Manu, Tmac, AI, Wade, Vc, Kobe, Rip, Roy, and Ray.

[Kblaze8855]

https://www.hostpic.org/images/2206240859420332.jpeg


Allow me to ask 5 questions about this picture I’ve had stashed for the off-season.




1. Best era of 2 guards ever?


2. What is your ideal big 3 to win in 2023 made of those guys if you can only take Kobe OR Wade but not both in your 3?


3. Are you one of those people still enamored with Brandon Roy as a missed out potential all time great or one of those people who don’t get why some still talk about him as if he did anything?

4. Does Rip Hamilton stand out as someone who just got tossed in to make it a neat little graphic or would you say he belongs in that general company even if not at the top of it?


5. Tmac in Houston, Ray Allen in Seattle, and Vince in New Jersey.

Put them in order 1-3 please.




That is all.

[SouBeachTalents]

Too lazy to answer all of those, I'll answer two of them :lol

2. I'd take a Big 3 of Wade/Allen/Manu

5. I'd rank them Allen/Vince/McGrady

[FultzNationRISE]

Brandon Roy was overrated IMO.

Rip was nice, Im not high on ball dominant, questionable efficiency guards so Id be happy to take him over some of the guys in that pic.

Big 3 of Wade/Manu/Ray sounds good.

Allen, Tmac, Wince in that order.

[tpols]

1. Yes.

2. Kobe, Manu, and Ray.

3. Brandon Roy had a Paul Pierce style skill and cadence to his game. He definitely was a great talent minus the injuries.

4. Rip Hamilton was an off ball maestro who contributed greatly to his teams success. Can't hate on him.

5. Tmac in Houston was hurt so he's pretty much disqualified. As far as the Vince Carter vs Ray Allen debate goes... I'd take Bucks Ray over any version of Vince carter. And I'm a huge fan of what Vince carter did on the nets but ray was a different level sniper imo. Even though Vince Carter's nickname on the jumbotron was VC3.

[Sulico]

1. Probably. Didn't think about it enough.

2. A) Manu, Kobe, Ray or B) Manu, DWade, Ray. Wouldn't be huge difference.

3. He was good. Nowhere close to all time great. He could've been rich mans Damian Lillard.

4. He definitely belongs. Would take him over TMac, Vince and Roy

5. Ray Allen anywhere as #1. Vince and TMac #2/3. Does it really matter which cousin you get your unefficient chucking from?

[red1]

https://www.hostpic.org/images/2206240859420332.jpeg


Allow me to ask 5 questions about this picture I’ve had stashed for the off-season.




1. Best era of 2 guards ever?

Yeah. Hands down.

2. What is your ideal big 3 to win in 2023 made of those guys if you can only take Kobe OR Wade but not both in your 3?
Wade Tmac Ray Allen

3. Are you one of those people still enamored with Brandon Roy as a missed out potential all time great or one of those people who don’t get why some still talk about him as if he did anything?

Broy was a legend. His jumpshot was pure and he was an underrated athlete who could make incredible shots and was calm and cool and clutch as hell. He was destined for big games in the playoffs.

4. Does Rip Hamilton stand out as someone who just got tossed in to make it a neat little graphic or would you say he belongs in that general company even if not at the top of it?

Rip isnt even close to the level of most of these guys and thats no disrespect. These are are some of the GOATs.

5. Tmac in Houston, Ray Allen in Seattle, and Vince in New Jersey.

Put them in order 1-3 please.

Tmac was always injured but he was the best of the three at this stage, Ray Allen in Seattle was in his prime, Vince declined at this point but he was still great. That's the order.



That is all.

These are the correct answers.

[red1]

if I could get raptors carter I would take wade carter and ray allen


those versions it would be wade tmac and ray the GOAT allen.




wade and tmac are unselfish ball-handlers that can do it all and ray is the GOAT no explanation needed. still making haters cry to this day. :roll:

[Kblaze8855]

. 4. He definitely belongs. Would take him over TMac, Vince and Roy



Im not sure in a straight up no demanding out situation you could get anyone on that list for Rip. He did get Stackhouse but that’s…kinda saying the same thing.

