Wizards jordon was worse than nearly any all-time great who played until his late 30s

[Axe]

The Three-Peat requirement for a dynasty is not my definition, Axe is the one throwing it out there. My definition is at least back-to-back titles.

Yes, Boston never won back-to-back but neither did San Antonio. The Lakers and Pistons are dynasties.
I don't believe that shit either. The purpose was to show that one of your fellow lebron haters think a 'three-peat' is necessary for teams to become a dynasty. You really are a dumbass.

[Axe]

Are the Spurs a dynasty?

The Bulls opponents are ringless because they kept them ringless. Unlike Lebron where teams won alot against him.
Yet they have a higher srs than any of the teams jordan beat in the finals lmao.

[RogueBorg]

The purpose was to show that one of your fellow lebron haters think a 'three-peat' is necessary for teams to become a dynasty. You really are a dumbass.

Try to follow along.

TheMan93 was making the argument that the Celtics and Pistons were dynasties, he said to you "Were the mid 90's Knicks a dynasty that Pippen ran in to? Or was Bird's Celtics and the Bad Boy Pistons a dynasty that MJ ran in to?"

Your response to him in post #219 was "But those aren't dynasties coach. Since someone said 'dynasties' have to 'three-peat' first."


You said they aren't dynasties "But those aren't dynasties coach.

Go back and read post #219.

[Axe]

And then i said someone else mentioned it. Lol all of a sudden you're so fixated into it. :roll:

Try going btt, you buffoon.

[theman93]

Probably. But that doesn't explain why jordan never had any winning seasons until pippen started playing for the bulls.

No, not probably. 100% definitely.

If you want to believe a bench player putting up 8/4 on bad efficiency was the reason the Bulls made the playoffs, that's fine you can believe whatever you want. It just shows you're low IQ. No objective person believes that though.

[Axe]

If you want to believe a bench player putting up 8/4 on bad efficiency was the reason the Bulls made the playoffs, that's fine you can believe whatever you want. It just shows you're low IQ. No objective person believes that though.
Lmao you're the only one here trying to imply that.

[theman93]

And then i said someone else mentioned it. Lol all of a sudden you're so fixated into it. :roll:

Try going btt, you buffoon.

Why are you bringing someone else's opinion in to it? It's irrelevant and a deflection when your debate is with me and not them.

[theman93]

Lmao you're the only one here trying to imply that.

I've never implied that, actually.

[Axe]

Why are you bringing someone else's opinion in to it? It's irrelevant and a deflection when your debate is with me and not them.
Just trying to see if you'd agree with them or not.

[FilmyCogTurner]

This thread is a backfire. It goes to show that even a washed up Jordan with a worse supporting cast is still technically the better basketball player over a 37 year old Lebron on a "title" contending team.

Good job Bronsexuals, you lose again.

[2much_knowledge]

What all-time greats who played at age 37+ is Wizards jordon NOT worse than?

LeBron
Kareem
Karl Malone
Tim Duncan

are/were all clearly better.

After injuries of course. We all knew that silly

[HoopsNY]

can someone please explain this? im actually reading every post and it’s amazing how every lebron stan is avoiding this point :lol

They can't explain it. They know very well that 2022 was embarrassing for LeBron given that his team were the favorites to win the title coming into the season. A team with a LeBron-Westbrook-AD trio and role players like Monk, Melo, and Howard absolutely underachieved.

[1987_Lakers]

The Three-Peat requirement for a dynasty is not my definition, Axe is the one throwing it out there. My definition is at least back-to-back titles.

Yes, Boston never won back-to-back but neither did San Antonio. The Lakers and Pistons are dynasties.

I've never met anyone who thinks those back to back Detroit title teams were better than Bird's Celtics in their prime. But do you.

[RRR3]

PoopsNY still pretending he’s remotely objective is hilarious. He’s just a more intelligent non obsessed 3ball.

[HoopsNY]

I'm struggling to see how Dwight Howard doesn't suck if White sucks lol. Dwight put up 7/8 on a TS% 3.8% above league average the season before he played with LeBron last year. White Put up 5/6 on a TS% 3.2% above league average but his usage percentage was 4.1% lower. His efficiency then went up a lot with LeBron, which I think we can safely credit in some part to LeBron's passing. They are both backup centers who are there to dunk and block shots and aren't good enough to play big minutes. You are also ignoring my point that the Lakers with LeBron and AD were consistently the best team in the league when healthy until this past year. Do you think it was their fault that changed or something else?

