If Jokic wins 3 Consecutive MVPs his career will NEVER recover narratively speaking

[BigShotBob]

Right now he seems to be running away with the ballots (which I disagree with) and if he does win 3 in a row but fails to deliver then the narrative around him will never recover.

I love his game and the advanced stats love him too. He's also on a team that's fully healthy and has good to great players to fill their roles.

He has one player averaging barely less points than him (Jamal Murray at 20 ppg vs Jokic's 24 ppg) and two other players who average over 15 points (Aaron Gordon at 17 and MPJ at 16)

To put this in perspective...'

The Celtic's 3rd highest scorer outside of Tatum and Brown is 14ppg (Brogdon)

The Bucks does not have a player that averages over 20 points outside of Giannis (who averages 31) though Jrue is close at 19. Third highest scorer is Brook Lopez at 14.5 (Bobby Portis is at 14.4 but he's injured right now and they're still on an 11 game winning streak without him

The West has been absolutely decimated with injuries. Warriors (Steph in and out), Clippers (Kawhi and PG), Lakers (Lebron and AD), Mavs (Luka in and out twice), Pelicans (Zion and Ingram), Suns (Devin Booker) so it was honestly a cake walk for the Nuggets to make it to the top seed.

But all this will do is set him up for an even bigger fall.

The Nuggets may very well lose to a fully healthy and focused/retooled Suns team, a healthy Warriors squad (I'm 50/50 on this though), a fully healthy Clippers squad (also 50/50), or even a fully healthy Grizzlies squad (Jokic is not stopping Ja in the paint).

If he fails with a fully loaded and healthy team it'll be all over for him....

Discuss

[AlternativeAcc.]

He'll still have 3 MVPs in a row

Warriors are more stacked, so he doesn't need to win

Has to wait out the Durant dynasty, then we can judge on winning.

[Wardell Curry]

It's a regular season award. He's the best regular season player. Teams win championships, not players.

Discuss.

[ArbitraryWater]

If he doesnt win chips, yeah. But he wi. If he wont do it with these Nuggets, sooner or ater he wi team up with Luka and they wi rue.

[SATAN]

If he fails with a fully loaded and healthy team it'll be all over for him....

Discuss

This is quite the hot take. It'll be all over? What are you even saying? He'll be seen as a lesser player all of a sudden?

He's a very likable guy. I don't see him just being written off by media and fans all of a sudden.

[Axe]

11 game winning streak? It's aready at 12 now after winning against the bus, ya dummy.

[FKAri]

If he doesnt win chips, yeah. But he wi. If he wont do it with these Nuggets, sooner or ater he wi team up with Luka and they wi rue.

Why won't you just buy a new keyboard?

[RRR3]

Nuggets being loaded is hilarious. His second best player is Jamal Murray, hardly all time great help

[SouBeachTalents]

He has a good enough team to win it all, but would anyone really predict the Nuggets to beat the Suns if both teams are healthy? I wouldn't. I also don't think they're better than Milwaukee, Boston, or a healthy Clippers team.

Obviously if he literally never wins a title he'll take a lot of heat, but never winning with this Nuggets team shouldn't be seen as some kind of big underachievement or an indictment on him, this would be one of the lesser supporting casts to win a title imo.

[tontoz]

Nuggets being loaded is hilarious. His second best player is Jamal Murray, hardly all time great help


Not to mention that Murray is coming off a major injury. MPJ has also been struggling with injuries.

Last time Murray was healthy in the playoffs they made the WCF.

[Axe]

Not to mention that Murray is coming off a major injury. MPJ has also been struggling with injuries.

Last time Murray was healthy in the playoffs they made the WCF.
And the warriors also beat them to a pulp in the playoffs last year, while the nuggets themselves were hampered.

[kawhileonard2]

Only guys who won a title had won 3 mvp's in a row. Not guys who who never made the finals.

[L.Kizzle]

Only 3 players have won 3 straight MVP Awards. Russell, Wilt and Bird. Will the powers that be give it to Joker for a 3rd time? 15 times, it's been won 2 in a row.

