Giannis can’t carry his team like Tatum

[AirBonner]

He’s not a 3-level offensive player. Because of that he will get swept again

[elementally morale]

And this guy was MVP. Twice. When Derrick Rose won MVP... oh no. Then Westbrook and Harden... of God please stop. And then Giannis. Twice.

I'm not sure as to what the message is (other than: a cool media story) but it isn't good for the NBA or basketball in general.

[AirBonner]

And this guy was MVP. Twice. When Derrick Rose won MVP... oh no. Then Westbrook and Harden... of God please stop. And then Giannis. Twice.

I'm not sure as to what the message is (other than: a cool media story) but it isn't good for the NBA or basketball in general.

Agree it’s not a good look getting swept as the mvp lol

[Charlie Sheen]

And this guy was MVP. Twice. When Derrick Rose won MVP... oh no. Then Westbrook and Harden... of God please stop. And then Giannis. Twice.

I'm not sure as to what the message is (other than: a cool media story) but it isn't good for the NBA or basketball in general.

Want to expand on that?

[3ball]

Tatum is an elite jumpshooter, so his high-scoring allows ball movement and can therefore beat good teams

Otoh, high scoring from Giannis is extremely ball-dominant, so he can't win with high scoring or scoring period

[hold this L]

Congratulations to Tatum for getting his shit pushed in 5 games, what a victory! :applause:

[LoneyROY7]

GAnus doesn't have the skillset to be a number 1 option when it comes down to half-court basketball. This has been proven time and time again.

He desperately needs a star guard/forward he can play 2nd fiddle to.

[Airupthere]

Different players. After so many failed years for the bucks, they should have made adjustments by now. I doubted Tatum for some time but he showed good potential against the Nets. But there is certainly more room for improvement.

I'm just glad that this generation of SF/PF types are not following the Lebron colluding, easy way out path.

[3ball]

GAnus doesn't have the skillset to be a number 1 option when it comes down to half-court basketball. This has been proven time and time again.

He desperately needs a star guard/forward he can play 2nd fiddle to.


The skillset required to do the bolded above is elite jumpshooting skill

All the guys with good Finals records are elite shooters from either mid-range or threes (MJ, Bird, KD, Kobe, Kawhi, Dirk, Curry, Hakeem, etc)

[elementally morale]

Want to expand on that?

The MVP award is a media driven award. It's storytelling and not much else. MVP = most valuable to the media, he best selling story that year. Oftentimes it shows correlation with a winning team... but not all the time. Sometimes it's a triple double season. Or a greekfreak. It has very little to do with 'best player'. It is most valuable. Definition? None... or vague. 1st or 2nd in a Conference (that's 4 teams already)... and sometimes... if there is a better story.... So MVP is not the best player. Not the most valuable to the NBA. It's.. best player on a winning team... maybe not.

Then it s marketed as 'he was the best player last year' because he won the MVP. It changes in retrospect. It's never the 'bes player in the NBA' in a given year... but looking backwards it becomes 'best player last year or best player in 1999'. So if it is a Duncan, a Shaq, Jordan, LeBron, Kobe... okay... you believe it. But Nash? Twice? Giannis, twice? Westbrook? Rose? Not really.

[LoneyROY7]

Imagine getting clamped down by a 32-year old no knees Blake Griffin when it matters most.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Charlie Sheen]

The MVP award is a media driven award. It's storytelling and not much else. MVP = most valuable to the media, he best selling story that year. Oftentimes it shows correlation with a winning team... but not all the time. Sometimes it's a triple double season. Or a greekfreak. It has very little to do with 'best player'. It is most valuable. Definition? None... or vague. 1st or 2nd in a Conference (that's 4 teams already)... and sometimes... if there is a better story.... So MVP is not the best player. Not the most valuable to the NBA. It's.. best player on a winning team... maybe not.

Then it s marketed as 'he was the best player last year' because he won the MVP. It changes in retrospect. It's never the 'bes player in the NBA' in a given year... but looking backwards it becomes 'best player last year or best player in 1999'. So if it is a Duncan, a Shaq, Jordan, LeBron, Kobe... okay... you believe it. But Nash? Twice? Giannis, twice? Westbrook? Rose? Not really.

NBA fans are focusing too sharply on player legacies in general. The obsession with all time rankings is what's really bad for the NBA in my opinion. Giannis winning the mvp is only bad for basketball if it becomes like baseball and fans stop watching 90% of the games in favor of box scores.

