24-year-old LeBron James lead the Cavs to 66 wins with this starting lineup in 2009.

[Lebron23]

https://scontent.fmnl8-3.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/356924962_136175359495778_308310311543177280_n.jpg ?_nc_cat=104&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=7fMnULr3B9MAX_MPyma&_nc_ht=scontent.fmnl8-3.fna&oh=00_AfClLkkvfGB10TnSbZo46Ohx7VDI7cIZPf-tYS-b7SUavA&oe=64A8FC25

[warriorfan]

and got bounced out by dwight howard and rafer alston even with HCA

[Lebron23]

and got bounced out by dwight howard and rafer alston even with HCA

Not his fault. LeBron put up better stats than the late Kobe against the same Magic team.

[SouBeachTalents]

Louie, Louie
Oh, no, you take me where ya gotta go
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, baby
Louie, Louie
Oh, baby, take me where ya gotta go
A fine little girl, she waits for me
Me catch the ship across the sea
Me sailed that ship all alone
Me never think I'll make it home
Oh, Louie, Louie
Oh, no, no, no, take me where ya gotta go
Oh, no
Louie, Louie
Oh, baby, take me where ya gotta go
Three nights and days I sailed the sea
Me think of girl constantly
On that ship, I dream she there
I smell the rose in her hair
Louie, Louie
Oh, no, me gotta go
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, baby
Louie, Louie
Oh, baby, me gotta go
Okay, let's give it to 'em, right now
Me see
Me see Jamaica, the moon above
It won't be long me see me love
Me take her in my arms and then
I tell her I'll never leave again
Oh, Louie, Louie
Oh, no, me gotta go
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, baby
Louie, Louie
Oh, baby, me gotta go
I said me gotta go now
Let's hustle on out of here
Let's go!

[imdaman99]

Not his fault. LeBron put up better stats than the late Kobe against the same Magic team.

Maybe it's not always about the stats. Maybe once in a while it's about the leadership.

[RRR3]

Anyone who faults LeBron for 2009 is a horrendous troll.

[warriorfan]

Anyone who faults LeBron for 2009 is a horrendous troll.

how old were you in 2009? did you even watch the series or is this a basketball reference based take?

[Lebron23]

Maybe it's not always about the stats. Maybe once in a while it's about the leadership.

LeBron won 4 mvp, and 4 finals mvp. Led 3 different nba teams into 4 nba titles. He is a better leader than Kobe who had a better supporting casts than lebron in 2009 and 2010.

Lebron is also 16-6 against Kobe in their regular season matchup

[Baller789]

Lebron also went up against nobodies in the East.

[Spurs m8]

and got bounced out by dwight howard and rafer alston even with HCA

End thread

[BigShotBob]

and got bounced out by dwight howard and rafer alston even with HCA

Ether

[JBSptfn]

It just goes to show that LeBron would have won a title if Memphis would have won the 2003 lottery instead and drafted him. From the start, he would have been playing with Pau Gasol, Mike Miller, White Chocolate, James Posey, etc....

[imdaman99]

LeBron won 4 mvp, and 4 finals mvp. Led 3 different nba teams into 4 nba titles. He is a better leader than Kobe who had a better supporting casts than lebron in 2009 and 2010.

Lebron is also 16-6 against Kobe in their regular season matchup

I have no problem with anyone saying LeBron is the better player. I don't think he was the better leader

[RRR3]

I have no problem with anyone saying LeBron is the better player. I don't think he was the better leader
When did LeBron assault his teammates

[dazzer87]

And lost to career loser in Howard…66 wins and didnt make it to the finals….:lol

[warriorfan]

how old were you in 2009? did you even watch the series or is this a basketball reference based take?

still awaiting your answer little bro

[ArbitraryWater]

Maybe it's not always about the stats. Maybe once in a while it's about the leadership.

yeah man, it was definitely his leadership why they lost...



are you a dummie in every sport you fan?

