Why didn't Lebron guard Orlando's point-forward (Hedo), the set up man for Dwight?

[3ba11]

If Lebron shuts down the heart/soul and set up man for Dwight (Hedo), the Cavs win easily - and this was the expectation - Lebron was expected to defend the opposing SF, so the Cavs were heavily favored.

But Lebron ran from his defensive duty and didn't disrupt defensively, while employing an inferior offensive strategy (westbrooking, weak ball movement) - so the Magic won as historic underdogs

[MadDog]

LeBron averaged 39/8/8 in that series & still holds the greatest peak postseason PER in history. You want him to clamp the other teams "heart and soul" too? Who do you think he is, Superman?

[3ba11]

LeBron averaged 39/8/8 in that series & still holds the greatest peak postseason PER in history. Who do you think he is, Superman?


Westbrooking doesn't win - I thought Lebron was a smart basketball player?

Why can't he get 38/8/8 partially off-ball so the ball moves and teammates aren't reduced to spot-up shooter? Why use a vastly inferior offensive strategy? (ball-dominance < ball movement)

Why does lebron only know simpleton, westbrooking, AAU playground ball-dominance?.. I thought he was a smart player and knew how to have the better team offense? So why is he losing to 1-star team underdogs with 1 seeds (09') and super-teams (11')????

[Bankaii]

Why didn’t MJ shut down Bird when he was going 1-9?

[3ba11]

Why didn’t MJ shut down Bird when he was going 1-9?


He was an 8 seed and massive underdog against a goat team, while the 09' Cavs were the league favorite and Magic were a historic underdog

Only Lebron lost as the favorite or to 1-star teams... The goat never did

[MadDog]

Westbrooking doesn't win - I thought Lebron was a smart basketball player?

Why can't he get 38/8/8 partially off-ball so the ball moves and teammates aren't reduced to spot-up shooter? Why use a vastly inferior offensive strategy? (ball-dominance < ball movement)

Why does lebron only know simpleton, westbrooking, AAU playground ball-dominance?.. I thought he was a smart player and knew how to have the better team offense? So why is he losing to 1-star team underdogs with 1 seeds (09') and super-teams (11')????

I'm no LeBron fan and agree that he's ball a dominator. But still. Numbers wise, doesn't he have like 6 playoff runs in the Top 25? 3 of them I believe are top 10, and in 4 he was "Westbrooking" his teams to championships. I'm not buying what you are selling.

[Bankaii]

He was an 8 seed and massive underdog against a goat team, while the 09' Cavs were the league favorite and Magic were a historic underdog

Only Lebron lost as the favorite or to 1-star teams... The goat never did
Yea but why didn’t MJ shut down Bird when he was going 1-9?

[3ba11]

I'm no LeBron fan and agree that he's ball a dominator. But still. Numbers wise, doesn't he have like 6 playoff runs in the Top 25? 3 of them I believe are top 10, and in 4 he was "Westbrooking" his teams to championships. I'm not buying what you are selling.


Westbrooking only wins with super-teams, which Westbrook never had until this year, but Lebron had since 2011

Westbrooking skillsets need super-team talent to offset the weak strategy/brand of ball

For example, Paul George had less stats than 09' Lebron but beat the 1-seeded Gobert/Mitchell combo because he WASN'T westbrooking.. If he was westbrooking, he could've averaged 38/8/8 and still lost

[MadDog]

Westbrooking only wins with super-teams, which Westbrook never had until this year, but Lebron had since 2011

Westbrooking skillsets need super-team talent to offset the weak strategy/brand of ball

For example, Paul George had less stats than 09' Lebron but beat the 1-seeded Gobert/Mitchell combo because he WASN'T westbrooking.. If he was westbrooking, he could've averaged 38/8/8 and still lost

The Lakers weren't a superteam last year. And while AD was probably the most impactful player on that team, LeBron still got his numbers. :confusedshrug: Paul George had less stats than LeBron because he had better teammates. Look at Terrance Mann who closed Utah out, dropping 40 lol

[3ba11]

