Kobe, Kawhi, KD or Dirk are 19-8

No comparison.

And btw, all those individual records are better than 4-6 because everyone knows that Lebron manufactured Finals-appearances in the East..

Ultimately, Finals appearances are conference-dependent affairs and only winning them matters.






And your hypocrisy and double standards never cease to amaze me. I've seen you post repeatedly about how LeBron was never able to outscore his sidekick by more than 5 points in his Finals wins, yet here you are giving Kobe full credit for his Finals record when he was outscored by 10-20 points in his first 3 Finals wins


I never give Kobe credit for his rings with Shaq

However, I credit his 2 non-superteam rings with a true 2nd option as a goat achievement - in the history of 3-pointer basketball, the only 2nd options on champions that never achieved elite 1st option stats or FMVP (true 2nd options) are Gasol, Rip Hamilton, Klay, Horry and Pippen.. Every other 2nd option was actually an elite 1st option or FMVP.

[Johnny32]

the lakers don't even play bron ball lol.

[Johnny32]

oh and btw...no one ever mentioned finals record when comparing greats before legoat. jordone fangirls are so desperate and scared lol.

[Johnny32]

Ball-dominators like Magic, Lebron, CP3, Nash, Westbrook or Harden are 9-12 in the Finals, while off-ball players like Bird, Jordan, Kobe, Kawhi, KD or Dirk are 19-8

No comparison.

And btw, all those individual records are better than 4-6 because everyone knows that Lebron manufactured Finals-appearances in the East..

Ultimately, Finals appearances are conference-dependent affairs and only winning them matters.






I never give Kobe credit for his rings with Shaq

However, I credit his 2 non-superteam rings with a true 2nd option as a goat achievement - in the history of 3-pointer basketball, the only 2nd options on champions that never achieved elite 1st option stats or FMVP (true 2nd options) are Gasol, Rip Hamilton, Klay, Horry and Pippen.. Every other 2nd option was actually an elite 1st option or FMVP.

hurrr, pippen finished third in mvp voting as a first option when mj quit, durrr

[dirkdiggler41]

Teams built around a single ball handler don't win championships.
Teams with ball dominant PGs in general don't win championships, even if the team has a more diverse offense, it is what it is.

That is because those teams usually have a superstar and the rest of the team is good, but not great. If those ballhogs had better players around them, they would give the ball up more. Just look at those LeBron James teams. Do you want LeBron og Larry Hughes to handle the ball? Mo Williams? Delonte West? You give him Kyrie and Wade and you got a different story.

[Spain_]

That is because those teams usually have a superstar and the rest of the team is good, but not great. If those ballhogs had better players around them, they would give the ball up more. Just look at those LeBron James teams. Do you want LeBron og Larry Hughes to handle the ball? Mo Williams? Delonte West? You give him Kyrie and Wade and you got a different story.

Yeah that's part of it, but it has to do with the way people play.
Dirk lead a team of role players to the championship taking exactly as much of the load on as he should, he could have been more of a ball hog but he didn't , for the sake of quality basketball.

[Spain_]

Yeah that's part of it, but it has to do with the way people play.
Dirk lead a team of role players to the championship taking exactly as much of the load on as he should, he could have been more of a ball hog but he didn't , for the sake of quality basketball.

The years Westbrook won the MVP, I think there were ways that team could have gotten a higher seed of he didn't chase stats

[SouBeachTalents]

Ball-dominators like Magic, Lebron, CP3, Nash, Westbrook or Harden are 9-12 in the Finals, while off-ball players like Bird, Jordan, Kobe, Kawhi, KD or Dirk are 19-8

No comparison.

And btw, all those individual records are better than 4-6 because everyone knows that Lebron manufactured Finals-appearances in the East..

Ultimately, Finals appearances are conference-dependent affairs and only winning them matters.






