No seriously.. On what planet would MJ be .500 with a team of HOF's

[3ba11]

On what planet would he basically never win 60 games with super-teams, or turn hand-picked preseason favorites into perennial underdogs instead of soaring dynasties?

Unfortunately, people don't understand the concept of brand of ball, so they can't understand how frontcourt ball-dominance is wildly suboptimal and yields weaker teams that get upset in the playoffs (09' and 10'), or mostly lose with super-teams (11-17').

[RRR3]

On what planet would LeBron? AD doesn’t equal a team of HOFers.

[Dengness9]

In denial about the existence of Russell Westbrook?

I would be too. Not mad at you

[3ba11]

On what planet would LeBron? AD doesn’t equal a team of HOFers.


Lebron wasn't the top producer for that regular season or Playoffs.. He was the Pippen that season.

When was MJ the pippen in a series or playoff run?

Lebron never won without super-teams as the clear-cut top producer, while Jordan ALWAYS won that way (6 times)

[RRR3]

In denial about the existence of Russell Westbrook?

I would be too. Not mad at you
Westbrook hasn’t been a superstar in years. He hasn’t even been all star the last two years lmfao. You’re just proving you know nothing about basketball. It’s like saying MJ played with superstar Robert Parish.

[RRR3]

Lebron wasn't the top producer for that regular season or Playoffs.. He was the Pippen that season.

When was MJ the pippen in a series or playoff run?

Lebron never won without super-teams as the clear-cut top producer, while Jordan ALWAYS won that way (6 times)
You lied about playing college basketball :(

[Johnny32]

imagine pretending melo, howard and westbrook are currently superstars.

[John8204]

On the planet where MJ had to rebuild his fourth championship team because of free agency and the development of superteams. Michael took his ball and went home because he couldn't do a rebuild and we saw what happened when he tried to redo the Bulls system in Washington...they failed.

[Johnny32]

On the planet where MJ had to rebuild his fourth championship team because of free agency and the development of superteams. Michael took his ball and went home because he couldn't do a rebuild and we saw what happened when he tried to redo the Bulls system in Washington...they failed.

teams also couldn't build a championship contender seemingly overnight in mj's era because of the lack of player movement. there's far more competition to win a ring now now than ever before.

[RRR3]

imagine pretending melo, howard and westbrook are currently superstars.
Imagine pretending they’re even above average. LeBron haters are retarded.

[Dengness9]

Did you just compare current 33 year old Westbrook to 43 year old Robert Parish? Now I know you don’t know anything about basketball. You reached as far as anyone can, impressive. I respect how desperate you’ve become so quickly here

[Johnny32]

Imagine pretending they’re even above average. LeBron haters are retarded.

i can't fully blame them though. his sustained greatness has driven them to this point.

[Dengness9]

Lebron started superteams of players in their primes. Lebron has only himself to blame. Deal with it bro. Excuses are like **** and you’re at minimum bisexual.

[3ba11]

On the planet where MJ had to rebuild his fourth championship team because of free agency and the development of superteams. Michael took his ball and went home because he couldn't do a rebuild and we saw what happened when he tried to redo the Bulls system in Washington...they failed.


Lebron simply amasses enough talent to win (team-hopping)

so he's a talent-based winner because his frontcourt ball-dominance can't develop sufficient chemistry - specifically, he imposes spot-up roles that stall young players, thereby needing ready-made stars to win (team-hopping, talent-based winning)...

Talent-based winning loses to organic ball movement, so Lebron has a lottery record against the Spurs, Mavs and Warriors.

[Johnny32]

Lebron simply amasses enough talent to win (team-hopping)

so he's a talent-based winner because his ball-dominant skillset imposes spot-up roles that stall young players, thereby needing ready-made stars to win (team-hopping, talent-based winning)...

Talent-based winning loses to organic ball movement, so Lebron has a lottery record against the Spurs, Mavs and Warriors.

speaking of stalling young players. jordan slapped monk in the head and benched him. with lebron he looks like a young future star.