[kawhileonard2]

Only 3 players have won 3 straight MVP Awards. Russell, Wilt and Bird. Will the powers that be give ot to Joker for a 3rd time? 15 times, it's been won 2 in a row.

Those guys had won titles at least. If you give a 3rd to a guy who never won then why not MJ or Magic as well or Duncan?

[post]

imagine the fear of him winning a 4th in a row if he wins 3 in a row

will be good for some laughs if nothing else

[ArbitraryWater]

Why won't you just buy a new keyboard?

its a aptop. coudnt be bothered yet.

[SouBeachTalents]

Only 3 players have won 3 straight MVP Awards. Russell, Wilt and Bird. Will the powers that be give it to Joker for a 3rd time? 15 times, it's been won 2 in a row.
He's the pretty heavy favorite to win, even with voter fatigue in play. Something catastrophic would have to occur for him not to win at this point.

[L.Kizzle]

He's the pretty heavy favorite to win, even with voter fatigue in play. Something catastrophic would have to occur for him not to win at this point.
It's happened to the likes of Jordan and LeBron, I don't see Joker winning 3 times in a row unless they go the rest of the season losing about only 5 games or so.

[AlternativeAcc.]

It's happened to the likes of Jordan and LeBron, I don't see Joker winning 3 times in a row unless they go the rest of the season losing about only 5 games or so.

He's a prohibitive favorite and most of the media members who vote have him number 1 as it stands, despite Giannis' and the Bucks crazy run.

[BigShotBob]

It's a regular season award. He's the best regular season player. Teams win championships, not players.

Discuss.

Yet Giannis was punished for winning two while getting bounced in the 2nd round

[BigShotBob]

This is quite the hot take. It'll be all over? What are you even saying? He'll be seen as a lesser player all of a sudden?

He's a very likable guy. I don't see him just being written off by media and fans all of a sudden.

That he'll be remembered like Steve Nash's MVPs are remembered

[Real Men Wear Green]

He's a second round pick and is spending his career so far with the Denver Nuggets. If he gets 3 straight mvp he will be celebrated no matter what happens. Real life and internet trolls will talk trash but that was always going to happen no matter what he did. MJ had 6 rings and there are still Idiots talking shit why would 1 ring keep that from happening to Jokic?

[hold this L]

He's 27 years old, how can it be 'over' for him? KD won his first ring at 29, Steph I think 27, Lebron 27. He has plenty of time to win championships.

People need to accept the reality that for this regular season, he's the clear cut MVP of the season. 3x in a row, accept it and move on.

[hold this L]

That he'll be remembered like Steve Nash's MVPs are remembered
Dumb. If he continues the form from this season, it will be one of the best MVPs in the last 15 years.

[RRR3]

He's 27 years old, how can it be 'over' for him? KD won his first ring at 29, Steph I think 27, Lebron 27. He has plenty of time to win championships.

People need to accept the reality that for this regular season, he's the clear cut MVP of the season. 3x in a row, accept it and move on.
You'll never convince the RRRANNNNNGZZZZZ crowd of anything, even if it's basic logic. Jokic has no rings so he sucks, even though few players would ever would win a ring with his supporting cast :lol

[Axe]

He's 27 years old, how can it be 'over' for him? KD won his first ring at 29, Steph I think 27, Lebron 27. He has plenty of time to win championships.

People need to accept the reality that for this regular season, he's the clear cut MVP of the season. 3x in a row, accept it and move on.
Those ignorant fools who keep on giving mvp chants for morant are gonna be on suicide watch soon. :lebronamazed:

[iamgine]

Right now he seems to be running away with the ballots (which I disagree with) and if he does win 3 in a row but fails to deliver then the narrative around him will never recover.

I love his game and the advanced stats love him too. He's also on a team that's fully healthy and has good to great players to fill their roles.

He has one player averaging barely less points than him (Jamal Murray at 20 ppg vs Jokic's 24 ppg) and two other players who average over 15 points (Aaron Gordon at 17 and MPJ at 16)

To put this in perspective...'

