KD can't win with his sidekick at 17/8/8 on 50% TS, but MJ three-peated with that

[3ba11]

.
2022 Harden Regular Season'... 17.3... 7.0... 8.3... 48% TS
96-98' Pippen Playoffs............... 17.6... 7.4... 5.0... 50% TS

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/hardeja01.html
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/pippesc01.html#1996-1998-sum:playoffs_per_game

[SouBeachTalents]

OP was slurping KD hard last playoffs, did a complete 180 as he does with virtually every player after the Nets lost :lol Let me guess, it's KD's fault when he averages 35/11/5 and drops an NBA record 48 in Game 7

[3ba11]

OP was slurping KD hard last playoffs, did a complete 180 as he does with virtually every player after the Nets lost :lol Let me guess, it's KD's fault when he averages 35/11/5 and drops an NBA record 48 in Game 7


I'm not knocking KD - I'm just showing how much better MJ was than today's best player

[AirBonner]

KD is a better 3pt shooter than MJ

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Kyle Lowry this season is averaging 7 points on 26% FG

[Im so nba'd out]

No one ever said kd is better than mj :oldlol:. This thread reeks of insecurity

[AirBonner]

No one ever said kd is better than mj :oldlol:. This thread reeks of insecurity

Because KD matches MJ from midrange and is exponentially better from 3pt land. He can’t cope

[3ba11]

No one ever said kd is better than mj :oldlol:. This thread reeks of insecurity


Many people say that KD is a comparable scorer to MJ, which doesn't consider the superior ad-hoc, off-the-cuff ability of MJ's scoring ability and superior instinct, pure scoring ability.. or his ability to overpower defenses physically via strength, hangtime or flying through the air and mitigating defenders.. also his elevation on jumpshots is unmatched in history

[Manny98]

This is psychotic levels of insecurity, literally nobody thinks that KD > MJ :lol

[3ba11]

This is psychotic levels of insecurity, literally nobody thinks that KD > MJ :lol


I have KD in my top 5 all-time


MJ
Kobe
Bird
KD
Giannis

[SouBeachTalents]

I have KD in my top 5 all-time


MJ
Kobe
Bird
KD
Giannis

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?494962-KD-Lebron-PG-whoever-they-only-learned-to-team-hop-not-actually-WIN-(organic)&p=14384069&viewfull=1#post14384069

Crazy how 3 of your top 5 are completely different, and how Durant & Giannis went from outside the top 10 to top 5 in one week of basketball.

[8Ball]

3ball top 5 today:


MJ
Kobe
Bird
KD
Giannis


Just a few months ago:

1) MJ
2) Wilt
3) Bird
4) Russell
5) Kareem


https://c.tenor.com/ukWX9Mben44AAAAM/bull-shit.gif

[8Ball]

I have KD in my top 5 all-time


MJ
Kobe
Bird
KD
Giannis


My top 10 is mostly based on guys that learned to WIN (organic), with few exception:


1) MJ
2) Wilt
3) Bird
4) Russell
5) Kareem


Gonna screen shot this. :roll:

[3ba11]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?494962-KD-Lebron-PG-whoever-they-only-learned-to-team-hop-not-actually-WIN-(organic)&p=14384069&viewfull=1#post14384069

Crazy how 3 of your top 5 are completely different, and how Durant & Giannis went from outside the top 10 to top 5 in one week of basketball.


Yes I decided that I couldn't deny the historical record anymore - centers and ball-dominators simply need a lot more help than on-ball/off-ball assassin scorers (elite jumpshooting skill) that fit with everyone and allow the bed strategy (ball movement), which ultimately yields the highest team ceilings/Finals record

So centers and ball-dominators aren't in my top 6

[8Ball]

Yes I decided that I couldn't deny the historical record anymore - centers and ball-dominators simply need a lot more help than on-ball/off-ball assassin scorers (elite jumpshooting skill) that fit with everyone and allow the bed strategy (ball movement), which ultimately yields the highest team ceilings/Finals record

