View Full Version : Looks like Bron's prime ended at 35
StrongLurk
11-22-2021, 09:50 PM
Just like MJ...these two really do stand at the top of the NBA.
HBK_Kliq_2
11-22-2021, 10:10 PM
2009-2018
RIP
10 year prime like a lot of guys. He was lucky to win the scrimmage ball title in 2020 when he was already pretty much washed up
SouBeachTalents
11-22-2021, 10:13 PM
2009-2018
RIP
10 year prime like a lot of guys. He was lucky to win the scrimmage ball title in 2020 when he was already pretty much washed up
How'd Kawhi do during scrimmage ball in 2020 while 6 years younger than washed up LeBron?
Indian guy
11-22-2021, 10:15 PM
Prime to me is when you are playing your best ball or close to it. From that standpoint, LeBron's prime most certainly ended with 2018. 2020 LeBron, while still pretty good, is a faaaar cry from 09-18 LeBron.
HBK_Kliq_2
11-22-2021, 10:17 PM
How'd Kawhi do during scrimmage ball in 2020 while 6 years younger than washed up LeBron?
He dominated until he was 1 game away from conference finals, then realised the bubble was f'n stupid and left.
Remmeber, shams reported that both lakers and clippers voted to leave the bubble and that was like late 1st roundish.
Hey Yo
11-22-2021, 10:25 PM
Nobody in their 17th season, with that much milage (not even counting his Olympic play) is considered still in his prime.
ELITEpower23
11-22-2021, 10:31 PM
How'd Kawhi do during scrimmage ball in 2020 while 6 years younger than washed up LeBron?
:oldlol::roll:
StrongLurk
11-22-2021, 10:44 PM
Prime to me is when you are playing your best ball or close to it. From that standpoint, LeBron's prime most certainly ended with 2018. 2020 LeBron, while still pretty good, is a faaaar cry from 09-18 LeBron.
Nah, Lebron was the best player in the 2020 playoffs. He was still in his prime.
Bro played 21 games those playoffs and put up 30.2 PER, 64.7 TS%, and a 10.6 BPM. Capped it with FMVP.
Lebron has missed a TON of games since then and his body hasn't seemed to recover.
FKAri
11-22-2021, 10:48 PM
Lebron managed to extend his prime by not playing defense. But tbh I agree with his allocation of how to expend his energy. The energy to make a stop on one end was the same as running 3 plays on the other. But make no mistake his 2018 run had a lot to do with him playing only on one end.
Dr. Lemon
11-22-2021, 10:49 PM
LeClonk's prime ended in 2010.
Everything else was a result of team-hopping and ball-domination tactics.
Baller789
11-22-2021, 10:59 PM
Lebron's prime ended when he stopped playing D.
8Ball
11-22-2021, 11:09 PM
He dominated until he was 1 game away from conference finals, then realised the bubble was f'n stupid and left.
Remmeber, shams reported that both lakers and clippers voted to leave the bubble and that was like late 1st roundish.
:roll:
:roll:
And he said he was leaving ish after his hero gets whacked. What a bummer.
HBK_Kliq_2
11-22-2021, 11:57 PM
Lebron's prime ended when he stopped playing D.
2018 then
ELITEpower23
11-23-2021, 12:00 AM
2020 LeBron had his sixth 30.0 Playoff PER through the Finals. To give you an idea of how incredible a 30.0 PER through the Finals is, I've compiled a list of all the other players to have ever done this even once in their careers:
Jordan and Shaq
We done here? :oldlol:
CTbasketball92
11-23-2021, 12:46 AM
Prime to me is when you are playing your best ball or close to it. From that standpoint, LeBron's prime most certainly ended with 2018. 2020 LeBron, while still pretty good, is a faaaar cry from 09-18 LeBron.
Ehh, LeBron was extremely dominant in 2020, especially the bubble. Even last year he looked crazy good. The difference after the high Anke sprain is a lack of burst/ability to explode off one leg with good balance to finish. Takes away so much from his game. It's insane.
CTbasketball92
11-23-2021, 12:51 AM
2020 LeBron had his sixth 30.0 Playoff PER through the Finals. To give you an idea of how incredible a 30.0 PER through the Finals is, I've compiled a list of all the other players to have ever done this even once in their careers:
Jordan and Shaq
We done here? :oldlol:
Yeah I feel like people are really sleeping on how great he was that year. He was the clearcut best player on the court, even w. AD playing as well as he did.
