If dennis rodman was drafted in 2018, does he make the hall of fame?

[TAZORAC]

Does a guy who did nothing but get rebounds, play defense, and get technical fouls get any playing time in today's NBA of high powered offense?

If he got drafted in 2018 and played until 2028, do you think he'd make the HOF?

[FultzNationRISE]

If he plays with LeStarMaker then yes, definitely, but otherwise I have no my doubts. Today youre barely allowed to even play defense. If youre not a rim protector I dont think you can really make a mark as a player without being able to shoot. I know Rodman was kind of a hybrid of an interior and perimeter defender, but I just dont think his style of defense would go as far under current rules. And assuming he still couldnt shoot well today… hard to imagine a HOF career.

[Full Court]

Yeah, he was a colorful enough personality that he drew a lot of attention. Seeing how it's the Hall of....FAME....being famous helps get in. Of course, being on championship teams helps too.

[FultzNationRISE]

Yeah, he was a colorful enough personality that he drew a lot of attention. Seeing how it's the Hall of....FAME....being famous helps get in. Of course, being on championship teams helps too.

Ive always thought this is how it SHOULD be. To me a guy like Robert Horry should be in the HOF simply for being iconically clutch on seven title teams. I also think Artest should be in just on the basis of his highly eventful career.

Like if you cant write up a description of an era without mentioning a guy’s name several times, to me thats what the hall of fame is. Players who define the story of an era.

But thats not how they do it in reality, obviously.

[Real Men Wear Green]

If he the same career with DPoY and championships then yes.Ben Wallace just made it and like ridden he we as he at st defense and rebounding and unable to create offense.

[TheMan]

Yes

[rawimpact]

I don't think so. The game has evolved. Every single player has to be able to shoot

[Real Men Wear Green]

I don't think so. The game has evolved. Every single player has to be able to shoot

Antetokuonmpo win MVPwhile Rondo and Ben Simmons made the allstar game as bad shooters. Ben Simmons would be on a hall of fame trajectory if he wasn't so soft.

[FultzNationRISE]

Antetokuonmpo win MVPwhile Rondo and Ben Simmons made the allstar game as bad shooters. Ben Simmons would be on a hall of fame trajectory if he wasn't so soft.


Shooting doesnt strictly mean three pointers. Giannis and Simmons can still score the basketball much better than Rodman, who is a significantly worse offensive player.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Shooting doesnt strictly mean three pointers. Giannis and Simmons can still score the basketball much better than Rodman, who is a significantly worse offensive player.

By what standard is Simmons not a bad shooter? Because that is what is actually being discussed.

[FultzNationRISE]

By what standard is Simmons not a bad shooter? Because that is what is actually being discussed.

By comparison to Dennis Rodman. Because that is what is actually being discussed.

Simmons career average: 16 pts on 56%
Rodman career average: 7 pts on 52%

If theres a way to score points without attempting shots in the form of field goals or free throws, please advise.

[Real Men Wear Green]

By comparison to Dennis Rodman. Because that is what is actually being discussed.

Simmons career average: 16 pts on 56%
Rodman career average: 7 pts on 52%

If theres a way to score points without attempting shots in the form of field goals or free throws, please advise.
Being a better scorer is not the same as being a better shooter. Most ball fans know that. Shaq is not a better shooter than Reggie Miller. Simmons is a nonshooter. In fact he's scared of shooting in the extreme. He only shots 1 percent better than Rodman from the free throw line and in spite of being a point guard took and made less threes than Rodman in an average year.

[3ba11]

:facepalm:

Who did Kukoc thank in his HOF speech for getting him into HOF??

JORDAN

Jordan got Kukoc, Rodman and Pippen into HOF, otherwise they were just ordinary players outside the dynasty system - look at Pippen's disaster in Houston, aka Jeff Green outside the triangle

Btw, the old Rodman that the Bulls received was like Andre Drummond but with zero offense.. he made the Bulls go 4-on-5 offensively and wasn't playable for most teams

[Lee]

Why not?He is better than Draymond Green

[iamgine]

He was drafted at 25 years old from a small school and only averaged 15 mpg in his first season. And he was sort of a mental midget. Without the right coaches and teammates, he wouldn't be who he turned out to be.