The Lakers weren't a superteam last year. And while AD was probably the most impactful player on that team, LeBron still got his numbers. :confusedshrug: Paul George had less stats than LeBron because he had better teammates. Look at Terrance Mann who closed Utah out, dropping 40 lol


Boobie Gibson pulled a Terrence Mann to carry the Cavs to the 07' Finals in Game 6 of ECF

One-offs like that mean nothing

And when I mentioned Paul George, I was comparing his stats and cast from the 21' ECSF to 09' Lebron - PG had less stats than 09' Lebron but beat a better team than the 09' Magic because he wasn't westbrooking.. He upset Gobert/Mitchell's 1 seed with ball movement, while Lebron's ball-dominance GOT UPSET by Dwight's 1-star underdog team

[RRR3]

Yea but why didn’t MJ shut down Bird when he was going 1-9?
He doesn’t care about MJ, he’s a Kobe stan. MJ is a shield.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?496852-3ball-slips-up-reveals-self-to-be-a-butthurt-Kobe-stan-just-using-MJ-to-attack-LBJ

[MadDog]

Boobie Gibson pulled a Terrence Mann to carry the Cavs to the 07' Finals in Game 6 of ECF

One-offs like that mean nothing

And when I mentioned Paul George, I was comparing his stats and cast from the 21' ECSF to 09' Lebron - PG had less stats than 09' Lebron but beat a better team than the 09' Magic because he wasn't westbrooking.. He upset Gobert/Mitchell's 1 seed with ball movement, while Lebron's ball-dominance GOT UPSET by Dwight's 1-star underdog team

The 07 Cavs? You can't be serious. Mann was just an example, but top to bottom, the Clippers clearly had more talent. They beat Utah WITHOUT Kawhi lol

[RRR3]

The 07 Cavs? You can't be serious. Mann was just an example, but top to bottom, the Clippers clearly had more talent. They beat Utah WITHOUT Kawhi lol
He’s on meth. No one on Utah causes the same issues peak Dwight did.

[3ba11]

The 07 Cavs? You can't be serious. Mann was just an example, but top to bottom, the Clippers clearly had more talent. They beat Utah WITHOUT Kawhi lol


Nonsense

The Cavs were the 1 seed

and the Clippers' best player after George was Reggie Jackson, which equals Mo Williams... Otherwise, the the remaining cast is role players on both sides.

Again, PG had less stats than 09' Lebron but beat a better team than the 09' Magic because he wasn't westbrooking... 38/8/8 is great if you aren't westbrooking, otherwise you'd rather have 30/8/6 with a better brand of basketball & clutch

[RRR3]

Westbrook is literally incapable of doing what LeBron did in the 09 playoffs. 3ball is braindead.

[ShawkFactory]

If Lebron shuts down the heart/soul and set up man for Dwight (Hedo), the Cavs win easily - and this was the expectation - Lebron was expected to defend the opposing SF, so the Cavs were heavily favored.

But Lebron ran from his defensive duty and didn't disrupt defensively, while employing an inferior offensive strategy (westbrooking, weak ball movement) - so the Magic won as historic underdogs

Stick to what you know

[RRR3]

Stick to what you know
He doesn’t know anything.

[Axe]

Kobe was winless without tutelage from phil jackson

[3ba11]

Stick to what you know


Lebron failed at whatever his assignment was in that series, and it should've been to defend Hedo - I was watching basketball back then, so I'm aware of what happened more than you

Lebron failed to defend any of the frontcourt players that were having the most damage, and instead defended the unimpactful guards like Courtney Lee or the playground point guard from AND1... aka the easiest assignment

Ultimately, Lebron ran from his defensive duty and made a bad decision to undertake those assignments, while employing an inferior offensive strategy (westbrooking, weak ball movement) - consequently, the Magic won as historic underdogs

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Kobeball still at it. :lol Lots of chucking on the front page. Where's the efficiency tho?

https://c.tenor.com/sSlf7sBNqnoAAAAC/fail-basketball.gif

[ShawkFactory]

Lebron failed at whatever his assignment was in that series, and it should've been to defend Hedo - I was watching basketball back then, so I'm aware of what happened more than you

Lebron failed to defend any of the frontcourt players that were having the most damage, and instead defended the unimpactful guards like Courtney Lee or the playground point guard from AND1... aka the easiest assignment

Ultimately, Lebron ran from his defensive duty and made a bad decision to undertake those assignments, while employing an inferior offensive strategy (westbrooking, weak ball movement) - consequently, the Magic won as historic underdogs

You’ve gone from spewing wacky nonsense to just blatant falsehoods. Are we witnessing your true dissent now?

