Pippen + Grant in 1993-94 had a better record than Pippen + Grant + jordon in 1992-93

[TheGoatest]

It is often pointed out how the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls only lost two less games than in their previous 1992-93 season.
But did you know that the only reason the 93-94 Bulls had a worse record than the previous season at all is because The Great Scott Pippen missed 10 games in the 1993-94 season vs 1 game in 1992-93, and Horace Grant missed 12 games in 1993-94 vs 5 games in 1992-93?

In the 60 games The Great Scott Pippen and Horace Grant played together in the 1993-94 season the Bulls had a 44-16 record (.733)
In the 72 games The Great Scott Pippen, Horace Grant and jordon played together in the 1992-93 season the Bulls had a 51-21 record (.708)

The 1993-94 Bulls were a true team that played proper team basketball. Their only sin is that they didn't have a player who was worshipped enough by Stern to instruct the refs to make sure the Bulls got through in the playoffs like in the previous and upcoming seasons:

https://thumbor.bigedition.com/scottie-pippen-and-hubert-davis/WsFjAkibgG_0Oop09YBnQ3mcHZE=/800x0/filters:quality(80)/granite-web-prod/7d/58/7d58a02616ae4afbb982595fefe30021.jpg

[Round Mound]

We all know Pippen was a GREAT Player and Grant a very good player.

[iamgine]

Pippen and Grant totally upgraded their play in 1994 in a major way but the Bulls also upgraded their role players greatly with the addition of Kerr and Kukoc. You may think Kerr and Kukoc were small fries but for the Bulls, they were huge additions.

For example, the Bulls won 67 games in '92. So why did they only won 57 games in '93? I believe one of the main reasons (other than fatigue), was that John Paxson completely fell off the wheel in the regular season and there was no decent replacement for him. Adding Kerr in '94 hugely alleviate that problem and adding Kukoc also alleviate some of the scoring hole that was left by MJ leaving.

[TheMan]

Pippen and Grant totally upgraded their play in 1994 in a major way but the Bulls also upgraded their role players greatly with the addition of Kerr and Kukoc. You may think Kerr and Kukoc were small fries but for the Bulls, they were huge additions.

For example, the Bulls won 67 games in '92. So why did they only won 57 games in '93? I believe one of the main reasons (other than fatigue), was that John Paxson completely fell off the wheel in the regular season and there was no decent replacement for him. Adding Kerr in '94 hugely alleviate that problem and adding Kukoc also alleviate some of the scoring hole that was left by MJ leaving.

BJ Armstrong filled Paxson's role pretty well. Kerr was added on as an off the bench 3pt threat. Armstrong was the starter, he was later let go because the Bulls needed bigger guards to match up with the Magic, so Ron Harper was brought on and he became the starter even though he isn't a PG by nature.

[iamgine]

BJ Armstrong filled Paxson's role pretty well. Kerr was added on as an off the bench 3pt threat. Armstrong was the starter, he was later let go because the Bulls needed bigger guards to match up with the Magic, so Ron Harper was brought on and he became the starter even though he isn't a PG by nature.
BJ indeed filled it well, but then there's no one to fill BJ's role off the bench. Which was alleviated by Kerr.

[MadDogg]

Troll thread? The 93 Bulls had just come off back to back championships (MJ and Scottie also participated in the 92 Olympics). Not to mention the 93 team actually won a title lol. Say whatever you want about the regular-season, but that 94 team was ousted in the second round.

Apples and bowling balls.

[TheGoatest]

Troll thread? The 93 Bulls had just come off back to back championships (MJ and Scottie also participated in the 92 Olympics). Not to mention the 93 team actually won a title lol. Say whatever you want about the regular-season, but that 94 team was ousted in the second round.

Apples and bowling balls.

How does your newly created alt's agenda that fatigue + more games played fit in your overall agenda that jordon extended his career mileage by sitting out multiple seasons even though he was completely healthy?

[Bawkish]

So?

2016 Curry+Klay+Dray GSW has better record than 2017 KD+Curry+Klay+Dray GSW

[MadDogg]

How does your newly created alt's agenda that fatigue + more games played fit in your overall agenda that jordon extended his career mileage by sitting out multiple seasons even though he was completely healthy?

