The Emperor has no clothes - Draymond exposed for what he is

[3ba11]

his recent comments on his podcast expose that he's just an untalented.confidence man that gets over on the league.

The Warriors' system gives a great plus/minus to ANYONE that is willing to relish the non-scoring, break-pushing, defender role that their system offers - the key is that only unabashed bums who can't score like Draymond will relish such a role.

So Draymond will make the HOF not because of talent, but because of a delusional belief in himself that he belongs.. I think he's one of the most overrated frauds in sports that gets inflated because people have a proclivity to listen to a big mouth and confidence man.

[warriorfan]

He’s a role player hustle guy who was in the right place at the right time.

[3ba11]

He’s a role player hustle guy who was in the right place at the right time.


Boom

The Warriors needed a delusional confidence man in their hustler role and one came along

It could've easily been Anthony Mason in that role but Mason didn't luckbox the timing to land with a dynasty chemistry system that would elevate him to HOF

[Bronbron23]

Warriors would be shit without him. He's their best defender and playmaker.

[1987_Lakers]

More prisoner of the moment BS from OP, there is a reason why he always flip flops on his takes.

Draymond has never been a good scorer and he is on another level bad this year, but he was better offensively during his peak years in '16 & '17. He was the only player who showed up for the Warriors in that game 7 vs the Cavs in 2016, he has been an elite defender most of his career, even winning DPOY in '17, (these 2 bad games in the Finals don't change that fact), also believe he shot over 40% from 3 in the '17 postseason.

At his peak he was the most versatite PF ever besides maybe Garnett. You can't name many bigs who gave you the versatility Draymond gave you, whether it was his defense and being able to guard multiple positions, his ball-handling, & his crisp passing. Shit, just this past summer in the Olympics coach Pop had Draymond in the game during crunch time in alot of games and made a positive impact.

[3ba11]

Warriors would be shit without him. He's their best defender and playmaker.


He's the designated break-pusher so goat shooters/closers like Curry or Klay can play the transition shooter role and aren't pushing the ball themselves too often

It's an easy role that requires simple handle - no break-down handle needed and no "bag" needed.. And this role is only available on this team with the goat shooters & system

Dray's podcast ruined the little magic and confidence game that he had going - everyone knows that he's been getting by on sheer belief and savvy mastery of a system, rather than actual ability

[tpols]

IF the league allowed rugby rules he'd be great. And at home and in certain situations they do. They probably will in Game 4. And if not definitely game 5 at home.

But it's a disgrace. Its not hard to hand off to curry or Klay. Theres a million guys who could do that. Imagine Anthony mason just handing off to curry and laying his man out in the process. That's Drays whole offensive game. Along with absurdly rushed errant transition passes.

But in the switch happy league of today elite offenses can put him in a corner and isolate the weakest defender.

So dray has absolutely no impact (negative impact actually) UNLESS the refs allow him to goon guys.

Then it all opens up.

[Bronbron23]

He isn't a playmaker

He's the designated break-pusher so goat shooters/closers like Curry or Klay can play the transition shooter role and aren't pushing the ball themselves too often

It's an easy role that requires simple handle - no break-down handle needed and no "bag" needed.. And this role is only available on this team with the goat shooters & system

Dray's podcast ruined the little magic and confidence game that he had going - everyone knows that he's been getting by on sheer belief and savvy mastery of a system, rather than actual ability
I didn't say he's in a great playmaker I said he's their best playmaker.

And he's not just getting by on sheer belief all though sometimes that's just as important as skill. He's a skilled and elite defender. He can defend multiple positions. He's a decent passer. As a center basically he can get the rebound and push the ball like few in the league do. He can get in the oppositions head. He keeps his own teammates accountable. He gets the crown hype. He does lots of valuable things. Ya'll just hating.

[tpols]

More prisoner of the moment BS from OP, there is a reason why he always flip flops on his takes.

Draymond has never been a good scorer and he is on another level bad this year, but he was better offensively during his peak years in '16 & '17. He was the only player who showed up for the Warriors in that game 7 vs the Cavs in 2016, he has been an elite defender most of his career, even winning DPOY in '17, (these 2 bad games in the Finals don't change that fact), also believe he shot over 40% from 3 in the '17 postseason.

At his peak he was the most versatite PF ever besides maybe Garnett. You can't name many bigs who gave you the versatility Draymond gave you, whether it was his defense and being able to guard multiple positions, his ball-handling, & his crisp passing. Shit, just this past summer in the Olympics coach Pop had Draymond in the game during crunch time in alot of games and made a positive impact.

