Solution to fix the scoring issue - move the 3-point line a few feet closer like 94'

[3ba11]

This would shrink the court and reduce scoring just like the massive drop-off we saw in 1994 when they shortened the line or the current overseas game that shows shorter line and harder scoring.. this would also reduce load management because players wouldn't have to cover as much ground on defense... 3-point efficiency wouldn't increase because the shots would be better contested as defenders easily cover the ground (smaller court).

This should be done for 2-3 years like the mid-90's.. Then move the line back out and bring back hand-checking at that time.

[1987_Lakers]

No.

[3ba11]

No.


says a victim

[BigShotBob]

No. They need to either get rid of the corner three, or bring back hand-checking and remove the freedom of movement rules so that players can effectively close out and fight through screens without committing fouls. Though the shortened 3 point line did effectively nearly remove the corner 3 as well

But the league won't do it until we either get a new commissioner or fan engagement bottoms out. Both of which may not happen any time soon

[SouBeachTalents]

So when players are already making 3’s at an ungodly rate, your solution is to move the line up further and make it even easier to make 3’s? You’re not terribly bright :lol

Look at the 3 point % for players from ‘95-‘97, most of them (unsurprisingly) spiked, even Jordan with his broke ass 3 pointer was shooting 40%, a number he never came CLOSE to replicating the rest of his career.

Nice “subtle” way to prop up Jordan’s era though, you’re real slick lol.

[AlternativeAcc.]

So when players are already making 3’s at an ungodly rate, your solution is to move the line up further and make it even easier to make 3’s? You’re not terribly bright :lol

Look at the 3 point % for players from ‘95-‘97, most of them (unsurprisingly) spiked, even Jordan with his broke ass 3 pointer was shooting 40%, a number he never came CLOSE to replicating the rest of his career.

Nice “subtle” way to prop up Jordan’s era though, you’re real slick lol.

:lol

This would allow and promote fringe 3 point shooters to take way more 3s, including many big men, so his way of "shrinking" the court would have the opposite effect.

The amount of 3s would go even higher, and the scoring would inevitably increase.

[Real Men Wear Green]

A rule change that would make Shai Gilgous Alexander average more points than Jordan. Nice.

[3ba11]

So when players are already making 3’s at an ungodly rate, your solution is to move the line up further and make it even easier to make 3’s? You’re not terribly bright :lol

Look at the 3 point % for players from ‘95-‘97, most of them (unsurprisingly) spiked, even Jordan with his broke ass 3 pointer was shooting 40%, a number he never came CLOSE to replicating the rest of his career.

Nice “subtle” way to prop up Jordan’s era though, you’re real slick lol.


I'm just making the point that shrinking the court would reduce scoring like it did in the 90's despite the slightly higher 3-point percentages

But I suppose it would be simpler to just bring back the old defensive rules which would reduce attempts somewhat, while reducing automatic penetration and open paints

[3ba11]

A rule change that would make Shai Gilgous Alexander average more points than Jordan. Nice.


SGA has 47 total shot attempts this year between 20-24 feet (long 2's that would often be 3's with a shorter line).. so no

[Real Men Wear Green]

SGA has 47 total shot attempts this year between 20-24 feet (long 2's that would often be 3's with a shorter line).. so no
Players are coached not to take long twos genius. It's considered to be high risk low reward. If they can get the same 3 points for a shot that's a few feet closer they will take it.

[ShawkFactory]

SGA has 47 total shot attempts this year between 20-24 feet (long 2's that would often be 3's with a shorter line).. so no
Is that an actual argument you just made? :lol

[Indian guy]

As long as teams are free to jack up a shot that's worth 50% more than a regular shot, scoring is not going to get curtailed. More pre-2019 physicality may put a minor dent into it, but nothing significant. The NBA game was never that physical to begin with. Go watch a random game from the 80's or 90's and you'll laugh at the supposed "hand checking" and "no layups allowed". The biggest thing that'll stand out will be far and away the spacing. Without the threat of the 3pt shot in high volume, defenses pre-2017 just weren't spaced out like they are now. That's what needs to change.