The Celtic's 3rd highest scorer outside of Tatum and Brown is 14ppg (Brogdon)

The Bucks does not have a player that averages over 20 points outside of Giannis (who averages 31) though Jrue is close at 19. Third highest scorer is Brook Lopez at 14.5 (Bobby Portis is at 14.4 but he's injured right now and they're still on an 11 game winning streak without him

The West has been absolutely decimated with injuries. Warriors (Steph in and out), Clippers (Kawhi and PG), Lakers (Lebron and AD), Mavs (Luka in and out twice), Pelicans (Zion and Ingram), Suns (Devin Booker) so it was honestly a cake walk for the Nuggets to make it to the top seed.

But all this will do is set him up for an even bigger fall.

The Nuggets may very well lose to a fully healthy and focused/retooled Suns team, a healthy Warriors squad (I'm 50/50 on this though), a fully healthy Clippers squad (also 50/50), or even a fully healthy Grizzlies squad (Jokic is not stopping Ja in the paint).

If he fails with a fully loaded and healthy team it'll be all over for him....

Discuss

Pretty sure the only one making that narrative is OP. :lol

[NBAGOAT]

[
We really using ppg to rate supporting casts in 2023…. Doesn’t matter if jrue scores 19ppg, he’s easily better than Murray and Giannis’ cast likely better then jokics. Boston has one of the better rosters depth wise we’ve seen in awhile. Other teams suns clippers Sixers have 2 all nba caliber players, denver didn’t even have 2 all stars technically though Gordon should’ve been one. It’s a good cast but not that special.

[ShawkFactory]

Yet Giannis was punished for winning two while getting bounced in the 2nd round

No he wasn’t. He was punished because his on-court play suffered mightily in those series.

[bison]

Only on ISH is winning 3 straight MVPs a potential black mark on a players career.

[BigShotBob]

He's a second round pick and is spending his career so far with the Denver Nuggets. If he gets 3 straight mvp he will be celebrated no matter what happens. Real life and internet trolls will talk trash but that was always going to happen no matter what he did. MJ had 6 rings and there are still Idiots talking shit why would 1 ring keep that from happening to Jokic?

No one can take away Nash's MVPs either but they aren't looked back as fondly as Shaq's MVP either.


He's 27 years old, how can it be 'over' for him? KD won his first ring at 29, Steph I think 27, Lebron 27. He has plenty of time to win championships.

People need to accept the reality that for this regular season, he's the clear cut MVP of the season. 3x in a row, accept it and move on.

This is the way the cookie crumbles. A 3 time back-to-back-to-back MVP not winning anything will not be remembered fondly.


We really using ppg to rate supporting casts in 2023…. Doesn’t matter if jrue scores 19ppg, he’s easily better than Murray and Giannis’ cast likely better then jokics. Boston has one of the better rosters depth wise we’ve seen in awhile. Other teams suns clippers Sixers have 2 all nba caliber players, denver didn’t even have 2 all stars technically though Gordon should’ve been one. It’s a good cast but not that special.

Giannis's second and third options have been out for most of the year and he's been on a win streak with Brook Lopez Jrue Holiday and Grayson Allen. If Jokic had that supporting cast I don't think you'd overrate them.


No he wasn’t. He was punished because his on-court play suffered mightily in those series.

More like his supporting cast didn't do much to take defensive pressure off of him. Still post-season shouldn't have affected Giannis winning in the regular season but it's funny how that doesn't apply to Jokic.

[1987_Lakers]

Right now he seems to be running away with the ballots (which I disagree with) and if he does win 3 in a row but fails to deliver then the narrative around him will never recover.

This is just a very lazy way of thinking. Nobody had the Nuggets winning anything in 2021 and 2022 despite Jokic winning MVP, his team wasn't good enough. Say Jokic wins MVP again this year and loses to the Suns with a healthy Durant, Booker, Ayton, & CP3, are you really gonna hold that against him?

[RRR3]

This is just a very lazy way of thinking. Nobody had the Nuggets winning anything in 2021 and 2022 despite Jokic winning MVP, his team wasn't good enough. Say Jokic wins MVP again this year and loses to the Suns with a healthy Durant, Booker, Ayton, & CP3, are you really gonna hold that against him?
OP constantly makes these type of arguments. He doesn’t realize his opinions were fed to him by ESPN

[Norcaliblunt]

I think he needs to at least lead his team to the best record in the regular season once. 3 MVPs when his team has never even had the best record in the regular season is odd.