If 80s MJ is better than 09 LeBron, his results with a similar supporting cast would have proven it by your logic. :confusedshrug:

Not sure what gives you this impression. Were you watching the league in 2002? White was an absolute scrub who had no potential.

White w/MJ '02: 5.5 PPG | 6.4 Rebs | 55% FG%
White w/o MJ '02: 4.9 PPG 5.5 Reb | 49% FG%

What about Howard?

Howard w/LeBron '22: 5.3 PPG | 5.7 Rebs | 59% FG%
Howard w/o LeBron '22: 7.6 PPG | 6.3 Rebs | 64% FG%

Just because the overall stats were similar doesn't mean the two players were similar in caliber or what they brought to the table.

You're not wrong that the Lakers were the best team with AD and LeBron when healthy in 2020 for example. Dynamics changed though and context matters, which you've proven in this instance. I'm just unsure why that matters more than say MJ joining an entirely new team, with a worst cast, and also being three years removed from the league.

Those factors tilt the scales a bit when adjusting for conference. Tbh, I can't lie, I don't know what the hell happened with LAL last year and it's pretty mind boggling. But it's a negative in LeBron's scale simply because that team, on paper, and prior to the season starting was expected to win it all.

You have people on this thread acting like LeBron was significantly better. I don't see how that's justifiable given the results and higher quality of casts. Washington's cast was horrible. The Laker's cast was decent. There's no way around that.

[HoopsNY]

PoopsNY still pretending he’s remotely objective is hilarious. He’s just a more intelligent non obsessed 3ball.

Sorry that you can't handle disagreement or logic. You're the one out here trying to tilt the argument in favor of LeBron by somehow saying the two casts were equal. This is hilarious. And I'm the one who isn't being objective? Get a brain you moron.

[HoopsNY]

We don't play what ifs. Fact is the Wizards didn't make the playoffs and MJ's Wizards years are largely looked as a stain on his legacy.

Deal with it.

You same guys also ignoring '09 & '10 LeBron won more games than '88 & '89 MJ despite having similar casts, why is that? Why couldn't MJ elevate his teammates back then like LeBron did?

Similar casts? lol, whut? Keep in mind, you're using '88 as if having rookie Pippen and rookie Grant somehow makes for great cast. That's pretty outlandish and you know it.

[theman93]

I've never met anyone who thinks those back to back Detroit title teams were better than Bird's Celtics in their prime. But do you.

Yeah bro not even close........even though the Pistons beat the #1 seed Celtics in '88 with the Celtics having homecourt advantage and McHale putting up 27/7 and Bird putting up 20/12/6/3/2. And that was before they were even a title team. They were 3 points away from 3-peating.

[RRR3]

Similar casts? lol, whut? Keep in mind, you're using '88 as if having rookie Pippen and rookie Grant somehow makes for great cast. That's pretty outlandish and you know it.
Who the **** did LeBron have in 09 lmao? Role players.

[RRR3]

Not sure what gives you this impression. Were you watching the league in 2002? White was an absolute scrub who had no potential.

White w/MJ '02: 5.5 PPG | 6.4 Rebs | 55% FG%
White w/o MJ '02: 4.9 PPG 5.5 Reb | 49% FG%

What about Howard?

Howard w/LeBron '22: 5.3 PPG | 5.7 Rebs | 59% FG%
Howard w/o LeBron '22: 7.6 PPG | 6.3 Rebs | 64% FG%

Just because the overall stats were similar doesn't mean the two players were similar in caliber or what they brought to the table.

You're not wrong that the Lakers were the best team with AD and LeBron when healthy in 2020 for example. Dynamics changed though and context matters, which you've proven in this instance. I'm just unsure why that matters more than say MJ joining an entirely new team, with a worst cast, and also being three years removed from the league.

Those factors tilt the scales a bit when adjusting for conference. Tbh, I can't lie, I don't know what the hell happened with LAL last year and it's pretty mind boggling. But it's a negative in LeBron's scale simply because that team, on paper, and prior to the season starting was expected to win it all.

