Where's all the long/athletic wing defenders in this era?

[Bronbron23]

Who are on contending teams and are as tall or taller than mj and close to his athleticism in his prime? Surely there must be a bunch because of evolution? Lakers, warriors, clippers, denver, blazers, nets, celtics, heat, philly and bucks must be loaded with defenders who were taller and more athletic than mj?

[Johnny32]

00/10s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

bowen
christie
kobe
artest
ak47
prince
battier
lebron
thabo
g. wallace
iggy
deng
pg13
butler
kawhi
giannis
dray
danny green
andre roberson
robert covington
klay
simmons

80/90s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

mj
rodney mccray
rodman
pippen
majerle
derrick mckey
eddie jones

rip

[RRR3]

00/10s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

bowen
christie
kobe
artest
ak47
prince
battier
lebron
thabo
g. wallace
iggy
deng
pg13
butler
kawhi
giannis
dray
danny green
andre roberson
robert covington
klay
simmons

80/90s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

mj
rodney mccray
rodman
pippen
majerle
derrick mckey
eddie jones

rip
Poor Dumbdumb23 :(

[Hey Yo]

Mikemike23 shook

[Bronbron23]

00/10s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

bowen
christie
kobe
artest
ak47
prince
battier
lebron
thabo
g. wallace
iggy
deng
pg13
butler
kawhi
giannis
dray
danny green
andre roberson
robert covington
klay
simmons

80/90s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

mj
rodney mccray
rodman
pippen
majerle
derrick mckey
eddie jones

rip

Right now buddy in this era and there were alot more than what you listed for 80/90's

[RRR3]

Mikemike23 shook
Imagine being retarded enough name your account after the player you hate lmfao. Poor Jordan stans they’re not very bright.

[expansionera]

00/10s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

bowen
christie
kobe
artest
ak47
prince
battier
lebron
thabo
g. wallace
iggy
deng
pg13
butler
kawhi
giannis
dray
danny green
andre roberson
robert covington
klay
simmons

80/90s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

mj
rodney mccray
rodman
pippen
majerle
derrick mckey
eddie jones

rip

The post that sent Jordan stans into a multi-decade depression :applause:

[RRR3]

Dumbdumb23 scritching his head desperately trying to get the ol’ neurons firing, but they just won’t comply. Thinking for longer than a few seconds is too much for the poor fella.

[Johnny32]

Right now buddy in this era and there were alot more than what you listed for 80/90's

no there wasn't. the only one i possibly left off was anthony mason. he did defend mj on occasion when he was mostly posting up but i wouldn't call him a wing defender. name the others i missed. all def, 6'6 or taller, ability to defend 2/3.

[expansionera]

Scratch Jordan from the list, his defense was overrated.

In the SI 1996-97 Pro Basketball annual, they have a story on the worst defenders in the NBA. I found an interesting quote from Craig Ehlo, a man who has known jordon for a long time and has competed against him since jordon joined the league in 1984.

He says, "I don't think Michael's that great a defensive player, he's just so quick that they let him get away with a lot of zone or with guarding his man from farther away than he should be allowed."

[Bronbron23]

Imagine being retarded enough name your account after the player you hate lmfao. Poor Jordan stans they’re not very bright.

What does this thread have to do with bron dummy?

[Bronbron23]

no there wasn't. the only one i possibly left off was anthony mason. he did defend mj on occasion when he was mostly posting up but i wouldn't call him a wing defender. name the others i missed. all def, 6'6 or taller, ability to defend 2/3.

Answer the question first. Where are all the tall long/athletic defenders mj would face on contending teams right now? Still waiting for an answer from one of yall

[Bronbron23]

Scratch Jordan from the list, his defense was overrated.

In the SI 1996-97 Pro Basketball annual, they have a story on the worst defenders in the NBA. I found an interesting quote from Craig Ehlo, a man who has known jordon for a long time and has competed against him since jordon joined the league in 1984.

He says, "I don't think Michael's that great a defensive player, he's just so quick that they let him get away with a lot of zone or with guarding his man from farther away than he should be allowed."

Cool so right now who are the long,tall, athletic defenders mj would face on contending teams?

[Baller789]

Cool so right now who are the long,tall, athletic defenders mj would face on contending teams?

Well they still had to dig deep to the 2000's for Kirilenko, Bowen, Wallace, Artest, Christie, Kobe and Prince.

Pure comedy gold. :lol

[expansionera]

Cool so right now who are the long,tall, athletic defenders mj would face on contending teams?