I do concede it will become a larger issue as we move further away from these MVP seasons and fewer of us were watching the games to add a contextual flavor. We aren't there yet however.

[hold this L]

The MVP award is a media driven award. It's storytelling and not much else. MVP = most valuable to the media, he best selling story that year. Oftentimes it shows correlation with a winning team... but not all the time. Sometimes it's a triple double season. Or a greekfreak. It has very little to do with 'best player'. It is most valuable. Definition? None... or vague. 1st or 2nd in a Conference (that's 4 teams already)... and sometimes... if there is a better story.... So MVP is not the best player. Not the most valuable to the NBA. It's.. best player on a winning team... maybe not.

Then it s marketed as 'he was the best player last year' because he won the MVP. It changes in retrospect. It's never the 'bes player in the NBA' in a given year... but looking backwards it becomes 'best player last year or best player in 1999'. So if it is a Duncan, a Shaq, Jordan, LeBron, Kobe... okay... you believe it. But Nash? Twice? Giannis, twice? Westbrook? Rose? Not really.
This slander with Rose has to stop. Feels like people forgot how good he was that year during the regular season. They also had the best record in the NBA while he balled out. I think Harden had a legit case to win 1/2 over Giannis, but the other one Giannis 100% deserved. Feels a bit weird for Giannis to have 2 over Harden when Harden is the better player.

[elementally morale]

NBA fans are focusing too sharply on player legacies in general. The obsession with all time rankings is what's really bad for the NBA in my opinion. Giannis winning the mvp is only bad for basketball if it becomes like baseball and fans stop watching 90% of the games in favor of box scores.

I do concede it will become a larger issue as we move further away from these MVP seasons and fewer of us were watching the games to add a contextual flavor. We aren't there yet however.


I agree. But this whole 'winning it all is the only thing that matters' mentality hurts. You just can't win all the time. Maybe you can't win at all because there are other very good players on better teams. Etc. That and 'advanced' stats. I can make up any kind of stat if I want to prove some o my favorite players is 'objectivelythe best'. You skew the metric a little... okay, here is this 'new stat'... etc. It usually lacks context. Context disappears later but stats and accolades remain... well... well.

[AirBonner]

I agree. But this whole 'winning it all is the only thing that matters' mentality hurts. You just can't win all the time. Maybe you can't win at all because there are other very good players on better teams. Etc. That and 'advanced' stats. I can make up any kind of stat if I want to prove some o my favorite players is 'objectivelythe best'. You skew the metric a little... okay, here is this 'new stat'... etc. It usually lacks context. Context disappears later but stats and accolades remain... well... well.

The thing is Giannis routinely shits the bed in the playoffs. No fight. All great players even when playing on bad teams still should put up numbers or steal a game

[elementally morale]

This slander with Rose has to stop. Feels like people forgot how good he was that year during the regular season. They also had the best record in the NBA while he balled out. I think Harden had a legit case to win 1/2 over Giannis, but the other one Giannis 100% deserved. Feels a bit weird for Giannis to have 2 over Harden when Harden is the better player.

I actually like Derrick Rose. The older he gets the more I like him. But he was a great story that year, not the best player. No worries as it is 'MVP'. I think he really was the 'MVP'... just the award makes little sense to me. Especially because it's media driven.

[tpols]

Tatum has an elite jumper with similar size and athleticism. Hes easily better. I was surprised by how much more jacked he was than Durant. He's legit big guy but moves and shoots like a small one.

[Airupthere]

Tatum has an elite jumper with similar size and athleticism. Hes easily better. I was surprised by how much more jacked he was than Durant. He's legit big guy but moves and shoots like a small one.

That's a good way to put it.

[ImKobe]

The thing is Giannis routinely shits the bed in the playoffs. No fight. All great players even when playing on bad teams still should put up numbers or steal a game

Ok, and how good was Tatum in the first 2 games against the Nets? :kobe:

[tpols]

And this guy was MVP. Twice. When Derrick Rose won MVP... oh no. Then Westbrook and Harden... of God please stop. And then Giannis. Twice.

I'm not sure as to what the message is (other than: a cool media story) but it isn't good for the NBA or basketball in general.

Super athletes that can't shoot ~ Westbrook, Giannis, Rose etc. see massive fall offs in the playoffs because there's more halfcourt play and teams are actually hardcore scheming and gameplanning to cut the head off the snake. When you have an easily exploitable weakness (can't shoot a basketball) it becomes quite easy to do.

