Mahmoud Abdul Rauf aka the Original Stephen Curry

[Lebron23]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXGRNGWNk0I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whnAZdGlhFU

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Steph with hand checking and elite rim protectors in the paint = Mahmoud for sure

Thanks OP

https://media1.tenor.com/images/47150584347f873015f5e81ea7b8bf34/tenor.gif

[Lebron23]

He destroyed Jordan and Stockton. He''ll be a superstar in today's NBA

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

He destroyed Jordan and Stockton. He''ll be a superstar in today's NBA

Stockton career VS Mahmoud

16/10/3/2 on 52/48/82

Mahmoud averages 16 PPG on 14 shots a game against Stockton.

Jordan career VS Mahmoud

35/6/5/2 on 55/50/88

Mahmoud averages 14 PPG on 14 shots a game against Jordan.

Not so easy with handchecking babyboi. He couldnt even crack 30 MPG for his career or prime in the NBA since shooting deep 3s and being a decent passer was all he could do. That's more than enough for a fringe all star today :lol:lol

[snipes12]

Oh shut up , steph curry is the new trae young

[Phoenix]

Easily a 25+ppg guy today. And nowadays Stockton wouldn't have guarded him nearly as much, was basically on an island defensively.

[000]

Leking would lose to this guy, who was never an allstar in the 90s.

[Phoenix]

Leking would lose to this guy, who was never an allstar in the 90s.

Nobody is talking about Lebron, loser. Go outside.

[000]

You horseradish!!!
:wtf:

[Phoenix]

:wtf:

Nobody is talking about Lebron, loser. Go outside.

[Lebron23]

Nobody is talking about Lebron, loser. Go outside.

Just report all of his posts.

[000]

Just report all of his posts.
Good idea Playername-jerseynumber

[Phoenix]

Just report all of his posts.

Eh, useless function. Jizzing all over the 'new' troll alts is far more entertaining.

[000]

Eh, useless function. Jizzing all over the 'new' troll alts is far more entertaining.

:roll:

[Phoenix]

Good idea Playername-jerseynumber

Unabashed fakkitry on your end. Go outside and off your moms tits and think of a better reply.

[tontoz]

Similar in playing style. Not similar in terms of actually making shots.

For his career Rauf shot 46% on 2s and 35.4% on 3s. :sleeping

Mark Price played in that same era and shot 50% on 2s, 40% on 3s.

[Phoenix]

Similar in playing style. Not similar in terms of actually making shots.

For his career Rauf shot 46% on 2s and 35.4% on 3s. :sleeping

Mark Price played in that same era and shot 50% on 2s, 40% on 3s.

True but Mark was kind of a pick your spots shooter often. He wasn't going to iso you and let it RIP. Just in the video above when he was shitting on Stockton dude just gave zero ****s. He'd probably be 40% from 3 today. Just how the defense is played and spacing nowadays.

[tontoz]

True but Mark was kind of a pick your spots shooter often. He wasn't going to iso you and let it RIP. Just in the video above when he was shitting on Stockton dude just gave zero ****s. He'd probably be 40% from 3 today. Just how the defense is played and spacing nowadays.

Price had one of the quickest releases ever. He took 5 3s a game back in 1990, he averaged 3.4 three point attempts for his career compared to 2.4 for Rauf.

Rauf never made an all star team. His career TS was 8% worse than Price. He wasn't a volume scorer or an efficient scorer. It is funny how he gets overrated now.

For his career he averaged 14.6 ppg with a TS of 50.6%. he was out of the league at 31. He just wasn't that good.

[Phoenix]

Price had one of the quickest releases ever. He took 5 3s a game back in 1990, he averaged 3.4 three point attempts for his career compared to 2.4 for Rauf.

Rauf never made an all star team. His career TS was 8% worse than Price. He wasn't a volume scorer or an efficient scorer. It is funny how he gets overrated now.

For his career he averaged 14.6 ppg with a TS of 50.6%. he was out of the league at 31. He just wasn't that good.

