Clippers @ Pels GT: Goatbrook carrying Kawhi

[ArbitraryWater]

Interesting

[Street Hunger]

Kawhi might ask for Westbrook's autograph after this game.

[Nike D'Antoni]

Wow. If Clippers lose this, They have same amount of losses as Lakers. The Russ effect?

[RRR3]

Clippers embarrassing themselves.

[Nike D'Antoni]

Clippers embarrassing themselves.

Wow. Lakers traded Russ and now are about to pass the Clippers in the standings

[Indian guy]

Clippers are 8-10 with WB. Lakers are 14-7 post-trade.

Lakers can even surpass Clippers in the standings.

[RRR3]

Clippers are 8-10 with WB. Lakers are 14-7 post-trade.

Lakers can even surpass Clippers in the standings.
He wasn't the problem tho!

[Axe]

Brodie with another net negative. Still ImKobe must be happy jerking off in seeing him and ingraham post some decent stats itg. :D

[k 96]

He wasn't the problem tho!
I agree.
Clippers are still in the playoffs, and will beat the ESPN Lakers in a 7 game series.

[hold this L]

Clippers really selling for that 6th spot

[ImKobe]

BI with another monster performance. Pels have won 7 out of 8 and he's putting up 30+ ppg & 8+ apg on 50+/40+/90+ splits in this stretch. So much for him not being close to Tatum's level as a player lol.


He wasn't the problem tho!

His contract was the problem. 2 of the 3 players they got in return were close to his level overall. That's like if you traded Bran or AD for two stars + another starter-level player. Clippers would have been worse off with Reggie Jackson in Westbrook's place.

[RRR3]

BI with another monster performance. Pels have won 7 out of 8 and he's putting up 30+ ppg & 8+ apg on 50+/40+/90+ splits in this stretch. So much for him not being close to Tatum's level as a player lol.



His contract was the problem. 2 of the 3 players they got in return were close to his level overall. That's like if you traded Bran or AD for two stars + another starter-level player. Clippers would have been worse off with Reggie Jackson in Westbrook's place.
You’re such a complete dim bulb it s honestly incredible. Ingram isn’t close to Tatum because of a hot stretch of 7 games. I can find 7 games stretches that make it look like Jamal Murray is as good as Curry. As for your Westbrook defense, the clippers record with him speaks for itself. 8-10 yikes. This is with him shooting way better than normal too :lol

[ImKobe]

You’re such a complete dim bulb it s honestly incredible. Ingram isn’t close to Tatum because of a hot stretch of 7 games. I can find 7 games stretches that make it look like Jamal Murray is as good as Curry. As for your Westbrook defense, the clippers record with him speaks for itself. 8-10 yikes. This is with him shooting way better than normal too :lol

BI's been averaging 28/5/6 on 51/40/88 splits since February (22 games) and that's not counting this last one. He's been on Tatum's level since returning from injury. Tatum is averaging 29/9/5 on 47/36/83 splits in this same stretch.

"Ingram isn't close to Tatum" doe.. cmon man. Can we stop pretending that JT is close to Embiid or Jokic level here? Him and BI are close as players and I'm tired of people pretending that they're not. It's crickets every time BI goes on a run.

[1987_Lakers]

Clippers are 8-10 with WB. Lakers are 14-7 post-trade.

Lakers can even surpass Clippers in the standings.

ImKobe rooting against his own team once hearing this stat.

[RRR3]

BI's been averaging 28/5/6 on 51/40/88 splits since February (22 games) and that's not counting this last one. He's been on Tatum's level since returning from injury. Tatum is averaging 29/9/5 on 47/36/83 splits in this same stretch.

"Ingram isn't close to Tatum" doe.. cmon man. Can we stop pretending that JT is close to Embiid or Jokic level here? Him and BI are close as players and I'm tired of people pretending that they're not. It's crickets every time BI goes on a run.
You constantly cherry pick like this and it’s exactly why no one takes you seriously. I remember you cherry-picking some 20 game stretch from Kuzma last year to “prove” he was all star level in a season he averaged like 18 PPG on bad efficiency (and don’t claim Kuzma averaging 21 on awful efficiency this year means anything, he’s just shooting a lot and the stats reflect it). Tatum has blown Ingram out of the water for years now and it’s incredibly embarrassing you can’t admit it.