[dazzer87]

Hopefully Tatum get the hell out of Boston....Wasted talent....Imagine wasting your career in that shitty ass town....

[tpols]

Imagine getting clamped down by a 32-year old no knees Blake Griffin when it matters most.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Blake is still as strong as ever. You can't just bully him. You beat him by shooting over his stubby ass.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Giannis backdoor swept Tatum and Kyrie babyboi

[Real Men Wear Green]

Ok, and how good was Tatum in the first 2 games against the Nets? :kobe:

Who had great games all the time? And you do recall what happened to Tatum in game 2 don't you?

[Real Men Wear Green]

Tatum has an elite jumper with similar size and athleticism. Hes easily better. I was surprised by how much more jacked he was than Durant. He's legit big guy but moves and shoots like a small one.

We hope to see Tatum become an MVP candidate one day but he's not on that level yet. Antetokunmpo can take any team to the playoffs. Tatum can't carry a team like that just yet. Also your assertion that Tatum is as athletic as Antetokuonmpo is kind of nuts. He's far more skilled and does have legit big man size but Antetokuonmpo is Shawn Kemp with a handle.

[Axe]

Super athletes that can't shoot ~ Westbrook, Giannis, Rose etc. see massive fall offs in the playoffs because there's more halfcourt play and teams are actually hardcore scheming and gameplanning to cut the head off the snake. When you have an easily exploitable weakness (can't shoot a basketball) it becomes quite easy to do.
I believe those guys can make up for their shortcomings by playing defense. Otoh, stephen curry becomes a defensive liability when he's not nailing his own shots but in the playoffs he's lucky to have other guys that would bail him out if that becomes the case. Throughout his career, he also only has two 40+ point games in the playoffs and his highest (47 points) wasn't even enough to garner a win in game 3 of the 2019 finals against the underdog raptors.

[ZionDunks]

I like Giannis. He was fine in this game.

Tatum has a chance to be something close to Kobe.

[ZionDunks]

We hope to see Tatum become an MVP candidate one day but he's not on that level yet. Antetokunmpo can take any team to the playoffs. Tatum can't carry a team like that just yet. Also your assertion that Tatum is as athletic as Antetokuonmpo is kind of nuts. He's far more skilled and does have legit big man size but Antetokuonmpo is Shawn Kemp with a handle.

Sir , Durant said himself he’s played against them all, you name it. LeBigot, Duncan, etc, and Tatum was as tough as any of them.

[miggyme1]

Giannis should be averaging 40 points a game without even attempting a 3 pointer. What was the purpose of him putting the muscle on if he isnt gonna use it? He should be posting up anybody that guards him. Just play bully ball....he is basically a young shaq when he played for the magic. Just run down the court,get under the basket,call for the ball and go to work. Im tired of seeing this dude bring the ball up the court,do a spin move and either throw up some awkward shit or pass it back out. Its like he forgets he is 7 feet tall and the strongest person on the court most nights.

[000]

he is basically a young shaq
shaq was more skilled down low, and didnt move like a newborn deer

[Real Men Wear Green]

Sir , Durant said himself he’s played against them all, you name it. LeBigot, Duncan, etc, and Tatum was as tough as any of them.

I'm sure that Tatum is a tough match up for everyone. Antetokuonmpo averaged 28 points 11 boards and 6 assists in just 33 minutes. He is an overwhelming regular season force. It is like comparing Westbrook and Kyrie Irving. Peak Westbrook can carry your team to the playoffs no matter what. Irving can't do that. But if the game is on the line and you need a basket Irving is better. To me between Antetokuonmpo and Tatum it's a similar thing.

[DoctorP]

Tatum/Giannis would be a formidable duo.

[AirBonner]

I'm sure that Tatum is a tough match up for everyone. Antetokuonmpo averaged 28 points 11 boards and 6 assists in just 33 minutes. He is an overwhelming regular season force. It is like comparing Westbrook and Kyrie Irving. Peak Westbrook can carry your team to the playoffs no matter what. Irving can't do that. But if the game is on the line and you need a basket Irving is better. To me between Antetokuonmpo and Tatum it's a similar thing.