[Jimmy Rustler]

and got bounced out by dwight howard and rafer alston even with HCA

First reply body-bagging. :roll:

No matter how much damage control OP tries to do, there's no escaping that fact that LeShrivel has the most choke jobs in the history of the sport.

[diamenz]

When did LeBron assault his teammates

maybe he should have. :confusedshrug:

[sdot_thadon]

how old were you in 2009? did you even watch the series or is this a basketball reference based take?

Real question is: we're you watching in 2009? In that series Orlando had given the Cavs problems all season when they met. Rafer Alston wasn't even in the top 3 of the scouting report. Magic had 2 allstar level 6'10 wings and the Cavs had 2 under 6'3. Those guys couldn't even dream of bothering the jumper of Lewis and Turk. They opted to play Lerbon off them to roam and help on D and it backfired in a terrible way. They had matchup disadvantages all over the floor so Alston was wide open most of the series by design. That's not to mention Dwight Howard either, at that point in time the Cavs had zero answers for him. When Big Z was in the game he was way too mobile for Z to guard him and when they switched off and it was Andy, he was far too weak at that stage of his career. The veteran version of Varejeo would have fared much better against Dwight. And Lebron? He kinda posted historic numbers that series, he could do virtually anything he wanted except go to the bench, even for a minute. Some of us actually watched that series.

[RRR3]

maybe he should have. :confusedshrug:
Real men attack their teammates-dumbamenz

[diamenz]

Real men attack their teammates-dumbamenz

real men do what they need to do in order to get the job done. :confusedshrug:

[kawhileonard2]

Lebron lost to a career loser in Dwight Howard and he had Ben Wallace as well.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?459570-How-is-it-even-possible-to-lose-to-Dwight-Howard-in-a-series-with-HCA/page11

[theman93]

Real question is: we're you watching in 2009? In that series Orlando had given the Cavs problems all season when they met. Rafer Alston wasn't even in the top 3 of the scouting report. Magic had 2 allstar level 6'10 wings and the Cavs had 2 under 6'3. Those guys couldn't even dream of bothering the jumper of Lewis and Turk. They opted to play Lerbon off them to roam and help on D and it backfired in a terrible way. They had matchup disadvantages all over the floor so Alston was wide open most of the series by design. That's not to mention Dwight Howard either, at that point in time the Cavs had zero answers for him. When Big Z was in the game he was way too mobile for Z to guard him and when they switched off and it was Andy, he was far too weak at that stage of his career. The veteran version of Varejeo would have fared much better against Dwight. And Lebron? He kinda posted historic numbers that series, he could do virtually anything he wanted except go to the bench, even for a minute. Some of us actually watched that series.

Remember when Lebron blew game 4? :lol

https://twitter.com/ApexJones22/status/1676323095315992576?s=20

[1987_Lakers]

He is the greatest floor raiser in NBA history, little people dispute this. Nobody did more with less like LeBron, 2018 being a great example.

[Axe]

He is the greatest floor raiser in NBA history, little people dispute this. Nobody did more with less like LeBron, 2018 being a great example.
ImKobe gonna fume about this.

[MrFonzworth]

He is the greatest floor raiser in NBA history, little people dispute this. Nobody did more with less like LeBron, 2018 being a great example.

2011 also being a great example of his leadership

[Hey Yo]

Remember when Lebron blew game 4? :lol

https://twitter.com/ApexJones22/status/1676323095315992576?s=20

Remember when MJ quit before game 5 even started in the 89 ecf?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF_uNik6zB8&pp=ygUqR2FtZSA1IDE5ODkgbmJhIGVhc3Rlcm4gY29uZmVyZW5 jZSBmaW5hbHMg


Highlights show his teammates hitting shots... but here MJ blames them for not making enough, while he only takes 8fga

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1989-06-01-sp-1414-story.html

[theman93]

Remember when MJ quit before game 5 even started in the 89 ecf?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF_uNik6zB8&pp=ygUqR2FtZSA1IDE5ODkgbmJhIGVhc3Rlcm4gY29uZmVyZW5 jZSBmaW5hbHMg


