Kobe could win without Shaq but MJ couldn’t win without Pippen

[AirBonner]

This imo makes Kobe greater. He had a more diverse offense that could carry a bigger load. Kobe straight up was unguardable. Meanwhile MJ was stubborn as hell and his unwillingness to psss got him destroyed by better team ball (Pistons, Celtics) Kobe was the better passer and best -worst shot maker in history. His knack for making bad shots made him the ultimate cheat code.

[Axe]

Interesting.

[3ba11]

This imo makes Kobe greater. He had a more diverse offense that could carry a bigger load. Kobe straight up was unguardable. Meanwhile MJ was stubborn as hell and his unwillingness to psss got him destroyed by better team ball (Pistons, Celtics) Kobe was the better passer and best -worst shot maker in history. His knack for making bad shots made him the ultimate cheat code.


The bolded is an obvious lie

No one carried teams more than Jordan because everyone in history had equal-scoring partners to attract equal defensive attention for entire playoff runs, so they didn't always face maximum defensive attention (carry scoring load)

Any period without facing maximum defensive attention is inflated stats compared to Jordan, who always faced maximum defensive attention - he carried the scoring load for every SERIES, let alone playoff run.

And Jordan averaged more assists than Kobe, so the passing angle is dead

I won't mention defense because individual defense doesn't matter when comparing individual players (many transcendant offensive players are easier to build defensive teams around)

Ultimately, Jordan had the least help of any dynasty and he's the only player in history that didn't have a go-to teammate, as Shaq and Kenny Smith explain here (https://i.makeagif.com/media/3-27-2022/qrDm8n.gif) and here (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4UF6Xx3F2Lo&t=01m54s), respectively.

Since Jordan is the only guy that lacked a go-to teammate, he's the only player that always had to defeat maximum defensive attention (carry scoring load)

[AirBonner]

The bolded is an obvious lie

No one carried teams more than Jordan because everyone in history had equal-scoring partners to attract equal defensive attention for entire playoff runs, so they didn't always face maximum defensive attention (carry scoring load)

Any period without facing maximum defensive attention is inflated stats compared to Jordan, who always faced maximum defensive attention - he carried the scoring load for every SERIES, let alone playoff run.

And Jordan averaged more assists than Kobe, so the passing angle is dead

I won't mention defense because individual defense doesn't matter when comparing individual players (many transcendant offensive players are easier to build defensive teams around)

Ultimately, Jordan had the least help of any dynasty and he's the only player in history that didn't have a go-to teammate, as Shaq and Kenny Smith explain here (https://i.makeagif.com/media/3-27-2022/qrDm8n.gif) and here (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4UF6Xx3F2Lo&t=01m54s), respectively.

Since Jordan is the only guy that lacked a go-to teammate, he's the only player that always had to defeat maximum defensive attention (carry scoring load)

Pippen ->>>Pau

[3ba11]

Pippen ->>>Pau


Pippen was a transition/hustle player that couldn't create his own shot in the halfcourt

He was just lucky to grow up in a dynasty system and chemistry - he was nothing without it - he was a 14 ppg dunker that couldn't score outside the triangle

Otoh, Pau commanded doubles and was a go-to player - Pippen was not (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4UF6Xx3F2Lo&t=01m54s)

Pau frequently dominated and was on the scouting report - Pippen never was (https://i.makeagif.com/media/3-27-2022/qrDm8n.gif)

pau was often THE GUY, even when Kobe was out there, while guys like Kukoc, Kerr, and Paxson were preferred over Pippen in the clutch and 4th

[97 bulls]

Pippen was a transition/hustle player that couldn't create his own shot in the halfcourt

He was just lucky to grow up in a dynasty system and chemistry - he was nothing without it - he was a 14 ppg dunker that couldn't score outside the triangle

Otoh, Pau commanded doubles and was a go-to player - Pippen was not (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4UF6Xx3F2Lo&t=01m54s)

Pau frequently dominated and was on the scouting report - Pippen never was (https://i.makeagif.com/media/3-27-2022/qrDm8n.gif)

pau was often THE GUY, even when Kobe was out there, while guys like Kukoc, Kerr, and Paxson were preferred over Pippen in the clutch and 4th

Gasol never won a playoff game leading a team. Lol.

