Top 50 All-Time List - Shot Clock Era = #48

[dankok8]

List

#1 - Michael Jordan
#2 - Lebron James
#3 - Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
#4 - Bill Russell
#5 - Wilt Chamberlain
#6 - Magic Johnson
#7 - Shaquille O'Neal
#8 - Tim Duncan
#9 - Larry Bird
#10 - Hakeem Olajuwon
#11 - Kobe Bryant
#12 - Stephen Curry
#13 - Oscar Robertson
#14 - Jerry West
#15 - Moses Malone
#16 - Julius Erving
#17 - Kevin Durant
#18 - Kevin Garnett
#19 - Karl Malone
#20 - Dirk Nowitzki
#21 - Charles Barkley
#22 - David Robinson
#23 - Dwyane Wade
#24 - Elgin Baylor
#25 - Scottie Pippen
#26 - Giannis Antetokounmpo
#27 - John Havlicek
#28 - Isiah Thomas
#29 - Bob Pettit
#30 - Chris Paul
#31 - Kawhi Leonard
#32 - Rick Barry
#33 - James Harden
#34 - Patrick Ewing
#35 - Bob Cousy
#36 - John Stockton
#37 - Jason Kidd
#38 - Steve Nash
#39 - Willis Reed
#40 - Walt Frazier
#41 - Allen Iverson
#42 - Clyde Drexler
#43 - Russell Westbrook
#44 - Kevin McHale
#45 - Elvin Hayes
#46 - George Gervin
#47 - Gary Payton
#48 - VOTING NOW

Top 50 Player Pool

For an updated player pool and vote breakdowns see the link (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ARaI3VCNauULLYL1Yu24HIRY768FYQdip56sp6uRFGk/edit?usp=sharing).

Everyone may post in this thread but only votes from serious contributors will be considered. Not everyone has to write an essay but there should be some justification or explanation and some coherent arguments being presented. I encourage people to be open-minded and willing to adjust their rankings in response to strong evidence. Debate and discussion is encouraged.

Opening Vote Tally

Bill Walton - 7 (colts19, Round Mound, LBJ, Lebron_James, Go Getter, francesco totti, NIke D'Antoni)
Paul Pierce - 1 (fsvr54)
Ray Allen - 1 (Manny98)
Anthony Davis - 1 (000)
Damian Lilllard - 1 (blazers32)

[dankok8]

I'll go for Anthony Davis in this one. Walton has a better peak but Davis still crushes Walton in terms of longevity and has a pretty great peak himself.

[gonzaldo]

Dwight Howard. He was an obviously impactful player in his prime and is probably the biggest omission in NBA top 75 players, so let right this wrong. Had he played in the 90s, he probably would have less individual accolades, but he'll be seen as someone roughly at the level of Ewing - worse offence, but better defence and Ewing is in the list already.

[L.Kizzle]

I'll go for Anthony Davis in this one. Walton has a better peak but Davis still crushes Walton in terms of longevity and has a pretty great peak himself.
Never made it out of the first other then the season the Lakers won. Might as well vote for T-Mac here.

[RRR3]

Shit idfk at this point lmao. Is it too early for T-Mac? Probably, **** injuries man.

[fsvr54]

Paul Pierce

[Phoenix]

Dwight Howard. He was an obviously impactful player in his prime and is probably the biggest omission in NBA top 75 players, so let right this wrong. Had he played in the 90s, he probably would have less individual accolades, but he'll be seen as someone roughly at the level of Ewing - worse offence, but better defence and Ewing is in the list already.

I think he's closer to Zo level in the 90s, not intended as a knock, but a half notch below Ewing, and notch below Shaq/Hakeem/Robinson.