GoSpursGo1984
11-23-2021, 12:55 AM
Lecramp been carried by his teammates for a while.
Gohan
11-23-2021, 03:14 AM
How'd Kawhi do during scrimmage ball in 2020 while 6 years younger than washed up LeBron?
Youre kidding right? Clippers wanted to go home
TheGoatest
11-23-2021, 04:07 AM
The difference between Jordan's and LeBron's age 35 seasons:
Jordan in 1997-98:
Lowest scoring ppg of his entire career, aside from his rookie season
Lowest fg% of his entire career
Lowest ft% of his career
Lowest apg of his career
Third lowest rpg of his career
While playing the second most mpg he played in the 6 Bulls championship seasons
LeBron in 2019-20:
One of the lowest scoring ppg seasons of his entire career, just about the only negative thing that can be said
About average shooting percentages compared to the rest of his career
Highest apg season of his career
7th highest rpg season of his career (out of 17 seasons)
While playing the lowest amount of mpg of his entire career
LeBron was able to transform his game and played in a way that he never really played before in up to that point 17 season career, whereas Jordan was the exact same, though clearly inferior version of Jordan.
Also, a reminder about LeBron's stats THE very last game (age 36) before the Solomon Hill injury:
37 points on 14-23/4-9/5-6
8 rebounds
6 assists
in 36 minutes
That intentional injury committed by a scrub player who has since been exposed for having pro-Jordan/anti-LeBron tweets will be seen as a turning point in LeBron's career, which despite this is still unquestionably the GOAT career.
SATAN
11-23-2021, 04:23 AM
Michael Jordan got his ass handed to him by Master P. True story.
Phoenix
11-23-2021, 04:50 AM
He dominated until he was 1 game away from conference finals, then realised the bubble was f'n stupid and left.
Ah I see, so why didnt Kawhit just do the on-brand load managing routine? Considering his history of doing whatever he wants, nothing stopped him from just....not playing anymore citing health concerns, instead of going out like a bitch.
I know you're a gimmick account, we've had and have enough of those. But you lack innovation and cleverness, generally a fukking idiot.
Im Still Ballin
11-23-2021, 05:05 AM
Y'all dingbats need to chill. This is what King LeBJ did 9 months ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nq9d2naAg8c
Im Still Ballin
11-23-2021, 05:07 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELjm9_1xaf8
Nah, Lebron was the best player in the 2020 playoffs. He was still in his prime.
Bro played 21 games those playoffs and put up 30.2 PER, 64.7 TS%, and a 10.6 BPM. Capped it with FMVP.
Lebron has missed a TON of games since then and his body hasn't seemed to recover.
Hahahaha :oldlol:
I thought regular season games don't mean real shit? :confusedshrug:
Hahahaha :oldlol:
Too bad for you, kobe could never get more than two finals mvps. :ohwell:
Too bad for you, kobe could never get more than two finals mvps. :ohwell:
Most lazy unproductive asian ever. 20 thousand posts :biggums:
Most lazy unproductive asian ever. 20 thousand posts :biggums:
More delicious meltdowns from albania. :cry:
RogueBorg
11-23-2021, 09:26 AM
The difference between Jordan's and LeBron's age 35 seasons:
Jordan in 1997-98:
Lowest scoring ppg of his entire career, aside from his rookie season
Lowest fg% of his entire career
Lowest ft% of his career
Lowest apg of his career
Third lowest rpg of his career
While playing the second most mpg he played in the 6 Bulls championship seasons
LeBron in 2019-20:
One of the lowest scoring ppg seasons of his entire career, just about the only negative thing that can be said
About average shooting percentages compared to the rest of his career
Highest apg season of his career
7th highest rpg season of his career (out of 17 seasons)
While playing the lowest amount of mpg of his entire career
LeBron was able to transform his game and played in a way that he never really played before in up to that point 17 season career, whereas Jordan was the exact same, though clearly inferior version of Jordan.
