Which Pippen Championship run was worse than 2013 Wade?

[Pip' N Rodman]

And which Pippen Finals performance was worse than 2014 Wade? :confusedshrug:

[ImKobe]

All of them.

[000]

All of them.

[Johnny32]

91 - 21, 9, 7
92 - 21, 8, 8
93 - 21, 9, 8
96 - 16, 8, 5
97 - 20, 8, 4
98 - 16, 7, 5

13 - 20, 5, 4
14 - 15, 4, 3

[Johnny32]

when comparing second option help is hard to do across eras. the 90s was low scoring. pippen was the better second option compared to the opp's second option in every finals series besides sea.

in 2014 sas had 3 maybe even 4 players who had a better series than wade.

[Blazers32]

You Need to adjust scoring based on eras

[Johnny32]

You Need to adjust scoring based on eras

that's why the only way to compare is vs their opp's help.

pip - 21, 9, 7. he was better than magic let alone the lakers second option.
pip - 21, 8, 8. porter - 16, 5, 4.
pip - 21, 9, 8. kj - 17, 6, 3.
pip - 16, 8, 5. gp - 18, 7, 6.
pip - 20, 8, 4. stockton - 15, 9, 4.
pip - 16, 7, 5. hornacek - 11, 3, 3.

wade - 20, 5, 4. parker - 16, 6, 2
wade - 15, 4, 3. kawhi - 18, 6, 2. td - 15, 10, 2.

[Johnny32]

once again for the slow kids. comparing help across eras is impossible for multiple reasons. we can only compare jordan's help vs his opponents help. same for lebron.

[FultzNationRISE]

once again for the slow kids. comparing help across eras is impossible for multiple reasons. we can only compare jordan's help vs his opponents help. same for lebron.

So what youre saying is MJ had more and better help than LeLoneRanger?

[3ba11]

.
PLAYOFFS


13' Lebron..... 28.1 PER.... 11.7 BPM... 3.0 VORP... 0.260 WS/48... 25.9 ppg
13' Wade....... 18.7 PER...... 3.1 BPM... 1.0 VORP... 0.108 WS/48... 15.9 ppg
GAP.................. 9.4.............8.6........... 2.0............ 0.152........ 10.0

93' Jordan...... 30.1 PER... 11.6 BPM... 2.9 VORP... 0.270 WS/48... 35.1 ppg
93' Pippen...... 16.9 PER..... 2.0 BPM... 0.8 VORP... 0.083 WS/48... 20.1 ppg
GAP.................. 13.2.......... 9.6........... 2.1............ 0.187........ 15.0

94' Hakeem.... 27.7 PER.... 8.5 BPM... 2.6 VORP... 0.208 WS/48... 28.9 ppg
94' Horry........ 16.7 PER.... 5.0 BPM... 1.4 VORP... 0.152 WS/48... 13.8 ppg*
GAP.................. 11.0...........3.5........... 1.2............ 0.056......... 15.1

11' Dirk........... 25.2 PER... 5.5 BPM... 1.6 VORP... 0.210 WS/48... 27.7 ppg
11' Terry.......... 20.3 PER... 4.6 BPM... 1.1 VORP... 0.179 WS/48... 17.5 ppg
GAP................... 4.9............1.1........... 0.5............ 0.031......... 10.2

92' Jordan...... 27.2 PER.... 9.9 BPM... 2.8 VORP... 0.216 WS/48... 34.5 ppg
92' Pippen...... 20.1 PER.... 6.6 BPM... 2.0 VORP... 0.168 WS/48... 19.5 ppg
GAP.................. 7.1............ 3.3............ 0.8............ 0.048........ 15.0

91' Jordan...... 32.0 PER... 14.6 BPM... 2.9 VORP... 0.333 WS/48... 31.1 ppg
91' Pippen...... 22.0 PER..... 6.5 BPM... 1.5 VORP... 0.197 WS/48... 21.6 ppg
GAP.................. 10.0........... 8.1........... 1.4............ 0.136......... 9.5

96' Jordan...... 26.7 PER... 10.7 BPM... 2.4 VORP.. 0.317 WS/48... 30.7 ppg
96' Pippen...... 19.4 PER..... 7.8 BPM... 1.8 VORP.. 0.195 WS/48... 16.9 ppg
GAP................... 7.3........... 2.9............ 0.6............ 0.122........ 13.8