[SaintzFury13]

Lebron failed at whatever his assignment was in that series, and it should've been to defend Hedo - I was watching basketball back then, so I'm aware of what happened more than you

You didn't even know who LeBron was guarding in that series until I corrected you on it.

[TheCorporation]

LeBron averaged 39/8/8 in that series & still holds the greatest peak postseason PER in history. You want him to clamp the other teams "heart and soul" too? Who do you think he is, Superman?


Double


Why didn’t MJ shut down Bird when he was going 1-9?

Slay

[Phoenix]

Yea but why didn’t MJ shut down Bird when he was going 1-9?

3ball? You plan on answering this anytime soon? And not with the non-reply you tried to slip through last time.

[TheCorporation]

He doesn’t care about MJ, he’s a Kobe stan. MJ is a shield.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?496852-3ball-slips-up-reveals-self-to-be-a-butthurt-Kobe-stan-just-using-MJ-to-attack-LBJ

https://i.postimg.cc/85QGMVWq/12be-Does-Not-Belong.png

[Shogon]

Yes, clearly, Michael Jordan would have carried the Cavs to a championship that year. So would Kobe.

Never mind the fact that neither of these guys would have won 66 ****ing games and wouldn't have made it that deep into the postseason with that roster to begin with, but, yeah... they would have won that series, and the title and all.

Damn. What a loser LeBron is for someone supposedly so great.

:roll:

****ing garbo player. Barely top 30 ever tbh.

[SouBeachTalents]

Start of the NFL season, historic tennis match on earlier this afternoon, and most likely a beautiful day outside where he lives, and 3ball opts to log onto ISH, make SEVERAL more LeBron topics and posts, only to get shat on by everybody in the thread :lol Dude is an absolute glutton for punishment

[RRR3]

Start of the NFL season, historic tennis match on earlier this afternoon, and most likely a beautiful day outside where he lives, and 3ball opts to log onto ISH, make SEVERAL more LeBron topics and posts, only to get shat on by everybody in the thread :lol Dude is an absolute glutton for punishment
Since he’s been exposed as a Kobe stan he’s gotten noticeably worse. He’s desperate now.

[DoctorP]

Great points by OP. LeBron didn't beat ORL so he is open for criticism. LeBron realized he couldn't do it alone and left but he also did use some suspect strategy along the way. I guess you blame the coach for not adjusting, ultimately.

[Phoenix]

Start of the NFL season, historic tennis match on earlier this afternoon, and most likely a beautiful day outside where he lives, and 3ball opts to log onto ISH, make SEVERAL more LeBron topics and posts, only to get shat on by everybody in the thread :lol Dude is an absolute glutton for punishment

Fukk I completely was tuned out of the U.S Open this year :banghead:.

[jbryan1984]

We were out matched in the playoffs. Simple as that. Sure, we had them beat at small forward but they were better than us in every other position. This was one of the first pre-Warriors teams to shoot threes like this. Hedo, Lewis, Nelson, Rafer Alston was on that team. Pietrus. And people forget how good Dwight was back then. A double double machine. He tried to double team him too much, which always left a guy open. If we played man to man, Dwight would abuse Wallace, Z and Varejao everytime.

So we went out and got (even at 38 years old) the only guy who was big enough to at least slow him down, and this time we dont even make it to face Orlando and Boston does the same thing. Rondo was the killer in that series though. No answer for him what so ever.

