Stockton carried Jazz to 97' Finals with historic series walk-off in Barkley's face

[3ba11]

21/4/10 on 54% (46% threes) in WCF

This is part of the "dominant 90's sidekick series", since nearly every 90's sidekick were go-to players that took over various series with dominant stats and were 1b co-leaders..

Payton (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?502964-Gary-Payton-ragdolled-Hakeem-s-back-to-back-champs-in-1996), Porter (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?502705-In-the-92-WCF-Terry-Porter-averaged-26-4-8-on-52-threes-(6-attempts)), Stockton, KJ, Penny, Kemp and others were 1b co-leaders in many series and completely dominated with top-tier stats

[Johnny32]

stockton is probably the first player in nba history to average 20 ppg in a playoff series.

[3ba11]

stockton is probably the first player in nba history to average 20 ppg in a playoff series.


Stockton is in the conversation for top 2 playmaker all-time - he turned a stiff football physique like Malone into a bigger scorer than Lebron (as of today's date, Malone is still ahead of Lebron).

If Stockton made life so easy for Karl and made Karl the goat top 2 scorer, then what would he do for MJ?.. heck, if Pippen's 5 apg and mid-tier playmaking helped Jordan, then what would Stockton's 15 apg and goat steals or BPM do?

[Johnny32]

stockton and malone lost in the 1st rd 9 times. they didn't sniff the finals until their mid 30s when the west became a joke. i understand you're desperately trying to hype up jordone's laughable finals competition but it isn't going to work. sorry.

[3ba11]

stockton and malone lost in the 1st rd 9 times. they didn't sniff the finals until their mid 30s when the west became a joke. i understand you're desperately trying to hype up jordone's laughable finals competition but it isn't going to work. sorry.


I'm pointing out the obvious that everyone else had go-to teammates except Jordan - everyone else had guys that achieved elite scoring and/or assists.... except jordan

If Stockton made life so easy for Karl and made Karl the goat top 2 scorer, then what would he do for MJ?.. heck, if Pippen's 5 apg and mid-tier playmaking helped Jordan, then what would Stockton's 15 apg and goat steals or BPM do?

[Round Mound]

3-ball i know you've been trying to get my attention on some of your posts. Stockton was the 3rd best PG from 85 to 98. He was a great player but most don't view him as that because he wasn't flashy. Stockon designed alot of Malone's scoring. Barkley with KJ didn't work well since both had 1st drive or score mentality. You also bash Barkley in the 94 and 95 play-offs forgeting that he was injured for some crucial games. In the 93 finals KJ played horrible. Pippen was better than any other side kick that did not play with Jordan. Pippen was a not a shooter but a capable 20 PPG scorer, capable of almost 9 rpg and still dish 5-6 apg while playing the best defense for any SF in the 90's. Sometimes its not a good idea to have too many scorers on your team (example today's Lakers) but defenders, rebounders and playmakers.

[3ba11]

3-ball i know you've been trying to get my attention on some of your posts. Stockton was the 3rd best PG from 85 to 98. He was a great player but most don't view him as that because he wasn't flashy. Stockon designed alot of Malone's scoring. Barkley with KJ didn't work well since both had 1st drive or score mentality. You also bash Barkley in the 94 and 95 play-offs forgeting that he was injured for some crucial games. In the 93 finals KJ played horrible. Pippen was better than any other side kick that did not play with Jordan. Pippen was a not a shooter but a capable 20 PPG scorer, capable of almost 9 rpg and still dish 5-6 apg while playing the best defense for any SF in the 90's. Sometimes its not a good idea to have too many scorers on your team (example today's Lakers) but defenders, rebounders and playmakers.


Everyone's best was better than Pippen's

Every sidekick averaged 25-30 in numerous big series or 8-12 apg (elite scoring or passing), while Pippen never did - so everyone else comnanded defensive attention like a go-to player, except Pippen, because Pippen wasn't a threat to dominate.. He was an athlete/dunker that was propped up by the triangle and dynasty chemistry (system player).. The timeline of his career shows this

[1987_Lakers]

3-ball i know you've been trying to get my attention on some of your posts. Stockton was the 3rd best PG from 85 to 98. He was a great player but most don't view him as that because he wasn't flashy. Stockon designed alot of Malone's scoring. Barkley with KJ didn't work well since both had 1st drive or score mentality. You also bash Barkley in the 94 and 95 play-offs forgeting that he was injured for some crucial games. In the 93 finals KJ played horrible. Pippen was better than any other side kick that did not play with Jordan. Pippen was a not a shooter but a capable 20 PPG scorer, capable of almost 9 rpg and still dish 5-6 apg while playing the best defense for any SF in the 90's. Sometimes its not a good idea to have too many scorers on your team (example today's Lakers) but defenders, rebounders and playmakers.