97' Jordan...... 27.1 PER.... 9.9 BPM... 2.4 VORP... 0.235 WS/48... 31.1 ppg
97' Pippen...... 18.1 PER.... 5.1 BPM... 1.4 VORP... 0.145 WS/48... 19.2 ppg
GAP.................. 9.1........... 4.8............ 1.0............ 0.090......... 11.9

98' Jordan...... 28.1 PER.... 9.0 BPM... 2.4 VORP... 0.265 WS/48... 32.4 ppg
98' Pippen...... 19.4 PER.... 5.6 BPM... 1.6 VORP... 0.166 WS/48... 16.8 ppg
GAP.................. 8.7........... 3.4............ 0.8............ 0.095......... 16.4


* Vernon Maxwell was the Rockets' 2nd leading scorer, so his PPG was used


MJ is #1 all-time in PPG, PER, WS/48, and other key stats while Pippen ranks about 120th in these areas - so there's never been a bigger statistical gap between 1st and 2nd option..

Jordan led Pippen by 10-30 ppg in every series of their career, while everyone else in history needed teammates to match them or lead in scoring for entire playoff runs - i.e. Wade and AD led Lebron in PPG for the 11' and 20' Playoffs, while Kyrie nearly matched Lebron in the 2016 Playoffs.. These equal-scoring partners attract equal defensive attention, so only MJ faced 1-man team defensive coverage for his entire career, as Kenny Smith points out here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4UF6Xx3F2Lo&t=114s).

[LeCola]

All of them.

MJ > Wade > Pippen > ....... > Tacko Fall > Lebron

[000]

.
PLAYOFFS


13' Lebron..... 28.1 PER.... 11.7 BPM... 3.0 VORP... 0.260 WS/48... 25.9 ppg
13' Wade....... 18.7 PER...... 3.1 BPM... 1.0 VORP... 0.108 WS/48... 15.9 ppg
GAP.................. 9.4.............8.6........... 2.0............ 0.152........ 10.0

93' Jordan...... 30.1 PER... 11.6 BPM... 2.9 VORP... 0.270 WS/48... 35.1 ppg
93' Pippen...... 16.9 PER..... 2.0 BPM... 0.8 VORP... 0.083 WS/48... 20.1 ppg
GAP.................. 13.2.......... 9.6........... 2.1............ 0.187........ 15.0

94' Hakeem.... 27.7 PER.... 8.5 BPM... 2.6 VORP... 0.208 WS/48... 28.9 ppg
94' Horry........ 16.7 PER.... 5.0 BPM... 1.4 VORP... 0.152 WS/48... 13.8 ppg*
GAP.................. 11.0...........3.5........... 1.2............ 0.056......... 15.1

11' Dirk........... 25.2 PER... 5.5 BPM... 1.6 VORP... 0.210 WS/48... 27.7 ppg
11' Terry.......... 20.3 PER... 4.6 BPM... 1.1 VORP... 0.179 WS/48... 17.5 ppg
GAP................... 4.9............1.1........... 0.5............ 0.031......... 10.2

92' Jordan...... 27.2 PER.... 9.9 BPM... 2.8 VORP... 0.216 WS/48... 34.5 ppg
92' Pippen...... 20.1 PER.... 6.6 BPM... 2.0 VORP... 0.168 WS/48... 19.5 ppg
GAP.................. 7.1............ 3.3............ 0.8............ 0.048........ 15.0

91' Jordan...... 32.0 PER... 14.6 BPM... 2.9 VORP... 0.333 WS/48... 31.1 ppg
91' Pippen...... 22.0 PER..... 6.5 BPM... 1.5 VORP... 0.197 WS/48... 21.6 ppg
GAP.................. 10.0........... 8.1........... 1.4............ 0.136......... 9.5

96' Jordan...... 26.7 PER... 10.7 BPM... 2.4 VORP.. 0.317 WS/48... 30.7 ppg
96' Pippen...... 19.4 PER..... 7.8 BPM... 1.8 VORP.. 0.195 WS/48... 16.9 ppg
GAP................... 7.3........... 2.9............ 0.6............ 0.122........ 13.8

97' Jordan...... 27.1 PER.... 9.9 BPM... 2.4 VORP... 0.235 WS/48... 31.1 ppg
97' Pippen...... 18.1 PER.... 5.1 BPM... 1.4 VORP... 0.145 WS/48... 19.2 ppg
GAP.................. 9.1........... 4.8............ 1.0............ 0.090......... 11.9

98' Jordan...... 28.1 PER.... 9.0 BPM... 2.4 VORP... 0.265 WS/48... 32.4 ppg
98' Pippen...... 19.4 PER.... 5.6 BPM... 1.6 VORP... 0.166 WS/48... 16.8 ppg
GAP.................. 8.7........... 3.4............ 0.8............ 0.095......... 16.4


* Vernon Maxwell was the Rockets' 2nd leading scorer, so his PPG was used


MJ is #1 all-time in PPG, PER, WS/48, and other key stats while Pippen ranks about 120th in these areas - so there's never been a bigger statistical gap between 1st and 2nd option..

