Who are the top 25 players from the last 25 years....

[RogueBorg]

...to be added to the top 50 players from the first 50 years in honor of the league's 75th Anniversary. I would think this might be difficult to do. There are some no brainers sure, but who gets left off?

[RogueBorg]

I'm sure I forgot someone;

1. LeBron James
2. Kobe Bryant
3. Tim Duncan
4. Dwayne Wade
5. Allen Iverson
6. Kevin Garnett
7. Chris Paul
8. Dirk Nowitski
9. Kevin Durant
10. Steph Curry
11. Dwight Howard
12. Klay Thompson
13. Kawhi Leonard
14. James Harden
15. Russell Westbrook
16. Damian Lillard
17. Chris Bosh
18. Ray Allen
19. Jason Kidd
20. Giannis Antetokounmpo
21. Chris Webber
22. Ben Wallace
23. Steve Nash
24. Anthony Davis
25. Reggie Miller

[And1AllDay]

I'm sure I forgot someone;

1. LeBron James
2. Kobe Bryant
3. Tim Duncan
4. Dwayne Wade
5. Allen Iverson
6. Kevin Garnett
7. Chris Paul
8. Dirk Nowitski
9. Kevin Durant
10. Steph Curry
11. Dwight Howard
12. Klay Thompson
13. Kawhi Leonard
14. James Harden
15. Russell Westbrook
16. Damian Lillard
17. Chris Bosh
18. Ray Allen
19. Jason Kidd
20. Giannis Antetokounmpo
21. Chris Webber
22. Ben Wallace
23. Steve Nash
24. Anthony Davis
25. Reggie Miller

i hope this is not in order

[jalbert009]

So the last 25 years is 96 till present. Jordan played 5 seasons in that time period. 1 3peat, 5 all star appeances, 2 MVPs, 3 scoring titles and 3 All NBA first team selections. That's a pretty good accomplishment in 5 seasons.

[Manny98]

I'm sure I forgot someone;

1. LeBron James
2. Kobe Bryant
3. Tim Duncan
4. Dwayne Wade
5. Allen Iverson
6. Kevin Garnett
7. Chris Paul
8. Dirk Nowitski
9. Kevin Durant
10. Steph Curry
11. Dwight Howard
12. Klay Thompson
13. Kawhi Leonard
14. James Harden
15. Russell Westbrook
16. Damian Lillard
17. Chris Bosh
18. Ray Allen
19. Jason Kidd
20. Giannis Antetokounmpo
21. Chris Webber
22. Ben Wallace
23. Steve Nash
24. Anthony Davis
25. Reggie Miller
:facepalm

[ninjaseal]

mcgrady

1st post lurking since 99 , barkley , wheres roundmoundofrebounds list =)

[Cleverness]

So the last 25 years is 96 till present. Jordan played 5 seasons in that time period. 1 3peat, 5 all star appeances, 2 MVPs, 3 scoring titles and 3 All NBA first team selections. That's a pretty good accomplishment in 5 seasons.

Yeah, I was wondering about this... who exactly meets the qualifications for a player from the last 25 years...

[HBK_Kliq_2]

for me the GOAT prime\peaks would go something like this.
1st tier: Kawhi, Jordan, ​Hakeem, Lebron
2nd tier: Bird, Shaq, Kobe, Russell, Kareem
3rd tier: Magic Johnson, Duncan, Wilt, West

and then it gets hard after top 13 but guys like DIrk, Chris Paul, Durant, Garnett start popping up.

[Sportal]

for me the GOAT prime\peaks would go something like this.
1st tier: Kawhi, Jordan, ​Hakeem, Lebron
2nd tier: Bird, Shaq, Kobe, Russell, Kareem
3rd tier: Magic Johnson, Duncan, Wilt, West

and then it gets hard after top 13 but guys like DIrk, Chris Paul, Durant, Garnett start popping up.

???????????????????????????

Kawhi over Shaq?

Let us know what drugs you're on rn.

[72-10]

The thread you posit doesn't make sense because you're really asking for one answer to two questions because you're implying that the next 25 players are from the last 25 years, and I don't think that's remotely close to the truth. Some examples are Klay, Kawhi, Lillard, Bosh, Giannis and Davis. Therefore, it wouldn't be a 75th Anniversary Team.

[RogueBorg]

i hope this is not in order

No sir

[RogueBorg]

Yeah, I was wondering about this... who exactly meets the qualifications for a player from the last 25 years...

So it amounts to the top 75 players in league history, the 1st 50 were done in 1997 for the league's 50th anniversary, Jordan's already on it.

[L.Kizzle]

I'm sure I forgot someone;

1. LeBron James
2. Kobe Bryant
3. Tim Duncan
4. Dwayne Wade
5. Allen Iverson
6. Kevin Garnett
7. Chris Paul
8. Dirk Nowitski
9. Kevin Durant
10. Steph Curry
11. Dwight Howard
12. Klay Thompson
13. Kawhi Leonard
14. James Harden
15. Russell Westbrook
16. Damian Lillard
17. Chris Bosh
18. Ray Allen
19. Jason Kidd
20. Giannis Antetokounmpo
21. Chris Webber
22. Ben Wallace
23. Steve Nash
24. Anthony Davis
25. Reggie Miller
How did Reggie Miller sneak on this list?

