You really telling me this guy isnt the BITW?

[ArbitraryWater]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhMsAU4gcMQ


Get outta here.


All you idiots that rely too heavily on team success getting exposed.


This guy IS the BITW.

[K Xerxes]

He is not better than Durant, Giannis, LeBron, Steph or Kawhi.

Arguable with Harden, Jokic, Embiid, AD.

[ArbitraryWater]

He is not better than Durant, Giannis, LeBron, Steph or Kawhi.

Arguable with Harden, Jokic, Embiid, AD.

On what basis?

Watch that, keep in mind the absolute regularity with which he can do this, and tell me how LeBron or Kawhi is better.

I'd keep KD/Steph/Giannis out as they're all coin flips with him, but KD really has no argument either.

Steph can at least match what Luka does, and Giannis is the only one with a significant defensive impact here that transcends everyone else's.

[K Xerxes]

On what basis?

Watch that, keep in mind the absolute regularity with which he can do this, and tell me how LeBron or Kawhi is better.

I'd keep KD/Steph/Giannis out as they're all coin flips with him, but KD really has no argument either.

Steph can at least match what Luka does, and Giannis is the only one with a significant defensive impact here that transcends everyone else's.

LeBron is a few months removed from dominating a playoffs and winning a chip / FMVP.

Kawhi is a dominant two way player and put up 30/8 on almost 60% shooting in this playoffs before getting hurt. Two years removed from one of the greatest playoff runs ever, and has only had one poor playoff series in recent memory (Denver).

The above counts when discussing the BITW as it accounts for performances on the biggest stage. Although this is not entirely Luka's fault because his team is bad, the fact is he has not won a playoff series yet.

We're not that far removed either from Harden putting up ungodly stats either, which were probably even greater than Luka's, but it was nonsense to call him BITW.

Doncic piles up stats and is a great all round offensive player. Things he can improve on: late game stamina, FT shooting, defense.

[Gohan]

[QUOTE=K Xerxes;14403312]LeBron is a few months removed from dominating a playoffs and winning a chip / FMVP.

Kawhi is a dominant two way player and put up 30/8 on almost 60% shooting in this playoffs before getting hurt. Two years removed from one of the greatest playoff runs ever, and has only had one poor playoff series in recent memory (Denver).

The above counts when discussing the BITW as it accounts for performances on the biggest stage. Although this is not entirely Luka's fault because his team is bad, the fact is he has not won a playoff series yet.

We're not that far removed either from Harden putting up ungodly stats either, which were probably even greater than Luka's, but it was nonsense to call him BITW.

Doncic piles up stats and is a great all round offensive player. Things he can improve on: late game stamina, FT shooting, defenseautocrat-of

DO YOU KNOW who tried to destroy all the jews throughout xerxes?

[ArbitraryWater]

You cant pull that "dominant two way player" shit anymore for Kawhi.


Exactly, Kawhi and LeBron are REMOVED from that.


The LeBron we had last year is nothing like 2020 LeBron.


And you seem to believe that leading a great team to a title with good stats will automatically make you better than anyone who didn't lead a team to a title and also has good stats (if not better ones).

You are literally saying that it is not possible to be the BITW when your team sucks / you didnt make playoffs / WCSF whatever.

Thats obviously very, very dumbed down, simplified logic.


"late game stamina" is a funny critique, every single one of these players would struggle carrying the weight Luka carries night-in-night-out.

Didnt KD gass out and go 0/5 in OT of game 7?

That was the Luka experience.

I dont see you telling KD he needs to improve on his late game stamina.

You should tell Kawhi to improve his defense, not Luka.

Luka is a solid defender, Kawhi is terrible on that end now. He does not care.


Anything that might be outside the box is completely too much for you.

You literally entirely rely on established narratives.


And yes, Harden is at that level btw, but not as clutch / dependant.

[ArbitraryWater]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1XkoVjIvmc



Watch this and think about your defensive bullshit for Kawhi.


You're literally just clinging on to simple narratives.

"muh two-way dominance".


The funny thing is, even if Kawhi actually had some sort of defensive impact, Luka breaks an offensive barrier that would probably still have him ahead overall.

But again, you prefer the "two-way" simplistic bullshit. Go lie to yourself.

[K Xerxes]

Not sure how I'm supposed to have a reasonable conversation with someone stating Kawhi is a 'terrible' defender now and Luka is a solid defender.