[SouBeachTalents]

Nique should make the top 50

7x All-NBA, was making some of the most stacked All-NBA Teams ever, even before there was a 3rd Team
Finished top 8 in MVP voting 5 times, including a 2nd place finish
Averaged 28 ppg on 54%TS over a 10 year period

[fsvr54]

Nique should make the top 50

7x All-NBA, was making some of the most stacked All-NBA Teams ever, even before there was a 3rd Team
Finished top 8 in MVP voting 5 times, including a 2nd place finish
Averaged 28 ppg on 54%TS over a 10 year period

I think it should be Nique and Pierce for the next two spots and Walton 50th (but really Mitch Richmond)

[L.Kizzle]

Nique should make the top 50

7x All-NBA, was making some of the most stacked All-NBA Teams ever, even before there was a 3rd Team
Finished top 8 in MVP voting 5 times, including a 2nd place finish
Averaged 28 ppg on 54%TS over a 10 year period
I'd take about 20 players left over Nique.

[Reggie43]

Worthy

[1987_Lakers]

Pierce

[Phoenix]

I'd take about 20 players left over Nique.

:coleman:

[1987_Lakers]

I'd take about 20 players left over Nique.

Why? I'm not a huge fan of him, but taking 20 players who are left over him seems excessive.

[SouBeachTalents]

I'd take about 20 players left over Nique.
So Nique isn't top 70? That's garbage

[Blazers32]

I'll go for Anthony Davis in this one. Walton has a better peak but Davis still crushes Walton in terms of longevity and has a pretty great peak himself.

Davis done nothing without Lebron James. Lillard did aloooooooooot more with Blazers sorry ass roster than Davis did with Pelicans.
Davis is nothing without Lebron.

[dankok8]

Never made it out of the first other then the season the Lakers won. Might as well vote for T-Mac here.

Davis made the 2nd round in 2018. Each time he lost in the playoffs with the Pelicans he played the Warriors. How do you blame a guy for losing playing on those teams... the Pelicans sucked! The one year they could have made a run Cousins got hurt and DNP in the playoffs.

That would be like blaming KG for not winning in Minnesota... last time I checked KG is still a top 20 all timer and rightfully so. Davis is merely a top 50 all timer because he doesn't have KG's longevity.

[Blazers32]

Davis made the 2nd round in 2018. Each time he lost in the playoffs with the Pelicans he played the Warriors. How do you blame a guy for losing playing on those teams... the Pelicans sucked! The one year they could have made a run Cousins got hurt and DNP in the playoffs.

That would be like blaming KG for not winning in Minnesota... last time I checked KG is still a top 20 all timer and rightfully so. Davis is merely a top 50 all timer because he doesn't have KG's longevity.

By this logic, we might push for a case for Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love. Just because Lebron turned losers into winners.
KG much like Lillard with Portland made WCF with Minnesota in 2004!!!! And KG also won league MVP with Minnesota!

[L.Kizzle]

Davis made the 2nd round in 2018. Each time he lost in the playoffs with the Pelicans he played the Warriors. How do you blame a guy for losing playing on those teams... the Pelicans sucked! The one year they could have made a run Cousins got hurt and DNP in the playoffs.

That would be like blaming KG for not winning in Minnesota... last time I checked KG is still a top 20 all timer and rightfully so. Davis is merely a top 50 all timer because he doesn't have KG's longevity.
You're right. They beat Portland, I totally forgot about that series. Jrue sinned Dame Lillard that series.

[Phoenix]

Dwight Howard

[ELITEpower23]

Anthony Davis

Jesus based on what? :oldlol:

You'd put AD over D12? Career wise?

[Phoenix]

Jesus based on what? :oldlol:

You'd put AD over D12? Career wise?

To be perfectly frank, I'm nearing the don't give a fukk stage of this exercise. I didn't even vote 47. I had Dwight in my head, also had Nique, and Davis. Threw names up in the air, Davis landed. Ask me tomorrow, and my answer will be different. Doesn't really matter...

[Phoenix]

You know what Elite? In a rare moment of humility, you're right. I'll change my vote to D12 because I'm not married to voting for Brow here.

[dankok8]

Dwight vs AD is actually a pretty close comparison career-wise. You might be shocked to know that they made the same number of all-star games. Dwight hasn't been an all-star since 2014. Dwight has a few more All-NBA teams and both won a ring but AD won as a top dog and Dwight as a role player. I might give the edge to AD because I think peak AD is better than peak Dwight. Both can anchor a defense but Davis is much better on offense.