It will never happen but I've long been an advocate of putting a cap on 3pters. Just limited them to 30 per game until the last 2 minutes of regulation. That's how scoring comes down and maybe even more importantly, the game actually has variety to it again as opposed to the spread pick-n-roll offense that every team has been running for half a decade now.

[StrongLurk]

As long as teams are free to jack up a shot that's worth 50% more than a regular shot, scoring is not going to get curtailed. More pre-2019 physicality may put a minor dent into it, but nothing significant. The NBA game was never that physical to begin with. Go watch a random game from the 80's or 90's and you'll laugh at the supposed "hand checking" and "no layups allowed". The biggest thing that'll stand out will be far and away the spacing. Without the threat of the 3pt shot in high volume, defenses pre-2017 just weren't spaced out like they are now. That's what needs to change.

It will never happen but I've long been an advocate of putting a cap on 3pters. Just limited them to 30 per game until the last 2 minutes of regulation. That's how scoring comes down and maybe even more importantly, the game actually has variety to it again as opposed to the spread pick-n-roll offense that every team has been running for half a decade now.

I made this point a few times. The "math" is just too in favor of the three point shot. Ideally it would only be worth 2.5 points. If it was, then you'd see an immediate shift back to early/mid 2000s type ball.

Shit I remember everyone saying the rules changes in 06 opened up the game too much...seems laughable compared to what's happening now.

[j3lademaster]

KD will average 30 ppg on 25 mpg for the rest of the season.

[97 bulls]

What's wrong with the boost in offense? Let's just enjoy the game as it is today, and stop comparing it to the past.

If the league needs to do anything in my opinion, it should be to crack down on the carrys and traveling violations.

[BigShotBob]

As long as teams are free to jack up a shot that's worth 50% more than a regular shot, scoring is not going to get curtailed. More pre-2019 physicality may put a minor dent into it, but nothing significant. The NBA game was never that physical to begin with. Go watch a random game from the 80's or 90's and you'll laugh at the supposed "hand checking" and "no layups allowed". The biggest thing that'll stand out will be far and away the spacing. Without the threat of the 3pt shot in high volume, defenses pre-2017 just weren't spaced out like they are now. That's what needs to change.

It will never happen but I've long been an advocate of putting a cap on 3pters. Just limited them to 30 per game until the last 2 minutes of regulation. That's how scoring comes down and maybe even more importantly, the game actually has variety to it again as opposed to the spread pick-n-roll offense that every team has been running for half a decade now.

You could actually fight over the screens back then. The amount of mandatory space and cushion you have to give players now is asinine.

[Full Court]

Let's just bring back hand checking. Let the guys play defense.

[bison]

Stop with the rule changes!!!!!!

[Phoenix]

Yes, that's exactly what the league needs, moving in the line to incentive MORE 3's being taken. Someone like Dame has 1/2 of his shots at the 3point line, let's boost that to like 3/4 shall we? Let's not have 40 guys averaging 20ppg, let's have the guys who are averaging 18-19 take a couple more 3's so that we can double that number to 80.

If you're going to keep this moron around can you at least curtail his ability to make threads? Jesus H. Christ.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Yes, that's exactly what the league needs, moving in the line to incentive MORE 3's being taken. Someone like Dame has 1/2 of his shots at the 3point line, let's boost that to like 3/4 shall we? Let's not have 40 guys averaging 20ppg, let's have the guys who are averaging 18-19 take a couple more 3's so that we can double that number to 80.

If you're going to keep this moron around can you at least curtail his ability to make threads? Jesus H. Christ.