You sound completely deranged. What are you even asking?

[TheGoatest]

You sound completely deranged. What the hell are you even asking?

And you sound completely like your other jordon extremist alts.
You implied that the reason the 1992-93 Bulls had a worse record was because of long playoff runs in 1991 and 1992 + Olympics.
If you're going to admit that fatigue/playing more games in 1991 and 1992 makes it more difficult to win in 1993, then you automatically also admit that sitting out seasons/avoiding fatigue like jordon did in 1993-95 makes it easier to win in 1996-98. Except you hypocritically don't do that, and constantly try to have your cake while eating it too.

[MrFonzworth]

Wow, sounds like the Bulls were MUCH better without Jordan. Surely they won the title after he retired right?

[PerkinsFor3]

Can we get a seperate Lebron and MJ forum? It seems its all these nutjobs are able to talk about.

[Axe]

Can we get a seperate Lebron and MJ forum? It seems its all these nutjobs are able to talk about.
This.

[PerkinsFor3]

I cant imagine being this obsessed with players, lists and what others think about their favorite players. To me, it almosts looks like these people are getting paid to write all of this nonsense and to keep coming back over and over and over. Its just.. I can not imagine being like that.

[WhiteKyrie]

It’s just a regular season record

[TheMan]

And you sound completely like your other jordon extremist alts.
You implied that the reason the 1992-93 Bulls had a worse record was because of long playoff runs in 1991 and 1992 + Olympics.
If you're going to admit that fatigue/playing more games in 1991 and 1992 makes it more difficult to win in 1993, then you automatically also admit that sitting out seasons/avoiding fatigue like jordon did in 1993-95 makes it easier to win in 1996-98. Except you hypocritically don't do that, and constantly try to have your cake while eating it too.

This man is completely off the rails. MJ got this retard on skates :lol

[TheMan]

I cant imagine being this obsessed with players, lists and what others think about their favorite players. To me, it almosts looks like these people are getting paid to write all of this nonsense and to keep coming back over and over and over. Its just.. I can not imagine being like that.

I completely agree. I'm a Bulls and MJ fan, I'll admit I enjoy trolling Bronies but this dude Goatits actually spends hours creating threads by researching any bit of obscure info to try to back up his retarded take that the Bulls were better off without MJ :lol

Even the most anti LBJ trolliest trolls don't reach that level of stupidity to suggest a LeBron team is better off without him, lol.

Goatits is easily the dumbest c*nt here.

[MadDogg]

And you sound completely like your other jordon extremist alts.
You implied that the reason the 1992-93 Bulls had a worse record was because of long playoff runs in 1991 and 1992 + Olympics.
If you're going to admit that fatigue/playing more games in 1991 and 1992 makes it more difficult to win in 1993, then you automatically also admit that sitting out seasons/avoiding fatigue like jordon did in 1993-95 makes it easier to win in 1996-98. Except you hypocritically don't do that, and constantly try to have your cake while eating it too.

Maybe, maybe not. Jordan went on to train for and play a different sport. He wasn't just sitting on his laurels. All of that is beside the point however. You "implied" the 94 team was better than in 93 because of regular-season record. Well the Bulls actually won a title in 93 which makes your OP irrelevant.

[MadDogg]

This man is completely off the rails. MJ got this retard on skates :lol

Can't stick to his own topic, and shouts "jordon extremist!" in every reply. OP is crazy as a fox lol

[HoopsNY]

1993 was an anomaly. Keep in mind, Pippen played on a bad ankle the entire season due to playing in the olympics and not resting it, hence a drop in his numbers.

'92 Pippen: 21.0/7.7/7.0 on 51%

'93 Pippen: 18.6/7.7/6.3 on 47%

By '94, Grant, Armstrong, and Pippen had all hit their peaks. If MJ doesn't retire, that '94 team wins 70 games easy, maybe even 73-75 games.

[TheGoatest]

Maybe, maybe not. Jordan went on to train for and play a different sport. He wasn't just sitting on his laurels. All of that is beside the point however. You "implied" the 94 team was better than in 93 because of regular-season record. Well the Bulls actually won a title in 93 which makes your OP irrelevant.