This is a total clown post. There are plenty of tough, big (way taller and bigger) power forwards who could do what dray does on defense while being far less of a liability on offense. You really don't have a clue. :oldlol:

[1987_Lakers]

This is a total clown post. There are plenty of tough, big (way taller and bigger) power forwards who could do what dray does on defense while being far less of a liability on offense. You really don't have a clue. :oldlol:

Coming from a guy who thinks Siakam > Giannis.

Dennis Rodman became a liability by like '97, even more so than current Draymond, yet you never hear people mention it or bring up those years to devalue his career. People look at his Detroit years & that first season with the Bulls in '96. Draymond overall will be remembered for being the defensive anchor, leader, & playmaker on probably the GOAT team, they are not gonna remember the 2 bad games he had in the Finals when he was past his prime and judge his entire career on it. Stop being a clown.

[AirBonner]

Op once said he was better than Rodman

[3ba11]

Op once said he was better than Rodman


Prime Dray was better than the old Rodman that the Bulls had, who wasn't the starter in the 98' Playoffs and averaged 3/8 for entire 97' Playoffs

But current Dray (triple single dray) is probably worse than any version of Rodman

[AirBonner]

Prime Dray was better than the old Rodman that the Bulls had, who wasn't the starter in the 98' Playoffs and averaged 3/8 for entire 97' Playoffs

Draymond is lucky to score 3 pts. I’d say they are on par

[3ba11]

Draymond is lucky to score 3 pts. I’d say they are on par

Agreed

[1987_Lakers]

Prime Dray was better than the old Rodman that the Bulls had, who wasn't the starter in the 98' Playoffs and averaged 3/8 for entire 97' Playoffs

Actually agree with you for once. '16-'19 Dray > Bulls Rodman. Although you can say '96 Rodman is better than current Draymond.

[3ba11]

Actually agree with you for once. '16-'19 Dray > Bulls Rodman. Although you can say '96 Rodman is better than current Draymond.


For sure

He shouldn't have exposed himself on that podcast - it ruined the magic and confidence game that he's relied on his entire career

[FultzNationRISE]

Shoot, if Dray is a role player what tf is Anderson Varejao??

Lebron got that dude PAID for having literally no basketball skills.

At least Dray can shoot the three a little bit (not in this series) and pass well. Plus hes an elite defender.

Lebron aint never had a role player like that.

[1987_Lakers]

Shoot, if Dray is a role player what tf is Anderson Varejao??

Lebron got that dude PAID for having literally no basketball skills.

At least Dray can shoot the three a little bit (not in this series) and pass well. Plus hes an elite defender.

Lebron aint never had a role player like that.

Big Facts.

[Spurs m8]

He’s a role player hustle guy who was in the right place at the right time.

This

I remember a few years ago talk of him being 'that guy' on a different team.....what a laugh that was

[dankok8]

Lots of people in this thread calling Draymond a decent/good passer. He's a great passer by just about any definition of great.

Everyone can have a bad couple of games. Even averaging 8 ppg. he's still a bit positive presence on the team because of all the other things he does well. He also tends to light a fire under his teammates and piss off opponents and take them off their games which are good traits to have.

[FultzNationRISE]

Big Facts.


Fam STAYS winning :pimp: :rockon: :banana:

[Hoopexpert]

He’s a role player hustle guy who was in the right place at the right time.

Plus he brings them that enforcer/motivator that the other more "gentle" guys like Klay and Steph NEED.

He is perfect for the warriors dynamic. A vocal leader and defensive stopper.

He had a bad game in g3. He will bounce back.

But its apparent to everyone that the warriors are unable to put together the same intense effort in G2 in back to back games. Its age.

Reminds me of the lakers in the later seasons of their dynasty. They were able to pull it out, but just not dominate teams anymore.

The same will be true of the warriors. They might be able to have one last go and pull it out against the celts.

[3ba11]

Plus he brings them that enforcer/motivator that the other more "gentle" guys like Klay and Steph NEED.

He is perfect for the warriors dynamic. A vocal leader and defensive stopper.

He had a bad game in g3. He will bounce back.

But its apparent to everyone that the warriors are unable to put together the same intense effort in G2 in back to back games. Its age.

Reminds me of the lakers in the later seasons of their dynasty. They were able to pull it out, but just not dominate teams anymore.

The same will be true of the warriors. They might be able to have one last go and pull it out against the celts.


Systems work best with less scorers and more chemistry, so low-scoring "filler" players are necessary components in a good system.

So guys like Dray are system players that are only impactful in great systems with dominant teammates.

These system players ride the wave of plus/minus as their "filler" role is an impactful chemistry-booster that the system needs.

