Gary Payton: "LeBron James is by far a better all round than Jordan"

[8Ball]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/amp/gary_payton_thinks_lebron_james_is_a_better_all_ar ound_player_than_michael_jordan/s1_16751_37939301

“LeBron James is by far a better all-around basketball player than Michael Jordan”


Is this fact not obvious to everyone in the NBA universe yet?


Why does it need to be said so many times? It is like saying Curry is the greatest 3 point shooter.

[8Ball]

Scottie Pippen said as much 11 years ago. The man knew the truth and spoke it and got flack for it.

[GrayGoat]

Incoming full court meltdown

[Full Court]

Incoming full court meltdown

:roll:

I've got these guys so triggered that they dread me.

:lebronamazed:

[8Ball]

Incoming full court meltdown

Like I said, once Bron gets Kareem's record and retires and becomes an old head himself, all the old heads will crown LeBron as the GOAT.

They can't do it yet because they are emotionally attached to the past.

Once Bran overrides that, it will be infinitely easier emotionally for them to accept the obvious.

Some old heads have already spoken it.

[Full Court]

Bronie logic:

Lebron passed up Jordan in scoring....but Jordan's still ranked ahead of him. But when he passes up KAREEM, he'll magically be passed Jordan then. He he he he.

:lebronamazed:

Let me know how that works out for you guys. :roll:

[8Ball]

The all time scoring record is Kareem's most important achievement.

We don't talk about his 6 rings or 6 mvps.

Once Bron takes that trophy, nothing Jordan has ever done can be measured against that achievement.

Jordan fans are very concerned about this.

[Full Court]

The all time scoring record is Kareem's most important achievement.

We don't talk about his 6 rings or 6 mvps.

Once Bron takes that trophy, nothing Jordan has ever done can be measured against that achievement.

Jordan fans are very concerned about this.

If, as you assert, the all time scoring record is Kareem's most important achievement, and yet virtually nobody has him ranked #1....then why would you think that breaking it would put Bronie at #1? Hmmmmmmm?

Man, you're getting ragdolled all over the place once again. :lol

[8Ball]

Bron is already at #1 since 2020.


The all time scoring record is merely an olympic torch for the dinosaurs / neanderthals to see the light.

[8Ball]

More context from Gary Payton:


I think LeBron is an all-around basketball player. If you ask me who is a better all-around basketball player, LeBron James, by far, he does everything. He passes the ball better than Jordan, he can dribble little bit better than Jordan, shooting wise I don't think so, rebounding I think he did, but so did Jordan.

[1987_Lakers]

This is common sense. LeBron is a better passer, rebounder and has the ability to play and defend multiple positions.

[Full Court]

Bron is already at #1 since 2020.


The all time scoring record is merely an olympic torch for the dinosaurs / neanderthals to see the light.

:lol I know that you think that if you say something over and over again it will magically become so, but I hate to break it to you, life doesn't work that way.

:confusedshrug:

[Full Court]

This is common sense. LeBron is a better passer, rebounder and has the ability to play and defend multiple positions.

Yet, Jordan has far more defensive accolades, got just as many blocks despite being smaller, and got way more steals. Nobody in their right mind would say Lebron is a better defender.

[1987_Lakers]

Yet, Jordan has far more defensive accolades, got just as many blocks despite being smaller, and got way more steals. Nobody in their right mind would say Lebron is a better defender.

Peak for peak. LeBron was the better defender, although MJ was more consistent. As far as defensive versatility, it isn't even close. LeBron can guard 1-4 at a very high level in his prime. MJ just didn't have the size to do that.

[Full Court]

Peak for peak. LeBron was the better defender, although MJ was more consistent. As far as defensive versatility, it isn't even close. LeBron can guard 1-4 at a very high level in his prime. MJ just didn't have the size to do that.

Versatility does not equal better. I don't think there's even a case for Lebron peak-for-peak.

[GrayGoat]

Gary Payton played in the nba. His opinion is valid

[1987_Lakers]

Versatility does not equal better. I don't think there's even a case for Lebron peak-for-peak.

The thread is about LeBron being better "all-around". LeBron being able to guard more positions qualifies as that.

[Johnny32]

i pity anyone who thinks 6'4 198 lb lil mikey was a better defender than mia lebron.