[RogueBorg]

The thread you posit doesn't make sense because you're really asking for one answer to two questions because you're implying that the next 25 players are from the last 25 years, and I don't think that's remotely close to the truth. Some examples are Klay, Kawhi, Lillard, Bosh, Giannis and Davis.

The top 50 players were elected in 1997, like Shaq to commemorate the league's 50th anniversary. The league is celebrating it's 75th anniversary so I'm sure they're going to add another 25 players to bring it to the top 75 players in the leagues 75 year history. So it would be 1998 to present.

[RogueBorg]

How did Reggie Miller sneak on this list?

Well, he is a Hall of Famer but I did forget Vince Carter and Grant Hill.

[72-10]

Yeah, I was wondering about this... who exactly meets the qualifications for a player from the last 25 years...

Reggie Miller

[RogueBorg]

???????????????????????????

Kawhi over Shaq?

Let us know what drugs you're on rn.

Shaq is already part of the leagues top 50 players voted on in 1997. He's not going to be on the list twice for the top 75.

[72-10]

The top 50 players were elected in 1997, like Shaq to commemorate the league's 50th anniversary. The league is celebrating it's 75th anniversary so I'm sure they're going to add another 25 players to bring it to the top 75 players in the leagues 75 year history. So it would be 1998 to present.

That doesn't mean they necessarily played in the last 25 years because 75 is a different threshold than 50. For instance, Dominique Wilkins is clearly a top 75 player, and he didn't play in the NBA in the last 25 years, although he still played the sport professionally.

[RogueBorg]

:facepalm

It's in no particular order. Of course KD is a better player than Wade and Iverson. It's just a list.

[RogueBorg]

That doesn't mean they necessarily played in the last 25 years because 75 is a different threshold than 50. For instance, Dominique Wilkins is clearly a top 75 player, and he didn't play in the NBA in the last 25 years, although he still played the sport professionally.

That's exactly right. You could go back and take someone like Dominque who didn't make the cut for the first 50 in 1997. Good point. The hard part is, once you make your own list and then remember someone like 'Nique, now who do you remove?

[L.Kizzle]

Well, he is a Hall of Famer but I did forget Vince Carter and Grant Hill.
And Tracy McGrady.

[Sportal]

Shaq is already part of the leagues top 50 players voted on in 1997. He's not going to be on the list twice for the top 75.

??? The guy, if it wasn't you anyway, who knows tbfh. Said Kawhi had a better peak than Shaq. Off his head.

[RogueBorg]

Here are the 50 voted in 1997;

50 Greatest Players in NBA History
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Nate Archibald
Paul Arizin
Charles Barkley
Rick Barry
Elgin Baylor
Dave Bing
Larry Bird
Wilt Chamberlain
Bob Cousy
Dave Cowens
Billy Cunningham
Dave DeBusschere
Clyde Drexler
Julius Erving
Patrick Ewing
Walt Frazier
George Gervin
Hal Greer
John Havlicek
Elvin Hayes
Magic Johnson
Sam Jones
Michael Jordan
Jerry Lucas
Karl Malone
Moses Malone
Pete Maravich
Kevin McHale
George Mikan
Earl Monroe
Hakeem Olajuwon
Shaquille O’Neal
Robert Parish
Bob Pettit
Scottie Pippen
Willis Reed
Oscar Robertson
David Robinson
Bill Russell
Dolph Schayes
Bill Sharman
John Stockton
Isiah Thomas
Nate Thurmond
Wes Unseld
Bill Walton
Jerry West
Lenny Wilkens
James Worthy
* * *

[3ba11]

I'm sure I forgot someone;

1. LeBron James
2. Kobe Bryant
3. Tim Duncan
4. Dwayne Wade
5. Allen Iverson
6. Kevin Garnett
7. Chris Paul
8. Dirk Nowitski
9. Kevin Durant
10. Steph Curry
11. Dwight Howard
12. Klay Thompson
13. Kawhi Leonard
14. James Harden
15. Russell Westbrook
16. Damian Lillard
17. Chris Bosh
18. Ray Allen
19. Jason Kidd
20. Giannis Antetokounmpo
21. Chris Webber
22. Ben Wallace
23. Steve Nash
24. Anthony Davis
25. Reggie Miller


^^^ All those guys are over Pippen right, except maybe Ben Wallace?

[RogueBorg]

And Tracy McGrady.

yup

[RogueBorg]

??? The guy, if it wasn't you anyway, who knows tbfh. Said Kawhi had a better peak than Shaq. Off his head.

Wasn't me, I don't believe that.

[72-10]

There's another problem with your question, and it's whether we disagree with how past players from the 50th Anniversary Team compare with players that were either excluded from it in the first place, and players who have played since then. In other words, we might no longer think a player from the 50th Anniversary Team is in the top 75. But I gave this by best shot.

Ray Allen
Kobe Bryant
Stephen Curry
Adrian Dantley
Tim Duncan
Kevin Durant
Alex English
Kevin Garnett
Anfernee "Penny" Hardaway
Grant Hill
Dwight Howard
Allen Iverson
LeBron James
Jason Kidd
Bob McAdoo
Reggie Miller
Alonzo Mourning
Cal Murphy
Steve Nash
Dirk Nowitzki
Gary Payton
Paul Pierce
Dennis Rodman
Dwyane Wade
Dominique Wilkins

[72-10]

^^^ All those guys are over Pippen right, except maybe Ben Wallace?