It's amazing 3ball still doesn't understand this concept. It's all about scoring for him, while completely ignoring every other aspect.

[3ba11]

It's amazing 3ball still doesn't understand this concept. It's all about scoring for him, while completely ignoring every other aspect.


Everyone else needed scoring help - no one else won like Jordan won, so you're just lying.. You're saying that everyone else wins with no scoring help like Jordan, when nobody did.. ONLY JORDAN won a bunch of chips with no scoring help - only Jordan won with the role player shit you're talking about (he won without scoring help, while everyone else needed a bunch of star scoring help)

So you're fos

[Johnny32]

fun fact: pippen averaged more ppg in the 91, 92 and 93 finals than stockton's 'vaunted' 97 wcf.

poor 3tard.

[Johnny32]

oh and pippen also averaged 24 or 25 ppg vs cle while getting hurrr, "maximum defensive attention" while jordone quit the game due to mental and physical exhaustion.

poor 3tard.

[3ba11]

oh and pippen also averaged 24 or 25 ppg vs cle while getting hurrr, "maximum defensive attention" while jordone quit the game due to mental and physical exhaustion.

poor 3tard.


A first round series against a team missing their entire starting 5?

You made my point

Stockton averaged 27/14 in a 1st Round series, but I didn't bring it up because it was 1st Round and I assumed you aren't an idiot.. I guess that assumption was wrong

[3ba11]

fun fact: pippen averaged more ppg in the 91, 92 and 93 finals than stockton's 'vaunted' 97 wcf.

poor 3tard.


Stockton was a co-scoring leader in many series, while Pippen was always carried

You guys stress that scoring help isn't everything, except everyone else needed it except Jordan

no one else won a bunch of chips without star scoring help and juggernaut go-to scorers except Jordan... No one else won with JUST the role player shit you guys talk about (rebounds, passing, hustle) - only Jordan won with just that and no scoring help

[Johnny32]

Stockton was a co-scoring leader in many series, while Pippen was always carried

You guys stress that scoring isn't everything, except no one else won a bunch of chips without star scoring help and juggernaut go-to scorers except Jordan... No one else won with JUST the role player shit you guys talk about (rebounds, passing, hustle) - only Jordan won with just that and no scoring help

stockton scoring less than pippen in the wcf is "star scoring help"

pippen scoring more than stockton did in the wcf in back to back to back finals "isn't star scoring help"

3tard logic.

[Johnny32]

Stockton was a co-scoring leader in many series, while Pippen was always carried

You guys stress that scoring help isn't everything, except everyone else needed it except Jordan

no one else won a bunch of chips without star scoring help and juggernaut go-to scorers except Jordan... No one else won with JUST the role player shit you guys talk about (rebounds, passing, hustle) - only Jordan won with just that and no scoring help

hurrr, stockton isn't facing maximum defensive attention with malone on the court, durrr

it's kind of fun to use your stupid ass tard logic against you. enjoy!

[3ba11]

stockton scoring less than pippen in the wcf is "star scoring help"

pippen scoring more than stockton did in the wcf in back to back to back finals "isn't star scoring help"

3tard logic.


They both scored the same except Stockton averaged elite assists and Pippen never did

Since everyone had elite scoring or passing threats at sidekick except Jordan, only Jordan faced maximum defensive attention (carried scoring load in every series - no one else was a threat)

You guys stress that scoring help isn't everything, except everyone else needed it except Jordan

no one else won a bunch of chips without star scoring help and juggernaut go-to scorers except Jordan... No one else won with JUST the role player shit you guys talk about (rebounds, passing, hustle) - only Jordan won with just that and no scoring help

[Johnny32]

They both scored the same except Stockton averaged elite assists and Pippen never did

So everyone had elite scoring or passing sidekicks except Jordan.

You guys stress that scoring help isn't everything, except everyone else needed it except Jordan

no one else won a bunch of chips without star scoring help and juggernaut go-to scorers except Jordan... No one else won with JUST the role player shit you guys talk about (rebounds, passing, hustle) - only Jordan won with just that and no scoring help

false. pippen scored more in every finals i mentioned. you were also typing about "star scoring help" and only focus on ppg in your tard topics. it's hilarious watching you desperately squirm.

[3ba11]

false. pippen scored more in every finals i mentioned. you were also typing about "star scoring help" and only focus on ppg in your tard topics. it's hilarious watching you desperately squirm.


Stockton and Pippen both averaged 21 ppg, except Stockton had elite assists and Pippen didn't - so ONLY JORDAN lacked elite scoring or passing help at sidekick.