[Full Court]

The thread is about LeBron being better "all-around". LeBron being able to guard more positions qualifies as that.

Jordan had 9 all defense first team selection, tied for the most ever. He was also a DPOY. Lebron has 5 all defense first teams and was never DPOY. When Jordan is better on both offense and defense, you can't really make a case that Lebron is better "all around." Saying he could "guard 1-4" doesn't change that. I'll concede that he's a better rebounder, but I'm not convinced he's that much better of a passer if at all.

[Full Court]

i pity anyone who thinks 6'4 198 lb lil mikey was a better defender than mia lebron.

^And there's proof that Jabronie32 knows nothing about basketball.

[GrayGoat]

Guys listen up. Full Court is more knowledgeable about basketball than Gary Payton

[Full Court]

Guys listen up. Full Court is more knowledgeable about basketball than Gary Payton

Obviously I'm less biased than Gary Payton. He's talking about the guy who kept him from getting a ring, so I'm suuuuuuuuuuuure he's completely objective. :lol

[1987_Lakers]

Jordan had 9 all defense first team selection, tied for the most ever. He was also a DPOY. Lebron has 5 all defense first teams and was never DPOY. When Jordan is better on both offense and defense, you can't really make a case that Lebron is better "all around." Saying he could "guard 1-4" doesn't change that. I'll concede that he's a better rebounder, but I'm not convinced he's that much better of a passer if at all.

lol

[TheMan]

The all time scoring record is Kareem's most important achievement.

We don't talk about his 6 rings or 6 mvps.

Once Bron takes that trophy, nothing Jordan has ever done can be measured against that achievement.

Jordan fans are very concerned about this.

KAJ was never seen as consensus GOAT

[TheMan]

i pity anyone who thinks 6'4 198 lb lil mikey was a better defender than mia lebron.

DPOY? Is that when LBJ won that award because I could have sworn I missed that...

[1987_Lakers]

Any guard winning DPOY is a joke. Look at Marcus Smart, once more NBA fans got to see him play during the postseason it was clear he wasn't even the best player on his team.

[TheMan]

Guys listen up. Full Court is more knowledgeable about basketball than Gary PaytonBronie logic...

Guys, listen up, we'll take into consideration Payton's opinion over someone like Ray Allen that like Payton, played in MJ and LeBron's era BUT Ray actually played alongside LeBron, you can't get a better perspective than that...but he believes MJ is the GOAT and there's nothing LeBron at this point can do to change his mind so let's disregard his opinion because it doesn't fit our narrative.

[SATAN]

Guys listen up. Full Court is more knowledgeable about basketball than Gary Payton

:lol

[Baller789]

Any guard winning DPOY is a joke. Look at Marcus Smart, once more NBA fans got to see him play during the postseason it was clear he wasn't even the best player on his team.

So Gary Payton winning it was a joke as well? So his opinion is a joke as well.

[1987_Lakers]

So Gary Payton winning it was a joke as well? So his opinion is a joke as well.

What does him winning DPOY have to do with his own opinion? I don't understand this logic.

Low IQ Bron haters at it again.

[Axe]

What does him winning DPOY have to do with his own opinion? I don't understand this logic.

Low IQ Bron haters at it again.
Oh casuals... :ohwell:

[3ba11]

.
Surely Payton thinks Magic is a better all-round player than MJ too, but Magic is still below MJ as a basketball player just like Lebron is (and MJ was a better PG than Magic when he played that position in 89' anyway, so Payton is wrong even by his own flawed logic of inflating point-guard-style players)

Ultimately, ball-dominators like Magic, Lebron, and Luka have the following flaws:



* can't run off-screens and play off-guard OR DEFEND off-guards, aka Klay, Reggie Miller, Curry, MJ

* can't carry the scoring load and therefore needs all-time scoring help like Kareem, Wade, AD, Kyrie



If required to carry the scoring load, the skillsets of Lebron, Luka, Magic, or Westbrook are too ball-dominant to beat top teams and therefore need elite 1st options at sidekick like Kareem, Durant, Wade, AD, Kyrie, etc.. Otoh, expert jumpshooters can carry the scoring load against top teams (maintain ball movement), so they can win secondary producers like Wiggins or Pippen and don't need all-time scoring help like ball-dominators.. People forget that GM's prefer to build a contender cheaply with defenders but this requires a 1st option that can carry the scoring load like Curry or MJ (expert jumpshooters), otherwise the GM must find expensive scoring help to support inferior brands of ball (ball-dominators).