[3ba11]

Gasol never won a playoff game leading a team. Lol.


Pippen averaged 8 ppg as a rookie and would never become a 1st option under normal circumstances.

The only team in history where Pippen could be a 1st option is a team that Jordan retired from.

So let's summarize - Pippen was only a 1st option on a team that Jordan retired from and he was only a 2nd option alongside Jordan!!!! Otherwise, he was 3rd to 8th option on the Rockets and Blazers - he was a hustle/transition player that couldn't create his own shot.. :confusedshrug:

Otoh, Pau was good right away - he would've 3-peated with MJ from 88-90'.. That was a time when Pippen was wetting the bed - Pippen needed the dynasty system and chemistry to produce (system player)

Btw, Pippen's only playoff win was against an opponent that was literally missing their entire starting 5 (94' Cavs).. lol - that's the only series Pippen could win - versus a bench

[TheMan]

This imo makes Kobe greater. He had a more diverse offense that could carry a bigger load. Kobe straight up was unguardable. Meanwhile MJ was stubborn as hell and his unwillingness to psss got him destroyed by better team ball (Pistons, Celtics) Kobe was the better passer and best -worst shot maker in history. His knack for making bad shots made him the ultimate cheat code.

I agree 100%

[WhiteKyrie]

Because Shaq = Pippen

Way to try to breakup the MJ and Kobe partnership. So transparent.

Gasol is more equivalent to Pippen in terms of production and impact as a second option. Kobe was second option for 2000. And at best 1b for the two others.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Kobe with Gasol: 2008 - 2013
2x rings, 3 Finals appearances in 6 seasons

Jordan with Pip: 1988 - 1993, 1995 - 1998
6x rings, 6 Finals appearances in 10 seasons

You can’t be serious? And I love Kobe.

[2much_knowledge]

Very creative topic op! Never ever heard it

Im no genius but i think..

Maybe because Kobe had the chance to play his prime without Shaq??
Maybe because Mj played all of his prime with Pip?

Something like that

[John8204]

Well two of Kobe's/Shaq's(00,02) rings are really dubious...the officials likely rigged the conference finals in both cases and that has reverberations towards other players as well.

[97 bulls]

Pippen averaged 8 ppg as a rookie and would never become a 1st option under normal circumstances.

The only team in history where Pippen could be a 1st option is a team that Jordan retired from.

So let's summarize - Pippen was only a 1st option on a team that Jordan retired from and he was only a 2nd option alongside Jordan!!!! Otherwise, he was 3rd to 8th option on the Rockets and Blazers - he was a hustle/transition player that couldn't create his own shot.. :confusedshrug:

Otoh, Pau was good right away - he would've 3-peated with MJ from 88-90'.. That was a time when Pippen was wetting the bed - Pippen needed the dynasty system and chemistry to produce (system player)

Btw, Pippen's only playoff win was against an opponent that was literally missing their entire starting 5 (94' Cavs).. lol - that's the only series Pippen could win - versus a bench

Pippen was playing with a back injury his rookie season. It's always these circular arguments with you. You make these insane assertions get checked, then run out of the thread never to be heard from again in said thread. You just make another one with the same BS. But never respond.

And as an FYI, based on your dumb logic. The only team Jordan could lead to an NBA championship was a team thar had Scottie Pippen. Lol.

Now go ahead and do what you normally do, weasel out of this thread and make another one spouting the same nonsense because you can't respond to being challenged on your rhetoric.

[TheGoatest]

jordon could not only not win without The Great Scott Pippen. He couldn't even make the playoffs without The Great Scott Pippen.*

*An era where a 30-52 record is sufficient for a playoff spot does not count