[RogueBorg]

We were out matched in the playoffs. Simple as that. Sure, we had them beat at small forward but they were better than us in every other position. This was one of the first pre-Warriors teams to shoot threes like this. Hedo, Lewis, Nelson, Rafer Alston was on that team. Pietrus. And people forget how good Dwight was back then. A double double machine. He tried to double team him too much, which always left a guy open. If we played man to man, Dwight would abuse Wallace, Z and Varejao everytime.

So we went out and got (even at 38 years old) the only guy who was big enough to at least slow him down, and this time we dont even make it to face Orlando and Boston does the same thing. Rondo was the killer in that series though. No answer for him what so ever.

Everyone says Lebron can guard 1-5...he can't guard real centers puhlease.

[jbryan1984]

Dwight in his prime he couldnt. Dwight was bigger. Honestly, not much of anyone in the league at that time could guard Dwight.

[RogueBorg]

Iirc, didn't Bosh abuse Dwight on more than once occasion?

[ScottieQuitting]

Yea but why didn’t MJ shut down Bird when he was going 1-9?

Bird is 6’10 / 6’11 and is basically a stretch 4.

Mike was a 6’6 shooting guard. That’s like a 4-5 inch difference.

LeBron is 6’8 / 6’9 and Hedo is 6’9 / 6’10.

They’re closer in position and stature than the dumb ass comparison you just made.

[Hey Yo]

Lebron failed at whatever his assignment was in that series, and it should've been to defend Hedo - I was watching basketball back then, so I'm aware of what happened more than you

Lebron failed to defend any of the frontcourt players that were having the most damage, and instead defended the unimpactful guards like Courtney Lee or the playground point guard from AND1... aka the easiest assignment

Ultimately, Lebron ran from his defensive duty and made a bad decision to undertake those assignments, while employing an inferior offensive strategy (westbrooking, weak ball movement) - consequently, the Magic won as historic underdogs

04 Pistons were bigger underdogs against LA than Magic against Cavs.

Your boy Kobe ****ed up big time in that series.

[Hey Yo]

Bird is 6’10 / 6’11 and is basically a stretch 4.

Mike was a 6’6 shooting guard. That’s like a 4-5 inch difference.

LeBron is 6’8 / 6’9 and Hedo is 6’9 / 6’10.

They’re closer in position and stature than the dumb ass comparison you just made.

Bird has always been listed as 6'9

[j3lademaster]

When you have a guy who's good defending on-ball and off-ball you put him on the weaker assignment and let him play safety. Especially if that guy also drives your offense. Lebron could go on the toughest assignment against teams who only have that one offensive force(D-Rose Bulls in 2011), but it's not like Hedo was lighting the world on fire that series. His best game where he dropped 29 Orlando lost.

[SaintzFury13]

When you have a guy who's good defending on-ball and off-ball you put him on the weaker assignment and let him play safety. Especially if that guy also drives your offense. Lebron could go on the toughest assignment against teams who only have that one offensive force(D-Rose Bulls in 2011), but it's not like Hedo was lighting the world on fire that series. His best game where he dropped 29 Orlando lost.

That isn't even really what happened though. LeBron's main assignment was Alston and that was to force Orlando to run their offense unconventionally because they knew there would be major mismatches all series long so they had to force Orlando to think outside the box. This actually worked in the first two games but on both occasions, their shooters caught fire and they easily found Howard down low when Cleveland was forced to give more attention to the perimeter. By the time game 3 rolled around, Orlando started forcing even more mismatches by putting West in situations where he had to guard Hedo, which allowed him to run the offense more effectively.

It amazes me how there are people who try to use the Magic/Cavs series to discredit LeBron. The series had no business being as close as it was and the only reason it was is entirely due to LeBron.

[j3lademaster]

That isn't even really what happened though. LeBron's main assignment was Alston and that was to force Orlando to run their offense unconventionally because they knew there would be major mismatches all series long so they had to force Orlando to think outside the box. This actually worked in the first two games but on both occasions, their shooters caught fire and they easily found Howard down low when Cleveland was forced to give more attention to the perimeter. By the time game 3 rolled around, Orlando started forcing even more mismatches by putting West in situations where he had to guard Hedo, which allowed him to run the offense more effectively.