Ultimately, expert jumpshooters can defeat maximum defensive attention (carry the scoring load in playoffs and Finals of title run), so they need the least scoring help, thereby building dynasties with the least help (secondary producders like Wiggins, Pippen and cheap defenders).


* Uncoachable - they never evolved out of ball-dominant offenses that revolve around them, thus forcing coaches into a predictable heliocentric offense where 80% of the team plays a spot-up role - this garbage brand of ball predictably requires goat supporting talent and has lower team ceilings/Finals records than expected



* impose spot-up roles that stall young players, so they lack the teammate development, fits, and brand of ball needed to win organically and must be talent-based winners instead (team-hoppers or colluders... all-star game strategy).. aka they never really learn how to win (organic) and only learn how to collude/team-hop.

* turnover prone and uses teammates as bailout options instead of being a bailout option for teammates (elevating teammates)

[RRR3]

Gary Payton giving his opinion has sent 3ball into a massive tantrum

[Full Court]

3ball sending RRR3 into a meltdown.

As usual. :lol

[Baller789]

What does him winning DPOY have to do with his own opinion? I don't understand this logic.

Low IQ Bron haters at it again.

Was Payton winning DPOY a joke?

[1987_Lakers]

Was Payton winning DPOY a joke?

Yes, but does that mean his own opinion is a joke just because he won the award?

[Street Hunger]

How would Jordan do in isolation against LeBron in 3-point range at the top of the key?

[3ba11]

How would Jordan do in isolation against LeBron in 3-point range at the top of the key?


Two made jumpers

Then upfake -blowby

Then jab step-blowby when Lebron presses up on him (down 0-3 at this point)

Then jab-step, pivot, spin

Blow-by left

Then Mike turns his back to him and starts shooting fadeaways

[RRR3]

Two made jumpers

Then upfake -blowby

Then jab step-blowby when Lebron presses up on him (down 0-3 at this point)

Then jab-step, pivot, spin

And on and on.
Why do you throw so many tantrums at your advanced age? Never matured past toddler?

[3ba11]

How would Jordan do in isolation against LeBron in 3-point range at the top of the key?



https://i.makeagif.com/media/6-01-2021/e_YBWb.gif

[Street Hunger]

Wonder if GP and Jordan talk these days

[Baller789]

Yes, but does that mean his own opinion is a joke just because he won the award?

Well if him winning DPOY to you was a joke, theres no stopping anyone else from calling his opinion as a joke.

[Street Hunger]

Need to rewatch some Gary Payton games to properly remember his defensive skills

[1987_Lakers]

Well if him winning DPOY to you was a joke, theres no stopping anyone else from calling his opinion as a joke.

Nice logic there. :oldlol:

[Smook A.]

LeBron's the best all-around player ever. Elite scorer, elite passer, always been a solid rebounder, has an extremely high basketball IQ, and he was also an elite defender for a while. Full package

[RRR3]

Nice logic there. :oldlol:
It's crazy how I've never seen a smart LeBron hater. I've encountered smart people who underrate LeBron, but that's just because they're wrong, not because they hate him. People who hate LeBron obsessively almost always seem to be incredibly dimwitted.

[jayfan]

And Emmit Smith was a better "all around" back than Barry Sanders. No one cares. Barry's the goat.


.

[Baller789]

It's crazy how I've never seen a smart LeBron hater. I've encountered smart people who underrate LeBron, but that's just because they're wrong, not because they hate him. People who hate LeBron obsessively almost always seem to be incredibly dimwitted.

Oh youve seen them l, youre just not smart enough to recognize them.