[L.Kizzle]

1 yes. Tho the mid 80s to mid 90s in mad underrated. Clyde/Jordan/Dumars/Reggie/Mitch are the Hall of Famers. But, Reggie Lewis (RIP), Latrell Sprewell (1st Team All NBA), Jeff Malone, Ricky Pierce, Dale Ellis were all serviceable players.

2 Kobe, McGrady, Ray Allen

3 Roy would have been a Hall of Famer

4 He belongs, but where is Joe Johnson at?

5 McGrady, Ray, VC. All were still top 10-15ish players. Probably closer to 10 than 15.

[dankok8]

1 yes. Tho the mid 80s to mid 90s in mad underrated. Clyde/Jordan/Dumars/Reggie/Mitch are the Hall of Famers. But, Reggie Lewis (RIP), Latrell Sprewell (1st Team All NBA), Jeff Malone, Ricky Pierce, Dale Ellis were all serviceable players.

2 Kobe, McGrady, Ray Allen

3 Roy would have been a Hall of Famer

4 He belongs, but where is Joe Johnson at?

5 McGrady, Ray, VC. All were still top 10-15ish players. Probably closer to 10 than 15.

I agree with this completely.

But I will say VC is underrated by people these days. Dude was a great ballhandler, killer first step to blow by people, could dunk over anyone and hovered around 40% from 3pt range. And I'd say an underrated playmaker as well even though he wasn't a PG. This guy would be absolutely un-guardable under today's rules.

[L.Kizzle]

I agree with this completely.

But I will say VC is underrated by people these days. Dude was a great ballhandler, killer first step to blow by people, could dunk over anyone and hovered around 40% from 3pt range. And I'd say an underrated playmaker as well even though he wasn't a PG. This guy would be absolutely un-guardable under today's rules.
He's a 1st ballot Hall of Famer.
Now Toronto VC, I'm taking over Milwaukee Ray Allen.

[ShawkFactory]

I agree with this completely.

But I will say VC is underrated by people these days. Dude was a great ballhandler, killer first step to blow by people, could dunk over anyone and hovered around 40% from 3pt range. And I'd say an underrated playmaker as well even though he wasn't a PG. This guy would be absolutely un-guardable under today's rules.

His issue I think is that he was a bit of a ball-stopper. Kind of similar to Melo.

[fsvr54]

He's a 1st ballot Hall of Famer.
Now Toronto VC, I'm taking over Milwaukee Ray Allen.

VC had his best year in 06. He was a killer on the Nets and people completely forgot for some reason.

[red1]

VC had his best year in 06. He was a killer on the Nets and people completely forgot for some reason.

nah his best year by far was 01



by far

[red1]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLdzAEXcBsA&ab_channel=VinceCarterArchive


he was untouchable that year

[red1]

8 threes in a row in a crucial game :roll:



they dont know

[red1]

vincent lamar carter



he was THE man.

[L.Kizzle]

VC had his best year in 06. He was a killer on the Nets and people completely forgot for some reason.
06 VC was still a force. 01 VC was the best version.

[red1]

dell curry misses a 3, vince carter gets the rebound and splashes his 8th three in a row, going 8-8 from three...


...before the half is even over :roll:

https://youtu.be/bLdzAEXcBsA?t=180


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D726mdQX4AAif29.jpg
https://assets-cms.thescore.com/uploads/image/file/357579/w768xh576_GettyImages-1152747526.jpg
https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2019/05/drake-dell-curry-jersey-nba-finals-raptors-warriors.jpg

[Akeem34TheDream]

Vince Carter is comparable to Paul George imo. Similar level. Not quite superstar but around top 10. I was a big Brandon Roy fan and i was sure Blazers were gonna win championships with him, Oden and Aldridge. I'm sad again now.

[red1]

Vince Carter is comparable to Paul George imo. Similar level. Not quite superstar but around top 10. I was a big Brandon Roy fan and i was sure Blazers were gonna win championships with him, Oden and Aldridge. I'm sad again now.

LOOOOL



my guy.




please. never again.

[red1]

kobe always had the utmost respect for vince - because he knew holy shit this guy is on my exact level


this was kobe in his prime 3-peat days...