[Manny98]

Warriors 5th seed :banana:

KD sweating in his pants right now :oldlol:

[Real Men Wear Green]

BI's been averaging 28/5/6 on 51/40/88 splits since February (22 games) and that's not counting this last one. He's been on Tatum's level since returning from injury. Tatum is averaging 29/9/5 on 47/36/83 splits in this same stretch.

"Ingram isn't close to Tatum" doe.. cmon man. Can we stop pretending that JT is close to Embiid or Jokic level here? Him and BI are close as players and I'm tired of people pretending that they're not. It's crickets every time BI goes on a run.

If Ingram averaged 30 and 9 for a whole season where he stayed healthy you would be calling him God. One guy will be first team All NBA. The other wasn't even an allstar. The argument is dead

[Axe]

If Ingram averaged 30 and 9 for a whole season where he stayed healthy you would be calling him God. One guy will be first team All NBA. The other wasn't even an allstar. The argument is dead
:roll:

Imagine him doing that while ingram himself hasn't done anything close to proving his worth yet in the playoffs. :lol

[ArbitraryWater]

Clippers are 8-10 with WB. Lakers are 14-7 post-trade.

Lakers can even surpass Clippers in the standings.

they should only if GSW maintain the 5th.

[RRR3]

If Ingram averaged 30 and 9 for a whole season where he stayed healthy you would be calling him God. One guy will be first team All NBA. The other wasn't even an allstar. The argument is dead
:applause:

[Nike D'Antoni]

Let Russ be Russ

[ImKobe]

:roll:

Imagine him doing that while ingram himself hasn't done anything close to proving his worth yet in the playoffs. :lol

I mean he dragged them into the POs last year and took multiple games from the Suns and averaged 27/6/6 on 58%TS in that series. He's leading the team to the POs again this year.

That Celtic fan (imagine being a Celtic fan lmao) is so salty any time I bring up BI.

[RRR3]

I mean he dragged them into the POs last year and took multiple games from the Suns and averaged 27/6/6 on 58%TS in that series. He's leading the team to the POs again this year.

That Celtic fan (imagine being a Celtic fan lmao) is so salty any time I bring up BI.
I don’t think he’s salty he’s just dumbfounded you can’t admit when you’re wrong even in the face of overwhelming evidence.

[Axe]

I mean he dragged them into the POs last year and took multiple games from the Suns and averaged 27/6/6 on 58%TS in that series. He's leading the team to the POs again this year.

That Celtic fan (imagine being a Celtic fan lmao) is so salty any time I bring up BI.
I'll wait first 'til he's won a series in the playoffs. Then we'll talk.


:whatever:

[ImKobe]

You constantly cherry pick like this and it’s exactly why no one takes you seriously. I remember you cherry-picking some 20 game stretch from Kuzma last year to “prove” he was all star level in a season he averaged like 18 PPG on bad efficiency (and don’t claim Kuzma averaging 21 on awful efficiency this year means anything, he’s just shooting a lot and the stats reflect it). Tatum has blown Ingram out of the water for years now and it’s incredibly embarrassing you can’t admit it.

Bran fans cherry-pick 3-5-game stretches all the time yet I can't use a sample size of 23 games when BI's played as the #1 option and has had to carry the Pels by himself in that stretch? That's over a quarter of the season.

Oh and btw I was right about Kuzma last year.. you said "it's only x amount of games" and he ended up averaging over 21 this season and the Wizards have fallen out of Playoff contention since his injury. You most love taking Ls because you keep trying to play the contrarian on anything I post and you end up being wrong every single time. Keep trying though.

[ImKobe]

I don’t think he’s salty he’s just dumbfounded you can’t admit when you’re wrong even in the face of overwhelming evidence.

Wrong about what? BI when healthy is close to Tatum's level (idc who's better tbh) and he's proving my point this year again.. It's never enough for you guys. Averaging 28/5/6 on 60%TS for 2 months is obviously just a fluke.. Him carrying them last year was just a fluke.. He has no impact and is just a stats guy on a bad team, right?