So dumb that reading it actually hurt. The fact he thinks its nuanced is a pretty good troll, though lol

I'd say bring back some physicality and possibly handcheck. Wont stop today's 3>2 mantra, but it'll help curtail it. I'm game for MORE defense. :confusedshrug:

[Phoenix]

So dumb that reading it actually hurt. The fact he thinks its nuanced is a pretty good troll, though lol

I'd say bring back some physicality and possibly handcheck. Wont stop today's 3>2 mantra, but it'll help curtail it. I'm game for MORE defense. :confusedshrug:

That and clamping down on travelling/carrying, but you've had an entire generation who've built their games around how the game is officiated now, so that ain't happening.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

That and clamping down on travelling/carrying, but you've had an entire generation who've built their games around how the game is officiated now, so that ain't happening.

Agreed

[hateraid]

What's wrong with the boost in offense? Let's just enjoy the game as it is today, and stop comparing it to the past.

If the league needs to do anything in my opinion, it should be to crack down on the carrys and traveling violations.

It's his attempt to prevent any player from surpassing Jordan's scoring mark lol

[dankok8]

OP made what must be the most bizarre suggestion for a rule change ever! :oldlol:

[Phoenix]

OP made what must be the most bizarre suggestion for a rule change ever! :oldlol:

Akin to trying to cure an alcoholic by taking him to happy hour.

[CurryOverLebron]

Michael Jordan actually stood out in 1990s because most teams best players were big men or the rare perimeter guy that couldn't shoot like Clyde Drexler. He was ahead of his time. Now every team has a perimeter guy that can shoot as their best player.

[Indian guy]

This would shrink the court and reduce scoring just like the massive drop-off we saw in 1994 when they shortened the line

I love how in classic 3ball fashion, he tried to sneak in a massive lie as fact to push his agenda. Nobody caught that? Just correcting that destroys the very premise of his post.

- The line was shortened for 3 seasons starting with 1995, not 1994 like 3ball lied
- NBA saw a notable jump in scoring in 1995, which obviously didn't help 3ball's case, so he lied
- 1994 was a down year for the NBA in scoring WITH the regular 3pt line

ORTG

1994 106.3
1995 108.3 (shortened 3pt line introduced)
1996 107.6
1997 106.7
1998 105.0 (back to regular 3pt line)

[jayfan]

It's time to raise the rim.

The height was set at 10 feet by Dr. Naismith in 1891, when the average male height was 5' 6".

It has not been adjusted since.

The average height of basketball players today is 6' 7".

Raising the rim is long overdue.

[SouBeachTalents]

It's time to raise the rim.

The height was set at 10 feet by Dr. Naismith in 1891, when the average male height was 5' 6".

It has not been adjusted since.

The average height of basketball players today is 6' 7".

Raising the rim is long overdue.
This is an idea I don't hear floated very often.

[Full Court]

It's time to raise the rim.

The height was set at 10 feet by Dr. Naismith in 1891, when the average male height was 5' 6".

It has not been adjusted since.

The average height of basketball players today is 6' 7".

Raising the rim is long overdue.

I'll go along with this. It would go a good ways toward making the three point shot harder too without moving the line.

[ShawkFactory]

I love how in classic 3ball fashion, he tried to sneak in a massive lie as fact to push his agenda. Nobody caught that? Just correcting that destroys the very premise of his post.

- The line was shortened for 3 seasons starting with 1995, not 1994 like 3ball lied
- NBA saw a notable jump in scoring in 1995, which obviously didn't help 3ball's case, so he lied
- 1994 was a down year for the NBA in scoring WITH the regular 3pt line

ORTG

1994 106.3
1995 108.3 (shortened 3pt line introduced)
1996 107.6
1997 106.7
1998 105.0 (back to regular 3pt line)
:roll:

I think most people assume that he does this type of stuff and don’t care enough to take time checking and/or making a counter argument.

[Charlie Sheen]

I cant figure out how op arrived at the conclusion this shrinks the court? Wouldn't it expand the area defense has to cover since nobody is taking those shots 1-2 feet inside the line but they would if the line was moved in?