I implied that the main worth jordon brought to the Bulls is favorable calls in the playoffs, and getting away with this scot-free in 1993:

https://www.yardbarker.com/media/e/8/e8dd0f2da3cddaf730f9b99b1601d37e87c615ef/600_wide/charles-smith.png

While being punished for this in 1994:

https://thumbor.bigedition.com/scottie-pippen-and-hubert-davis/WsFjAkibgG_0Oop09YBnQ3mcHZE=/800x0/filters:quality(80)/granite-web-prod/7d/58/7d58a02616ae4afbb982595fefe30021.jpg

And I won't even address your troll claim that jordon was being "fatigued" by baseball activity, let alone minor league baseball.

[Da_Realist]

The 93 Bulls were just trying to get through the regular season after winning back to back titles. They were sleepwalking to 57 wins. The real Bulls didn't show up until the playoffs. They went 15-4, snapped the Knicks 27 game home winning streak then went undefeated on the road in the Finals. It took the Suns winning a gutsy triple-OT Game 3 to prevent a 4-0 sweep in the Finals.

The 94 Bulls were using the regular season to make a statement.

The two teams had different motivations.

[3ba11]

A three-peat dynasty fell to 2nd Round and then borderline lottery in 95' before MJ returned

So the franchise collapsed without MJ and was immediately restored to 3-peat caliber upon his return for a full season

[MadDogg]

I implied that the main worth jordon brought to the Bulls is favorable calls in the playoffs, and getting away with this scot-free in 1993:

And I won't even address your troll claim that jordon was being "fatigued" by baseball activity, let alone minor league baseball.

You realize you're giving Jordan credit, right? MJ averaged more FGM than FTA - and is arguably the greatest slasher in history. Without his prescence, Chicago lost in 94. They had just won three straight with him. What are you even arguing right now? lol

That "missed call" also happened in the second round. Far cry from the finals, much less a title.

[TheGoatest]

You realize you're giving Jordan credit, right? MJ averaged more FGM than FTA - and is arguably the greatest slasher in history. Without his prescence, Chicago lost in 94. They had just won three straight with him. What are you even arguing right now? lol

That "missed call" also happened in the second round. Far cry from the finals, much less a title.

LOL, the hilarious thing is that even if that crap foul on Hubert Davis was legit, which it wasn't, the 93-94 Bulls without the presence of the Almighty jordon absolutely demolish any of the 3 Bulls teams from 1984-87 with his presence. Not to mention the fact that the following season they had his presence all over again, but they lost in the same 2nd round. Without any bullshit calls like the Hubert Davis one, mind you.

No consensus top 10 player ever had a team that would win 55 games if you remove that player's "presence".

[MadDogg]

And I won't even address your troll claim that jordon was being "fatigued" by baseball activity, let alone minor league baseball.

I get that you don't leave your house, but transitoning to another sport is pretty difficult. It requires alternate training on different muscle groups. Jordan went from basketball, to baseball, back to basketball. Lol go on though. Tell us why that's so easy.

[RogueBorg]

It is often pointed out how the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls only lost two less games than in their previous 1992-93 season.
But did you know that the only reason the 93-94 Bulls had a worse record than the previous season at all is because The Great Scott Pippen missed 10 games in the 1993-94 season vs 1 game in 1992-93, and Horace Grant missed 12 games in 1993-94 vs 5 games in 1992-93?

In the 60 games The Great Scott Pippen and Horace Grant played together in the 1993-94 season the Bulls had a 44-16 record (.733)
In the 72 games The Great Scott Pippen, Horace Grant and jordon played together in the 1992-93 season the Bulls had a 51-21 record (.708)

The 1993-94 Bulls were a true team that played proper team basketball. Their only sin is that they didn't have a player who was worshipped enough by Stern to instruct the refs to make sure the Bulls got through in the playoffs like in the previous and upcoming seasons:

https://thumbor.bigedition.com/scottie-pippen-and-hubert-davis/WsFjAkibgG_0Oop09YBnQ3mcHZE=/800x0/filters:quality(80)/granite-web-prod/7d/58/7d58a02616ae4afbb982595fefe30021.jpg

And now the rest of the story;

1992-'93 Bulls - NBA Champions
1993-'94 Bulls - 2nd round exit

Only worshippers of a 4/6 god think 1993-'94>>>1992-'93

[TheGoatest]

I get that you don't leave your house, but transitoning to another sport is pretty difficult. It requires alternate training on different muscle groups. Jordan did it twice.

