bball index picks their all nba and all defense teams (warning: heads may explode)

[post]

all nba

1st team

nikola jokic
giannis antetokounmpo
jayson tatum
stephen curry
trae young

2nd team

joel embiid
kevin durant
lebron james
dejounte murray
chris paul

3rd team

rudy gobert
jaren jackson jr.
pascal siakam
james harden
jrue holiday

all defense

1st team

rudy gobert
jaren jackson jr.
evan mobley
matisse thybulle
lonzo ball

2nd team

al horford
herbert jones
robert covington
marcus smart
kyle lowry

3rd team

nikola jokic
giannis antetokounmpo
draymond green
mikal bridges
jrue holiday

[ShawkFactory]

WTF lol

Jaren Jackson on 3rd team? :lol

[post]

WTF lol

Jaren Jackson on 3rd team? :lol

here's what they wrote about him

F: Jaren Jackson Jr.: JJJ earned our Comeback Player of the Year award this season, going from 11 games played to a durable contributor for Memphis. He was a strong contributor on offense, but his primary value was on defense, where he had the 2nd highest impact among Anchor Bigs this year.

From his 1st Team All-Defense writeup: JJJ had a breakout year, finishing 6th in D-LEBRON, after missing almost all of last year due to injury. He was 5th in our Rim Protection metric, establishing himself as an elite paint presence. He also showed versatility as a defender, finishing in the 75th percentile among bigs in our On-Ball Defense metric. 44.14% of the 2-pointers he contested resulted in blocks, which ranked 3rd this season among Bigs.

[post]

5 of the 6 forwards they picked for all nba were the same as the media picks but media had lebron 3rd team

here's what bball index wrote about derozan who was media 2nd team

F: DeMar DeRozan: If this were an All-Offense list, DDR would be another name referenced. The season’s 3rd highest impact Power Forward per 100 possessions offensively, he impacted games with his ability to dominate inside the 3-point line and with strong playmaking to support that scoring. His offense not being in the outlier range + very negative defensive impact held him off these lists, but he’s an exciting offensive player that had MVP candidate stretches of play this year.

[post]

their assessment of kat who was media 3rd team center

C: Karl-Anthony Towns: KAT, much like DeRozan, had a combination of top offense and very poor defense for his position that makes him an exciting player to watch but does hold his impact back. He would’ve been our 4th team Center if we had a 4th team, so he’s not too far off from breaking into these top 3 tiers. If there were multiple Centers on each team as there are Guards and Forwards, we’d see him on here for sure.

[post]

interestingly harden got 0 votes from the media

holiday and dejounte each got 1 third team vote from different voters

[Spurs m8]

First of all, James Harden :roll::roll::roll:

Also, steals leader for season - who's also been second dedense team in past - gets zero mention in defensive teams.

Right.

[post]

First of all, James Harden :roll::roll::roll:

Also, steals leader for season - who's also been second dedense team in past - gets zero mention in defensive teams.

Right.

they give reasonable explanations for everything if anyone bothers to read

G: James Harden: The new 76er had quite a down year relative to his norm. It’s important to recognize and acknowledge that. He had his lowest rating in our Perimeter Shooting Talent (96th percentile) metric and 2nd lowest in our Playmaking (99th percentile) and Finishing Talent (93rd percentile) metrics. His performance in each, while lower, was still at very strong to elite levels. He was still the third most efficient perimeter isolation scorer, per our Stable Isolation Efficiency metric. He also had a career high rating in our Middle Game Talent metric, with more willingness and effectiveness in an area once purposefully avoided by him in Houston.

Harden is certainly a less exciting pick as a dropping player than rising players like Booker/Doncic/Morant, but the math shows Harden had a higher aggregate impact than those alternatives and a higher per 100 possession than all but Morant, who would’ve gotten this spot on a LEBRON tiebreaker had his LEBRON Wins Added been closer to Harden’s.