Maybe you should watch Kawhi's dominant defense especially in game 6 & 7 against the Mavs instead of *********ing over box scores.

And yes I do not believe someone can be called the BITW when they have never gotten out of the first round, and other great players have had dominant deep runs in recent years.

[ArbitraryWater]

Not sure how I'm supposed to have a reasonable conversation with someone stating Kawhi is a 'terrible' defender now and Luka is a solid defender.

Maybe you should watch Kawhi's dominant defense especially in game 6 & 7 against the Mavs instead of *********ing over box scores.

And yes I do not believe someone can be called the BITW when they have never gotten out of the first round, and other great players have had dominant deep runs in recent years.

Thats exactly your problem.

This is a culture shock to a casual like you. Im literally showing you possession-by-possession breakdown, what box score are you refering to?


LeBron lost in the 1st round this year and you have him as BITW contender doofus.


If Luka makes the 2R next year with a better team while playing worse, all of a sudden he has an argument for BITW?


You're as dumb as a rock.

[ScottieQuitting]

Not sure how I'm supposed to have a reasonable conversation with someone stating Kawhi is a 'terrible' defender now and Luka is a solid defender.

Maybe you should watch Kawhi's dominant defense especially in game 6 & 7 against the Mavs instead of *********ing over box scores.

And yes I do not believe someone can be called the BITW when they have never gotten out of the first round, and other great players have had dominant deep runs in recent years.
He’s never been all that great at analyzing basketball, broski. He’s a German nerd.

[ArbitraryWater]

He’s never been all that great at analyzing basketball, broski. He’s a German nerd.

Go make another comment about "alpha" bub, thats literally your best understanding of basketball :lol

[K Xerxes]

Here's some possessions for you showing Kawhi's 'terrible' defense.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BY7MhhKWDUI


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXGdLyv4FlA&t

[K Xerxes]

He’s never been all that great at analyzing basketball, broski. He’s a German nerd.

You'd think after 41,000 posts over 7 years, he'd develop some understanding of the game.

[ScottieQuitting]

Luka is amazing. But these guys:

Kawhi
LeBron
KD
AD
Giannis
Steph
Harden

IMO are still clearly superior players.

Given their total impact on the floor, experience, or in some cases athleticism. Some of those guys I don’t even like, but truth is truth.


You'd think after 41,000 posts over 7 years, he'd develop some understanding of the game.
You’d think, but nah.

[hold this L]

Luka will get there, but he's not in the tier 1 yet. He's only 22. At his age, only Lebron I remember being better in the last 15-20 years. If we start analyzing Luka's issues at the micro level that we do with other superstars, a lot of his fans would get mad. He's already an easy top 10 player which in itself is amazing, and he's the best 25+ under guy as well.

[ArbitraryWater]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GV_KkqMDpaM


Luka Doncic: It's easier to score in the NBA than in Europe. That's about right.
K the best player in the world D: 10
Luka: 48


Nobody has ever scored 48 points at the Olympic games since NBA players were allowed to play at the Olympics in 1992.

[ArbitraryWater]

Here's some possessions for you showing Kawhi's 'terrible' defense.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BY7MhhKWDUI


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXGdLyv4FlA&t


Thats exactly what you need, highlights.

[ArbitraryWater]

Luka is amazing. But these guys:

Kawhi
LeBron
KD
AD
Giannis
Steph
Harden

IMO are still clearly superior players.

Given their total impact on the floor, experience, or in some cases athleticism. Some of those guys I don’t even like, but truth is truth.


You’d think, but nah.


Anyone thinking that there are basketball players alive that are "clearly" better than Luka is a mouth-drooling retard.


Good job, coach.


Love how you prefaced it with the "imo" given you know its bs.

[ArbitraryWater]

I dont even care how old Luka is.


He's breaking norms.


He's breaking standards.


None of the criticism players at his age would normally receive, apply to him.


He probably manages the game better than any of these other BITW contenders but LeBron.

[K Xerxes]

Thats exactly what you need, highlights.

While you linked an hour long analysis of game 2, which the Mavs won and led to being up 2-0 going to home court.

A very comprehensive assessment of Kawhi's defense in a 7 game series which the Clippers ended up winning lol.

[K Xerxes]

I dont even care how old Luka is.


He's breaking norms.


He's breaking standards.