Jordan led Pippen by 10-30 ppg in every series of their career, while everyone else in history needed teammates to match them or lead in scoring for entire playoff runs - i.e. Wade and AD led Lebron in PPG for the 11' and 20' Playoffs, while Kyrie nearly matched Lebron in the 2016 Playoffs.. These equal-scoring partners attract equal defensive attention, so only MJ faced 1-man team defensive coverage for his entire career, as Kenny Smith points out here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4UF6Xx3F2Lo&t=114s).
Wait a minute

[Johnny32]

lol mj fans are avoiding this like the plague.

pip - 21, 9, 7. he was better than magic let alone the lakers second option.
pip - 21, 8, 8. porter - 16, 5, 4.
pip - 21, 9, 8. kj - 17, 6, 3.
pip - 16, 8, 5. gp - 18, 7, 6.
pip - 20, 8, 4. stockton - 15, 9, 4.
pip - 16, 7, 5. hornacek - 11, 3, 3.

[2much_knowledge]

Does it matter? Its not just Wade. Its Wade AND Bosh

You can bet your A$$ Wade + Bosh > > > > Pippen

[Johnny32]

Does it matter? Its not just Wade. Its Wade AND Bosh

You can bet your A$$ Wade + Bosh > > > > Pippen

same bosh who dropped 0 points in gm 7 of the nba finals...that guy?

[2much_knowledge]

same bosh who dropped 0 points in gm 7 of the nba finals...that guy?


The same guy that rebounded that brick and got arguably the most important clutch assist of the decade.

Talking about combined averages. Not a bad single game

[dankok8]

1998 Pippen was worse than 2013 Wade IMO. The overall stats don't show it but Wade really stepped up in Game 7 of the ECF and the last four games of the finals when the Heat were in trouble and played like a bona fide star. In totality, he had a better run than Pip in 1998. 1996 Pip is also debatable. Pippen really struggled in those playoffs and especially in the finals against the Sonics which is the only series that the Bulls were challenged.

[2much_knowledge]

1998 Pippen was worse than 2013 Wade IMO. The overall stats don't show it but Wade really stepped up in Game 7 of the ECF and the last four games of the finals when the Heat were in trouble and played like a bona fide star. In totality, he had a better run than Pip in 1998. 1996 Pip is also debatable. Pippen really struggled in those playoffs and especially in the finals against the Sonics which is the only series that the Bulls were challenged.

Well op , your question has been answered. So theres no need to wait a month and log into an alt and bump it asking like an idiot... anyone??? When its already answered

[3ba11]

lol mj fans are avoiding this like the plague.

pip - 21, 9, 7. he was better than magic let alone the lakers second option.
pip - 21, 8, 8. porter - 16, 5, 4.
pip - 21, 9, 8. kj - 17, 6, 3.
pip - 16, 8, 5. gp - 18, 7, 6.
pip - 20, 8, 4. stockton - 15, 9, 4.
pip - 16, 7, 5. hornacek - 11, 3, 3.


No one commented on it because those things don't compare to outplaying the only unanimous MVP in league history (Kyrie destroys Curry), or outplaying the MVP in 2011 (Bosh destroys Rose), or outplaying the future MVP in 2020 (AD dominates Jokic)..

And no one thinks Pippen was anywhere near Magic, who the scouting report was based around, while Pippen wasn't on the scouting report and lived off the attention paid to MJ.

Ultimately, Pippen averaged 20 and 3 APG in the 97' Finals (on 42%), so he was outplayed by Stockton, who tripled Pippen's assists and scored like MJ in the clutch (he nearly matched Jordan's 22 clutch points), while Pippen didn't score in the clutch (4 points for the series).. And of course Pippen was horrible in the 96' and 98' Finals (15.7 on 40%).. Finally, Majerle had higher gamescore in the 93' Finals as Pippen shot 45% true shooting and forced MJ to average 41, while letting rookie Dumas achieve 14' Kawhi stats (16 on 57%) and win Game 5 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyzIKvx9gmk&t=460s)..