[Real Men Wear Green]

No one can take away Nash's MVPs either but they aren't looked back as fondly as Shaq's MVP either. .Shaq's MVP is more marveled at for being the only one he had than celebrated for being some kind of historic season. Shaq is still regarded as being one of the greatest players of all time because he was a dominant force for a solid decade. Steve Nash career wasn't like that. He didn't even average double figures in his first 4 seasons. Even when Nash won mvp there were many fans that didn't think he was the best player in the world. Nash led a great offense for a few years in Phoenix. No one thinks he was anywhere near Shaq level dominance. To return the subject to Jokic he has been a statistical monster for the last 5 seasons and if this continues into his 30s he will be recognized as one of the greatest centers of all time. In fact he starting to get that praise already. Will he have a legacy equal to Shaq? I don't know we have to actually see how he performs. But he is a lock as an all time great if he has 3 mvp awards with 20+ 10+ 5+ toe numbers for over 10 years while using all NBA trophies as paper weights

[Norcaliblunt]

Once he leads his team to 60 wins I’ll give him his credit.

[tontoz]

Once he leads his team to 60 wins I’ll give him his credit.


How many stars have led their team to a winning record, and won in the first round, with the 2nd and 3rd options out hurt all season?

[NugzFan]

If he doesnt win chips, yeah. But he wi. If he wont do it with these Nuggets, sooner or ater he wi team up with Luka and they wi rue.



I’ve thought about that too. I wonder what denver would have to give up for Luka but that duo in denver could be amazing in a couple seasons.

[NugzFan]

Nuggets being loaded is hilarious. His second best player is Jamal Murray, hardly all time great help

It’s always whatever matches their narrative.

[AlternativeAcc.]

I’ve thought about that too. I wonder what denver would have to give up for Luka but that duo in denver could be amazing in a couple seasons.

A lot of 1st round picks AND murray/MPJ.

Luka is the face of their franchise, beyond just a winning perspective he draws a lot of money to the team. There's no realistic way Denver would ever be able to trade for him.

[ShawkFactory]

No one can take away Nash's MVPs either but they aren't looked back as fondly as Shaq's MVP either.



This is the way the cookie crumbles. A 3 time back-to-back-to-back MVP not winning anything will not be remembered fondly.



Giannis's second and third options have been out for most of the year and he's been on a win streak with Brook Lopez Jrue Holiday and Grayson Allen. If Jokic had that supporting cast I don't think you'd overrate them.



More like his supporting cast didn't do much to take defensive pressure off of him. Still post-season shouldn't have affected Giannis winning in the regular season but it's funny how that doesn't apply to Jokic.

Again, people don’t get on Jokic as much because he has either played to his standard or upped his game in the playoffs. Regardless of the series outcome.

Before 2021 Giannis dropped off.

There’s a massive difference here and you’re ignoring it

[NugzFan]

A lot of 1st round picks AND murray/MPJ.

Luka is the face of their franchise, beyond just a winning perspective he draws a lot of money to the team. There's no realistic way Denver would ever be able to trade for him.


I was just referring to arbitrary waters post about Luka teaming up with jokic

It would be tough to get Luka to denver but if they want to team up, nuggets will find a way to make it happen

[Norcaliblunt]

How many stars have led their team to a winning record, and won in the first round, with the 2nd and 3rd options out hurt all season?

Steve Nash in 2005-06 lead the Suns to the conference finals while Amare missed the whole season from micro fracture surgery. Kurt Thomas Phoenix’s starting center went down halfway through that year, so the Suns were forced to put third year Boris Diaw at center in a league that was still playing big.

Anyway I don’t care about the playoffs when it comes to regular season MVP. I just think if you win 3 straight “regular season” mvps then at some point your teams should have dominated the regular season. Or at least win 60 games. Lol.

[tontoz]

Steve Nash in 2005-06 lead the Suns to the conference finals while Amare missed the whole season from micro fracture surgery. Kurt Thomas Phoenix’s starting center went down halfway through that year, so the Suns were forced to put third year Boris Diaw at center in a league that was still playing big.