You have people on this thread acting like LeBron was significantly better. I don't see how that's justifiable given the results and higher quality of casts. Washington's cast was horrible. The Laker's cast was decent. There's no way around that.
No one has ever been held to these standards at LeBron’s age. People were happy when Kobe hit a shot when he was 37. I’m sorry LeBron isn’t immortal and can’t impact a team the same way forever like you think he should be able to

[theman93]

No one has ever been held to these standards at LeBron’s age. People were happy when Kobe hit a shot when he was 37.

Lol you don't get it both ways. If he's still credited for being great because he has the best longevity of all-time, then making the play-in over the measley 34 win Spurs who traded away Derrick White in the middle of the season is a completely reasonable standard to hold him to. Anything less is laughable.

[HoopsNY]

Who the **** did LeBron have in 09 lmao? Role players.

Compared to MJ? Mo Williams was an All-Star. He also had Ilgauskas, a former 2 time All-Star.

CLE w/Ilgauskas '09: 55-10 | .846% (69 win pace)
CLE w/o Ilgauskas '09: 11-6 | .647% (53 win pace)

You can say MJ had Oakley, i'll give you that. But Oakley alone doesn't offset Mo Williams, Zydrunas, Varajeo, and West.

[theman93]

Not sure what gives you this impression. Were you watching the league in 2002? White was an absolute scrub who had no potential.

White w/MJ '02: 5.5 PPG | 6.4 Rebs | 55% FG%
White w/o MJ '02: 4.9 PPG 5.5 Reb | 49% FG%

What about Howard?

Howard w/LeBron '22: 5.3 PPG | 5.7 Rebs | 59% FG%
Howard w/o LeBron '22: 7.6 PPG | 6.3 Rebs | 64% FG%

Just because the overall stats were similar doesn't mean the two players were similar in caliber or what they brought to the table.

You're not wrong that the Lakers were the best team with AD and LeBron when healthy in 2020 for example. Dynamics changed though and context matters, which you've proven in this instance. I'm just unsure why that matters more than say MJ joining an entirely new team, with a worst cast, and also being three years removed from the league.

Those factors tilt the scales a bit when adjusting for conference. Tbh, I can't lie, I don't know what the hell happened with LAL last year and it's pretty mind boggling. But it's a negative in LeBron's scale simply because that team, on paper, and prior to the season starting was expected to win it all.

You have people on this thread acting like LeBron was significantly better. I don't see how that's justifiable given the results and higher quality of casts. Washington's cast was horrible. The Laker's cast was decent. There's no way around that.
No, he wasn't. He didn't start seriously watching the NBA until 2011 by his own admission. It's obvious too with how he's trying to prop up the likes of Chris Whitney and Jahidi freaking White lmao. Certified scrubs as everyone knew who actually watched those guys.


Similar casts? lol, whut? Keep in mind, you're using '88 as if having rookie Pippen and rookie Grant somehow makes for great cast. That's pretty outlandish and you know it.
Yeah similar casts bro with rookie Grant and Pippen starting a combined 6 of 160 games :roll:

[HoopsNY]

No one has ever been held to these standards at LeBron’s age. People were happy when Kobe hit a shot when he was 37. I’m sorry LeBron isn’t immortal and can’t impact a team the same way forever like you think he should be able to

I don't think it was a matter of standards based on age. I think being champions in 2020 and then the combination of AD-Melo-LeBron-Westbrook-Howard together with other smaller role players is something that was fair.

If one thing is for sure, even if you said that favoring them to win the title was absurd, I don't think you or anyone else would have said they wouldn't have even made the play-in. And that's even with injuries. It's just not something that any reasonable fan would have expected.

[HoopsNY]

No, he wasn't. He didn't start seriously watching the NBA until 2011 by his own admission. It's obvious too with how he's trying to prop up the likes of Chris Whitney and Jahidi freaking White lmao. Certified scrubs as everyone knew who actually watched those guys.


Yeah similar casts bro with rookie Grant and Pippen starting a combined 6 of 160 games :roll:

Ahh okay. If he started watching the league in the 2010s, then it makes sense as to why he would rely on statistics alone. No one who watched Jahidi White would say they would take him over Dwight Howard. And no one would certainly choose a combination of Rip, White, Laettner, Whitney, and Jones over guys like AD, Westbrook, Melo, Monk, and Howard.