[RRR3]

Lebron started superteams of players in their primes. Lebron has only himself to blame. Deal with it bro. Excuses are like **** and you’re at minimum bisexual.
You sound psychotic.

[Dengness9]

You’re confused. That slap has propelled Monk to future greatness. MJ literally wiped excellence on Monk. Obviously.

[Dengness9]

I am. Thanks for noticing brother

[Kblaze8855]

Westbrook hasn’t been a superstar in years. He hasn’t even been all star the last two years lmfao. You’re just proving you know nothing about basketball. It’s like saying MJ played with superstar Robert Parish.


Random trivia….

Westbrook last year had a higher ppg than Parish career high and more rebounds than Parish averaged in 19 of his seasons. Not that it has anything to do with anything it’s just amusing to me.

[John8204]

Lebron started superteams of players in their primes. Lebron has only himself to blame. Deal with it bro. Excuses are like **** and you’re at minimum bisexual.

LOL we literally had a finals between super teams in the 80's.

1983 76ers vs 1983 LA Lakers

Dr J - Nets
Jones - Nuggets
Malone - Rockets

Kareem - Bucks
McAdoo - Nets
Wilkes - Warriors

[beasted]

Westbrook hasn’t been a superstar in years. He hasn’t even been all star the last two years lmfao. You’re just proving you know nothing about basketball. It’s like saying MJ played with superstar Robert Parish.

You're a dumbass to reach that badly. Russell is 33. Parish was 43.

[3ba11]

LOL we literally had a finals between super teams in the 80's.

1983 76ers vs 1983 LA Lakers

Dr J - Nets
Jones - Nuggets
Malone - Rockets

Kareem - Bucks
McAdoo - Nets
Wilkes - Warriors


Lebron had the only super-teams from 2011-2016, and they were preseason favorites (the on-paper, talent favorite), but inferior brand of ball ceded favorite status to others as the season progressed

[John8204]

No MJ played with 33 year old George Gervin and he ran him out of the league

[3ba11]

No MJ played with 33 year old George Gervin and he ran him out of the league


Gervin played exactly 1 minute total in the 86' Playoffs

[Johnny32]

Lebron had the only super-teams from 2011-2016, and they were preseason favorites (the on-paper, talent favorite), but inferior brand of ball ceded favorite status to others as the season progressed

hurrr, going by your tard logic...bos had 5 future hofers, sas had 4, gsw had 3, okc had 3, durrr.

[RRR3]

Random trivia….

Westbrook last year had a higher ppg than Parish career high and more rebounds than Parish averaged in 19 of his seasons. Not that it has anything to do with anything it’s just amusing to me.
And his advanced stats were terrible and the wizards are better without him. Pretending he’s still good is ridiculous and not based in reality.

[RRR3]

You're a dumbass to reach that badly. Russell is 33. Parish was 43.
Is Russell still good? It’s the same reasoning, it’s like saying LeBron played with Shaq.

[3ba11]

hurrr, going by your tard logic...bos had 5 future hofers, sas had 4, gsw had 3, okc had 3, durrr.


OKC wasn't a super-team because Harden was a bench player and sucked.

Boston was post-injury and a bummy 50-win team in 2010 - they were led by Rondo and a massive underdog when they faced the league favorite Cavs.

Klay/Dray weren't even all-stars heading into 2015, while Love/Kyrie were perennial all-stars, so the Cavs were favored in 15' and 16' preseason.

Only Lebron had the #2 player in the league (Wade), and 2 of the top 5 PER's, or 3 perennial all-stars

[John8204]

Lebron had the only super-teams from 2011-2016, and they were preseason favorites (the on-paper, talent favorite), but inferior brand of ball ceded favorite status to others as the season progressed

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_NBA_All-Star_Game
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_NBA_All-Star_Game

Bull...Spurs, Lakers, Celtics, Thunder, and Warriors...plenty of "super" teams during that era

[John8204]

Gervin played exactly 1 minute total in the 86' Playoffs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbYhWOzqxD0

And MJ told a 33 year old HOF that he sucked he wasn't good enough and he should retire.