[RRR3]

Bran fans cherry-pick 3-5-game stretches all the time yet I can't use a sample size of 23 games when BI's played as the #1 option and has had to carry the Pels by himself in that stretch? That's over a quarter of the season.

Oh and btw I was right about Kuzma last year.. you said "it's only x amount of games" and he ended up averaging over 21 this season and the Wizards have fallen out of Playoff contention since his injury. You most love taking Ls because you keep trying to play the contrarian on anything I post and you end up being wrong every single time. Keep trying though.
You were right about Kuzma how? Do you think averaging 21 PPG on -3.7 rTS% is impressive? He’s horribly inefficient and it’s made even worse considering he has two very efficient all star teammates he should be passing to instead of chucking up bricks that have no chance of going in.

[RRR3]

Wrong about what? BI when healthy is close to Tatum's level (idc who's better tbh) and he's proving my point this year again.. It's never enough for you guys. Averaging 28/5/6 on 60%TS for 2 months is obviously just a fluke.. Him carrying them last year was just a fluke.. He has no impact and is just a stats guy on a bad team, right?
He’s not close to Tatum’s level. He’s significantly worse defensively (not that you care about that) and worse offensively too. You have to play well for the whole year to be in top 10 conversations and Tatum has. Ingram is maybe top 25 and that’s me being generous.

[ImKobe]

He’s not close to Tatum’s level. He’s significantly worse defensively (not that you care about that) and worse offensively too. You have to play well for the whole year to be in top 10 conversations and Tatum has. Ingram is maybe top 25 and that’s me being generous.

They have different strengths but that's not the point. Like I've said 100 times already, there's no convo in their overall season rankings as BI gets hurt but skill-wise there's no gap here.. when BI is healthy he plays on that level and he's shown it time & time again.

But all that aside, go and look at Tatum's metrics and tell me they're anywhere close to Jokic/Embiid/Giannis/Luka level as a player. Try and argue he's closer to those guys than BI. He's a volume 3PT chucker who shoots below league average from 3. His eFG is at the league average. He's barely above league average on 2s. He's not even close to AD in production, much less the actual guys fighting for MVP right now. Even Jimmy Butler shits on Tatum in RAPTOR, EPM, PER, BPM, VORP etc.. You guys sound mad offended when I compare JT to BI but all the data suggests that JT is not that good bro. He's not Kobe. He's not even prime (OKC) Paul George level in a lot of these metrics. He's a gimmick 3PT chucker/FT merchant who looks better than he really is because of his supporting cast.

[Real Men Wear Green]

I mean he dragged them into the POs last year and took multiple games from the Suns and averaged 27/6/6 on 58%TS in that series. He's leading the team to the POs again this year.

That Celtic fan (imagine being a Celtic fan lmao) is so salty any time I bring up BI.

I would not have said anything if you didn't try to compare him to Tatum but your keep doing this. You just can't accept reality. And now that you've called him a gimmick three point chucker please don't claim to like Tatum again. No one believes that lie of course but it's worth pointing out.

Imagine being a Celtic fan: you get to watch a talented young team compete for a championship with a hopefully large window two superstars and a great supporting cast. My only real concern is the health of Robert Williams

But imagine pretending to be a fan of a franchise whose star player you hate with a closed championship window that has had to fight like mad just to make the play in. Now that must suck. I can understand why someone like that would be frustrated but he still shouldn't be posting bullshit all night to try and pretend that a guy that isn't even an allstar is on par with a guy about to repeat first team AllNBA.

Odd thought: if Ingram is averaging 28 over the last 22 or 23 games then in the other 20 or so he's averaged what, 22? Based on that I guess we can say he played at Kyle Kuzma level, no? I mean seeing as we are selectively emphasizing just part of the year.

[ImKobe]

I would not have said anything if you didn't try to compare him to Tatum but your keep doing this. You just can't accept reality. And now that you've called him a gimmick three point chucker please don't claim to like Tatum again. No one believes that lie of course but it's worth pointing out.