Anyway I don’t care about the playoffs when it comes to regular season MVP. I just think if you win 3 straight “regular season” mvps then at some point your teams should have dominated the regular season. Or at least win 60 games. Lol.


It is hard to win 60 when your team is getting crushed with injuries. Last season MPJ and Murray missed the entire season but they still won 48 games in the West with Will Barton as his second option.

Barton was traded to the wizards, didn't play much and just got bought out. Jokics second option last year is just garbage without him.

[NBAGOAT]

No one can take away Nash's MVPs either but they aren't looked back as fondly as Shaq's MVP either.



This is the way the cookie crumbles. A 3 time back-to-back-to-back MVP not winning anything will not be remembered fondly.



Giannis's second and third options have been out for most of the year and he's been on a win streak with Brook Lopez Jrue Holiday and Grayson Allen. If Jokic had that supporting cast I don't think you'd overrate them.



More like his supporting cast didn't do much to take defensive pressure off of him. Still post-season shouldn't have affected Giannis winning in the regular season but it's funny how that doesn't apply to Jokic.

Khris Middleton has played for most of the winning streak. Only been missing portis. Middleton jrue lopez are the bucks 2nd-4th options. Only Middletons missed most of the year. That cast isn’t overrated, it’s a proven championship cast with 2 all star lvl guys. Brook is a great 2 way guy and having an even better year than the year bucks won a title

[StrongLurk]

Lebron technically had three MVPs before he ever won a chip. Not three in a row, but three out of four years.

[John8204]

Lebron technically had three MVPs before he ever won a chip. Not three in a row, but three out of four years.

That's one way of putting it...another is he didn't get an MVP until after he took his team to the finals...and in his third year when he got the MVP he also won a chip after two trips to the finals.

[kawhileonard2]

Lebron technically had three MVPs before he ever won a chip. Not three in a row, but three out of four years.

Jokic hasn't got to the finals though.

[Jasper]

Jokic owns the team ... 3,4,5 mvp's in a roll .. actually diminishes the award.

He needs a ring for actual super stardom.

We will see this year , but in the past the best record , and MVP stats used to be the MVP

[j3lademaster]

Jokic owns the team ... 3,4,5 mvp's in a roll .. actually diminishes the award.

He needs a ring for actual super stardom.

We will see this year , but in the past the best record , and MVP stats used to be the MVPYou don't consider him a superstar? Wild.

[StrongLurk]

That's one way of putting it...another is he didn't get an MVP until after he took his team to the finals...and in his third year when he got the MVP he also won a chip after two trips to the finals.

Lebron had one lucky run in an insane weak eastern conference that year and then proceed to plat horribly and get swept in the finals.

Jokic has deserved his MVPs regardless of not making a finals yet.

[WhiteKyrie]

I think it’s crazy this dude will have 3x MVPs

[Mask the Embiid]

3 time mvp and has to pretty much beg to not be picked last during the all star…. Goes to show just how much them all star voters votes matter:oldlol:…. Damn, ya hate to see that :oldlol:



And don’t bother to quote me…..I’m not coming back to this thread

[tontoz]

3 time mvp and has to pretty much beg to not be picked last during the all star…. Goes to show just how much them all star voters votes matter:oldlol:…. Damn, ya hate to see that :oldlol:



And don’t bother to quote me…..I’m not coming back to this thread


Picked last? He was a starter. :facepalm

[Im Still Ballin]

Lebron had one lucky run in an insane weak eastern conference that year and then proceed to plat horribly and get swept in the finals.

Jokic has deserved his MVPs regardless of not making a finals yet.

That Detroit team was solid.

04: Champs
05: Game 7 NBA Finals loss
06: 64-18 W/L; Game 6 ECF loss
07: 53-29 W/L; Game 6 ECF loss
08: 59-23 W/L; Game 6 ECF loss

They missed Ben but C-Webb and the emergence of Maxiell softened the blow. McDyess replaced Webber the next season. You have to give LeBJ props for beating them. He almost did it a year earlier when they won 64-18 and still had Big Ben.