[Johnny32]

OKC wasn't a super-team because Harden was a bench player and sucked.

San Antonio was old and didn't have 3 perennial all-stars like the Heat or Cavs

Boston was post-injury and a bummy 50-win team in 2010 - they were led by Rondo and a massive underdog when they faced the league favorite Cavs.

Only Lebron had the #2 player in the league (Wade), and 2 of the top 5 PER's, or 3 perennial all-stars

again...going by the tard logic you set in this topic context doesn't matter.

[3ba11]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_NBA_All-Star_Game
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_NBA_All-Star_Game

Bull...Spurs, Lakers, Celtics, Thunder, and Warriors...plenty of "super" teams during that era


Nope - only Lebron's team was a super-team

In 2010, Wade had the #2 PER, BPM, VORP and WS/48... So that's like Magic teaming up with Bird or Kobe with Tmac... UNPRECEDENTED... :confusedshrug:

[Johnny32]

fun fact: lebron is currently older than everyone on the 2013 spurs roster.

[3ba11]

fun fact: lebron is currently older than everyone on the 2013 spurs roster.


Funny that you bring up the 2013 season

That's when Lebron averaged 16 on 39% thru the first 3 games of the Finals, while teammates staved off an 0-3 deficit.. His 23 on 43% was insufficient thru 6 games and needed Ray Allen to force Game 7.. Lebron had a zero plus/minus and negative net rating for the series, so the Heat didn't win with him on the floor..

Finally, Lebron averaged 25 on 45% for the series (not dominant), while having an equal-scoring partner to attract equal defensive attention, and therefore didn't face maximum defensive attention like MJ always did.

[Johnny32]

Funny that you bring up the 2013 season

That's when Lebron averaged 16 on 39% thru the first 3 games of the Finals, while teammates staved off an 0-3 deficit.. His 23 on 43% was insufficient thru 6 games and needed Ray Allen to force Game 7.. Lebron had a zero plus/minus and negative net rating for the series, so the Heat didn't win with him on the floor..

Finally, Lebron averaged 25 on 45% for the series (not dominant), while having an equal-scoring partner to attract equal defensive attention, and therefore didn't face maximum defensive attention like MJ always did.

25 ppg, 11 rpg, 7 apg on 45%? that's better than every mj finals from 96-98 lol. no wonder you're so insecure and desperate.

[Johnny32]

25 ppg, 11 rpg, 7 apg on 45%? that's better than every mj finals from 96-98 lol. no wonder you're so insecure and desperate.

oh and lebron wasn't the worst starting defender on his team on the other end like mj lol.

[3ba11]

25 ppg, 11, rpg, 7 apg on 45%? that's better than every mj finals from 96-98 lol. no wonder you're so insecure and desperate.


Lebron only averaged 25 ppg with a near-equal scoring partner - that's a joke

His 23 on 43% was insufficient thru 6 games, so he should've averaged 27 on 42% like 96' MJ

[Phoenix]

Funny that you bring up the 2013 season

That's when Lebron averaged 16 on 39% thru the first 3 games of the Finals, while teammates staved off an 0-3 deficit.. His 23 on 43% was insufficient thru 6 games and needed Ray Allen to force Game 7.. Lebron had a zero plus/minus and negative net rating for the series, so the Heat didn't win with him on the floor..



Dude, MJ had games in the 97 Heat series where he went 4/15 and 9/35. He was 3/18 in game 3 vs Knicks 1993 and could have gone down 0-3 if not for Pippen's 29 on 10/12. The only reason the Bulls even won that game was because the Knicks leading scorer, Ewing, had 21 points and no-one else had more than 12( Mason off the bench). Hell, John Paxson off the bench in that game had 14, Starks and Oakley combined had that much. Stop acting like MJ was a miracle in every single game of his career. He had shit games like everyone else every so often.

Dear 3nutball,

Kindly cease and desist talking about Michael Jordan as you are ruining his legacy with dumb ass arguments.