[Sulico]

Im not sure in a straight up no demanding out situation you could get anyone on that list for Rip. He did get Stackhouse but that’s…kinda saying the same thing.

Because there is always bad, desperate teams in the NBA, that want to get marketable #1 option to maybe take them to 1st round playoff exit or 2nd round sweep. Those teams will gladly pay max, or close to it to a mediocre star player like Vince or TMac, thats why their market price usually high.

For a good team, great role player that plays hard on D and have talent on offense, is more valuable, because they already have good #1.

So Rip was more valuable to Detroit than VC or TMac would be, and same would be true for like 10-12 other teams.

[FultzNationRISE]

1 yes. Tho the mid 80s to mid 90s in mad underrated. Clyde/Jordan/Dumars/Reggie/Mitch are the Hall of Famers. But, Reggie Lewis (RIP), Latrell Sprewell (1st Team All NBA), Jeff Malone, Ricky Pierce, Dale Ellis were all serviceable players.

2 Kobe, McGrady, Ray Allen

3 Roy would have been a Hall of Famer

4 He belongs, but where is Joe Johnson at?

5 McGrady, Ray, VC. All were still top 10-15ish players. Probably closer to 10 than 15.

Mully as well.

Edit: I guess he was listed at sf for most of his prime. I always think of him as an sg.

[Kblaze8855]

Because there is always bad, desperate teams in the NBA, that want to get marketable #1 option to maybe take them to 1st round playoff exit or 2nd round sweep. Those teams will gladly pay max, or close to it to a mediocre star player like Vince or TMac, thats why their market price usually high.

For a good team, great role player that plays hard on D and have talent on offense, is more valuable, because they already have good #1.

So Rip was more valuable to Detroit than VC or TMac would be, and same would be true for like 10-12 other teams.


If the Magic called and offered Tmac for Rip and Prince in 03 they would have made the deal and if talks broke down might have offered the pick that became Darko in place of Prince to sweeten it.

[fsvr54]

Grant Hill was supposed to be playing with Tmac. That's the real tragedy...that Hill got hurt.

[ShawkFactory]

kobe always had the utmost respect for vince - because he knew holy shit this guy is on my exact level


this was kobe in his prime 3-peat days...

Wow this Vince thing is getting out of control with you :lol

Saying that he's on the PG kind of level isn't a crazy thing at all. He maybe slightly higher than that but it's the same kind of tier. It's very reasonable to say that he was never a top 10 player in the league. If he was it was it was only for a couple years and he was on the lower end.

Just thinking about his best year, which was 2001: Shaq, Kobe, Duncan, Garnett, Kidd, Webber, McGrady, and Iverson. Then you have GP and Dirk who were arguable.

[Kblaze8855]

Grant Hill was supposed to be playing with Tmac. That's the real tragedy...that Hill got hurt.

And that Doc Rivers didn’t agree to let Duncan’s wife on the plane for the Magic like the spurs did when they were already house hunting in Orlando to make it a big 3.

One stupid decision makes Tmac half the player he’s likely remembered as otherwise because you couldn’t attach losing to him.

[red1]

Wow this Vince thing is getting out of control with you :lol

Saying that he's on the PG kind of level isn't a crazy thing at all. He maybe slightly higher than that but it's the same kind of tier. It's very reasonable to say that he was never a top 10 player in the league. If he was it was it was only for a couple years and he was on the lower end.

Just thinking about his best year, which was 2001: Shaq, Kobe, Duncan, Garnett, Kidd, Webber, McGrady, and Iverson. Then you have GP and Dirk who were arguable.

nah vince just had a shit team. very common for stars back then.

he was the best shooting guard in the league over iverson and kobe. Im biased but I believe it.

[HoopsNY]

1 yes. Tho the mid 80s to mid 90s in mad underrated. Clyde/Jordan/Dumars/Reggie/Mitch are the Hall of Famers. But, Reggie Lewis (RIP), Latrell Sprewell (1st Team All NBA), Jeff Malone, Ricky Pierce, Dale Ellis were all serviceable players.