Also, a reminder about LeBron's stats THE very last game (age 36) before the Solomon Hill injury:
37 points on 14-23/4-9/5-6
8 rebounds
6 assists
in 36 minutes
That intentional injury committed by a scrub player who has since been exposed for having pro-Jordan/anti-LeBron tweets will be seen as a turning point in LeBron's career, which despite this is still unquestionably the GOAT career.
Jordan was league MVP and 1st Team All-NBA Defense at age 35...Lebron was..............
Does Lebron even have an MVP in his 30's I can't remember.
TheGoatest
11-23-2021, 09:48 AM
Jordan was league MVP and 1st Team All-NBA Defense at age 35...Lebron was..............
Does Lebron even have an MVP in his 30's I can't remember.
LeBron had 5 straight all-NBA 1st defensive teams between 2008 and 2013 when NBA coaches voted for the teams.
Then the voting switched from coaches to the media and he hasn't had an all-defensive 1st team selection since.
All you're doing is pointing out the media's slupring and overlooking of degenerate gambler Jordan, and the media's hatred of LeBron because he surpassed Jordan. Everyone already knows this, but thanks for pointing it out again.
The numbers, as opposed to media stanning, show that LeBron was easily better than Jordan at the age of 35.
RogueBorg
11-23-2021, 10:01 AM
LeBron had 5 straight all-NBA 1st defensive teams between 2008 and 2013 when NBA coaches voted for the teams.
Then the voting switched from coaches to the media and he hasn't had an all-defensive 1st team selection since.
All you're doing is pointing out the media's slupring and overlooking of degenerate gambler Jordan, and the media's hatred of LeBron because he surpassed Jordan. Everyone already knows this, but thanks for pointing it out again.
The numbers, as opposed to media stanning, show that LeBron was easily better than Jordan at the age of 35.
The media slurps Lebron as well, quit acting like they don't.
So, how many league MVP's does Lebron have in his 30's?
Any All-Defensive Teams in there either?
Are you saying he doesn't have a single one? Nada?
https://c.tenor.com/Pom7afI8cJkAAAAM/michael-jordan-laughing.gif
TheGoatest
11-23-2021, 10:08 AM
The media slurps Lebron as well, quit acting like they don't.
So, how many league MVP's does Lebron have in his 30's?
Any All-Defensive Teams in there either?
Are you saying he doesn't have a single one? Nada?
https://c.tenor.com/Pom7afI8cJkAAAAM/michael-jordan-laughing.gif
I already provided the proof of media's hatred of LeBron:
He stopped getting all-defensive 1st teams the exact season the voting switched from coaches to the media.
Is this supposed to be a coincidence?
Now, getting back to unbiased numbers.
How many 30 PER championship runs does Jordan have in his 30s?
How many 3 apg finals does he have at 35? 5 rpg averaging finals?
SouBeachTalents
11-23-2021, 10:09 AM
The media slurps Lebron as well, quit acting like they don't.
So, how many league MVP's does Lebron have in his 30's?
Any All-Defensive Teams in there either?
Are you saying he doesn't have a single one? Nada?
https://c.tenor.com/Pom7afI8cJkAAAAM/michael-jordan-laughing.gif
In fairness though, he had to compete with with peak Durant, Curry & Giannis for most of those MVP’s instead of 34 year old Malone.
Axe tell your cousin to stop posting those links. Life must be really ****ed up over there.
RogueBorg
11-23-2021, 10:13 AM
I already provided the proof of media's hatred of LeBron:
He stopped getting all-defensive 1st teams the exact season the voting switched from coaches to the media.
Is this supposed to be a coincidence?
Now, getting back to unbiased numbers.
How many 30 PER championship runs does Jordan have in his 30s?
How many 3 apg finals does he have at 35? 5 rpg averaging finals?
Meltdown
TheGoatest
11-23-2021, 10:19 AM
In fairness though, he had to compete with with peak Durant, Curry & Giannis for most of those MVP’s instead of 34 year old Malone.
Strength of competition, whether quality teams or individual players is a subject Jordan stans try to avoid like the plague.