I think if he got drafted in 2018, he'd be drafted near the end of 2nd round and not get much opportunity to shine.

[Phoenix]

If he came into the league in 2018, he would likely have an entirely different skillset. And he wouldn't be able to play now like he did then, the NBA simply doesn't allow it and hasn't in nearly 20 years. It would be like asking 'what if Bill Russell was born in 2000'. He'd have 75 years of NBA history to pick from and would probably come in shooting 3's, because they've outlawed just about every big who can't.

[Xiao Yao You]

He was drafted at 25 years old from a small school and only averaged 15 mpg in his first season. And he was sort of a mental midget. Without the right coaches and teammates, he wouldn't be who he turned out to be.

I think if he got drafted in 2018, he'd be drafted near the end of 2nd round and not get much opportunity to shine.

they were 15 big minutes a game. Him and John Salley were huge additions

[Real Men Wear Green]

It's simpler to just evaluate him as if he was the same player. Best rebounder and defender in the league but almost completely unskilled offensively. Trying to guess what he would have developed like in the modern era is too much assumption. He finished high school at 5'11, this was not a guy that was training to be in the NBA. Which is also a big reason he had so little skill with the ball. After HS he had a major growth spurt and tried to see if he could get somewhere off of just being big and athletic. Most NBA players are training seriously from a young age there are even rankings for 12 year-olds (I think that's irresponsible but whatever).

[Phoenix]

It's simpler to just evaluate him as if he was the same player. Best rebounder and defender in the league but almost completely unskilled offensively. Trying to guess what he would have developed like in the modern era is too much assumption. He finished high school at 5'11, this was not a guy that was training to be in the NBA. Which is also a big reason he had so little skill with the ball. After HS he had a major growth spurt and tried to see if he could get somewhere off of just being big and athletic. Most NBA players are training seriously from a young age there are even rankings for 12 year-olds (I think that's irresponsible but whatever).

By that reckoning a better rebounding version of Draymond with similar defensive versatility( especially Pistons Rodman who would have the athleticism to switch morseo than Bulls Rodman) but completely void of Draymond's playmaking. Which, in today's league I think not having that playmaking aspect would make him a less valuable asset overall even if he's grabbing 18 boards a night.

[90sgoat]

He'd probably the biggest cultural icon in the world.

He was dying his hair and crossdressing before it was cool.

You really have to respect Rodman for how he carried himself, absolutely no ****s given, in a time and place, that was hyper-macho and homophobic as ****. It's quite sad how his career ended, because he today, he'd have had a much larger impact.

[FultzNationRISE]

Being a better scorer is not the same as being a better shooter. Most ball fans know that. Shaq is not a better shooter than Reggie Miller. Simmons is a nonshooter. In fact he's scared of shooting in the extreme. He only shots 1 percent better than Rodman from the free throw line and in spite of being a point guard took and made less threes than Rodman in an average year.


Point is if you wanna be pedantic about shooting vs scoring, one can be equally pedantic about what shooting actually is. Neither distinction changes Rodman's outlook as a player in today's game. A guy who provides nil offense is not likely to be a hall of famer.

[Real Men Wear Green]

By that reckoning a better rebounding version of Draymond with similar defensive versatility( especially Pistons Rodman who would have the athleticism to switch morseo than Bulls Rodman) but completely void of Draymond's playmaking. Which, in today's league I think not having that playmaking aspect would make him a less valuable asset overall even if he's grabbing 18 boards a night.
His teams scorers had to carry a little more of the load but the impact he had in other aspects was more than big enough to justify it. The Bulls left him as the primary defender on Shaq while the Pistons had him shut down young Scot Pippen. There is no other player in NBA history that could have guarded both of those players. Even his weakness, shooting, was made up for by what he did on the offensive boards. With the Bulls there were times that even though shots were missed because of Rodman they just didn't give the ball back until they had scored. Of course his man is going to help off of him but you can use him in the dunker spot and the stuff he did as a rebounder truly was a level above anyone else in the league, which is why he was on so many vhampionship teams even though he had that severe flaw as a shooter.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Point is if you wanna be pedantic about shooting vs scoring, one can be equally pedantic about what shooting actually is. Neither distinction changes Rodman's outlook as a player in today's game. A guy who provides nil offense is not likely to be a hall of famer.
We were talking about shooting. You wandered into the convo and talked about something else. Regardless your evaluation of his offensive impact is incorrect. He averaged almost 5 offensive rebounds per game. Seeing as his career scoring average was higher than Ben Wallace's the facts indicate he could still have been a Hall of Fame player in the modern day,