[Phoenix]

Dwight vs AD is actually a pretty close comparison career-wise. You might be shocked to know that they made the same number of all-star games. Dwight hasn't been an all-star since 2014. Dwight has a few more All-NBA teams and both won a ring but AD won as a top dog and Dwight as a role player. I might give the edge to AD because I think peak AD is better than peak Dwight. Both can anchor a defense but Davis is much better on offense.

The argument would be Dwights first 10 years versus ADs and I would take Dwight in that case. Regarding the context of their rings yes, AD won as a primary contributor but he wasn't doing anything special team-wise prior to being in LA and definitely doesn't have a chip otherwise. Dwight had better team success and while his 09 Magic may have been better than most of AD's teams, if AD was/is the more impactful player I think he could have squeezed a little more out of those Pelican squads. Right now AD is still writing his story and Dwight's is pretty much in stone, he's not going to do anything more legacy-wise.

[SouBeachTalents]

I think some combo of Nique/AD/Jokic/McGrady/Dwight should get the remaining spots

[fsvr54]

I think some combo of Nique/AD/Jokic/McGrady/Dwight should get the remaining spots

Paul Pierce, one of the clutchest of all time, all time leading scorer in a top 2 NBA franchise history, Finals MVP, 10x all star, intangibles

[jlip]

How is Dave Cowens not really even in these conversations? He had a "Willis Reed-esque" career. It was relatively short, but during the course of it, he was a ROY, league MVP (I know many feel that Kareem should have won it that year, but anyways...) an 8x all star, 2x champion as a 1b on his team, and had multiple all NBA and all defensive teams.

[Round Mound]

How is Dave Cowens not really even in these conversations? He had a "Willis Reed-esque" career. It was relatively short, but during the course of it, he was a ROY, league MVP (I know many feel that Kareem should have won it that year, but anyways...) an 8x all star, 2x champion as a 1b on his team, and had multiple all NBA and all defensive teams.

True. I think Dave Cowens and Paul Pierce should be in the top 50

[kawhileonard2]

Anthony Davis. Led team in every stat in 2020 and was the best player.

[L.Kizzle]

How is Dave Cowens not really even in these conversations? He had a "Willis Reed-esque" career. It was relatively short, but during the course of it, he was a ROY, league MVP (I know many feel that Kareem should have won it that year, but anyways...) an 8x all star, 2x champion as a 1b on his team, and had multiple all NBA and all defensive teams.
I was voting for Dave about 5 spots ago until the Kevin McHale votes started to pour in.
I'm back to Dave Cowens voting.

[Phoenix]

:banghead:

[dankok8]

Current Vote Tally

Bill Walton - 7 (colts19, Round Mound, LBJ, Lebron_James, Go Getter, francesco totti, NIke D'Antoni)
Anthony Davis - 3 (OOO, dankok8, kawhileonard2)
Dave Cowens - 2 (jlip, L. Kizzle)
Paul Pierce - 2 (fsvr54, 1987_Lakers)
Dwight Howard - 2 (gonzaldo, Phoenix)
James Worthy - 1 (Reggie43)
Dominique Wilkins - 1 (SouBeachTalents)
Ray Allen - 1 (Manny98)
Damian Lillard - 1 (blazers32)

I'm thinking we can call this one for Walton. I mean he doesn't have 10 votes but he has by far the most and we did call with 8 a couple of times... :confusedshrug:

What do y'all think?

[SouBeachTalents]

I’ll vote for AD, Walton has no business making the top 50 over guys who were elite for 7-10 years off the basis of 2 seasons.

[RRR3]

Current Vote Tally

Bill Walton - 7 (colts19, Round Mound, LBJ, Lebron_James, Go Getter, francesco totti, NIke D'Antoni)
Anthony Davis - 3 (OOO, dankok8, kawhileonard2)
Dave Cowens - 2 (jlip, L. Kizzle)
Paul Pierce - 2 (fsvr54, 1987_Lakers)
Dwight Howard - 2 (gonzaldo, Phoenix)
James Worthy - 1 (Reggie43)
Dominique Wilkins - 1 (SouBeachTalents)
Ray Allen - 1 (Manny98)
Damian Lillard - 1 (blazers32)

I'm thinking we can call this one for Walton. I mean he doesn't have 10 votes but he has by far the most and we did call with 8 a couple of times... :confusedshrug:

What do y'all think?
I voted for T-Mac. But if it’s down to the last few AD. Walton isn’t even top 100. I don’t care how good his peak was.