RogueBorg
11-23-2021, 10:20 AM
Strength of competition, whether quality teams or individual players is a subject Jordan stans try to avoid like the plague.
https://c.tenor.com/mZZoOtDcouoAAAAC/stop-it-get-some-help.gif
dankok8
11-23-2021, 10:55 AM
Yea right now it looks like 2020 was his last prime season although even in 2020 he was clearly past his best already. The great numbers had a lot to do with getting so many months off to recharge and playing against really bad defenses. Despite the stats, 2020 was probably his weakest title run IMO although I can see a case for 2013 where he had a pedestrian playoffs by GOAT standards.
As for competition let's shove that argument aside. Jordan competed against Magic, Bird, Hakeem, Robinson, Shaq, Malone, and Barkley for his MVP's. Let's not act like these guys were scrubs. As for quality of teams, the Western Conference had a Hakeem/Barkley/Drexler superteam in 1997 and another Shaq/Kobe/Jones/Van Exel superteam in 1998 but those lost to the Jazz in the playoffs. That's not Jordan's fault...
This era is stronger type of arguments are always dumb. Players are judged relative to their own eras. Jordan was most dominant in his era than Lebron in his era. People try to justify it by saying that Lebron had it tougher. It's very debatable... There is always the issue of winning bias as well. People can't objectively compare a title team (say 2011 Mavs) to a non-title team (say 1997 Jazz). The title teams always look better in people's eyes...
Phoenix
11-23-2021, 11:38 AM
Yea right now it looks like 2020 was his last prime season although even in 2020 he was clearly past his best already. The great numbers had a lot to do with getting so many months off to recharge and playing against really bad defenses. Despite the stats, 2020 was probably his weakest title run IMO although I can see a case for 2013 where he had a pedestrian playoffs by GOAT standards.
2020 wasn't a prime year. Neither was 1998 for MJ. It speaks to the greatness of each they were able to win championships past the point of their peaks. That's the non-stan way to look at it.
noonereal
11-23-2021, 12:26 PM
James is sullying what will be his legacy this year.
He should call a news conference and retire.
noonereal
11-23-2021, 12:27 PM
2020 wasn't a prime year. Neither was 1998 for MJ. It speaks to the greatness of each they were able to win championships past the point of their peaks. That's the non-stan way to look at it.
OMG, no it doesn't. It speaks to the teammates they were gifted.
SouBeachTalents
11-23-2021, 12:31 PM
Yea right now it looks like 2020 was his last prime season although even in 2020 he was clearly past his best already. The great numbers had a lot to do with getting so many months off to recharge and playing against really bad defenses. Despite the stats, 2020 was probably his weakest title run IMO although I can see a case for 2013 where he had a pedestrian playoffs by GOAT standards.
As for competition let's shove that argument aside. Jordan competed against Magic, Bird, Hakeem, Robinson, Shaq, Malone, and Barkley for his MVP's. Let's not act like these guys were scrubs. As for quality of teams, the Western Conference had a Hakeem/Barkley/Drexler superteam in 1997 and another Shaq/Kobe/Jones/Van Exel superteam in 1998 but those lost to the Jazz in the playoffs. That's not Jordan's fault...
This era is stronger type of arguments are always dumb. Players are judged relative to their own eras. Jordan was most dominant in his era than Lebron in his era. People try to justify it by saying that Lebron had it tougher. It's very debatable... There is always the issue of winning bias as well. People can't objectively compare a title team (say 2011 Mavs) to a non-title team (say 1997 Jazz). The title teams always look better in people's eyes...
Imo, the late 90’s, specifically ‘97 & ‘98 were historically weak compared to other eras, both in terms of top teams & elite players. Comparing the top 5 players of this year, or honestly almost any other year, to ‘97 & ‘98, after Jordan & Shaq, the drop off is pretty significant. Curry/KD/Giannis/Jokic/Kawhi (if healthy) blows away Malone/Hill/Payton/rookie Duncan, as would several other seasons top 5’s.
Jordan has a great argument for GOAT, but I always felt those last 2 Bulls years inflated his resume, he was facing weak competition historically.
Phoenix
11-23-2021, 12:37 PM
OMG, no it doesn't. It speaks to the teammates they were gifted.
OMG, yes it does.
dankok8
11-23-2021, 01:11 PM
Imo, the late 90’s, specifically ‘97 & ‘98 were historically weak compared to other eras, both in terms of top teams & elite players. Comparing the top 5 players of this year, or honestly almost any other year, to ‘97 & ‘98, after Jordan & Shaq, the drop off is pretty significant. Curry/KD/Giannis/Jokic/Kawhi (if healthy) blows away Malone/Hill/Payton/rookie Duncan, as would several other seasons top 5’s.