None of the criticism players at his age would normally receive, apply to him.


He probably manages the game better than any of these other BITW contenders but LeBron.

You just said you don't care how old Luka is, and 3 lines later said none of the criticisms players at his age normally receive apply to him.

Nice contradiction.

[SaintzFury13]

The problem with Kawhi's defense is the same problem as LeBron's defense when he came to Cleveland. He's absolutely capable of being a dominant defensive player but it's not on a consistent basis anymore. When you watch your typical Clippers game featuring Kawhi, you don't see the same kind of defensive impact he had in San Antonio or even in bunches in Toronto. He's become one of those players who will take plays off on that end and usually will not guard the opposing teams best player unless he has to. If he wanted to on a nightly basis, then yes, he'd probably still be a top five defensive player in this league. But his days of being a legitimate contender for Defensive Player of the Year are long gone because he just does not bring the night in and night out defensive impact anymore. He doesn't have to, especially when he's on the same team as another top 10 defender at the SF position in Paul George, one of the best defensive PG's in the league in Beverly and a still relatively good defensive PF in Ibaka, as well as Morris who is a good one on one defender. The Clippers usually need Kawhi's offense a lot more than they do his defense. But make no mistake about it, when needed, he can be a dominant two way player.

[dazzer87]

Imagine listening to this foreigner talk about bball…..Better than KL and others………:lol. Stick to watching cricket

[SaintzFury13]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhMsAU4gcMQ


Get outta here.


All you idiots that rely too heavily on team success getting exposed.


This guy IS the BITW.

The argument is certainly there, I will not deny that. At this point in his career, I don't think you can put LeBron above him or even Kawhi per say. But I don't know if I can rank Luka above Giannis, Nokic or Durant just yet. I really need to see him sustain a level of dominance similar to the kind those two were able to bring and I just haven't seen it yet.

Whoever said that Harden is arguable is kidding themselves. Harden at this point doesn't belong in the same conversation as someone like Luka.

[SaintzFury13]

Imagine listening to this foreigner talk about bball…..Better than KL and others………:lol. Stick to watching cricket

Why does the idea of a foreigner talking about bball and being right sound so absurd? We live in an age where so many major outlets of media are available to everyone across the country who has access to them. And really all you need in that regard is internet, a computer, a legitimate interest in the sport and the free time to watch and study it. While I don't necessarily agree with the idea that Luka is the best player in the NBA at the moment (even though him becoming the best player in the world one day is a very real possibility), I don't think that's an outrageous statement to make based on the body of work he's presented so far. Me? I'd still like to see a little bit more at an even higher level. One of the things about becoming the best player in the world is that it's hard to eclipse someone who many consider to be the true holder of that title (and for a lot of people, that person is still LeBron, even though I think both KD and Giannis have truly surpassed him this year). Even if you perform at a higher level than they did, you have to do so at such a noticeable rate to make it come across as crystal clear before a consensus can be reached. LeBron wasn't able to truly surpass Kobe despite doing some incredible things already early in his career until it became perfectly clear that he was a level above Kobe. Imo, that happened in 2009, but you could already see glimpses of him being better in 2008 with some of the incredible things he was doing that season. But you didn't see anyone making the claim then and they had good reason not to.

[90sgoat]

Not only is Luka BITW, he is also the biggest GOAT talent since Shaq.

I've ever only seen Shaq, MJ and Luka, make crazy plays with so much consistency.

I don't need to get into all kinds of arguments, but for me Luka is must watch, something that Lebron, Kobe, Duncan etc, just weren't to the same degree, though the two latter Kobe and Duncan had games of sheer brilliance like Luka, but not as consistently.

Luka will end up a top 5 goat.

A top 5, that contrary to bootlickers, does not include Lebron James.

MJ, Kareem, Bird, Magic, Luka.

[ArbitraryWater]

You just said you don't care how old Luka is, and 3 lines later said none of the criticisms players at his age normally receive apply to him.

Nice contradiction.


Thanks for telling us you are retarded.

[WhiteKyrie]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GV_KkqMDpaM


Luka Doncic: It's easier to score in the NBA than in Europe. That's about right.
K the best player in the world D: 10
Luka: 48


Nobody has ever scored 48 points at the Olympic games since NBA players were allowed to play at the Olympics in 1992.