It's just not even remotely close. And even if we adjust for conferences, which is fair, I don't think it offsets the difference in casts, the fact that MJ and LeBron were nearly 2 years apart, and that MJ was out of the league for three years.

2022 is a bigger stain on LeBron's career than MJ's stint with the Wizards. No one really expected anything from those Wizards teams.

[FilmyCogTurner]

I like how posters here compare stats and come to the conclusion that both players are equal while also ignoring all of the other components that make up a basketball player.

[theman93]

Ahh okay. If he started watching the league in the 2010s, then it makes sense as to why he would rely on statistics alone. No one who watched Jahidi White would say they would take him over Dwight Howard. And no one would certainly choose a combination of Rip, White, Laettner, Whitney, and Jones over guys like AD, Westbrook, Melo, Monk, and Howard.

It's just not even remotely close. And even if we adjust for conferences, which is fair, I don't think it offsets the difference in casts, the fact that MJ and LeBron were nearly 2 years apart, and that MJ was out of the league for three years.

2022 is a bigger stain on LeBron's career than MJ's stint with the Wizards. No one really expected anything from those Wizards teams.

And here's the kicker. Even if you did want to take Jordan's '02 supporting cast over Lebrons '22 supporting cast, Lebron being the supposed significantly superior player should be what put his team way over the top compared to Jordan's. But it didn't.

Regarding the conferences, and I've already made this point repeatedly which no one wanted to touch, the 2022 Western Conference teams only averaged 1.4 more wins than the 2002 Eastern Conference teams. And that's with their admission that the early '00 East was the weakest it ever was.

[Xiao Yao You]

Compared to MJ? Mo Williams was an All-Star. He also had Ilgauskas, a former 2 time All-Star.

CLE w/Ilgauskas '09: 55-10 | .846% (69 win pace)
CLE w/o Ilgauskas '09: 11-6 | .647% (53 win pace)

You can say MJ had Oakley, i'll give you that. But Oakley alone doesn't offset Mo Williams, Zydrunas, Varajeo, and West.

Who cares that he had Oakley? They traded Oakley because they liked Horace better. Oakley nor Horace were all stars like a couple of those guys mentioned

[Xiao Yao You]

I don't think it was a matter of standards based on age. I think being champions in 2020 and then the combination of AD-Melo-LeBron-Westbrook-Howard together with other smaller role players is something that was fair.

If one thing is for sure, even if you said that favoring them to win the title was absurd, I don't think you or anyone else would have said they wouldn't have even made the play-in. And that's even with injuries. It's just not something that any reasonable fan would have expected.

I thought it was laughable that the so called experts thought the Lakers were a favorite. But I certainly didn't think they'd be as bad as they were

[Xiao Yao You]

I like how posters here compare stats and come to the conclusion that both players are equal while also ignoring all of the other components that make up a basketball player.

I like how they try to tell you how things were in the 80's and 90's when they weren't even around yet :facepalm

[FilmyCogTurner]

It always intrigues me how the early Bulls team would have played out had they kept Oakley and used Horace as the trade piece for a center instead.

Ho Grant played his role well but he really was a bitch of a man on the court. Zero toughness at all and Oak was the exact opposite. Who knows, maybe the Bulls could have been even better.

[Xiao Yao You]

It always intrigues me how the early Bulls team would have played out had they kept Oakley and used Horace as the trade piece for a center instead.

Ho Grant played his role well but he really was a bitch of a man on the court. Zero toughness at all and Oak was the exact opposite. Who knows, maybe the Bulls could have been even better.

Oakley was close with MJ too. Hard to imagine that the Bulls would have been better without Horace though. He was the key to their full court press that they could use to put any team away at any time. They didn't have that in the 2nd repeat. They both played D but Horace was more versatile and athletic than Oakley. Don't remember Oakley being considered a great defender until later on the Knicks either. They both could hit it from mid range. Oakley was a better rebounder and passer. He couldn't jump at all

[1987_Lakers]

Yeah bro not even close........even though the Pistons beat the #1 seed Celtics in '88 with the Celtics having homecourt advantage and McHale putting up 27/7 and Bird putting up 20/12/6/3/2. And that was before they were even a title team. They were 3 points away from 3-peating.

