Players that elevated into the top 75 this season

[John8204]

I'm not talking about guys that should be on the list and weren't (English, Mutombo, Issel, McGrady, and Howard)....but only refering to this season.

Who are you putting in and more importantly who are you taking out.

[Phoenix]

Take Shaq out. Barely top 100 at this point.

[John8204]

Have you considered medication?

[Phoenix]

Have you?

[John8204]

I can make a coherent argument and move on...you seem to be both obsessed with Shaq and incapable of defending his many flaws.

[L.Kizzle]

Who had Dan Issel top 75?
Maybe top 150.

Mayne Joel Embiid. Won his first MVP.

[FultzNationRISE]

Who had Dan Issel top 75?
Maybe top 150.

Mayne Joel Embiid. Won his first MVP.

I mean if Melo is top 75, Embiid has to be. Their playoff level is about the same and Embiid is better in the regular season. :confusedshrug:

[L.Kizzle]

I mean if Melo is top 75, Embiid has to be. Their playoff level is about the same and Embiid is better in the regular season. :confusedshrug:

Maybe Joel tho. Here's a kicker, Jokic had just one his 1st MVP when the original list came out a few years ago and he wasn't included. Obviously that was eons ago.

[Phoenix]

I can make a coherent argument and move on...you seem to be both obsessed with Shaq and incapable of defending his many flaws.

Says the one who specifically made a thread about why Shaq isn't a top 25 player, with numerous posts within your posting history of the same ilk. Anyone can make an argument about anything, but opinions something something assholes..... I only bring up Shaq in this thread because your opinions on him are the only thing I remember out of anything you say.

[John8204]

Says the one who specifically made a thread about why Shaq isn't a top 25 player, with numerous posts within your posting history of the same ilk. Anyone can make an argument about anything, but opinions something something assholes..... I only bring up Shaq in this thread because your opinions on him are the only thing I remember out of anything you say.



I don't have Shaq in my top twenty, apparently this is a big enough deal for people to bring this up over and over again. Here are my ten reasons Shaq isn't a GOAT.

#1 - His rebounding numbers. Shaq is 15th in rebounds, he's allegedly the greatest most dominant big of all-time yet he's behind low tier guys like Dwight Howard, Walt Bellamy, Kevin Garnett, and Wes Unseld. 4 Centers that I have in the top 5 are also top 5 in this stat (Wilt, Moses, Bill, and Kareem) the other center I rank in the top five George Mikan average 13.4 RPG, Shaq only averaged 10.

#2 - His competition, Shaq's greatest accomplishment is his rings as he has four of them. He beat The Indiana Pacers, Philadelphia 76ers, New Jersey Nets, and Dallas Mavericks. Only Dallas with Dirk ever won a ring (thanks to a 37 year old Jason Kidd joining the team). His teams that won featured Kobe and Dwayne Wade along with a who's who list of supporting elite role players. Head to Head he lost to Hakeem Olajuwon's Rockets and Ben Wallaces Pistons.

#3 - He never averaged 30PPG in a season, once again the argument for Shaq is that he was the most dominant player in NBA history. Yet dozens of players have managed to hit the 30PPG threshold and Shaq never did...this was a driving force in his failure to win multiple MVP's.

#4 - He only has a single MVP, while Kobe was likely held back from winning the award because of his rape charge what's Shaq's excuse? He wasn't really competing for the MVP in an era when they piled on guys like Lebron, Jordan, Bird, Magic, or Wilt. The race was open every year and yet for some reason he was never respected enough by the media to get the award more than once.

#5 - The Sacramento Kings Series - 4 rings, 3 Finals MVP's you can remove two of those points after what was the worst called series in NBA history...also

#6 - The Portland Trailblazers Series - Another fixed series...one player benefited from two of the shadiest series in NBA history. The NBA also sabotaged the FBI investigation over game fixing we don't know how many refs would have gone down in Tim was able to wear a wire.

#7 - His weight, the NBA is filled with many great's none of them weighed 400lbs. The man had little self control and discipline plenty of players have weaknesses but how many of them had to do with food.