[Baller789]

Oh casuals... :ohwell:

Oh incels :oldlol:

[1987_Lakers]

Oh youve seen them l, youre just not smart enough to recognize them.

https://c.tenor.com/5Er9n9AWC7MAAAAM/kobe-bryant-what.gif

[Axe]

https://c.tenor.com/5Er9n9AWC7MAAAAM/kobe-bryant-what.gif
:lol

[TheGoatest]

.
Surely Payton thinks Magic is a better all-round player than MJ too, but Magic is still below MJ as a basketball player just like Lebron is (and MJ was a better PG than Magic when he played that position in 89' anyway, so Payton is wrong even by his own flawed logic of inflating point-guard-style players)

Ultimately, ball-dominators like Magic, Lebron, and Luka have the following flaws:



* can't run off-screens and play off-guard OR DEFEND off-guards, aka Klay, Reggie Miller, Curry, MJ

* can't carry the scoring load and therefore needs all-time scoring help like Kareem, Wade, AD, Kyrie



If required to carry the scoring load, the skillsets of Lebron, Luka, Magic, or Westbrook are too ball-dominant to beat top teams and therefore need elite 1st options at sidekick like Kareem, Durant, Wade, AD, Kyrie, etc.. Otoh, expert jumpshooters can carry the scoring load against top teams (maintain ball movement), so they can win secondary producers like Wiggins or Pippen and don't need all-time scoring help like ball-dominators.. People forget that GM's prefer to build a contender cheaply with defenders but this requires a 1st option that can carry the scoring load like Curry or MJ (expert jumpshooters), otherwise the GM must find expensive scoring help to support inferior brands of ball (ball-dominators).

Ultimately, expert jumpshooters can defeat maximum defensive attention (carry the scoring load in playoffs and Finals of title run), so they need the least scoring help, thereby building dynasties with the least help (secondary producders like Wiggins, Pippen and cheap defenders).


* Uncoachable - they never evolved out of ball-dominant offenses that revolve around them, thus forcing coaches into a predictable heliocentric offense where 80% of the team plays a spot-up role - this garbage brand of ball predictably requires goat supporting talent and has lower team ceilings/Finals records than expected



* impose spot-up roles that stall young players, so they lack the teammate development, fits, and brand of ball needed to win organically and must be talent-based winners instead (team-hoppers or colluders... all-star game strategy).. aka they never really learn how to win (organic) and only learn how to collude/team-hop.

* turnover prone and uses teammates as bailout options instead of being a bailout option for teammates (elevating teammates)

Holy shit. :oldlol:
Damn, this meltdown created by Gary Payton's fact-telling had to be vented out by a novel that contains more text than War and Peace. :roll:

[Manny98]

Versatility does not equal better. I don't think there's even a case for Lebron peak-for-peak.
There is definitely a case

[Full Court]

It's crazy how I've never seen a smart LeBron hater. I've encountered smart people who underrate LeBron, but that's just because they're wrong, not because they hate him. People who hate LeBron obsessively almost always seem to be incredibly dimwitted.

Hmmmmmm, I guess FACTS hurt you then. Facts like

-86
4/10
22/33
2011 epic choke job
2022 led a super team to the lottery

etc.

"Bu-bu-bu-but that's underrating him!!!!"

:lebroncry:







:roll:

[LAL]

Lebron has really fooled so many people with his all around stats dribbling the air out of the ball. Guess doncic, westbrook, harden, giannis were all around better than MJ? I mean you guys want us to just act like lebron doesn't have many many flaws on both sides of the court, no true offensive skills or lack of defensive intelligence and effort.

Comparing him with MJ :roll: MJ and Kobe never respected his game or mindset.

[Spurs m8]

MJ still upsetting his opponents...what's new...he'll live rent free forever because he stunted their careers and legacies

Op is a b1tch

[1987_Lakers]

Lebron has really fooled so many people with his all around stats dribbling the air out of the ball. Guess doncic, westbrook, harden, giannis were all around better than MJ? I mean you guys want us to just act like lebron doesn't have many many flaws on both sides of the court, no true offensive skills or lack of defensive intelligence and effort.

Comparing him with MJ :roll: MJ and Kobe never respected his game or mindset.

MJ was miles ahead on the defensive end compared to Luka, Harden, & Westbrook.

LeBron has "major flaws" on both ends, but he's considered an all-time great offensive & defensive player in his peak. lol, where do you come up with this stuff?

[colts19]

And Emmit Smith was a better "all around" back than Barry Sanders. No one cares. Barry's the goat.


.

This

[colts19]

Before Lebron came along, Larry Bird was a better all around player than MJ. Better rebounder, passer, and shooter and could guard power forwards at a high level. No one cared for 20 years. But now people care. Mj is considered better because he could win games with his scoring ability and there was nothing you could do to stop him.