What separated the early-mid 80's Celtics teams from their late 80s version was their bench. By '88 KC Jones strictly played their starters it seemed.

Not to mention DJ was on the decline by '88, Parish regressed a bit and McHale was never really the same after he broke his foot in '87, especially oh the defensive end.

Again, history looks at the Celtics as the better team. Shit, the Rockets repeated in the mid 90's, would you dare say they were better than the mid 80's Celtics just because they repeated as champs? Lol

[outofstomach]

No one has ever been held to these standards at LeBron’s age. People were happy when Kobe hit a shot when he was 37. I’m sorry LeBron isn’t immortal and can’t impact a team the same way forever like you think he should be able to

ah, so when lebron’s team is doing good and everything is fine; it’s “omg lebron is doing this at 37, he’s the goat and better than jordan” the inverse it’s “sorry lebron isn’t immortal, he’s only 37 cut him some slack” :lol

you ****** are honestly shameless, it’s impressive how increasingly delusional you lot got every year as ive lurked this forum :lol

[theman93]

ah, so when lebron’s team is doing good and everything is fine; it’s “omg lebron is doing this at 37, he’s the goat and better than jordan” the inverse it’s “sorry lebron isn’t immortal, he’s only 37 cut him some slack” :lol

you ****** are honestly shameless, it’s impressive how increasingly delusional you lot got every year as ive lurked this forum :lol

The double standard really is hilarious :lol

[theman93]

What separated the early-mid 80's Celtics teams from their late 80s version was their bench. By '88 KC Jones strictly played their starters it seemed.

Not to mention DJ was on the decline by '88, Parish regressed a bit and McHale was never really the same after he broke his foot in '87, especially oh the defensive end.

Again, history looks at the Celtics as the better team. Shit, the Rockets repeated in the mid 90's, would you dare say they were better than the mid 80's Celtics just because they repeated as champs? Lol

The only Celtic team I would put over the '89 Pistons are the '86 Celtics. Every other year is a toss up.

[SATAN]

LeBron is better.

[Baller789]

Nice cop out

Hey thats the reality. Doesnt mean you have to like it. :confusedshrug:

[Baller789]

But those aren't dynasties coach. Since someone said 'dynasties' have to 'three-peat' first. :roll:

If thats your argument.

Do you concede that I'm correct about dynasties?

Otherwise you just shot yourself.

[Bawkish]

LeBron is better.

...at getting empty stats. FACTS

[SATAN]

...at getting empty stats. FACTS

Maybe the not great offensive players or has beens should have done all the scoring. LeBron shouldn't have even shot the ball at all. Shouldn't have even tried.

[Axe]

If thats your argument.

Do you concede that I'm correct about dynasties?

Otherwise you just shot yourself.
Sure, if it makes you feel better mentally. Us non-casuals personally think that your self-indulgent opinion is dumb tho. :oldlol:

[HoopsNY]

Who cares that he had Oakley? They traded Oakley because they liked Horace better. Oakley nor Horace were all stars like a couple of those guys mentioned

Well, Oakley was a good role player and the enforcer on CHI those years. I'm saying he had Oakley, but LeBron's cast was still better.

[Baller789]

Sure, if it makes you feel better mentally. Us non-casuals personally think that your self-indulgent opinion is dumb tho. :oldlol:

Actually its really strange that you would try to use someone else's argument and try to imply it to someone else.

Bronies are really struggling with this one. Only way they could respond is through moving goalposts and deceit.

[Axe]

Actually its really strange that you would try to use someone else's argument and try to imply it to someone else.
Because you would clearly have issues if they use the term 'dynasty' in describing teams you think they shouldn't be describing with the said term.

[Baller789]

Because you would clearly have issues if they use the term 'dynasty' in describing teams you think they shouldn't be describing with the said term.

Well no one was able to disprove my point. Despite all your frustrations and efforts.

Feel free to try again and make a thread about it. I dont want to derail this one.

Still that doesnt justify using my talking points when they are contrary to yours. Its odd.

[Axe]

Contrary? Lmao i bet even coach himself had to scratch his own head when he saw what you thought about it.

[Baller789]

Axe i suggest you argue your point rather than arguing your ego.

I said enough in this thread. As I've said if you have anything to argue about that, make a thread about it, I would be happy to participate in it.

[Axe]

Yeah you don't like to get exposed. Ok bub.