Kawhi Leonard
Paul George
Nicolas Batum

Lebron James
Trevor Ariza
Kent Bazemore

Andrew Wiggins
Draymond Green
Klay Thompson

Derrick Jones Jr

Aaron Gordon

Jayson Tatum
Jaylen Brown

Jimmy Butler

Khris Middleton

Mikal Bridges
Jae Crowder

Miles Bridges

I’m missing plenty but the reality is all the best defenders played for the Bulls in Jordan’s era

[Johnny32]

Answer the question first. Where are all the tall long/athletic defenders mj would face on contending teams right now? Still waiting for an answer from one of yall

wing defenders as tall as mj who've made an all def team on today's contenders? define contenders. all playoff teams?

[Baller789]

Kawhi Leonard
Paul George
Nicolas Batum

Lebron James
Trevor Ariza
Kent Bazemore

Andrew Wiggins
Draymond Green
Klay Thompson

Derrick Jones Jr

Aaron Gordon

Jayson Tatum
Jaylen Brown

Jimmy Butler

Khris Middleton

Mikal Bridges
Jae Crowder

Miles Bridges

I’m missing plenty but the reality is all the best defenders played for the Bulls in Jordan’s era

No. You just don't remember or know them because it was over two decades ago.

Just as the names you listed bar a couple would be forgotten and laughed at in two decades.

[Johnny32]

it's insane to think the only wing defenders mj faced in the postseason that were 6'6 or taller and made an all defensive team at least once are majerle, derrick mckey and rodman (who borderline qualifies as a wing defender and very rarely guarded mj.) two players. that's unbelievable.

[Johnny32]

it's insane to think the only wing defenders mj faced in the postseason that were 6'6 or taller and made an all defensive team at least once are majerle, derrick mckey and rodman (who borderline qualifies as a wing defender and very rarely guarded mj.) two players. that's unbelievable.

lol lebron faced more of these players in one series vs gsw than mj did in his entire career.

[Bronbron23]

Kawhi Leonard
Paul George
Nicolas Batum

Lebron James
Trevor Ariza
Kent Bazemore

Andrew Wiggins
Draymond Green
Klay Thompson

Derrick Jones Jr

Aaron Gordon

Jayson Tatum
Jaylen Brown

Jimmy Butler

Khris Middleton

Mikal Bridges
Jae Crowder

Miles Bridges

I’m missing plenty but the reality is all the best defenders played for the Bulls in Jordan’s era

Right and how many of these guys were on q defensive team in the last few years?

Your just being a prisoner of the moment dude. Who in the hell is gonna remember half of these guys 30 years from now? What's the difference between derrick jones jr who's 6'5 btw and dominique wilkens who's taller and just as athletic. What's the difference between batum and augmon? What's the difference between miles bridges and kemp who's as athletic and taller? What's the difference between klay and dan mar? Whats the difference between aaron gordon qnd antonio mcdysse? I could go on qnd on dude, penny, hill, dumas, rice, lewis, nance, mcdaniels, gerald wilkens, mason ect.

Honestly i don't know if ypur trolling or just have little knowledge of the game. Funny thing is like bron it's usually smaller faster players that are better to put on mj. Defenders who are bigger and taller than both bron and mj don't have the quickness laterally to stay in front of either player.

I swear most of yall don't know jack shit about the game:facepalm

[Bronbron23]

wing defenders as tall as mj who've made an all def team on today's contenders? define contenders. all playoff teams?

Basically any yeam that would be a threat to mj and the if they were in this era. There is none dude. Who's gaurding mj in the east contending teams? The slower less athletic butler? The slower less athletic brown? The much slower less athletic durant? The smaller slower DeRozan? The much slower Middleton?What qbout the west? The much slower bron? The slower kawhi or George, the much slower klay? The slower shorter weaker bridges?

None of these guys can stay in front of prime mj. Do you understand how quick and strong this dude was? That's why none of them other than maybe bridges would even be assigned to mj. Teams now would do what teams then did and put a smallet quicker player on mj.

Learn the game dude before you talk on these things

[Johnny32]

the narrative that longer defenders didn't give mj problems is false. jordan had trouble scoring when mckey was on him in the 98 ecf. and of course reggie lewis famously blocked peak mj 4 times in a single game. the thing is so very few of these players existed in mj's era.

[Johnny32]

it's like they don't understand how a longer defender in today's game would guard mj. you lay off and contest the jumper with your length and make him shoot over you. and of course there would be a second line of defense cheating off the shooters so he sees no driving lane until he proves to be a willing passer and not a last resort passer.

[Bronbron23]

the narrative that longer defenders didn't give mj problems is false. jordan had trouble scoring when mckey was on him in the 98 ecf. and of course reggie lewis famously blocked peak mj 4 times in a single game. the thing is so very few of these players existed in mj's era.