I never give Kobe credit for his rings with Shaq

However, I credit his 2 non-superteam rings with a true 2nd option as a goat achievement - in the history of 3-pointer basketball, the only 2nd options on champions that never achieved elite 1st option stats or FMVP (true 2nd options) are Gasol, Rip Hamilton, Klay, Horry and Pippen.. Every other 2nd option was actually an elite 1st option or FMVP.
Durant has the most manufactured rings of all time, he's 0-1 in the Finals without jumping ship to a 73 win team. And you clearly do give Kobe credit for the Shaq rings since you include his 5-2 record, he's 2-1 without Shaq

[Ainosterhaspie]

The Warriors demonstrate 3ball has no idea what he's talking about. In simple terms good offense happens when easy scoring opportunities are created. Systems and stars are two ways to create those easy opportunities. Ideally you have both, but small disruptions undermine the offense.

The Warriors core was in place by 2014, but made a massive leap forward in 2015, then another in 2016. What changed? New coach brings in system that fits the talent. But even there, in the 2015 finals, things looked shaky until they discovered their small ball death lineup that won them the title and was the foundation for the greatest regular season ever.

The Warriors didn't achieve this sooner, not because of player deficiency, but coaching deficiency. A great system is impossible without the right coach. And even with the right coach, stumbling on the perfect setup may take time and luck.

But the 2016 finals showed that even with a great system and stars, one weak link could ruin the whole thing. The Cavaliers stopped defending Harrison Barnes, he couldn't make them pay and it all fell apart.

So they bring in a superstar scorer to replace him, a guy who fits 3balls off ball great scorer trope, and its all good for one season, but even there, they don't seem to hit quite the same highs. They're more stable with a higher floor, but it isn't quite the same, and by 2018, Durant's not bothering to keep things going and looks to just score more. Not a ball dominator, but the system isn't working like it once did.

Highly effective motion offenses are great when they work, but having all the right pieces is very difficult to achieve, because one little flaw can disrupt the whole thing. Coaches who are effective at implementing such a system are rare. One guy who makes bad decisions can ruin it all. One guy not making open shots can ruin it all.

The "ball dominators" allow a team to have strong, even great offenses when things necessary for a ball movement system are missing. Don't have a great offensive minded coach? No problem. The ball dominant star can be the system. Don't have other playmaker. No problem. The star has that covered. Can't create open looks. No problem, the star doesn't need them.

Part of the genius of Jackson was that he understood something was needed that would keep the team afloat when his star wasn't generating offense. Many lesser coaches don't bother. They just ride their star and hope he'll be transcendent enough to overcome the low spots when he's not creating.

Superstars who are elite in many facets of the game aren't the most likely bottleneck point that prevents great systems. Inadequate coaching and lack of depth are generally the real culprits.

[Lebron23]

Suns failed to win a championship because they never play defense.

[StrongLurk]

Why the hell do people still respond to this troll? He's clearly a mentally unstable troll who cant help but post the same nonsense hundreds of thousands of times on the internet. Amazingly enough OP would crawl back into his hole if people just kept ignoring his bullshit.

[tpols]

The Warriors demonstrate 3ball has no idea what he's talking about. In simple terms good offense happens when easy scoring opportunities are created. Systems and stars are two ways to create those easy opportunities. Ideally you have both, but small disruptions undermine the offense.

The Warriors core was in place by 2014, but made a massive leap forward in 2015, then another in 2016. What changed? New coach brings in system that fits the talent. But even there, in the 2015 finals, things looked shaky until they discovered their small ball death lineup that won them the title and was the foundation for the greatest regular season ever.

The Warriors didn't achieve this sooner, not because of player deficiency, but coaching deficiency. A great system is impossible without the right coach. And even with the right coach, stumbling on the perfect setup may take time and luck.

But the 2016 finals showed that even with a great system and stars, one weak link could ruin the whole thing. The Cavaliers stopped defending Harrison Barnes, he couldn't make them pay and it all fell apart.

So they bring in a superstar scorer to replace him, a guy who fits 3balls off ball great scorer trope, and its all good for one season, but even there, they don't seem to hit quite the same highs. They're more stable with a higher floor, but it isn't quite the same, and by 2018, Durant's not bothering to keep things going and looks to just score more. Not a ball dominator, but the system isn't working like it once did.