[8Ball]

Wizards jordon was so much worse than 37 year old Lebron that he led the 2002 Wizards to a better record than the 2022 Lakers in less games started and with a much worse supporting cast.

Also, MJ was atleast an all-star at age 39. Duncan and Malone were not.

Jordan didnt make any allnba teams those years.


Man I missed this beautiful thread.

[8Ball]

Wizards years are good sampling to show the world that jordan does not have good longevity at all.

Tim duncan, kareem, malone, leBron, hell even cp3 made all-nba teams at 37.

This is why LeBron will be remembered as the greatest. There just isn't anyone that can match Bron over 19 years and 18 all-nba teams.


Bron's 18 all-nba teams is probably the most unbreakable record in the nba.

[Baller789]

Wizards years are good sampling to show the world that jordan does not have good longevity at all.

Tim duncan, kareem, malone, leBron, hell even cp3 made all-nba teams at 37.

This is why LeBron will be remembered as the greatest. There just isn't anyone that can match Bron over 19 years and 18 all-nba teams.


Bron's 18 all-nba teams is probably the most unbreakable record in the nba.

Terrible argunent as per usual :roll:

[theman93]

Jordan didnt make any allnba teams those years.


Man I missed this beautiful thread.

Didn't make All-NBA as a washed up old man, yet led the Wizards to a better record than what Lebron, as an All-NBA player, could lead the Lakers to. Absolutely incredible.

[8Ball]

Didn't make All-NBA as a washed up old man, yet led the Wizards to a better record than what Lebron, as an All-NBA player, could lead the Lakers to. Absolutely incredible.


The voters saw Jordan's gameplay and refused to give him any all-nba teams. That means nobody thought he was even the 15th best player in the NBA at the time. No longevity.

Bron made all-nba team for the 18th year in a row in 2022. That means the voters believed he was amongst the top 15 players at age 37. And it was a tossup between Bron and Kevin Durant for 2nd team all-nba.


LeBron is an old ass 37 year old and it was between him and Kevin Durant for all-nba 2nd team. Jordan at that age was like a top 30 player.

[8Ball]

Terrible argunent as per usual :roll:

Everything I wrote is correct.

[Baller789]

Everything I wrote is correct.

Wrong. You typed it.

[theman93]

The voters saw Jordan's gameplay and refused to give him any all-nba teams. That means nobody thought he was even the 15th best player in the NBA at the time. No longevity.

Bron made all-nba team for the 18th year in a row in 2022. That means the voters believed he was amongst the top 15 players at age 37. And it was a tossup between Bron and Kevin Durant for 2nd team all-nba.


LeBron is an old ass 37 year old and it was between him and Kevin Durant for all-nba 2nd team. Jordan at that age was like a top 30 player.

Tell me you don't know how All-NBA voting works without telling me you don't know how All-NBA voting works. :lol

Old, "barely top 30 player" washed up MJ with an even worse supporting cast still led the Wizards to a better record than what All-NBA Lebron led the Lakers to. Imagine that. Absolutely incredible.

[8Ball]

If Jordan played good he would have won at least 1st 2nd or 3rd team all-nba. He didn't and got booted out of the league.


Last season it was a tossup between LeBron or Durant for all-nba 2nd team. Jordan is not getting any kind of comparisons like that on the Wizards.


Debate end.

[theman93]

Durant accumulated 276 voter points to Lebron's 169. But you go on about that "toss up". :lol

Anyways, washed up MJ who went on to get booted out of the league still led the Wizards to the better record than All-NBA Lebron with a worse supporting cast. His team value was simply just greater. Absolutely incredible.

[8Ball]

Durant accumulated 276 voter points to Lebron's 169. But you go on about that "toss up". :lol

Anyways, washed up MJ who went on to get booted out of the league still led the Wizards to the better record than All-NBA Lebron with a worse supporting cast. His team value was simply just greater. Absolutely incredible.

Jordan accumulated how many voter points? 0?

Absolutely incredible.




Wizards jordon was worse than nearly any all-time great who played until his late 30s
What all-time greats who played at age 37+ is Wizards jordon NOT worse than?

LeBron
Kareem
Karl Malone
Tim Duncan

are/were all clearly better.

True.