So you were wrong for years about everything. Got it. :lol

[HBK_Kliq_2]

I have KD in my top 5 all-time


MJ
Kobe
Bird
KD
Giannis

https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2019-nba-eastern-conference-finals-raptors-vs-bucks.html

role player derek fisher lowry as 2nd option

[8Ball]

I have KD in my top 5 all-time


MJ
Kobe
Bird
KD
Giannis


giannis must dribble slowly like a beginner before taking any jumpshot

he sucks


https://c.tenor.com/nmk1aE7XnxwAAAAd/laughing-hysterically-thats-funny.gif

[3ba11]

So you were wrong for years about everything. Got it. :lol


I just hadn't properly evaluated the historical record, as you haven't.

Kareem needed the #1 and #2 point guards ever to win, otherwise he was getting smashed every year badly - ditto Shaq, who had 1 seeds with Penny, Wade, Kobe and Lebron (most help ever).. Meanwhile, Russell needed 8 HOF teammates.. These centers need insane help despite their physical advantage.

Similarly, ball-dominators need super-teams to win, yet Magic/Lebron still go 9-10 in the Finals (confirming that ball-dominance yields lower team ceilings).

Otoh, assassin scorers with elite jumpshooting skill can win with a non-super-team and no 1b (equal-scoring partner) - this is the highest quality ring (19' Kawhi, MJ, 09-10' Kobe).. the jumpshooting skill and on-ball/off-ball ability fits with all player types and allows the best strategy for the highest team ceilings/Finals record.

[SouBeachTalents]

https://i.ibb.co/Vv2QrQC/Screenshot-2021-07-20-180658.png

Giannis went from "absolute trash" to top 5 all time in just one year

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-_PLLVhFgJF4/VdMrrpv0ZXI/AAAAAAAATRM/cKxfSA7qbjg/s1600/impressive-very-nice.gif

[3ba11]

https://c.tenor.com/nmk1aE7XnxwAAAAd/laughing-hysterically-thats-funny.gif


#6 is Giannis, and Kawhi is 5

a typo

Btw, those posts were before Giannis won organically in the team-hopping era as a legit guard-center

[3ba11]

https://i.ibb.co/Vv2QrQC/Screenshot-2021-07-20-180658.png

Giannis went from "absolute trash" to top 5 all time in just one year

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-_PLLVhFgJF4/VdMrrpv0ZXI/AAAAAAAATRM/cKxfSA7qbjg/s1600/impressive-very-nice.gif


Those posts were before Giannis won organically in the team-hopping era as a legit guard-center, and I apologized to Giannis in it's own thread.

Ultimately, Giannis learned to operate closer to the basket and let the perimeter guys play to capacity on the perimeter - so he knows how to get the maximum out of perimeter players, which was part of his organic learning curve

Otoh, Lebron's super-teams from 11-16' were so unfair, that KD had to team-up with Curry/Klay to overcome them - so he didn't get to finish climbing the organic learning curve and therefore only knows how to team-hop - he doesn't know how to WIN (organic).

Since Giannis climbed the organic learning curve and learned to WIN (organic), he's superior to anyone that only knows how to team-hop (Lebron)

[HBK_Kliq_2]

https://c.tenor.com/nmk1aE7XnxwAAAAd/laughing-hysterically-thats-funny.gif

2-0 without lebron this season

1-2 with lebron this season

Is that what's so funny? :(

[AirBonner]

It’s weird because Hakeem did what Giannis did twice. Yet no top 5 hmm

[j3lademaster]

Those posts were before Giannis won organically in the team-hopping era as a legit guard-center, and I apologized to Giannis in it's own thread.

Ultimately, Giannis learned to operate closer to the basket and let the perimeter guys play to capacity on the perimeter - so he knows how to get the maximum out of perimeter players, which was part of his organic learning curve

Otoh, Lebron's super-teams from 11-16' were so unfair, that KD had to team-up with Curry/Klay to overcome them - so he didn't get to finish climbing the organic learning curve and therefore only knows how to team-hop - he doesn't know how to WIN (organic).