Universally signed,

Actual Michael Jordan fans

[Kblaze8855]

And his advanced stats were terrible and the wizards are better without him. Pretending he’s still good is ridiculous and not based in reality.

I don’t care if you think he’s good. You seem like the type to think he’s been bad most of his hall of fame career. I just find it amusing the washed Russell put up 22/12/12. And after all this time you must know I don’t care about anyones advanced anything no matter if it supports what I’m saying or not. You only selectively care yourself as is usually the case. You certainly don’t care about Goberts.

And the Wizards have lost 13 of 19 by the way. That fell apart rather quickly.

And again I don’t care about your 3ball argument. The name parish just stood out to me and I immediately wondered if he ever had a season better than the washed Russell you compared him to.

[MadDog]

I don’t care if you think he’s good. You seem like the type to think he’s been bad most of his hall of fame career. I just find it amusing the washed Russell put up 22/12/12. And after all this time you must know I don’t care about anyones advanced anything no matter if it supports what I’m saying or not. You only selectively care yourself as is usually the case. You certainly don’t care about Goberts.

And the Wizards have lost 13 of 19 by the way. That fell apart rather quickly.

And again I don’t care about your 3ball argument. The name parish just stood out to me and I immediately wondered if he ever had a season better than the washed Russell you compared him to.

Russ began last year slow then turned it around the second half of the year. He's looked mediocre next to LeBron (the two aren't exactly a perfect fit), but that could be because of the role he's playing. As bad as Westbrook's looked, I think he's got game left.

[Kblaze8855]

I’m not sure when it changed last season but somehow I stumbled over some wizards game and he was pushing the pace like magic Johnson. I’m talking grab the rebound and sprint full speed or just turn and fling it 70 feet for a dunk over and over and over. I figured it was a fluke but I watched a couple more and it was still happening.

Started to get some of that showtime effect where people you never saw run before committed to it because they knew somebody was looking for them from 50 feet away. I was actually wondering why he didn’t do more of that years ago. I don’t have or care about the numbers on pace but just looking at the games….it was cool.

Rooks and vets sprinting all out and Russ just throwing touchdowns. I just like to see something different now and then and for a while there they were.

[StrongLurk]

MJ couldn't even play ball at Bron's age :roll:

What's even more pathetic is MJ would shit all over OP's actions and want nothing to do with him...OP is just that desperate and miserable.

[TheCorporation]

Did you just compare current 33 year old Westbrook to 43 year old Robert Parish? Now I know you don’t know anything about basketball. You reached as far as anyone can, impressive. I respect how desperate you’ve become so quickly here

This retard reads 3ball posts and says someone else reaches further :lol

Must be a new rookie fan again *sigh* Read more, type less.

[RRR3]

I don’t care if you think he’s good. You seem like the type to think he’s been bad most of his hall of fame career. I just find it amusing the washed Russell put up 22/12/12. And after all this time you must know I don’t care about anyones advanced anything no matter if it supports what I’m saying or not. You only selectively care yourself as is usually the case. You certainly don’t care about Goberts.

And the Wizards have lost 13 of 19 by the way. That fell apart rather quickly.

And again I don’t care about your 3ball argument. The name parish just stood out to me and I immediately wondered if he ever had a season better than the washed Russell you compared him to.
No. Russ was really good in his prime. The amount of possessions he needs to achieve those stats makes them unimpressive and he achieves those rebound totals by not playing defense. Unless you think it’s somehow a coincidence he’s turned a team that was a first seed two years in a row when healthy into a .500 team. I rate Gobert highly, just not ridiculously highly like Xiao does so weird point.

[Kblaze8855]

Point out to me the 20/12 assist people who didn’t have the ball to do it. I certainly can’t think of any. And he turned the lakers into whatever they are….not the combined 25 or whatever games AD and Lebron missed? Have the lakers even had a “When healthy”? to talk about this year? How many games have all 3 played in healthy? 10-15?

Lebron teams have had multiple stars and take half a year to look better than average. What did the Heat start out that first year with a prime Wade and Lebron? Like 9-9 or so?

Nobody knows anything after 10-15 games. That team is just old and beat up.