[Axe]

Before Lebron came along, Larry Bird was a better all around player than MJ. Better rebounder, passer, and shooter and could guard power forwards at a high level. No one cared for 20 years. But now people care. Mj is considered better because he could win games with his scoring ability and there was nothing you could do to stop him.
Funny how many casuals treat jordan as if he was the sole reason the bulls started winning a lot of games in the late 80s and throughout the rest of his career when it was actually the efforts of the front office to surround him with reliable supporting casts that did it.

[TheMan]

Funny how many casuals treat jordan as if he was the sole reason the bulls started winning a lot of games in the late 80s and throughout the rest of his career when it was actually the efforts of the front office to surround him with reliable supporting casts that did it.

True but that also applies to every GOAT tier player. Can't win on your own.

[FilmyCogTurner]

There are micro and macro levels to what an all around player is in basketball and it's definitely Jordan. On the surface level Lebron may seem like the better all around player because of reb/assists but can he play in different systems? Not really. Can he play as an off ball threat? Hardly. Dominate a game defensively? Nice highlights here and there but he could never put the effort in for a full 48.

Jordan could play in any system because of his deadly midrange game. On ball, off ball it didn't matter he could do what the team needed. It just happened the Bulls needed his scoring punch quite a bit of the time but he could defer when needed and still impact the game.

A superior player by any metric and I don't want hear about longevity because who cares. Who is the better BASKETBALL PLAYER. It's Michael Jordan.

[TheGoatest]

And Emmit Smith was a better "all around" back than Barry Sanders. No one cares. Barry's the goat.


.

And Alex English, George Gervin, Adrian Dantley, Bernard King, Dominique Wilkins, Mark Aguirre and Kiki Vandeweghe all "averaged more points" than Magic Johnson. No one cares. Magic was a way better player than any of them.

[Full Court]

And Alex English, George Gervin, Adrian Dantley, Bernard King, Dominique Wilkins, Mark Aguirre and Kiki Vandeweghe all "averaged more points" than Magic Johnson. No one cares. Magic was a way better player than any of them.

And yet career points is the ONLY thing you and your fellow Bronies are desperately clinging to. :roll:


Boom. Ethered again.

:lebronamazed:

[Baller789]

Funny how many casuals treat jordan as if he was the sole reason the bulls started winning a lot of games in the late 80s and throughout the rest of his career when it was actually the efforts of the front office to surround him with reliable supporting casts that did it.

Other than 3ball, who said this?

[TheGoatest]

And yet career points is the ONLY thing you and your fellow Bronies are desperately clinging to. :roll:


Boom. Ethered again.

:lebronamazed:

Um, no. LeBron is better than jordon in all the ways Magic is better than Dantley, Aguirre and all those players AND on top of that he has thousands and thousands of more career points scored than jordon, both regular season and playoffs. :roll:

[jayfan]

And Alex English, George Gervin, Adrian Dantley, Bernard King, Dominique Wilkins, Mark Aguirre and Kiki Vandeweghe all "averaged more points" than Magic Johnson. No one cares. Magic was a way better player than any of them.


Cringy effort. Fell short.

[Bacchus]

All the players from the 90's hate Jordon because he kept them ring less.
Karl Malone who could not win a championship against Jordan doesn't even have Jordan in his top 5 but has Stockton in it

[Johnny32]

All the players from the 90's hate Jordon because he kept them ring less.
Karl Malone who could not win a championship against Jordan doesn't even have Jordan in his top 5 but has Stockton in it

malone picked by position. he has oscar at the 2 who can easily be argued was a better all-around player than mj.

[8Ball]

Looks like nobody can refute Gary Payton.


LeBron better all around than Jordan, BY FAR.


Better playmaker, more versatile, can do more things on the court, simply a better basketball player.

[8Ball]

Guys listen up. Full Court is more knowledgeable about basketball than Gary Payton

:roll:

[Lakers Legend#32]

Listen to The Glove.

[Full Court]

Guys listen up. Full Court is more knowledgeable about basketball than Gary Payton

This is a true statement.

Payton is obviously better at playing basketball, but I'm clearly a better analyst, as this thread demonstrates.

[TheGoatest]

All the players from the 90's hate Jordon because he kept them ring less.