[John8204]

Lebron had one lucky run in an insane weak eastern conference that year and then proceed to plat horribly and get swept in the finals.

Jokic has deserved his MVPs regardless of not making a finals yet.

I don't know if Jokic even deserved a single MVP. Look at CPIII who elevated the Suns into a contender-ship, Lebron won with his third team and Jimmy Butler took what was believed to be a tanking team into contender-ship.

And while I'll normally speak up for white players in league history it will be a little gross that five MVP's go to five white guys that never made the finals (Nash and Jokic)

[NugzFan]

It is hard to win 60 when your team is getting crushed with injuries. Last season MPJ and Murray missed the entire season but they still won 48 games in the West with Will Barton as his second option.

Barton was traded to the wizards, didn't play much and just got bought out. Jokics second option last year is just garbage without him.

Look at our top mpg players from last season (not counting jokic and mpj who played 9 games):

Barton
Gordon
Monte Morris
Jeff green
Austin rivers
Bones
Pj dozier
Facu
Bryn Forbes
Zeke nnaji
Jamychal green
Cousins
Reed

How many of these guys are out of the league or barely play?

It’s incredible he got these guys to 48 wins and 6th seee

[NugzFan]

3 time mvp and has to pretty much beg to not be picked last during the all star…. Goes to show just how much them all star voters votes matter:oldlol:…. Damn, ya hate to see that :oldlol:



And don’t bother to quote me…..I’m not coming back to this thread

Check the player votes.

It’s funny how you are supposedly a real nba fan and still think this all matters

[999Guy]

Well it’s his destiny. He is outrageously good at the game and deserves each one. The first one was debateble for a bit there but these last two seasons have been possibly the greatest regular seasons ever or close.

RS Jokic gives you as good of a chance to win a random game as anybody ever.

[AlternativeAcc.]

What OP doesn't seem to understand is that Jokic winning 3 straight MVPs is CREATING his legacy. Without MVPs he doesn't even really have one. You don't think if Karl Malone or Barkley won 3 straight MVPs it would help their case all-time?

With or without rings, MVPs help your legacy and differentiate yourself from your peers. Especially 3 in a row - only Russell, wilt, and Bird have done it. Especially ones that aren't really controversial, ie Nash.

In summary, guys like Embiid don't even have a legacy or get talked about like this, but Jokic does BECAUSE of the MVPs. op is painting mvps as a vice instead of the primers that they are

[Axe]

What OP doesn't seem to understand is that Jokic winning 3 straight MVPs is CREATING his legacy. Without MVPs he doesn't even really have one. You don't think if Karl Malone or Barkley won 3 straight MVPs it would help their case all-time?

With or without rings, MVPs help your legacy and differentiate yourself from your peers. Especially 3 in a row - only Russell, wilt, and Bird have done it. Especially ones that aren't really controversial, ie Nash.

In summary, guys like Embiid don't even have a legacy or get talked about like this, but Jokic does BECAUSE of the MVPs. op is painting mvps as a vice instead of the primers that they are
Op is a casual. It's not surprising that takes from a kind of people like him are funny.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Op is a casual. It's not surprising that takes from a kind of people like him are funny.

:lol


Love you Axe.

:cheers:

[Axe]

:lol


Love you Axe.

:cheers:
:cheers:

[kawhileonard2]

Should have never won back to back. I mean won 2nd MVP as a 6th seed.

[dankok8]

Unfortunately yes but Denver isn't a championship caliber team IMO. Jokic is amazing but the talent around him is unreliable in terms of both performance and health.

[StrongLurk]

What we can't say is Jokic isn't a top 3 player in the league these last three years.

Here is what he has done over his last three regular seasons.

197 games (very healthy), 32 PER (MJ/LeBron level of PER), 66.5 TS% (Curry level efficiency), WS/48 .303 (MJ/Lebron level), 130 offensive rating (GOAT-level), 13 BPM (again MJ/Lebron level stuff).

The dude is LEGENDARY on the offensive side of the ball. Curry-like scoring with best all time passing ability for a center, plus elite rebounder. All his basic stats and regular "advanced" numbers show this guy is GOAT-level on offense right now..and his team's records show it. Jokic also shows up in the playoffs every year so far.