Highly effective motion offenses are great when they work, but having all the right pieces is very difficult to achieve, because one little flaw can disrupt the whole thing. Coaches who are effective at implementing such a system are rare. One guy who makes bad decisions can ruin it all. One guy not making open shots can ruin it all.

The "ball dominators" allow a team to have strong, even great offenses when things necessary for a ball movement system are missing. Don't have a great offensive minded coach? No problem. The ball dominant star can be the system. Don't have other playmaker. No problem. The star has that covered. Can't create open looks. No problem, the star doesn't need them.

Part of the genius of Jackson was that he understood something was needed that would keep the team afloat when his star wasn't generating offense. Many lesser coaches don't bother. They just ride their star and hope he'll be transcendent enough to overcome the low spots when he's not creating.

Superstars who are elite in many facets of the game aren't the most likely bottleneck point that prevents great systems. Inadequate coaching and lack of depth are generally the real culprits.

He said the warriors don't count because their ball movement is too good lmao... And 3s are apparently illegal.

[And1AllDay]

Didnt CP3 say one of the reasons the Clippers always lost to Golden State was because of the clippers constant ball movement? He said the Warriors would just switch matchups which would make them easier to stop.

The toughest series the KD Warriors ever had was against Houston. A known ISO team that had a 3-2 lead before CP3 went down.

/ t h r e a d d d d d d

[TheCorporation]

So the player with all the playoff records in existence (most points, steals, game winners, VORP, PER, TD, etc.) who also has the second most FMVP ever...Does not have a good "style" of basketball? :lol

3ball is losing his mind

[insight]

Teams built around a single ball handler don't win championships.
Teams with ball dominant PGs in general don't win championships, even if the team has a more diverse offense, it is what it is.

Back in the day, Centers and Power Forwards rarely handled the ball which is why the point guard was the primary ball handler. On top of that the point guard was usually the coach on the court, getting players into position and running the offense like a Quarterback. That is their main responsibility, the most lethal scorer is usually the 2 guard, whos responsibility is to stress the defense. In the modern NBA more players are able to handle the ball proficiently but outside of Golden State and Lebron teams, most championship squads had very good point who started the offense.

[Norcaliblunt]

It’s hard to be unpredictable when in the half court your second best player (Marion) can’t create a shot for himself or anyone else to save his life.

[mehyaM24]

this guy gassing himself up lol. phoenix were predictable because they couldn't defend for shit. and like others have mentioned, they WIN IT ALL had horry not been a dirtbag.

[Replay32]

If there is a such thing as Bron Ball, it has been more successful than not. He's in rare historic company with 4 titles and 4 finals MVP's. Only a handful of players can say that. Anyway....

Lebron is a playmaker, scorer, and really good defender. He's a threat on the floor on many levels that the coaches can run plays thru. He can play on the perimeter as a point guard, run pick and roll, and has the court vision and accuracy to throw lobs or find the open man for a 3. He's an elite passer.

Lebron can also move to power forward and be an on ball screener and roll man with another play maker (problem is he's never really played with any elite passers/playmakers in his career). That's why he was happy to be playing with Rondo last year. He can also be a cutter off the ball for easy lay in's and dunks. Lebron doesn't move off screens for pin downs as much as Kobe and Jordan, but he can and did more of this early in his career when he played SG.

Lebron can also play make out of the high post. Where he has a reliable turn around jump shot out this area on the floor and he can find cutters with pin point passes. Lebron is also a threat in the low post with his fadaway, spin move out the post and his ability to find the open man.

Bottom line is lebron is a versatile player on offense and defense(remember his defense last year in the playoffs. It was elite) even in his 18th season. Haters going to hate, but the Lakers have had an injury plagued season this year and big human being fell on Lebron's ankle giving causing a high ankle sprain.

The Lakers are the defending world champs. They won it for Kobe Bryant last year and as a Lakers fan, I couldn't more happy about that. We had 6 years of being losers prior to that. The Lakers will be raising that 17th banner on May 12th. No matter how much you hate Lebron, he balled out last season in the playoffs especially, got his ring and help add to the Lakers legacy. Kobe would be proud. You haters can put that in your pipe and smoke.