Stockton also co-led many series while Pippen was always carried, and Stockton was #1 option in the clutch (Stockton nearly tied MJ for clutch points in 97' Playoffs, aka last 5 within 5), while Pippen wasn't an option in the 4th quarter (Kukoc, Kerr, Paxson and BJ were better options).

You guys stress that scoring help isn't everything, except everyone else needed it except Jordan - only Jordan carried the scoring load in every series and never had a go-to teammate

[Johnny32]

Stockton was a co-scoring leader in many series, while Pippen was always carried

You guys stress that scoring help isn't everything, except everyone else needed it except Jordan

no one else won a bunch of chips without star scoring help and juggernaut go-to scorers except Jordan... No one else won with JUST the role player shit you guys talk about (rebounds, passing, hustle) - only Jordan won with just that and no scoring help

3tard trying to add elite playmaking to his tard narrative is hilarious to me. you lost 30 mins ago. you can fk off now.

[3ba11]

3tard trying to add elite playmaking to his tard narrative is hilarious to me. you lost 30 mins ago. you can fk off now.


You guys stress that scoring help isn't everything, except everyone else needed tons of it except Jordan

Lol y'all dumb as shit

[1987_Lakers]

You guys stress that scoring help isn't everything, except everyone else needed tons of it except Jordan

Lol y'all dumb as shit

Not gonna factor in that MJ played in the 90's where most 2nd options weren't legit scorers to begin with? Knicks, Pacers, Jazz, '94 Rockets, were all championship contenders without a 2nd scorer and Pippen was outscoring every 2nd option in the 1st 3 peat.

You're dumb as shit.

[jstern]

stockton and malone lost in the 1st rd 9 times. they didn't sniff the finals until their mid 30s when the west became a joke. i understand you're desperately trying to hype up jordone's laughable finals competition but it isn't going to work. sorry.

If I remember correctly, all but one of the teams that the Jazz lost to from 1990 to 98 went to the Finals or won the championship. I know at least 4 of them won the championship.

I normally don't respond in the main NBA forum, but when you think back to the era and how good those Jazz teams were, it's hard to imagine that there are going to be people who were not even born yet telling others that it wasn't a good team because of this or that out of context stat.

It's the reason why I only go to the Off the Court Lounge (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?7-Off-the-Court-Lounge).

[Johnny32]

the jazz were the whipping boys of the 80s and 90s in the postseason until the west fell off a cliff. those of us who actually watched it know. those who didn't make desperate excuses and hide on another board. now go pretend elsewhere.

[Johnny32]

Former Jazz guard Blue Edwards, who has played the last two seasons with the Vancouver Grizzlies, gave Vancouver reporters in October an interesting perspective on why the Jazz never won a title. He recalled the 1992 conference finals against Portland:

"The thing that really bothered me was that even before the series was over, there were a couple of guys who were talking about 'There's no way we're going to beat Chicago. We may as well go and lay down now.' "

"These guys were All-Stars [John Stockton and Malone are the only All-Stars], they were our best players the next couple of games, we basically quit. That was the reason. If you have your best players quitting, your support people aren't going to be there."

lol heart of a champion is a thing and these two clowns clearly didn't have it.

[HoopsNY]

21/4/10 on 54% (46% threes) in WCF

This is part of the "dominant 90's sidekick series", since nearly every 90's sidekick were go-to players that took over various series with dominant stats and were 1b co-leaders..

Payton (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?502964-Gary-Payton-ragdolled-Hakeem-s-back-to-back-champs-in-1996), Porter (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?502705-In-the-92-WCF-Terry-Porter-averaged-26-4-8-on-52-threes-(6-attempts)), Stockton, KJ, Penny, Kemp and others were 1b co-leaders in many series and completely dominated with top-tier stats

Pippen in the '90 series against Milwaukee put up 23/9/8/3/2 on 63% TS%. He wasn't 1b to Jordan, but if you're gonna champion guys putting up 20-25 PPG, 5-10 rebs, and 5-10 assists, on great efficiency, then Pippen has plenty of that.

[ArbitraryWater]

21 ppg? is that his best scoring series that year?

Lol

[sdot_thadon]

If Stockton made life so easy for Karl and made Karl the goat top 2 scorer, then what would he do for MJ?.. heck, if Pippen's 5 apg and mid-tier playmaking helped Jordan, then what would Stockton's 15 apg and goat steals or BPM do?
My money's on get punched in practice.

[Phoenix]

Stockton averaged like 10 points in the 98 finals. He's not the one you want to use to make whatever argument you're trying to.

[SouBeachTalents]

Stockton averaged like 10 points in the 98 finals. He's not the one you want to use to make whatever argument you're trying to.
That's what's so funny about 3ball's attempts, Pippen outscored so many of these sidekicks he's trying to hype up. Porter, KJ, Stockton twice, hell he even outscored Magic.