[Hey Yo]

OKC wasn't a super-team because Harden was a bench player and sucked.

Boston was post-injury and a bummy 50-win team in 2010 - they were led by Rondo and a massive underdog when they faced the league favorite Cavs.

Klay/Dray weren't even all-stars heading into 2015, while Love/Kyrie were perennial all-stars, so the Cavs were favored in 15' and 16' preseason.

Only Lebron had the #2 player in the league (Wade), and 2 of the top 5 PER's, or 3 perennial all-stars

If OKC wasn't a superteam because the 6MOY played bad in the 2012 Finals, then that means 2014 Heat and 15 and 16 Cavs weren't superteams.

Thanks for confirming.

[RRR3]

Point out to me the 20/12 assist people who didn’t have the ball to do it. I certainly can’t think of any. And he turned the lakers into whatever they are….not the combined 25 or whatever games AD and Lebron missed? Have the lakers even had a “When healthy”? to talk about this year? How many games have all 3 played in healthy? 10-15?

Lebron teams have had multiple stars and take half a year to look better than average. What did the Heat start out that first year with a prime Wade and Lebron? Like 9-9 or so?

Nobody knows anything after 10-15 games. That team is just old and beat up.
I mean they’re significantly worse with Westbrook on the court. These are just facts. LeBron is playing off ball a lot more to help him and he still stinks. 20 PPG isn’t worth much when you’re taking 18 shots to achieve it in a league that prizes efficiency. He’s essentially Ricky Davis at this point in his career.

[Kblaze8855]

Oh yeah the league prizes it. They prize it so much they put it in incentives that get players to protect it even when harming it might help the team. I don’t really blame the players though. If you don’t want guys playing for the numbers stop paying them for it. Who was the guy recently who didn’t take a three the last game of the season to ensure a bonus he was one miss from not getting?

Cant remember. It was funny though.

And being Ricky Davis wouldn’t make you bad either. Or average. Be a bonehead but still one of the 2-3 best players on most nba teams. Isn’t exactly being garbage but I know we live in a world of extremes.

[RRR3]

Oh yeah the league prizes it. They prize it so much they put it in incentives that get players to protect it even when harming it might help the team. I don’t really blame the players though. If you don’t want guys playing for the numbers stop paying them for it. Who was the guy recently who didn’t take a three the last game of the season to ensure a bonus he was one miss from not getting?

Cant remember. It was funny though.

And being Ricky Davis wouldn’t make you bad either. Or average. Be a bonehead but still one of the 2-3 best players on most nba teams. Isn’t exactly being garbage but I know we live in a world of extremes.
Ricky Davis was bad. You are confusing ability with how much they help a team. No doubt Westbrook could still be good if he played intelligently. He’s not as freakishly athletic as he used to be so he can’t get away with being a bonehead anymore. Also his skills have deteriorated, he’s become a much worse shooter and much clumsier with the ball. He will be out of the league before LeBron is.

[RRR3]

When I say a player is bad I mean they are bad at the role the team is giving them before Kblaze gives me his “well there’s 500 players in the league technically…”. Westbrook is 100% bad at the role the Lakers have given him.

[Kblaze8855]

Literally 100% of the players I’ve ever seen called bad on ISH were better than average. Every single one. It’s actually pretty funny.

Ricky did some things I would call cancerous from a “That’s not how you play the game…” point of view but he was never one of his teams worst players in his prime. “Bad” just get redefined by some fans in such a way they can ignore 300 players they couldn’t identify in a headshot.

And potentially being out of the league before Lebron means what? He’s a 14 year veteran who is like 33 or 34. 35 is about the usual age to be done. He’s had a long healthy career. Did more than most in the hall ever did. Career is wrapping up nicely compared to a lot of these guys looking flabby and sick taking curtain calls at the end.

[ShawkFactory]

Aleks Poku is bad

[TheGoatest]

#NEVERFORGET

Jordan got swept in the first round with this guy on his team:

https://images4.imagebam.com/45/20/8a/ME68INB_o.jpg