Btw, the aspect of "more-chemistry-less-talent-needed" is one of the benefits of systems and chemistry over talent-based winning (team-hopping.. all-star team strategy).

And the Warriors are done.. They're wearing out and expending/discovering their limits (aka Poole), while the Celtics are trending up with R Williams beginning to dominate again after that injury

I actually wanted the off-ball Curry to match Lebron's ring count - this would elevate the case for Curry, MJ and Bird because their off-ball skillsets allows the caliber of teammate fits, chemistry and brand of ball to win organically.. Otoh, the "heliocentric" players (ball-dominators) make teammates stand in the corner and therefore lack the teammate fits, development or brand of ball to win organically.. All of this would be magnified with a organic Curry victory.

People forget that Lebron's talent-based approach (super-team formation) stole organic rings from 12' Durant, 13' Duncan and 16' Curry, which is why Durant had to respond by joining Warriors and getting his ring back.. Durant was about to win organically with the so-called Westbrick, but Lebron's veteran super-team collusion ruined the natural competitive environment.. It's simply been misreported to where only KD gets knocked for colluding when he was just responding

[jayfan]

his recent comments on his podcast expose that he's just an untalented.confidence man that gets over on the league.

The Warriors' system gives a great plus/minus to ANYONE that is willing to relish the non-scoring, break-pushing, defender role that their system offers - the key is that only unabashed bums who can't score like Draymond will relish such a role.

So Draymond will make the HOF not because of talent, but because of a delusional belief in himself that he belongs.. I think he's one of the most overrated frauds in sports that gets inflated because people have a proclivity to listen to a big mouth and confidence man.

Possibly your worst take.

[Phoenix]

Actually agree with you for once. '16-'19 Dray > Bulls Rodman. Although you can say '96 Rodman is better than current Draymond.

I'd take 96 Rodman over prime Draymond just on the basis of his rebounding and post defense. The Bulls could get away with single covering Shaq in 96 and staying home on the shooters. Shaq would have shat all over Draymond if he tried to defend him.

[SouBeachTalents]

Dray was legit during the Warriors Finals runs, in the playoffs he averaged 13/10/7/2/2 with elite defense from 2015-19, and was a legit top 15-20 player in the league in 2016. He has obviously declined significantly since then.

[SouBeachTalents]

I'd take 96 Rodman over prime Draymond just on the basis of his rebounding and post defense. The Bulls could get away with single covering Shaq in 96 and staying home on the shooters. Shaq would have shat all over Draymond if he tried to defend him.
I think they complimented their teams perfectly, and if you swapped them both of their teams would get a lot worse. Rodman as you said was capable of guarding someone like prime Shaq in single coverage, something Dray would never be capable of, and his presence on the boards was arguably the biggest factor in Chicago winning the Finals. Don't forget the Bulls frontcourt was exposed badly the year before against Orlando, as Shaq & Grant eviscerated Chicago's bigs. Meanwhile, Rodman was simply incapable of replicating the passing & playmaking that Dray provides on Golden State.

If you swapped them, Dray & Pippen, while providing insane defense, would be pretty redundant offensively, and Rodman's rebounding was more valuable than anything Dray would've provided on those Bulls imo. And I have absolutely no idea what the Warriors would do with Rodman, swapping him with Dray would make their offense significantly less effective.

[ShawkFactory]

his recent comments on his podcast expose that he's just an untalented.confidence man that gets over on the league.

The Warriors' system gives a great plus/minus to ANYONE that is willing to relish the non-scoring, break-pushing, defender role that their system offers - the key is that only unabashed bums who can't score like Draymond will relish such a role.

So Draymond will make the HOF not because of talent, but because of a delusional belief in himself that he belongs.. I think he's one of the most overrated frauds in sports that gets inflated because people have a proclivity to listen to a big mouth and confidence man.

Is this a bad thing..?

[Phoenix]

I think they complimented their teams perfectly, and if you swapped them both of their teams would get a lot worse. Rodman as you said was capable of guarding someone like prime Shaq in single coverage, something Dray would never be capable of, and his presence on the boards was arguably the biggest factor in Chicago winning the Finals. Don't forget the Bulls frontcourt was exposed badly the year before against Orlando, as Shaq & Grant eviscerated Chicago's bigs. Meanwhile, Rodman was simply incapable of replicating the passing & playmaking that Dray provides on Golden State.

If you swapped them, Dray & Pippen, while providing insane defense, would be pretty redundant offensively, and Rodman's rebounding was more valuable than anything Dray would've provided on those Bulls imo. And I have absolutely no idea what the Warriors would do with Rodman, swapping him with Dray would make their offense significantly less effective.