I know he did, but Rauf's release weren't anything to sneeze at either. I'm just saying it's kind of obvious without tripping over the numbers that his style of game translates well today. I'm not saying he scales up to Steph Curry level or something silly like that. Hell I'm not even arguing that he was as good as Price back then. I just don't think he's a 35% 3point shooter in todays era. In 96 he shot 39% 3s on 5 attempts and a few seasons dropping 19 a game. Obviously not a huge sample size but if he was able to have a 12-13 year career in this era I'm relatively certain he's dropping 20+ on better efficiency numbers and may peak at 25.His game was custom built for 2020, not 1995.

Him being out of the league at 31 wasn't about his basketball ability, or am I misremembering that it was about his political/religious stances?

[StrongLurk]

Lol Mahmoud Abdul Rauf is getting so fukin overrated.

A few highlight tapes is not representative of someone's career people.

Dude shot 31.9% on only 1.7 attempts per game from the normal three point line (before it was shortened)...but yeah, he was totally Curry before Curry :facepalm

[StrongLurk]

I know he did, but Rauf's release weren't anything to sneeze at either. I'm just saying it's kind of obvious without tripping over the numbers that his style of game translates well today. I'm not saying he scales up to Steph Curry level or something silly like that. Hell I'm not even arguing that he was as good as Price back then. I just don't think he's a 35% 3point shooter in todays era. In 96 he shot 39% 3s on 5 attempts and a few seasons dropping 19 a game. Obviously not a huge sample size but if he was able to have a 12-13 year career in this era I'm relatively certain he's dropping 20+ on better efficiency numbers and may peak at 25.His game was custom built for 2020, not 1995.

Him being out of the league at 31 wasn't about his basketball ability, or am I misremembering that it was about his political/religious stances?

Three point line was shortened in 96. In fact, Rauf's only good three point shooting seasons were with the shortened three point shot...

[Phoenix]

Three point line was shortened in 96. In fact, Rauf's only good three point shooting seasons were with the shortened three point shot...

Fair enough. But one could say this era is better suited to his game than the one he came up in. So where does he scale in 2020? Again, I'm not saying the dude is on some GOAT shit in 2020, but all I'm seeing is overrated and this on its own doesn't say a whole lot.

So where do you think he scales in 2020?

[StrongLurk]

Fair enough. But one could say this era is better suited to this era than the one he came up in. So where does he scale in 2020? Again, I'm not saying the dude is on some GOAT shit in 2020, but all I'm seeing is overrated and this on its own doesn't say a whole lot.

So where do you think he scales in 2020?

Good 6th man on playoff team, not an all star.

I do think it's easier to score in the NBA of the last couple years than the 90's obviously...but that doesn't mean every single pretty good player from the 90's is all of a sudden a 25ppg scorer now. That's a ridiculous leap.

My comments are mostly directed to the OP who said Rauf is the original Curry...I don't care if you are comparing play styles, it's just a ridiculous comparison.

[Phoenix]

Good 6th man on playoff team, not an all star.

I do think it's easier to score in the NBA of the last couple years than the 90's obviously...but that doesn't mean every single pretty good player from the 90's is all of a sudden a 25ppg scorer now. That's a ridiculous leap.

Well no, that wouldn't be my argument. I'm looking at his skills in a vacuum, coupled with his tendencies, and the current era, and doing some extrapolating. Which is pretty much all you can do moving players between eras.

[Kblaze8855]

Lol Mahmoud Abdul Rauf is getting so fukin overrated.

A few highlight tapes is not representative of someone's career people.

Dude shot 31.9% on only 1.7 attempts per game from the normal three point line (before it was shortened)...but yeah, he was totally Curry before Curry :facepalm

People(including players....and including Currys coach) compare them due to style not numbers. Kinda like David Thompson and Jordan or that Baylor, Hawkins, Doc, Jordan lineage. It’s not a comparison of numbers. It’s about an evolution of a style.