Highlights show his teammates hitting shots... but here MJ blames them for not making enough, while he only takes 8fga

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1989-06-01-sp-1414-story.html

Remember when Lebron disappeared for an entire series in the 2011 Finals? :lol


https://youtube.com/watch?v=Q4NNzg-Luz0&feature=sharea

https://i.ibb.co/Wx3Nr7d/FCBB4468-13-FF-481-A-913-F-2-CFFEC7-B3983.png

[Bawkish]

Remember when Lebron disappeared for an entire series in the 2011 Finals? :lol


https://youtube.com/watch?v=Q4NNzg-Luz0&feature=sharea

https://i.ibb.co/Wx3Nr7d/FCBB4468-13-FF-481-A-913-F-2-CFFEC7-B3983.png

Dude argued for one game while his hero did it for the entire series :lol

[Lebron23]

Dude argued for one game while his hero did it for the entire series :lol

And since then he is a 4x nba mvp, and 4x finals mvp

[Jimmy Rustler]

He is the greatest floor raiser in NBA history, little people dispute this. Nobody did more with less like LeBron, 2018 being a great example.

He led a super team to the lottery in 2022. Nobody has ever done less with more.

[Clifton]

I loved that Cavs-Magic matchup. The best player in the league leading a poorly-constructed roster full of nobodies vs. a perfectly-constructed, beautiful offense orchestrated around an absolute paper tiger in Dwight Howard.

(I acknowledge Howard's greatness as a defender and rebounder, but his offense in general, and post game in particular, was like sitting through 30 minutes of a little kid practicing the violin who's not good yet. Every. Time. ... Even if he scored.)

[CountDracula]

https://i.ibb.co/CzDqRtR/CCF3-FA74-1-B22-42-A9-AFB5-9-FECC87785-AB.jpg (https://ibb.co/PN0RqYq)

https://i.ibb.co/Jpk0NHB/6-BD0693-E-70-AB-4519-9-D92-7825-FCB13-D47.jpg (https://ibb.co/WzKqQfx)

https://i.ibb.co/yXjfd8s/7185-D942-667-C-40-D4-8703-B9-A63-DF5-FC1-F.jpg (https://ibb.co/qdQy7R1)

https://i.ibb.co/pL5zy07/BD5-FCD6-D-5564-4-AA0-A058-78-D34-D9-D8-E1-E.jpg (https://ibb.co/ZM78mLj)

[HylianNightmare]

3 all stars in that lineup

[warriorfan]

3 all stars in that lineup

It is a solid team. The funny part is if hedo and rashard were on lebron’s team we wouldn’t hear the end of it about how they are bums. But when lebron loses to them they are all of a sudden superstars or something.

[90sgoat]

https://scontent.fmnl8-3.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/356924962_136175359495778_308310311543177280_n.jpg ?_nc_cat=104&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=7fMnULr3B9MAX_MPyma&_nc_ht=scontent.fmnl8-3.fna&oh=00_AfClLkkvfGB10TnSbZo46Ohx7VDI7cIZPf-tYS-b7SUavA&oe=64A8FC25

Better starting lineup that Luka has ever had.

[3ba11]

.
The Cavs won 45 games in 2008 before Lebron received the all-star spacing that his stiff arm needs in 2009.



1) The starting lineup in 2009 contained Lebron + 2x all-star center + all-star guard + all-defender forward (varejao)



2) The 09' Cavs had the 3rd-ranked defense (19th for 1990 Bulls), while 09' Mo > 90' Pippen across the board offensively:



09' Mo... 17.2 PER... 2.3 BPM... 3.1 VORP.... 0.165 WS/48.... #3 team defense
90' Pip... 16.3 PER... 1.8 BPM... 3.0 VORP.... 0.087 WS/48.. #19 team defense


So Lebron started with a better team on both sides of the ball, yet Jordan still beat him to titles by winning in 91', while Lebron kept losing as the favorite for 2 more years in 10' and 11'.