Yeah that's true, situationally they were in the perfect place for their respective skillsets.

[Bronbron23]

Shoot, if Dray is a role player what tf is Anderson Varejao??

Lebron got that dude PAID for having literally no basketball skills.

At least Dray can shoot the three a little bit (not in this series) and pass well. Plus hes an elite defender.

Lebron aint never had a role player like that.

I swear ya'll don't understand the game for shit. Dray wouldn't be able to be the role player he is with Bron. One of drays biggest strength is his ability to get the rebound and push the tempo. He wouldn't even get that opportunity in brons ball dominant system.

[ShawkFactory]

I swear ya'll don't understand the game for shit. Dray wouldn't be able to be the role player he is with Bron. One of drays biggest strength is his ability to get the rebound and push the tempo. He wouldn't even get that opportunity in brons ball dominant system.

How would a ball dominant offensive system prevent fast break opportunities after a rebound? Prime Lebron is one of the best transition players ever...they'd be pushing the tempo off of rebounds.

[RRR3]

How would a ball dominant offensive system prevent fast break opportunities after a rebound? Prime Lebron is one of the best transition players ever...they'd be pushing the tempo off of rebounds.
He’s not very smart, go easy on the poor guy.

[Bronbron23]

How would a ball dominant offensive system prevent fast break opportunities after a rebound? Prime Lebron is one of the best transition players ever...they'd be pushing the tempo off of rebounds.

Because the ball would be going to Bron. If dray got the rebound he'd have to outlet it to Bron immediately. Pretty basic shit buddy.

[Bronbron23]

He’s not very smart, go easy on the poor guy.

We'll I've called every game right this series so far. My guess is your dumbass hasn't:facepalm

[ShawkFactory]

Because the ball would be going to Bron. If dray got the rebound he'd have to outlet it to Bron immediately. Pretty basic shit buddy.

So...they wouldn't run in transition, is what you're saying?

[SouBeachTalents]

Because the ball would be going to Bron. If dray got the rebound he'd have to outlet it to Bron immediately. Pretty basic shit buddy.
That's not true at all. Wade & LeBron were absolutely lethal on the fast break together. Wade was not passing to LeBron immediately on fast break opportunities, I doubt Dray would do that either.

[Bronbron23]

That's not true at all. Wade & LeBron were absolutely lethal on the fast break together. Wade was not passing to LeBron immediately on fast break opportunities, I doubt Dray would do that either.

Bruh it's just math. Dray is the warriors best and main playmaker so he obviously gets the rock alot to make things happen offensively. On brons team he would no longer be the best playmaker. Bron is a considerably better playmaker so he would obviously get the ball alot more than dray to make plays. This is even more true in a ball dominant system. The philosophy of these systems is for the ball to be in the best playmakers hands most often. That would Bron not dray.

What do u thinks gonna happen to drays numbers when he goes from bringing up the ball 80 to times vs 30? Do you really think he'll maintain his numbers?

[Bronbron23]

So...they wouldn't run in transition, is what you're saying?

We'll brons teams in general run in transition less than the warriors do but dray would still get the opportunity to start the fast break he'd just get way less opportunity than he did with the Warriors.

I can't believe I have to explain this basic shit to ya'll. Throw dray with any ball dominant player and his numbers would be considerably less because he'd have the ball in his hands considerably less. What's so hard to understand about this:confusedshrug:

[ShawkFactory]

We'll brons teams in general run in transition less than the warriors do but dray would still get the opportunity to start the fast break he'd just get way less opportunity than he did with the Warriors.

I can't believe I have to explain this basic shit to ya'll. Throw dray with any ball dominant player and his numbers would be considerably less because he'd have the ball in his hands considerably less. What's so hard to understand about this:confusedshrug:

You weren't talking about his numbers. You were talking about pushing the tempo.

[Bronbron23]

You weren't talking about his numbers. You were talking about pushing the tempo.

It goes hand in hand. He gets alot of his offensive numbers from pushing the tempo. He'd get way less opportunity to push the tempo on brons team and that's why his numbers would suffer. This is very basic.

[ShawkFactory]

It goes hand in hand. He gets alot of his offensive numbers from pushing the tempo. He'd get way less opportunity to push the tempo on brons team and that's why his numbers would suffer. This is very basic.

This is where the disagreement comes. The last couple years the Lakers have been top 3 in fast break points, and this is with somewhat of a physical decline from Bron. Dray is good at converting a rebound into an up tempo situation, I agree. I don't know why Lebron would want it to be slowed down, especially if it means a transition bucket.