Your examples of this is a series were a one game sample against lewis and 35 year old mj put up 32 pts a game on 47% fg and 40% 3pt? Oh and mj had plenty of big games against lewis btw and his career head to head is 35/6/6 on 54% shooting. https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/michael-jordan-average-vs-reggie-lewis-in-the-regular-season

Again learn your history buddy:facepalm

[999Guy]

You literally wouldn’t know them.

What do you know about Jonathan Isaac? Juan Toscano-Anderson? David Nwaba?

But in reality Jordan didn’t typically get slowed down by big wings. His feet were too quick for them.

Jordan had trouble with guards small enough to have his foot speed, but strong, not too small and athletic enough to contest him and bang with him at the point of attack. This culminated with Gary Payton giving the ultimate example of this in 1996. Him and McMillan.

Dumars is another one.


Jordan would’ve been given a horrible type of hell with peak Tony Allen in a playoff series. The greatest combo guard defender I’ve ever seen.

Literally Gary Payton’s son, too. Who seems to be a better defender than his father ever was on GS this year, at 6’3.

****ing Peak Eric Bledsoe would give Jordan more trouble than Kawhi or Iguodala, or LeBron, etc.

[Bronbron23]

it's like they don't understand how a longer defender in today's game would guard mj. you lay off and contest the jumper with your length and make him shoot over you. and of course there would be a second line of defense cheating off the shooters so he sees no driving lane until he proves to be a willing passer and not a last resort passer.

Sure bud hows that working for longer defenders right now trying to gaurd DeRozan or Lavine who are both poor mans mj's? Shit luka is one of the best offensive players in the game and he does nothing as good as mj. It's like you don't understand what's happening right in front of your face:facepalm

[Johnny32]

Your examples of this is a series were a one game sample against lewis and 35 year old mj put up 32 pts a game on 47% fg and 40% 3pt? Oh and mj had plenty of big games against lewis btw and his career head to head is 35/6/6 on 54% shooting. https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/michael-jordan-average-vs-reggie-lewis-in-the-regular-season

Again learn your history buddy:facepalm

mckey came off the bench so jordan's stats mean nothing. he went from limited mins to start the series to peaking near 30 mins in a gm for one reason...how well he defended mj. you'd know this by watching the series not googling box scores. lol poser.

[3ba11]

The name is Richard Dumas:


https://thumbs.gfycat.com/GlaringCreepyAztecant.webp

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HyzIKvx9gmk&t=07m40s


Unfortunately, most possessions in the 80's and 90's didn't require perimeter defenders to be in the play because the ball was going to the post.. So perimeter players weren't viewed as impactful defenders like today's game, where anyone that can move their feet on a screen-roll gets all-defense consideration.

So many great perimeter athletes didn't get defensive recognition like Dumas, Stacey Augmon, Derrick McKey, Michael Cooper, Eddie Jones, Drexler, Robert Horry, X-man, Grant Hill, Anthony Mason, Larry Nance, Kemp, Rodman and many more - all these guys would be viewed as better defenders in today's game because they would be involved in every screen roll

[3ba11]

00/10s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

bowen
christie
kobe
artest
ak47
prince
battier
lebron
thabo
g. wallace
iggy
deng
pg13
butler
kawhi
giannis
dray
danny green
andre roberson
robert covington
klay
simmons

80/90s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

mj
rodney mccray
rodman
pippen
majerle
derrick mckey
eddie jones

rip


Look at all the bums on the 00's list - thabo, christie, roberson and more.. Meager athletes and players... These guys are decent defenders but they aren't good enough to make all-defense in a format where all the action is on the post like the 80's or 90"s... They only started making all-defense when teams started revolving offenses around perimeter players instead of bigs/post - this increased the demand for perimeter defenders, which revealed the Thabo's and Roberson's of the world... But these guys were always there - they were just playing a different game where their defensive abilities weren't needed on most plays..

Furthermore, the list is inaccurate because it includes a lot of frontcourt players that cannot defend an elite perimeter scorer as the primary defender, like Draymond, Kirelinko, Giannis, and more - if you're going to include these guys, than there's tons of frontcourt players from the 80's or 90's that would qualify like Larry Nance or Anthony Mason or Hakeem or Robinson

[Johnny32]

lol dray and giannis regularly defend lebron who is an elite perimeter scorer. here's ak47 (who you clearly know nothing about) blocking kobe 4 times in one gm.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSMwoiyzOds&ab_channel=RustyBuckets

[3ba11]

lol dray and giannis regularly defend lebron who is an elite perimeter scorer. here's ak47 (who you clearly know nothing about) blocking kobe 4 times in one gm.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSMwoiyzOds&ab_channel=RustyBuckets


It's called spot-duty.

