Why do some people say that Kobe was never the best player in the league?

[Atlantis]

I thought there was a general consensus that Kobe was the best player in the league between 2003 and 2009, with AI/Shaq being the best before and then LeBron after, but there's a lot of people who claim that he was never the league's best player.

[TheGoatest]

Because he wasn't. He was never recognized as "hands down the best player in the league". He might've been had he won the championship and Finals MVP in 2008, but that didn't happen.

[warriorfan]

Trolls

[iamgine]

He was the most popular.

As far as being best there were Garnett, Duncan, Lebron, Dirk amongst others who were better at one year or another.

[plowking]

Kobe was the best player in the league from 06-08. Who in their right mind was calling him the best in 03 after Shaq just reeled off 3 straight FMVPs?

In 05 he was all NBA 3rd team...

[Atlantis]

also people saying stuff like "Kobe was a good perimeter defender in his early years. Most of his defensive selections though are based on reputation before analytics was even a thing and you couldn't measure defensive impact."

Like where do people come up with that? This is another argument that's thrown around with Kobe's legacy.

The simplest explanation for a player being selected to an all defensive team is that they played great defense that year and is the correct reason until proven otherwise. WHY would Kobe be given a free pass here? Name ONE other player who got defensive selections because of their reputation?

Also this argument would mean that any player who got defensive selections before analytics was a thing got there based on reputation, which makes the award largely meaningless...

There's like an industry that's really anti-Kobe and there are so many lies out there.

[SouBeachTalents]

Saying Kobe was the best player from 2003-09 is more egregious than claiming he was never the best player.

[Atlantis]

Kobe was the best player in the league from 06-08. Who in their right mind was calling him the best in 03 after Shaq just reeled off 3 straight FMVPs?

In 05 he was all NBA 3rd team...

Some people won't even acknowledge this. Like they'll literally deny that Kobe wasn't the best player as seen by his peers and the general public during this 3 year phase simply because his peak didn't coincide with when he was winning championships.

[Carbine]

I lived through the 06-08 era.

That was his time. It wasn't Duncan, it wasn't LeBron.

Kobe was regarded as the best in the world by the vast majority of people. As we see with Curry now getting too ten all time hype, Kobe was getting = MJ hype after the back to back titles.

[Wally450]

It was short lived, but he was the best player from about 06-08 as others have said.

[RRR3]

06-08 is fine it’s just when it’s his stans start claiming he was the best in any year besides that, it’s laughable.

[Shooter]

2003: Duncan
2004: KG
2005: Dirk
2006: Dirk / Kobe
2007: Dirk / KG / LeBron / Kobe
2008: Dirk / KG / LeBron
2009-2023: LeBron

[SouBeachTalents]

2003: Shaq
2004: Shaq
2005: Dirk
2006: Dirk / Kobe
2007: Dirk / KG / LeBron / Kobe
2008: Dirk / KG / LeBron
2009-2023: LeBron
You’re WAY off on this bro

2003: Duncan
2004: KG
2005: Duncan should be there
2006: Wade should be there
2007: Duncan should be there
2008: Kobe

[Shooter]

You’re WAY off on this bro

2003: Duncan
2004: KG
2005: Duncan should be there
2006: Wade should be there
2007: Duncan should be there
2008: Kobe

Word. I just jotted some names down to be honest :cheers:

[3ba11]

People say Lebron was the face of the league since 2010 except Kobe repeated that year - HE was the face of the league.

Lebron was only the face from 2011-2014 - after that he shared the spotlight with Curry, who won more and made the entire league play his 3-pointer format - the whole league plays a version of Curry-ball and the Warriors have the best version

[Rysio]

If you ain't a stat nerd it could be argued kobe was the best player from 01 till 10.

[SouBeachTalents]

Kobe really has the most deranged fans in sports history :lol

[3ba11]

If you ain't a stat nerd it could be argued kobe was the best player from 01 till 10.


This

Real basketball heads know that Kobe was the best player from 01-10'

Even Shaq said Kobe was the best player in the league during their 3-peat

Then he led the league in scoring with numerous records and then he repeated as champion in 2010

And he repeated with a secondary producer at sidekick - he didn't need the all-time scorers at sidekick that Lebron needs because he can't carry the scoring load with a good brand of ball that can beat good teams (so he needs elite 1st options to play sidekick)

[tpols]

Its a combination of jealous LeBron and Shaq fans.

Shaq fans said Kobe could never win without Shaq. Or as 1st option. Then he went ahead and won back to back rings with Chris Bosh... *ahem* Pau Gasol. They were proven dead wrong and dug their feet deeper into their grudge.

And then you have LeBron fans where its self explanatory. They hate Kobe because when their primes overlapped Kobe was the one winning all the rings and LeBron was getting bounced (hard) by the spurs, celtics, and magic.