G: Dejounte Murray: More impactful in prior years due to his defense, Murray this year saw his offense take a big leap into the higher tiers of impact among Point Guards this year. With career highs in Perimeter Shooting Talent, Playmaking Talent, Finishing Talent, AND Middle Game Talent, Murray’s play rose to a level that will leave those not up to speed on his game a bit puzzled at his placement on this 2nd team. This season he was a new player from last year, and the Spurs operating in the perpetual shadows from a national TV exposure standpoint meant many missed out on a breakout year for a budding star.

And while his defense was more tame with him taking on a heavier offensive focus, it was still a big strength of his and a differentiating one compared to his PG peers, helping him close the gap on offense while all but 1 (Steph) ahead of him had negative impact seasons defensively. While many PGs above him were hiding on defense, Murray took on a Wing Stopper defensive role and was strong in it. That, along with a heavy minutes load this season, got Murray to his 2nd team place.

[Spurs m8]

Oh damn I didn't even see him there lmao

Was only looking in all D

[Baller789]

The game sure looks mighty boring from a stat nerd's persepective.

[post]

Oh damn I didn't even see him there lmao

Was only looking in all D

a few other things worth pointing out about all d

lonzo ball got 0 votes from the media

yet among all guards he was 4th in defensive raptor 1st in defensive lebron and 5th in defensive epm and only played about 100 less minutes than draymond

jokic also got 0 votes from the media

yet jokic was 2nd among all players in defensive raptor bball index obviously picked him for 3rd team and epm says he is slightly behind embiid

finally covington got 0 votes from the media

yet raptor has him 5th among forwards bball index 2nd and epm 6th

the media should probably add a 3rd team all defense and stop pretending there are only 10 defensive players in the league worth noticing

the reality is sometimes there are probably small differences between some of these guys but people may think if you don't make something you are nothing

how many people or voters watch every game and understand fully everything they are seeing without pushing agendas

who knows

[post]

The game sure looks mighty boring from a stat nerd's persepective.

most things in life are boring or wouldn't exist in an ideal world

[Spurs m8]

a few other things worth pointing out about all d

lonzo ball got 0 votes from the media

yet among all guards he was 4th in defensive raptor 1st in defensive lebron and 5th in defensive epm and only played about 100 less minutes than draymond

jokic also got 0 votes from the media

yet jokic was 2nd among all players in defensive raptor bball index obviously picked him for 3rd team and epm says he is slightly behind embiid

finally covington got 0 votes from the media

yet raptor has him 5th among forwards bball index 2nd and epm 6th

the media should probably add a 3rd team all defense and stop pretending there are only 10 defensive players in the league worth noticing

the reality is sometimes there are probably small differences between some of these guys but people may think if you don't make something you are nothing

how many people or voters watch every game and understand fully everything they are seeing without pushing agendas

who knows

Thanks, mate

[post]

Thanks, mate

uh huh

[post]

for the ppg contingent out there here's the all nba team going strictly by ppg and using bball reference's time played criteria

1st

embiid
giannis
derozan
luka
trae

2nd

jokic
tatum
lavine
booker
mitchell

3rd

towns
brown
siakam
curry
fox

now let's do ppg with espn which has no time played criteria apparently

1st

embiid
lebron
giannis
luka
trae

2nd

jokic
durant
derozan
kyrie
ja

3rd

towns
tatum
davis
booker
mitchell

now by that espn method curry who is cooking the shit out of boston doesn't even make it

just give embiid the mvp if you want i really don't care in the end

but if that's how people want to play it let jokic know so he can start the season taking more shots and stop being an apparent moron by passing too much

because he like luka obviously play the game different in the playoffs taking more shots and scoring more than the regular season

[Baller789]

most things in life are boring or wouldn't exist in an ideal world

Have you played organized sports?

[Cleverness]

So they've got the "DPOY" as 2nd team defense...

Horford 2nd team defense? Why?

Why not put Robert Williams III on one of those all defensive teams??

[post]

Have you played organized sports?

yes baseball

and a lot of pickup basketball

what difference if any do you think it makes

[post]

So they've got the "DPOY" as 2nd team defense...

Horford 2nd team defense? Why?

Why not put Robert Williams III on one of those all defensive teams??