So Pippen only had 2 decent Finals (91' and 92') but it's funny because the 91' Finals showed Pippen committing a dumb foul against a stumbling Vlade at the end of Game 3 to lose that game, except MJ hit the game-tying shot and then took over the OT.. So even the few series where Pippen played okay, he still had the choke-factor that nearly causes loss.. If MJ doesn't save the day, then Game 3 would be looked at as another historic choke for Pippen's long list.

[Johnny32]

The same guy that rebounded that brick and got arguably the most important clutch assist of the decade.

Talking about combined averages. Not a bad single game

great point. cuz grant/rodman never rebounded.

fun fact: lebron led all 4 of his championship teams in points, rebounds, and assists in the nba finals. jordan managed to do this 0 times in 6 appearances.

hurrr, more halp, durrr

[2much_knowledge]

great point. cuz grant/rodman never rebounded.

fun fact: lebron led all 4 of his championship teams in points, rebounds, and assists in the nba finals. jordan managed to do this 0 times in 6 appearances.

hurrr, more halp, durrr

The point of basketball is winning. Not stuffing the stat sheet. You must be a masive Westbrook fan aren't you

Triangle offense is not ment for any guard to average high numbers of assists or rebounds. Name me a guard ever under Phil Jackson's system with high number of assist averages or rebounds.

That's to lebron's all downfall. Tryna handle the ball all the time and pimping stats doesn't cut it in championship basketball, no matter how pretty it looks.

If he would let others do thier job more to their strengths, maybe he would be at least 5/10

[Johnny32]

thanks for admitting lebron's role on his championship teams was far greater than jordan's. you can blame this on whatever you like it doesn't really matter.

[ELITEpower23]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

Anybody?

[Hey Yo]

thanks for admitting lebron's role on his championship teams was far greater than jordan's. you can blame this on whatever you like it doesn't really matter.

2dumb_destroyed :oldlol:

[2much_knowledge]

https://i.postimg.cc/1RVSY1bd/Pippen-Wade.png

Anybody?

Why are 2011 and 2012 seasons missing???? Why, why, why??? WHY?



WHY????

[2much_knowledge]

thanks for admitting lebron's role on his championship teams was far greater than jordan's. you can blame this on whatever you like it doesn't really matter.

Call it all you want. A couple of extra assist and rebounds won't change the fact that his resume is wayyyy behind even playing 4 extra seasons and with more allstar help

Maybe by season 26 he will catch up

[2much_knowledge]

2dumb_destroyed :oldlol:

Spoken too soon Ramón

[Johnny32]

this topic is about championship runs. i understand your need to desperately deflect though. you got shit on pretty badly.

[2much_knowledge]

this topic is about championship runs. i understand your need to desperately deflect though. you got shit on pretty badly.

Im responding to that grafic in red and green. If it is about championship runs, then you should let him know that 2011 - 12 season is missing and that was a championship run ;)

Let him know!

[Axe]

Pippen averaged more ppg in the 1991 finals than kobe did in the 2000 finals.

[kawhileonard2]

All of them.

This! Pippen never had a Finals MVP.

[TheGoatest]

Wade's 2013 15.9 ppg playoff run, without any other notable stats to compensate for this low ppg, is easily worse than any of Pippen's playoff runs.

Wade's 15.9 ppg run should be compared to 1975 Jamaal Wilkes, 1994 Vernon Maxwell and 2003 Tony Parker 2nd option playoff runs, not the legendary Scottie Pippen.

[ImKobe]

Wade's 2013 15.9 ppg playoff run, without any other notable stats to compensate for this low ppg, is easily worse than any of Pippen's playoff runs.

Wade's 15.9 ppg run should be compared to 1975 Jamaal Wilkes, 1994 Vernon Maxwell and 2003 Tony Parker 2nd option playoff runs, not the legendary Scottie Pippen.


https://youtu.be/VQsNbxLwSqQ

[TheGoatest]

https://youtu.be/VQsNbxLwSqQ


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BoLVF94FX1U

[ELITEpower23]

Why are 2011 and 2012 seasons missing???? Why, why, why??? WHY?



WHY????

Which Pippen Championship run was worse than 2013 Wade?

[2much_knowledge]

Which Pippen Championship run was worse than 2013 Wade?

Answer this first. Was Wade healthy in the 2013 finals? Yes or no? Don't remember