[1987_Lakers]

This

Real basketball heads know that Kobe was the best player from 01-10'

Even Shaq said Kobe was the best player in the league during their 3-peat

Then he led the league in scoring with numerous records and then he repeated as champion in 2010

And he repeated with a secondary producer at sidekick - he didn't need the all-time scorers at sidekick that Lebron needs because he can't carry the scoring load with a good brand of ball that can beat good teams (so he needs elite 1st options to play sidekick)

Didn't you say that you used to call into radio shows and cry about Kobe and how he sucked?

[Hey Yo]

People say Lebron was the face of the league since 2010 except Kobe repeated that year - HE was the face of the league.

Lebron was only the face from 2011-2014 - after that he shared the spotlight with Curry, who won more and made the entire league play his 3-pointer format - the whole league plays a version of Curry-ball and the Warriors have the best version

Nobody looked at that rapist as the face of the league..... ever.

[Cold soul]

Kobe was the best player in the league 06-08 you can argue other years like 01,03, 09 and 10.

[RRR3]

Stupidbe stans saying he was the best player in 04 and 05 is downright comical. I mean any year besides 06-08 is laughable but those years in particular :oldlol:

[RRR3]

Kobe really has the most deranged fans in sports history :lol
It’s not even close either.

[fsvr54]

He was the best in 09 and 10 as well, maybe Wade.

Lebron was the best maybe one or two years. I'm sick of his fanboys

[RRR3]

DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Average MAGAt

[ImKobe]

Obviously only the haters/trolls say that. You can go look up how players/coaches/media all viewed him in that era. Wade Dirk Bran etc all said that Kobe was the best too.


If you ain't a stat nerd it could be argued kobe was the best player from 01 till 10.

He won that decade poll in a landslide at the time too. He had a couple seasons in between where he wasn't healthy (04, 05) and you have to give it to Shaq in 02 but it's debatable for every other season.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Obviously only the haters/trolls say that. You can go look up how players/coaches/media all viewed him in that era. Wade Dirk Bran etc all said that Kobe was the best too.

Derek Jeter won gold gloves being the worst defensive player in baseball.

Appealing to mass delusion doesn't help your argument

Kobe was never the best player, but he was close in some years. That's the reality.

[ImKobe]

Derek Jeter won gold gloves being the worst defensive player in baseball.

Appealing to mass delusion doesn't help your argument

Kobe was never the best player, but he was close in some years. That's the reality.

Yes, all the players/coaches/media members were bought & paid for and just lied about KB for a damn decade. A troll on a message board knows better.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Yes, all the players/coaches/media members were bought & paid for and just lied about KB for a damn decade. A troll on a message board knows better.

Every single player, coach, and media member thought Kobe was the best? Every single one?

That's pretty crazy. Thank you 'ImKobe' for being the voice of reason on this topic about Kobe.

You bring up media members... you're aware that Kobe is almost always outside of the top ten on lists and only ever makes the top 10 because of his death. I'm sure you agree with these lists right?

[Axe]

Lol even the zenmaster phil jackson knew he wasn't a few years before their reign with shaq ended.

[ShawkFactory]

This

Real basketball heads know that Kobe was the best player from 01-10'

Even Shaq said Kobe was the best player in the league during their 3-peat

Then he led the league in scoring with numerous records and then he repeated as champion in 2010

And he repeated with a secondary producer at sidekick - he didn't need the all-time scorers at sidekick that Lebron needs because he can't carry the scoring load with a good brand of ball that can beat good teams (so he needs elite 1st options to play sidekick)

:lol

Anyway..the 06-08 is right. I don't think many reasonable people would argue that he wasn't THE guy these years. 03 and 09 were arguable, but Duncan and Lebron have good arguments those years as well. I'd probably lean Duncan in 03 and Kobe in 09 but it's close.

01 and 02 were Shaq. 04 and 05 were Garnett/Duncan. 10 was Lebron.

[ImKobe]

Every single player, coach, and media member thought Kobe was the best? Every single one?

That's pretty crazy. Thank you 'ImKobe' for being the voice of reason on this topic about Kobe.

You bring up media members... you're aware that Kobe is almost always outside of the top ten on lists and only ever makes the top 10 because of his death. I'm sure you agree with these lists right?


https://youtu.be/QVRBTxtlvI8


https://youtu.be/Fv37ykpYk84


https://youtu.be/NVWFIGhD980

[FKAri]

The most unfortunate thing is Kobe's prime coincided with some of the worst Laker rosters. People don't like proclaiming someone BITW when they're missing or barely making playoffs. Smush Parker and Ronny Turiaf among others. We will never forget these Laker greats.


This

Real basketball heads know that Kobe was the best player from 01-10'

Even Shaq said Kobe was the best player in the league during their 3-peat

Then he led the league in scoring with numerous records and then he repeated as champion in 2010

And he repeated with a secondary producer at sidekick - he didn't need the all-time scorers at sidekick that Lebron needs because he can't carry the scoring load with a good brand of ball that can beat good teams (so he needs elite 1st options to play sidekick)

Maybe if their head is literally a basketball. Well, actually it's not too ridiculous to suggest. It can certainly be argued but I wouldn't be on the pro side of that.