Are you saying now or then; Pippen made the 50th Anniversary Team, although a lot of folks think he barely made it on his own merits.

[72-10]

In fact, I think Wilkins got snubbed from the 50th Anniversary Team in the first place, he's that type of guy, and I think that's another All-Star for 1984-85.

[3ba11]

Are you saying now or then; Pippen made the 50th Anniversary Team, although a lot of folks think he barely made it on his own merits.


I don't see how Pippen is top 50 now considering tons of guys have passed him. Even at the time in the 90's, he was already getting a few extra all-nba's that he didn't deserve due to the winning spotlight and association with MJ, similar to Kobe getting a few extra all-defenses..

In addition to inflated accolades in the 90's (winning spotlight), Pippen is getting overrated by new fans and media, who keep him in the top 50 despite many new guys passing him - this occurs because the on-paper evaluations of new fans laud Pippen's 6 rings over the zero rings of Ewing or Giannis.. So Pippen unfairly gets credit for rings like he's a 1st option - imagine if Klay was ranked ahead of Beal or Harden due to rings - that would be unfair, but that's the treatment Pippen gets..

It's especially unfair for Pippen because no one was more of a 2nd option than him (low peak stats and biggest gap ever between 1st and 2nd option).. Everyone in history had an equal-scoring partner in the playoffs for at least half their rings - they needed equal-scoring partners for entire playoff runs, while Jordan led his sidekick in scoring for every series, and by at least 10 ppg.. Pippen is just the low-producing bum that came along after the super-team 80's - expansion had spread the talent around evenly so 2-star teams could win, and anyone wins alongside the GOAT in a 2-star vs 2-star format.

[RogueBorg]

There's another problem with your question, and it's whether we disagree with how past players from the 50th Anniversary Team compare with players that were either excluded from it in the first place, and players who have played since then. In other words, we might no longer think a player from the 50th Anniversary Team is in the top 75.

That's a whole 'nother can of worms to get into. I kept it simple and left the original 50 in place. It is a legitimate argument though.

[RogueBorg]

In fact, I think Wilkins got snubbed from the 50th Anniversary Team in the first place, he's that type of guy, and I think that's another All-Star for 1984-85.

You're right, back then the debate was Wilkins or Pippen. Looking back now I think Pippen definitely belongs, but back then it was a debate.

[ShawkFactory]

Yea let’s go ahead and move Durant to #4.

[Jasper]

The thread you posit doesn't make sense because you're really asking for one answer to two questions because you're implying that the next 25 players are from the last 25 years, and I don't think that's remotely close to the truth. Some examples are Klay, Kawhi, Lillard, Bosh, Giannis and Davis. Therefore, it wouldn't be a 75th Anniversary Team.

Basically you include the top 50 of all time , and add 25 more , which I think is more realistic , that saying its better than last 25 and Jordan for example and Shaq are counted.
Should be top 75 of all time. IMO

[L.Kizzle]

There's another problem with your question, and it's whether we disagree with how past players from the 50th Anniversary Team compare with players that were either excluded from it in the first place, and players who have played since then. In other words, we might no longer think a player from the 50th Anniversary Team is in the top 75. But I gave this by best shot.

Ray Allen
Kobe Bryant
Stephen Curry
Adrian Dantley
Tim Duncan
Kevin Durant
Alex English
Kevin Garnett
Anfernee "Penny" Hardaway
Grant Hill
Dwight Howard
Allen Iverson
LeBron James
Jason Kidd
Bob McAdoo
Reggie Miller
Alonzo Mourning
Cal Murphy
Steve Nash
Dirk Nowitzki
Gary Payton
Paul Pierce
Dennis Rodman
Dwyane Wade
Dominique Wilkins
Penny Hardaway ... I'd take Tim over him. Still both outside 75.
Calvin Murphy is my dude but he's not top 75.
Neither is Zo, AD or English.
McAdoo and Wilkins on the fence. Same for Reggie Miller.

Westbrook, Harden should be here. And Giannis.

[DevBooker'sMask]

How did Reggie Miller sneak on this list?

Maybe because he does the broadcasting gigs because there is no way he should be making this list with only 25 slots available.

[Orange_Cassidy]

not including anyone that didn't play at least 10 years

1. Mamba
2. Duncan
3. snaq
4. leturd (cause I'm not insecure like jeffany)
6. durant
7. KG
8. dirk
9. wade
10. kawhi
11. curry (front runner. choker. changed nothing)
12. nash
13. Iverson
14. Kidd
15. tmac (one of the best peaks ever. becoming underrated)
16. Ray
17. pierce
18. AD
19. bosh
20. Tony Parker (seriously why the f*ck don't people give this guy some love. he led the spurs in scoring for the 4th and 5th championships. won 5 as lead playmaker and had 1 of his 2 finals mvps stolen by kawhi. and 1 of his 6 rings stolen by Ray allen)


btw f*ck Chris paul and his bogus 2021 4 rounds of injured stars to finally get him a title

hes still a career choker like harden to me. always will be

[ShawkFactory]

Tmac is a tough case. When feeling good was he a better player than at least half of the guys on the list? I’d say unquestionably yes.

He had some absolutely terrible luck in his career.

But he also was only a truly great player for like 5-6 years.