Imagine being a Celtic fan: you get to watch a talented young team compete for a championship with a hopefully large window two superstars and a great supporting cast. My only real concern is the health of Robert Williams

But imagine pretending to be a fan of a franchise whose star player you hate with a closed championship window that has had to fight like mad just to make the play in. Now that must suck. I can understand why someone like that would be frustrated but he still shouldn't be posting bullshit all night to try and pretend that a guy that isn't even an allstar is on par with a guy about to repeat first team AllNBA.

Odd thought: if Ingram is averaging 28 over the last 22 or 23 games then in the other 20 or so he's averaged what, 22? Based on that I guess we can say he played at Kyle Kuzma level, no? I mean seeing as we are selectively emphasizing just part of the year.


AD wasn't an All-Star this year and won't make the All-NBA this year either due to injuries.. same as Kawhi.. guess what, they're A LOT better than Tatum WHEN HEALTHY. Are you going to rebut with "but Tatum made All-Star and is All-NBA" in defense of that as well?

When BI is healthy he's comparable to JT , that's all I've really said but y'all wanna get mad about it, even when he's dropping 36 on Kawhi's ass with the POs on the line lol. 2 months is not enough of a sample size. Last year wasn't enough of a sample size... idk just watch some damn games if you think he ain't all that and come back to me.

[RRR3]

AD wasn't an All-Star this year and won't make the All-NBA this year either due to injuries.. same as Kawhi.. guess what, they're A LOT better than Tatum WHEN HEALTHY. Are you going to rebut with "but Tatum made All-Star and is All-NBA" in defense of that as well?

When BI is healthy he's comparable to JT , that's all I've really said but y'all wanna get mad about it, even when he's dropping 36 on Kawhi's ass with the POs on the line lol. 2 months is not enough of a sample size. Last year wasn't enough of a sample size... idk just watch some damn games if you think he ain't all that and come back to me.
By what metric are Kawhi or AD “much better” than Tatum? Tatum making you seethe doesn’t change how impactful he is

[Real Men Wear Green]

AD wasn't an All-Star this year and won't make the All-NBA this year either due to injuries.. same as Kawhi.. guess what, they're A LOT better than Tatum WHEN HEALTHY. Are you going to rebut with "but Tatum made All-Star and is All-NBA" in defense of that as well?

When BI is healthy he's comparable to JT , that's all I've really said but y'all wanna get mad about it, even when he's dropping 36 on Kawhi's ass with the POs on the line lol. 2 months is not enough of a sample size. Last year wasn't enough of a sample size... idk just watch some damn games if you think he ain't all that and come back to me.The Tatum hate continues. Kawhi Leonard averages less points, less boards and less assists than Tatum. He does have a higher FG %age and that's good but 7 less ppg is a significant number. Your arguments always focus on some random stretch of games where the guy you prefer looks better than his normal numbers. Well guess what? Tatum has had player of the month and week awards too. I could go tit for tat with that kind of bs but I recognize it for what it is. The Celtic broadcast once ran a graphic saying Tatum averaged 34 the game after he takes a game off. But selective crap like that is irrelevant because a real franchise player has to be there for his team game after game and not just get selectively played when he's feeling his best. And that's why Tatum is an All-Star and All-NBA...and certain other players are not.

[ImKobe]

The Tatum hate continues. Kawhi Leonard averages less points, less boards and less assists than Tatum. He does have a higher FG %age and that's good but 7 less ppg is a significant number. Your arguments always focus on some random stretch of games where the guy you prefer looks better than his normal numbers. Well guess what? Tatum has had player of the month and week awards too. I could go tit for tat with that kind of bs but I recognize it for what it is. The Celtic broadcast once ran a graphic saying Tatum averaged 34 the game after he takes a game off. But selective crap like that is irrelevant because a real franchise player has to be there for his team game after game and not just get selectively played when he's feeling his best. And that's why Tatum is an All-Star and All-NBA...and certain other players are not.

Ok so you'll say that I'm cherry-picking again but you're using raw averages on the season when Kawhi was playing 20 mpg at the start of the year lol.. He's averaging 27/6/4/2/1 on 53/47/90 splits or 64.74%TS in his last 30 games. We know how good Kawhi is when he's healthy in the POs and Tatum's never been close to that on either end. I know you don't care about the advanced stuff but Kawhi has been so much better than his raw numbers suggest. Even with the raw numbers & the entire season in perspective he's basically a 50/40/90 guy who turns the ball over less than 2 times a game and the Clippers play at a 50-win pace with him & they've been a 30-win team without. All the efficiency & impact numbers tell us he's one of the 5 best players in the league when he does play, even with me including the early season stuff when he was barely moving and playing 20 mpg.