[FultzNationRISE]

We were talking about shooting. You wandered into the convo and talked about something else. Regardless your evaluation of his offensive impact is incorrect. He averaged almost 5 offensive rebounds per game. Seeing as his career scoring average was higher than Ben Wallace's the facts indicate he could still have been a Hall of Fame player in the modern day,

Bro Ben Wallace “retired” in 06 (aka took a big contract with chicago and was butt cheeks for the rest of his career). The game is already WAY different today. Hall of Famer Ben Wallace would be sitting on the bench behind Robert Williams today. Stationary fumble-fingers’ who menace the paint and do nothing else arent HoFers today. It’s pretty obvious. Furthermore, Wallace was at least a rim protector at 2 bpg. Rodman, at .6, was not.

The game is far more perimeter oriented on offense and less physical on defense. That has a huge impact on how Rodman and Wallace would translate.

If you think their impact is the same today without an adjustment in playstyle you are clearly not one for nuance.

[Phoenix]

His teams scorers had to carry a little more of the load but the impact he had in other aspects was more than big enough to justify it. The Bulls left him as the primary defender on Shaq while the Pistons had him shut down young Scot Pippen. There is no other player in NBA history that could have guarded both of those players. Even his weakness, shooting, was made up for by what he did on the offensive boards. With the Bulls there were times that even though shots were missed because of Rodman they just didn't give the ball back until they had scored. Of course his man is going to help off of him but you can use him in the dunker spot and the stuff he did as a rebounder truly was a level above anyone else in the league, which is why he was on so many vhampionship teams even though he had that severe flaw as a shooter.

THat's all true, I'm just wondering if him basically being an offensive non-factor cuts it in today's NBA. The league he came along in was more tolerant of specialists. As transcendent a rebounding/defensive talent as he was, he comes under the 'it depends who is coaching him and who his teammates are'. All his chips were won with coaches who were able to maximize him on-court while keeping him in check mentally, and tough leadership from the core players. Rodman on,say, the 95 Magic would have completely disrupted that team. Too young and Brian Hill wasn't the coach to check him. It's all hindsight now but the Dennis Rodman Chicago got in 1995 was an outright basket-case, it worked out for them but the other option was complete anarchy. There was no gray area there.

[90sgoat]

He could be a small ball center with huge impact on the right team, mostly with his ability to completely negate the opposition small ball center like Draymond.

[Real Men Wear Green]