[Pip' N Rodman]

not including anyone that didn't play at least 10 years

1. Mamba
2. Duncan
3. snaq
4. leturd (cause I'm not insecure like jeffany)
6. durant
7. KG
8. dirk
9. wade
10. kawhi
11. curry (front runner. choker. changed nothing)
12. nash
13. Iverson
14. Kidd
15. tmac (one of the best peaks ever. becoming underrated)
16. Ray
17. pierce
18. AD
19. bosh
20. Tony Parker (seriously why the f*ck don't people give this guy some love. he led the spurs in scoring for the 4th and 5th championships. won 5 as lead playmaker and had 1 of his 2 finals mvps stolen by kawhi. and 1 of his 6 rings stolen by Ray allen)


btw f*ck Chris paul and his bogus 2021 4 rounds of injured stars to finally get him a title

hes still a career choker like harden to me. always will be

hey kenneth

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe, Kawhi, Durant ahead of Lebron for sure along with Duncan, Dirk, Shaq in just using guys who played 10+ season's in that time span.

[Orange_Cassidy]

Tmac is a tough case. When feeling good was he a better player than at least half of the guys on the list? I’d say unquestionably yes.

He had some absolutely terrible luck in his career.

But he also was only a truly great player for like 5-6 years.

that's why he's around 15-20th and not right behind kobe at #2 for me.. he was easily the 3rd most talented player of the last 25 years behind kobe and durant

[L.Kizzle]

Tmac is a tough case. When feeling good was he a better player than at least half of the guys on the list? I’d say unquestionably yes.

He had some absolutely terrible luck in his career.

But he also was only a truly great player for like 5-6 years.
His prime was 8 seasons. 7 all nba, 7 all stars 2 scoring titles in 8 seasons. A few 50 win seasons (out in 1st round but hey ...)

[theman93]

A few guys to consider..

Vince Carter
Carmelo Anthony
Tony Parker
Tracy McGrady
Grant Hill
Yao Ming
Dikeme Mutombo
Alonzo Mourning

[ShawkFactory]

His prime was 8 seasons. 7 all nba, 7 all stars 2 scoring titles in 8 seasons. A few 50 win seasons (out in 1st round but hey ...)

Yea but even in 06 and 07 he was dealing with his back pretty heavily. It started in 04 really

He only played 47 games in 06

[L.Kizzle]

Yea but even in 06 and 07 he was dealing with his back pretty heavily. It started in 04 really

He only played 47 games in 06
07 he was 25/7/5 in 71 games and Rockets won 52 games. All.NBA 2nd team and All-Star.

08 he was last top-tier season. 22/6/5. All NBA 3rd team and Rockets won 55 games.

He was decent in 09 and done by 2011.

[theman93]

1. LeBron James
2. Tim Duncan
3. Kobe Bryant
4. Kevin Durant
5. Steph Curry
6. Dwayne Wade
7. Kawhi Leonard
8. Kevin Garnett
9. Dirk Nowitzki
10. Chris Paul
11. Allen Iverson
12. Paul Pierce
13. Ray Allen
14. James Harden
15. Steve Nash
16. Anthony Davis
17. Giannis Antetokounmpo
18. Dwight Howard
19. Jason Kidd
20. Damian Lillard
21. Russell Westbrook
22. Chris Bosh
23. Carmelo Anthony
24. Tracy McGrady
25. Jimmy Butler

If Paul wins this year's Finals I move him to 8th.

Honorable Mentions in no particular order: Yao Ming, Chris Webber, Klay Thompson, Ben Wallace, Kevin Love, Paul George, Tony Parker, Vince Carter, Pau Gasol, Dikembe Mutombo

[L.Kizzle]

1. LeBron James
2. Tim Duncan
3. Kobe Bryant
4. Kevin Durant
5. Steph Curry
6. Dwayne Wade
7. Kawhi Leonard
8. Kevin Garnett
9. Dirk Nowitzki
10. Chris Paul
11. Allen Iverson
12. Paul Pierce
13. Ray Allen
14. James Harden
15. Steve Nash
16. Anthony Davis
17. Giannis Antetokounmpo
18. Dwight Howard
19. Jason Kidd
20. Damian Lillard
21. Russell Westbrook
22. Chris Bosh
23. Carmelo Anthony
24. Tracy McGrady
25. Jimmy Butler

If Paul wins this year's Finals I move him to 8th.

Honorable Mentions in no particular order: Yao Ming, Chris Webber, Klay Thompson, Ben Wallace, Kevin Love, Paul George, Tony Parker, Vince Carter, Pau Gasol, Dikembe Mutombo
Remove Jimmy Butler for anyone in your honorable mentioned list.


Everything else is good

[rmt]

not including anyone that didn't play at least 10 years

1. Mamba
2. Duncan
3. snaq
4. leturd (cause I'm not insecure like jeffany)
6. durant
7. KG
8. dirk
9. wade
10. kawhi
11. curry (front runner. choker. changed nothing)
12. nash
13. Iverson
14. Kidd
15. tmac (one of the best peaks ever. becoming underrated)
16. Ray
17. pierce
18. AD
19. bosh
20. Tony Parker (seriously why the f*ck don't people give this guy some love. he led the spurs in scoring for the 4th and 5th championships. won 5 as lead playmaker and had 1 of his 2 finals mvps stolen by kawhi. and 1 of his 6 rings stolen by Ray allen)


btw f*ck Chris paul and his bogus 2021 4 rounds of injured stars to finally get him a title

hes still a career choker like harden to me. always will be

Given that Parker outscored Kawhi by only 0.2 pts per game and Kawhi had by far the more difficult defensive opponent (Lebron) vs Parker's (Mario Chalmers), 2014 FMVP rightly went to Leonard. Parker did not win 5 rings - much less 5 as lead playmaker - that would be 3 as 2003 playoffs, Duncan lead the team in points, rebs, assists and blocks. And no, Parker did not lead the spurs in scoring for 2007:

2007 playoffs
Duncan 22.2 pts 11.5 rebs 3.3 asst 3.1 blks 52.1%FG
Parker 20.8 pts 3.4 rebs 5.8 asst 1.1 stl 48%FG

[RRR3]

07 he was 25/7/5 in 71 games and Rockets won 52 games. All.NBA 2nd team and All-Star.

08 he was last top-tier season. 22/6/5. All NBA 3rd team and Rockets won 55 games.

He was decent in 09 and done by 2011.
He was only truly spectacular from like 01-05.

[RogueBorg]

1. LeBron James
2. Tim Duncan
3. Kobe Bryant
4. Kevin Durant
5. Steph Curry
6. Dwayne Wade
7. Kawhi Leonard
8. Kevin Garnett
9. Dirk Nowitzki
10. Chris Paul
11. Allen Iverson
12. Paul Pierce
13. Ray Allen
14. James Harden
15. Steve Nash
16. Anthony Davis
17. Giannis Antetokounmpo
18. Dwight Howard
19. Jason Kidd
20. Damian Lillard
21. Russell Westbrook
22. Chris Bosh
23. Carmelo Anthony
24. Tracy McGrady
25. Jimmy Butler

If Paul wins this year's Finals I move him to 8th.

Honorable Mentions in no particular order: Yao Ming, Chris Webber, Klay Thompson, Ben Wallace, Kevin Love, Paul George, Tony Parker, Vince Carter, Pau Gasol, Dikembe Mutombo

Solid list

[72-10]

The thing about T-Mac is that he didn't play good defense, produced on a team that didn't win, and didn't get much national exposure. He's certainly on that next level down, though.

[Phoenix]

The thing about T-Mac is that he didn't play good defense, produced on a team that didn't win, and didn't get much national exposure. He's certainly on that next level down, though.

True but we really never got to see the best of the guy on a team with a chance to do anything. Squeezing 40 plus wins out of those early 2000s Magic rosters was a semi-miracle. Grant was never healthy after 2000. The Tmac that everyone reveres is the 2001-2003 guy, specifically that 2003 campaign, and he was 23. Few in the history of the game figured out winning that young. By the time he was on a team that may have had a chance of doing some damage, those mid to late 2000s Rockets, we had already seen his best on an individual level and he happened to be paired with a 2nd star who was also injury prone. A healthy Tmac/Yao combo surrounded by Battier, Scola, Skip to my Lou etc should have challenged the Spurs and Lakers.

[ShawkFactory]

The thing about T-Mac is that he didn't play good defense, produced on a team that didn't win, and didn't get much national exposure. He's certainly on that next level down, though.

This is actually kind of a myth. He didn’t play great D once he started having injury issues but young Tmac was very effective on the defensive end.

He was extremely long and obviously extremely athletic. He took breaks on that end starting in 2004 or so because the offensive load he had to carry was ridiculous.

Not necessarily making excuses but that’s just how it was.

[L.Kizzle]

The thing about T-Mac is that he didn't play good defense, produced on a team that didn't win, and didn't get much national exposure. He's certainly on that next level down, though.
Only thing correct here is he produced on teams that didn't win.
He was a good (nor great but could be if he wanted) defender. He was known for defense In Toronto more than his scoring and he started like every All-Star game he appeared and that says a lot he we was in an east that included his cousin Vince and Allen Iverson and a returning Jordan. Actually I take that back, I don't think he started in his first all star game but in 03 he had more votes than Jordan as he didn't start his last all star game.

[Orange_Cassidy]

Given that Parker outscored Kawhi by only 0.2 pts per game and Kawhi had by far the more difficult defensive opponent (Lebron) vs Parker's (Mario Chalmers), 2014 FMVP rightly went to Leonard. Parker did not win 5 rings - much less 5 as lead playmaker - that would be 3 as 2003 playoffs, Duncan lead the team in points, rebs, assists and blocks. And no, Parker did not lead the spurs in scoring for 2007:

2007 playoffs
Duncan 22.2 pts 11.5 rebs 3.3 asst 3.1 blks 52.1%FG
Parker 20.8 pts 3.4 rebs 5.8 asst 1.1 stl 48%FG

translation: tony Parker led 2 of his 5 title teams in finals scoring

[Phoenix]

Only thing correct here is he produced on teams that didn't win.
He was a good (nor great but could be if he wanted) defender. He was known for defense In Toronto more than his scoring and he started like every All-Star game he appeared and that says a lot he we was in an east that included his cousin Vince and Allen Iverson and a returning Jordan. Actually I take that back, I don't think he started in his first all star game but in 03 he had more votes than Jordan as he didn't start his last all star game.

IIRC it was Vince that beat out MJ for one of the guard spots and gave it up. TMac started in 03.

[tanibanana]

i hope this is not in order
Obviously in no particular order..