Which players did he keep ringless in 1994 and 1995? :roll:

[8Ball]

Which players did he keep ringless in 1994 and 1995? :roll:

He forgot 1990 as well. That was the year Isiah Thomas beat Jordan for the 3rd year in a row.

[8Ball]

All the players from the 90's hate Jordon because he kept them ring less.
Karl Malone who could not win a championship against Jordan doesn't even have Jordan in his top 5 but has Stockton in it

Scottie Pippen won 6 championships and says LeBron is a better player.

[Full Court]

Scottie Pippen won 6 championships and says LeBron is a better player.

With Scottie being the best player on the Bulls for those 6 championships, did he win a bunch of FMVPs?

[Axe]

Scottie Pippen won 6 championships and says LeBron is a better player.
Lol pippen gets berated now by deluded jordan stans just because he lacks a finals mvp in his career, just like bill russell. :oldlol:

[Spurs m8]

With Scottie being the best player on the Bulls for those 6 championships, did he win a bunch of FMVPs?

Surely at least one?

Nope...didn't even pull an AD or Kyrie and actually put up fmvp numbers either...

[WhiteKyrie]

Zeke, and Oscar always were salty trying to throw shade at MJ … for obvious reasons but post 2020 doc I’ve noticed it a lot from Pippen, GP, and John Salley.

[SATAN]

John Salley has been shitting on MJ for years. Why the hell would GP be mad at MJ? He respects him. Let him have his opinion, coach.

[Full Court]

Lol pippen gets berated now by deluded jordan stans just because he lacks a finals mvp in his career, just like bill russell. :oldlol:

:roll:

This low-IQ dingus doesn't even know that the FMVP award only existed for the very last of Russell's 11 championships he won.

This low-IQ dingus also doesn't know that the FMVP award is named.....wait for it....the Bill Russell trophy.

:roll:

:biggums:

[Axe]

John Salley has been shitting on MJ for years. Why the hell would GP be mad at MJ? He respects him. Let him have his opinion, coach.
Lol just like how lebron's fans have been shitting on the redneck jizzrag poster directly below you for several months now. Stuck on a very unfortunate limbo ever since. :yaohappy:

[TheGoatest]

Why the hell would GP be mad at MJ?

Exactly.
It would be in Payton's interest to hype up jordon as much as possible, so that he could say: "Look how I held the greatest player ever to .415 shooting in the finals and 5-19 in the championship clinching game".
Instead, he's just being honest about his experience with jordon. Kind of how Isiah Thomas doesn't hype up jordon being the GOAT to make his 3 straight beatings of jordon look more impressive, and is instead just honest about how overrated jordon is compared to his on-court experience with him. Props to both Payton and Isiah for their honesty.

[Full Court]

I see the merman is still up to his dingus ways. :lol

[TheMan]

Exactly.
It would be in Payton's interest to hype up jordon as much as possible, so that he could say: "Look how I held the greatest player ever to .415 shooting in the finals and 5-19 in the championship clinching game".
Instead, he's just being honest about his experience with jordon. Kind of how Isiah Thomas doesn't hype up jordon being the GOAT to make his 3 straight beatings of jordon look more impressive, and is instead just honest about how overrated jordon is compared to his on-court experience with him. Props to both Payton and Isiah for their honesty.

Same could be said for Ray Allen. He beat LeBron's and also lost to him, he could prop up LeBron for the exact same self serving reasons you say GP and IT have but Allen says MJ is the GOAT :confusedshrug:

[Baller789]

I see the merman is still up to his dingus ways. :lol
:lebronamazed:

[TheGoatest]

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/cd/0c/8d/cd0c8d20a3afffb611bc69c54274f8d0.jpg

[8Ball]

Exactly.
It would be in Payton's interest to hype up jordon as much as possible, so that he could say: "Look how I held the greatest player ever to .415 shooting in the finals and 5-19 in the championship clinching game".
Instead, he's just being honest about his experience with jordon. Kind of how Isiah Thomas doesn't hype up jordon being the GOAT to make his 3 straight beatings of jordon look more impressive, and is instead just honest about how overrated jordon is compared to his on-court experience with him. Props to both Payton and Isiah for their honesty.

Exactly. It would be in Isiah, Pippen, and GP to hype Jordan as much as possible in order to inflate their own era. Like Barkley does.