It amazes me how there are people who try to use the Magic/Cavs series to discredit LeBron. The series had no business being as close as it was and the only reason it was is entirely due to LeBron.That's true. good insight.

[MadDog]

That isn't even really what happened though. LeBron's main assignment was Alston and that was to force Orlando to run their offense unconventionally because they knew there would be major mismatches all series long so they had to force Orlando to think outside the box. This actually worked in the first two games but on both occasions, their shooters caught fire and they easily found Howard down low when Cleveland was forced to give more attention to the perimeter. By the time game 3 rolled around, Orlando started forcing even more mismatches by putting West in situations where he had to guard Hedo, which allowed him to run the offense more effectively.

It amazes me how there are people who try to use the Magic/Cavs series to discredit LeBron. The series had no business being as close as it was and the only reason it was is entirely due to LeBron.

LeBron still holds the record PER(among perimeter players) & BPM in that playoffs. He averaged near 40 in the Orlando series, so no difference there. Don't know why OP expected LeBron to shutdown Orlando's best players. This isn't a Marvel movie.

[SaintzFury13]

LeBron still holds the record PER(among perimeter players) & BPM in that playoffs. He averaged near 40 in the Orlando series, so no difference there. Don't know why OP expected LeBron to shutdown Orlando's best players. This isn't a Marvel movie.

The only thing that I guess you can use against LeBron is his game 6 performance, where he did underperform down the stretch. The only reason I give him a pass for that is because that doesn't come close to erasing what LeBron was doing in the previous five games where it was a literal carry job from top to bottom. His game 6 performance wasn't even necessarily a bad one. It just doesn't compare with the rest of his games which were all basically god tier.

[HylianNightmare]

Dwight was cooking anyone on that cavs team up. He got spoonfed allot but they could also just dump it down low and Dwight had a handful of moves that worked well against any defense the cavs could throw at him

[ScottieQuitting]

Bird has always been listed as 6'9
So was Kevin Durant. And KG. Both were of near 7 footers.

Magic was listed as 6’9, too.

Look at this team photo

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nba/news/dream-team-roster-history-usa-1992-olympics/4o78v2slilky1inrskk8h6wkb

Bird is way way taller than Mike. And even a whole half a forehead taller than Magic. And yet they’re both listed at 6’9? :oldlol:

Magic looks about 3 inches taller than Mike. Larry Legend looks a solid 4 - 5 inches taller. Bird was more like 6’10 or 6’11.

[Sportal]

He was an 8 seed and massive underdog against a goat team, while the 09' Cavs were the league favorite and Magic were a historic underdog

Only Lebron lost as the favorite or to 1-star teams... The goat never did

Were they? What was the line for the Cavs vs Magic series?

[SaintzFury13]

Were they? What was the line for the Cavs vs Magic series?

He's not going to. He knows just as well as the rest of us that the Magic were not "historic underdogs" by any stretch of the imagination. Underdogs? Sure. But this wasn't a case of Cleveland being stacked with talent. They didn't even have more all star talent than the Magic did. And not to mention they won the regular season series against Cleveland.

[Shogon]

He's not going to. He knows just as well as the rest of us that the Magic were not "historic underdogs" by any stretch of the imagination. Underdogs? Sure. But this wasn't a case of Cleveland being stacked with talent. They didn't even have more all star talent than the Magic did. And not to mention they won the regular season series against Cleveland.

The Magic definitely weren't massive underdogs... they were the #1 defensive team in the entire league.

[hateraid]

MJ had to switch off Magic and assigned Pippen to gaurd him for their first championship.

[DoctorP]

MJ had to switch off Magic and assigned Pippen to gaurd him for their first championship.

Yeah but the Bulls won.

[ScottieQuitting]

MJ had to switch off Magic and assigned Pippen to gaurd him for their first championship.

Mike actually guarded him for a larger percentage of the series than Scottie did. People almost exclusively refer to the first game where they had Pippen defend him for the vast majority of the game, which was game 2.