3) Jordan would never have "the worst Finals team ever" with an all-star center teammate and this acquisition:



05' HUGHES..... 21.6 PER.. 4.3 BPM.. 0.157 WS/48.. 3.7 VORP... 22/6/5.. 1st Team All-D
90' PIPPEN....... 16.3 PER.. 1.8 BPM.. 0.087 WS/48.. 3.0 VORP... 16/6/5.. No All-D




4) Lebron avoided low seeds or the 8 vs 1 matchup by waiting 3 years to develop a veteran high seed before entering the 06' Playoffs - the all-star duo of Lebron/Zydrunas added a HOF coach and 22/5/5 acquisition to make the 06' Playoffs as a high seed, so Lebron didn't have low playoff seeds until 2021 (1st Round exit).




5) Since Lebron was locked up by the 07' Spurs and 08' Celtics, he was either locked up, lottery or upset in every season from 2004-2011 (except 2006, although he only averaged 26 on 46% vs Pistons)

[bluechox2]

can we get the first father son and grandson on the same team...get delonte a 10 day to play with bran and lilbran jr

[3ba11]

It's funny that Dirk won 67 games in the West with less help in 2007 and he upset Lebron's super-team in 2011, so Dirk was a better floor-raiser and ceiling-raiser.

People forget that Lebron was a 1-trick pony with 1 Finals run like Iverson or Dwight until the "decision" to stack the deck and manufacture an all-time resume.

[Duderonomy]

And still lost to Fright Coward and Rashard Lewis on a then Fred VanFleet contract.

[theman93]

3 all stars in that lineup

Not in the ECF, Jameer was out. Rashard only made it because he was on a good team (ala his 2005 season)

[Axe]

.
The Cavs won 45 games in 2008 before Lebron received the all-star spacing that his stiff arm needs in 2009.



1) The starting lineup in 2009 contained Lebron + 2x all-star center + all-star guard + all-defender forward (varejao)



2) The 09' Cavs had the 3rd-ranked defense (19th for 1990 Bulls), while 09' Mo > 90' Pippen across the board offensively:



09' Mo... 17.2 PER... 2.3 BPM... 3.1 VORP.... 0.165 WS/48.... #3 team defense
90' Pip... 16.3 PER... 1.8 BPM... 3.0 VORP.... 0.087 WS/48.. #19 team defense


So Lebron started with a better team on both sides of the ball, yet Jordan still beat him to titles by winning in 91', while Lebron kept losing as the favorite for 2 more years in 10' and 11'.



3) Jordan would never have "the worst Finals team ever" with an all-star center teammate and this acquisition:



05' HUGHES..... 21.6 PER.. 4.3 BPM.. 0.157 WS/48.. 3.7 VORP... 22/6/5.. 1st Team All-D
90' PIPPEN....... 16.3 PER.. 1.8 BPM.. 0.087 WS/48.. 3.0 VORP... 16/6/5.. No All-D




4) Lebron avoided low seeds or the 8 vs 1 matchup by waiting 3 years to develop a veteran high seed before entering the 06' Playoffs - the all-star duo of Lebron/Zydrunas added a HOF coach and 22/5/5 acquisition to make the 06' Playoffs as a high seed, so Lebron didn't have low playoff seeds until 2021 (1st Round exit).




5) Since Lebron was locked up by the 07' Spurs and 08' Celtics, he was either locked up, lottery or upset in every season from 2004-2011 (except 2006, although he only averaged 26 on 46% vs Pistons)
1-9

[Dbrog]

Remember when Lebron blew game 4? :lol

https://twitter.com/ApexJones22/status/1676323095315992576?s=20

Ether

[3ba11]

Ether


Exactly - it's impossible for a team to win when the star player turns into a 12 turnover per game player in clutch-time and that was the video evidence - just embarrassing collapse in the critical Game 4 OT that swung the series

And I never understood why he decided to guard Courtney Lee for that series instead of providing the size/agility to hinder Hedo or Rashard.. Kind of a ridiculous defensive game-plan backfire

[Lebron23]

RIP Michael Jordan 1963-2023