There obviously was no 80s/90s Curry but people who remember them list a number of people as being in that Pistol Pete/Price/Abdul/Rauf line of players that leads you to the modern take despite many differences among them.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Other than having similar size and great shoot ability, don't see the Curry comparison.

Like others have pointed out, Mahmoud was an 'OK' 3PT shooter. He wasn't nearly as aggressive as Curry.

If I think of a closer comparison, I'll post one. But Chef is a unicorn.

[Kblaze8855]

Other than having similar size and great shoot ability, don't see the Curry comparison.

Like others have pointed out, Mahmoud was an 'OK' 3PT shooter. He wasn't nearly as aggressive as Curry.

If I think of a closer comparison, I'll post one. But Chef is a unicorn.

Steph takes 13 threes a game. In 1992 the team that took the most took 12.

Of course he wasn’t as aggressive from 3. Basketball just wasn’t played that way. He’s just in the line of players that ends(for now) with Steph.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Steph takes 13 threes a game. In 1992 the team that took the most took 12.

Of course he wasn’t as aggressive from 3. Basketball just wasn’t played that way. He’s just in the line of players that ends(for now) with Steph.

He wasn't as aggressive, period.

Curry's got a higher usage and is a far better playmaker. He simply does more with the ball than Mahmoud.

[tontoz]

Michael Adams took 8.5 3s per game back in '91 so let's compare him to Curry.

[Kblaze8855]

Michael Adams didn’t play as similar. He took 3s when Westhead tried to win every game 170-168 as I’m sure you remember.

Like I said guys have never needed to be the same to be considered in the same
line of progression.

Elgin Baylor didn’t play anything like Lebron....but he’s still kinda the first one of that lineage.

You are asked for the 90s version of Steph the answer is that there isn’t one. The closest however? Rauf or Mark price.

[tontoz]

Michael Adams didn’t play as similar. He took 3s when Westhead tried to win every game 170-168 as I’m sure you remember.

Like I said guys have never needed to be the same to be considered in the same
line of progression.

Elgin Baylor didn’t play anything like Lebron....but he’s still kinda the first one of that lineage.

You are asked for the 90s version of Steph the answer is that there isn’t one. The closest however? Rauf or Mark price.

Mark price is a legit comp. He took a lot of 3s for that era and made them at a high rate.

Reggie Miller took nearly 5 3s per game for his career shooting 39.5%. His off ball movement was even better than Steph.

Let's not forget Steph's father Dell. Per 36 minutes he took 4.7 3s shooting 40%.

Rauf didn't take as many 3s and didn't shoot them that well even for that era. Like Stronglurk pointed out his only respectable shooting years were with the shortened line. He wasn't that good in general.

[Kblaze8855]

Steph currys style isn’t taking and making a lot of threes. A lot of guys take a lot of threes and even off ball while playing nothing similar to Steph. Reggie Miller among them(not that he took many threes by today’s standards).

There are virtually no comparisons to any modern scorers if you make a basketball comparison all about shooting numbers.

If you snatch Chris Mullin from his highest scoring season when he did 27 a game and only made 23 threes the whole year and drop him into 2021....he’d obviously take waaaaaaaaaaaaay more threes. The numbers wouldn’t be similar.

Doesn’t mean a 2021 Mullin wouldn’t be a good comparison with his 89 version. Basketball changed. His numbers would change. The underlying player would be the same.

Rauf didn’t need to take 14 threes in 1992 for what he did to later come to mind when people watch Steph. Obviously nobody but you guys are talking about the numbers. The people making this comparison popular(Kerr....Phil Jackson...I believe Dale Ellis) see the numbers difference. Obviously that isn’t what they are talking about.

When Kobe was young he reminded people of Jordan. He was scoring like 15 a game but you could still see why. A similar basic approach and some similar moves. That’s all anyone means.

Nobody needs a statistical break down of the difference between 20 year old Kobe and prime Jordan. It’s not that serious.

[tontoz]

Style doesn't show up on the scoreboard.