[ImKobe]

not including anyone that didn't play at least 10 years

1. Mamba
2. Duncan
3. snaq
4. leturd (cause I'm not insecure like jeffany)
6. durant
7. KG
8. dirk
9. wade
10. kawhi
11. curry (front runner. choker. changed nothing)
12. nash
13. Iverson
14. Kidd
15. tmac (one of the best peaks ever. becoming underrated)
16. Ray
17. pierce
18. AD
19. bosh
20. Tony Parker (seriously why the f*ck don't people give this guy some love. he led the spurs in scoring for the 4th and 5th championships. won 5 as lead playmaker and had 1 of his 2 finals mvps stolen by kawhi. and 1 of his 6 rings stolen by Ray allen)


btw f*ck Chris paul and his bogus 2021 4 rounds of injured stars to finally get him a title

hes still a career choker like harden to me. always will be

Wade should be higher than Dirk & KG but otherwise a decent list.

Kobe and TD have to be at the top with them leading the two greatest dynasties at 5 rings a pop with a high Finals win rate. Kobe gets the #1 nod becaue he beat Duncan 4 out of 5 times in the 2000s, the NBA championship was essentially decided in 3 of those 5 series.

[Phoenix]

Kobe gets the #1 nod becaue he beat Duncan 4 out of 5 times in the 2000s, the NBA championship was essentially decided in 3 of those 5 series.

So is there any acknowledgement of Shaq in those series, or....? I mean its possible to say that Kobe played great, spectacular if you will, against the Spurs while also acknowledging that Shaq did hold his own in the paint against the Twin Towers. I dont need a reply with the numbers, I know what they are and I saw the series back in the day. I'm just saying, can we at least pretend like Shaq was there, and relevant in some form, to those victories? I don't even care if you think Kobe was 1A in 2001 to Shaqs 1B against the Spurs. Just saying 'Kobe beat Duncan' as if Shaq was some Rick Fox level role player along the way, you can do better than that.

[Orange_Cassidy]

So is there any acknowledgement of Shaq in those series, or....? I mean its possible to say that Kobe played great, spectacular if you will, against the Spurs while also acknowledging that Shaq did hold his own in the paint against the Twin Towers. I dont need a reply with the numbers, I know what they are and I saw the series back in the day. I'm just saying, can we at least pretend like Shaq was there, and relevant in some form, to those victories? I don't even care if you think Kobe was 1A in 2001 to Shaqs 1B against the Spurs. Just saying 'Kobe beat Duncan' as if Shaq was some Rick Fox level role player along the way, you can do better than that.

kobe outperformed shaq in literally every spurs series. even 1999

and he shoulda beat duncan in 2003 too and 4 peated but horry missed all 20 of his threes that series including the game winning attempt after kobes historic comeback


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wF1uYujpHB0

[FKAri]

Kobe over Duncan isn't a given. It could go either way. I side Kobe because the modern game is more reliant on star guards than star bigs.

[ImKobe]

So is there any acknowledgement of Shaq in those series, or....? I mean its possible to say that Kobe played great, spectacular if you will, against the Spurs while also acknowledging that Shaq did hold his own in the paint against the Twin Towers. I dont need a reply with the numbers, I know what they are and I saw the series back in the day. I'm just saying, can we at least pretend like Shaq was there, and relevant in some form, to those victories? I don't even care if you think Kobe was 1A in 2001 to Shaqs 1B against the Spurs. Just saying 'Kobe beat Duncan' as if Shaq was some Rick Fox level role player along the way, you can do better than that.

He did, but this is about Kobe vs. Duncan. Duncan had the deeper rosters & the better FO/Coach but Kobe had Shaq. Spurs led 4 out of the 5 games in '02 in those 4th quarters (tied in the other one) and got their asses beat. Kobe was the best 4th quarter player in the league those years and decided those series for the most part. Shaq was still great but even he said that Kobe was the best in the world during that '01 Spurs series.

Duncan's numbers can be very misleading as well, like the 34/25 game he had in Game 5 of that '02 series. He had just 5 points and 4 rebounds on 33% shooting in a tight 4th quarter game and scored 0 in the last 5 minutes until a garbage time layup, so in reality he only had 3 points that impacted the game in the 4th while Kobe made go-ahead layups against him & Bowen. I don't know anyone who went away from those games thinking that Duncan was better than Kobe when the two played against each other in the Playoffs. Kobe got everything he wanted offensively and scored over Duncan at will from 01-08, which is why his teams succeeded against him in most cases, even when Shaq wasn't there in '08.

For a long time the consensus was that Kobe was the best player of his era, followed by Duncan & Shaq. The 5th ring TD won off the back of his stacked Spurs roster with 3-4 other HOFers is what all of a sudden made people go the other way but Kobe was clearly the better all-around player due to his ability to close games more consistently, now people who didn't follow the league at the time are looking at some advanced metrics to bash Kobe's legacy but the games speak for themselves.

[Phoenix]

kobe outperformed shaq in literally every spurs series. even 1999

and he shoulda beat duncan in 2003 too and 4 peated but horry missed all 20 of his threes that series including the game winning attempt after kobes historic comeback


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wF1uYujpHB0

Like I said, I'm not arguing who was better against the Spurs. I'm asking are we pretending like Shaq wasnt on the court or of trivial importance. The guy dropped 27/13 in the 2001 series and I all I hear is 'Kobe beat the Spurs' from the Kobe crowd. The Lakers had the the best players on the court, but if I didnt know better I would think Kobe pulled a solo act.