But their eyes can't tell a lie. They saw a better basketball player in Bron.

[dankok8]

Big O is also much better all-around than Jordan... It doesn't mean GP thinks Lebron is actually better.

[Round Mound]

Michael is the greatest and i say this even despite the fact i hated his fans as a kid. I also don't say this to prop up my era. Jordan was the best he had no weakness in his game (don't say 3-point shooting because back then the game did not rely on them).

[bizil]

Sure Bron is the better all around player. Hell hes the best all around player of all time. BUT the thing is MJ was asCOMPLETE a player as ANYBODY EVER for players 6’6 and under! Legit could play and defend PG, SG, and SF at great levels. Was legit great at scoring, passing, defending, and rebounding his position. Plus had the crazy freak athletic ability on top of it!

Before Pip came of age, MJ was putting up 30-8-8 in 88-89. Thats where MJ was taking his game! If Pip didnt come of age, MJ would have had more7-8 dimes and 7-8 boards seasons. So the notion Bron is BY FAR a better all around player is BS. Better all around yes. But mainly due to more positional versatility.

Thats the biggest gap Bron has on MJ. Even more that the triple double ability aspect. Cause MJ PROVED he could average Bron-esque 30-8-8 in a season. ALONG with DPOY caliber defense. Bron is more of a floor general who can average 30. MJ is the ultimate assassin who is a great passer for a score first player. Two totally different players.

[Johnny32]

Sure Bron is the better all around player. Hell hes the best all around player of all time. BUT the thing is MJ was asCOMPLETE a player as ANYBODY EVER for players 6’6 and under! Legit could play and defend PG, SG, and SF at great levels. Was legit great at scoring, passing, defending, and rebounding his position. Plus had the crazy freak athletic ability on top of it!

Before Pip came of age, MJ was putting up 30-8-8 in 88-89. Thats where MJ was taking his game! If Pip didnt come of age, MJ would have had more7-8 dimes and 7-8 boards seasons. So the notion Bron is BY FAR a better all around player is BS. Better all around yes. But mainly due to more positional versatility.

Thats the biggest gap Bron has on MJ. Even more that the triple double ability aspect. Cause MJ PROVED he could average Bron-esque 30-8-8 in a season. ALONG with DPOY caliber defense. Bron is more of a floor general who can average 30. MJ is the ultimate assassin who is a great passer for a score first player. Two totally different players.

that's nice. problem is, lebron won championships in a role you claim mj could have continued to do if pip didn't come along. lebron did it. mj maybe, woulda, coulda, my childhood memories, blah, he didn't.

[bizil]

that's nice. problem is, lebron won championships in a role you claim mj could have continued to do if pip didn't come along. lebron did it. mj maybe, woulda, coulda, my childhood memories, blah, he didn't.

Bron won rings with Kyrie, AD, Wade, and Bosh. Wayyyy more scoring help than MJ ever played with. The best scorers MJ played with in his Bulls career are Pip and Orlando Woolridge

[TheMan]

Bron won rings with Kyrie, AD, Wade, and Bosh. Wayyyy more scoring help than MJ ever played with. The best scorers MJ played with in his Bulls career are Pip and Orlando Woolridge

This

[3ba11]

that's nice. problem is, lebron won championships in a role you claim mj could have continued to do if pip didn't come along. lebron did it. mj maybe, woulda, coulda, my childhood memories, blah, he didn't.


Jordan averaged 11 apg in the 1991 Finals and was a goat floor general for that title run

It's almost like you know nothing about Jordan's career.

So Jordan won as a passer, but when did Lebron win while defeating maximum defensive attention (carrying scoring load for playoffs and Finals of title run)?... He always needed equal-scoring partners to attract equal defensive attention, so he never defeated maximum defensive attention - Lebron fans like to say that scoring help isn't everything, but elite-scoring help is what everyone in history needed, except the GOAT

[Round Mound]

Sure Bron is the better all around player. Hell hes the best all around player of all time. BUT the thing is MJ was asCOMPLETE a player as ANYBODY EVER for players 6’6 and under! Legit could play and defend PG, SG, and SF at great levels. Was legit great at scoring, passing, defending, and rebounding his position. Plus had the crazy freak athletic ability on top of it!