If you ain't a stat nerd it could be argued kobe was the best player from 01 till 10.

It's not about being a stathead. It's about taking emotion out of evaluating a player. Besides Kobe's best years weren't necessarily his best statistical years imo. Like after 07 a lot of Lebron fans like to give it to him but I think Kobe's maturity and ability to elevate his teammates made him more valuable in the playoffs than Lebron until around 09 or 10. But over the course of the season he couldn't match the value that Lebron or Wade brought. Wade especially gets underrated for his 09-11. And overrated post 2011 by the Lebron haters.

[StrongLurk]

The mid-2000s had a lot of different "best players", but for me I'm taking Kobe 06-08.

[Manny98]

06 - Wade was better
07 - Duncan and LeBron were better
08 - I'd give Kobe that year but you can make a case for LeBron
09 - I lean towards LeBron

[Atlantis]

Nobody looked at that rapist as the face of the league..... ever.

No, he was so great that even though he probably did commit some crime, he was STILL the face of the league.

[Axe]

No, he was so great that even though he probably did commit some crime, he was STILL the face of the league.
Lol but he lost fans after the incident went viral.

[Shooter]

Well I mean he did win one MVP so he's 1/20

[HoopsNY]

I'd say Kobe was the best in the game from 2007-2009. 2010 was LeBron IMO. Early 2000s was Duncan/Shaq and 2004 was KG. 2005 is probably Duncan again.

2006 is an interesting case. Nash won MVP and some might say Kobe given how bad that Lakers team was and Kobe still leading that team to 45 wins and winning the scoring title. But I think Wade might actually have a case.

Wade had a ridiculous finals (irrespective of what the conspiracy theorists say), but also had a ridiculous ECF. Miami beat a Detroit team that won 64 games and had an elite defense with Wade putting up 27/5/6/2/2 on an insane 68% TS%. So for 2006, I might actually have to give it to Wade.

For an entire decade, it's not really unreasonable to put Kobe ahead of everyone, but it's probably splitting hairs. I'd probably say it's between him and Duncan, though Shaq might have something to say for that after finishing 2nd in MVP voting in 2005 after three straight FMVPs from 2000-02.

[2much_knowledge]

https://youtu.be/QVRBTxtlvI8


https://youtu.be/Fv37ykpYk84


https://youtu.be/NVWFIGhD980

And its a W R A P

[2much_knowledge]

Lets put the hate aside and mention some Facts

2001 - Shaq calls Kobe the best during the playoffs

2009 - Lebron calls Kobe best in the league


So - 03, 06, 07, 08 and 09 Kobe is at least 1a with someone else being 1b

04 and 05 were bad years

2010 is split down the middle wth bron

[2much_knowledge]

Kobe really has the most deranged fans in sports history :lol

Really? Have you seen any kobetard make obsessed threads every single day or bumping old threads that no one cares about or making homo threads about kobes organs???

Where?

[Axe]

Lmao if he's 1a in 08, he shouldn't have lost to the celtics.

[2much_knowledge]

Lmao if he's 1a in 08, he shouldn't have lost to the celtics.

Everyone lost to the celtics genious. All of the 29 teams

[Axe]

Everyone lost to the celtics genious. All of the 29 teams
But the lakers were favored to win the 2008 finals if i'm not mistaken.

[SATAN]

Everyone lost to the celtics genious.

:facepalm

[WhiteKyrie]

2003: Duncan
2004: KG
2005: Dirk
2006: Dirk / Kobe
2007: Dirk / KG / LeBron / Kobe
2008: Dirk / KG / LeBron
2009-2023: LeBron
:oldlol:

Ridiculously stupid.

I’d say Kobe was best in 2006, 2007, and 2008.

With an argument or strong arguments seasonally in 2003, 2009, 2010 and even 2013. Wade had arguments in 2006, 2007 (pre injury), and 2009.

[guy]

Pretty much everyone thought he was the best from 06-08 and it was a constant argument that was fairly split in 09 and 10. I constantly hear talking heads on TV say that Kobe was never the best player in the league, which is absolutely absurd revisionist history.

[Axe]

Pretty much everyone thought he was the best from 06-08 and it was a constant argument that was fairly split in 09 and 10. I constantly hear talking heads on TV say that Kobe was never the best player in the league, which is absolutely absurd revisionist history.
He could have gotten more mvps but even then, his sole in 2008 was neck to neck with chris paul if i'm not mistaken.

[2much_knowledge]

He could have gotten more mvps but even then, his sole in 2008 was neck to neck with chris paul if i'm not mistaken.

It was up in the air till the last lakers vs hornets matchup where Kobe destroyed them and made a statement with that double pump reverse