Giannis can’t be relied on to get a bucket tho. Tatum averaged 30ppg against the nets. The gap is not there

[Real Men Wear Green]

Giannis can’t be relied on to get a bucket tho. Tatum averaged 30ppg against the nets. The gap is not there
1: Antetokuonmpo is extremely reliable for anything you need that doesn't involve a jumpshot. For the regular season and the greater part of most playoff games that's enough. Tatum is better if you want a game-winning basket but there is more to basketball than just that.

2: Every opponent isn't the Nets. Tatum will have plenty of big games but his 50 point game is an outlier that makes his average vs. Brooklyn misleading if you are trying to talk about what will be his normal performance.

[Thenameless]

Giannis can't carry his team like Tatum....to a first round exit. And now the Celtics are going to have problems with Kemba Walker's value.

[AirBonner]

Giannus

[Naero]

True. Giannis didn’t do nearly enough in the Finals, sadly.

https://a57.foxsports.com/statics.foxsports.com/www.foxsports.com/content/uploads/2021/07/640/427/419.11_Editorial_1500x1000_Inline_NBA_Playoff_Stat s_BucksSuns.jpg?ve=1&tl=1

[dreamshake]

Tatum getting exposed in international basketball play. Jayson Potatotum :roll:

[tontoz]

OP with another epic thread backfire.

:roll:

[Pointguard]

The thing is Giannis routinely shits the bed in the playoffs. No fight. All great players even when playing on bad teams still should put up numbers or steal a game

Unlike other super stars Giannis never got doubled team before. Its definitely not something you just know how to do. Nobody handles it well the first time they see it. Triple teams are one step beyond that. So he struggled with it at a later age than other players, but he isn't in his prime yet. He's done well considering. Who has more fight than him? Who plays ever play, offense and defense, like him?

[Pointguard]

LOL, all of this superskilled players as the great deservers of MVP's is a joke right. Please name me the super skilled player that wins more than the ultra competitive, well gifted players? It doesn't happen much. Its the exception, not the rule. The last three championships were not shooting teams. True Golden State won before that but they had arguably 3 of the best shooters in the game probably ever in their prime on the same team. Lebron could beat the two best shooters himself being down 3 to 1. A team of Giannis, Duncan and Lebron would kill that great shooting Golden State team. Skill wouldn't levels wouldn't mean much at all. Skill even abandon's Curry when the pressure is on and he's pretty clutch. Durant has been on some very talented teams but he hasn't carried one. Same with Curry.

[MrFonzworth]

Tatum would've had a ring by now if OP wasn't alive to jinx him.

[Axe]

True. Giannis didn’t do nearly enough in the Finals, sadly.

https://a57.foxsports.com/statics.foxsports.com/www.foxsports.com/content/uploads/2021/07/640/427/419.11_Editorial_1500x1000_Inline_NBA_Playoff_Stat s_BucksSuns.jpg?ve=1&tl=1
Wally fuming about this. Also thought brad stevens would lead Cs to a chip.

[1987_Lakers]

Tatum is an elite jumpshooter, so his high-scoring allows ball mlolovement and can therefore beat good teams

Otoh, high scoring from Giannis is extremely ball-dominant, so he can't win with high scoring or scoring period

lol

[Wally450]

Tatum getting exposed in international basketball play. Jayson Potatotum :roll:

To be fair, Giannis got exposed in international play too. If anything, that's a good sign for Tatum.

[8Ball]

Tatum is an elite jumpshooter, so his high-scoring allows ball movement and can therefore beat good teams

Otoh, high scoring from Giannis is extremely ball-dominant, so he can't win with high scoring or scoring period

Lol what a flip flopping coward changing his narrative within 30 days.


Giannis destroyed every 3ball narrative and now 3ball making up new ones.

[hold this L]

2ball with another low IQ post.

[j3lademaster]

Lol what a flip flopping coward changing his narrative within 30 days.


Giannis destroyed every 3ball narrative and now 3ball making up new ones.That was a big 30 days for his career though. You can't deny Gianni evolved in the Nets and Suns series'. Sometimes playing someone like KD makes you better. There's nothing wrong with changing one's mind based on new evidence.

[8Ball]

That was a big 30 days for his career though. You can't deny Gianni evolved in the Nets and Suns series'. Sometimes playing someone like KD makes you better. There's nothing wrong with changing one's mind based on new evidence.

If he flip flops that, than he invalidates half of his Jordan vs LeBron narratives.

Tatum = elite jumper shooter -> Jordan.

Giannis = Ball dominant ball driver -> LeBron.


Narrative destroyed.