[Phoenix]

Current Vote Tally

Bill Walton - 7 (colts19, Round Mound, LBJ, Lebron_James, Go Getter, francesco totti, NIke D'Antoni)
Anthony Davis - 3 (OOO, dankok8, kawhileonard2)
Dave Cowens - 2 (jlip, L. Kizzle)
Paul Pierce - 2 (fsvr54, 1987_Lakers)
Dwight Howard - 2 (gonzaldo, Phoenix)
James Worthy - 1 (Reggie43)
Dominique Wilkins - 1 (SouBeachTalents)
Ray Allen - 1 (Manny98)
Damian Lillard - 1 (blazers32)

I'm thinking we can call this one for Walton. I mean he doesn't have 10 votes but he has by far the most and we did call with 8 a couple of times... :confusedshrug:

What do y'all think?

In the name of consistency I would call it, because you've hit the 20 vote minimum and there's way too many names left you could vote into this spot and drag this whole thing out. Hard disagree with Walton at this pick, but whatever. Hell, he didn't peak as high but Dave Cowens checks all the team/solo award boxes and had a much more prolific career.

[Akeem34TheDream]

Never made it out of the first other then the season the Lakers won. Might as well vote for T-Mac here.

False

[dankok8]

Alright then we have Walton 7 Davis 5 as our finalists. Let's vote for one of those two!

[Phoenix]

Lol well if we keeping it open, I'll switch my vote back from Dwight to AD then.

[L.Kizzle]

False

I corrected myself. They beat Portland in 17 or 18.

[L.Kizzle]

Alright then we have Walton 7 Davis 5 as our finalists. Let's vote for one of those two!
Damn, why it gotta be out of those two lol. I don't have either close to my top 50 lol.

[ELITEpower23]

You know what Elite? In a rare moment of humility, you're right. I'll change my vote to D12 because I'm not married to voting for Brow here.

Real recognize real :cheers:


I'll vote D12 too

[dankok8]

Damn, why it gotta be out of those two lol. I don't have either close to my top 50 lol.

That's how most of the people voted. We have to call this race sometimes soon! :lol

[Airupthere]

Not a fan of the two top selections. I'll keep my non-vote on the two.

[Phoenix]

Real recognize real :cheers:


I'll vote D12 too

Yeah but I had to reverse course again because it's basically down to Walton vs AD :lol. If Dwight somehow gains steam over the next few hours I'll go back to him just to muddy the waters :confusedshrug:

OP, consider my vote for AD conditional on it being between him and Walton. If Dwight somehow manages a 3 way split I want him in this spot over either of them.

[dankok8]

I'm thinking unless more votes come in I may just make a 24-hour poll for Walton vs. Davis to settle it. Currently Walton 7 Davis 6.

[fsvr54]

AD top 50 is funny

[RRR3]

AD top 50 is funny
He has a much better case than frigging Bill “less than 2 full star seasons” Walton.

[fsvr54]

Some people like peaks some, longetivity.

[RRR3]

Some people like peaks some, longetivity.
If we were just ranking peaks, Walton should have been in a while ago. But we’re not.

[TheCorporation]

3 DPOY in 4 years

Been done once ever by Howard.

I'm going Dwight Howard

[dankok8]

Final Vote Tally

Bill Walton - 7 (colts19, Round Mound, LBJ, Lebron_James, Go Getter, francesco totti, Nike D'Antoni)
Anthony Davis - 6 (OOO, dankok8, kawhileonard2, SouBeachTalents, RRR3, Phoenix)
Dwight Howard - 3 (gonzaldo, Phoenix, TheCorporation)
Dave Cowens - 2 (jlip, L. Kizzle)
Paul Pierce - 2 (fsvr54, 1987_Lakers)
James Worthy - 1 (Reggie43)
Ray Allen - 1 (Manny98)
Damian Lillard - 1 (blazers32)

It was too close to call for Walton so we ran a poll and Walton won 22-9.