I mean it is very impressive and he’s a top 10 NBA player easily. But do you really think that

Barkley in 1992
D-Rob in 1992
MJ in 1992
D-Rob in 1996
Shaq in 1996
VC in 2000
Iverson in 2004
Wade in 2008
Kobe in 2008
LeBron in 2008
Melo in 2008
LeBron in 2012
KD in 2012
Melo in 2012
KD in 2016
Kyrie in 2016

Couldn’t accomplish the same scoring feat given similar circumstances on a team where they alone would be holding the ball constantly and shooting on a team where they would be head and shoulders above in terms of talent?

[ArbitraryWater]

I mean it is very impressive and he’s a top 10 NBA player easily. But do you really think that

Barkley in 1992
D-Rob in 1992
MJ in 1992
D-Rob in 1996
Shaq in 1996
VC in 2000
Iverson in 2004
Wade in 2008
Kobe in 2008
LeBron in 2008
Melo in 2008
LeBron in 2012
KD in 2012
Melo in 2012
KD in 2016
Kyrie in 2016

Couldn’t accomplish the same scoring feat given similar circumstances on a team where they alone would be holding the ball constantly and shooting on a team where they would be head and shoulders above in terms of talent?


No, not at all...

Not nearly as polished or skilled.

They'd have to chuck to an extreme to do so.

I didn't bold '08 Kobe but he doesn't have the long-ranger for it either.



Luka is an absolute outlier.

The fact you think AI or Melo could do what he does shows how underrated he still is.

[ScottieQuitting]

No, not at all...

Not nearly as polished or skilled.

They'd have to chuck to an extreme to do so.

I didn't bold '08 Kobe but he doesn't have the long-ranger for it either.



Luka is an absolute outlier.

The fact you think AI or Melo could do what he does shows how underrated he still is.

AI def could. He hit 8 3’s in international competition in like a half.

You’re talking about polish and being skilled and almost bolded Kobe Bryant in his prime coming off an MVP season? Lol yet you have no problem leaving LeBron in 2012 not in bold?

You’re a clown and a dumb racist German stan. Who got his ass beat and then snitched on classmates.

If it wasn’t obvious before, but good lord you don’t know basketball.

Each one of those guys, David Robinson included could’ve easily put up 48 points in international Olympic competition … being head and shoulders above the rest of her teammates in terms of talent and getting to be the decision-maker the vast majority of the time.

:facepalm

[tpols]

He had 31 points at half time in the Olympics. I've never seen a young player as confident as Luka. He has the same driving ability of lebron, but the fearlessness and shooting spree ability of Kobe.

[Manny98]

Nope the top 3 is KD, Giannis and Lebron (interchangeable)

After that it can be debated

[SaintzFury13]

You’re talking about polish and being skilled and almost bolded Kobe Bryant in his prime coming off an MVP season? Lol yet you have no problem leaving LeBron in 2012 not in bold?

Why is the idea of that so ridiculous? Granted, I am glad that he chose not to bold Kobe, but when comparing him in 2008 and LeBron in 2012, I think LeBron is definitely more likely to be able to do what Luka did than Kobe. Unless you had a specific set of players who were all big, agile and possessed great defensive instincts like the Mavericks did in 2011, you weren't stopping LeBron from being able to get as many points as he wanted.

[tpols]

Why is the idea of that so ridiculous? Granted, I am glad that he chose not to bold Kobe, but when comparing him in 2008 and LeBron in 2012, I think LeBron is definitely more likely to be able to do what Luka did than Kobe. Unless you had a specific set of players who were all big, agile and possessed great defensive instincts like the Mavericks did in 2011, you weren't stopping LeBron from being able to get as many points as he wanted.

Although they play alike, Lebron doesn't have Lukas streak shooting ability.

[3ba11]

Luka will get there, but he's not in the tier 1 yet. He's only 22. At his age, only Lebron I remember being better in the last 15-20 years. If we start analyzing Luka's issues at the micro level that we do with other superstars, a lot of his fans would get mad. He's already an easy top 10 player which in itself is amazing, and he's the best 25+ under guy as well.


Luka is superior to Lebron at 22 because Lebron shot 35% against the champs in 07' and 08' - no 1st option ever shot 35% in a series period, so Lebron's caliber against championship comp at 22 years was worst-ever scrub level - Luka is waaay better than that... Tons of guys are...