2 Kobe, McGrady, Ray Allen

3 Roy would have been a Hall of Famer

4 He belongs, but where is Joe Johnson at?

5 McGrady, Ray, VC. All were still top 10-15ish players. Probably closer to 10 than 15.

Yea add Drazen to that list. Both him and Lewis died and that's why to some, the 90s pool of SGs doesn't look as great as it should. But a pool that includes Reggie/Richmond/Clyde/Dumars/MJ is pretty damn impressive as is. Add Lewis and Drazen and that's 7 guards that could legit takeover a game, with most of them being elite shooters.

[HoopsNY]

https://www.hostpic.org/images/2206240859420332.jpeg


Allow me to ask 5 questions about this picture I’ve had stashed for the off-season.




1. Best era of 2 guards ever?


2. What is your ideal big 3 to win in 2023 made of those guys if you can only take Kobe OR Wade but not both in your 3?


3. Are you one of those people still enamored with Brandon Roy as a missed out potential all time great or one of those people who don’t get why some still talk about him as if he did anything?

4. Does Rip Hamilton stand out as someone who just got tossed in to make it a neat little graphic or would you say he belongs in that general company even if not at the top of it?


5. Tmac in Houston, Ray Allen in Seattle, and Vince in New Jersey.

Put them in order 1-3 please.




That is all.

I'd add Pierce to that list. VC and T-Mac were SFs, but they played a bunch of years as SGs. Pierce played a bunch of years as a SG until Ray arrived. Either way, that was a great era for perimeter players.

It's pretty crazy cause you also had guys like Finley, Allan Houston, Eddie Jones, Sprewell, Mobley, M. Redd, S. Smith, J. Richardson, and J. Terry. They weren't elite like the others but they definitely were excellent players.

[PP34Deuce]

Once he got his first injury in toronto ..he started mauling it in. Raptors fans hated him the last year. Nets Carter of 2006 was big on proving he was more than just dunks

[houston]

yes

Kobe Manu Rip


Brandon Roy was alright he could been 3rd option on a title team.

Rip was underrated due to the fact he was the leading scorer on that Pistons team plus he had some clutch moments in the playoffs.

Ray Allen in Sonics was better than Vince in New Jersey and T-Mac in Houston.


P.S. where is Micheal Finley. Now that underrated 2 guard or Eddie Jones on the list.

[ShawkFactory]

nah vince just had a shit team. very common for stars back then.

he was the best shooting guard in the league over iverson and kobe. Im biased but I believe it.

Lol he wasn’t better than McGrady

[red1]

Lol he wasn’t better than McGrady

mcgrady reached a very high level and is one of the most naturally-talented nba players of all-time outside of the injuries and fragility


very arguable mcgrady was better.


I'd rock with 01 vince and feel comfortable any day. I was watching those games and he made me a huge NBA fan. Vinsanity was a real thing. he had a highlight dunk every single game.

[red1]

everyone that I know had these posters

https://www.bardown.com/polopoly_fs/1.1441690!/fileimage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/default/vc1.jpg
https://assets1.sportsnet.ca/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/VC-01.jpg
https://assets1.sportsnet.ca/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/VC-02.jpg

[999Guy]

I agree with this completely.

But I will say VC is underrated by people these days. Dude was a great ballhandler, killer first step to blow by people, could dunk over anyone and hovered around 40% from 3pt range. And I'd say an underrated playmaker as well even though he wasn't a PG. This guy would be absolutely un-guardable under today's rules.

VC really didn’t have a first step. His ridiculous vert got him separation off dribble that made him a really good shot creator. In close he finished like a big man a la Wiggins or somebody but the ability to create separation like Kobe, let alone Harden or Wade going downhill, didn’t exist for him.

But VC was a good defender literally his entire career unlike everyone in that graphic except Manu. His career is hella underrated.

And he was better than Kobe from 00-02.


I don’t understand how people have fun with these discussions while just deciding it in their head based on conventional wisdom. Kobe’s defense sucked a dick when you really watch it in the early 00’s. No strength, getting blown by, gambling runs, low effort. But I just know VC won’t get rightful credit from anybody for being a way better defender than him from 00-02, when the evidence is RIGHT there.