The defining characteristic of Steph's game is taking a lot of 3s while making them at a high rate. Reggie was among the league leaders for years in 3 pt attempts whole shooting 40% from 3. He was the all time leader in 3s made for years until Ray finally broke his record.

Reggie didn't create 3s off the dribble like Steph but his running around screens without the ball was very similar to Steph. He was just better at it.

In his career Rauf made 474 3s in the regular season. Steph made 400 in one season. :oldlol:

If someone isn't even a good 3 pt shooter in their own era they arent a good comp to the best 3 pt shooter ever.

[Stephonit]

Lillard is much better than Rauf and closer to Curry. Still 10-0 for Curry. It is a yawning gap between Curry and previous guys somewhat similar in appearance. People are nowhere near appreciating how large the difference is.

[Kblaze8855]

Style doesn't show up on the scoreboard.

The defining characteristic of Steph's game is taking a lot of 3s while making them at a high rate. Reggie was among the league leaders for years in 3 pt attempts whole shooting 40% from 3. He was the all time leader in 3s made for years until Ray finally broke his record.

Reggie didn't create 3s off the dribble like Steph but his running around screens without the ball was very similar to Steph. He was just better at it.

In his career Rauf made 474 3s in the regular season. Steph made 400 in one season. :oldlol:

If someone isn't even a good 3 pt shooter in their own era they arent a good comp to the best 3 pt shooter ever.


Style doesn’t show up on a scoreboard? What does that matter? Is someone arguing who was better at basketball or talking about reminiscent players? If I ask you who reminds you of Shawn Kemp are you finding lists of people who averaged 15/8 on 48% shooting? No. Because I’m not asking for numbers. I’m asking about style. You always seem totally unwilling to acknowledge that shooting(numbers especially) and basketball aren’t the same thing. And this Reggie/Steph thing is an example.

They are unbelievably different players with nothing in common but being great shooters and off ball players. Steph is an all time elite ball handler. You can’t think of 20 guards in the last 30 years with worse handles than Reggie. Steph is a great passer. Reggie could barely pass on the move. He was an average passer at very best for a guard. He could throw something fancy when standing still or maybe a quick touch pass but he was nothing to talk about. Steph is a shot creator off the dribble. Reggie wouldn’t be able to bring the damn ball up vs a Mookie Blaylock or Patrick Beverly type on a regular basis. Reggie was a jab step pull-up guy...a pump fake 2 dribble guy. He had almost none of what Steph has in his bag. He would post you up before he’d dribble in traffic.

They even play different kinds of defense. Reggie way more physical.

They aren’t even somewhat similar basketball players but you focus only on shooting numbers.


Steph Currys coach....many players...and Steph Curry himself see it:





I actually went and watched YouTube highlights of (Abdul-Rauf) at LSU. I really never watched his game before. It helped my basketball knowledge a little bit. There are some similarities for sure. He had that thrust in transition, pulling up from 3, getting in the paint. .


Because Steph like everyone else evaluating this like a normal person is talking about style not numbers.

If Youre gonna argue with those who know him best....and the man himself....feel free. But not seeing this is looking like a you issue not a real issue.

[tontoz]

Steph's shooting numbers are what separate him from every 3 point shooter in league history, not his style. Steph is good at other things, good at finishing inside especially, but his 3 point shooting is legendary.

I never considered him an especially.good passer. I would consider that a weakness actually. He makes way too many turnovers on careless passes, especially under pressure.

Steph led the league in made 3s 6 times. Reggie did it twice and was the all time leader in made 3s when he retired.

Rauf? His career best was 121 made 3s. Reggie made 47 more that year. :roll:

You actually tried to compare Trae Young to Steph, completely disregarding the difference in their styles not to mention percentages, so spare me the tldr sermonizing.

Trae became a more effective player this year in part by cutting down his 3 pt attempts.

[Kblaze8855]

Nobody is talking about “separation” and how good they are. Not Kerr when he said Rauf, Price, and Nash were the only ones similar, nor Steph himself when he said they were similar, and
nobody else. You can try to reframe it all you like but you’re not arguing what everyone....including the subjects of the discussion....have said.