Honestly he has a lot of haters because he is not a black american and he is unathletic. Wasn't he not even top 15 in jersey sales? Jokic is basically the opposite of the current NBA player and fandom "culture".

[StrongLurk]

Right now he seems to be running away with the ballots (which I disagree with) and if he does win 3 in a row but fails to deliver then the narrative around him will never recover.

I love his game and the advanced stats love him too. He's also on a team that's fully healthy and has good to great players to fill their roles.

He has one player averaging barely less points than him (Jamal Murray at 20 ppg vs Jokic's 24 ppg) and two other players who average over 15 points (Aaron Gordon at 17 and MPJ at 16)

To put this in perspective...'

The Celtic's 3rd highest scorer outside of Tatum and Brown is 14ppg (Brogdon)

The Bucks does not have a player that averages over 20 points outside of Giannis (who averages 31) though Jrue is close at 19. Third highest scorer is Brook Lopez at 14.5 (Bobby Portis is at 14.4 but he's injured right now and they're still on an 11 game winning streak without him

The West has been absolutely decimated with injuries. Warriors (Steph in and out), Clippers (Kawhi and PG), Lakers (Lebron and AD), Mavs (Luka in and out twice), Pelicans (Zion and Ingram), Suns (Devin Booker) so it was honestly a cake walk for the Nuggets to make it to the top seed.

But all this will do is set him up for an even bigger fall.

The Nuggets may very well lose to a fully healthy and focused/retooled Suns team, a healthy Warriors squad (I'm 50/50 on this though), a fully healthy Clippers squad (also 50/50), or even a fully healthy Grizzlies squad (Jokic is not stopping Ja in the paint).

If he fails with a fully loaded and healthy team it'll be all over for him....

Discuss

This is really stupid by the way...Jokic being an elite passer/playmaker absolutely helps his teammates score more. I don't remember people complaining that Magic Johnson wasn't leading his team in scoring. In fact, Magic was often the 3rd or 4th scorer by ppg.

[Axe]

This is really stupid by the way...Jokic being an elite passer/playmaker absolutely helps his teammates score more. I don't remember people complaining that Magic Johnson wasn't leading his team in scoring. In fact, Magic was often the 3rd or 4th scorer by ppg.
One of the nicest things about him. He's not selfish.

[BigShotBob]

This is really stupid by the way...Jokic being an elite passer/playmaker absolutely helps his teammates score more. I don't remember people complaining that Magic Johnson wasn't leading his team in scoring. In fact, Magic was often the 3rd or 4th scorer by ppg.

Jamal Murray isn't a spot-up shooter lol he doesn't need Jokic to pass it to him to score. He is more than capable of scoring off the dribble and getting hot. That's better than what most teams have btw

[ShawkFactory]

Jamal Murray isn't a spot-up shooter lol he doesn't need Jokic to pass it to him to score. He is more than capable of scoring off the dribble and getting hot. That's better than what most teams have btw

What is “most teams”? Less than half?

[BigShotBob]

What is “most teams”? Less than half?

More than half

[ShawkFactory]

More than half

If he’s healthy perhaps. Last year Jokic was running with Aaron Gordon and Will Barton.

[BigShotBob]

If he’s healthy perhaps. Last year Jokic was running with Aaron Gordon and Will Barton.

But Aaron Gordon is better this year and with a healthy Jamal Murray and supporting cast he's running out of excuses

[ShawkFactory]

But Aaron Gordon is better this year and with a healthy Jamal Murray and supporting cast he's running out of excuses

This year has nothing to do with what’s happened in the past. Yea, if they’re healthy the squad is solid.

That hasn’t been the case for him ever.

[ArbitraryWater]

But Aaron Gordon is better this year and with a healthy Jamal Murray and supporting cast he's running out of excuses

Its 1 season.

Plenty of teams capable this year.

[100grandman]

This is quite the hot take. It'll be all over? What are you even saying? He'll be seen as a lesser player all of a sudden?

He's a very likable guy. I don't see him just being written off by media and fans all of a sudden.


Yeah I don’t know about VERY likeable.