[3ball]

If there is a such thing as Bron Ball, it has been more successful than not. He's in rare historic company with 4 titles and 4 finals MVP's. Only a handful of players can say that. Anyway....

Lebron is a playmaker, scorer, and really good defender. He's a threat on the floor on many levels that the coaches can run plays thru. He can play on the perimeter as a point guard, run pick and roll, and has the court vision and accuracy to throw lobs or find the open man for a 3. He's an elite passer.

Lebron can also move to power forward and be an on ball screener and roll man with another play maker (problem is he's never really played with any elite passers/playmakers in his career). That's why he was happy to be playing with Rondo last year. He can also be a cutter off the ball for easy lay in's and dunks. Lebron doesn't move off screens for pin downs as much as Kobe and Jordan, but he can and did more of this early in his career when he played SG.

Lebron can also play make out of the high post. Where he has a reliable turn around jump shot out this area on the floor and he can find cutters with pin point passes. Lebron is also a threat in the low post with his fadaway, spin move out the post and his ability to find the open man.

Bottom line is lebron is a versatile player on offense and defense(remember his defense last year in the playoffs. It was elite) even in his 18th season. Haters going to hate, but the Lakers have had an injury plagued season this year and big human being fell on Lebron's ankle giving causing a high ankle sprain.

The Lakers are the defending world champs. They won it for Kobe Bryant last year and as a Lakers fan, I couldn't more happy about that. We had 6 years of being losers prior to that. The Lakers will be raising that 17th banner on May 12th. No matter how much you hate Lebron, he balled out last season in the playoffs especially, got his ring and help add to the Lakers legacy. Kobe would be proud. You haters can put that in your pipe and smoke.


Rachel Nichols, you're wrong about everything.

Bron-ball has never been a #1 offense in 2 decades of playing, despite arguably the best offensive help ever.

And Lebron played with Kyrie and Wade, who were always bigger assist guys than Pippen and among the best playmakers in the league... Only Lebron lowered their assists to pippen's level.

Lebron's frontcourt ball-dominance lowers everyone's assists, so the TEAM has low assists and a brand that competes poorly in Finals - the common thread in Lebron's Finals losses is massive deficits in team assists.

Essentially, his skill restriction to ball-dominance imposes spot-up roles that stall young players, thereby needing ready-made stars to win (talent-based winning).. Talent-based winning loses to organic ball movement, so lebron has a lottery record against the Spurs, Mavs and Warriors.

Furthermore, Lebron isn't a jumpshooter - so his high-scoring games equal dribble-heavy rim attacks, which get beat by ball movement - that's why lebron can't win outside the 1st round when he scores 35+.. His ball-dominance becomes a liability when he needs to score a lot, so coaches like Stan Van Gundy said they didn't double lebron and wanted him to "dribble and get stats".

Ultimately, his lack of elite jumpshooting skill and ball-dominance doesn't wear teams down like the shooting and ball movement he faces at the championship level, so opponents are always fresher with more capacity to go off offensively.. The best defense is a good offense, and Bron-ball simply loses the attrition battle on the championship level.

Btw, defensive versatility doesn't equal good defense.. Lebron is a proven bad defender that teammates shove into the correct assignments - he hasn't been all-defense in 8 years, whereas MJ was top 5 DPOY from 88-98'.. There's no comparison defensively.. And offensively, Jordan was scoring champ with goat team offense, while Lebron isn't even top 15 in scoring and his suboptimal brand prevents his goat offensive help from having #1 offenses

Ultimately, lebron's entire resume is predicated on team-hopping - before the "decision", he was a 1-trick pony with 1 Finals run like Iverson, Dwight and Kidd.. the team-hopping allowed him to refresh his cast every 4 years with prime studs, so he never dealt with aging teammates like Jordan - Jordan dealt with aging Pippen, who averaged 17 on 41% for the entire 96-98' Playoffs.... or 36-year Rodman, who averaged 4/8 in the 97' Playoffs and wasn't the starter in 98' Playoffs.

[3ball]

Kwame Brown has moved into my top 10 all-time players

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lBejfVWsM68..