[Bronbron23]

This is where the disagreement comes. The last couple years the Lakers have been top 3 in fast break points, and this is with somewhat of a physical decline from Bron. Dray is good at converting a rebound into an up tempo situation, I agree. I don't know why Lebron would want it to be slowed down, especially if it means a transition bucket.
Because like Luka he believes having the ball in his hands is there best chance. Again it just comes down to opportunity. You don't actually think green gets the ball in his hands to playmake with Bron or Luka or harden or any ball dominant player as he would with the Warriors? I guess this is where we disagree. I think his opportunity to do this decreases drastically.

[1987_Lakers]

Because the ball would be going to Bron. If dray got the rebound he'd have to outlet it to Bron immediately. Pretty basic shit buddy.

Are people really this stupid or is this a troll post?

[hold this L]

Are people really this stupid or is this a troll post?
He is an MJ stan that hates Lebron and still ended up naming his username after Bron. Imagine how much of a mouth breathing moron you have to be.

[BarberSchool]

We all know a player we played with in HS, AAU, or UNI, who because of their obvious shows of physical effort, and loud vocal outbursts, obvious displays of passion, etc ….. they fool the unknowing/untalented/casual-fans into overvaluing them as players.

Guys who have no skill or talent themselves and this lesser ability to judge, football fans, most women, other fellow talentless hustle dorks, Steve Kerr, Tom Izzo, DrayÂ’s eye-rolling teammates Â…. These are the ones who support Draymond

[Bronbron23]

Are people really this stupid or is this a troll post?

It's a fact. Dray would be able to bring it sometimes but Bron would be the primary playmaker unlike in the Warriors system where Steph isn't ball dominant at all. This shit isn't even arguable

[StrongLurk]

OP is just mad the Warriors are down in the series right now. OP does not care about Draymond at all. You can tell because his posts about Dray in this thread are ignorant.

[DMAVS41]

I don't understand points like this.

Dray is currently not as good as he used to be...that is abundantly clear to anyone with a brain...his shooting has regressed from where is was back in their first title run and he's not the same defender or player...his current play doesn't somehow make him worse in the past.

Same thing with Westbrook...his current play does not somehow change how good he used to be.

Hell, just look at Klay...he can't defend at all...he can't go by anyone...and he's missing shots he used to make...the current version of Klay has no impact on how good he was before his injury.

[ClipperRevival]

Sorry but right now, Dray sucks. He brings almost nothing to the table outside of his solid D at times. But that's it. He no longer pushes and facilitates like he used too. Gets pushed around down low. That's on top of 4 on 5, he can't even hit 5 footers.

[warriorfan]

Sorry but right now, Dray sucks. He brings almost nothing to the table outside of his solid D at times. But that's it. He no longer pushes and facilitates like he used too. Gets pushed around down low. That's on top of 4 on 5, he can't even hit 5 footers.

Bjelica is no joke better than Dray right now….insane

[1987_Lakers]

This thread is a perfect example to why you can't overreact over a couple of games.

Draymond looked great to close out this series.

[3ba11]

This thread is a perfect example to why you can't overreact over a couple of games.

Draymond looked great to close out this series.


Draymond shot 12% on threes and 33% overall

The Warriors won in spite of him and he gets props and is kept around because of SHEER FAMILIARITY..

otherwise, he was a bum this year and a hindrance to the Warriors.. Again, if not for familiarity.

A healthy Robert Williams would be far better in Dray's place, for example

[AlternativeAcc.]

Draymond shot 12% on threes and 33% overall

The Warriors won in spite of him and he gets props and is kept around because of SHEER FAMILIARITY..

otherwise, he was a bum this year and a hindrance to the Warriors.. Again, if not for familiarity.

A healthy Robert Williams would be far better in Dray's place, for example

He's the emotional leader, similar to what pippen was for the Bulls

His locker room intangibles go far beyond the stat sheets. They don't win without dray... period.

Also, whyd you lie about the mods taking your account.. that's weak

[Lakers Legend#32]

No way he should be included in any "Big Three."

[1987_Lakers]

Draymond shot 12% on threes and 33% overall

The Warriors won in spite of him and he gets props and is kept around because of SHEER FAMILIARITY..

otherwise, he was a bum this year and a hindrance to the Warriors.. Again, if not for familiarity.


Spoken like someone who didn't watch the last two games in this series.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHPvcM246v0

[Shooter]

Spoken like someone who didn't watch the last two games in this series.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHPvcM246v0

Wrekt his ass :lol 3ball knows nothing