#8 - His ego, the Magic were a great team and a nice destination for players. Had he stayed on the team that drafted him he would have had great players come over the years to play with the big man. Well he left the Magic and followed Jerry West to Los Angeles who put together a championship level squad for Shaq...he could have stayed in Los Angeles and won 4-5-6 but he couldn't get along with Kobe. So he bounces over to Pat Riley and the team he built up in Miami wins a single title and I guess not believing he could beat the Celtics and Lebron he runs to the Phoenix Suns to play under D'antoni and try and beat Kobe...flops horribly. Then he ring chases with the teams that were better than him...Cleveland and Boston fails to win as a bench player. Shaq's a front runner who when his feelings got hurt he left a dynasty. I don't respect players that leave rings on the table.

#9 - His contemporaries....was Shaq better than KG? Nowitzki? Duncan? or Kobe? Look at Allen Iverson taking a team to the finals with far less talent than any season Shaq played. Jason Kidd did the same thing, won a chip when he was old but maintained his same level of productivity. Is there an argument for Shaq over Jordan and Hakeem? How about Duncan and Kobe? We saw how poorly he performed during his career even though he had all that talent, all of those calls, and all of that raw natural ability.

#10 - The changing of the rules/build of teams....Shaq only made 50% of his free throws so the league changed the rules to help him out. Shaq didn't have to play against the great centers of the 80's/70's/60's. Not a single center cracked the top 75 after Shaq.

Many of you think Shaq's great good for you...I don't I think he was very good. I believe in judging players based on their contemporaries in position and generation so for me Shaq not a high ranked player all-time.

1. You don't address my issues with Shaq...
2. You misrepresented the arguement...he's not in the top 20...he's near top 25
3. You have issues with people having discussion topics...on a discussion forum, isn't that the point

Take your meds

[Phoenix]

1. You don't address my issues with Shaq...
2. You misrepresented the arguement...he's not in the top 20...he's near top 25
3. You have issues with people having discussion topics...on a discussion forum, isn't that the point

Take your meds

1.I actually did address your issues with Shaq in another thread, over several posts. If you were either on meds or they actually worked, you'd know that.

2.Oh, my sincere apologies. He's not top 20, but near top 25. As if that's somehow less retarded.

3. Don't recall saying I had an issue with people posting topics. You made a topic, and I responded. Not seriously, but there's only a few posters here I would discuss basketball with in good faith and you sure as hell ain't one of em.

[SouBeachTalents]

1.I actually did address your issues with Shaq in another thread, over several posts. If you were either on meds or they actually worked, you'd know that.

2.Oh, my sincere apologies. He's not top 20, but near top 25. As if that's somehow less retarded.

3. Don't recall saying I had an issue with people posting topics. You made a topic, and I responded. Not seriously, but there's only a few posters here I would discuss basketball with in good faith and you sure as hell ain't one of em.
Fck is wrong with you bro, guy says Shaq isn't top 20 and you have to completely exaggerate and claim he said not top 25?

[John8204]

3. Don't recall saying I had an issue with people posting topics. You made a topic, and I responded. Not seriously, but there's only a few posters here I would discuss basketball with in good faith and you sure as hell ain't one of em.

You don't have issues with people posting topics but you will only talk about basketball with a select few. Well then you can kindly go **** yourself because you are a fraud and a troll. You also didn't address my issues with Shaq in that thread which makes you a liar. A pathetic sad loser and a liar.

[Phoenix]

Fck is wrong with you bro, guy says Shaq isn't top 20 and you have to completely exaggerate and claim he said not top 25?

The fact that he made that distinction is hilarious. :oldlol:

[Phoenix]

You don't have issues with people posting topics but you will only talk about basketball with a select few. Well then you can kindly go **** yourself because you are a fraud and a troll. You also didn't address my issues with Shaq in that thread which makes you a liar. A pathetic sad loser and a liar.

1.Saying I would only talk basketball seriously with a few posters and not having an issue with people posting topics aren't connected. 80% of the topics here are troll topics. Do I take them seriously? Nope. Do I have a 'problem' with people posting them? Nope.

2. I said I addressed your issues with Shaq in ANOTHER thread, not the one you specifically created. Failing to comprehend that because you are a retard.

3. whysoserious? :oldlol:

[Manny98]

Jokic and Butler, take out Melo and Earl Monroe