Jordan has a great argument for GOAT, but I always felt those last 2 Bulls years inflated his resume, he was facing weak competition historically.
2020 was pretty weak too though. Curry and KD out for the season, Giannis hurt in the playoffs, Jokic not yet peaking etc. The Lakers also faced weaker teams in that run than the Bulls did in 97 and 98... the 2020 Heat especially with their injuries.. yikes.
You can do this for literally anyone's career.
SouBeachTalents
11-23-2021, 01:27 PM
2020 was pretty weak too though. Curry and KD out for the season, Giannis hurt in the playoffs, Jokic not yet peaking etc. The Lakers also faced weaker teams in that run than the Bulls did in 97 and 98... the 2020 Heat especially with their injuries.. yikes.
You can do this for literally anyone's career.
Nah, even without Durant & Curry Kawhi/Giannis/Luka/Harden is still better than what I listed above imo. Add those 2 it becomes a landslide.
dankok8
11-23-2021, 01:36 PM
Nah, even without Durant & Curry Kawhi/Giannis/Luka/Harden is still better than what I listed above imo. Add those 2 it becomes a landslide.
No they aren't. Come on now.
Sophomore Luka wasn't better than rookie Duncan.
Giannis was hurt in the playoffs like I said.
Not to mention Lebron had AD who was arguably the best player in those playoffs and faced the Heat in the finals who were a lottery team given their injuries.
I'm not trying to disparage Lebron's competition by the way. I hate competition arguments in general. They are terrible. Just trying to prove a point that you can make reasonable cases against any player.
SouBeachTalents
11-23-2021, 01:48 PM
No they aren't. Come on now.
Sophomore Luka wasn't better than rookie Duncan.
Giannis was hurt in the playoffs like I said.
Not to mention Lebron had AD who was arguably the best player in those playoffs and faced the Heat in the finals who were a lottery team given their injuries.
I'm not trying to disparage Lebron's competition by the way. I hate competition arguments in general. They are terrible. Just trying to prove a point that you can make reasonable cases against any player.
Just the fact 33-35 year old Jordan was essentially the consensus best player really speaks to how weak the competition was imo. I can’t think of another 3 year period where mid 30’s Jordan would be considered the clear BITW like he was in the late 90’s. I also think there’s very little chance those late 90’s Bulls teams 3peat in any other era.
But again, that’s just my opinion. If you feel differently, we can agree to disagree.
dankok8
11-23-2021, 08:15 PM
Just the fact 33-35 year old Jordan was essentially the consensus best player really speaks to how weak the competition was imo. I can’t think of another 3 year period where mid 30’s Jordan would be considered the clear BITW like he was in the late 90’s. I also think there’s very little chance those late 90’s Bulls teams 3peat in any other era.
But again, that’s just my opinion. If you feel differently, we can agree to disagree.
It's just our individual opinions as you said but what is the bolded opinion based on? The second threepeat Bulls played at a 70-win pace across all three seasons when Jordan/Pippen/Rodman played and had around 10 SRS on average. Even if you think the league was weak they'd still win what... like 65 games and have +9 SRS now. They'd be a juggernaut in any era.
The best player of such a team who is also the best scorer in the league and an elite defender will generally be BITW. Jordan's efficiency also doesn't jump off of the page but his historically low turnover rates are overlooked. He was still a pretty insane offensive player even as late as 1998.
Baller789
11-24-2021, 07:23 AM
Just the fact 33-35 year old Jordan was essentially the consensus best player really speaks to how weak the competition was imo. I can’t think of another 3 year period where mid 30’s Jordan would be considered the clear BITW like he was in the late 90’s. I also think there’s very little chance those late 90’s Bulls teams 3peat in any other era.
But again, that’s just my opinion. If you feel differently, we can agree to disagree.
You can go ahead and flip that argument around.
Floyd Mayweather is arguably the best boxer of his era through his 30's. Yet you could argue that he was that good, or plain argue "weak era".
It goes both ways. Depending on your own bias.
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