Aside from exposing that he is no Deion Sanders or Bo Jackson, who could play both baseball and another sport at the very highest level during that very same era of late 80s/early 90s, the only thing that jordon's baseball "career" in the minor leagues did is keep his physical activity at about 4 out of 10 instead of 0 out of 10. It helped him warm up so that he could fully enforce his unfair advantage over the other NBA players who were fully active while he was away and endured normal fatigue and normal risk of injury.

I'm surprised that you haven't mentioned jordon's frequent golf play. And let's not forget his career in gambling.

[RogueBorg]

Only loser Lebronstans think not winning a chip is better than winning one.

[TheMan]

Only loser Lebronstans think not winning a chip is better than winning one.

That's what makes them LeLosers, runners up = winning it all in their feeble minds. God bless their poor souls :lol

[TheGoatest]

Only jordon extremists think that 0 .500 seasons in 5 attempts (:facepalm) is somehow better than a 55 win season in 1st attempt. :roll:

[MadDogg]

Aside from exposing that he is no Deion Sanders or Bo Jackson, who could play both baseball and another sport at the very highest level during that very same era of late 80s/early 90s, the only thing that jordon's baseball "career" in the minor leagues did is keep his physical activity at about 4 out of 10 instead of 0 out of 10. It helped him warm up so that he could fully enforce his unfair advantage over the other NBA players who were fully active while he was away and endured normal fatigue and normal risk of injury.

I'm surprised that you haven't mentioned jordon's frequent golf play. And let's not forget his career in gambling.

Deion and Bo were outliers. Not the norm. They also had bigger bodies going into baseball. Jordan had to put on at least 10-15 pounds and had a different training regimen. Why you're comparing that to gambling is dumbfounding. But its enough for me to stop taking you seriously.

[TheMan]

Only jordon extremists think that 0 .500 seasons in 5 attempts (:facepalm) is somehow better than a 55 win season in 1st attempt. :roll:

Only a retard wouldn't notice the huge difference between one lineup consisting of the GOAT as a youngster with a bunch of coked out trash teammates and the sidekick fronting a bunch of battle hardened vets coming from a threepeat that was previously led by the GOAT.

[Soundwave]

92-93 Bulls were bored of the regular season which happens to most 2 time champions the regular season gets stale. They just wanted to get to the playoffs so they could chase the Threepeat thing which was being hyped through the roof at the time.

A big part of why the 92-93 Bulls weren't as good in the regular season also was because Pippen and Grant got lazy in the regular season, Jordan retiring after 93 was a kick in the ass to get their games back up a notch.

[TheGoatest]

Deion and Bo were outliers. Not the norm. They also had bigger bodies going into baseball. Jordan had to put on at least 10-15 pounds and had a different training regimen. Why you're comparing that to gambling is dumbfounding. But its enough for me to stop taking you seriously.

Nah, jordon sucking at baseball compared to Deion and Bo had nothing to do their body size. jordon's performance just plain sucked ass. And players bulk up way more than 10-15 pounds in basketball, so I don't know what's your point. You comparing minor league baseball fatigue to NBA fatigue should be enough for anyone to stop taking you seriously.

[TheGoatest]

Only a retard wouldn't notice the huge difference between one lineup consisting of the GOAT as a youngster with a bunch of coked out trash teammates and the sidekick fronting a bunch of battle hardened vets coming from a threepeat that was previously led by the GOAT.

Only a multi-alt retard would somehow find it justifiable that jordon's Bulls finished below the 1986-87 Indiana Pacers despite jordon having a teammate who had more all-star votes than anyone on the Pacers roster.

[TheMan]

Only a multi-alt retard would somehow find it justifiable that jordon's Bulls finished below the 1986-87 Indiana Pacers despite jordon having a teammate who had more all-star votes than anyone on the Pacers roster.

Who gives a **** about seasons not ending in a chip?

In the end, the mission wasn't accomplished which is to win a ring.