Again, this is not me hating on Tatum, I'm trying to be objective here with how good he is. He's still one of the 10 best players in the league IMO and he has a lot he could improve upon to take that next step. Celtics could very well win the title and he could be the FMVP but skill-wise there's so much he could add to his game. He's kind of maximized the efficiency part of it & now I want to see him add to his bag where he's less predictable against good defenses in the POs. Ingram has a much deeper bag and he's showing again that when he's healthy for a long period he's right on that level as a player, but obviously JT is having a much better season as he's avoided injury.



By what metric are Kawhi or AD “much better” than Tatum? Tatum making you seethe doesn’t change how impactful he is


Look at the EPM numbers, I bet you already knew before you quoted me, which is why you couldn't bring them up. Kawhi and AD are both much better on D in terms of their impact to their respective teams and are also very impactful offensively and both have played at a much higher level in the POs when healthy and have won championships as a result. They also have better RAPTOR, TS%, PER, WS, BPM etc numbers that you guys love to use as well.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Ok so you'll say that I'm cherry-picking again but you're using raw averages on the season when Kawhi was playing 20 mpg at the start of the year lol.. He's averaging 27/6/4/2/1 on 53/47/90 splits or 64.74%TS in his last 30 games. We know how good Kawhi is when he's healthy in the POs and Tatum's never been close to that on either end. I know you don't care about the advanced stuff but Kawhi has been so much better than his raw numbers suggest. Even with the raw numbers & the entire season in perspective he's basically a 50/40/90 guy who turns the ball over less than 2 times a game and the Clippers play at a 50-win pace with him & they've been a 30-win team without. All the efficiency & impact numbers tell us he's one of the 5 best players in the league when he does play, even with me including the early season stuff when he was barely moving and playing 20 mpg.And you continue to ignore the importance of actually playing more. Every player would be more efficient if he played less minutes and didn't have to play in back-to-back games, let alone getting rested half the season like Leonard. Why do you think they have load management? Tatum has played with sore wrist, stayed in the game after a hard fall, gets hit all game long to get his free throws. Leonard...does not.


Again, this is not me hating on Tatum, I'm trying to be objective here with how good he is. You are full of shit. You wrote, "He's a gimmick 3PT chucker/FT merchant who looks better than he really is because of his supporting cast." You are a hater. Always have been, always will be.
He's still one of the 10 best players in the league IMO and he has a lot he could improve upon to take that next step. Celtics could very well win the title and he could be the FMVP but skill-wise there's so much he could add to his game. He's kind of maximized the efficiency part of it & now I want to see him add to his bag where he's less predictable against good defenses in the POs. Ingram has a much deeper bag and he's showing again that when he's healthy for a long period he's right on that level as a player, but obviously JT is having a much better season as he's avoided injury.
You also dont know what your talking about and make no sense. Somehow in the same paragraph you manage to say:

1. Tatum has a lot to improve on.
2: He has maximized his efficiency.

Who are you arguing with, me or yourself? People that honestly evaluate Tatum know that he's one of the most skilled players his height in the game today. Ingram can reach into that deep bag but can't find 30 ppg. You are talking nonsense.

[aj1987]

Tatum is much better than Ingram. Especially when you factor in defense.


As for WB? Dude has become an absolutely unplayable player. Dude is straight up trash now. He should be playing 15-20 minutes MAX. Nowhere close to the 30 MPG he's playing right now.

[ShawkFactory]

Bran fans cherry-pick 3-5-game stretches all the time yet I can't use a sample size of 23 games when BI's played as the #1 option and has had to carry the Pels by himself in that stretch? That's over a quarter of the season.

Oh and btw I was right about Kuzma last year.. you said "it's only x amount of games" and he ended up averaging over 21 this season and the Wizards have fallen out of Playoff contention since his injury. You most love taking Ls because you keep trying to play the contrarian on anything I post and you end up being wrong every single time. Keep trying though.