THat's all true, I'm just wondering if him basically being an offensive non-factor cuts it in today's NBA. The league he came along in was more tolerant of specialists. As transcendent a rebounding/defensive talent as he was, he comes under the 'it depends who is coaching him and who his teammates are'. All his chips were won with coaches who were able to maximize him on-court while keeping him in check mentally, and tough leadership from the core players. Rodman on,say, the 95 Magic would have completely disrupted that team. Too young and Brian Hill wasn't the coach to check him. It's all hindsight now but the Dennis Rodman Chicago got in 1995 was an outright basket-case, it worked out for them but the other option was complete anarchy. There was no gray area there.The team he plays on was the x-factor for Rodman in his day as well. He was never any kind of typical player, the only guy we think of as being similar is Ben Wallace and that's just because of impact there are important differences (Wallace is a shotblocker, Rodman far superior in man defense and also more dominant as a rebounder). But there are teams today he would be a good fit for. To start I know the Celtics would love to have him. Like mRobert Williams he would be a dominant defensive force and him not being a floor spacer or scorer would be fine because Tatum and Brown both want to take 20 shots per game anyway. The Celtics are defense-first and love versatile defensive players that don't mind not being featured offensively. The second team that comes to mind is Dallas. Luka Doncic is already doing everything offensively anyway so Rodman out there making them a much better defensive unit and taking over the boards would be big. Tom Thibodeau of the Knicks would love to have him, he would be a good fit on paper with the Clippers, and I could go on...basically any team that wants to play strong defense and has their best scorer(s) on the perimeter could use him if their coach has any level of creativity. He may not work well in Philly or in general on a team where the offense is best when the center is posting up because that could lead to too much instant obvious double-teams with bad spacing. But for another example, Phoenix whose offense is all about the guards, teams with high-scoring sgd or pgs love a teammate that doesn't complain about shots and goes to grab all of his misses and then gives him the ball back without complaining.

[dankok8]

I wouldn't say Rodman provides nil offense. His offensive rebounds alone are worth a significant amount.

[FultzNationRISE]

I wouldn't say Rodman provides nil offense. His offensive rebounds alone are worth a significant amount.

Thats fine but remember he’s gonna be pulled out to the perimeter a lot more often than in his era, and it likely impacts his offensive rebound rate. You also cannot be as cheeky and physical which negates some of his strengths as a rebounder. Hed still be good, but as good? It’s doubtful.

The modern game is basically four scoring wings and a tall rim runner. And youre not allowed to be physical on defense. It’s going to be very difficult to find a role wherein Rodman has a Hall of Fame career in today’s game.

It can never be proven one way or another but let’s be real, it’s not happenin.

[FultzNationRISE]

And btw Im someone who has always rated The Menace’s impact very highly relative to his own era. But the game is called and played a different way now and his style is likely too specialist to translate, it’s just that simple.

[TAZORAC]

Why not?He is better than Draymond Green

If Draymond Green didn't play in the Warriors, he'd be a free agent right now and probably had played on about 7 teams already.

Green isn't HOF worthy either.

[Real Men Wear Green]

If Draymond Green didn't play in the Warriors, he'd be a free agent right now and probably had played on about 7 teams already.

Green isn't HOF worthy either.
Green and Rodman are a bad comparison but Green is going to the Hall. Every player's resume is effected by what teams they played with. I'll concede that Green's effect is more static than most as to me he's the second coming of Anthony Mason but it's not like he would not be a good player.

[Smook A.]

If Draymond Green didn't play in the Warriors, he'd be a free agent right now and probably had played on about 7 teams already.

Green isn't HOF worthy either.

Draymond was literally drafted into the best situation possible. If he was drafted to some mediocre team with an average market, he'd just be known as a role player. Highly doubt he'd even make a single all-star game if he didn't play with 3 of the best shooters ever, let alone a DPOY.

[John8204]

Nah...that Piston's team was special and Dennis fit in really well. Dennis was groomed into becoming a HOFer and if Jordan wasn't so toxic and desperate for another player Dennis likely misses the HOF like Aguirre and Laimbeer.

[KNOW1EDGE]

Yes.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Nah...that Piston's team was special and Dennis fit in really well. Dennis was groomed into becoming a HOFer and if Jordan wasn't so toxic and desperate for another player Dennis likely misses the HOF like Aguirre and Laimbeer.

I've never seen a player criticized for wanting to win before. Congratulations, you're a dumbass.

[Carbine]

I'd argue what he brought to a team is more valuable today than it was back in his era.

He would be a phenomenal five in today's league.

[John8204]

I've never seen a player criticized for wanting to win before. Congratulations, you're a dumbass.

Jordan's ego was a huge issue, top guys didn't want to play with him. Gervin retired after a season, Grant left him, Parish only tolerated him for a season.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Jordan's ego was a huge issue, top guys didn't want to play with him. Gervin retired after a season, Grant left him, Parish only tolerated him for a season.

Your ability to invent bullshit doesn't qualify as a talent.