I know it pains you that so many people think Bron is the GOAT. But that's a fact now. It can't be changed. Jordan no longer has undisputed GOAT claims.

Many people still think Jordan is the GOAT, that's fine. I think he is #2 which isn't even an insult.

[8Ball]

Wrong. You typed it.

I'm glad you admit everything I typed was correct. Everything here is factual:


Wizards years are good sampling to show the world that jordan does not have good longevity at all.

Tim duncan, kareem, malone, leBron, hell even cp3 made all-nba teams at 37.

This is why LeBron will be remembered as the greatest. There just isn't anyone that can match Bron over 19 years and 18 all-nba teams.

Bron's 18 all-nba teams is probably the most unbreakable record in the nba.

[theman93]

Jordan accumulated how many voter points? 0?

Absolutely incredible.

0 voter points and yet still led the Wizards to a better record than Lebron who accumulated 169 voter points. So yes, you are right it is absolutely incredible. :applause:

[8Ball]

0 voter points and yet still led the Wizards to a better record than Lebron who accumulated 169 voter points. So yes, you are right it is absolutely incredible. :applause:

169 > 0. All-nba is an individual award.

You switch to team accomplishments when comparing individual players. Like championships are also team accomplishments.

Individually, Bron is just superior.

[8Ball]

Michael Jordan at 37: 22/5/5 on 41%

Bron at 37: 30/8/6 on 52%



Bron is being offered a max deal right now at 37 by the Lakers. Nobody was offering Jordan the max.

[theman93]

169 > 0. All-nba is an individual award.

You switch to team accomplishments when comparing individual players. Like championships are also team accomplishments.

Individually, Bron is just superior.

In case you need to be reminded, this thread was a comparison of better/worse than - which extends beyond just individual performance. It's also inclusive to which individual was better at team elevation. To which washed up Wizards jordon was greater at elevating his team than All-NBA super star Lebron was with the better supporting cast. Absolute bonkers.

[theman93]

Michael Jordan at 37: 22/5/5 on 41%

Bron at 37: 30/8/6 on 52%



Bron is being offered a max deal right now at 37 by the Lakers. Nobody was offering Jordan the max.

This is a really good point, and I'm glad you brought it up. It just highlights the discrepancy even further that the significantly better, All-NBA, max-level player Lebron wasn't as great at elevating his team as old man Wizards jordon was. This is a stunning revelation.

[RogueBorg]

LeBron is an old ass 37 year old and it was between him and Kevin Durant for all-nba 2nd team. Jordan at that age was like a top 30 player.

You keep dodging the question. If Lebron was so much better why did the Lakers finish with a significantly worse record than Jordan's Wizard's?

Secret answer down below...
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Lebron is the empty stats king.

[FilmyCogTurner]

This is a really good point, and I'm glad you brought it up. It just highlights the discrepancy even further that the significantly better, All-NBA, max-level player Lebron wasn't as great at elevating his team as old man Wizards jordon was. This is a stunning revelation.

It goes to show how the stats doesn't always tell the full story. Jordan can in fact have worse stats and yet still be the better basketball player.

Something the Bronsexuals will never understand.

[TheGoatest]

I'm glad you admit everything I typed was correct. Everything here is factual:


Wizards years are good sampling to show the world that jordan does not have good longevity at all.

Tim duncan, kareem, malone, leBron, hell even cp3 made all-nba teams at 37.

This is why LeBron will be remembered as the greatest. There just isn't anyone that can match Bron over 19 years and 18 all-nba teams.

Bron's 18 all-nba teams is probably the most unbreakable record in the nba.

Excellent post.
Either 18 x all-NBA or his all-time playoff scoring record. Those are about equally unbreakable.
Meanwhile, it is flat out embarrassing that jordon failed to make an all-NBA team the season Jamal Mashburn made one (the only one of his career) :facepalm

[theman93]

Excellent post.
Either 18 x all-NBA or his all-time playoff scoring record. Those are about equally unbreakable.
Meanwhile, it is flat out embarrassing that jordon failed to make an all-NBA team the season Jamal Mashburn made one (the only one of his career) :facepalm

This is so true. The flat out embarassing Wizards jordon who failed to make All-NBA over All-NBA virgin Jamal Mashburn was greater at elevating his team than All-NBA super star Lebron. That is crazy the more you think about it.