Only recently have I been checking out the NBA forum, I didn't recognize your posts from you ISH handle since it's pretty indistinguishable from the overall amount of stupidity that comes from you Bronies but now that I'm more familiar with your content, you really do stand out as a numbskull. You keep harping on when MJ was before his prime, when most other legends are just getting started, not every legend gers drafted by the Lakers or Celtics. The Bulls were pathetic before MJ and since. LeBron wasn't taking his team nowhere either during his first years. You're an idiot, your takes are stupid and you winning Stupidest Poster here is well deserved.

[MrFonzworth]

Who gives a **** about seasons not ending in a chip?

In the end, the mission wasn't accomplished which is to win a ring.

Only recently have I been checking out the NBA forum, I didn't recognize your posts from you ISH handle since it's pretty indistinguishable from the overall amount of stupidity that comes from you Bronies but now that I'm more familiar with your content, you really do stand out as a numbskull. You keep harping on when MJ was before his prime, when most other legends are just getting started, not every legend gers drafted by the Lakers or Celtics. The Bulls were pathetic before MJ and since. LeBron wasn't taking his team nowhere either during his first years. You're an idiot, your takes are stupid and you winning Stupidest Poster here is well deserved.

Slayed:lol

[TheGoatest]

Who gives a **** about seasons not ending in a chip?

In the end, the mission wasn't accomplished which is to win a ring.

Only recently have I been checking out the NBA forum, I didn't recognize your posts from you ISH handle since it's pretty indistinguishable from the overall amount of stupidity that comes from you Bronies but now that I'm more familiar with your content, you really do stand out as a numbskull. You keep harping on when MJ was before his prime, when most other legends are just getting started, not every legend gers drafted by the Lakers or Celtics. The Bulls were pathetic before MJ and since. LeBron wasn't taking his team nowhere either during his first years. You're an idiot, your takes are stupid and you winning Stupidest Poster here is well deserved.

You and your alts care about seasons not ending in a chip as soon as you mention these two words: Bill Russell

I care about the vast, vast contrast in winning between jordon and The Great Scott Pippen in the seasons they didn't play without each other because jordon never won a ring without The Great Scott Pippen. Therefore, it is highly relevant to look at which of the two did better without the other in terms of winning. You're ready to call something a 26 year-old LeBron did in the finals for the greatest choke job in history, but conveniently slide a 24 year-old jordon being out-led by a 22 year-old rookie not even footnote-worthy Chuck Person like it's beyond insignificant. LeBron, Magic, Bird, Duncan, Shaq, Hakeem ALL took their teams further than jordon did in his first years. And none of them have a teammate to whose success they are ball-and-chained to as jordon is to The Great Scott Pippen. Nor did most of them have the luxury of making the playoffs with a 30-52 record.

[red1]

Im a big fan of hating on jordan, who I like to call baldan.


I heard pippen used to steal his girls. That's why I'm not surprised that he (pippen) won 55 games, and led the team to game 7 of the conference semis. All while baldan was suspended for sociopathic gambling.

[RogueBorg]

92-93 Bulls were bored of the regular season which happens to most 2 time champions the regular season gets stale. They just wanted to get to the playoffs so they could chase the Threepeat thing which was being hyped through the roof at the time.

A big part of why the 92-93 Bulls weren't as good in the regular season also was because Pippen and Grant got lazy in the regular season, Jordan retiring after 93 was a kick in the ass to get their games back up a notch.

Everyone notice how OP is focusing on the 1992-'93 regular season and not the post-season?

In the playoffs, where it really matters, the Bulls swept Atlanta, swept the 54-win Cavs, beat the Eastern Conferences top-seeded Knicks in 6, and then beat the overall top-seeded Suns in 6. They went 15-4 in a so-called down year.

They beat the Knicks in '91, '92, '93 with Jordan and got bounced by them in '94 without Jordan.

Tell me the cool story of how great the '93-'94 season was again LeLoserstans (not you Soundwave)

[RogueBorg]

Who gives a **** about seasons not ending in a chip?

In the end, the mission wasn't accomplished which is to win a ring.



Only losers think 6 Finals losses is some sort of accomplishment.