[ShawkFactory]

He did, but this is about Kobe vs. Duncan. Duncan had the deeper rosters & the better FO/Coach but Kobe had Shaq. Spurs led 4 out of the 5 games in '02 in those 4th quarters (tied in the other one) and got their asses beat. Kobe was the best 4th quarter player in the league those years and decided those series for the most part. Shaq was still great but even he said that Kobe was the best in the world during that '01 Spurs series.

Duncan's numbers can be very misleading as well, like the 34/25 game he had in Game 5 of that '02 series. He had just 5 points and 4 rebounds on 33% shooting in a tight 4th quarter game and scored 0 in the last 5 minutes until a garbage time layup, so in reality he only had 3 points that impacted the game in the 4th while Kobe made go-ahead layups against him & Bowen. I don't know anyone who went away from those games thinking that Duncan was better than Kobe when the two played against each other in the Playoffs. Kobe got everything he wanted offensively and scored over Duncan at will from 01-08, which is why his teams succeeded against him in most cases, even when Shaq wasn't there in '08.

For a long time the consensus was that Kobe was the best player of his era, followed by Duncan & Shaq. The 5th ring TD won off the back of his stacked Spurs roster with 3-4 other HOFers is what all of a sudden made people go the other way but Kobe was clearly the better all-around player due to his ability to close games more consistently, now people who didn't follow the league at the time are looking at some advanced metrics to bash Kobe's legacy but the games speak for themselves.

This is a completely unfair and contextless analysis.

For starters, Duncan was banging down low with Shaq (when Robinson was out) and typically being doubled when not guarded by Shaq. Can't really blame him for starting to flame out in the 4th when he has to deal with Shaq half the time and the Spurs team had literally no reliable scorers or creators, other than him. Kobe didn't have to put in work in every facet for the entire game like Duncan did. This is not a knock on Kobe like some try to imply but just a fact, and a great luxury of having peak Shaquille O'neal on your team.

Second, go watch any game of any great big man in that era. I'm talking Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Shaq, Duncan, etc. When the game slows down in the 4th teams would pack the paint and/or send doubles at these great bigs to force the ball out of their hands and further away from the basket in general. This is just an intuitive way to play defense when baskets truly count more...make offense work outside in. And this is why most if not all bigs (I haven't checked all the numbers) had their scoring totals and/or efficiency dip in the 4th, at least in the playoffs. Kobe, without even going into his talent, naturally benefited from this given the nature of his position and how the game was played.

So you can't just put Kobe's 4th quarter production against Duncan's and ignore all of this context involved with it.

As far as those guys against eachother in the eyes of the "consensus"...Kobe didn't truly move the needle until he started winning again later in the decade. From 2001-2005 PLENTY of people just outwardly considered Duncan the better player.

[Phoenix]

He did, but this is about Kobe vs. Duncan. Duncan had the deeper rosters & the better FO/Coach but Kobe had Shaq. Spurs led 4 out of the 5 games in '02 in those 4th quarters (tied in the other one) and got their asses beat. Kobe was the best 4th quarter player in the league those years and decided those series for the most part. Shaq was still great but even he said that Kobe was the best in the world during that '01 Spurs series.

Duncan's numbers can be very misleading as well, like the 34/25 game he had in Game 5 of that '02 series. He had just 5 points and 4 rebounds on 33% shooting in a tight 4th quarter game and scored 0 in the last 5 minutes until a garbage time layup, so in reality he only had 3 points that impacted the game in the 4th while Kobe made go-ahead layups against him & Bowen. I don't know anyone who went away from those games thinking that Duncan was better than Kobe when the two played against each other in the Playoffs. Kobe got everything he wanted offensively and scored over Duncan at will from 01-08, which is why his teams succeeded against him in most cases, even when Shaq wasn't there in '08.

For a long time the consensus was that Kobe was the best player of his era, followed by Duncan & Shaq. The 5th ring TD won off the back of his stacked Spurs roster with 3-4 other HOFers is what all of a sudden made people go the other way but Kobe was clearly the better all-around player due to his ability to close games more consistently, now people who didn't follow the league at the time are looking at some advanced metrics to bash Kobe's legacy but the games speak for themselves.

It's really not though, not when Shaq was there. If you want to say 'Kobe beat Duncan' in 2008 when Kobe didnt have the other best player on either side, sure. I just dont see how we can mano a mano anything about Kobe and Duncan in the early 2000s. And in saying that, I'm not even making any argument about who was better between Kobe and Duncan in 2001. I'm just saying 'Kobe beat Duncan' while completely ignoring the context of Shaq to hammer home a pro-Kobe position is pretty transparent. You can say Kobe was the best player in the 2001 series without resorting to completely avoiding mentioning Shaqs name.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Based on my eye test, i would rank them something like this:


1) Kawhi
2) Jordan
3) Lebron
4) Giannis
5) Kobe
6) Shaq
7) Dirk
8) Duncan
9) Kevin Durant
10) Chris Paul
11) Stephen Curry
12) Kevin Garnett
13) Manu Ginobili
14) Jimmy Butler
15) Joel Embiid
16) Jason Kidd
17) Steve Nash
18) Anthony Davis
19) James Harden
20) Carmello Anthony
21) Russell Westbrook
22) Damian Lillard
23) Tracy Mcgrady
24) Ray Allen
25) Allen Iverson