And go on and list me the guards in all history closer in style to Steph than Trae. When you top out at like 4 people out of thousands come back and change the subject to shooting percentages again.

Nobody was allowed to play with the freedom they have before this era. Nobody in the past plays at all like Steph, Dame, or Trae....they can only remind with aspects of their style.

All those 30 footer off the dribble wicked handle break you down types are closer to each other than anyone was in the past including Rauf and Pistol Pete who were both 18 foot pull-up guys.

[Kblaze8855]

And Steph isn’t a weak playmaker or passer. He’s just smart enough to realize that the best shooter ever passing up shots to get worse guys looks isn’t ideal. He’s exactly what a point should be. He gets good shots for him which is often the best thing for the team. He’s just so absurdly good at traditionally bad shots it looks like bad offense when it doesn’t work.

His total package of guard skills is offensively flawless. There are people better than him at some things but nothing is on a level low enough to call a failing or a hole in his skill set.

[tontoz]

And Steph isn’t a weak playmaker or passer. He’s just smart enough to realize that the best shooter ever passing up shots to get worse guys looks isn’t ideal. He’s exactly what a point should be. He gets good shots for him which is often the best thing for the team. He’s just so absurdly good at traditionally bad shots it looks like bad offense when it doesn’t work.

His total package of guard skills is offensively flawless. There are people better than him at some things but nothing is on a level low enough to call a failing or a hole in his skill set.


Uhh....no. He simply doesn't have the court awareness that great playmakers have. He is not a guy who's aware of everyone on the court like Magic or CP3, or even Trae.

I'm a big fan of his but every time I watch him I cringe at some of his passes. He holds onto the ball too long and doesn't seem aware of what is going on around him.

I agree that he takes some absurdly difficult shots and is able to make them but that leads him into trouble at times.

He can't handle double teams worth a damn, especially in relation to great playmakers. He will lob the ball cross court up for grabs and I'm like dude wtf.

If we could somehow combine his skills with Trae's it would be like BOOM.

[Stephonit]

Uhh....no. He simply doesn't have the court awareness that great playmakers have. He is not a guy who's aware of everyone on the court like Magic or CP3.

I'm a big fan of his but every time I watch him I cringe at some of his passes. He holds onto the ball too long and doesn't seem aware of what is going on around him.

I agree that he takes some absurdly difficult shots and is able to make them but that leads him into trouble at times.

He can't handle double teams worth a damn, especially in relation to great playmakers. He will lob the ball cross court up for grabs and I'm like dude wtf.

If we could somehow combine his skills with Trae's it would be like BOOM.

Curry makes higher risk aggressive passes and makes lazy ones too. But the value of the aggression shouldn't be discounted: it forces the issue and keeps pressure on the opponent. If you ever watched top end women's tennis back in the day you'd understand the value of it. The tier of players below Serena Williams and Steffi Graf were extremely consistent at putting the ball back in play in comparison to Williams and Graf. Williams and Graf almost always made more unforced errors. The flip side is they made more winners too. The result is they usually won.

[tontoz]

Curry makes higher risk aggressive passes and makes lazy ones too. But the value of the aggression shouldn't be discounted: it forces the issue and keeps pressure on the opponent. If you ever watched top end women's tennis back in the day you'd understand the value of it. The tier of players below Serena Williams and Steffi Graf were extremely consistent at putting the ball back in play in comparison to Williams and Graf. Williams and Graf almost always made more unforced errors. The flip side is they made more winners too. The result is they usually won.


That comparison doesn't work because in tennis if you go for a shot and it is outside the line play stops. In basketball a turnover turns into a fast break for the other team very quickly.

I think playing with Durant for several years may have made him a bit rusty at handling double teams. He didnt have to worry about them with Durant and Klay on the floor.

[tpols]

There's never been a player to play with this variety of routes off ball for 3s, and have a 45 foot pull up game. Nobody's ever done that.