Do Buffalo Bills fans sing the praises of their 4 straight Super Bowl losses?

Do Minnesota Vikings fans brag about making the Super Bowl 4 times only to come away empty each time?

There's only one set of fans that think almost winning is some kind of success.

The goal is to win it all, anything less is a failure.

https://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/quote-losing-the-super-bowl-is-worse-than-death-you-have-to-get-up-the-next-morning-george-allen-132-6-0610.jpg

[theman93]

Only losers think 6 Finals losses is some sort of accomplishment.

Do Buffalo Bills fans sing the praises of their 4 straight Super Bowl losses?

Do Minnesota Vikings fans brag about making the Super Bowl 4 times only to come away empty each time?

There's only one set of fans that think almost winning is some kind of success.

The goal is to win it all, anything less is a failure.

https://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/quote-losing-the-super-bowl-is-worse-than-death-you-have-to-get-up-the-next-morning-george-allen-132-6-0610.jpg

Remember Eagles fans celebrating 4 trips in a row to the NFCCG in the early 00's only to lose every single time? Yeah me neither :lol

[Full Court]

Bulls: three-peated '91-'93.

Bulls: didn't even make it to the finals in '94. Eliminated in second round.

Bulls: Three-peated again '96-98.


But they "climaxed" in 1994 without MJ.

:roll:

[3ba11]

Jordan got away scot-free in 93' after fouling Charles Smith





Jordan always delivered, while Pippen choked in 1994:



https://i.makeagif.com/media/11-21-2021/6q8E2n.gif








While being punished for this in 1994:


https://thumbor.bigedition.com/scottie-pippen-and-hubert-davis/WsFjAkibgG_0Oop09YBnQ3mcHZE=/800x0/filters:quality(80)/granite-web-prod/7d/58/7d58a02616ae4afbb982595fefe30021.jpg





^^^ that's BEFORE the follow-through on the shot:

This was the follow-through:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/6-27-2021/W44XtX.gif


HOF announcer Hubie Brown said it was a clear-cut hack right after it happened on live TV:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3FbvWSZQkY&t=01m28s



The Pippen foul on Hubert only put the Bulls down 3-2 - they had every chance in Game 7 but Pippen choked again (8-24)..

So it was a clear-cut, solid win by the Knicks especially since the Kukoc miracle stopped a 3-0 lead

Pippen choked with the "sit out" in game 3, the dumb foul in game 5, and Game 7, plus a bunch of other little chokes (https://i.makeagif.com/media/6-27-2021/_p33FZ.gif) in between (21.7 on 40% overall with woat 4th quarter stats (above).

If Pippen has woat 4th quarter stats in the 2nd Round, how will he compete with Reggie Miller in the ECF, especially when Miller owns Pippen (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?493657-Reggie-Miller-and-Pippen-faced-the-same-opponent-in-the-playoffs-6-times)?.. It's impossible88

[TheMan]

This thread...

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ae/07/20/ae072070163758984243215cabd3bf71.gif

[Axe]

We all know Pippen was a GREAT Player and Grant a very good player.
Interesting to see non-casuals acknowledging the infamous 1-9 dad killer got some good help/company during the 90s dynasty bt. Complete opposite of whatever pure bullshit that 3ball keeps on spitting out in multiple threads here. :lebronamazed: :applause:

[TheGoatest]

Everyone notice how OP is focusing on the 1992-'93 regular season and not the post-season?

In the playoffs, where it really matters, the Bulls swept Atlanta, swept the 54-win Cavs, beat the Eastern Conferences top-seeded Knicks in 6, and then beat the overall top-seeded Suns in 6. They went 15-4 in a so-called down year.

They beat the Knicks in '91, '92, '93 with Jordan and got bounced by them in '94 without Jordan.

Tell me the cool story of how great the '93-'94 season was again LeLoserstans (not you Soundwave)

I'll gladly compare the 93-94 Bulls post-season without jordon to ANY post-season jordon had without The Great Scott Pippen. Even with the bullshit Hubert Davis call.
So which of those Bulls post-seasons do you want to compare it to? 1985? 1986? 1987? Take your pick. You have three shots in the barrel. Surely one of those MUST beat the 1994 post-season... right?