Robert Williams III: Williams was also strong this season, albeit did so at a lower impact that we can see in the data is due to him performing against lower caliber players. Their data in many areas, from rim protection to perimeter defense, was quite similar this year. Horford just accomplished that against higher competition, leading to that higher impact in the advanced on/off data. Williams was a few spots away from making our 3rd team.

[post]

G: Marus Smart: Smart is among the NBA’s best when it came to taking charges and recovering loose balls, we saw Smart’s impact both in steals, deflections, and fouls drawn. His performance in our Matchup Difficulty, On-Ball Defense, Ball Handler Screen Defense, and Off-Ball Chaser Defense metrics are all strong, albeit have each dropped to either the lowest or second lowest levels in years. Strong defense on high minutes materialized in his DPS and earned him a spot on this second team. He’s been a key cog in the Boston defensive machine, but our data wouldn’t support a DPOY pick for Smart.

[post]

C: Al Horford: Horford was used in a new role this season, and it led to him being the second most impactful defender in the league according to D-LEBRON. Moving away from the Anchor Big role that’s more about rim protection and drop coverage, and over to the Mobile Big that asked him to defend aggressively in pick-and-roll situations, often switching and hedging to push ball-handlers away from the rim, Horford shined. Horford finished second only to his teammate Robert Williams III in our On-Ball Defense metric among centers. A close 2nd in the DPOY hunt until the final few weeks of the year, the data tells us Horford’s (& Williams’ against bench units) mobility with size was the true key piece to Boston’s elite defense this season that also boasted several elite Wing Stoppers in Smart and White, as well as strong defenders in Tatum and Brown.

[Baller789]

yes baseball

and a lot of pickup basketball

what difference if any do you think it makes

Pickup basketball isnt even organized basketball.

You sure you arent one of those dork types?

[post]

Pickup basketball isnt even organized basketball.

You sure you arent one of those dork types?

i know the difference hence the way i worded what i wrote

whatever dude

[FKAri]

The game sure looks mighty boring from a stat nerd's persepective.

Can't be more boring than the on-court product.

[Baller789]

i know the difference hence the way i worded what i wrote

whatever dude


Hence I was wondering why you still brought it up.

:kobe:

All cool man.

[Baller789]

Can't be more boring than the on-court product.

Well the current NBA Finals sure aint boring.

[post]

Hence I was wondering why you still brought it up.

:kobe:

All cool man.

it's a basketball forum

didn't seem like the least relevant thing in the world to bring up given the question

[Baller789]

it's a basketball forum

didn't seem like the least relevant thing in the world to bring up given the question
:whatever:

[post]

:whatever:

that was probably the look some people had when they saw the picks

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/EmbellishedFrightenedBlobfish-size_restricted.gif

any other questions or i'll assume the thread is dead

[ILLsmak]

a few other things worth pointing out about all d

lonzo ball got 0 votes from the media

yet among all guards he was 4th in defensive raptor 1st in defensive lebron and 5th in defensive epm and only played about 100 less minutes than draymond

jokic also got 0 votes from the media

yet jokic was 2nd among all players in defensive raptor bball index obviously picked him for 3rd team and epm says he is slightly behind embiid

finally covington got 0 votes from the media

yet raptor has him 5th among forwards bball index 2nd and epm 6th

the media should probably add a 3rd team all defense and stop pretending there are only 10 defensive players in the league worth noticing

the reality is sometimes there are probably small differences between some of these guys but people may think if you don't make something you are nothing

how many people or voters watch every game and understand fully everything they are seeing without pushing agendas

who knows

lonzo is the only cool member of the ball fam, I am glad to see him get luv.

and yea that's wordlife his dad is a clown. His dad ruined Lonzos career in a way. Still dude is a freak. So ugly, so effective.

-Smak

[post]

lonzo is the only cool member of the ball fam, I am glad to see him get luv.

and yea that's wordlife his dad is a clown. His dad ruined Lonzos career in a way. Still dude is a freak. So ugly, so effective.

-Smak

don't know about his family situation

but for whatever reasons lamelo has the offense and lonzo has the defense

magically combine them and voila all nba