[Red Pill Sports]

If he plays with LeStarMaker then yes, definitely, but otherwise I have no my doubts. Today youre barely allowed to even play defense. If youre not a rim protector I dont think you can really make a mark as a player without being able to shoot. I know Rodman was kind of a hybrid of an interior and perimeter defender, but I just dont think his style of defense would go as far under current rules. And assuming he still couldnt shoot well today… hard to imagine a HOF career.

LeBron would have had Rodman traded away because he can't shoot threes, after which you would eventually start moaning that LeBron "needs more help" on defense.

[Red Pill Sports]

Jordan's ego was a huge issue, top guys didn't want to play with him. Gervin retired after a season, Grant left him, Parish only tolerated him for a season.

Gervin and Parish were dinosaurs. Grant left when Jordan was playing baseball. Nice try.

[ShawkFactory]

Probably yea. I'd be willing to bet he'd score more now with the paint being less packed. If he played with someone like Trae Young I could see him scoring 15 a game almost purely off of lobs and put backs.

And his defensive versatility would be even more important now.

[Red Pill Sports]

:facepalm:

Who did Kukoc thank in his HOF speech for getting him into HOF??

JORDAN

Jordan got Kukoc, Rodman and Pippen into HOF, otherwise they were just ordinary players outside the dynasty system - look at Pippen's disaster in Houston, aka Jeff Green outside the triangle

Btw, the old Rodman that the Bulls received was like Andre Drummond but with zero offense.. he made the Bulls go 4-on-5 offensively and wasn't playable for most teams

Which is why I scoff at Bron Stans when they complain that LeBron "never had a teammate like Pippen!"

Yeah, he wouldn't have wanted a teammate like Pippen. Because Pippen's outside shooting was always suspect as hell and Bron needs floor spacers. Pippen needed to be the primary ball handler in order to develop, but that ain't happening with LeBron.

Pippen with Bron=Derrick McKey

[Hey Yo]

Rodman could never put up 32-15-9 like Green did in game 7 of the 2016 Finals

[3ba11]

If Draymond Green didn't play in the Warriors, he'd be a free agent right now and probably had played on about 7 teams already.

Green isn't HOF worthy either.


Boom

Rodman, Draymond and Pippen are system players.. No one would've ever heard of Draymond if he was winning 25 games a year for the Wizards.. These guys only look viable on winning teams and alongside goat scorers that can carry the scoring load to offset their own ineptness offensively

Rodman actually averaged 3/8 on 35% for the entire 97' Playoffs yet Jordan gets no credit for carrying this bum to titles... Rodman wasn't even the starter in the 98' Playoffs (3/8 in Finals).. This kind of offensive ineptness wouldn't be playable in Lebron lineups because Lebron needs shooters - his inferior brand can't handle going 4 on 5 offensively.. Heck, if Draymond averaged 3 ppg on 35%, then Curry wouldn't win either... only MJ can win with that crap

[Hey Yo]

Did Green ever get multiple FMVP votes while avg. 7ppg?

[RogueBorg]

Does a guy who did nothing but get rebounds, play defense, and get technical fouls get any playing time in today's NBA of high powered offense?

If he got drafted in 2018 and played until 2028, do you think he'd make the HOF?

Depends, if he played with Lebron he gets blamed for everything and is out of the league by 2021 never to be heard from again.

[Hey Yo]

Rent free ^^^^^

[Druckenmiller]

Shooting doesnt strictly mean three pointers. Giannis and Simmons can still score the basketball much better than Rodman, who is a significantly worse offensive player.

Ben Simmons is averaging 5.2 points per game right now and he’s a pv$$y who literally does absolutely nothing when he checks in a game.

Doesn’t hustle, doesn’t play hard, plays the game with zero passion or energy. He looks scared and like he would do anything to get out of a game.

If a clown like that can play in the league Dennis Rodman could play.

[Round Mound]

Rebounds are different today. Almost none of the plays come from shorter range shots. The are rarely contested. He had no offensive game. He needed contact to be effective. Different game.