MJ regularly did that on Barkley too.

But no coach would make Giannis, Dray, or Lebron the primary defender on Reggie Miller, Klay, Rip Hamilton or Kyrie

[Johnny32]

It's called spot-duty.

MJ regularly did that on Barkley too.

But no coach would make Giannis, Dray, or Lebron the primary defender on Reggie Miller, Klay, Rip Hamilton or Kyrie

In basketball, the term “swingman” (a.k.a. “wing” or “guard-forward”) denotes a player who can play both the shooting guard (2) and small forward (3) positions, and in essence swing between the positions.

kemp (rofl), nance, etc...none of those guy's are manning up vs kobe or lebron unless it's a switch and considered a mismatch. ak47, dray, giannis are defending those players by design...not a random switch.

[TheCorporation]

00/10s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

bowen
christie
kobe
artest
ak47
prince
battier
lebron
thabo
g. wallace
iggy
deng
pg13
butler
kawhi
giannis
dray
danny green
andre roberson
robert covington
klay
simmons

80/90s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

mj
rodney mccray
rodman
pippen
majerle
derrick mckey
eddie jones

rip


Got these bois on skates

:dancin

LYTE WORK

[Johnny32]

i feel like this guy doesn't know how good of a defender ak47 was. such a weird player to pick out of my list. he was a beast and could stay in front of elite guards.

[TheCorporation]

i feel like this guy doesn't know how good of a defender ak47 was. such a weird player to pick out of my list. he was a beast and could stay in front of elite guards.

+1


Some people have a painfully low IQ

[Bronbron23]

mckey came off the bench so jordan's stats mean nothing. he went from limited mins to start the series to peaking near 30 mins in a gm for one reason...how well he defended mj. you'd know this by watching the series not googling box scores. lol poser.

I watched all those games buddy but i'll admit it's been awhile so i just spead watched game 7 in that series to see if what you were saying is true. I chose game 7 because it was mj's worse game scoring wise so if there was some truth to what you were saying it should be more obvious in this game.
Mckey only gaurded mj for about the last 3 min of the 1st quarter. Mj was 1/5 that quarter bur didn't take any when mckey was on him. Pacers did double mj a couple times when Mckey was on him which is weird since apparently Mckey is so great at gaurding mj.

In the second mj took shots with mckey on him. One at 39:54 which he made, another at 41:29 which he makes even with help defense helping, another at 54:51 which he makes with help qgain btw. He missed one at 58:14 again with help defense, at 59:24 he beats mckey off the dribble but misses a left hand layup against the help defense. In the 3rd mckey barely gaurded mj but at 1:34:14 mj easily beats mckey but misses at the rim against the help defense, at 1:35:17 he sheds mckey on a screen and misses an easy mid. In the 4th at 1:51:39 he attacks mckey in the post but mckey makes a nice defensive play and strips him, at 1:52:30 he attacks mckey and the double team and help defense and misses a fadeaway, at 1:53:12 he beats mckey off the dribble and gets fouled by the help d and shoits 2 foul shots, At 1:56:06 he attacks mckey and gets fouled for 2 foul shots, at 2:00:35 he takes mckey off the dribble and gets fouled by the help defense for 2 shots, at 2:04:51 with a couple seconds left on shot clock mj missed a contested mid against mckey.

A few takeaways from watching this game. Other than the strip and the contested shot mj missed to beat the clock mckey never really bothers mj that much. Mj just missed open shots or missed against the help.

Mckey also barely ever gaurds mj heads up without the double and help coming. Also Mckey wasn't very fast. He could hang ok against 35 year old mj in the post in a half court slowed down playoffs but against mj in his prime in this up and down era mj would absolutely wreck him.

Again not a great example man. One series where 35 year old mj pretty much can get any shot he wants against mckey but has to deal with alot of doubles and help defense. And again this was mj's worst game of the series scoring wise. It's a good story man but your just talking out your ass.

[Bronbron23]

i feel like this guy doesn't know how good of a defender ak47 was. such a weird player to pick out of my list. he was a beast and could stay in front of elite guards.

Ak47? Do you know how much faster mj was than that dude. Prime Bron who's nowhere near as quick as mj was flying by that dude. What you think mj would do:facepalm

[Baller789]

+1


Some people have a painfully low IQ

:lol

[Johnny32]

Ak47? Do you know how much faster mj was than that dude. Prime Bron who's nowhere near as quick as mj was flying by that dude. What you think mj would do:facepalm

ak47 had freakish speed and lateral movement. you're just typing out your ass at this point.