[Phoenix]

:roll:

I think most people assume that he does this type of stuff and don’t care enough to take time checking and/or making a counter argument.

I tend to gloss over his posts nowadays, I just assume whatever he's going on about is some variation of the shit he's already said 10,000+ times about the same 3-4 players.

[Jasper]

This would shrink the court and reduce scoring just like the massive drop-off we saw in 1994 when they shortened the line or the current overseas game that shows shorter line and harder scoring.. this would also reduce load management because players wouldn't have to cover as much ground on defense... 3-point efficiency wouldn't increase because the shots would be better contested as defenders easily cover the ground (smaller court).

This should be done for 2-3 years like the mid-90's.. Then move the line back out and bring back hand-checking at that time.

what are we playing 3 on 3 ...?? :facepalm

/

[3ba11]

I love how in classic 3ball fashion, he tried to sneak in a massive lie as fact to push his agenda. Nobody caught that? Just correcting that destroys the very premise of his post.

- The line was shortened for 3 seasons starting with 1995, not 1994 like 3ball lied
- NBA saw a notable jump in scoring in 1995, which obviously didn't help 3ball's case, so he lied
- 1994 was a down year for the NBA in scoring WITH the regular 3pt line

ORTG

1994 106.3
1995 108.3 (shortened 3pt line introduced)
1996 107.6
1997 106.7
1998 105.0 (back to regular 3pt line)


An honest oversight.. The shorter line caused unspaced courts regardless of 3-point volume and ushered in an era of physical play and defensive-focused basketball, since that was easier for most teams than elite offense.

This defensive-focused basketball remained after the line was moved back, which required the commissioner to eventually change the rules that teams had gotten so good at taking advantage of.

[3ba11]

I cant figure out how op arrived at the conclusion this shrinks the court? Wouldn't it expand the area defense has to cover since nobody is taking those shots 1-2 feet inside the line but they would if the line was moved in?


A shortened 3-point line allows defenders to cover less ground when closing out on 3-pointers and in general, while also making it harder for coaches to space the floor - the shorter line essentially removes the effect of distance shots (spacing) without actually removing the 3-point shot... Just a few less feet to cover for each defender makes a massive difference.. Often times they don't have to move at all when the ball is swung and can just move their body like a swivel chair

[Real Men Wear Green]

A shortened 3-point line allows defenders to cover less ground when closing out on 3-pointers and in general, while also making it harder for coaches to space the floor - the shorter line essentially removes the effect of distance shots (spacing) without actually removing the 3-point shot... Just a few less feet to cover for each defender makes a massive difference.. Often times they don't have to move at all when the ball is swung and can just move their body like a swivel chair

If the spacing is so dependent on a few feet teams could just have shooters stand just as far from the hoop as they used to. Of course such stupid analysis ignores the fact that many threes are going to be taken by open shooters that step in to a now easier shot but whatever. Thread isn't supposed to make sense.

[paksat]

3ball you're normally a decent poster but this is just stupid. Why not just make the 3 point line 8 feet while we're at it? You're just encouraging more 3's to be taken because it becomes an even easier shot.

two solutions, neither of which will be done:

1. remove the 3 point line

2. bring back all the rules allowing defenders to hound the offensive players

the nba is in big trouble, the game is stale and it's not showing in the $$$ yet but it will soon. Realgm forums have lost an immense amount of their posters in just the last year. Thread used to get to 50 pages before the end of the day, now threads might be there for an entire week before it hits 15 pages. They've lost a good 80% of their posters and I think it's because they're just bored out of their minds watching this crap that's being put out today. A lot of the threads there are people talking about the past, past players, team comparisons etc. rather than talking about what's actually going on in the league today.

[3ba11]

3ball you're normally a decent poster but this is just stupid. Why not just make the 3 point line 8 feet while we're at it? You're just encouraging more 3's to be taken because it becomes an even easier shot.