In that he could score 21 a game? Lots of people could do that in the right situation.

[RRR3]

In that he could score 21 a game? Lots of people could do that in the right situation.
That’s also not what he said. He said Kuzma could be all star level. Unless you rate his defense extremely highly I’m not sure how you could argue he’s been on that level. He’s scoring about the same as Jordan Clarkson on worse efficiency and no one calls Clarkson an all star.

[ImKobe]

And you continue to ignore the importance of actually playing more. Every player would be more efficient if he played less minutes and didn't have to play in back-to-back games, let alone getting rested half the season like Leonard. Why do you think they have load management? Tatum has played with sore wrist, stayed in the game after a hard fall, gets hit all game long to get his free throws. Leonard...does not.

You are full of shit. You wrote, "He's a gimmick 3PT chucker/FT merchant who looks better than he really is because of his supporting cast." You are a hater. Always have been, always will be.You also dont know what your talking about and make no sense. Somehow in the same paragraph you manage to say:

1. Tatum has a lot to improve on.
2: He has maximized his efficiency.

Who are you arguing with, me or yourself? People that honestly evaluate Tatum know that he's one of the most skilled players his height in the game today. Ingram can reach into that deep bag but can't find 30 ppg. You are talking nonsense.

He used to try to score from mid-range but has completely went away from that part of his game to maximize his efficiency numbers, but in doing so his game translates worse to the POs as he's not getting as many open 3s & easy layups/FTs vs. better teams, so you get a result like the one in the Finals where he looks worse than Jaylen Brown with his 3s not falling as much. Celtics are so focused on their volume of 3s which leads to a higher variance with them blowing leads and playing down to their competition when they can get better shots inside the arc.

Of course BI can find 30 ppg. It's a matter of volume at that point. He's been carrying a 28 ppg load on 60+%TS efficiency over the past 2 months lol, he passes more than JT and doesn't force as many 3s when IMO he should be taking more of those looks as he's developed into an efficient 3PT shooter.

[ImKobe]

That’s also not what he said. He said Kuzma could be all star level. Unless you rate his defense extremely highly I’m not sure how you could argue he’s been on that level. He’s scoring about the same as Jordan Clarkson on worse efficiency and no one calls Clarkson an all star.

Clarkson is much much worse defensively lol, cmon man. EPM tells us Kuz is in the 89-percentile defensively (which I don't really agree with but he's definitely above-average and constantly makes big defensive plays in crunch time vs. the best players) while JC is in the bottom 20%.

[Real Men Wear Green]

He used to try to score from mid-range but has completely went away from that part of his game to maximize his efficiency numbers, but in doing so his game translates worse to the POs as he's not getting as many open 3s & easy layups/FTs vs. better teams, so you get a result like the one in the Finals where he looks worse than Jaylen Brown with his 3s not falling as much. Celtics are so focused on their volume of 3s which leads to a higher variance with them blowing leads and playing down to their competition when they can get better shots inside the arc.

Of course BI can find 30 ppg. It's a matter of volume at that point. He's been carrying a 28 ppg load on 60+%TS efficiency over the past 2 months lol, he passes more than JT and doesn't force as many 3s when IMO he should be taking more of those looks as he's developed into an efficient 3PT shooter.

So the guy that won the only EC playoff mvp award is doing bad in the playoffs now? You're an idiot. I am done with this discussion my patience has ran out. I'll probably point out future garbage but for now? Enough.

Feel free to let me know when Ingram averages 30 for a season. I'll wait.

[ImKobe]

So the guy that won the only EC playoff mvp award is doing bad in the playoffs now? You're an idiot. I am done with this discussion my patience has ran out. I'll probably point out future garbage but for now? Enough.

Feel free to let me know when Ingram averages 30 for a season. I'll wait.

He wasn't the best player in the series, even with Butler injured in like half the games lol, they backed their way into the Finals against a team that shouldn't have had a chance to begin with. Him & Jaylen were really close that series. It's a nice achievement but again it didn't show me he was a top 5 player in the league, he was really inconsistent as the mediocre high-volume shooters who rely on that shot usually are, which is why I've liked his game less over the years. It just doesn't translate that well to the POs unless you're Steph or Dame.