[Johnny32]

https://youtu.be/XGkSph7VDrU?t=21

educate yourself.

[Baller789]

ak47 had freakish speed and lateral movement. you're just typing out your ass at this point.

Do you think ak47 could guard prime Westbrook or Rose the whole game well?

[Johnny32]

Do you think ak47 could guard prime Westbrook or Rose the whole game well?

lebron easily defended prime rose so yeah.

[Bronbron23]

ak47 had freakish speed and lateral movement. you're just typing out your ass at this point.

For his size yeah. He wasn't quick enough to defend prime mj dude. Prime mj is one of the quickest players ever.

[Baller789]

lebron easily defended prime rose so yeah.

I said AK47.

I have observed that you seem to have this habitual problem of "the need to be right" constantly.

[Johnny32]

I said AK47.

I have observed that you seem to have this habitual problem of "the need to be right" constantly.

and i said..."yeah"

[Baller789]

and i said..."yeah"

And would would be wrong tbh.

[Bronbron23]

ak47 had freakish speed and lateral movement. you're just typing out your ass at this point.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SfFwZVUqZOU look at how slow this dude moves compared to bron and in the half court prime mj makes prime bron look slow. You can't be serious with this shit dude :facepalm

[Johnny32]

I have observed that you seem to have this habitual problem of "the need to be right" constantly. And would would be wrong tbh.

lol comedy.

[Baller789]

lol comedy.

Of course you'd find it funny.
That's gonna be your defensive mechanism.
I probably already know what you gonna do next tho.

[Johnny32]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SfFwZVUqZOU look at how slow this dude moves compared to bron and in the half court prime mj makes prime bron look slow. You can't be serious with this shit dude :facepalm

watched the first minute and saw zero evidence of what you're claiming.

[Johnny32]

hurrr, you always need to be right. next post. you're wrong, i'm right, durrr.

[Baller789]

hurrr, you always need to be right. next post. you're wrong, i'm right, durrr.

Insults... Called it. :lol

[Johnny32]

i was mocking you. if you find that insulting, oh well.

[Baller789]

i was mocking you. if you find that insulting, oh well.

Aaanndd goes right back to the need to be right.
:lol

[Johnny32]

Aaanndd goes right back to the need to be right.
:lol

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?499803-Players-who-won-a-ship-while-leading-their-team-in-pts-rbds-asts-in-the-finals

[Bronbron23]

watched the first minute and saw zero evidence of what you're claiming.

Then your blind dude. Kirilenko is clearly a step or 2 slower than bron. You posted about kirilenko blocking kobe several times but ignore the fact that kobe almost scored a record breaking 33 points in a quarter on kirilenko https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=17ah5N4oHP0

You just cherry pick what you want to fit your narrative. You even convinced yourself that kirilenko is as fast as this guy https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=D_Z22PZhF10

Like i said for his size ak47 was very fast. He ain't no mj though dude. Not even close.

[Baller789]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?499803-Players-who-won-a-ship-while-leading-their-team-in-pts-rbds-asts-in-the-finals

Trying to be slick trying to passoff Kirilenko as the same level perimeter defender as peak PEDron James is just sad.

[Johnny32]

find any yet?

[Johnny32]

00/10s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

bowen
christie
kobe
artest
ak47
prince
battier
lebron
thabo
g. wallace
iggy
deng
pg13
butler
kawhi
giannis
dray
danny green
andre roberson
robert covington
klay
simmons

80/90s wing defenders 6'6 or taller that made an all defensive team.

mj
rodney mccray
rodman
pippen
majerle
derrick mckey
eddie jones

rip

guess not.

[And1AllDay]

dont 4get jeffrey hornycek :oldlol:

[3ba11]

There were just as many tall athletic defenders but It wasn't a perimeter game, so almost no one got recognition

Jordan began the trend of the NBA recognizing many perimeter defenders - guys like Doug Christie, Bowen, or Roberson wouldn't be recognized back then just like Augmon, Drexler and Grant Hill didn't get recognition

[aj1987]

There were just as many tall athletic defenders but It wasn't a perimeter game, so almost no one got recognition

Jordan began the trend of the NBA recognizing many perimeter defenders - guys like Doug Christie, Bowen, or Roberson wouldn't be recognized back then just like Augmon, Drexler and Grant Hill didn't get recognition

Dumars? Coop? Sidney? Bobby Jones? DJ? Chaney? Robertston? McCray? Cheeks? Wilkes?



I could keep going for years. Literally every single one of them was known as a perimeter defensive stopper.