8 feet is a little too close obviously and this is just a temporary thing for a couple years to improve everyone's 2-pointers, which will be much better defended with the closer 3-point line than currently.

The problem with today's game is that shot-making has become boring.. 2-pointers entail a higher proportion of easier in-stride layups/dunks or boring/open mid-range.. If a team doesn't get these things from 2-point range then it's a boring three.. So there's little resistance to any shot due to the spacing, therefore a shorter 3-point line would reduce the spacing for a couple years.. When players and teams adjust their perception and adapt, then move the line back and bring back hand-checking and impeding.. This process will develop better skillsets like we saw in prior eras where the lesser spacing forced players to develop individually-unique ways of dealing with the greater resistance to shot-makiing.. Chemistry becomes more nuanced as well and a more critical factor then today's talent-based approach to achieving an uncontested threes/layups shot allocation.







two solutions, neither of which will be done:

1. remove the 3 point line

2. bring back all the rules allowing defenders to hound the offensive players

the nba is in big trouble, the game is stale and it's not showing in the $$$ yet but it will soon. Realgm forums have lost an immense amount of their posters in just the last year. Thread used to get to 50 pages before the end of the day, now threads might be there for an entire week before it hits 15 pages. They've lost a good 80% of their posters and I think it's because they're just bored out of their minds watching this crap that's being put out today. A lot of the threads there are people talking about the past, past players, team comparisons etc. rather than talking about what's actually going on in the league today.





I agree with both of these things - think how sick players' moves and shot-making would get if there was more defensive resistance by doing either of those things.. Basketball shouldn't have layups, threes and dunks on every play... (copy-paste incoming)

The problem with today's game is that shot-making has become boring.. 2-pointers entail a higher proportion of easier in-stride layups/dunks or boring/open mid-range.. If a team doesn't get these things from 2-point range then it's a boring three.. So there's little resistance to any shot due to the spacing, therefore a shorter 3-point line would reduce the spacing for a couple years.. When players and teams adjust their perception and adapt, then move the line back and bring back hand-checking and impeding.. This process will develop better skillsets like we saw in prior eras where the lesser spacing allowed players to develop individually-unique ways of dealing with the greater resistance to shot-makiing.. Chemistry becomes more nuanced as well and a more critical factor then today's talent-based approach to achieving an uncontested threes/layups shot allocation.

[Full Court]

What would happen if the NBA did away with the three point line altogether and went old school? How would that change the game?

[3ba11]

What would happen if the NBA did away with the three point line altogether and went old school? How would that change the game?


The game would collapse into the paint as teams pursued a 55% paint shot versus a 45% two-pointer from 25 feet.

The lack of spacing would produce more individually-unique skillsets like Magic, Bird or Kareem as each player develops their own individually-unique ways of overcoming superior defensive resistance - this contrasts from today's game where players just have to be athletic enough to beat defenders to the open space for the open shot.

Players start to look more different and individually-unique in tougher defensive formats that require everyone to develop individually-unique ways of overcoming the defensive contest.

In the unspaced era of the 80's and 90's, guys like Kiki Vandeweghe, Bernard King, or Alex English were experts at making ad-hoc, "ugly" contested shots amongst a packed paint - this required incredible touch but today's game avoids these shots and sucks at those shots, while the aforementioned players LIVED off those shots and averaged 30 ppg.. Every great scorer in the 80's had tremendous touch on 2-pointers - those eras had the same advantage on 2-pointers that today's game has on 3's..

So if the NBA removed the 3-point line, players would become experts at 2-pointers again but this time with better handle - they would truly develop into superior players than their 80's and 90's counterparts.

[Gimmedarock]

What scoring issues is there? Guys are just good shooters.

[Lebron23]

Michael Jordan had a weak pulse that's why he was a bad 3 points shooter. In Tagalog mahina ang pulso.

[HoopologyPhD]

OP is close, but there is only one really solution: remove the 3 point line.