[gonzaldo]

All MVps made it into initial top 50, so all mvp would probably make it now, with rose being only questionable one, but still his career post mvp and injuries have been long enough and decent enough to get the nod
Iverson
Duncan
Garnett
Nash
Nowitzki
Kobe
Lebron
Durant
Curry
Westbrook
Harden
Giannis
Jokic
Rose

Then guys who won finals mvp

Pierce
Parker
Kawhi
Wade

thats 18 players already. Billups and Iggy probably cant make it

No MVPs but career with so many accolades they should make it without a doubt.
Payton
Kidd
Paul
Lillard
Dwight
Big Ben

Thats 24 players.
Then we have Davis, Kyrie, Ray Allen, Manu, Klay...
someone should be left out

[rmt]

Based on my eye test, i would rank them something like this:


1) Kawhi
2) Jordan
3) Lebron
4) Giannis
5) Kobe
6) Shaq
7) Dirk
8) Duncan
9) Kevin Durant
10) Chris Paul
11) Stephen Curry
12) Kevin Garnett
13) Manu Ginobili
14) Jimmy Butler
15) Joel Embiid
16) Jason Kidd
17) Steve Nash
18) Anthony Davis
19) James Harden
20) Carmello Anthony
21) Russell Westbrook
22) Damian Lillard
23) Tracy Mcgrady
24) Ray Allen
25) Allen Iverson

Most would say that you are blind.

[rmt]

He did, but this is about Kobe vs. Duncan. Duncan had the deeper rosters & the better FO/Coach but Kobe had Shaq. Spurs led 4 out of the 5 games in '02 in those 4th quarters (tied in the other one) and got their asses beat. Kobe was the best 4th quarter player in the league those years and decided those series for the most part. Shaq was still great but even he said that Kobe was the best in the world during that '01 Spurs series.

Duncan's numbers can be very misleading as well, like the 34/25 game he had in Game 5 of that '02 series. He had just 5 points and 4 rebounds on 33% shooting in a tight 4th quarter game and scored 0 in the last 5 minutes until a garbage time layup, so in reality he only had 3 points that impacted the game in the 4th while Kobe made go-ahead layups against him & Bowen. I don't know anyone who went away from those games thinking that Duncan was better than Kobe when the two played against each other in the Playoffs. Kobe got everything he wanted offensively and scored over Duncan at will from 01-08, which is why his teams succeeded against him in most cases, even when Shaq wasn't there in '08.

For a long time the consensus was that Kobe was the best player of his era, followed by Duncan & Shaq. The 5th ring TD won off the back of his stacked Spurs roster with 3-4 other HOFers is what all of a sudden made people go the other way but Kobe was clearly the better all-around player due to his ability to close games more consistently, now people who didn't follow the league at the time are looking at some advanced metrics to bash Kobe's legacy but the games speak for themselves.

In 2002, which coach had won 8 rings and which coach had only one? I guess Phil Jackson was chopped liver and Pop was GOAT then? Which front office had brought Shaq and Kobe together? Tell me again who had MDE as a team mate and who had 36 year old DRob and 19 year old rookie Parker as team mates?

As far as I know, a point scored in the 4th quarter COUNTS just as much as a point made in the 1st quarter.

There was no consensus that Kobe was the best player of his era - much less for A LONG TIME. Kobe had Shaq - a top 10 GOAT player in his PRIME for 3 of his championships. In 2014, Duncan's 3 HOFs were 32 year old Parker, 36 year old Manu and 22 year old Kawhi who averaged 12.8/14.3 (rs/playoffs).

[L.Kizzle]

All MVps made it into initial top 50, so all mvp would probably make it now, with rose being only questionable one, but still his career post mvp and injuries have been long enough and decent enough to get the nod
Iverson
Duncan
Garnett
Nash
Nowitzki
Kobe
Lebron
Durant
Curry
Westbrook
Harden
Giannis
Jokic
Rose

Then guys who won finals mvp

Pierce
Parker
Kawhi
Wade

thats 18 players already. Billups and Iggy probably cant make it

No MVPs but career with so many accolades they should make it without a doubt.
Payton
Kidd
Paul
Lillard
Dwight
Big Ben

Thats 24 players.
Then we have Davis, Kyrie, Ray Allen, Manu, Klay...
someone should be left out
McAdoo, MVP who didn't make the initial list so I see Rose and Jokic being left off.

[danakery]

There's another problem with your question, and it's whether we disagree with how past NBA players (https://careerexplorerguide.com/nba-player-salary/) from the 50th Anniversary Team compare with players that were either excluded from it in the first place, and players who have played since then. In other words, we might no longer think a player from the 50th Anniversary Team is in the top 75. But I gave this by best shot.

Ray Allen
Kobe Bryant
Stephen Curry
Adrian Dantley
Tim Duncan
Kevin Durant
Alex English
Kevin Garnett
Anfernee "Penny" Hardaway
Grant Hill
Dwight Howard
Allen Iverson
LeBron James
Jason Kidd
Bob McAdoo
Reggie Miller
Alonzo Mourning
Cal Murphy
Steve Nash
Dirk Nowitzki
Gary Payton
Paul Pierce
Dennis Rodman
Dwyane Wade
Dominique Wilkins
Now this is what you call a list. Man you did justice to it.