Since Giannis climbed the organic learning curve and learned to WIN (organic), he's superior to anyone that only knows how to team-hop (Lebron)Why do you put team hopping KD over Organic title Giannis?

[SouBeachTalents]

It’s weird because Hakeem did what Giannis did twice. Yet no top 5 hmm
And he didn't need the entire league to get injured either

[j3lademaster]

And he didn't need the entire league to get injured eitherHe's going to say one season of no MJ and another of a rusty MJ. But in actuality propping up Hakeem as a top 4 or 5 all time would just make that era look better, and thus MJ's competition.

[Bronbron23]

.
2022 Harden Regular Season'... 17.3... 7.0... 8.3... 48% TS
96-98' Pippen Playoffs............... 17.6... 7.4... 5.0... 50% TS

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/hardeja01.html
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/pippesc01.html#1996-1998-sum:playoffs_per_game

His side kick isn't one of the best defenders ever

[ShawkFactory]

What does “can’t win” mean? You’re talking the first 4 games of this regular season after a deep playoff run and playing in the olympics on a shortened offseason?

Confused

[ELITEpower23]

https://i.ibb.co/Vv2QrQC/Screenshot-2021-07-20-180658.png

Giannis went from "absolute trash" to top 5 all time in just one year

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-_PLLVhFgJF4/VdMrrpv0ZXI/AAAAAAAATRM/cKxfSA7qbjg/s1600/impressive-very-nice.gif

It's over :oldlol: 3ball has ZERO credibility.

[RRR3]

I have KD in my top 5 all-time


MJ
Kobe
Bird
KD
Giannis
Worst top 5 I’ve ever seen.

[hold this L]

https://i.ibb.co/Vv2QrQC/Screenshot-2021-07-20-180658.png

Giannis went from "absolute trash" to top 5 all time in just one year

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-_PLLVhFgJF4/VdMrrpv0ZXI/AAAAAAAATRM/cKxfSA7qbjg/s1600/impressive-very-nice.gif

Poor 2ball, he didn't take his medication before cliking post again


It's over :oldlol: 3ball has ZERO credibility.

He never did.

[3ba11]

His side kick isn't one of the best defenders ever


Scoring is what determines if a player is 2nd option - without sufficient scoring, the player is just a defensive role player..

15.7 on 40% is defensive role player stats and Pippen averaged that in 2 Finals... 17 on 41% for the entire 96-98' Playoffs..

And Pippen's standard wasn't a top 5 DPOY defender - he was only top 5 DPOY twice, while MJ was top 5 DPOY from 88-98' (and scoring champ, aka the top caliber that anyone ever reached)

[ShawkFactory]

Love this dude trying to jump through hoops with the verbiage.

A second option is the second best scorer. A side kick is the second best player. Those are not always the same person.

[8Ball]

I just hadn't properly evaluated the historical record, as you haven't.

Kareem needed the #1 and #2 point guards ever to win, otherwise he was getting smashed every year badly - ditto Shaq, who had 1 seeds with Penny, Wade, Kobe and Lebron (most help ever).. Meanwhile, Russell needed 8 HOF teammates.. These centers need insane help despite their physical advantage.

Similarly, ball-dominators need super-teams to win, yet Magic/Lebron still go 9-10 in the Finals (confirming that ball-dominance yields lower team ceilings).

Otoh, assassin scorers with elite jumpshooting skill can win with a non-super-team and no 1b (equal-scoring partner) - this is the highest quality ring (19' Kawhi, MJ, 09-10' Kobe).. the jumpshooting skill and on-ball/off-ball ability fits with all player types and allows the best strategy for the highest team ceilings/Finals record.


I have KD in my top 5 all-time

MJ
Kobe
Bird
KD
Giannis


https://i.ibb.co/Vv2QrQC/Screenshot-2021-07-20-180658.png

https://c.tenor.com/nmk1aE7XnxwAAAAd/laughing-hysterically-thats-funny.gif