Magic was FMVP at 20... Jordan was getting 44/6/6 on 50% against champs at 22-23 years old.... Luka is entirely dominant against anyone at this age... Otoh, Lebron is worst-ever at that age (35%) and also lost in the World Games in 06'... So Lebron wasn't that good at 22 compared to Magic, MJ, or Luka

[nbafaste]

https://youtu.be/dr_J2cMrbJk

[ScottieQuitting]

Why is the idea of that so ridiculous? Granted, I am glad that he chose not to bold Kobe, but when comparing him in 2008 and LeBron in 2012, I think LeBron is definitely more likely to be able to do what Luka did than Kobe. Unless you had a specific set of players who were all big, agile and possessed great defensive instincts like the Mavericks did in 2011, you weren't stopping LeBron from being able to get as many points as he wanted.
Why? You’re talking about the guy who dropped 81? And was a more skilled scorer and a way hotter streak shooter when he got going. LeBron and Luka both have that ability to be the guy with the ball in their hands a lot but LeBron’s natural inclination isn’t to score as much as possible anyway. He could do it. So could all those other guys I mentioned. It’s not that much of a unique necessity to score 48. Luke is a top ten guy as the lone sole superstar option in his team. Under similar circumstances all those guys I listed could drop a 50 burger if they wanted or got hot. And that’s not including guys that played in the FIBA seasons of 2003, and 2014. Guys like McGrady and Harden.

[ArbitraryWater]

Why? You’re talking about the guy who dropped 81? And was a more skilled scorer and a way hotter streak shooter when he got going. LeBron and Luka both have that ability to be the guy with the ball in their hands a lot but LeBron’s natural inclination isn’t to score as much as possible anyway. He could do it. So could all those other guys I mentioned. It’s not that much of a unique necessity to score 48. Luke is a top ten guy as the lone sole superstar option in his team. Under similar circumstances all those guys I listed could drop a 50 burger if they wanted or got hot. And that’s not including guys that played in the FIBA seasons of 2003, and 2014. Guys like McGrady and Harden.

When did McGrady ever have a series or season like Luka had last yr?

Are you trolling, coach?

[StrongLurk]

Luka is getting the Lebron treatment.

People don't want to crown this guy yet because he is so young, but 10 years from now people will say Luka was ALWAYS the best player in the nba when he was 22...

[HBK_Kliq_2]

What do you guys say about Jordan? 1-9 ball

I don't see how 5-8 ball is that much better.

Luka doesn't play defense, his career playoff defensive rating is 119. Even his offensive rating is nothing special.

Let me know if he wins gold by himself like manu did, even then a lot of people didn't consider manu the best player in the nba.

[8Ball]

I think Luka is the most talented player ever.


No basketball player was as good as Luka at 22 years old. Nobody.

[ZenMaster]

Not sure how I'm supposed to have a reasonable conversation with someone stating Kawhi is a 'terrible' defender now and Luka is a solid defender.

Maybe you should watch Kawhi's dominant defense especially in game 6 & 7 against the Mavs instead of *********ing over box scores.

And yes I do not believe someone can be called the BITW when they have never gotten out of the first round, and other great players have had dominant deep runs in recent years.

It depends on your perspective, skills and current form vs accomplishment in recent years.

[hold this L]

Luka is getting the Lebron treatment.

People don't want to crown this guy yet because he is so young, but 10 years from now people will say Luka was ALWAYS the best player in the nba when he was 22...
Lebron was definitely not the best when he was 22, and neither is Luka.

[DoctorP]

If Luka brings home gold hes olympic goat. thats that.

it would be a feat of this calibre:


https://youtu.be/oVT3-wbL8HU

[Axe]

I think he needs to go elsewhere if he wants a ring.

[RRR3]

Lebron was definitely not the best when he was 22, and neither is Luka.
He was the best when he was 24 and didn’t relinquish it for a very long time.

[dankok8]

When did McGrady ever have a series or season like Luka had last yr?

Are you trolling, coach?

I love Luka as much as anyone but this is a huge overreaction thread.

McGrady has a peak season of 32.1/6.5/5.5 on 56.4 %TS in a league with averages of 91.0 pace and 51.9 %TS.
Luka last year had a season of 27.7/8.0/8.6 on 58.7 %TS in a league with averages of 99.2 pace and 57.2 %TS.

[SATAN]

This thread is cancer. Jesus Christ.