Before Pip came of age, MJ was putting up 30-8-8 in 88-89. Thats where MJ was taking his game! If Pip didnt come of age, MJ would have had more7-8 dimes and 7-8 boards seasons. So the notion Bron is BY FAR a better all around player is BS. Better all around yes. But mainly due to more positional versatility.

Thats the biggest gap Bron has on MJ. Even more that the triple double ability aspect. Cause MJ PROVED he could average Bron-esque 30-8-8 in a season. ALONG with DPOY caliber defense. Bron is more of a floor general who can average 30. MJ is the ultimate assassin who is a great passer for a score first player. Two totally different players.

:applause:

[SATAN]

Sure Bron is the better all around player. Hell hes the best all around player of all time. BUT the thing is MJ was asCOMPLETE a player as ANYBODY EVER for players 6’6 and under!

That's pretty much how I feel about the "debate". All the rest is stupid. Different eras. Different competition. Some different rules and play styles. They would both dominate in any era. It's fine to have either ahead of each other. Who cares.

[Johnny32]

Bron won rings with Kyrie, AD, Wade, and Bosh. Wayyyy more scoring help than MJ ever played with. The best scorers MJ played with in his Bulls career are Pip and Orlando Woolridge

lebron's all-around role on his championship teams > jordone's one dimensional chucker role.

your pathetic, desperate, and embarrassing excuses don't matter. sry!

[Full Court]

lebron's all-around role on his championship teams > jordone's one dimensional chucker role.

your pathetic, desperate, and embarrassing excuses don't matter. sry!

6/6 >>>>>>>>>> 4/10

24/11 >>>>>>>>>>>>> 22/33

Truth hurts.

:lebroncry:

[TheGoatest]

lebron's all-around role on his championship teams > jordone's one dimensional chucker role.


Truer words have never been spoken!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ehcd46SWsAA0JHe.jpg

versus:

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/b3/75/c7/b375c7a409b2c1eaafcf56ef23a110b3--lebron-james-stats-nba-finals-.jpg

No contest.

[TheMan]

Truer words have never been spoken!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ehcd46SWsAA0JHe.jpg

versus:

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/b3/75/c7/b375c7a409b2c1eaafcf56ef23a110b3--lebron-james-stats-nba-finals-.jpg

No contest.

So then why is Bran's Finals record so abysmal? And spare me the excuses of Bran having to face GOAT teams, lol. He had superteams behind him as well and on top of that, supposedly was the best player in those Finals. You can't claim MJ had empty stats vs the 80s Bird Boston Celtics and Bad Boys Detroit Pistons and losing to those two historic championship teams and then turn around and exclaim LeBron's weren't empty stats when he lost all those Finals, you can't have it both ways, numbnuts. Either they were both beasting and just lost to the better TEAM or they both were empty stat padding. Make up your mind :confusedshrug:

[TheMan]

lebron's all-around role on his championship teams > jordone's one dimensional chucker role.

your pathetic, desperate, and embarrassing excuses don't matter. sry!

Seething

The GOAT has this dude on skates :oldlol:

[3ba11]

lebron's all-around role on his championship teams > jordone's one dimensional chucker role.






Playoffs

Jordan...... 33/6/6
Lebron...... 28/9/7


So Jordan was an all-round player with superior numbers - he also had to carry the scoring load, so he could win with less and didn't need star-filled, super-teams..

That's the difference - carrying the scoring load (defeating maximum defensive attention) requires less help, but lebron lacks the elite jumpshooting skill and brand of ball required to do so.

In addition to superior scoring, offensive rebounds and lower turnovers, Jordan also had superior clutch, defense, ball movement (assisted rate), teammate fits, leadership and brand of ball (high assist teams)

[SATAN]

:facepalm

[JBSptfn]

Jordan's championships were produced by a TV network. They weren't real. Enough said.

[Axe]

Jordan's championships were produced by a TV network. They weren't real. Enough said.
You mean it's a product of the flagrant foul implementation into the league starting in the early 90s.

[Pitbull]

Nothing wrong in what said. Jordan is much better scorer though.

[Axe]

Jordan wouldn't be the same decorated player without the implementation of the flagrant foul bt.

[Pitbull]

Jordan wouldn't be the same decorated player without the implementation of the flagrant foul bt.

:biggums: